Intel 13900K & 13600K Temperature Myths BUSTED

[@HardwareCanucks]

Unlike your favorite Cheetos, Raptor Lake CPUs apparently don't have to be Flaming Hot....unless the motherboard says so. And different motherboards do different things. This seems to come up with MCE discussions on every Intel generation....so what are your thoughts on it? Shenanigans or "spec"?

[@Joshua-uq9zw]

The 13900k is ridiculous imo. Way to high powerdraw and temps. Was pleasantly surprised about the 13600k though. Only around 60c in gaming and around 86W powerdraw. Not too bad in gaming. The all core workload temps, even with a ak620(d15 ish performance), was still way too high though at 79c 100% fanspeed for me personally.

[@budala1969]

The most important question not answered... How well does 13600K OC and what kind of a cooler do we need for that?

[@ABaumstumpf]

Intel should just step up and should at least make the "guidelines" to be Mandatory for stock-settings. The current auto-overclock settings of motherboards just make the CPUs draw way more power for no reason - they even increase the voltage despite that not being needed. PL1 is still "only" 125W - the i9 13900K when run according to specs will go back to that level and perform within spitting distance of when its powerlimits are completely ignored.

[@jerrygenser]

Can you do a similar video on 7950 vs. 7700 or 7600? Would be really good guidance on which cooler to use. Also include eco modes to check performance/cooler matrix. Would be helpful for my own cooler buying for AMD side

[@n1kobg]

Cool video. I know you wanted to make a point but the OC part is missing and its not a small deal since you can add extra 500mhz on top. It doesnt need to be all core OC. Actually TVB & V/F Curve are very strong here.

[@Audibleknight]

As someone eyeing a 13600k this video is amazing. The comparison between different cooler types is something that was seriously needed with the overall narrative of "Raptor Lake runs hot!". Great job and much appreciated!

[@HardwareCanucks]

Glad you liked it!

[@kmcrafting4837]

Picked up a 13600 and love it, great balance of perf/cost. Mine is cooled with a noctua NH-U12A OC'd to 5.5Ghz and it never cracks 70deg running 3d mark cpu stress test

[@SepticFuddy]

@@kmcrafting4837 Good to know, just ordered one myself with a 360mm AIO. Definitely gonna have to play with some OC

[@teeaymusik9811]

@@SepticFuddy Why would you OC the 13600? I have it myself and its insanely fast.

[@SepticFuddy]

@@teeaymusik9811 Moar frames more gooder? At the very least, "insanely fast" over the years is going to turn into "fairly adequate" as it always does and having that kind of thermal headroom to play with will stretch the longevity nicely. That's assuming games don't improve so drastically in multithread efficiency that the core count is finally the problem, which I think is fairly safe. Definitely because I want to be green and reduce e-waste and not at all because I am stingy! I do video work, too, so a 400-600MHz clock boost could save me some time.

[@handicapper911]

Finally a straightforward shot of air-cooling the 13900k. Huge thanks guys!

[@ruslanmamedaliyev3912]

What air tower cooler do u use and how much does it cool down ur cpu?

[@ClassicalPan]

@@hwyterrorist Because you prefer the aio? I bought an air cooler for mine.

[@kumarsalib722]

There's no excuse for these overwattage settings being default. Users are welcome to crank up their settings if they want, but people who don't mess with settings shouldn't have the lifespan of their computer jacked up without their consent.

[@mrbobgamingmemes9558]

That motherboard power limit bypass setting should be disabled out of the box . Cuz seriosly , so in customer want they just have to enabled it . No joke it could be a huge problem if cuatomer live in country with hot climate

[@fakethiscrap2083]

You can always under-volt the cpu

[@magottyk]

LOL, it's nothing new, it's been standard practice on Intel platforms for years.

[@neroz06m.20]

A lot of people dont want to tinker wigh the bios so they prefer the auto performance boost and get what they pay for. Remember that a lot of people are not even aware of XMP.

[@flimermithrandir]

I feel the same regarding the Insane usage of Watt in GPUs. The 4090 at 550 Watt compared to 300 Watt is like… just 10% Better. I have no Issue Nvidia making the 4090 running 660 Watts (as they claimed was possible in their Lab) but make the normal User Experience be 300 +- a few Watts). If ppl want to use 600 Watts… let them with OC Cards. Let themself Remove the Powerlimit. But dont make it the new Normal to run GPUs at 500+ Watts. It gets Insane for no Reason.

[@pupsaderpupin5627]

This is the only video I've found that clearly and thoughtfully explains the thermals of these chips. Kudos guys.

[@04_ruizatanedy24]

I truly appreciate and really love that you guys made these kind of videos. Information about coolers and chip behavior this in-depth was really lacking out there.

[@HardwareCanucks]

Our pleasure!

[@jubayerwasidraiyan5874]

you guys are the best when it comes to coolers because you GUYS ARE SOME OF THE ONLY PEOPLE WHO TEST THEM SMH I know coolers aren't as cool as graphics cards but they're definitely pretty damn important!

[@HardwareCanucks]

I have a passion for them. - Mike

[@muhammadzinc5228]

I got fooled by what others were saying and I worried about 13600K temps so I bought a 13400F instead. Now I'm regretting my decision.

[@RojPhoo]

Currently having this problem😂

[@RS-nq8xk]

Underclocked (not even undervolted) 13600K will be more power efficient than the 13400F simply because more cores matter a lot too, not just low clocks/voltage. Unless you run something like these mini PCs, even if you buy an i7/i9 it will still offer you performance gain over any lower end CPU. (Whether the price increase is worth it for you is another thing...)

