Is Legend of Korra Too Western? - On Korra & Colonial Era Chinese History

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ALSO note that I got some facts mixed up in this video. Yu Dao didn't become Republic City itself, but part of the United Republic of Nations. It was Cranefish town that became Republic City specifically. And when I said "waist binding," I meant tight-lacing, but it may not have been as damaging to your health as popularly believed?
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🔎👒 Download June's Journey for free here: pixly.go2cloud.org/SH2P3 (thank u sponsor 太太) Edit: Please note that I got some facts mixed up in this video! Yu Dao didn't become Republic City itself, but part of the United Republic of Nations. It was Cranefish town that became Republic City specifically (though most of the colonies had the same story as Yu Dao). And when I said "waist binding," I meant tight-lacing, but it may not have been as damaging to your health as popularly believed? I swear, I still really liked the characters and action in Korra 😂 But I think it was too ambitious for its own good when tackling political ideologies. They simply didn't have room to get into nuance with the number of episodes they had per season, which is understandable. They ran into a LOT of problems with Nickelodeon.

[@keithwintersjr.7721]

The discourse between bender and non-benders started and in Avatar comic called imbalance with the gang goes to a city called crane fishtown will factories of put bender out of a job and it creates a whole entire game warfare just read the comic

[@nriab23]

How nuanced or accurate can any historical show spaced over several episodes be? I've seen representations of Northern Ireland from america that would make this show look like a historical textbook in comparison. Unfortuantly most film makers aren't historians. :/

[@origamipein18]

I still say that each season should've had 20+ episodes each. Thankfully, a friend of mine and I remedied that in our LOK rendition.

[@AlmostSkillfull]

I can definitely see Nickelodeon objecting to any strong criticism of westernism, colonialism, & capitalism. Like I get the impression they were already pretty wary of having a darker skinned female protag as apposed to their previous light skin cis het protag. Like just look at how they threw a fit and refused to have a korrasami kiss or even air half of the last season. The vibe I get from Korra is very much "this is what we were able to sell the producers on" which is why it's such a mess, because producers don't often make great storytellers and the actual story tellers had to deal with a lot of red tape and scrutiny that they didn't have to when they had a more normalized brand-"safe" cis het light skinned male protag.

[@yannenenenen]

Everyone else in the reply section: long sentences Me: :) Yes I totally understand everything you guys say :) (This is a joke please don’t take this seriously thank you 😊)

[@shockingheaven]

I hate how “too western" is often synonymous to "too civilized", another backhanded _compliment_ by some folks

[@fandeperu3582]

Good, I'm so grateful I have no idea what does that supposed to mean.

[@karaqakkzl]

"too civilized" just like call other culture as barbaric or inferior. "too Western" just don't make sense because do you even know where Gunpowder or Compass come from, Silk Road tried to make you not to become cavemen

[@paulgotik]

@@karaqakkzl sure but for example most technology of automation was created in germany and england so eastern contries without that would also be in mediavel times. Every culture has influence from each other.

[@ariamusuu]

@@fandeperu3582 koknikkiio

[@ariamusuu]

@@fandeperu3582 just

[@shinyagumon7015]

"To my longtime viewers" I feel honoured to be called that, but let's be real here, this channel isn't *that* old.

[@atruv2089]

I can proudly say that I've been here since the first video!

[@abthedragon4921]

I started watching this channel regularly around the time they uploaded the Over the Moon video and at that point I fell in love with the stuff I learned.

[@ce2araybara226]

No cap lol

[@booketoiles1600]

loong time viewers were there for the twitter thread

[@absolutelynotellen]

Yeah. I have been here since Over the Moon lmao

[@Frederico945]

It's so refreshing to see criticism of Korra that it not so dishonest and ill-intentioned

[@deepSea__]

I notice that a lot of actual criticism of Korra gets called invalid because people on Reddit had to explain something the creators didn’t show or explain.

[@yeshuamattatron5745]

There has been an insurgence of pretty neutral criticism of korra and I think it is a response to the wave of bad faith criticism from the first half of the decade. Some of the most popular reviews on the site are from content creators like Lily Orchard, "this is garbage here's why" and "korra defication" and so on. they are some of the most uncharitable reviews of the series and a lot people grew accustomed to agreeing with the criticisms of the show from that. But more people who either grew up being more familiar with korra or have watched korra again without nostalgia glasses have been debunking some of these earlier claims about the show.

[@ChangedMyNameFinally69]

@@yeshuamattatron5745 Ah yes Lily Orchard is the problem and not the literal Nazi E;R

[@ChangedMyNameFinally69]

@@yeshuamattatron5745 What's uncharitable about Lily's video beyond her view on anarchism?

[@munkee_man]

@@ChangedMyNameFinally69 Bruh Lily Orchard isn't shy from being an asshole too, other creators that are in that same genre as Lily despise them. But Lily's takes are terrible and anytime someone tries to argue otherwise in her comment section, she disapproves of them and keeps them blocked.

[@abbyalchemist4625]

The issue with Korra was production. Unlike other shows, they were only given the green-light for one season at a time instead of a set of seasons at a time. This heavily affects the story telling with a show because you do not want a season to feel incomplete in the fear that they will not be renewed for another season.

[@carmcam1]

this endeared me more to the show, i initially like TLOK at first watch than ATLA, then when i discovered the production shit they have to go through, and how the animators works so hard to give us probably the most beautiful animation as of date, i love the show more.

[@anomalyalice]

Very much this!! Season 1 was supposed to be a standalone 1 off set 100 years after TLA but the reaction was so massively popular that they decided to make a 2nd season and then be done for real!! Except... everyone loved the 2nd season too so they greenlit S3 and S4 which is why the last half of the show feels more cohesive than when you take the production as a whole.

[@acornfae18294]

@@anomalyalice Not to mention they pulled korra off of the kids block after the s1 ending bc of how dark it was, and later pulled it off tv altogether so the last season aired almost if not entirely on their website

[@bubbleteabeatboxx]

Yes, but season one still felt... off. The way they addressed political topics is not accurate and half-baked if I explained that properly.

[@celisewillis]

@Carmela Camba It is not correct to say that Korra's failures were due to season renewal issues. ATLA did most certainly NOT get 3 seasons greenlit at the start. Yes, Mike and Bryan said that they really wanted 3 seasons to tell the story, but NO greedy billion-dollar company is going to hand 3 seasons to two creators who have not made any shows before. They got a pilot approved, maybe 6 episodes picked up, and then the rest of the first season approved after they had good numbers (going by how things work today in the animation industry). Then Nick picked up the other two seasons, which is very unusual to have more than one season picked up, especially in the 2000s. LOK went thru a very similar process, except if anything, it likely went relatively smoother because Mike and Bryan had "proven" themselves already. I would argue instead, that the core writing staff was different on LOK, and smaller. I've met both Mike and Bryan, and they are very driven artists with huge imaginations! Creators NEED lots of feedback and collective creativity to make a show as good as ATLA. After creating a successful franchise, creators can fall into a echo bubble where everyone around them accidentally becomes a "yesman", because they misattribute the responsibility of the show's success to one or two people. Without honest feedback, creators are just kind of stuck making a product that doesn't *quite* live up to the hype of the original. (ie Mike and Bryan with Korra, George Lucas and the prequels, Just Kidding Rowling and the Fantastic Beasts movies, etc). This is why it's important to avoid lionizing one or two people on a project and crediting them 99% for the success of the property they headed. All the best media we have now is the result of creative collaboration and honest feedback!

