Is Bayle FromSoftware's Best Dragon?

Obviously a matter of opinion! But here I compare dragons from Elden Ring, the ER DLC Shadow of the Erdtree, and Dark Souls 3. Hope you enjoy!
#eldenring #darksouls3 #gaming #gaminganalysis

[@jermergerg]

Let me preach to you the gospel of liking both Elden Ring and Dark Souls 3. It is possible. I'm doing it right now!

[@enman009]

Wait! DS3 fanboys can't accept that. You need to say one is objectively better while downplaying the other.

[@jermergerg]

@@enman009 I've got ER diehards talking shit on my DS3 videos as well, so it's a 2-way street lol.

[@enman009]

@@jermergerg Ah, the Soulsborne Community experience: many Masterpieces but can't like more than one.

[@xd-px5ne]

Or in general liking all Fromsoftware's Soulsborne games, they each have their own personality and thing that makes them good, it's kinda annoying when people just start downplaying other games

[@rohansensei5708]

@@enman009 There are way more Elden Ring fans doing exactly that to Ds3

[@Xfushion2]

Bayle without Igon -> gold medal Bayle with Igon -> platinum medal

[@weskintime4177]

Igon is the best character in Fromsoft with the best voice acting (including cut content)

[@cheeks_of_the_boreal_valley]

​@@weskintime4177nah patches is still the goat

[@andreiriboli]

CURSE YOU, BAYLE! I HEREBY VOW! YOU WILL RUE THIS DAY!

[@gs32621]

ur a summoning scrub

[@Bakamoli]

​@weskintime4177 Igon is cool but he can't beat the GOAT Siegward.

[@zergthemad1659]

there was a lack of hating on ancient dragons

[@D0verking69]

They are so bad that people refuse to acknowledge their existence

[@brandinicole1372]

We don’t talk about the “those” dragons for good reason 😊

[@AceAviations2]

​@@brandinicole1372eh, I found Fortissax to be the best base game dragon fight. Placi is just a slog with a runup that is way too easy to fall to you death to, or get f**ked over by the game and have it send you into the void after the getting up animation.

[@wilburforce8046]

@@bigsmall2842yea I thought normal dragons were bad enough lol

[@breakfast6159]

I liked the wyverns on horseback but there was no redeeming ancient dragons for me, their hit box always feel so out of reach

[@hm5820]

If you’re not including Igon, it’s a tough debate, with Igon however, it’s simply undisputed (I am so very biased)

[@abrahamlincolnreal8166]

CURSE YOU BAYLE!!

[@JajsjNsbsvshana]

Petition for FS to make a spin off Igon game.

[@thepublicpotato3887]

I prefer fighting him without Igon as fighting a boss solo is more epic 😊

[@ZaddyGohan]

@@thepublicpotato3887igon doesn’t really do anything except scream lmao. When I used him, he only hit bayle like twice and I think he took aggro maybe one time for a split second or two

[@thefanciesttortoise557]

​@@abrahamlincolnreal8166 I hereby vow! You will rue this day!

[@anukthotawatta982]

BAAYYYLE! VILE BAYYLE!!!

[@uryenatienza4093]

As a fan of Monster Hunter, I always found it odd that some players struggled or refused to ever free aim any boss encounters even when it's more advantageous to do so. However, when you mentioned that normal encounters very much don't demand that I understood why. I guess when a boss demands you use a skill that isn't taught, it can be quite frustrating.

[@jamesbell1186]

As a console player, you need to use your right thumb to move a camera around. Most players will also use their right thumb the roll. When boss is doing an attack string, it can be nearly impossible to keep your camera focused on a boss whilst they do a complex attack strong whilst also dodging through the attacks with precise timing with the same thumb, which is why it's pretty annoying (at least when playing with a controller)

[@Ghorda9]

@@jamesbell1186 for enemies that don't move around so much like fire giant or placidussax you don't really need to move the camera much at all.

[@jamesbell1186]

@@Ghorda9 That's true

[@The_Warden]

Honestly most Souls vets learned to not use lock on back in DS1. But I do see what you mean, it isn't necessarily taught by the game, however on the flip side of that same coin nothing really is in Souls games. 🤷🏻‍♂️ Just more base strategies are taught a little more intuitively, and not everyone is a vet.

[@moosiemoose1337]

That's exactly why I re-mapped my dodge to left trigger. I can look around and dodge at the same time. Who the heck thought losing control of your camera was a good idea?

[@VeroniqueMichelinnardo]

I think you should've talked about the laser attack of each boss, in my opinion they're the pinnacle and the tradition in the tough dragon fights of FromSoft. (Also the runback to bayle's arena is by far the shortest one which is a + for me)

[@StrappingYoungLadam]

Dude I knew some of the DLC fights were going to be tough when they put sites of grace right outside the arena instead of a stake of merika

[@wojijiwojiji4009]

@@StrappingYoungLadamBut thank god they did. I’m very glad they moved away from run backs, especially the really bad run backs

[@anigodzapex9384]

Midirs run back is very short, has no enemy's and one of the most Epic Entrances in the Franchise right after Burnt Ivori King. They even replicated this Fall and the look of his Arena with Putrecent Knight. Midir has many Inspiring things, that people aren't acknowledging. Bayle is a top Tier Boss, maybe the best in the Dlc. Wich is very unfortunate for Midir beeing next to Gael, the picnickle of the Dark Souls Franchise. Bayle is technically better, but Midir was the first true Outstanding Dragon fight, who is on par with Amazing fights like O&S, Alone, Ludwig, Gael and Godfrey. Bayle beeing the Second on the exact caliber is insane to me. Placidusax wore of after a couple of Playthroughs. He is Great and all, but not as refined and all other Dragons are to janky for it. Sry Kalameet, Sin and Fortisaxx Fans.