[@ohne_speed]

What I've done to my 13700kf is: removed the power limitations, slapped a big ass Arctic Liquid II 420 on it, set the TjMax to 80°C and undervolted it by 160mV. 1-2core Turbo is 57x, 3-4 56x, 5-6 55x, 7-8 54x (stock max). 99.9% it is not even close to the 80°C limit (40-60°C usually in games and photo heavy batched editing), but i limited it to that for longetivity.

[@atriusvinius319]

Cinebench 23 after 10 minutes please

[@DreamParadiseTv]

Can you guide me through what you,ve done please ? just upgraded to a i7-13700kf and getting very high temps..even at idle...thanks

[@doublemountainman3043]

Thanks! Cinebench multi core tests were giving me scores of 39.5k but temps of 100 degrees and thermal throttling, and after this video I turned off the msi turbo boost (and limited PL1 and PL2 to 253W just to be sure), and I get stable 85 degrees temp with scores around 37.8k. Very minor drop for a massive improvement!

[@doublemountainman3043]

And this is with an NH-D15

[@Newshustle]

@@doublemountainman3043 hey I have an NH D15 too so that's good to know. Could you possibly recommend a good budget motherboard that uses DDR4? I can't make my mind up on the motherboard but am currently looking at the ASUS Prime Z790-P WiFi D4

[@atomicskull6405]

If you have an MSI board set CPU Light Load to 4 or 5, MSI's LGA1700 selects 12 by default which is much higher voltage than necessary. With my MSI board set to Light Lode 4 Cinebench r23 generates around 169w~171w, this settings is like some kind of CPU voodoo. You can actually go lower but some individual 13600's may not be stable and going below 4 is diminishing returns anyway. (also be aware that the march/april 2023 BIOS changed the voltage curves, Light Lode 6 is now equivalent to 9 previously)

[@atomicskull6405]

@@Newshustle If you want an absolutely no bullcrap motherboard that doesn't cost a lot then take a look at the ASUS Pro Business motherboards for LGA1700. Absolutely no OC features at all, the BIOS has a text interface like something from the 90's where you just hit "load optimized defaults" and go, and the MB itself is a plain green board with off the shelf generic heatsinks where no thought was given to how it looks only that it works and is reliable. These boards are designed for enterprise computers where they are expected to be installed and "just work". This is the MB I would base on if I was building an i3-3100 or i5-3600 gaming PC for a "normal everyday person" who simply wants a system that is reliable and performs well. Yes I was surprised that someone still makes motherboards like this too.

[@barteks816]

@@doublemountainman3043 13900k or 13700k? :) Have you tried switch Light Lode from default 12 to lower one? Greetings

[@GoofieNewfie]

Noctua DH-15 2 fan Chromax 13700k. Asus Strix Gaming 790-E, Lian Li O11 EVO. Idle temp 28-34. Cinebench hits 87C, 31000+ score. No overclock. ddr5 5600 ram g-skill. Intel XM benchmark over 10k. I was determined NOT to use water or AIO. No Throttling. Multicore disabled. 100% Intel spec.

[@laggmonstret]

This in a Fractal Torrent case was my plan :D

[@thepathnotfound]

@@laggmonstret I’m using a Torrent and a U12a chromax black, tons of air flow through that case.

[@EZ3DTV]

I have an Intel 13900K and an ASUS TUF Gaming Z790-Plus WiFi motherboard and I am wondering if it will create that spike of wattage at the beginning of the load cycle even if it is set to auto? I don't see a reason to let the board overheat the chip with wattage even for a short duration. What settings would I need to manually set in the ASUS bios to prevent that initial wattage duration? What is the best way to monitor the chip wattage to tell if it is blasting the chip? How do I bypass the 96 seconds?

[@Zhunter5000]

I'm using a NH-D15S with the 13600K rn and it doesn't exceed 77 degrees under OCCT with a Vcore of 1.068V at stock speeds. Gaming temps never exceed 60. Really satisfied with the cooling of the 13600K on a D15S, but I do think it's important to undervolt these CPUs to get the lower temps. (Wattage also never exceeds 150W in OCCT).

[@popgun2139]

how much did you undervolt?

[@a120068020]

I wouldn't undervolt - there's always going to be something that will tip it past a stability margin. I would prefer just to run within Intel spec power limits.

[@Zhunter5000]

@@a120068020 Stress testing to verify stability is useful when undervolting and allows me to have the minimum voltage needed without jeopardizing stability. People who don't care to stability test shouldn't undervolt.

[@Zhunter5000]

@@popgun2139 I have a fixed vcore of 1.150V at a low LLC

[@igeeek5100]

@@Zhunter5000 Can you recommend a good tutorial for undervolt on the 13600k? I have a 13600k with a Strix z690 D4 and I think its VCORE is too high.

[@briananzaldua]

Thanks!

[@kasimirdenhertog3516]

6:54 very good you brought this up. I’m running a passive system with Alder Lake and found efficiency drops off dramatically above 85C. This used to be different. I’ve got a 8086K (so Coffee Lake) and when you plot out power & MHz vs. temperature, it’s pretty linear, only slightly curving off towards 100C. But Alder Lake requires about 20% more power for the same performance above 85C (Coffee Lake showing a 5-7% hike). This is due to architecture & miniaturization. Very interesting to see and important to keep in mind when you have to deal with a limited thermal budget.

[@GyroCannon]

I bought a 13600k and I'm cooling it in an itx sandwich case with a 67mm-ish tall air cooler. It does fail to hit boost clocks if I throw an all-core workload on it but I haven't seen any stutters when I peg the P cores with heavy load. People who fell for the "Intel runs hot" clickbait are missing out on great value - better value than Ryzen 7000

[@GyroCannon]

@Seola agreed. I upgraded from the 3700x

[@brucemoolenaar7944]

This is one of the BEST videos I have ever seen on this topic. WELL DONE Hardware Canucks.