[@Sibunamember101]

Gotta say, Nickelodeon ordering that each season of Korra had to be standalone really fucked the show over. ATLA was produced knowing it would have 3 seasons. When the first season of Korra was being made, there was no promises of a second season. The same for seasons 2 and 3. They couldn't have a story arc going for 4 whole seasons.

[@abthedragon4921]

Yeah, this show went through production hell. I wish there was a way to go back and not only confirm four seasons from the start and keep their budget consistent.

[@mateuszkubas4433]

Yeah it really fucked it up. Season 2 felt so out of place with that huge fight at the end, you would expect something like that at the end of the series If not that the plot of season 3 is connected to season 2 with all the airbending stuff, i would put season 3 as the second and either throw the 2nd away or remake it and put it at the end. (I didn't really like season 2, it was the worst of the four for me)

[@Juju2927]

Better have that than having a show who prays to have another season and ends on Cliffhangers (TLA didn't have that, of course, because it was established to have 3 seasons from the starts, but there's a lot of shows who do that sadly)

[@BiG-JuPO1O1]

@@abthedragon4921 Yeah Nickelodeon was being jerks and now all sudenlly they want welcome the writers back like Reiko welcome Korra back to Republic city in Season 3. Nick just want milk out as much money from avatar series due to it being popular again from Netflix. Like in book 4, one episode was ment to build up Kuvira back story. Korra and Asami relationship was ment to built up their relationship but Nick said no. Wanted the writers to create remembrance episode instead or else they'll cut down their budget again. They forced the writers to finish the series by certain date, only airing some episodes early in the morning around 5 to 6am. That how messed up Nickelodeon is.

[@Alikaoz]

I think this is one of the main sticking points about the series. You can't delve deeper or deconstruct much about the city or society if you can't be sure you can even close your main arcs.

[@PotatoFarmer656]

From being determined to trash on that Mulan remake, sis really just woke up one day and decided to commit making their channel all about cultural information/education and I highly respect that. Serving looks is also an added bonus. Go off, queen. Subscribed.

[@kims8752]

@@poisontip where was that stated? I dont see pronouns on the insta etc

[@Light-ro5bp]

Their pronouns are also on their KZbin about I believe

[@alphabettical1]

Their website has more details. Iirc it's something like she/her is okay in passing but they/them is official.

[@marwaregab7040]

Theyre enby

[@nevergonnagiveyouup1180]

@@poisontip That’s good to know. Thanks

[@Agumame]

The biggest issue really is that it feels like the whole world just went “yeah it was all Azula and Ozai, no one else in the Fire Nation is in any way to blame.” Like we as viewers obviously know why Zuko was the right choice as Firelord. But idea that the whole world after a 100 year war would not only be ok with Zuko becoming Fire Lord, and then that merely 70 years later there is absolutely no ill will towards the Fire Nation when it is still led by Sozin’s heirs is insane. And thats not even to begin to address how it took less than 70 years to deprogram 100+ years of Fire Nation propaganda on their own citizens. Somehow they all just accept that the war is over and everything theyve fought for for 100 years will end with them right back where they were 100 years ago and that the shamed/banished prince is in charge. If the creators didnt want to address these issues properly, then they really shouldnt have made the show about the Avatar after Aang.

[@OMamifero]

100%. The avatar world in ATLA, despite being made for young children originally, had extreme political depth and besides not only representing various political ideologies and crises, included creative historic changes in order to adapt the extremely influential magic system. For them to create a sequel, designed for an older audience than ATLA was planned, and simplify the crap out of the world and political complexities when it was designed for an older audience is bonkers to me. They should have held off until they had a complex story to be told. //in my opinion//

[@PxndaCakes]

That's more an ATLA problem than a LOK problem. They decided to "deal" with it during the comics, so there wasn't really a lot to do with it in Korra because we don't see the fire nation.

[@OMamifero]

Pxndacakes, I disagree. You don’t “deal” with it and move on as if real political discourse just fades away. They chose to make the problems that should exist in Korra go away as opposed to confronting them. It leaves more room for controversy, and makes the writing a lot more difficult-but that’s what you take on when you start a politically complex show with a complex world. Same goes for Game of Thrones, the show writers took a politically complex world and once the book material ran out, they got lazy and rushed it for the sake of rushing it. It’s just bad writing and they should have known what they signed up for and committed to keeping the world complex, as opposed to simplifying the source material. Also, I’m not intentionally coming off as aggressive or condescending, I’m just sharing my opinions and I’m not necessarily correct. There’s a lot of “Korra haters” being told they’re rude and aggressive in these comments but I think a lot of sensitive people just can’t handle their favorite media being critiqued

[@GreaterGrievobeast55]

@@OMamifero moving isn’t quite exactly what happens in the comics or LOK. After all, much of kuviras justification for invading republic territory is because they use to be earth kingdom territory conquered by the fire nation that never integrated back into due to the mass cultural shift. Theres still people in/ from fire nation that would rather see ozai set free, or Bitter about not having a war machine to bolster their career. Many that try to dethrone or assassinate zuko. Questions of the new fire lords objectives and how he should best proceed are always brought up. On the opposite end of the spectrum theres still plenty of people from the other nations that are very resentful of the fire nation be it cautious paranoia or just straight up violent bigotry towards them. Brokering new peace treaties and sorting out how society has changed since the start of the war all takes place. Could it have been done better? In some cases probably, I’m not 100% certain what the exact order the comics were released but it does sort of give the impression that at least the later ATLA books came out as explanations for plot elements in LOK. Though more often than not the conclusions to certain crisis feels plausible enough in their contained stories. Should it have happened in LOK? Well I don’t see how much of it really could with the time skip unless they relied a lot more on flashbacks to aangs past. Its post his death after all, I would think he’d have spent his life mitigating the ramifications of his post 100 year war world. Plus the comics need some interesting story to say.

[@ayoogunsakin9223]

@@GreaterGrievobeast55 they could still definitely have addressed how people were adjusting to things in LoK. Till this day people in America still engage in racial discourse all kinds of political topics that started many years ago. Heck for their inequality theme in book 1 they could have followed up with how with the emergence of new technology bender powered jobs were no longer in demand. The lack of jobs and means to sustain themselves move benders to commit crimes and even start movements..but instead we get "bender gangs are causing trouble in our city so we're being oppressed and all benders should be stripped of their abilities."??

[@PrincessAmanante]

“Why are you looking to a western production for a non-western story to begin with?” Ouch.

[@rickoshay5525]

Because I was little back in 2005 and didn't know how to look up Asian movies. 😩

[@Julian-bm9sx]

That hair is fantastically done

[@lemonstarofficial]

yes

[@MariaRodriguez-dx6sm]

Karolina and Abby would approve

[@cayna3880]

The hair and hairpieces are always perfect.. Yes!

[@farida3692]

fr fr i need a tutorial!

[@ophiuchus44]

Seriously! Finger waves are such a pain in the ass to do too

[@kendraalvares8075]

I love how your cat is just constantly like "Hey, also, me. Hey. I exist." Yes! Continue to exist, precious furry overlord! ♥

[@davidlian1301]

Long ago, the four nations lived together in harmony. air , fire water, and kat😽

[@aimeemenard6695]

This is my favorite comment😋

[@kendraalvares8075]

@@aimeemenard6695 Lol, the video's all "serious history stuff" and I'm just "Ooo kitty." ( I was super into the history lesson but the cat moving around messed with my focus xD )

[@mypanexogamouslineage965]

Furry Lordess, her name is Kuntulan and she's a Chinese-Mongolian Empress.

[@Ash-yb8ex]

I thought you were talking about furries for a second 🤭

[@billie6547]

I always thought the "too Western" argument came from the Rava and Vatu reveal which seemed very "You shall have only one god", God vs. Satan, Christian-y to me. I never imagined there was so much actually behind it. Thank you for these continued thoughtful analyses.