[@Detriax]

@@anigodzapex9384I’ve always liked Placidusax more. And the issue with Midir is that he is incredibly simple and easy. He has very few moves, and only has 1 threatening move

[@anigodzapex9384]

@@Detriax Dont get me wrong. I love Placidusax. He is easily bettter then Rest of the Fromsoft Dragons. Dragon God, Gaping, Kalameet, Guardian Dragon, Ancient Dragon, Sin, Ancient Wyvern, Storn King, Oceiros (Nobody mentions the self created Half Dragon to resemble Seath), Divine Dragon, Lansseax, Fortisax. He is better then all of these, wich is a Lot at this Point. His Teleportions look cool and are well Telegraphed, his Thunderstrikes are a well Designed get of me Move and his Stormcloud Assaults look Amazing and are satisfying to Dodge. My problem is, that he just Sits there for 50 percent of the Fight, his Flame Breath Hitboxes are weird and he is also to easy in Repeated Runs. Midir and Bayle have way more imposing Melee Comboes, more Dynamic Movement. The Build Up for both is as good aswell and the Themes are just Magnificent. Bayle Bombastic Track and Midir Tragic Melody will be stuck in my Head Forever. Placid´s theme gives me Monster Hunter Frontier Shantien Vibes, wich is a Big Compliment. Its just really classic "Epic Dragon Music", wich is very good, but not good enough. And i feel this way for everything for him.

[@Alex-sd3fs]

All three fights are great, but I do think Midir and Bayle presents powerful rampaging dragons much better than Placidusax. Placidusax felt a bit too immobile and clunky despite having his teleport move.

[@godreaper8928]

Placidusax does feel more… special though. It’s hard to explain but when you get in his arena and he’s just… floating there with 3 missing heads and mutilated everywhere. His nuke move is also much cooler than bayle one, even makes his ost stop in the meantime. I do agree fight wise bayle was better though.

[@planetcheese]

I personally think that works in Placidusax's favor, since I see him as conveying more of a run-down regal dignity rather than something that's brutal and rampaging.

[@HaremAlLuna]

Placidusax feel like he is a lord fight bayle and midir are wild animals that you are putting down while placidusax is a fight between lords

[@Zyckro]

Yeah. I do think some types of players will appreciate Placidusax more than the other two, as some don't care to fully master the bosses and just want spectacle. The dragonlord will likely be their favorite of the 3.

[@wheekwarrior1406]

I felt like that gave him more awe, like he is an actual wise elder lord of the dragons rather than a self-serving savage beast.

[@D0verking69]

Bayle fans rise up

[@Cerran032]

SOLID OF SCALE YOU MIGHT BE, FOWL DRAGON

[@canamanblack7269]

BUT I WILL RIDDLE WITH HOLES ,YOUR ROTTEN HIDE

[@kaptenzoom7920]

BUT I WILL RIDDLE WITH HOLES, YOUR ROTTEN HIDE!

[@buffoonustroglodytus4688]

It’s spelled foul. Fowl means bird

[@courier6640]

*BUT I WILL RIDDLE WITH HOLES YOUR ROTTEN HIDE!!!*

[@thelytz9806]

Bayles fight was definitely the most fun and epic in the entire dlc, and unlike second phase Radahn, he actually felt fair

[@gerwan9132]

tell me what is unfair about second phase radahn? the only bad thing about him is the double slash attack which is nearly undodgeable, otherwise an extremely well crafted boss where everything is dodgeable, optimization is the games fault not radahns

[@Detriax]

@@gerwan9132the boss itself just doesn’t feel fair. That’s the issue. Well, it’s second phase doesn’t feel fair

[@santiagopepaj7525]

​@gerwan9132 The lights. I genuinely couldn't see shit because of light pillars end explosions everywhere, not to mention that when Radahn spins, all I can see are Miquellas long ass hair (and you HAVE to dodge him on the sides, if you roll backwards the lights are gonna hit you). His moveset per se it's fine, but the lights make everything so chaotic. Fantastic first phase, the second one is more scenic but less suitable for a gameplay

[@based-ys9um]

​@@santiagopepaj7525we need to stop using demon souls combat if the bosses are becoming more and more anime.

[@HeyTarnished]

@@based-ys9um Demon Souls combat? Are you serious? Play it again and tell me with a straight face it’s Demon Souls combat, Elden Ring’s combat is literally faster than Bloodborne even.

[@luisesteves5929]

The Midir lockon works perfectly fine?? I never considered to have problems with it in some sort of way? What is wrong about him? I could not figure out any way to stay locked on for the Bayle bossfight. With Midir, I never had problems at all 13:04 if this happens, Bayle falls apart as well The camera spins fast around Bayle, yes.. But if you are behind him after this combo 14:25 14:27 this next hit likely hits you. Thw camera is also too often inside of Bayle 14:33

[@Sir-Pleiades]

Midir camera is the best because it's mostly close to it's head, the head is low so unless he's doing the overhead fire attack and then you can see it and move back the camera doesn't go funky with spin. Also the fight is designed so you attack the head, retreat a bit while he does some combo and then attack again.

[@sirmaissi]

I stayed locked on for the whole bayle fight except that flying fire breath and never had any problems except for when I made the mistake of getting under him

[@luisesteves5929]

@@sirmaissi yeah.. I could not figure out how to fight with his camera. After two hours of trying btw.. I think I tried enough.

[@howdoyoudo5949]

Only one attack I had where the lockon was shit was when Midir got onto his hindlegs and spewed downwards fire.

[@Revision-Harrowed]

I would say, Placidusax becomes even more of a spectacle fight if you go into it with an ash of war like Raptor of the mists or Vow of the Indomitable! Being able to stand there as he readies his giant lightning nuke and just shrug it off, or land a jumping attack provided by Raptor of the mists is just so awesome. You can essentially avoid running away altogether with tools like those, as even with his divine breath attacks you can stay near him while he's doing and just counter the very end of it for even more damage.