[@nedimhalilovic1]

I paired my 13600k with Thermalright Peerless Assassin because of your review and excellent price I got it for (33 euros on Amazon) and the temps are great, I overclocked my 13600k to 5,5 GHz on P cores and 4,4Ghz on E cores with 0.85V in XTU which comes to around 1,26v (209W of power consumption at full load) in Cinebench r23 where I got 26200 points in multithread and 2144 in single thread

[@HardwareCanucks]

NICE!

[@heyitsjel]

That's a great sweet spot balancing performance and not pulling insane power. 2144 single thread points is right up with 13900k single threaded performance :)

[@dracer35]

That's awesome! That's pretty close to 12900ks score for half the price while running cooler and using less energy. I should pick up a 13600k to do some testing for myself.

[@nedimhalilovic1]

@@dracer35 yeah 13600k is a great cpu,idk why anyone would consider 7600x over it

[@rocketracer111]

Sounds fantastic! Do you think I can use/tinker with those settings for an 12600k?

[@idn]

I'm running the i5-13600k @ 5.7 GHz with a CPU frame and Arctic 280mm AIO. My max temperature while gaming today (max 1440p settings in some CPU-grinding games like Path of Exile and Star Citizen) on P-cores was 58° c and on E-cores was 46° c. Really nice package.

[@CreativeCommons277]

damnnn

[@kramnull8962]

Have you tried a R23 loop? My 13700K does great in gaming temp wise. Only at 5.5 Ghz though. But in a loop of R23 I am bouncing 100C at different times, with a 360 AIO.

[@maulcs]

@@APARAT79 Try Y-Cruncher and see what you get, it sounds like your P95 is with AVX off if it's getting similar temps as R23 (which is notoriously easy). I'm getting a 13900k shortly and I'm wondering if it'll even be possible to run these more intensive CPU tests - certainly not with MCE on at least. Although with my tuned 10900k I can hit 320w and be around 90c with my Liquid Freezer 360.

[@idn]

@@kramnull8962 I haven't yet. I just used some simple burn in benchmarks, but nothing that intense. I figure if it's stable in games and it's a gaming PC, that's all I care about. The temps and stability and performance have been consistent for 2 weeks straight, so I'll take it.

[@idn]

@@kramnull8962 also, did you set a temperature threshold? I set mine to 90c, and while I've yet to hit that, my understanding is that my Asus motherboard will allow the CPU to run at my manual overcooked settings until it reaches 90c, then start backing off from 5.7 GHz down to lower speeds. I'm only using 1.3 cpu voltage, so I used load line cali 6 (which is probably too aggressive really). Also, I used the new thermal grizzly extreme paste paired with a CPU frame, which supposedly works very very well.

[@yourshotsalwaysmiss]

I could not find a decent video covering air cooling for the i5 13600k until now, you are a legend my dude

[@hectorfelix9235]

This was the type of deep analysis I was looking for. Thanks and awesome work!

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@techluvin7691]

My favourite tech channel with honest reviews. If you run Intel CPU’s at their recommended power limits……they don’t overheat. All these youtubers max out the power limits. Also, motherboard companies also max the power limits on “auto” settings. At stock Intel power limits, none of these CPU’s are as powerful as they claim.

[@iichikocchi]

You finally answered the question why my Raptor Lake processor was not drawing the max wattage, it was actually reaching the max frequency with lower wattage. Thank you for the clarification!

[@HardwareCanucks]

Bingo!

[@a120068020]

I only cottoned onto this just this week. My 13900k was hitting TJ max on Cinebench even with a Noctua NH-D15 and 9 fans in an airflow case. Got a 280mm AIO as I couldnt fit anything bigger but wimped out and stuck it on my 12900k system as I didn't think it would still be enough. Then, switched to Intel limits and I went from around 40000 multicore points to 38000 on Cinebench but temps went no higher than 81C - mid 70s for most cores. My board (Aorus Elite Z690 DDR4) and others are making this CPU look really bad when out of the box Intel limits would be better - allowing tweaking to custom limits for those with exotic cooling solutions. I couldn't get a pass on a Timespy stability test with the out of the box settings but switching to Intel defaults I got a 99.6% score on my first attempt! Some people mention additionally or instead of doing some undervolting - I am all about stability on all workloads so wouldn't want to run the risk of any stability issues no matter how well people think they have tested an undervolt - there will always be something not tested that could cause a crash.

[@stefanpetrov8]

If you limit it to 205W you'll get roughly ~36k points and it'll run even cooler, less than 70 degrees.

[@disadadi8958]

Z690 aorus elite DDR4 defaults to over 1.4Vcore on my 13600kf. Ridiculous. I would rather UV and crash than fry the chip with this shitty ass motherboard. Legitimately the first and last time I buy anything branded "Gigabyte"

[@RogueTravel]

Air cooling kind of sucks on the 13900K, unfortunately. A 280mm AIO will beat out the NH-D15 so I’d try that out since you already purchased.

[@CyberneticArgumentCreator]

@@disadadi8958 This entire video is about how all high-end Intel motherboards do this.

[@disadadi8958]

@@CyberneticArgumentCreator The video is about unlimited power limits. I have those set at 4096W and I don't mind, but the Vcore override is damn useless and the default voltage is frying the chip. This video doesn't talk anything about it. I guess you misunderstood the content of the video or the content of my previous message..