[@starorcarina8525]

By right, Christianity came from Israel and Israel is Techincally an Asian country

[@kittykittybangbang9367]

@@starorcarina8525 A lot of people tend to forget that the abrahamic religions originated in the middle east. There's also the fact that a lot of biblical characters have been whitewashed

[@healgoth]

Bruh it’s literally a yin/yang, they spell it out in the show IDK how you got bible out of “He cannot destroy light anymore than I can destroy darkness. One cannot exist without the other. Even if I were to defeat Vaatu in this encounter, darkness would grow inside me until he emerges again. The same will hold true if Vaatu defeats me.” Jinora using the remnant of Raava left over in the teapot to speed up the 10,000 year reincarnation process even makes a literal dot of light within the dark ☯️

[@ravioli3807]

@@healgoth Thats surface level. The fact is Vaatu is shown as antagonistic and Raava as righteous and good, which is the antithesis of the yin/yang concept. A better ending would be for Vaatu and Raava be forced to coexist peacefully to potray the message of balance the creators intended.

[@ThatWeirdo04]

The whole light/dark dichotomy is present in pretty much every religion in some way

[@theBlindDeafMute]

"The problem with korra is that it has a very shallow understanding of the topics it tries to have discourse about" this is EXACTLY my problem with the dragon prince, too.

[@ceve]

I think The Dragon Prince did a better job than Korra. I still like both shows though,

[@emeraldtree13]

I would’ve much preferred if the series explored cultural identity issues with Mako and Bolin; it would’ve been more interesting than the silly romantic subplots they got tangled up in. It also would have deepened their characters, too, and given them more thematic relevance.

[@maadtee6281]

What identity issues they lived in a place with different cultures around they seemed comfortable where they lived. Series should have explored korra life in the south pole cause it seems she never had friends at all until meeting bolin and mako. Develop more of republic city

[@Vekcrazah]

Korra can be boiled down into this: Excellent worldbuilding, and would've been great if not for the romantic shit they tried squeezing in

[@cauaviniciusguedes1434]

@@maadtee6281 that's something the series Didn't building very well, yeah.

[@cauaviniciusguedes1434]

@@Vekcrazah or the squeezing of unnecessary things, like yeah the subplot and romance storylines, atla did romance but it was so flesh and more well done, the world building of korra is great, but the development of the storytelling of culture, people, social, job, freedom, standalone or separate stories like a episode of the week but that was connected and means something to your character development and the forgetable and no main characters to this episode, the storm, blue spirit, the blind bandit, like Zuko alone, the library, stories of ba sing se, the beach, the theater avatar adaptation and others.

[@unknownxme2242]

@@maadtee6281 Coming from someone who is mixed (four generations of interracial marriage) and live in one of the most culturally diverse cities whose education system promoted racial harmony (yall can guess which country I'm talking about), I actually do struggle with personal identity even though everyone around me is quite accepting. Even those who I know are in the half-and-half boat still struggle with it. Though it may not present itself as an external problem in such situations, internally I never feel like I truly belong to any of the communities I should be in. If anything I should be the pinnacle of racial harmony. Instead I've led my life feeling lost with regards to a part of my identity that others can proudly present and when racial conflicts arise, I'm caught in the crossfire. Of course, do take this bit with a grain of salt since mine is just one of the many different experiences!

[@kanzenatsume]

"expecting something Asian inspired to look a certain way without knowing or understanding what Asia was really like in modern time periods" boom! truth bomb dropped at the very start!

[@hysuka2]

The flaw in that argument is that Asia was heavily inspired by Europeans. In the Avatar universe, there are no Europeans to influence their cultures and the development of the kingdoms and nations should have reflected that.

[@PaintedHoundie]

@@hysuka2 you could easily explain that away by just saying they developed those on their own. its an anachronistic steampunk world, if they can develop blimps, drills and submarines in their version of the feudal era, they can develop tech that is similar to western tech in their version of the industrial period. i do think korra couldve worked on certain things in that regard, but i just cant really imagine what drastically different thing they were supposed to do when it comes to the tech and other stuff. not to mention the "too western" argument being tackled is heavily inspired by nitpicks about republic city just being new york without much frame of reference for the rest of the asian inspired themes in korra. the nations did reflect non european development, most of the stuff that people seem to see as western is the technology, but these technologies inevitably would end up as part of any world that continued to progress into this era, especially a steampunk world that is "ahead of its time" with their technology already. we see in real life civilizations develop similar things independently of each other all through out history. civilizations with no connection to each other will discover ways to build pyramids, chariots, math formulas, solar system models, etc. so its not too far fetched theyd have similar modern infrastructure or technology in universe.

[@TheJadedJames]

@@PaintedHoundie I am totally with you here. But it was basically inevitable that once you moved the setting to Asian inspired 20th Century, people were going to complain that it looked too western no matter what, for no other reason that we all see the aesthetic of the 20th century as one with so much cultural exchange that it isn't "pure" anymore, forgetting all the ways cultural exchange had shaped the world even before that.

[@Elghast]

@@TheJadedJames everything about cultural appropriation is such poorly researched bulshit I struggle to realise how it's become so mainstream. Like everything has such complexity in it it's useless to put a little flag on every single item just for personal satisfaction. Nothing belongs to one culture. Not even asian culture is fully one sided but a neverending blend of a million different subcultures, asian, mongol, western. Lonely person needs attention, uses poorly understood concepts to make other idiots feel sorry for her

[@apollon6870]

modern time itself has nothing to do with any other culture than the western

[@liinahyvarinen2388]

I actually really liked Korra, but I completely agree that they should have showed more of the other nations recovering. (Sorry if I wrote something wrong, English is not my first language)

[@carmcam1]

isn't this like 50-60 years after the war? I would think that recovery is already completed. That is why there is already advancement of technology

[@saddocatto9245]

Lol, many Chinese and korean are still very offensive to japanese until now tho..

[@Daddyseige]

I’m actually really glad someone brought this up. I’ve been a huge fan sense the release of atla and there are many atla comics that bring up how they industrialized and the struggles after the war. Very good comics 10/10 recommended on Amazon.

[@kenjimikki7064]

@@saddocatto9245 they still afraid to rising sun. That bella poarch have became an issue.

[@rmsgrey]

@@carmcam1 There are still people around today who haven't gotten over Culloden...

[@DistortedBird]

It actually never crossed my mind that Republic City was "Just New York" because as a denizen of NYC, the designs of the buildings was distinctly not NYC right down to the window panes. Even with the statue of liberty. The references to some things in america were pretty clear though, like Henry Ford.

[@ChangedMyNameFinally69]

Yeah but it's obvious that was the model

[@KRYMauL]

I was always of the opinion that Republic City was Singapore or Taiwan seeing as they both were invaded by the Japanese and were influenced enough to break apart from the mainland.

[@nehcooahnait7827]

@@KRYMauL yeah no. It is just US America like former British colonies but full of descendants of colonial settlers. In the creation story of the Republican city there were some form of reconciliation which never existed in the US since indigenous people always been largely excluded from the conversation. Reparations to the aboriginals is a controversial topic in the US. Taiwan’s case is different since it was returned to China but stranded as the result of a civil war and rival governments, full of ambiguities.

[@Goldfish1060]

Also another fun fact is that Asia has much more statues than the west. So republic city having a statue can be easily attributed to the statues they have in Asia.

[@alex_ho]

The individual architectural designs of the many structures may not have been NYC or Western specific, but you can't deny that the entire city's layout, inspiration, and design is meant to invoke a sort of 1920s "land of opportunity" feel of America. They have a statue of liberty of Aang for crying out loud!

