Is Avatar (2009) Overrated?

Avatar 2 is coming out this year so I decided to rewatch the first one and see how it holds up. I remember really loving it in the theaters, but I felt very outnumbered by the lackluster response. It seemed to me, from what I heard from friends and the internet in general, is that most people didn’t like it very much. Why have I heard nothing but negative stuff about this film? If its so bad, why is it getting a sequel? People say it's "overrated", so let's investigate.
Directed by James Cameron, Avatar (2009) stars Sam Worthington as Jake Sully and Zoe Saldana as Neytiri a Na'vi Warrior. Also starring Sigourney Weaver, Stephen Lang, Michelle Rodriguez, and Giovanni Ribisi.
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[@BSzili]

When Avatar came out the hype was incredible, and it seemed like everyone was blown away by it and they were endlessly gushing about the movie. I think this is what a lot of people mean when they call it overrated.

[@jamiemc2313]

Agreed, I think it's like when people call Cyber 2077 overrated, qhat they actually mean ia that it was overhyped. Sometimes people get mixed up on the admiteddly similar concepts.

[@kayzee3595]

It’s not overrated. It’s over-enviable.

[@churlbeck6321]

Movies don't make almost $3b unless someone is praising it.

[@tylerphillips6523]

Exactly, they are responding to a specific timeline.

[@KevinJDildonik]

OP is correct. This was years before Disney Star Wars. The public had never seen a marketing blitz of this magnitude before. James Cameron was talking about something crazy like making 7 Avatar films back-to-back because this would be a multi-trillion-dollar franchise and the literal greatest thing in cinema ever and revolutionize all moviemaking forever. Then it came out and let's be honest, it's basically just Pocohontas with expensive CG. That contrast is why people say they "hate" the film. It's not a bad film, it's just way, way, WAY overhyped.

[@rmiller6975]

I seem to remember Avatar was 3D too and that was a big part of the hype. It was "visually stunning."

[@Adrian2140]

It's gonna age just like Crysis or Cyberpuk in gaming did.

[@nielsunnerup7099]

@@Adrian2140 has crysis not aged well?

[@DjTrustNo.1]

@@nielsunnerup7099 isnt Cyberpunk redeeming itself?

[@renofheavens2]

I just rewatched it in theaters. Still incredible

[@ggs27]

Why is "visually stunning" in quotes??

[@Darksephir985]

It wasn't marketed as "Avatar" but rather "James Cameron's Avatar". James Cameron putting his name on the marketing really helped a lot and got everyone talking.

[@Burnzy494959]

Definitely. If it was Bob Jones Avatar I suspect it wouldn't have done nearly as well

[@calvinnigh5489]

I’m pretty sure this was partly to do with the Last Airbender conflation.

[@weatheredtome]

Lol cmon. His name did nothing for Dark Fate.

[@VTuber_Central]

and due to social politics it won't help him anymore, remember his T6? or terminator genishit?

[@tom4150]

Really, I never called it James Cameron's.

[@Dipsxi]

I love when James makes videos like this, just him talking about things he’s interested in. It’s refreshing

[@borissidealmeida]

Me too! I really like how He expresses his ideas, He is really respectful to people's work

[@territorialamcape2726]

James Cameron or James the avgn?

[@sluming2672]

i miss avgn :(

[@Daniel-Munoz]

it's my favorite videos of his. I've been binging. Wish there was a playlist.

[@bas9752]

@@territorialamcape2726 neither, James rolfe

[@thatcherfreeman]

I remember really enjoying Avatar when I saw it in theaters, but somehow there's something really forgettable about it. I never heard of any of my friends rewatching Avatar, but I know plenty of people who have watched Titanic and other movies several times.

[@favoritemustard3542]

Gonna watch the sequel?

[@UnizzyMD]

It's forgettable cause the story was so unoriginal. It's the most generic plot ever.

[@releasedakracken5175]

@@UnizzyMD I agree. And I'm tired of these sci-fi movies, that take place hundreds of years in the future, and our propensity for colonization and intolerance hasn't changed a bit. What a pessimistic mindset and view of humanity. It's actually quite depressing

[@chrisbarnett5303]

@@releasedakracken5175 reality is depressing

[@dachel683]

@@AcousticOlli unfortunately yes.

[@Gustavo-fm2vm]

I was blown away by the 3D effects and the visuals when I watched at the Movie Theater, one of the few movies that got the 3D right.

[@Fedorevsky]

I wasn't. looked lame and cartooney.

[@lukapitkanen3333]

@@Fedorevsky ok

[@Andronicus87]

Avatar is one of my favorite movies and i cannot wait for Way of the Water.

[@EricFancher]

Agreed- for me, I've seen 3 movies that 3D worked and didn't feel gimmicky. Avatar, Tron: Legacy, and Hugo. And I saw a LOT of movies in 3D in those days.