[@techtressow]

Just saw this in my recommended feed and thank god I wasn't going crazy when I read intel's specs and monitored my CPU's initial power consumption. I have a 13600k and I got a $35 cooler (peerless assassin 120 SE) which is a little beast, but cinebench r23 was pushing 95c and prime95 was maxing out at 100c and throttling pretty quickly. Did a bit of research for my own motherboard and found it's best to override a voltage because turning off enhanced turbo and adjusting the AC/DC loadlines + calibration didn't get my voltage as low as I wanted. Granted, it was a huge improvement, but it still kept the volts around 1.3 (instead of 1.4-1.5 at stock). Overriding didn't cause high idle temps or high power (uses like 5w idling) because it automatically turns down the power even if you force a constant voltage. Found out I could force as low as 1.18v at stock clocks. That is an entire 320mv undervolt which is absolutely insane. Cinebench then maxxed at 75c and prime95 at 85c, while gaming rarely takes it above 60c. It was an ENTIRE 20c drop temps and about 100 watt drop in power (from pushing 280w to like 180w in prime95). What I ended up doing was 1.26v while overclocking both P+E cores by 200mhz. Cinebench now gives 80c and p95 maxes at 96c but stays around 90c. No throttling.

[@SynthOSphere]

Thanks for these details! Would’ve been great to know which motherboard but it gives a great idea of where to start.

[@pisachasrinuan7960]

This video amazing! very well thought out, planned, well-paced. The story is perfect, it does justice to Raptor Lake. Some people seem to think that Raptor Lake is really a bad CPU that is impossible to cool (coming from some particular channels), but it's not really the whole story. I mean, it's half Intel and half MB manufacturer's fault that makes their CPUs looks bad, but Raptor Lake is not a bad product. Anyway, people who don't like the high Power and Temp, please go to BIOS and set PL1, PL2 to what you like. Thank you!

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@oMeGa0122]

This is something new to me. Kudos for being the first to say this. You have got a new subscriber

[@Cryptomined]

im just watching youtube and my 13900k is at 70c using the nzxt z73 360 cooler ... is that normal??

[@mattlm64]

I'd like to see a comparison of i5, i7 and i9 when air cooled. I'm looking at an i5 but wonder if it's worth going for an i7 when air cooled.

[@ghostplyr6346]

Doing all my research now before starting to order parts. Helpful video, thank you!

[@LineIDse89kim]

Congratulations🎉 you have been selected winner of the ongoing giveaway. send me a message via the above number to redeem your prizes...

[@pabloredigonda7281]

This video it's all i need. Thanks for the graphs and explanation of the Maximum Turbo Power, i had never understood that before. I comprise all the concepts and now everything is clear. Greetings from Argentina 🔷⬜🔷

[@cosmiccouplet]

Thank you, you have earned a subscriber. I just bought an i9 for work and a 360mm AIO and was worried I'd have to undervolt the processor. I almost thought I wasted the money. So, now I am pleased again that I made the right choice after several weeks learning and playing PCBS2 to learn what I hadn't known in the last 20 years (last time I built). Thanks again.

[@kramnull8962]

Screw that. The silicon lottery in that game is too addictive. Especially if you don't know the maximum limits and need to trial and error the game. And all the different platforms. You still have to have DDR4 6323 ram to have the best PC in the game. I won't spoil it any more than that.

[@ashryver3605]

im just worried about the AIO failing and needing to be replaced or worse destroying components (leak)... I've had this 4790k build for over 10 years and all I've done is dust out air and brush out the fans every now and again - in fact, I only replaced the thermal paste once (last year) out of over a decade when it came to my NZXT Havik 140 air cooler.

[@krisreddish3066]

it can happen but most folks that use AIO never have issues. I have fixed a few custom loops too, pumps can fail on the good, the bad, and the ugly. But as far as longevity I have a version 1 Corsair H00i that has lasted 7 years with 100% uptime and it is still going strong. I would assume they are a bit better now. In the early days of AIOs, I replaced a few pumps, as more and more adopted them, they seem to fail much less. Either R&D made them last longer, or use case has changed slightly.

[@heuer03]

What about Noctua NH-D15 to cool i9-13900KS? enough for it? looking for a solution, and don't want liquid cooling, many thanks.

[@thestrykernet]

I wish more folks would key on the power consumption not being on Intel so much as out of base spec motherboards. It also adds a level of complexity to reviews due to all of the factors behind keeping heat under control. I'd be curious to see what your numbers looked like on the 13900K if you replaced the ILM with the thermaltake or thermal grizzly solutions. Sadly it seems like these are pretty much mandatory on the 13900K if you're going to be slamming it, but I'm curious if the advantages scale down with cooling solution. Thanks again for the great video.

[@moonwatcher6594]

After pocking around a little, I have settled for the following settings: 1. Set the tjmax to 90c for safety, 2. Set a negative 0.075v offset, 3. Set per core boost 2 cores to 5.8, 5 cores to 5.5 and 8 cores to 5.2. Didn't touch the E-cores. The AIO is a 360mm one and it runs quiet. Max power draw is around 220w and the system is stable. BTW I disabled motherboard overclocking/enhancements but didn't put limits to pl1 and pl2.

[@l3xx000]

This was great! Thank you! I really like how you tested the i5-13600K and gave me some great information on what cooler might make sense for this to be able to get the best performance at a reasonable cost for the cooling!

[@StevesRealWorld]

IS the CORSAIR iCUE H100i ELITE CAPELLIX Liquid CPU Cooler 240mm radiator a good cooler for the 13900k?

[@mizajuu]

No

[@aiswholema7622]

yes for rgb. not for performance and cost.

[@_thevaporz]

Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 SE cooler $40 and contact frame $12 works great.

[@rohaitastanoli3414]

I had a msi Z690 motherboard fucked up. because of 12 gen i700k processor. There has been problem with thermals the pc would randomly turn off. Now motherboard went to warrenty waiting for new motherboard.

[@skeeterhoney]

I was thinking about dropping a 13900KF into my Strix B660 but I was worried about the cooling since I have a (good) 240mm AIO. I feel a lot better about it now, especially since I won't (or can't) overclock and I'm only running DDR4 anyway (which I assume is a slight tax on how much work the CPU does...not really sure). Great video. Glad I found you guys.