[@hakanozaslan9571]

"Why is western conflated with modern?" As a Turkish person THIS hits me VERY hard ! XD My ancestral country `westernised` itself without colonialism but for a long time there was this feeling of shame and an inferiority complex after the fall of the Ottoman Empire and the establishment of the `modern` Republic of Turkey (of which many ppl overcompensate with nationalism). It even went to the point where traditional music was prohibited and only a weird "westernised" style was allowed in radio's (in addition to western classical music).

[@sherlocksmuuug6692]

Ataturk, the first president of Turkey even banned wearing a fez or similar "oriental" headdresses like turbans, because he thought they made Turkey look "backwards". Same would later happen in Egypt. Its a real shame how much culture was thrown in the dumpster by a lot of modernizing countries, just to appear more "international" and "civilized" to the dominant nations of the time.

[@thatasianplayer]

Ataturk moments just dismantling the Ottoman state so hard that the country literally gets a new Identity so progressive that now the reactionaries after almost 100 years have taken to power and are having none of his crap anymore and are trying to hit the reset button to return to having the Turks be the "leaders" of the Islamic world.

[@ct-gv6yl]

I'm not from Turkey but I feel this "westernisation" is still a problem? People around the world focus too much on American politics and cuture. It's kinda sad

[@sherlocksmuuug6692]

@@ct-gv6yl The current reactionary government of Turkey basically wants to turn back the clock and reverse all reforms of Atatürk and later because in their minds not a single good thing came from these reforms or societal progress and everything was better under the Empire, or rather, their mythical idea of what the Empire was like. Both of these ideas are very wrong and lead to some very dark places.

[@michaelh13]

@@sherlocksmuuug6692 this is a shame, I’ve read much of Ataturk, he was a great leader

[@lem0nwings]

10:14 "In a world without European cultural equivalent, where do these European aesthetic influences come from? It shouldn't be presented as an inevitability of social development." Such a good line.

[@BlitzsieLDiscoLSnow]

EXACTLY! This is where my dislike for Korra comes from. They had such a beautiful world with its own aesthetic, own cultures based on snippets of real-life cultures, and instead of using that and thinking how that would develop on its own they took the easy, stupid "progress == western culture/industrialism" move. Together with overall shallow characters I never made it past a couple episodes into season two. Because, ffs, why do people still wear only the colours of their bending. With Mako and Bolin it would've been nice to see that it may have to do with holding on to their heritage, but why so in the face? What would a mixture of that clothing look like? What new fashions would people think of now that there is a mixture of those cultures, instead of the "hurrdurr western clothing" feeling I got.

[@soonlet4977]

this explained why I, Asian-born Asian, disliked Korra while my European-born Asian friend loved it but neither could really explain why as we were kids. I couldn't understand why while I appreciated the aesthetics and "mature" (initially our words but now I think "modern" is more fitting) progression. It felt incredibly off and shallow to default to real life situations when the fantasy's history was so different.

[@user-nu5im9ej4j]

"Nations are not destined to develop European-looking cities managed by democratic leadership. Communities of people are not even destined to become "countries" as we currently know them." That's what I call a follow-up.

[@Lashb1ade]

@@user-nu5im9ej4j It's really sad that people see western democracy as normal and not as the miracle that it really is. We should be shouting from the rooftops about how amazing the west is for inventing it, not just taking it for granted.

[@user-nu5im9ej4j]

@@Lashb1ade Yep, that is so true. Without the west, democracy (by all logic in Avatar) shouldn't be possible. It's a really perplexing narrative, don't you think?

[@CollinBuckman]

"Where did the western influence come from?" Maybe the same place that those Republic City residents with Italian accents came from lmao

[@ayoogunsakin9223]

Thank you! And the Boston accent with that one little street kid too.

[@lonebattledroid4474]

I guess technically the Western influence in the Avatar world would be The Fire Nation since it's in the west and industrialized first but I don't think Korra ever took advantage of this.

[@dragonstryk7280]

@@lonebattledroid4474 Except that the Fire Nation isn't actually western. That's a BIG reach. See, that's sort of the issue with the westernization argument. There was no western influence in the world of Avatar. I mean, even China real world had massive western influences from the colonial powers. LoK was a chance to see what modern Asian cultures would look like without that western influence, and I feel like they flinched hard on that one.

[@lonebattledroid4474]

@@dragonstryk7280 yeah I agree I just ment that in Avatar the Fire Nation would've likely filled a similar role to the West since they were colonizers, industrialists, the biggest means of trade and likely during the 100 year war they probably brain washed the other nations into thinking the Fire Nation were "modern" because of their technology similar to the British. And yeah Republic City was especially disappointing as it could've been a really cool location as the cultures of the Water Tribes (based off Inuit culture), Earthkingdom (baised on tons like China, Indian, African, or Middle Eastern cultures), and Fire Nation (basied off Japan, Korean, and Central/ Latin American.) But it wasn't really explored and felt very bland.

[@ayoogunsakin9223]

@@lonebattledroid4474 I mean China? Japan? The fire nation would fill the role of those two, the Western influences didn't have to come into play at all.

[@dunke10]

From my point of view, The Legend of Korra doesn't necessarily propose western capitalism as the end, but what gives this impression is that the series is very good at presenting certain extremisms as problematic, but fails to propose solutions. Take the first season as an example, it is visible how many people follow Amon and agree with his violence, which only proves that there is dissatisfaction, but this is never addressed. For me, what was lacking in the series was more development in the nuances of these themes.

[@Lazurath101]

At the start of S2 there’s a throwaway line about how the Republic City council is now led by non-benders and how RC is about to elect its first non-bending president, but it’s such a shallow solution that I’m not surprised most people forget about it lol

[@LC-sc3en]

Ultimately this is why I still haven't finished it. I really did love the mythic stuff in season 2 but in the present day it felt like things happened more for rule of cool or to get from plot point A to plot point B than any intention to actually examine the issues in any serious depth. I might have been fine with this if the depth of the issues had only missed impacting Korra and maybe one other character. But no main character in the series takes the slightest moment to really consider the emotional reality and repercussions of the events or recognize complications of the fallout of their actions. I stopped in season 3 when the group of young adults and actual adults didn't think or didn't realize after being rejected several times that asking random people to just leave their homes to take up a monk like culture and lifestyle they had no investment to previously was a big ask. And then instead of realizing what a big ask it was and coming up with a clever solution and compromise, the show just forced the issue with a big bad giving an even worse option for them. And everyone was happy and nothing was said about it again. It's so frustrating the show writers can show us that these issues are real and serious but they don't ever make the main characters really confront them.

[@tesso.6193]

It can't present "extremisms" as problematic when all it presented was strawmen of all non-liberal-capitalist ideologies. The extremism when your moral center is a right-wing ideology forged in settler-colonialism (liberalism) are not inherently bad. A writer who cannot see past their own ideology cannot see the merit in others so you end with bizarre strawmen in Korra.

[@gingervald8601]

@@tesso.6193 ^^yes. Also I found it really strange how season 4 tried to make Kuvira sympathetic and how she had a rough childhood and Korra can understand where she comes from.. She created a fascist regime complete with interment camps for political dissenters and minorities (water/fire benders). Of all the straw man villains this is the one they put in a season with a forgiveness and empathy focus? Uncomfortable to say the least.

[@tesso.6193]

@@gingervald8601 let's not forget that literally no one bats an eye at the capitalist who sold weapons to her and others. Like, not even slightly questioned.

