Intel's Tom Petersen Talks B580, B570, XeSS2 & More | The Full Nerd Special

[@hbdude155]

Tom always game. Hoping for the best for this launch, competition is desperately needed

[@wargamingrefugee9065]

As an early Arc adopter, my A770 LE 16GB (and later on an A750 LE) have worked flawlessly. 16GB of vRAM really opened up the world of Stable Diffusion on Linux for me. Thank-you oneAPI and OpenVINO teams! :-) Just recently I demo'ed all of Topaz Labs' software; all three programs worked great on the A750's 8GB and I made the Black Friday bundle purchase. For the games I play, mainly World of Tanks and War Thunder, Arc's drivers have always worked. Thank-you Arc drivers teams and please keep those Windows and Linux drivers coming; you folks keep making things better and better. Arc has gone from a grit my teeth and hope for the best initial purchase to having earned a place in both my Linux and gaming PC's. I'm looking forward to buying a B770 as I'm still on PCIe 3 and would like to have all 16 lanes of PCIe bandwidth. Intel, don't give up -- you're making believers out of us. :-)

[@oneanother1]

Yeah, but the speed in image generation is no near nvidia's GPU, and you can make it even faster with the rtx extension. Intel isn't offering a 16gb vram model for their next gen GPU, correct? And so fast we don't know how fast it compares to nvidia. Also, performance per power efficiency is important when it comes to image generation. My 2080ti can undervolt to 140w while being as fast, slower by a couple of seconds. The older Intel GPUs were power hogs, and really slow on image generation speeds. Same with amd, sloooowww. Intel needs to prove itself for image generation, 12gb is not enough. And not likely to beat nvidia any time soon.

[@PixelatedWolf2077]

Did you ever game on it? If you did, then did you ever mess around with the settings in Arc control that allowed you to emulate a game more or less if it needed it?

[@wargamingrefugee9065]

@@PixelatedWolf2077 Hello, There are only two games which I play -- World of Tanks and War Thunder (I did spend some time in S.T.A.L.K.E.R. Anomaly which ran well.) I play on an old Samsung LS32D85KTSR/ZA 32" 1440p monitor which is limited to 60Hz. Arc's control panel isn't something I've spent much time in nor have I run an emulator.

[@paulboyce8537]

It is great there is so much interest on B770/B780. Keep the pressure. We need these for 4k.

[@artun42]

or future proof 1440p

[@paulboyce8537]

@@artun42 Games are getting heavy that's for sure. Yet there is a set amount of pixels to render. I think we are getting close to what hardware can do and major new step will take a big effort. I think most of the improvement will come from AI and software.

[@artun42]

@@paulboyce8537 games are getting heavier, yet not better looking, or longer. but yeah, matrix acceleration is the key for better performance

[@TechAmbr]

1:35:14 Bummer, no VR support. I think B580 could be a great mid-range VR card. It's disappointing that there's no support. Alchemist was "not yet" for its whole development cycle; hopefully this "not yet" actually becomes a "later."

[@garryarganis5801]

you might be one of the 20 people in the entire planet that cares about VR, honestly. i was expecting VR to die off by now and im dead serious, no cap.

[@BLAZEVENTURA904]

@@garryarganis5801 It must be 20 very rich people for there to be as many headset sales as there are.

[@diamondxdragons]

@@garryarganis5801 More than you think kiddo.

[@jonathanjones7751]

TAP for Intel CEO

[@thequestingblade]

he can finish the job of running it into the ground with happy talk and sub-par products

[@RiftWarth]

​​@@thequestingblade fanboy comment

[@thequestingblade]

@RiftWarth just a bit jaded because i fell for the hype a dozen too many times when the spooky skeleton guy was in charge

[@RiftWarth]

@@thequestingblade Yeah, I see your point. Hopefully, all the ass-kicking they’ve been getting wakes them up, because we can’t have one dominant player in the market. We’d just end up right back where we started.

[@itburnswhenip1963]

Tom is always fun to listen to. One of the few in the industry who seems to be legitimately excited about his job and it makes his interviews a lot easier to listen to and absorb especially because he really knows his stuff so it can be over my head sometimes.