[@TearfulNight]

11:56 I am confused .. isn't this chip is supposed to reach 5.1 max turbo ? .. its only hitting 4.8 in your test on all modes

[@shutitfukface]

my i5 13600k runs at 5.5 single core load, 5.4 all core on the P's and 4.3 on the E's all while hitting 180 watts on a single stack air cooler... All I did was hit AutoOC in the Intel Extreme Tuning Utility and it did that itself. No manual OC needed.

[@JobyP]

Man! Thanks for this video! I hated how hot this damn thing ran. 30 second trip to the bios set the power limits to 253 rather than 4096!!! And now she’s running cool as a cucumber hour long stress test didn’t pass 88 degrees. MUCH better. Thanks 🙏

[@DustinGorman]

Wow! Astounded at the work that went into this. Very, very informative. Thank you!

[@gemstone7818]

this is a pretty good showcase of 240mm water cooler vs really good air cooling

[@laggmonstret]

Still would love to see a Noctua NH-D15S on a 13900K in a Fractal Torrent case ;D

[@faidzfahmy5588]

Thanks for the info! Better understanding on temps issue between the two chips.

[@z8editing]

the 13900k isnt only used by gamers, yes gpu rendering got popular but you are still mostly capped by your vram, making it unusable for large complex scenes. on top of that gpu rendering seems to evolve to xpu meaning using cpu and gpu and the same time. so yes it won't be the cpu of choice for the vfx industry, but these rencent cpus are versatile and perfect for individuals other than that, thanks a lot for the in depth explaination !

[@thepathnotfound]

Which cpu would be used?

[@yellosuit]

Now that was a great video. Great job you did there making sense of the whole situation with cooling Vs. Power consumption.

[@heyitsjel]

My 13900k on an MSI Z690i Unify runs cool as a cucumber. Using "stock" power limits the board came with (around 240W), in cinebench R23 it pulled 35,000 points and didn't exceed 77 degrees celsius (ambient around 23-24C). I'm only running a EVGA 280 CLC (AIO) inside a Coolermaster NR200 and fans weren't at full speed. Average power draw was hovering around 220W. Now, I could unlock my power limits to squeeze another 15% performance out of it, but honestly for daily driving it's not needed. I don't even have a contact frame installed yet, and that's regular type thermal paste (ie. not liquid metal). Anytime you're seeing someone complain about how hot the 13900k runs (eg. thermal throttling, 100C), it's because they're pulling like 330W trying to squeeze every last bit of performance out of it; which unless you're running *very* specific workloads, you're realistically not going to even notice the difference in things like gaming.

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@shpex489]

Жтэжжэшю

[@KushiKush]

I am amazed that you took time out of your day to make a comparrison of fan speeds. that test is amazing and I always wondered how fans affect performance. And now I know, thank you

[@Shokyto]

What an amazing content, I already did a couple purchase selection based on your amazing work, my combo will be 13600k + Thermaltake Peerless Assassin 120 :D

[@ajrf92]

13:15 => would you consider good enough a 13600K paired with an Ak620 cooler, even for rendering at 4k in Daz Studio? Do I need to undervolt this chip, or would it be necessary to change from Intel to AMD? Thanks.

[@cnhtol1586]

freaking 2month old video. and i saw this now, i am so amazed. That HUB guy was making so much fuzz over this cooling thing

[@RicochetForce]

Thank you very much for this video. I'm going to keep this in mind ahead of my build early next year.

[@Varil92]

What about the PSU requirements? Is 850W enough for an i5-13600K with a GPU like a RX 6900 XT for example? I have doubts between the i5-13600K and the 5800X3D and the main concern I have here is power consumption.

[@kamau6988]

850w is more than enough for that combo

[@Varil92]

@@kamau6988 Are you sure? I see many people opting for a 1000W when building an i5-13600k build. I'm thinking about making a build with RX 6900 XT or RX 7800 XT.

[@MrWaheedulHaque]

@@Varil92 im using a 750w for i5 13600k with rx 6750 6 ssds, 4 m.2s, and lots of rgb hahaha, no issue at all, im slightly overclocked on both cpu and gpu too

[@Alp577]

I have an ITX build with 4090 founders and 13900k. My Corsair SF750 is only running at 660W. With undervolt with the same performance, I manage to get around 500-580W while gaming. Granted my PSU is platinum rating that can reach 900W with no problem, but I think 850W gold is more than enough for 13600k.

[@sd7335]

Even 750w gold will be fine

[@Bradh90]

Great video loving this style of content really really interesting and very helpful for me in specing out my new build.

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@Michael-ue9nv]

Awesome testing and explanations once again, great video!

[@mohammadsadeghlavaie5560]

Hi! I just built my 1st PC with a 13600kf and a AK620 digital. I'm having temps up to 93° in the CPU-Z stress test (with fans at 100%). Is that normal?

[@thegstoic]

Good to know the 13600k is good at those temps. I just got one installed on an H1 V2 and the idle temps are 44c with highest maybe 85c(normally 75c)

[@breez0-]

So I wanted to get a 13900k for my next build and with the motherboard shenanigans you mentioned in the video would you recommend turning changing it from auto on the msi enhanced turbo setting? Idk if you’ll even see this but I just want to make sure, that’s all. I’m sorry if I don’t make any sense too.

[@maxslayer11]

Could you make a video on what BIOS settings to use to keep the 13th gen run cooler and on less power. I will be turning off the turbo boost in the BIOS as I was not aware of that one for MSI.

[@AeiKei]

Just try to keep vcore as low as possible, on the 13700kf I managed to make it stable at 1.16 Vcore with 5.4p/4.4e all core

[@levelazn]

@@AeiKei 13900 has 1.2volts at default. You think a simple 1.16 will be stable ?