[@Malxer]

Not summoning Igon just for the voice lines is a crime

[@Enak147]

Midir, palcidusax, and bayle may be challenging bosses in their own right, but I don't think I've ever faced a boss as hard and difficult as the dark souls camera

[@Suesserto]

I feel like it’s a dance with Bayle rather than a fight, and every thing he does looks so dramatic while looking like a feral wild animal at the same time. My favorite part is his phase transition and his death animation, he tried his best to summon down thunder to charge his broken wing weapon but he didn’t realize he was already dead.

[@HEXBasmentBubba]

feels like a dance? Did we fight the same boss???

[@Kaiji...]

If by dance you mean wait for it to do a bloated combo, then get 1 hit in and repeat for the next 10 minutes that it takes to take his health down… then yes.

[@Vengeance_Im]

​@@HEXBasmentBubbanot everyone has narrow skillset like you

[@Vengeance_Im]

​​​@@Kaiji...Skill issue on your part, I literally kept attacking on the end of each combo, attacking the boss at least every 3-4 seconds. Stop making shit up, git gud, stop coping and misinforming people. I have video of my 6th attempt on a boss on my channel, I learned him much better on my second playthrough of DLC just yesterday, will post that too. That's if you're genuinely interested of course, and hopefully not a blatant troll trying to be different

[@painhurtssometimes2185]

@@Kaiji...Beat him with falling star beast jaw and didn’t take any damage till phase two. He doesn’t have a crazy amount of combos but his lightning after effect in phase two is pretty annoying. He’s really not that bad but then again using strength builds I can stagger him like 3-4 times in the fight.

[@Afrozilla92]

After the first few attempts on bayle my thoughts were: oh damn midir and placi had a child^^

[@ORLY911]

Sinh from Dark Souls 2 is pretty slept on (ba dum tiss), hes one of my favorite dragon fights in the series.

[@Leonhart_93]

For the time it was released, it was top notch. The dragons in the base game of DS3 couldn't compare, it took until Midir for that to change.

[@markopusic8258]

Sinh also loves spending anywhere between no and too much time in the air, there is so much RNG in that fight to determine wether you can even hit him or not.

[@jermergerg]

Hey guys, thanks so much for watching this video! I have literally never had this much engagement this quickly. On the few videos that have gotten these numbers, it's taken DAYS to get here. So, I'm not sure I'll be able to respond or react quickly to all of your comments, but I'll try. I really appreciate the engagement, even if it's to tell me I'm "objectively" wrong about an opinion :D

[@AhmadZakwan-fd3xc]

Amazing how people can be so confused and mixing up trailers with actually playing the god-damned game

[@B0SS8799]

Regarding the aerial attack at 14:43, I used Bayle's claw opening up as a visual clue for when to dodge. Seemed to work pretty well for me cause I don't think I got hit with that move after figuring out the timing.

[@alloytitanium5972]

I love Bayle too, he got complex moveset that requires good timing on dodges, positioning, even jump attack. My favourite is the tail swipe too, but also the slam attack in phase 2. After the slam theres lava erruption, so after dodging it you have to position yourself fast enough to be right infront of Bayle's head before the erruption goes off to get your punish. Its great that that move Bayle actually recover slower compare to the phase 1 slam, you can even get a full charge attack off. Even his laser move he will end up right infront of you afterwards. You can also jump over his phase 2 nuke to get a free jump attack, mastering the fight is immensely satisfying to me.

[@Vengeance_Im]

Yup. When I first got to phase 2, after like 3d attempt, I saw the nuke, just how much ground it covered and straight up thought there's the way to , or ideally jump it. Overall, Elden Ring DLC highly demands the player to know perfectly the core mechanics of the base game, with a lot of bosses requiring you to jump, having moderate poise so you target stance breaking, a lot of bosses still have roll catching attacks. For example, jumping over Rellana's moons, over Bayle's aoe. Also, Bayle has very low poise for a dragon so being aggressive with him is the key, especially considering how the boss has frequent punish windows where you hit his head

[@alloytitanium5972]

@@Vengeance_Im true, I was using a great hammer fighting him. End up poise break him 4 times in a single fight after knowing when to hit him and go full on aggressive mode.

[@GodWarsX]

You can still take an offensive approach during Placid's slam nuke. The tip of his tail is outside the shockwave. You can run back there and get in a bunch of hits

[@ZaddyGohan]

Bayle was an incredible fight. Took me about 6 tries and he was instantly my favorite dragon fight, and favorite boss of the DLC. Regarding your self proclaimed “skill issue” with playing not-locked on due to struggling with camera management-have you ever tried playing while holding the controller with a claw grip (in your right hand only, left hand normal.) This involves slightly shifting your fingers so that your thumb is on the joystick, pointer finger has access to all 4 letter/shape buttons, and middle finger is on the bumper/triggers. That makes it much easier to whip the camera around while unlocked

[@Markarov27]

Midir best fought unlocked? Interesting take. I always thought staying locked on to the head is what makes the fight easier.

[@luhcsgrimm8857]

I enjoy midir tge most, but bayle is so unbelievable close. I like Midirs aesthetic and lore, and his fight is great, I love how his fight evolves, he comvos more moves together.

[@ZZMonkeysUncleZZ]

No. Too many of his attacks put him out of reach, which can often result in you running after him, only for him to jump away again before you can reach him. He’s a good fight if the AI doesn’t decide to screw with you, but he’s still not better than Midir. The fight is much better with Igon.

[@fortress7493]

Igon doesn't provide anything except distract Bayle. that's the same as saying Using mimic tear makes Bayle more fun.