[@elder-woodsilverstein7716]

The idea of recycling ideas is like ET, The Iron Giant, and Lilo and Stitch having the same plot. They each do things differently and give you a different experience. That is why Mac and Me didn't work, it felt too similar to ET and that's why it didn't connect with people.

[@SofaCitySweetheart]

Great analysis. The main thing I remember from when this came out was it being touted as the best movie ever made! Not sure where that much hype came from, but I can understand people being let down if they set the bar that high.

[@jeh-jeal8403]

I'm really surprised you hadn't seen Dances With Wolves before this! Not being mean, just knowing how big a film buff you are it blew my mind. It's great that watching Avatar again got you to watch DWW and I'm glad you enjoyed it, definitely one of my favs!

[@Downhuman74]

Fun fact: Dark City and The Matrix shared some of the exact same sets. Both filmed on the same soundstage in Australia and The Matrix re-used some of the sets built for Dark City.

[@crazysilly2914]

I call it: The ‘Trix

[@chrisbarnett5303]

While the Matrix is great, Dark City is the superior film of the two

[@Downhuman74]

@@chrisbarnett5303 I agree and was fortunate to see both in a theater. You have to agree, though, the late 90's was an embarrassment of riches for ground-breaking popular cinema. Matrix and Dark City both belong in that category.

[@SmegulonPrime]

How is this relevant

[@kev3d]

@CtrlALlTerrorS Shell Beach? It's right over... You get to it by uh... You have to cross the um... That's funny, I can't remember.

[@OldMovieRob]

I really appreciate your down to earth analysis of films like this.

[@tresf]

Fantastic review. There's not much better than having repeated phrases corrected (clarified?) like this. Also, your friendly face, detailed research and calm demeanor really make it enjoyable. 👏👏

[@NecroxProduction]

It's funny, because all I heard when it came out is how amazing and ground braking it is. When I watched it was like a remake of Pocahontas or something, just average story about "evil men colonizing locals". Watched it once back then and forgot about it.

[@GringoXalapeno]

Well it is the inverse of the alien invasion story with the humans invading the aliens world

[@Blucham]

My experience is the exact opposite. I enjoyed it just fine and loved the visuals, and frankly “evil men colonizing locals” stories should be told more. I found myself trying to defend it more than I actually liked it though, just because it was getting discredited so harshly.

[@jayb.2649]

Box office says that most everyday people didn’t watch or remembered Pocahontas Ferbgully. Wait. Cameron did say he don’t make films for the niche movie circles. So it makes sense.

[@crazysilly2914]

Hollywoke loves to push the 'evil white men colonizing poor oppressed diverse locals’ plot.

[@robd1329]

Same here...saw it once. Never talked about it or remembered it afterwards

[@twitchybarber]

I remember everyone praising it initially. As the hype wore off, people started referring to it as 3D Pocahontas. Edit: I agree Fern Gully is more accurate. This was just a recollection of my own experiences.

[@dublev78]

I always called it Dances with Smurfs

[@mr.awesome6011]

Fern Gully

[@I_like_turtles_67]

@@dublev78 Southpark was hilarious for that one.

[@BoozyBeggar]

@@dublev78 I'd much rather watch Gargamel lose over and over again, lol.

[@BRAINFOXINFINITE]

I always thought of it as Disney's Atlantis in space. May as well be now that Fox got bought out.

[@KingHayabusa384]

I watched it on the big screen with all those amazing 3D effect and I loved it. When I rewatched it on the TV withoud 3D, it was just an okayish SciFi flick.

[@McMeatBag]

Exactly how I felt

[@chisomololo4941]

So your opinion changed, huh?

[@jomoser83]

I remember thinking it was ok but wasn't in my top 10 list. What I always found funny was that it's to top grossing movie but no one could tell you a single characters name in it! Like if you were to stoo someone on the street and say "Avatar made 2.8 billion dollars and is still the top movie. Who's the main character?" I bet no one could tell you. Most people know what it's about, at least "its about the blue people " but that's it. I agree that I think it was over hyped

[@n64central]

Funny enough, I’ve seen half of Titanic but I know it revolves around Jack and Rose. I literally couldn’t tell you anything about this

[@Kinkoyaburi]

I can tell you even some of the names of the secondary characters. It's all about how engaged you are and how many times you've watched it. I've seen it about 20 times.

[@WinnieTheTrain]

You are probably right, I seen avatar, and don't remember the characters names lol.

[@happyspaceinvader508]

@@Kinkoyaburi Then you’re not the average viewer we’re talking about here.

[@niceboy6010]

One thing I noticed is that even though this movie is absolutely massive. Everyone knows it. I don't think it sticks with the culture like other massive movies. Everyone know and loves the "titanic pose" they do at the front of the ship, the "thanos snap", and lightsabers. I've never once heard anyone make an avatar reference.