[@AeiKei]

@@levelazn 1.2 is only at boot, when you load the cpu it will spike to around 1.40, in order to make it stay at 1.20 you need to override the vcore setting and set it manually to 1.20, you could start at 1.16 and see if it passes a 30 min test of cinebench, if not try raising from 1.16 until it's stable

[@kramnull8962]

@@AeiKei Thanks a lot. My 13700K was throttling 3 P cores in R23. I couldn't go below 1.20V, without failures. But at 1.2V i went from 30706 to a 31206. Still using the basic overclocking tool on the MSI Tomahawk Z790. More than the DDR5 basic R23 scores for this chip on old DDR4.

[@AeiKei]

@@kramnull8962 31k is typical score for this chip, the pc I built was also using DDR4

[@1SaG]

One year later... the only time I wish I had a 360mm instead of a 240mm with my new 14700KF is ... in all-core, full load benchmarks like Cinebench. The 240 I have will deal with about 230, 235W of power/heat while keeping temps *just* out of truly scary territory. Like low 90°C package temp. In all other scenarios I've encountered so far (mostly gaming), the 240 has no problem keeping the CPU cool - and things don't even get *that* loud. Stock settings on my board (MSI Z690 Tomahawk) are pretty much all "no limits" and produced amounts of heat in CB23 that would probably overwhelm most 360 AiOs. CB23 and 2024 produced peak power draw of over 300W while other benchmarks gave me up to 340W of super short term peak power. Intel's XTU too will recommend power-settings (PL1/2 = 300W, ICCMax = 400A) that let the CPU run way too hot. I had to reduce those and MSI's auto-VCore offset ("CPU Lite Load") to avoid crazy temperatures and power-draw.

[@mickmoon6887]

Please include ambient room temperatures in the video because it does and will affect the temperature and result

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@Addeatt]

Wow, I'm so happy I fell into this video. Well done!

[@lukerestlessstudios]

DerBauer found that going above about 180 watts draw on the 13900K was where you get bodied by diminishing returns. 10% more performance for a trade off of 50% less efficiency at 300 watts. I’m limiting mine to no more than 200 watts.

[@SynthOSphere]

Awesome vid with 100% the tech info I needed. You guys are the best!

[@VirtualReality-kf7sh]

I just had my first Cinebench MP runs with 13900K, Gigabyte Aorus Master Z790 and Arctic Freezer II 360 and was shocked at the OOTB power draw HWInfo showed. 332W and constantly hitting 100°C and throttling looked scary. Thanks to this video i now understand what happens and will set my targets accordingly.

[@alissonreinaldosilva1119]

Did it work?

[@VirtualReality-kf7sh]

@@alissonreinaldosilva1119 Yes, setting the power limits made for 88 Celsius max. now which is fine.

[@atriusvinius319]

@@VirtualReality-kf7sh You loose performance when you decrease PL. You have bought 13900k and now you have 13700k with these PL)

[@Danlovestrivium]

@@atriusvinius319 Now make the same mobo settings changes to the 13700k and it's obvious that the 13900k still outperforms the i7. You're trying to pretend that a 13700k sucking down power is somehow comparable to a 13900k that's not. lol

[@MF_XCIII]

so it is best to have it on Auto or Disabled-Enforce all limits- if i dont want the cpu to reach 100c??

[@RobertFromEarth]

Great info, thank you! Future buyers must know that the 13600K will max out specs frequencies with ~150W. After watching your review of the AK620 (2 months ago?), I bought it for a new build based on the 13600K. This is a great combo. I also installed a CPU Contact Frame. I don't know if it makes a difference but it was an easy task and the temps look good. Question: for the 13600K at full load, did you see a difference in power consuption based on the temperature? Or maybe it's marginal (67c for the 360mm AIO vs 85c for the AK400).

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@UporaFilms]

Could you please do a comparison of the 13900k with the Deepcool LT720 vs Liquid Freezer ii 420? Trying to justify if needing to go to a bigger case is necessary...

[@YonOtto]

Noticed this with my 10850k. Sometimes the board will start up at 5.4ghz all core and loading into Windows will hit 100c... its insanity. Restart the system and it goes back to normal and doesn't touch 50c and is 4.8ghz to 5ghz.

[@TheSpiritof76]

The temperatures that are monitored are the CPU temperatures, right? I read that the heat output from hardware has more to do with how many watts it's using and not how hot the CPU itself is (even though these two are related), can someone correct me if I'm wrong?

[@HardwareCanucks]

This is correct. If its hotter, it needs more power. Conversely, with these new chips, if they run COOLER they can also be allowed to consume more power since there's thermal overhead. Eg: Intel THERMAL Velocity Boost.

[@WayStedYou]

It has everything to do woth powerdraw. You arent going to hwat your room up by bringing a cup of coffee into your room despite it being hot. But if you were trying to boil the pot of coffee in your room it will warm your room.

[@ABaumstumpf]

Yes - the heatoutput IS the Watts - nothing else. The temperature is a function of the Watts + how good the cooler is at removing the heat. An incandescent light is way way way hotter than an electric stove, but the stove outputs more power - cause with the light you want the filament to stay hot, with the stove you want to transport the heat away. But for a given hardware configuration heat and power are directly related (given constant fan-speed).

[@TheSpiritof76]

@@HardwareCanucks Thanks for the answer :3

[@adsrbad9733]

I feel like the 13600k data supports info that it has A LOT of OC headroom. Which is quite cool.

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@AmakusaWorld]

So I can use an arctic freezer 34 esports duro with i5 13600k? Nice

[@soapa4279]

I set my (13900K) PL's to 183W. I rarely only use all the threads/cores unless I'm video editing anyway. During gaming power barely reaches 100-150W in short bursts, so I notice zero difference in performance there.