[@Vengeance_Im]

The fight is straight up upgrade in every category: design, fight mechanics, fight build up, lore and ost. Also, boss being out of your reach means you're fighting cowardly and distancing yourself. On all of my attempts I kept applying pressure on Bayle and had no problems you mentioned. I say let's put nostalgia aside and see things for what they truly are

[@Nothimriel]

Bayle's phase two transition is so epic and also gets my #1 vote but yeah the dragons listed are 100% the top 3 without a doubt. Good video dude

[@adamnave1078]

very nice video man, hope this blows up because its very well thought out

[@rorymoriarty-scanlon882]

With regard to the camera, do you think it would help if the camera zoomed out slightly? Similar to how Final Fantasy 16 handles large bosses but not to the same extent.

[@chuongvulenguyen290]

My perfect dragon boss fight should be: - Atmosphere: Placidusax - Music: Midir -Moveset: Bayle - Lore: A bit bias here, I love the battle of Placidusax and Bayle, but raising by gods and fighting The Abyss for eternity is really my favorite vibe - Design: Dragon God (Although he’s a demon) - Epicness: Divine Dragon - Intro: Kalameet (We get a whole cutscene before fighting him is an absolute cinema) And the boss fight shouldn’t have any camera issues like how we fight against Bayle (it’s terrible locking on him). That is how I create my personal perfect dragon fight based on my previous dragon fights

[@BlacklistedSoup]

nah music should be Foritssax

[@chuongvulenguyen290]

@@BlacklistedSoup That’s ur opinion. Midir ost is still the goat to me

[@Vengeance_Im]

Bayle ost is of much higher quality and more memorable imo. Overall, DS3 music often times sounds too generic and repetitive, it's like you're listening to a remix. Elden Ring covers big range of instruments and different genres in the OSTs

[@chuongvulenguyen290]

@@Vengeance_Im Appreciate your opinion, but can’t say the same to me. My opinion is quite contradictory to your opinion, Bayle’s OST is actually too jarring for my ears during the fight and when I listen it from youtube, I find it quite generic and doesn’t have the rhythm like Midir OST

[@OfficialPokezae]

For me, Bayle is the best and will probably always be my favorite. His design is so well done. He has lore literally all over him, from his wounds to Placidusax’s heads. His build up was phenomenal, from the talisman we can get early in the DLC to the multiple dialogues we get about him and his nature. His OST is one of the best I’ve heard in Elden Ring. His moveset is stunning to look at, and is also terrifying as well. The camera for me wasn’t a problem at all, and Igon’s voice actor hyped up the fight even more than it already was. Even the two incantations we get from him are badass. Lastly, his laser beam really impacted me more than Midir or Placidusax’s has. The way he soars in the sky and delivers two devastating beams of destruction really struck me with fear. For me, Bayle was perfect. Others may have other opinions based off of different experiences. That’s what makes these games special in the first place.

[@minerman60101]

He'll always be your favorite among the dragons From Software has made so far 😉

[@JoseViktor4099]

The two main things that really gets on the way on me considering Midir fight as the best are: 1) It has a very annoying runback overall; I don´t dislike runbacks, but when they are long and has no enemies I feel im just loosing my time. 2) I feel like its health pool is too bloated for what the fight is; not really enough moves to compesate imo, making it a somewhat repetitive fight, which is the thing I hate the most a boss fight can do: not really be a big challenge for a moveset, but for stats, specially health. Still , for starting a trend for dragons like the laser attack and being very good spectacle wise,same as a awesome soundtrack and having relatebly easy attacks to understand and avoid, I can understand why some people would enjoy it.

[@Vengeance_Im]

You're absolutely correct. I believe that's the whole deal with Elden Ring bosses being misunderstood, Myiazaki made Elden Ring with idea in mind that DS3 and it's difficulty is outdated, he probably thought people would demand more difficulty, so he delivered bosses who demand more skill from the player (I mean namely bosses, him putting op stuff like spirits in the game for lower skill players is whole another topic). At least that's the case with all Fromsoftware games, if you compare chronologically, every newer game has been harder than the previous so far. But regarding DS3 vets and other people having problems with Elden Ring bosses, is they probably reached their skill ceiling and felt comfortable on where their skillset is, so when it came to leveling up their skill and getting gud, they simply couldn't and started spreading misinformation and coping made up terms like bosses' "unfairness". So far I've seen a lot of KZbinrs and some of my friends play the game, and what I noticed is that people who are not skilled at the game, they usually value DS3 higher and have criticism towards Elden Ring boss design. But some of the elite gamers, especially watching guys like Lilaggy, Ginomachino and I also have 2 friends who are really good at the game, all of them actually value bosses like Maliketh, Malenia, Radagon, etc very highly. Usually brushing off criticism with words like "skill issue", "git gud" can be toxic yes, but I believe in Elden Ring's case, most of the problems people have usually haa something to do with their level of play limiting them from having a good experience with the game

[@Vengeance_Im]

I believe people pick Midir over Bayle despite Bayle being straight up upgrade on every category, has a lot to do with their skill being enough to have good time fighting Midir and but not nearly enough to enjoy Bayle.

[@JoseViktor4099]

@@Vengeance_Im There were always this big debate of difficulty, if Elden Ring vs DS3 combat on which was actually better. And as you said, the biggest departure was the difficulty of the encounters. I personally saw as both takes equally enjoyable depending of the point of view: DS3 "turn based" combat requires a very easy to pick up combat that anybody can take and enjoy without bigger issues, with rhytmh based attacks that makes it very satisfactory to play with. Its literally a dance, with music determined by boss fights attacks. Elden Ring combat, is much more treatening, not only the rhytmh take is normally absent, but the concept of boss fights giving you a turn got completely reworked, now making you "earn" an attack. They also react of what you do more than DS3, extending attacks or changing them depending of you do/where you are. A boss fight being so reactive doesn´t feel like a musical dance, but as a duel against a formidable foe. And with that, you can see the reasons. DS3 is an spectacle, a dance that anybody can pick up, giving overall a very constant experience, as with good timing you dont even need to use all your moveset, even on the roughest cases. ER is a duel, which normally encourages the players to use its own mechanics and have their own tricks up their sleeves against the boss fights, rather going no tricks and squeeze out all base moveset posibilities. With this, we can understand both cases, and depending how you are you might enjoy different takes. I honestly enjoy ER boss design more, is the one which sticked more to me mainly for the "low skill floor, high skill ceilling" this take offers.