[@megaman13able]

Yes, this!

[@ChubbsTheCat]

i dunno, I use "unobtanium" a lot, it's also in the movie 'The Core' too.

[@breadordecide]

Nobody makes top gun references and the sequel just made a billion dollars. Memes are not a measure of whether or not an audience want to see a movie.

[@riseagain845]

@@breadordecide I've heard a lot more top gun references than I have Avatar references...

[@lindinle]

Top gun was at least referenced in other things since. Like ted there no staying power with avatar.

[@TobiAnimados]

Great video as usual! Talking about James Cameron, I would love to hear James reviewing Alita: Battle Angel (since the screenplay and production are Cameron's). I would rather a sequel from that movie than Avatar, but well I also liked Avatar.

[@thelookingcat]

Alita became one is my favorite movies rather quickly, having a lot of rewatching value

[@SurvivenTerry]

I saw avatar in imax true 3D and it was the vary definition of what 3D should have been...the floating seeds seen they were everywhere all over the theater....I have never seen a mover so beautiful and truly 3D and I never saw one again

[@fydiousmckormick]

Hugo is the only one i saw that was equal.

[@TheSwordfish009]

Play any modern video game and watch the cutscenes.

[@fydiousmckormick]

@@TheSwordfish009 no, what would be the point? If you’re saying those are going to be an equivalent experience you are out of your mind.

[@Lamtitude]

@@fydiousmckormick Idk man, some modern video games are getting to the point where you can barely tell it’s a game anymore, especially during cut scenes.

[@favoritemustard3542]

The only way a game could be **comparable* to what OP was impressed with (3D) would be VR... & it ain't there yet lol

[@tedlogan5628]

I was a bit bummed out that we lost a decade of James Cameron films just so we could have sequels to this.

[@ateevee2521]

*I was a bit bummed out that we lost a decade of James Cameron films just so we could have a James Cameron film

[@cfighter95]

@@ateevee2521 *I was a bit bummed out that we lost a decade of James Cameron films just so we could have almost a decade of James Cameron films

[@mistermatix8241]

Absolutely! The guy wasted himself. His run of movies from 84 - 97 was magnificent

[@chrisbarnett5303]

Sorry James Cameron does what James Cameron wants to do and Avatar is his passion project

[@rambler1475]

@@mistermatix8241 no love for Piranha 2: the spawning?

[@aureliansmask3502]

I doubt you'll see this James, but I just want to say your film analysis videos are phenomenal. Your passion for the art of filmmaking is clear and makes for a wonderful viewing experience You're an inner circle legend of the internet and continue to spread happiness to millions of people around the world

[@aarontone621]

Without having heard anything about similarities, I rewatched Disney’s Atlantis a few years ago, and I was floored by how much it reminded me of Avatar. I started to wonder if I had conflated the two stories.

[@pizzaishappiness7994]

It's the same movie.

[@SpongeBobaFett]

It's a very common trope. Dances With Wolves, The Last Samurai, Ferngully, all share the same basic storyline

[@gamestation2690]

@@SpongeBobaFett As long as the story is told WELL, and it keeps you invested, that’s all that really matters.

[@Luckmann]

Avatar is literally just a mash-up between Atlantis and Pocahontas. It is all it is. It starts and ends there.

[@gamestation2690]

@@Luckmann So?

[@nicholaspeterson61]

It's weird. I had the exact opposite experience. I didn't really enjoy the movie, but everyone I talked to absolutely loved it.

[@alexkrajci]

R.I.P. James Horner (1953-2015)

[@EricDemamp]

Need more of these types of retrospectives! Love em!

[@MysticMike]

I remember hearing maybe a year after Avatar came out that there would be some sequels. I think I heard maybe in 2015 that there was going to be several sequels like three and it seems like it's getting to that. Also James Cameron is well known for waiting to get a movie done just so technology can catch up.

[@xenobreak1160]

I kept hearing that an Independence Day sequel was coming...then we finally got it 😅

[@HallowedKhaos91]

@@xenobreak1160 I still have yet to watch the sequel, lol.

[@benmalsky9834]

I’m SO happy that after nonstop delays and setbacks, the sequels are finally happening!

[@breadordecide]

@@xenobreak1160 Rolland Emmerich wish he had even one ounce of the talent and genius of james cameron.

[@KLWarlord]

Last I was aware, James Cameron still owns the rights to make an Evangelion movie. He grabbed the rights back in the 90's, I believe, and has been waiting to make the movie.

[@Neezabja]

The visuals, the CG and the novelty of 3D was what earned this film its favourable opinions and box office return.

[@MASTEROFEVIL]

I can't believe we're at a point where Avatar is now considered nostalgic

[@connorkenway09]

Bruh it came out in 2009, what year are you stuck in?