[@HardwareCanucks]

But video editing....don't you use GPU Compute?

[@soapa4279]

@@HardwareCanucks Oh yes, but I like to do Render previews which uses mostly CPU

[@OfficialGundem]

@@soapa4279 what cooler would you recommend me if im using a 13700K for video editing?

[@soapa4279]

@@OfficialGundem Honestly the best one you can afford, but the Scythe Fuma 2 is one of the best for not much money. I have that on my other system and on my personal rig I use a Noctua NF U12A

[@randiryn]

The tdp for both processors are the same right 125w, will my dual 120fan air cooler be enough to cool i5-13600k? Or will it be enough for i7 13700k? Im worried about the thermal throttling, im not planning on buying aio for now btw

[@antiHUMANDesigns]

I've ordered the ASUS z790 Hero and a 13900k. My choice of cooling was to buy the EK AIO Elite 360 D-RGB, which seems to have the best cooling performance in the AIO market. I also bought a set of industrial, high-speed Noctua fans that I'll try putting on that AIO, though I'm not sure that'll make more than 1-2 degrees C difference.

[@ColinDyckes]

The Noctua Industrial fans are great on the Hero and 13900K on custom loop at 320W and 90C on torture loads. All P cores at 5.7 and E cores at 4.4. They are quite noisy though at high speed. Should help on an AIO but I've never used one.

[@antiHUMANDesigns]

@@ColinDyckes My computer is in a different room from where I sit. I run cables through a hole in the wall. So, noise is not a big concern, it's completely silent where I sit.

[@maulcs]

@@ColinDyckes What's your voltage/LLC?

[@SimplisticMinimalist]

Has the EK a new version? Last time I checked like 2 weeks ago Arctic freezer 420 was the best AIO

[@antiHUMANDesigns]

@@SimplisticMinimalist It may be that a 420 will beat a 360, yes. Der8auer did a comparison test of many AIOs, and the EK beat the artic freezer 360, at least. Marginally.

[@malccy72]

Good info vid but what's with the constant annoying door chimes in background?

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@MrTorexko]

Very informative, thank you!

[@USmanPakiGamingZone]

Dude Hi, I have a specific and short question. I have recently installed CORSAIR H150 360mm Liquid water AIO cooler for Intel 13th generation I9 13900K processor? Only 2 feedbacks needed: 1. How long can this AIO liquid water cooler run, even if my kids game at maximum whole day ? 2. Secondly how is it for Intel 13th generation I9 13900K processor?

[@AnthonyStudio]

Thank You so much for this video. Have an Intel 13600K and Arc 770 sitting on the desk and looking for info related to cpu + cooling. Spent approx 8 hrs today so far researching cooling options - this video is *hands down* the single most helpful piece of information on the internet so far related to 13th gen chip - cooling. Again, thank you!

[@HardwareCanucks]

Thanks man!

[@Starrk_1]

So AK400 cooler okay with i5 13600k??

[@shutitfukface]

my i5 13600k runs at 5.5 single core load, 5.4 all core on the P's and 4.3 on the E's all while hitting 180 watts on a single stack air cooler... All I did was hit AutoOC in the Intel Extreme Tuning Utility and it did that itself. No manual OC needed.

[@Starrk_1]

@@thrushton2631 I returned it and bought Deepcool LS720 360mm liquid cooler

[@cojo51]

Just out of curiosity, why haven’t you reviewed the 13700K yet? I’ve only been seeing the bigger tech tubers reviewing the i5 and the i9. Some of the smaller tech channels have been putting up i7 reviews. Edit: I bought the i7 figuring it’s a binned 12900k with a little extra cache but I do wanna know what you guys think of it.

[@WayStedYou]

Intel only sent 13600k and 900k to most outlets.

[@HardwareCanucks]

Because these are the CPUs we were seeded. We typically buy the others but haven't gotten around to it this time.

[@PunzL]

@@WayStedYou But why? It seems so weird to not include at least one sku from each tier of the product stack

[@kumarsalib722]

@@PunzL You're welcome to send them one.

[@MR-vj8dn]

Oh I understod your logo just now. Thanks for the video / info.

[@TheDoRelian]

I must say I recently bough a 13600k paired with MSI z690 pro ddr4 motherboard, and all I did (after updating to the last BIOS, needed for Intel 13 series) was setting my ram to XMP profile, and approving a tower-based air cooling solution. Obviously MSI did the same with 13600k as they are usually doing with the big brothers, so my chip ran piping hot at 100 degrees, sucking up to 3xx watts power, according to BIOS settings. I was forced to manually set a lower CPU lite mode, switched the air-cooling solution to box-cooler in BIOS, set a 150w limit for short time peak power, then everything worked perfectly fine

[@josesilva-pn9jw]

By spec max turbo power is 181 watts for this CPU, I've set it to the limit 181 watts in z790 mobo and now it is cool between 50 ~ 80 degrees. Also I've set CPU Tj Max to 98 degrees (someone here have verified that asrock and asus mobo set it to 115 degrees by default, but it is too much I guess)

[@claytonjames4779]

Do you have a video talking about the 149000k?

[@numbersix9477]

Succinct. Informative. Great choice of topic. Well done!

[@marshalllaw5349]

What case was used for testing? The Phantek G360A?

[@vMaxHeadroom]

Sanity at last...Running a 13700K small overclock to 5.4GHz all P cores and 4.4GHz all E Cores with an adaptive vcore at max 1.278v in Cenebench R23 gets over 31K multi score with temps never going over 80 Degrees with a 360mm AIO. In gaming in the low 40's to mid 50's. Power suseag is also great with idle and low useage between 15 to 35w with the e cores actually making a difference, and in gaming anywhere between 70w and 120w dependant on game. even when decoding or rendering the power usage is more than manageble and with a small negative offset even better. The 13600K and even the 13700K will run more than fine with a good quality air cooler or 240mm aio...Yes the Ryzen 7000 series are most certainly effecient but averaged out they are pretty much even...