[@RiseeRee]

When I thought of LoK being more Western, it wasn’t ever really because of the industrialization or new aesthetic. It was mostly because of season 2. Creating an ultimate spirit of light and and ultimate spirit of darkness felt jarringly Western/Christian and I thought it took away from the duality of the spirits established in ATLA. Of course, my view can be skewed. This is just me mostly going off of the Japanese myths/legends my grandfather used to tell me 😅

[@XiranJayZhao]

Agreed, didn't like that either!

[@trashgoblin1182]

There is no season two in ba sing sei

[@mitsukitai2713]

@@trashgoblin1182 Only Beginnings Part 1 and 2 ;)

[@15jewjew]

Vaatu and Raava are not based on Christianity. That's a misunderstanding of asian mythology and Christian mythology. Ravva and vaatu has more inspiration to Hinduism and Daoism. Christianity isn't a battle of light and dark it's a battle of temptation and faith.

[@animalia5554]

@@XiranJayZhao I am western and I saw that as a flaw.

[@room873_]

As a Taiwanese fan of yours, I was extremely anxious when you started explaining the history between ROC and PRC. I am forever greatful that you decided to explain everything without bias. Deliver the history in the right way, without taking side. It's really important when it comes to this issue. Thank you. I will not state any personal opinion regarding this matter. Though I will say that it gives me comfort hearing you talk about the history as it was.

[@brandonpersaud5634]

Of course the Taiwanese person would consider recognizing Taiwan as a separate entity as unbiased

[@Healeon]

@@brandonpersaud5634 It’s factually correct though?

[@PhilfreezeCH]

Ain‘t no such thing as a unbiased retelling of history.

[@room873_]

All I said was I appreciate the fact that she tells the *history between PRC and ROC* as how it was. That’s it. I didn’t want to start any discussion regarding the current state of Taiwan the island and mainland China mainly because I find it fairly unnecessary. Especially when she already address it pretty damn straight in the video. If anyone has any questions around the matter, I’d like to answer it as follow: I consider this particular part of “Chinese” history a three-sided history. There’s the side of the current government of mainland China with a point of view from PRC. Another is the ROC version with PRC being the main villain and them being the hero who till this day, still hasn’t gave up. And there’s the quote “unbiased” version. Which is pretty much what she said in the video. The two party fight with each other. One of them fled, one of them stayed. The one who fled claim the little island as their own and so did the one who won the civil war and stayed in mainland. Taiwan(ROC) being a separate entity was never in question, not even PRC has denied that Taiwan is currently running by a different government. Or at least a different party. The issue is whether Taiwan(ROC) should be considered as a separate COUNTRY, not entity. Fun fact, according to the current ROC’s constitution, we are still in the state of civil war with PRC. Not in the real WAR WAR way but you know.

[@1CE.]

Lol I was legit nervous too for a bit when she got to it, not cuz I thought she’d shill for the CCP but that she’d be missing a kidney mysteriously a month from now

[@dinolil1474]

As a mixed-race person, I completely agree with you on Mako and Bolin; Sometimes I think there aren't many stories on mixed-race people and how navigating their identity is a challenge. My grandparents died before I was born and my mum emigrated when she was young, so the imposter-syndrome is real

[@elodie4629]

"the first season should’ve been about how republic city is flooded with earth kingdom refugees who are swimming across the canal to escape the instability of the main land" "considerable violence of benders against non benders and that’s how anti bending sentiment could’ve rise up" someone write a fanfic about THAT please idc how many years it would take i would READ IT

[@williamgonzales4552]

Literally same.

[@ChangedMyNameFinally69]

Tbf the Fire Nation oppressing everyone could've been where Equalism came from, plenty episodes like Zuko Alone and The Painted Lady had Benders bully non-bending citizens

[@hassanalkhalaf1115]

@@ChangedMyNameFinally69 well it was Amons alibi story that a firebender killed his parents and burned his face

[@ChangedMyNameFinally69]

@@hassanalkhalaf1115 Which should've been true.

[@hassanalkhalaf1115]

@@ChangedMyNameFinally69 well I mean he didn't took it from creativity right? It's releatable because it happened to many people

[@dccalling5960]

I always thought Mako and Bolin were perfectly set up for reconciling with colonial histories of the Korra world. And then they did nothing with that.

[@vetarlittorf1807]

Probably because that wasn't the point of those characters.

[@dorje9580]

The point of Mako and Bolin was to extract the liminal spaces between the Earth and Fire kingdoms, I think the last arc did the best job in that regard.

[@Salightress]

Agreed! I also thought they could've been really good characters for exploring poverty and the working class in industrializing areas and how that influences their opportunities in life and drive the choices they make. Maybe even something with the overlap of poverty and marginalized ethnic identities, straddling the line between earth kingdom and fire nation and the tensions baked into that. In season 1 Mako works in that lightening generator, doing what's obviously portrayed to be very hard physical labour. And both of them at some point join either the police force or a military. That could've been such an interesting opportunity to comment on labour exploitation and the limited choices offered the working class, but instead it's like the later seasons forget that these two were ever poor. It's a bit of a shame.

[@vetarlittorf1807]

@@Salightress You have pretty unrealistic expectations for the show. If they had done that political commentary you wanted, there'd be no room for the plot. And the show never forgot that they were poor. In fact, Mako and Bolin's life on the street is a huge factor in their characterization.

[@QuikVidGuy]

@@vetarlittorf1807 first off, there's be plenty of room secondly, they were living with a billionaire for 90% of the show and never really had to worry about anything after the spirit forest spread

[@charlieisntthere7328]

i think someone else already commented this, but corsets weren't actually objects of female oppression; in fact, it was men who tried to cast doubt on corsets because corset-making was a career mostly made up of women

[@khaxjc1]

Yay for corset myth busting! Cause yeah, Corsets themselves weren't oppressive. But there was a definite push for accentuating the bust, waist, hip ratio for the male gaze. We see it in the pushback that came from men when the fashionable silhouette moved away from that and when hoops and similar foundational layers were most popular. So the wearing of corsets wasn't oppressive but it can be argued the glorification of beauty standards was (just like was and in many ways has been since). Those standards just varied. So while the description of waist cinching wasn't accurate the sentiment behind it kind of works.

[@charlieisntthere7328]

@@khaxjc1 oh yes, i think you're right!

[@RadicalDan4]

Wow did not know that. Thanks for the info on it, kinda makes sense in retrospective.

[@VRiderB]

If anyone is interested in the corset mythbusting rabbithole, highly recommend Bernadette Banner and Karolina Żebrowska as a start

[@PVilla27]

@@VRiderB they are both so amazing

[@erenjinchuriki]

Honestly, as an Asian, AtLA was pretty western as well. The backdrop might not have been, but the way characters behaved were VERY western.

[@apollon6870]

of course, it was directed to kids, american kids at first, but atleast the worldbuilding was correct set, in asian style

[@Cecilia-ky3uw]

and I dont really think we should have much of a problem with that if you dont enjoy it dont watch it if you do watch it if the movies great then dont complain it for being too "western"

[@Cecilia-ky3uw]

people are very weird

[@erenjinchuriki]

@@Cecilia-ky3uw geez, who said anything about not enjoying western shows? All I’m saying is that if anyone complains about LoK being too “western” but AtLA is “eastern” enough, that’s a weird complaint since AtLA isn’t much more eastern than LoK. Both shows are fine as is.

[@erenjinchuriki]

@@apollon6870 what are you talking about? LoK’s setting was just as pan-eastern as AtLA, just set in more modern times.

[@Theturtleowl]

I was expecting Korra to touch on the relationship between the fire nation and the other nations within Republic City. It is a heavy subject, but I think the writers could have done it justice.