[@41moose]

@@connorkenway09 it’s the same thing as saying nirvana is classic rock

[@Ficek-rv8zw]

@@41moose because it is lol

[@lordbaldi5238]

Starting to feel old? I just recently had a discurs with a young lad and I came up with the movie "the talented Mr.Ripley" and started to compare it to the french original "plain soleil" from the late 70s until I was interrupted by this fine young man asking me what I'm talking about. He never heard of the, in my mind, pretty NEW and Famous hollywood- movie. Turns out this movie "the talented Mr.Ripley" predated his birth by 5 or 6years.... Man, THERE and then I felt old and ignorant. Especially since I myself do neider feel as Adult, Grown-up, mature, let alome OLD!😅

[@Hamstray]

@@lordbaldi5238 that movie was pretty forgettable so idk why you would care

[@efe_aydal]

IMO, as a movie it's a forgettable action sci-fi. But I can understand why it became famous.

[@AaaSWE]

I had exactly the same thoughts about this movie. Now when they show it again at the cinema I am going to see it the way it is meant to be seen. Avatar was an amazing experience.

[@animalxing8697]

I came to literally the exact conclusion you did. Was wondering if you were gonna get there. "Overhyped, not overrated."

[@MrGetwellsoon]

It's interesting because I don't remember Avatar ever being advertised pre-release which may have saved it from being overrated.

[@jamespaul6315]

@@MrGetwellsoon especially as no one rates it really

[@noire.blackheart]

I dunno a single person who has ever stated Avatar is their favorite movie.

[@bradleyc.5425]

Nice pfp

[@animalxing8697]

@@bradleyc.5425 Thx bro. Likewise.

[@ooRay]

Overhyped, not overrated. I remember being so fed up with the hype that I refused to watch it when it came out. I watched it like ten years later on 3D BR and I liked it. But I like Camerons Aliens or Terminator way better.

[@Theneongreninja]

I’ve noticed that James’s genuine personality is the exact opposite of the characters he plays in his YKWBS and AVGN series’. That’s funny to me lol

[@magical571]

I found it extremely by the numbers, you could tune out and still know everything that would happen, there was no real tension at any point

[@Pimpedout007101]

That’s because it’s a white savior movie and we’ve been fed tons of them, another example being the blindside

[@quinton-ashley]

unless you were a kid and you hadn't seen any of the films with a similar narrative to it

[@thekingsig2153]

@@Pimpedout007101 lol the blindside is a literal true story though

[@ironlotus8787]

Crazy Mai You could say that about any movie that came out this year there was plenty of tension. What movie did you watch?

[@MayorBrownn]

@@Pimpedout007101 blue saviour

[@t00ncess]

Never watched it. All I ever heard/read was how "great the CG" was or how "awesome the visuals" were, but never heard much word about the characters, the story, or anything else really. Killed my interest.

[@connor3198]

That's because it is a very forgettable story, it's also unoriginal. This type of story has been done to death even when it came out. It is overrated.

[@Mountainlion118]

How much do you wanna hear before you actually watch it?

[@Kinkoyaburi]

It's your loss.The movie is amazing visual spectacle.

[@Gameprojordan]

Pocahontas in space

[@combatbenyamin]

@@Kinkoyaburi That's the thing. There are plenty of things are amazing visual spectacles AND have great storytelling. Avatar was basically like a grilled cheese without the bread. It basically had nothing to hold it together.

[@YodaPagoda]

I worked overseas when Avatar came out, and it took a while for it to finally arrive at the base I was working at as a civilian. For months, everyone was talking about this movie on MySpace (remember that?) and I had my doubts this would live up to the hype. It wasn't anything earth shattering, but wow the visuals were spectacular and the world-building was well done.

[@skorn8112]

I'd argue that the human weren't the real vilians in Fern Gully, the two in that big machine were basically following orders they assumed from their boss. When the real villain was Tim Currys character Hexas. An embodiment of destruction I think.

[@dipinmylip1171]

Hexxus*

[@MichaelPohoreski]

In Avatar Unobtanium was the commentary on unbridled greed.

[@Mirakelpung]

En embodiment of pollution actually. He's poisonous muck that wants to consume the world, and "greedy human beings will always lend a hand".

[@sirducksworthythe3rd842]

Ferngully has nothing to do with this movie

[@timewave02012]

Maybe the real villain was the friends they made along the way.

[@bongocongo2013]

I really like how the movie had big blue people in it

[@arronbeta598]

This right here. I stg if I don't get more 10 ft tall blue mfs I'm gonna commit warcrimes

[@999jay999]

Wasn't that the smurfs ?

[@nsasupporter7557]

“Big blue people?” Those things did not look like “people,” they looked more like big cat creatures

[@arronbeta598]

@@nsasupporter7557 the word is humanoid and people status isn't only for humans

[@rhysoneill7399]

massively overrated . Apart from the amazing visuals what did it do that other movies hadn't already done better ?