[@Coypop]

you deserve way more subs for an essay this smooth.

[@muscleman6875]

This is a cool video, I love the concept of dragons and even if some of the fights are janky I'm glad they are still making them. I like Midir's visual style more and the fact that he's super intimidating at first but becomes easy once you understand the fight is cool to me. Also seeing clips of how cool Midir looked was what convinced me to try souls games so I'm super biased. Bayle is awesome though, super close second from my very not objective point of view, great video.

[@koayuoo]

Midir all day for me, no disrespect to Bayle tho still an amazing boss fight.

[@fortress7493]

If you have nostalgia goggles yeah, Midir in hindsight is a poorman's placidusax in mechanical standpoint and poor camera view. and lastly he's way too easy compared to the other two

[@lewiscampbell8683]

@@fortress7493literally have no clue what you mean. Midir is so much more mobile than the other 2 which makes the fight feel more dynamic. Placidusax is a big blob who barely moves with his attacks almost always missing in the first phase. 2nd phase is better but that’s just because he actually MOVES. Midir’s camera is also better than Bayle’s but granted, it is worse than Placidusax (because he doesn’t MOVE). Difficulty is pretty subjective as well. You may have found Midir much easier than Placidusax and Bayle, but for me Midir and Bayle are hard and Placidusax is piss easy

[@alottadamage8192]

@@fortress7493In terms of difficulty of midir, I would disagree. I beat bayle in 2-3 tries my first run, but it took me multiple days to beat midir. Not only that, despite me getting slammed by midir I never once thought it was unfair. Overall, bayle is a great fight, but I still think midir wins out, at least for dragon fights.

[@fortress7493]

@alottadamage8192 considering how easy midir is I can tell you used summons on bayle. And that's okay, but it's unfair to even use that comparison considering DS doesn't have any summons.

[@fortress7493]

@lewiscampbell8683 placidusax literally flies around in his 2nd phase. Idk where u got that he's a blob, and every 2 attacks Bayle moves to a different spot in his 2nd phase.

[@pohlman1]

placidusax is personally my favorite dragon fight. I love dodging his teleport attacks.

[@Audio_noodle]

i wonder if they could incorporate a zoom out in conjunction with the snappier camera rotation, so if the boss is above you, it zooms out etc

[@Flupperz]

You didn't fully touch on it, but I think the music on Bayle also is top tier and elevates it so well. The way it changes in phase to make it seem like even more impending doom is something to witness your first time.

[@adaqable]

The transition descent has a very clear sound que for when to dodge if you lose visibility

[@aaatthh]

really good video, keep it up 👍

[@user-uy4iu2wp8b]

I play claw and can use thumb to aim and look around while ready to dodge with index finger and attack with middle finger, helps a lot with those look off moments

[@taz9041]

great vid I really wish you brought Kalameet into the discussion though I understand this was meant to be about the 'modern' fights still I think it would have added something. subbed.

[@jermergerg]

Appreciate it! Yeah not being able to discuss the older bosses in any detail is a weakness. Some day, I'll go through and replay them and get footage, but with the DLC and also working my job, I just don't have the bandwidth right now :/

[@ongabonga4378]

I used to absolutely despise the copy-pasted wyvern dragon fights in Elden Ring, but at some point I figured out that it's much more fun to try and fight them like Midir, and almost exclusively go for attacks on their heads. They stagger and crit animation on wyverns is so satisfying. I just wish that they did a better job conveying that to the player. Midir and Bayle's fights are great because the game almost always puts their heads right in front of you during a punish window when they finish attacking. If you look at Bayle and Midir, you notice that their models are stooped over so that their heads are pretty much eye-level with the player. The main issue I have with the wyverns is that their heads are placed way too high up, and sometimes entirely out of reach for certain weapons. You can get a few hits in during the roar animation that always folllows a stomp attack, but sometimes that entire window is eaten up when the wyvern's head ended up behind you because you rolled forward and under the boss to dodge the attack. Obviously if you are under the wyvern you're going to attack it's legs instead of running up to hit the head that you probably can't even reach anyway. And it's not even worth talking about the four-legged ancient dragon fights. Fromsoft gave up, and decided to make a 360° dragon fight where every attack has lightning or shockwave aoe cause the player has no incentive to be facing the front of the boss, and locking-on makes you want to throw up. Oh wait, there's a remembrance boss version with Godwyn lore? Oh, they just took the same shitty design, but added more aoe and deathblight. Thank you Dark Souls. Placidusax is fine, idk. He's like a fat version of the ancient dragons, but less annoying to fight cause you can't go under him and mess up the lock-on camera really bad. His cool attacks are really fucking cool though, and I think it's fine to have a boss that exists just for that. Especially now that Bayle exists to make up for it.

[@kamiwriterleonardo6345]

Just saying Midir doesn't have someone screaming "CURSE YOU"

[@L_Ankotte]

I want to make a comment about the content of the video and add to it, because I really vibe with the topic. Thing is, I have nothing to add, because I 100% agree with everything you said! Sub earned

[@georgiosgiannoukas3319]

Placidusax and Divine dragon are the best imo. Yeah they're easy but goddamn those are some of the most epic boss fights FromSoft has ever done

[@BobSB129]

Can we just also acknowledge how good the npc summon is for this fight? It would pain me not to use Igon. The voice acting from him is amazing, the fight is 100% fair (looking at you gaius) and fun, the music is spectacular, and if your weapon doesn’t do enough damage, just like the stormruler in DeS and DS3 there’s a weapon it gives you for the fight. The arena is sick too Amazing fight in every way

[@jacksonr260]

When the wings come out in phase 2 - wow. My fav dragon fight by far. Btw spectral lance is super good for this fight. You can get a stagger after just a few throws to his face.