[@Gnerma]

Tom is always excellent. Lots of really great information in here.

[@AI-STORY-gg]

New Intel CEO is here

[@saulgoodman2305]

I was also going to say same

[@delicious_seabass]

Hahaha. No. Not even close.

[@AI-STORY-gg]

@@delicious_seabass yes not even close

[@squatch545]

Actual Battlemage discussion starts @10:00

[@David_Banner]

A 12GB intel card for the price is excellent compared to a 8GB Nvidia 4060 non Ti. I really hope these cards workout and sell a load for Intel.

[@pfk2005]

I ordered the ASRock B580 from NewEgg this week. Can’t wait to get some juice Battlemage RT and XeSS

[@Act1veSp1n]

If Intel can release a 16-24GB card that is decently priced - they would be great for AI work - I would buy one for local Ollama setup.

[@Veptis]

1:23:56 thanks for taking my question on the topic. I have been reading the Intel affiliated research papers on the topic and was hoping for it to be productized already. Especially since GFFE provided a solution to do it easier than ExtraSS (extrapolation with some guidance). But maybe that is still in the near future (or nvidia does it before Intel?). If Tom says that the problems are jitter... I want to see this in a demo application. Maybe that will be my winter project... but shortcutting some of the classical render pipeline with guided extrapolation might bring any latency target we want. Also Will, if you had a time to skim the papers or just see the demo videos - what do you feel about this from a game dev perspective?

[@BarisYener]

great content, good questions and answers.

[@bmqww223]

sad prt is nobody asked whether if we get more driver updates will we get more performance out of the battlmage cards given how architecturally its distinch from alchemist and the die size of these cards are huge compared to nvidia and amd for the price or product class......

[@xBINARYGODx]

@@bmqww223 huge compared to nvidia? lol, the actual die area looks like a core based cpu and is smaller than the die area on most nvidia cards, which is more spread out - the size of the spreader might be the same or somewhat larger on intel, the die is not.

[@bmqww223]

@@xBINARYGODx AD104 is 294 mm and b580's is 272mm , intel is selling a rtx 4070 class gpu at the price of entry level gpu price.... so i guess they are breaking even(hopefully not at loss, because we need intel unless we want to buy gpus with trading our organs)....... btw next time you open your mouth do a bit of research, otherwise you seem like fool in front of everyone.....anyways my question is that with further driver updates will we eventually get near rtx 4070 level performance since the die is huge and hardware wise intel is there but driver wise it isnt.... if they can promise that theyll give a huge performance boost in future then intel can be the king

[@kazumakazuma5814]

Did they fix the idle power draw?

[@menger88p]

They did

[@kazumakazuma5814]

@@menger88p thanks for the info, really appreciate it

[@smashishere]

i would get an arc gpu just because of how awesome tom petersen seems to be, i love how much he interacts with us consumers, does nvidia or amd do that noooo

[@SashimiSteak]

The future is Full Dive VR.

[@M_Pingouin]

What a treat! My mind is blown, Thanks,

[@DJ-fw7mi]

Blue berry! Team blue wth big miss boys. Excited for the B580 if the features and drivers are solid I'll get one for my living room PC.

[@Mynx31]

B580 launches first so this is the flagship Battlemage?

[@fpgamemearray]

will they update the model in XeSS 1 though? they say they want cross-vendor compatibility but keeping the updates on XeSS 2 is kinda the same as DLSS.

[@senpos]

Tom is really nice presenter of the tech stuff. Ordered B580 from Sparkle just now (finally, it is available in Ukraine!)

[@kennethwilson8236]

really good point on Copilot and desktop

[@PedroDavidMoran]

DESCENTTTTTT WoW AMAZING!!!!. I remember in the 90's had an IBM and with Descent I put a blanket over my head reaching the CRT.....which mean I was Using the First Headset-VR* ... 😎🤓🤓🧐 Ps: The enemy Ships always gave me a weird feeling of....."Too smart" (AKA AI) (*Headset-VR experience)

[@HarelJann]

Well spoken and to the point, always educational and insightful to listen to Tom. I hope that over the next years arc would become a massive success for intel and Tom would be Intel CEO!