[@vjspectron]

Sooooo much hype. It had a giant budget if I remember correctly and was massively marketed. I remember how cynical some of the merchandising felt as well, given the film's themes of sustainability and conservation. It just had a lot to live up to in the public's mind.

[@jayb.2649]

The public answered. $2.8Bill. Go watch Avatar 2009 Trailer literally they told you the whole movie. Product promised, Product delivered.

[@dspada27]

@@jayb.2649 well the sequels should reach that high then. I doubt massively these sequels will do anywhere near those numbers

[@RmnGnzlz]

It can't be overrated, 99% of people that watched it can't even remember the character's names lol.

[@TheDisgruntledImperial]

Seriously. Remember watching a video where a guy went around asking people to name the characters from Avatar. And several of them thought he meant the Last Airbender.

[@kamikeserpentail3778]

@@TheDisgruntledImperial and those people are right. Avatar is referring to The last Airbender. I will never call this movie anything but James Cameron's avatar.

[@creategreatness8823]

That says more about the people who watched it than it does about the film.

[@RmnGnzlz]

@@creategreatness8823 Does it?

[@gamestation2690]

@@TheDisgruntledImperial Jake Sully, Grace Augistine, Colonel Quaritch, Norm Spellman, Ney'tiri, Tsu'tey, Mo'at, Eytukan

[@YouTubeCensors]

The box office says people liked it. I loved it but I wasn't comparing it to movies I hadn't seen. Which seems to be the most consistent critique i see of Avatar. Oh it's so and so or so and so in space with blue monkeys.. I'm like alright cool, I'm still not ever going to see those movies and I'll keep on liking Avatar

[@markborishnikoff5485]

I’ve never seen dances with wolves but the ferngully is pretty accurate, enemy lovers with a forest about to get destroyed or whatever

[@Jose_Pointero]

Funny enough, I remember Dances With Wolves being ripped on for being overrated back in the day.

[@lartrak]

People were mad it beat out Goodfellas at the Oscars I remember.

[@robcav8747]

I remember this film being an experience. The 3D graphics blew me away and I really did not care about story. At home on dvd it just was nowhere near the same.

[@jschnei3]

The 3D experience is what made it for me. I feel sorry for people who missed the 3D theater experience and watched it on DVD later on, wondering what all the fuss was about.

[@Skrenja]

Same with Top Gun: Maverick. That movie was built for the big screen.

[@onlywiigame.]

That’s why the movie is overated, it’s all visuals no substance

[@brently16]

I'm actually shocked that James had never seen dances with wolves until now

[@RobertK1993]

AVATAR in 3D is better version

[@TheUncleshady]

Avatar isn't necessarily overrated, but nobody is asking for 3+ sequels 13 years later. The characters aren't memorable enough.

[@JonToyCars]

I am happy its only your opinion :))))

[@gandhiatemilkduds5395]

You can’t doubt James Cameron when it comes to sequels. The man made Terminator 2 and Aliens.

[@movieworldcomics242]

And he wrote the screenplay of the second Rambo movie

[@tommj4365]

His movies just keep getting worse and worse

[@cloudtx]

Actually you CAN and should doubt him considering he had a hand on Terminator: Dark Fate and the way it butchered the legacy of the characters he himself created.

[@dspada27]

Alien is a much better movie than aliens.

[@chrisbarnett5303]

@@dspada27 Super subjective. It depends on whether you prefer sci-fi horror or sci-fi action

[@Loanwolf387]

I just want to say I was shocked to hear James didn’t see Dances with Wolves and Fern Gully! These are two films I had vhs of and grew up with ❤

[@tom4150]

We know what dances of wolves is about even without watching it.

[@Loanwolf387]

@@tom4150 Dances with wolves is still an awesome movie and worth the watch, even if you know the general plot

[@tom4150]

@@Loanwolf387 I agree. I think the acting holds up today.

[@Zeltor]

I remember laughing out loud in the cinema when I heard them call this rare and thus hard to get mineral 'Unobtanium', like come on bruh that's the best they could come up with 😂

[@FlyingFocs]

There's a movie called The Core where they also have "unobtanium," but they clarify that is just it's nickname, because "it's actual chemical name has 15 syllables." I like to imagine a similar scenario here. Or James Cameron was just being a troll.

[@ghostfreely7493]

Look up "Avatar dmt deleted scene". There is a prerendered deleted scene where sully does the Pandoran equivalent of dmt to become part of the tribe. It literally shows his mind going through a tunnel and "breaking through" into the center of Pandora.

[@DiestroCorleone]

And the alternate ending in future Earth is awsome too.

[@gldmj55]

It's the only 3D movie I've seen in theaters. I recall this whole thing where people felt heavy depression after leaving the theater because of how immersive the new 3D effect was with the movie. I kind of felt that immediately after seeing it, which is by far the most memorable thing about the movie to me. Even with your recap, I still can't recall any particular scene.