[@d7LS]

I think fights where it’s easier to unlock the camera are less fun. That’s how i started out with bayle but realizing you can actually stand in front of him and watch for cues was awesome

[@jolestoli]

I don't mind free aiming a camera but only if the game is built around it and doesnt feature a lock on, Dragons dogma is an example of a great camera with large monsters but no lock on

[@arara7713]

I wholeheartedly disagree with the lock on take on Midir. I was fight him lock on right in front of him only dodging backwards until he finishes his combos and I never have problems with his camera. Of course it does swing a lot up, down and side to side but it just makes the fight more cinematic and it doesn't interfere on the gameplay. As long as you keep him always in front of you its a flawless camera wich is impressive for such a big enemy and seeing how fromsoftware struggled so much with camera in this last dlc

[@ILYheavyrain]

I love that the peak of dragon power is a beam of pure fire it’s cool

[@iplaygames.3899]

Wish fromsoft added stuff to the base game from the dlc. Camera work can also be fixed if the front of the boss is always visible. Maybe when lockingnon we have a fixed camera point on an invisible model covering the front of the boss so we always know what its doing and maybe add some slight shifts in the direction of our character. The camera should also zoom way more out, seeing our speck of a character scurry sround gives more of a sense of scale

[@Raynhardx]

I always thought I was supposed to attack the legs, as the head is so awkward to keep in camera D:

[@luhcsgrimm8857]

A good note of scale is the difference between Monster hunter World vs Rise. The monsters, while remaining similar in proportion to world, seem so smaller in scale because of the camera

[@mauricedowork]

Yes, I absolutely love this boss fight

[@dumbsterdives]

one thing i think helps both bayle and placidusax is their body shapes. because placidusax is flat to the ground and bayle is very hunched, youre less likely to end up under their body getting screwed by the camera anywhere near as hard as you can with almost every other dragon in souls history

[@tonyjones3217]

I like both bayle and midir's fights roughly the same however the runback for midir made me choose bayle as my favourite.

[@thegreenfather1978]

I defeated Bayle first try with the help of Igon, and if it weren't for his awesome lines, it would have been a bad fight. Bad camera, screen constantly filled with particle effects, giant AoE attacks. Too many bosses in ER, even more so in the DLC, just fill the screen with tons of stuff. It's barely playable. Final boss phase 2 was a confusing chore, not a fun fight. At least the arena is flat.

[@M__FO]

Even without igon he's still the best imo

[@lakatariah5815]

Midir is by far the best dragon bossfight and imo one the best bossfight ever created by fromsoftware tied by gael. Its a perfect dance when you know how to fight it with absolute 0 dumbshit attacks that are undodgable or unreactable, its hp pool is more than enough and learning to fight midir properly (by staying next to his head) is so satisfying and the combat feels just insanely well. Talking about the Midir / Placidusax / Bayle laser beam attack, the midir one is the best also by far by the simple fact that midir doing his laser ultimate truely shows that he's giving absolutely EVERYTHING into that attack displayed by the fact that he is exhausted after doing it, it just feel fair, you play well against the boss that he's starting to struggle against you and then do that all out attack, Placidusax laser is cool af and felt like a cool reference to midir but it feels goofy to dodge and it doesn't give that "i gave everything" feeling after. Also placidusax basic attacks are complete garbage in terms of dodging, spacing etc.. its just a nightmare to fight against his firebreath, however the boss looks fucking cool. Bayle is insane and mix good references to midir moveset, i personally im sure i would love the fight if the lightning / fire effects didn't freeze my pc everytime he does an attack on phase 2. (also if you're a pc player, i prefer delocking when phase transition happens and just adjust the camera looking at each one of the fireballs that comes at you, it makes it easier to run away from it) anyway i would say Midir, Bayle and Placidusax, shout out to kalameet

[@botondzoltannagy8849]

Why would zooming out ruin that sense of scale? You would see how tiny you are compared to the creature.

[@erno6155]

Sinh the slumbering dragon is my personal favourite fight. Kahlameet is the coolest design. Midir was the most satisfying to defeat. But Bayle was definitely the most hype especially because of Igors addition and the build up to the top.

[@MiniWhiteDragon]

I’m torn between Bayle, Midir, and Kalameet tbh. I love all three so I really can’t say.

[@snowstorm5103]

Good video, but you should work on making it more cinematic . (Example at 5:40 you don't showcase Placi's lightning strike whatsoever) Otherwise it's alright, I just want to see the bosses epic moves.

[@atacansemerci8140]

Well if we took out the shitty flame breath attack and hitting with his belly/chest.Bayle was damn near perfect BUT midir is just pinnacle of the dragon fights.Non debatle in my opinion.(placi was good too but just too slow to be anywhere except 3rd place)

[@crabhater9373]

I always thought the best solution for camera issues with big bosses would be to just zoom the camera out. Seems like a pretty straightforward solution.

[@gothxm]

when an enemy is large i lock on when theyre in view and turn it off if theyre going to make the camera wonky. That's the trade off when youre playing 3rd person games against large enemies. i think its also a result of the impatience to win and get the battle over with. If we were more patient, which im not, we wouldnt put ourselves in those compromised positions just to get an extra hit in. Thats also why its tough to critique bosses because some may agitate you because of your particular play style and habits. I'd love a video where you get two players discussing what bosses were hard for them and then you give each other advice/watch each other's fight against it in real time.

[@mikariekki5708]

Could be interesting to see a fight againts a human size opponent from a dragons persepective. Do they even see anything during a breath attack?

[@morepower6800]

All of them are absolutely amazing and that should tell you how brilliant fromsoftware is and why we're absolutely blessed to have them in our lives

[@mesadrums375]

The only boss I used a summon for but it was worth it. Igon and Ansbach are the homies.