[@pisces2569]

I remember watching Doug aka the nostalgia critic review legend of Korra and mentioned that he wished the writers showed different parts of the city - like this part is a water tribe section and this is a fire nation section. If the writers did that, it might have led to your wish

[@basementdwellercosplay]

My only criticism for this video is Europe didn't have waist binding. I'm studying historical fashion(and anthropology) and the corset was and is like a form of a bra that also supported a back. Overly tight laces weren't really a thing, but even if you can still breath pretty easy (I tried it just to see and you just need to reteach your brain to breath with you chest and not outwards). When they did it, it was only for an event for a couple hours. Men also wore corsets to events and often were the ones right lacing. Women often wanted to have a bit of fat as it made it seem like you were marriage material and more motherly. They often made the waist look smaller with illusion, like big skirts and puffy sleeves. Corsets were made to spread the weight of heavy fabrics of skirts and give women chest support. I'm not mad that you didn't know this, but I'm just tried of people thinking corsets are terrible garments. You want to point out how terrible some fashion was for European or later American women, you can easily point to radium girls, clothing made with arsenic, or hobble skirts(and as someone pointed out in the comments some heels). The idea that it's a terrible garment was mainly spread by sexiest doctors who blames corsets on their lack on female anatomy. Again I'm not hating on the fact you didn't know, just want to inform you. I wrote a paper on it for one of my classes so I could go on but I'm just giving the short reasoning. Otherwise an amazing video!

[@jenblack98]

The anti-corset movement in the victorian era and early 20th century was less about caring about women's health and more about denying their intelligence. Corsets (and stays before corsets were a thing) were made predominantly by women and the men at the time wanted to discredit the work that women did and so they shamed corsets and by association the women who made them. Good luck with your studies.

[@juliadonati8245]

I was looking for this comment. That was my only complaint too.

[@Alice-gr1kb]

yeah sexist doctors would blame women’s corsets for uterus problems (bc to them women were worthless if they couldn’t have kids) despite them not doing anything

[@elnahya8892]

Thanks for debunking that idea in your comment! I'd like to add that while Europe didn't seem to have feet binding practices, we did have this idea of restraining women's feet: look at Marie Antoinette's shoes, measuring only 21 cm by 5 cm for an adult woman. (Source: This comparison was made in an exhibit ”marche et démarche,une histoire de la chaussure" by french museum Musée des arts décoratifs in which they drew a parallel between her shoes and 19th century chinese's one). It's interesting to think that a lot of different cultures didn't like the idea of women walking and going where they wanted to!

[@sherlocksmuuug6692]

@@jenblack98 Its a bit like heels. For centuries, heels were worn by men to show their status, with the highest of heels reserved for monarchs (look up the famous portrait of Louis XIV, considered the pinnacle of masculinity during his time). Then women started wearing them as a form of emancipation and suddenly heels became uncool with the men, who shamed women for their "supposed sense of impracticality and extravagance" that they displayed by wearing them. Proving once and for all that human societies in truth never evolved beyond a middle-school playground.

[@solarmoth4628]

I actually haven’t heard this criticism before, I loved the 1920’s aesthetic of LoK. I thought it was clear that the Republic City was heavily based on 20’s Hong Kong and Shanghai. I don’t get how people got New York from it. But I agree with your criticism of “western” development being equated with “modern” and how the show missed so many of the points made in the comics

[@jeandehuit5385]

The Comics were only written alongside LoK; the 1st comic (the Promise) came out the same year S1 of Korra aired. The 2nd comic (the Search, which had nothing to do w/ colonialism) was published only a few months b/f S2 aired. And the 3rd comic (the Rift) came out only as S4 of Korra was 'airing' digitally on nicktoons. Animation takes a *long* time, even when you're using Korean animators. Harley Quinn got renewed in Summer of 2020 & the next season won't be out until 2022. The turnaround time on comics is comparatively shorter (since, well, you have to draw a few pages, rather than a single frame for every second of a 24 minute episode of a 13 episode season). As a result, it's likely that by the time Korra was out of the scripting phase & into the animation phase, the comics hadn't even been *written* yet. They may have had *plans* or outlines, but Bryke was never very involved in the comics. About the only comic that the writers of S2-4 of Korra *possibly* had access to was the Promise (& even then I doubt they would have had more than an outline). & the Promise is *worse* than any season of Korra, so I'm *glad* they didn't use material from *that* particular piece of toilet paper.

[@falconeshield]

Most people don't leave their homes much until they travel for vacation only - they only see till their noses

[@minutemansam1214]

Republic City was based on the idea of 'if New York was built by the Chinese set in the roaring 20s'. The city itself takes a lot of influence from New York (Aang's statue is an analogue to the Statue of Liberty, and the Metalbending Police's uniforms are based off a mix of 1920s NYPS uniforms and Samurai armor). They have an equivalent to Central Park, and the Brooklyn Bridge. Even the layout of the city it heavily inspired by New York, with central Manhattan-esque borough and other outer boroughs. Of course Shanghai and Hong Kong were also heavy inspirations, but it was very obviously based on New York City. It's even the primary location of the first movies, just like New York City was once the center of the film industry until Hollywood took over.

[@colmlooney5843]

People assume 1910's-20's New York because big tech, booming city, underground crime gangs, unfront crime gangs.

[@LouisKing995]

The giant Green statue of Ang in the harbour meant to welcome in travellers and refugees didn’t scream New York to you ? The literal style of the buildings? Get aaaaaaaaaaaaout of here man

[@SunnysFilms]

I actually think LOK Book One's conflict makes a lot of sense and is a bigger by-product of the 100 Year War than fans give it credit for. Anti-bending sentiments arose in part BECAUSE of the 100 Year War. Not only was the war caused by benders - just like, as Amon points out, every war in the world's history - but people were powerless to stop it until the world's strongest bender (the avatar) returned. Non-benders make it clear that not only are they tired of benders having a power over them that they cannot have, but they're tired of relying on an avatar. This is aggrevated by the fact that, with the rise of factories and machinery, bending isn't the necessary tool that it used to be, making bending almost completely obsolete. I will definitely agree that Book One could have set all of that up a lot better, but it is still there, it's still woven into the narrative. And Book One would have flowed more smoothly into Book Two if the original ending in which Korra didn't get her bending back had remained intact. In fact, that would have fixed a lot of the massive issues within Book Two. Just my two cents - or yuans.

[@_hunnybe]

"Why are you looking to a western production for a non-western story to begin with?" I think this so often...

[@cormarine9812]

I love how your outfit reflects your topic - it's a more westernized qipao characteristic of the early 1900s. Less extra than before but love it as always lmfao

[@alyssaagnew4147]

I had no idea about that, I just thought she looked gorgeous.

[@DelilahFNightingale]

@@alyssaagnew4147 they use they/them pronouns! :)

[@DelilahFNightingale]

@@hikaru_4351 There's no reason to ask 'why', lol... being referred to with the correct pronouns/being identified as themself does nothing to hurt others and just allows people to live their lives without feeling as if they're being forced into a form they don't fit. Besides, pronouns aren't an orientation lol

[@alyssaagnew4147]

@@DelilahFNightingale Oh right, they look gorgeous.

[@johanabi]

@Lady Seashell Bikini so true! also, gender and sexuality are different :)

[@dadavey6280]

Right off the bat your outfit is stunning!

[@othello_red]

It’s beautiful ✨

[@graven6102]

Their outfits are always so goddamm good.

[@justjess6636]

It's her hair for me! 🥰

[@hakiymyoung2513]

Right omigod she looks so good...