[@veo16]

So what’s the ideal temp to get a 13900 to? 50-60C? And do we just set a temp target with some software

[@PsychoStreak]

These numbers still suggest that the higher end chips will be even more of a challenge for SFF builders unless they do some significant tweaking, or just give in and go with the lower spec CPUs. Also, what were the noise levels like with those coolers running full tilt? Would like to see you do a SFF cooler test with these chips, if only to show just how bad it can get. I think a LOT of people are put off by the apparent NEED to get an AIO (for those all core workloads), and that Intel's reviewer guide specified using a high end AIO. That really is problematic for people who were thinking about just dropping in a new MB & CPU in their existing case if a large AIO simply won't fit. That said, good job pointing out the shady practice of MB's coming with Palpatine mode (UNLIMITED POWER!) mode as the default. People who don't know better and buy the highest end assuming it's the best are going to have those heat and power consumption issues because they won't think to check that setting. Hopefully some of them or people they'll listen to will see this and check it.

[@teeaymusik9811]

Should i disable the unlimited power mode in my mainboard?

[@PsychoStreak]

@@teeaymusik9811 If you're not experiencing throttling or very high temps, then no, it's not necessary. If you are, that might help.

[@RFXCasey]

My MSI z690 Pro does not have the option in the BIOS to set 'per core', only all, turbo and turbo offset. I don't know what to do, please help.

[@simoSLJ89]

Thank you Mike! I'm going to buy a 13900k, and I will stick to intel specs, since I will stay on air with my "old" D15S chromax. I have a problem with using water in my systems :D even if they are just AIO

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@ausview4229]

may i ask whats the problem

[@simoSLJ89]

@@ausview4229 Fear. Nightmares of water leaking on my gpu, my psu, my ssds. The horror of losing components, losing data, losing sanity. Air. Air is all I need.

[@teeaymusik9811]

@@simoSLJ89 Haha yeah and a normal cpu cooler looks nicer imho.

[@SmokeSolo1975]

How come no one mentions undervolting instead of underwatting. I've got a 13700kf that at first was going to 100 degrees. After turning my vcore down . 1.25 and applying 2 levels of load line calibration my 13700k runs at 5.4 all core on p cores and 4.3 all core e core and temps max at 80 degrees. And in gaming doesn't top 50 degrees.

[@AeiKei]

Great temp, what cooling solution are you using? I have 5.4p/4.4e all core at 1.16v stable but still peaking at 90-91 degrees on cinebench 30 min run

[@SmokeSolo1975]

@@AeiKei 360mm artic liquid freezer 2 aio

[@AeiKei]

@@SmokeSolo1975 yeah that explains it, unfortunately i can't fit a 360 in the case i'm using. Indeed undervolting is the way to go. Thanks for the reply, cheers!

[@colinmcbottle]

With undervolting you need to stress test as much as you do with overclocking, to see if you are rock solid. WIth underwatting/underamping, you are still using Intel's validated stock f/v curve, which we know its rock solid. So its just the easier plug and play option. It indeed is more inneficient tho on a pure perf/w angle, but for people that use their pcs for productivity besides gaming the extra peace of mind is invaluable.

[@raincatchfire]

@@colinmcbottle Can you tell me more about under watting the 13600k? How many watts can you get it down to? Thanks!

[@DZ-og7pm]

Excellent Job you‘ve done here again - thank you so much 👌🏻👏🏻🤗

[@N3KO_79]

i have the 13600KF and for me is the best CPU actually... no expensive, DDR4 support, older chipset support... and power enough for all games

[@LineIDse89kim]

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[@teeaymusik9811]

It's even overkill for games. It has so much power that you can do everything with it.

[@thecowboyfromcali]

I have a Noctua NH-D15 air cooling my 13900k, and it's spectacular. I have no heat issues, it rarely gets above 60-65 degrees celsius, and isn't super loud at all. The coil whine on my Gigabyte Gaming Master RTX 4090 is actually louder than the tower cooler

[@cgroyg]

Are u gaming or rendering

[@Michael-ue9nv]

4:16 4 kW and 500 A limits lmao

[@ABaumstumpf]

Yeah - the supposed "intel" limits as he says are already running the CPU without any powerlimits cause none of the Z-boards follow the specs.

[@Michael-ue9nv]

@@ABaumstumpf ya I just find the specification of these crazy limits so funny. It's like saying the speed limit on a highway is 10,000 mph

[@ABaumstumpf]

@Stein Mauer You can set the powertarget higher, but Ryzen still limits the powerdraw and it is hard getting past ~245W. Cause AMD is limiting the power based on several factors, including temperature - so without sub-zero cooling it is not really possible to let the CPU run free.

[@ABaumstumpf]

@Stein Mauer "The 7950X can absolutely draw ~300W just by changing the power limits, with no crazy cooling." Try it - just try it. "They are stock about 250W and can be set higher with very diminishing returns." 125W - not a single CPU is higher. What you are talking about is the board-partners ignoring all powerlimits on Z-boards.

[@Marvolzz]

Do you think the NZXT Cracken X73 AIO it’s good for enough for the I nine 1300 K120 mm

[@petkozhivkov4271]

If you limit the Raptor by current(А), it becomes much more energy efficient than if it is limited by PL.

[@CreativeCommons277]

Does it hinder performance

[@petkozhivkov4271]

Limits always hinder the performance but current limit in most of the cases causes less performance loss that the PL for the similar power.