[@Housey29]

Was hoping for 4070 level card, not sure whether it’s worth swapping for my 3060 12gb model need to see the difference.

[@UnluckyDomino]

Definitely not worth it if you're coming from a 3060. Only upgrades considering would be cards like at least 7700 XT, 4070, 4070 S, 7800 XT

[@Housey29]

@ yes these are the cards I was considering still feel their still pricey so the wait continues!

[@odetojamie]

so in theory this would be an upgrade over a 8gb a770?

[@zivzulander]

Yes, if the marketing charts turn out to be accurate. You'll be getting a 4GB VRAM upgrade (8GB ->12GB) regardless. Personally, I'd wait to see if they announce a B770 and/or B750 around CES next month, which would hopefully target 4080 and 4070 levels, and possibly undercut Nvidia and AMD next generation cards at mid/upper-range performance.

[@RTX_Zombie]

@@zivzulander 32 xe2 cores for b770 = 4070 ti super performance. if its priced at 400$, it will be amazing

[@kennethwilson8236]

only 50 driver versions , feels like more with the in between non-WHQL versions

[@Serzari]

1:35:15 Thank you for getting an answer on this. Intel constantly said ARC would get VR support "later" as a lower priority and it never did. I'll be going AMD or Nvidia then, not chancing a "yet" that never comes

[@L08Productions]

I still have a 1080ti and I'm in the market for a new gpu. I'm not wanting to spend $1000+ on a new gpu, so if the B770 comes out soon that will probably be my next gpu. I have a laptop with Intel iris Xe graphics and an i5 and I'm pretty impressed with the performance of it. It was an Xmas gift last year for school, but so far this $400 laptop is holding up pretty well. Competition is good :)

[@xBINARYGODx]

rumor has it they launch/"launch" B770 (and 750 and/or 780 or something) at CES since they would more directly competing with 5070 and maybe 5070Ti, and saying "as good as 5070 at 2/3 the price" is great pr and pwnage

[@Regiampiero1]

580 Premiere? Does that mean no 700 series this time around?

[@kennethwilson8236]

great podcast

[@amyn227]

I just got to know Tom left nvidia for intel. Now with the new intel arc... This is amazing!

[@4brotroydavis]

Here looking for as much battlemage info as possible...but the search has showed me i can get an a770 for my needs if battlemage isnt available....might put that money towards a new monitor and see if they bring us a b770

[@retrosean199]

Clearly the solution is a name plate you can rotate, like on CPU pump blocks etc.

[@jwdickieson]

Oops you mean sapphire fury for air passthrough....😉

[@Reaper9-4]

HIGHER TIER CARDS CONFIRMED ! hope they perform great like a 4070 ti or just below for half the price then im truly all in on intel. If b580 is atleast 50% better with the softwares than 2080 super then im switching easy, and thats cause nvidia doesnt support their older cards cause of greed.

[@_shreyash_anand]

Nvidia is actually great at supporting older GPUs. My GTX 1060 laptop still gets regular driver updates

[@wargamingrefugee9065]

@@_shreyash_anand Yeah, nVidia is great with driver support. I just checked, my GTX 960 card is still getting driver updates. The most recent is from Tue Nov 12, 2024.

[@thequestingblade]

Tom ate a pie and stopped by to show us his Intel BM

[@voidmind]

I really hope Intel keeps releasing graphics cards. If I had not upgraded to a 7800 XT, I would totally be buying the B580. I just hate that all decent cards are above $500 right now. Cool that Linux is becoming popular enough that people ask about support. That's what I run, and I appreciate Intel's open source contributions.

[@johnsmith-i5j7i]

Would be even better if the drivers were open source.

[@wargamingrefugee9065]

@@johnsmith-i5j7i Intel's graphics drivers are open source. OpenVINO is open source. OneAPI is an open standard. Arc's firmware is not open source, however.