[@USSAnimeNCC-]

That 1920s Chinese outfit why they went away and why aren't they more mainstream

[@johannanicolaisen4676]

What I kinda found disappointing in Korra is how even though we spend a great deal more time in the Water Tribe and with Water Tribe people than ATLA we didn't see a lot of Indigenous influence. Obviously, it's present but in comparison to West Asian, Southeast Asian, etc. the Native American culture seemed a lot more ambiguous.

[@appa609]

The water tribe are not native American influenced they're Inuit influenced.

[@prophetofbara1214]

​@@appa609And where are the Inuit from? North America, so yes, they are Native American/Indigenous

[@KdeeBUBBLES444]

I really wish the Korra seasons were longer, then they might've had the time to explore the political themes more deeply

[@adeptdamage3669]

They shouldn't done that whole villain per season bullshit. That's what really hurt the show.

[@kxc7580]

@@adeptdamage3669 Nickelodeon first asked for 1 season, and then they asked for a second season because the first one did so well and then they asked for a 3rd and 4th season, i thought everyone knew this.

[@idontneedaname318]

Korra's production was very troubled

[@idontneedaname318]

@@adeptdamage3669 Korra didn't rlly have a choice because they weren't able to get more than one season confirmed at a time

[@ksng767]

I'd like to hear more about how colonialism affected people here in Asia, the West keeps thinking that we are backwards and not progressive while not knowing that most Asian countries are in their current state because of the consequences of colonialism. Even things like drugs, why are we so tough against drugs? Because Opium War and coolies. Which led to the state that Hong Kong is in right now. Really colonies and world wars really screwed us over.

[@adrianasevilla8984]

yup yup yuuuup

[@bananahat3350]

Exactly. I’ve heard so many dudes complain that they can’t bring their weed to China because they’ll face the death penalty and it’s like, well the last time they let Westerners bring drugs over, that didn’t really end well.

[@mobeenkhan824]

Colonialism and imperialism really caused the vast majority of problems in the non European world. Islamic terrorism rose because of colonialism.

[@mangalores-x_x]

@@mobeenkhan824 that is in itself a vast over simplifications. In fact colonialism and imperialism heavily depends on finding huge issues in existing societies for a foreign power to exploit. Otherwise you are implying the Europeans were superhumans because you say 10 000 Europeans could conquer vast kingdoms because the natives were idiots. They weren't. The Europeans just stumbled through the door when this or that society was already in domestic turmoil and obviously they did not help.

[@icarue993]

The west: Wacks the world with a stick Also the west: "Why are you bruised and on the ground? The west is the best, we are not bruised!"

[@artgremlin2847]

I would've really like to see at least some character development about Mako and Bolin's mixed identities. I'm mixed, and it's something I tend to think about a lot. that kind of identity crisis doesn't often get represented the right way onscreen, so the stuff about republic city and all these interracial families would've been really cool to explore.

[@boredasf4856]

I feel like since they’re both passing for one race bolin (earth kingdom) mako (fire nation), its easier for them.

[@Thoralmir]

They explored that more in the comics.

[@Otter34]

Yeah! It's something I feel they really fell down by centering things each season around a villain. The problems people can't magic away (prejudice, injustice, social and economic inequality) were something that LoK had a real shot at digging into where Avatar kinda glossed over by being a straightforward adventure series.

[@LionStaringAuraKingdom]

I am a Taiwanese American who've moved back to Taiwan for about 5-6 years ago, and I really, REALLY, enjoy your videos. Your videos helped me through the cultural differences in Taiwan, since I was never able to find liked minded people here that shares the same opinion about these films, heck, most of them never seen it. So during the time when you first uploaded the Mulan video, listening to you explaining all these ideas and cultures that resonated with me really made me happy. Keep up the good work! And I'll look forward to all your videos in the future.

[@xzilerq.5471]

My favorite part of your videos tends to be when the cat tries to help. I relate so hard, as a fellow cat owner/lover. The look you give while waiting for your beloved fuzzy-face to get out of the way is my entire experience as a gamer. It is always an absolute pleasure to watch another of your videos, regardless, and I am honored to count myself among your longtime viewers. As a fellow writer, I am also over the moon in joy for you that you're seizing your dream to become published. Blessings, Xiran.

[@catherinepoteat]

Jokes on you, we definitely still want a scene by scene of Korra

[@kodamaakemi9758]

I think a bonus is that despite having four seasons, each season is like 12 episodes, so the entirety of Korra is shorter than Last Airbender

[@darkstar2874]

Huh, this is a criticism I haven’t actually heard before, but man did I like your response to it.

[@lemonstarofficial]

ok

[@elizaeclipse1396]

I actually heard this criticism in a few "Korra is garbage and this is why" videos

[@markmontes17]

@@elizaeclipse1396 No one cares, you ATLA purists are so toxic

[@emptyxsuit]

Same, that critique came as a surprise to me. For example, as someone who was born and raised in New York, at no point did I get the feeling that Republic City had NY influences. Still an interesting take though

[@allendepacheco3419]

@@emptyxsuit I remember people saying that Aang statue was a mirror to the Statue of Liberty in NYC, but even then Republic City still more reminiscent to Shanghai than any American cities. Plus I don't think large statues near a city is uniquely American.

[@kami0njnegjfkd]

I just can't help but to think about that baby that was born when they were crossing the Serpent's Pass (or whatever they exactly called it.) The fact that they named their daughter Hope after KATARA. It's insane to think that this child, born when their mother was trying to get into the one SINGLE safe place in the *world* and was born on a bridge that was essentially designed to kill you just to get in, would suddenly be okay with the Fire Nation. She was born during wartime with her mother more willing to die by being eaten by a monster, where the most capable people ready to care for her were three 12-year-olds, just to be safe from what she knew the Fire Nation would do to her. Do you really think this woman, who would very likely still be alive, would just brush past it? That she and so many others like her would be okay? It's all just very frustrating that Legend of Korra doesn't touch on how impactful war is. It hasn't even been 2 generations and they completely pretend that everyone is okay with how things were.

[@WaterKirby1994]

Some people are forgiving of old war enemies, if my nation entered into Civil War 2 Years from now, I would try to forgive my enemies after winning the war. To hate a group of people just because of leaders they have no control over seems wrong, which is why I feel no hate towards the Russian People. Keep in mind that Hope was a baby when the war ended, with the new Fire Lord Zuko trying to make reparations & her parents seemed like good people who would raise her to accept people of other nationalities rather than carry on revenge. Hating a country you went to war with 20 years ago & defeated seems like a needless grudge. While I understand that there are people like that, I find them disappointing. Hating based on nationality isn't justified even if you were in a horrible war against their nation. Also your 3 12-year-olds argument fails as I remember the husband was there & you forgot Toph & Suki.

[@rickoshay5525]

Three 12-year olds? The Gaang had only two 12-year olds. And a 14 and a 15 year old. Another 14-15 year old if you count Suki.

[@rickoshay5525]

@@WaterKirby1994 "after winning the war", what if you lose?

[@ahsokatano6727]

"[...]He was actually in exile in America when he was proclaimed president of the republic [...]" Our first president was too! Tomáš (basically czech version of Thomas) Garrigue Masarik, back in times when Czech republic and Slovakia were still one country (Czechoslovakia).

[@Sam_on_YouTube]

"The Nationalists and the Communists went to war with each other." So what you're saying is, it was the 1st half of the 20th century somewhere on Earth.

[@WolfLykaios]

This comment is underrated.

[@PhilfreezeCH]

And we will fucking do it again!

[@UberOtaku001]

The 20th century was insane and we still haven't fully processed it.

[@shaneross739]

Also the anarchist's assassination of political figures.