[@NedransVikingar]

I felt down too. REALLY down. But not for the same reason, I was lonely back then so I was jealous and wanted a partner too. I wished I was in that movie.

[@exaIgnus]

Depression? that's an odd word to use. I'd understand some kind of motion sickness. But Depression? I got to say, besides the 3D and SFX, the movie was a big disappointment for me.

[@jbishop2454]

I saw this in iMax 3d when it came out. And honestly, never watched it from beginning to end after that.

[@icychill105]

I remember everyone loved the visuals but never heard people like the story as much

[@chasehedges6775]

It’s a style over substance movie

[@Craxin01]

@@chasehedges6775 Like 99.9% of Hollywood. Style counts for something.

[@chasehedges6775]

@@Craxin01 So should story and characters

[@popeye5274]

The story is pretty much a rip off of Dances with Wolves.

[@John-merman]

kinda like “Tron: Legacy”

[@soniclikesphone]

Glad to see Cinemassacre still uploading. Also when are you going to release YKWBS Episode 47?

[@jklegend2170]

It was great watching it in the cinema in 3D. However, I’ve only watched it once since.

[@MarcAquino1095]

2009 wasn’t exactly a great year when it comes to sci-fi action, especially if you compare it to other blockbuster movies of that year (Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen, X-Men Origins: Wolverine, G.I. Joe: Rise of Cobra, Terminator Salvation) but this holds up a lot more than I remember. Might not be James Cameron’s best, but I still dig it overall.

[@m0-m0597]

Your pfp reminds me of Javidx9

[@chasehedges6775]

2009 was a better year than 2020/2021/2022 tho. Still , you gotta point

[@intellectic9155]

Salvation is much better than people say. Especially considering the latest entries in the series.

[@chasehedges6775]

@@intellectic9155 Terminator 3 is better, honestly. Terminator 2 is still a masterpiece tho

[@powerbad696]

Don't forget Star Trek ( 2009 )

[@jasondowns940]

I feel it honestly comes down to so many people saying how deep and thought provoking it was, and it just wasn’t.

[@_Mr.Black_]

It was a fun film, akin to how I feel about some of the transformers movies . It's like an interesting rock you pick up, then throw back on the ground.

[@PopfulFrost]

I mean, at least Avatar is a lot more coherent than the Michael Bay Transformers movies. For one, you can actually remember and sum up what happens in Avatar; people can complain about the plot being formulaic (and, yes, leaning on White Savior tropes) all they like, but they have to admit that they know exactly what's happening, and why. Not really something you can say about the Transformers movies. XD

[@bleppyboo5969]

@@PopfulFrost I mean you can with the Transformers films for the most part

[@kayzee3595]

Science, Art and Philosophy must also be just an interesting rock for you to pick up and throw, huh 😏

[@_Mr.Black_]

@@kayzee3595 right at your empty little noggin 😆

[@bassage13]

@@kayzee3595 Are you 'tarded?

[@ShonkTeHonktalks]

Avatar left no impact, that for a moment I thought James was gonna talk about The Last Airbender

[@tristancampbell4941]

"mY nAmE iS aHnG"

[@pcpc6437]

@@tristancampbell4941 ?

[@Mr_Fancypants]

@@pcpc6437 he means, my name is ang

[@tristancampbell4941]

@@pcpc6437 If you remember that movie, you remember how he said it

[@tristancampbell4941]

@@Mr_Fancypants In the movie, it sounded more like Ong. It was weird

[@SpazziJackazzi]

Avitar is a modern rendition of Dances with Wolves. But not a rip off. I dont think its a bad thing to use inspiration from older art. Music is just the same.

[@JaggedDagger]

I watched this in 3D in theatre as well. I feel pretty much the same as you. The movie was incredible but a touch too long. This was a huge throwback to Ferngully: The Last Rain Forest

[@probably_afk]

I do have some memory of Avatar being referred to as "Dances with Smurfs".. which admittedly I thought was funny.. Whatever though. I like both movies and I don't think Avatar is "overrated". I think people just use the word incorrectly similar to how some random movie they like is "criminally underrated" but what they actually mean is "not a lot of people have heard of this movie I like..."

[@hashbash]

It was an enthralling experience for me. Not the movie or the plot itself, but all the masterful work and imagination put into the surroundings and flora/fauna of Pandora. The use of 3D was exquisite. I kinda wish the whole movie was one long stroll through the forests.

[@breadordecide]

Dune also has the same exact plot structure as avatar. Nobody ever calls it out for it. Art inspires art. That is the way of it.

[@markborishnikoff5485]

But isn’t dune much older?

[@ToiletGrenade]

It's refreshing to hear a nuanced take on Avatar. I'm really excited for The Way of Water, i've been waiting for this movie for 13 years now, I remember my friend at work telling me about the trailer that was shown before that Marvel movie and me being in awe at the things he was saying about it.