[@xBINARYGODx]

"Cool that Linux is becoming popular enough that people ask about support" outside of a specific device(s) its basically nothing, and with it, its still down at like 2% of steam. SteamOS/etc helped a little, and Desk gave a nice tiny boost more - but you linux gamers remain a vanishingly small percentage and your guesses about W11 and Windows in general remain in fantasy land because you fail to understand your average PC gamer or gamer of any kind - you niche inside a niche inside a niche inside another niche. Spend less time being a lying console-like fanboy, and maybe contribute to the cause where the energy is better spent. Also, no, simply using a thing is not helping.

[@kennethwilson8236]

Xess2 on Arc A770?

[@artun42]

Upscaling part yeah, XeLL - maybe, Tom himself doesn’t know yet, XeFG - definitely not.

[@ovemalmstrom7428]

Battlemage seems really interesting!

[@docbrody]

Pecan pie is the only correct answer

[@zolerii]

Came here to say that myself.

[@-INFERNUS-]

I eat it hot right out of the oven 🥧

[@liquidcorundum6568]

Next time a reviewer seems to favor Intel products over other brands, we can say they were bribed with pumpkin pie :^)

[@Cybebe]

For Intel to succeed: 1. A card running 90% games at 1080p with ultra settings @ $295 2. A card running 90% games at 1440p with ultra settings @ 395 3. A card running 4k games at high settings@ 495 Its all it needs to succeed

[@kennethwilson8236]

want a B770

[@Golscamp33]

Get that man a lozenge.

[@jeremycatches9766]

Argh. I just ordered one and now i may have to send it back, because VR is important to me. :(

[@tipoomaster]

TaP rules ...CEO?

[@kennethwilson8236]

new Indiana Jones game . requires hardware ray tracing.. trying to figure who paid them to do that.

[@stz1973]

Again, anytime TAP is speaking, you should be listening. And he makes pie....

[@jdkshuooc]

good interview , just kinda sick of looking at brad for the entire show might be a good idea to swap brad out with the other guest once in a while or keep both of them in the corner of the screen and use the main window for slides

[@davidgunther8428]

The future, where the game AIs play you! 😅

[@wargamingrefugee9065]

LOL! Good one. :-)

[@magnusnilsson9792]

Rhubarb is the best Pie.

[@johnsmith-i5j7i]

Why are they wearing headphones?

[@wargamingrefugee9065]

Audio feedback -- two participants weren't in the studio. Also, wearing headphones let's a speaker know how they sound to us in the audience. And, finally, the show's audio engineer/producer/director can communicate with the show's participants discretely to inform somebody if their audio has problems or if there's something else they need to know about. Actually, there's likely more to it than those reasons; I'm just talking off the top of my head and recalling some general knowledge I've learned.

[@middle_pickup]

There are games that will be well suited for the fake frames AI bullshit. There are just as many that will never be, notable competitive esports like Valorant, or Counter-Strike.

[@sleekblackroadster]

I think he was referring to Pâte Brisée

[@shogunluffy]

Should have said i am legend but already being used before lol.

[@jaegerjaquez1944]

I take MiLD leaks with a grain o salt as Battlemage is here after all. Really hope Intel follows through, else they will lose what credibility they have left. Cotninuing to roll out these products and same generic PR speak only to have them reviewed poorly with no change in stance "everything is fine" when clearly they need to shake things up is just sad at this point.

[@kennethwilson8236]

disagree on latency and being ok with AI generated frames versus real performance, this is why we have no real improvement in performance, lazy approach to improvement

[@ZizoYahya-ly3ge]