[@SenUchitana]

He's like a Kaiju lol

[@antarctic8927]

Borealis the freezing fog, he wins. This guy is the reason nothing is up in those mountains (My head cannon). He was actually so strong and such a tough fight. The arena being open world and being able to ride a horse made it feel as grand as a fight with a dragon can, and the fog around him gave a sick aesthetic. At the very least he was top 3 base dragon in Elden Ring, only contenders are Lichdragon Fortissax and the dragon lord himself. As a long term Dark souls 3 fan Darkeater Midir was my favorite dragon in any game until Elden Ring. His moveset was copied and the good parts of the fight implemented and improved upon and given unique spins. Adula and the magic sword comes to mind as something really cool they added. The build up to Midir, clipping his wings so he becomes a grounded fight, the area, the lore, the secret passage, all of this makes it a top tier fight. It is not anything less, it's just that fromSoftware did a great job learning from past successes and improving as time goes on. Midir is loved, but he got nothing on Bayle

[@Slaughter_Hill]

I still like midir more. After 50 tries seeing midir start shouting and exploding and seeing the dark spells, my heart was beating so hard. And when he fell down for the final riposte and still has health after the riposte. Bayle died on my 2nd try in 90 seconds since you can just stay under him

[@jamiebull1685]

i felt this exact same way, so much that i had to go to ds3 and go fight midir. I wanted to compare both fights back to back. And honestly after all this time.. Midir isnt hitting the same as he used to for me. Bayle was such an awesome fight and i want to fight him at a lower scadutree blessing to make it a bit more of a challenge. I completely agree that Midir is still one of fromsofts best dragons ever and Im still willing to say that he still is fromsofts best traditional dragon. Bayle doesnt even feel like a dragon fight to me most of the time which is what i think is the difference.

[@Sir-Pleiades]

​@@jamiebull1685Bayle isn't a FS dragon he's more like a Monster Hunter more than anything else

[@Detriax]

My issue with Midir is that he isn’t interesting. He had a very simple moveset, with 1 threatening move.

[@Vengeance_Im]

You probably like Midir more because he suits your level of play better, at least that's the case with most of Elden Ring bosses and souls veterans not liking them. Midir is much more simple and much easier than most Elden Ring bosses, same things with bosses like Soul of Cinder, Nameless King, etc. Which is totally fine imo, Elden Ring levels up on Dark Souls formula, demanding more skill from the player, so no wonder a lot of players don't appreciate the difficulty and accepting their skill limitations

[@Slaughter_Hill]

@@Vengeance_Im bayle died on my second try 💀

[@MeesaBack]

Yeah he’s an incredible fight

[@alloytitanium5972]

For the camera issue with big scale enemy, i ponder a bit but i think the best one at it is probably Rykard. You fight him at range so you get to see his entire body, you get a melee weapon that has insane range that only work on that boss without it having to charge up (stormruler) so rarely theres downtime, the lava pools keep you away from kissing the boss. Ig the only thing that detract from him is mechanically his a simple fight, or you can stunlock the shit out of him.

[@Mrfinch9999]

I personally prefer the older style dragons/bosses in DS1 and DS2. More recent games are too focused on making bosses be overly epic, having delays and fakeouts, crazy attack strings, teleporting and bosses flying all over the arena, aoe spam, etc. Which can lead to it being much more fun to watch, but worse to actually play. The difficulty is more memorizing the bosses attack strings and learning exactly what action to take with every attack, over just being good at the game (aka more variance in how you could win over performing the one correct reaction to properly dodge everything). Older games had a more strategical approach to combat because they were more tame and everything was slower. It felt like bosses had stamina and were bound by the same rules as you. It was more about spacing and felt like real one-on-one duels at it's peaks. The epic and more fast pace encounters stood out more because they were more rare and left to one or two bosses worthy of it. Now every late game bosses is nuking the whole arena and no longer has stamina at all.

[@giannispapakrivopoulos5455]

I thought bayle's scaling was awful in the beginning (too much dmg for the amount of health) but I had 6 scadutree blessing points (I am an average Souls player). Went back with 18-19 blessing and I was able to observe the boss movement more and this video pretty much does him justice!! Camera is a bit wanky and the straight fire attack can have weird hitboxes sometimes but overall he is great.

[@avelonzx]

Agheel in Limgrave is the best dragon fight. The abrupt nature of his arrival, crushing the enemies in his path is a great entrance and it's such a nice surprise that just feels like a natural way of encountering a dragon instead of knowing when you are about to face one like in the case of Bayle. His moveset is just complex enough, but not overly complicated so that you feel engaged in the fight. Torrent is also available and makes the down-time when he flies away less tedious and more fast-paced. There are way more openings for you to hit his head than the bigger dragons, and it's quite easy to stagger him that way which makes it satisfying. Too bad they felt the need to repeat this fight a hundred times after. Should have been a one-off fight.

[@Ryan-gc3sd]

😂😂😂😂 nice joke

[@avelonzx]

@@Ryan-gc3sd It is by far the best dragon fight, you are just an anime boy liking big lightning strikes and explosions instead of immersive RPG experiences. That's all there is to it. Now sit down.

[@yuomovaeh3028]

Even I play a more MH games it still feels more natural to use target lock in FromSoft games. Maybe I'm just too used to it. Cool analysis btw!

[@giganiga126]

4:13 blud stuttered

[@gigachigga]

Wondering if you consider the Elden Beast a dragon fight. I think that by all means it meets the criteria for a dragon fight and I’d like to see where you’d rank it

[@YokaiGotha]

But its not a dragon, its the physical embodiment of the Elden Ring. Its a god. It also looks more like one of those prehistoric whale looking sea creatures than a dragon

[@mehmetvursavas5922]

I didn't really like all the visual noise, but i can see why he would be someone's favorite

[@northwoodsjjd8454]

What’s your opinion on consort radahn?

[@internallyscreaming2788]

I love bayle, it took me 3 days. The only thing i dont like about him is that whenever I'm summoned to fight him, i prefer to get his aggro focused entirely on me, and solo him by myself.