[@zachsparkman5252]

I was so excited to watch it I actually bought it as a kid. I hated it. 😂 I had to force myself to finish it. Definitely by far overrated.

[@clutchyfinger]

I love that you brought up Fern Gully, it's totally true, but everything evolves from everything else. Everyone uses the hero's journey plot points too. Things use the same framework. Just look at the anime industry. How many isekai's are literally clones? This is a much lesser version of that.

[@BlazeMakesGames]

I mean your example with isekais is apt, and uh, a lot of people hate isekai as a genre unless it actually stands out to do something different.

[@theflail]

The scene where the main character is splayed across the window of the tree cutter is literally straight out of fern gully.

[@RTU130]

Ye

[@j.b.7669]

Fun fact, James Cameron had the option to produce Alita battle angel or Avatar. He chose to do Avatar and handed Alita battle Angel to Robert Rodriguez.

[@bigbakaboon]

and alita battle angel was fantastic

[@ToruKurosawa]

yes... it is..

[@revelationnow]

I would have liked that you had come to the conclusion that Avatar suffered the same fate at Final Fantasy (the movie).where it borrowed almost line-for-line dialogue copies from related properties. It broke the suspension of disbelief by reminding you of other movies where you had seen this exact set up and phrasing. Its a great show, but its hard to watch if you have seen what its directly emulating

[@drakealexander6668]

For me, it mesmerized me in theaters. It is a simple, run-of-the-mill story. It stands out because of respectable acting and great special effects.

[@cougar2013]

How are people still impressed by special effects. It’s all computer generated. Are you blown away by every new iOS?

[@kickfister]

It also had that effect on me (I was also 15). It was incredibly engrossing being transported to that world. I'm not sure a film has ever immersed me quite so much and it's hard to understand why given that I watched it as a teen and it's been nearly 13 years. Perhaps what sets it apart from other colonization stories is the specific method of bringing the foreigner into the culture of the "alien" civilization. It was an excellent vehicle for self insertion, and if the culture and I guess "science" around that society was emotionally engaging for the viewer (it was for me), it could be an extremely powerful combination.

[@zeebooboo9663]

@@cougar2013 it still looks amazing

[@WhispyWoods.]

@@kickfister Pocahontas? Dances with Wolves? James lists all the moves that have a very similar plot in the video.

[@jan7256]

@@WhispyWoods. Did you even watch the video?

[@thomasmacisaac1503]

Yes, what do I win?

[@GhoulingAround]

I've never thought this film was as great as people tried to convince me it was. It only made the amount it did in theaters because of the outrageous ticket prices for 3D which wasn't even that impressive from what I remember hearing.

[@tavish1658]

It was a stepping stone for technical prowess in a Pocahontas story. It was simply just groundbreaking for its visuals.

[@gamestation2690]

Sometimes it’s okay for stories to be retold, if they’re told well.

[@vjspectron]

Solid take!

[@cube2fox]

The inconsistent thing was this: to make an extremely expensive SciFi film but then use basically just a worn out cliché story appropriate for a Disney movie like Pocahontas. Big budget SciFi has so much more potential in terms of an interesting story, so Avatar seems like nothing more than an attempt to make money by appealing to people's Disney sensibilities.

[@ANONYMOUS-tg2tq]

@@cube2fox YOU ARE WORNG

[@dragonrain05]

Am I the only one that didn't like this movie? Like seriously. After I watched it I was like "What's the hype about? Who cares that it's James Cameron." I'd rather watch Fern Gully over and over again.

[@cabellero1120]

No, you're not

[@SkyzzzGaming]

In my opinion before i watch this yes it is overrated, i like the movie and it visually is really cool but for me it feels like some weird experiment because of how it was advertised... its kinda like they wanted us to be more impressed by the technology of creating the film than the actual film anyway thats my take now im gonna listen to the nerd

[@bananajoe9951]

The cutting edge CGI made me want to see it, the rinse and repeat story drove me away. I get Transformers vibes from it. I don't like with these movies, where there's a Gaia type consciousness, that the main character is part of a prophecy.

[@Zucadragon]

What is up with these spambots? I don't mean you, I mean the "whatsapp me" thing.

[@Tall_Order]

> 18:35 you mention "The treasure of the Sierra Madre". Dude you just gave me Fallout New Vegas flashbacks. Which was probably borrowed from that film. :)

[@jivesideproductions]

in the theater, 3D specs, movie blew my mind. that was a magical experience. looking forward to the next!!

[@TRIX-vg1ym]

I ate some mushrooms 🍄 and went and saw it 😂 at the theater in 3d

[@NecroxProduction]

how old were you?

[@tylerjames7015]

I think people loved it due to it being more of a spectacle than a cerebral film

[@kuropixeljp]

I am so here for movie discussion videos like these. James, love this!