IF this is a suceesor to A580 and since it's being marketed as 1440p then this is a very good value GPU. 24% faster than a750 at 1440p as shown in the slides, so indeed 'dramatic' improvement gen on gen as far as arc whole arc architecture is concerned. Dramatic in the sense alchemist architecture was held down by the architecture itself not letting it reach performance target class of GPUs and battlemage architectural leap /fixes is delivering the full raw performance. A580 is 6600 level card (should be way faster but it's not due to architecture holding it from performing as it should be). Following the naming scheme If : A580 - B580 (Entry level) 500s. A770 - B770 (High end card) 700s A750 - B750 (Mid range) 700s. A380-B380 (?) (Lower end card) Maybe an even higher end card B780 (?). Let's do some numbers Gen on gen uplift : More or less : AMD Gen on gen 7600 8gb (successor) uplift is 30% over 6600. B580 Gen on Gen uplift is 35% over A580 plus 4+gb of vram. Intel says B580 12gb is 10% faster than 4060 8gb at 1440p. Nvidia Gen on Gen 4060 8gb Gen on Gen is 20% faster over 3060 with less 4gb vram. B580 > 4060 by a 10% in this sense is truly great if it's the succesor to A580. Especially Considering 4060> 7600 > 3060 > 6600 relatively. How fast B750 would be? Technically it needs to be faster than a 4070. But the jump from a 4060 to a 4070 is ridiculous but still this is how competition works. These GPUs class is overpriced to begin with. B770 high end card would be as fast as 7900xt and even reach 4080 levels. Because well the next gen GPUs are releasing next months and who knows how much performance boost they'd get over previous cards.

[@-INFERNUS-]

Since Intel is serious about GPUs ( I still feel CPUs need more attention first) where are their GPUs to go up against Nvidia's 50 series? Nevermind last gen. Any 5070, 5070 Ti, or even a 5080 competitor? This is what I want to see.

[@ScottyDo3sntKnow]

I can’t see them competing much with the new gen stuff, but all they will be aiming for is to be better and cheaper and AMD to take some of their market share! They can worry about Nvidia at another date

[@LuizFernando-li1du]

I think they are serious about it, but they know they can't compete with NVIDIA in the high-end yet. NVIDIA products are just way more solid and complete as of now, Intel wouldn't be able to charge a premium on a product that is not at the same level of maturity I believe. At least it seems that they're catching up fairly fast, maybe Druid will get a high-end model if Battlemage and Celestial show good sales.

[@-INFERNUS-]

@LuizFernando-li1du I hope they will make a mid to high end card to cover all tiers, it seems Intel is better than AMD at upscaling, closer to Nvidia than AMD in quality.

[@thesupremeginge]

I don't trust Intel at all. (I was also one of the few who purchased one ARC back at the first launch) I always go AMD, but might consider Nvidia next time around.

[@xnitropunkx]

Trusting any mega corp whos main objective is maximizing profits is silly.

[@oneanother1]

Intel hyped it all too much back in the day. Yet to see how good their frame gen will be. I'm not sure how much excited I can be for a budget GPU that isn't faster than my 2080ti.

[@PixelatedWolf2077]

​@@oneanother1the difference is it'll use less power than your 2080 ti and probably have better RT lol

[@oneanother1]

@@PixelatedWolf2077 I'd be surprised how well the tsmc node was at making the 20 series rtx, mine under volts to 140w and maintains fast speed in image generation. Its the GOAT GPU for image gen because you can upgrade the gram to 22gb. Similar, the 6800rx was very power efficient too due to the tsmc chip node. But these are 4+ year old cards, still very relavent today, because price performance hasn't gone down. I want these new Intel GPUs to do well, they priced them right. Its yet to be seen if they can deliver on image generation. Sure they may be more power efficient due to s brand new tsmc node, but if the performance isn't there. Well, no point to even consider it. We will have to wait and see, plus 12gb gram isn't enough for image gen. And if its slow, forget about it.

[@PixelatedWolf2077]

@@oneanother1 It uses resizable BAR so there's a chance it could outdo a non-VRAM modded RTX 20's card. I'm not the biggest AI person but it would be cool if Intel did happen to make a competent AI card. It would be nice for LLMs at home

[@xBINARYGODx]

I will watch this for Peterson's words - but PCWorld is hard to take seriously if they publish garbage like "PlayStation 5 Pro review: The only true alternative to a gaming PC" instead of articles like "for about $100 more you get an AMD rig that does way more than any console will ever do". The powers that be at your site must be the subsection of PC gamers who also buy a PS console and then act like console fanboys on Steam - the worst of the worst, yes, even worse than lying Linux gamers who contribute nothing to their cause except acting like console fanboys over an OS to the detriment of many online conversations the world over.

[@spewp]

Hard to take this "Full Nerd" podcast seriously when Will Smith cannot pronounce the word "executable" correctly.