[@kurenian]

I will say one strike I have against Bayle is visual clutter. Especially his phase 2 wing slam into flame lightning trail aren’t hard on the camera, but they are hard on the eyes. There’s a lot of visual clutter for me. Sometimes I don’t really know what’s happening and even if I can dodge it, it doesn’t feel satisfying to dodge. I never really had that problem with Midir, so for that reason, I’d put Midir slightly above Bayle mechanically. But still a good fight.

[@zed6740]

Great points. While I love Bayle and consider him my favorite ER boss, Midir to me is still the best dragon boss mechanically speaking. There are 2 problems with Bayle. One as you already covered is the camera. While the camera does work sufficiently, it often takes you underneath him and you end up always being blinded or literally stuck inside the model, which can make for some janky moments. Second, while he has a very dynamic moveset that makes for some cinematic moments, it does create problems thats often found with a lot of ER bosses. He can often extend his combos without a buildup or enough time for you to react. For example, for his biting attack, he can extend it by doing almost a headbutt, which comes out quite quickly. This just leaves me guessing or always assuming he's gonna do it, so I end up either rolling through it, or wasting a roll. As similarly stated, some attacks come more quickly than you have time to roll out of. For example, he can sometimes just roar right in your face and multiple lightning strikes will follow. My only solution was to just keep a fair distance away from his head.

[@anonymousperson8903]

? You just i-frame the roar and run away from the lightning.

[@zed6740]

@anonymousperson8903 "As similarly stated, some attacks come more quickly than you have time to roll out of."

[@anonymousperson8903]

@@zed6740 It doesn't come out too quickly though. It's a subtle tell but it's definitely there, and once you learn it you can dodge it every time.

[@zed6740]

@anonymousperson8903 Then that's the problem, it's too subtle to even tell it's gonna come out. It should be better communicated and telegraphed that it's coming.

[@anonymousperson8903]

@@zed6740 Debatable. I see your point, unsure if I agree.

[@MakioGoHardio]

Bayle is my goat, he’s my favourite boss in the dlc right along with messmer and Rellana.

[@jermergerg]

Been quite a while since I've seen you around!

[@Njox]

My #1 is still Midir but Bayle close #2

[@nathanrelac8388]

My one issue with bayle - more of a nitpick than anything - is that you can only lock on to his head, not his body or anything else. Since his head moves around and up and down so much it is extremely difficult to hit him with spells and incantations that don't chase their target, and even if you try to free aim them they just auto lock on his head anyway.

[@Ribsi]

Gameplay wise it's Bayle, but holy shit Midir's soundtrack is unbeatable, it's straight up the best boss ost in the series imo (besides of course Ludwig's and Laurence's ost)

[@sebastiannelson6355]

Fatalis from MHW is still the best endboss dragon fight in games. It matches scale with difficulty perfectly

[@magnolt]

the main fix for bayle is to be able to move the lock on target between his chest and torso

[@Malxer]

Bayle has become my fav boss. Would've liked if you mentioned DS1 and DS2 dragons too. Theres some cool (and terrrible!) Dragons there

[@Leonhart_93]

DS2 has Snith in a DLC which was relatively nice, but DS1 dragons are too outdated and feel too one note at this point.

[@Malxer]

@@Leonhart_93 maybe, Kalameet is still top tier tho

[@Leonhart_93]

@@Malxer I remember Kalameet very well. The moveset is too basic for this day and age, and the player character is so incredibly slow to compensate. The stamina even regenerated at half the speed it does in Elden Ring, it felt quite turn based.

[@thedarkgenious7967]

Bayle was fun and I liked how Igon was an inversion of the typical Fromsoft NPC (we met him at his lowest point, broken and crippled, only to help him accomplish his goal and die presumably with a smile on his face)

[@alloydcyber557]

I personally prefer midir as he feels less janky and I don’t feel like I have to lock off except for the move where he runs across the arena and will climb over you. If locking off was how fromsoft wanted us to deal with these moves then I think they should have added a sign in the tutorial saying that some attacks are better dodged locked off.

[@anonymousperson8903]

"I think they should have added a sign in the tutorial saying that some attacks are better dodged locked off." I disagree. From was always about figuring it out yourself, and that continues here.

[@enfrax]

Great Video! Totally agree with everything you said. As a fellow lock-on andy i feel the pain on some of the larger bosses. Divine Beast Dancing Lion also comes to mind which is basically a completely different fight if play locked-off. im very stubborn so i rather spend some extra hours grinding out a solution that allows me to stay locked-on instead of learning locked-off play. It just feels so inconveient to me. On a standard controller with default keybinds you are physically not able to roll or sprint while simultaniously moving the camera unless you claw grip which is horrible. But in general I enjoy the fact that it elevates the skill ceiling having optimized dodges and punishes that only really work locked-off.

[@yes_temp_sem]

After Sekiro's implementation of a combat camera with big enemies, I was really disappointed when I saw what Elden Ring had to offer. I think in ER, their best result was with Rykard.

[@wesleycascio568]

I think my current ranking would for dragons would be 1. Mydyr 2 Kallamet 2. Standard elden ring dragons 4. Balye 5. King of the storm I had fun with Bayle but since I’m still on my first dlc play through it felt like I beat him because My 60 vigor, inclusion of Igor (I love him but is the only summon I’ve used in the dlc)and power stanced blade of darkness + Hand of Malenia carried me opposed to my own skill. I’ll probably learn to lve Balye like you have in time but for now he is just a flashy boss my old xbox was lucky to have not died from running.

[@Tk--cp9xw]

I haven't even beaten dark eater Midir nd its been 5 years...

[@herm574]

I feel like the divine dragon in sekiro tops Bayle. It's camerawork is perfect and the music, the spectacle and the gimmick all work really well together. My only gripe being it may be a little bit too simple.