[@wargrunt42]

This review reminds me of the online documentary "Everything is a Remix," which I highly recommend watching. In the documentary, he makes a lot of the same points and then some. He also described this genre of movie as "Sorry for colonialism," which I find fitting.

[@rigrog5777]

I came, I saw, I conquered... and I felt really bad about it!

[@thefallout_guy]

When james uploads its always a treat

[@andrewsmith5605]

I remember everyone going on about the effects and cgi in this movie. When I saw it, I was like is that it? In fariness, maybe it's because I saw it on TV and not at the cinema.

[@Protoman85]

I don't like Avatar very much, sure it's competent and has great action etc, but it's a very basic story I've seen many times before, and it felt kind of preachy "look at how noble the natives are, aren't we greedy humans bad?" etc.

[@kenisu-of-dragons5766]

Tough pill, but in alot of cases in our history, it's been true

[@spitfire4209]

There's nothing inherently wrong with how Avatar is made. James Cameron is always a highly proficient filmmaker. I never really connected with Avatar in particular though. I still like how James Cameron makes movies and I will likely still catch up with The Way of The Water.

[@Gorkab]

You said it all!

[@Nick-4K]

I always liked it. The movie got way to much hate back in the day.

[@redvex2114]

drop the 3D tech hype fully (not just for this one movie) and tone down the marketing, then imagine the release... the movie can afford to be very badly written in 2022, the social BS nowadays will do all the work.

[@lordjubilus]

to me avatar was just a pretty movie, the whole movie was extremely predicable

[@corruptedpoison1]

You're spelling wasn't very PREDICTABLE though.

[@FindingsOfAnArmouredMind]

Also, YOUR* spelling. You're welcome.

[@jayjohn9680]

Not to divert… yet… I want an AVGN MOVIE SEQUEL!!!🥳🥳🥳🤯🤯🤯

[@Eva01-jy2qu7pu9r]

I do still really enjoy the film even if its not perfect. The visuals are incredible and the characters do hold up well today cause of their personalities and dialogue. The only problem is that it is predictable and definitely a story told many times.

[@GringoXalapeno]

I suppose but you could also think of it as the inverse of the alien invasion story where the humans are invading the aliens world

[@Misterjuzz]

I thought exactly the same when I came out of the theatre having watched it. My friends loved it but half-way in I was able to predict what was going to happen and I kinda ruined it for myself. I'm not the kind of person to consume media based on graphic, but looking back, I definitely should've instead.

[@treybriscoe2721]

I think there is an interesting conversation to be had on whether things are overhyped or overrated. You can even see this in music like with the Beatles or in games like Zelda.

[@magical571]

Uh? What about the beatles or zelda lol

[@zeitgeist27]

What about the Beatles?!

[@ash8207]

Very fair & reasonable review! Honestly I never listen to what others say or think about any movies, games, etc. I either enjoy or don't enjoy something based on my own tastes & views. Avatar was a fun, exciting blockbuster film that I enjoyed watching with family & friends in the theaters on multiple occasions. And that's how I will always remember it.

[@thejackal007]

Thoughtful essay, James. I have to agree on what you said about it not being a copycat or being derivative. It references things, yes, but the claims of it being overrated are definitely not true.

[@Tool0GT92]

I loved the 3D in the theaters and I always enjoy watching the movie every couple years. The movie is just gorgeous and the story is fine, nothing amazing but not bad.

[@jasonneadle2614]

My assessment is one I use often: all writers bite off of each other. It’s how the tropes, elements and styles are molded that create a new story.

[@zillauniverse7208]

This movie is just ok for me but I feel like the Extended cut actually improves the movie quite a bit.

[@MrJC1]

I cannot imagine putting myself through an extended cut. Geeesh.

[@truedarkness4052]

@@MrJC1 Cause you don't know true art

[@m.c.murdoch6]

Funny enough I find the same to be true for the Hobbit films. lol

[@cgrooney9945]

@@truedarkness4052 Move over Salvador Dali, Van Gogh, Warhol. The Avatar extended cutscenes are on display!

[@truedarkness4052]

@@cgrooney9945 this but unironically

[@michaelboydston313]

To be honest, I thought that Disney's Princess and the Frog was better, it came out the same weekend and people went to see Avatar and caused Disney lost money, making it the last traditionally animated movie by Disney (until Bob's Burgers movie), now that I think about it, the next year Disney released their remake of Alice in Wonderland.

[@chasehedges6775]

💯💯💯💯

[@endlessbyakko]

I never watched Avatar because it was overhyped to begin with. Before it was ever released everyone said it was the greatest thing ever. So I didn't watch it. I'm never going to watch it.

[@Roobar_Plays]

Well, avatar is still gonna be "the movie with blue people" and "the movie I don't remember a single character's name"

[@gamestation2690]

Jake Sully and Princess Ney’tiri