[@spacetacos7574]

Well South America,east europe and Asia

[@ratdisease5280]

the thing is they sort of did try to do a mixed heritage story with aangs kids (as opposed to mako and bolin) but it was really shallow and poorly represented like bumi didnt really feel connected to his air nation heritage because he wasnt an airbender and he felt like his dad favored his brother over him for that, but instead of writing any meaningful commentary they resolved it by... giving him airbending powers and saying "oh well now youre ACTUALLY part of the air nation :)))" like what the fuck were they thinking there thats such an awful message

[@Agumame]

That whole mess ties into how they just utterly botch addressing the Air Nomad genocide correctly. I get why as KIDS they would be jealous and think Aang liked Tenzin better. But its insane that as grown adults they cant fathom why Aang would spend more time with Tenzin, making sure both 1) the air nomad culture didnt die and 2) making sure Tenzin will be equipped to train an entire new generation of airbenders including the next Avatar. Then theres the whole issue how instead of addressing the massive scar the Air Nomad genocide left on the world as how Aang and now Tenzin and his children are tasked with trying to preserve an entire culture and way of life that was wiped out, they just have people gain airbending at random cause spirit gates are open even though thats not even how they established humans gaining bending either in Avatar OR Korra.

[@paulgotik]

it's just bad writing. It's not that deep. If you don't like it that's fine, you can try to watch better shows. But you don't need to make a hole political commentary about the after effects of one thing in the show.

[@ratdisease5280]

@@paulgotik this video is literally about the writing and world building in this show what the hell are you talking about.... i only brought it up because she specifically addressed how the show handles characters with mixed heritage

[@NS-et5wh]

@@paulgotik If you don't like criticism and political commentary of shows, then find another video and comment section. This whole video is about that, so the comment section will inevitably also reflect that. If you don't like political commentary of shows you don't have to click on a video about that.

[@ayoogunsakin9223]

It's like I've found my people in this comment sections. The harmonic convergence was such a big mistake. I don't know why they didn't just let Airbenders repopulate normally? Then they tried to be deep too with "the world senses imbalance so it corrects stuff like an entire nation being almost completely wiped out by giving random people bedding abilities"?? LoK exists in an alternate reality for me.

[@ironq.3667]

honestly LOK had its flaws but I still absolutely adore Korra. I've rewatched it several times just to appreciate the art and nostalgia. i learn so much more and have more appreciation for the things you talk about. love your videos!!

[@kanalkucker14]

yes, I also love Korra while I feel its flaws, but I can live with them and will rewatch it in the future!

[@TheNicksSkitsShow]

I really appreciate this channel I feel like I’ve never really had a resource to learn more about chinese culture without it being dry history and making videos about shows and movies I’ve seen makes it feel really accessible! thank you☺️ can’t wait for more

[@TheOtakuNinja69]

How about how accurate is the Chinese history, culture and language learning for the cartoons of “Sagwa: The Chinese Siamese Cat”, “Ni Hao, Kai-Lan”, “Jackie Chan Adventures” and maybe “Xiaolin Showdown”?

[@cries_and_dies]

Yes please!!! That was my only cultural representation growing up!

[@CrystalArtest]

I have the book it was based on. I think it was written and illustrated by a Chinese American woman

[@TheOtakuNinja69]

@@cries_and_dies Mine too, along with “Ni Hao, Kai-Lan”.

[@TheOtakuNinja69]

@@CrystalArtest I figured that, but I’m trying to see if the cartoon is any different from the book.

[@PixelaGames2000]

I watched that show when I was a toddler but I don’t remember it but according to my sister I was super into it

[@danachos]

"I...I..just like my pretty clothes" What a mood 😂 A lot of pagan or pre-Christian movements are also marred by supremacist groups, and it makes it tough to reclaim beautiful elements of one's culture with them sucking up the limelight and harming folks :'(

[@Pandora234able]

Really? I didn’t know...tbh. I didn’t think white supremacist’s co-opted anything but Christianity...

[@devforfun5618]

@@Pandora234able in america yes. because their story started with christianism, but if you go back to europe there are many other religions, like for example viking gods, that supremacists can use on their "the old times were better" rethoric but also in america some other aspects can be utilised like old west imaginary of freedom and making justice with your own hands, just ignore the slavery, indigenous genocide and chinese immigrants being treated as lesser humans ( and when i wrote the paragraph i realised it didn't changed much )

[@wheresmyeyebrow1608]

@@Pandora234able Bruh like half of all Pagan-larpers are White supremacists trying to find the 'Pure White Man's religion free of outside (non-European i.e Abrahamic or anything else) influence

[@MtnNerd]

@@wheresmyeyebrow1608 Yeah it's got to the point where you have to be careful about talking about Viking influences because it can be a dog whistle

[@teamesh]

@@Pandora234able yeah, a lot of nordic, pagan, norse mythology gets appropriated into white supremacy. a lot of historical revisionism, and cherry picking to fit their "Aryan" narrative. symbols like the "nordic eagles, mjolnir, various runes" are used by them. There are still non-racists using them though too, but it's just something to be aware of they like to steal from it. like a "black sun" symbol is a red flag

[@alorachan]

I love your videos

[@ABewitchedTeaParty]

I appreciate this video so much as an anthropology students. This type of content is fascinating to watch as "authenticity" is a complicated term. Every culture is influenced by good and bad forces (Depending on your perspective.). A good chunk of the time, countries do make the influences their own to adapt to the changing times. Thank you for making this video.

[@clydeericksoncapati7566]

Off topic, the Japanese invasion was really something. Even though it's the shortest colonial period for us, Filipinos, yet it is considered to be the worst and most gruesome.

[@kittykittybangbang9367]

And the sad part is that here in the West, we never seem to talk about Japan's war crimes. We only thing to talk about Germany's war crimes.

[@mophead_xu]

same here in indonesia. the dutch colonised us on and off for about 3 centuries, meanwhile the japanese only did it for the duration of WW2 (more or less). but it's been speculated that the death toll during the japanese occupation could rival all the deaths caused by the dutch. probably a huge contributor was because the japanese specifically trained indonesian boys to fight for their side in WW2. then there was of course the infamous romusha.

[@bananahat3350]

@@kittykittybangbang9367 I was really lucky that, despite being an American public school, my school made a huge effort to highlight the atrocities committed by Japan. We read first hand documents and journals, as well as watched documentaries about the comfort women and Japan’s war crimes. In fact, I think we spent a comparable amount of time on that compared to the European front. Hopefully more schools will continue to educate their students like this.

[@forwhy8723]

@@kittykittybangbang9367 the west doesn't even educate its people on western war crimes let alone Japanese ones

[@booklet4003]

@@forwhy8723 very true, the United States doesn’t teach native, African, or colonialism history because they want to hide all the genocide and other stuff do they can pretend that they’re still the “good guys”

[@zachtemoro2116]

Idiots: I hate Korra because it was too western!” Me: Wait, so you didn’t not like the show because of plotholes, weird story directions, and unresolved story threads?

[@WolfLykaios]

This is so me

[@shadmanhasan4205]

I agree for both... but mostly the latter since the BEHAVIOR OF THE YOUTH was actually similar to OUR GENERATION rather than our GRANDPARENTS AND GREAT GRANDPARENT'S GENERATION

[@cestalia]

Lmao, i feel you. I dislike the show because their storyline. I didn't even give a shit whether it's Western or not.

[@pokemasterx4244]

Lol go watch an Asian show if you hate the west.

[@pokemasterx4244]

Also people who think avatar had no western influence to begin with are dumb. Why do the 'asian' fire nation have tanks and zeppelins?

[@Lohengrin1850]

Thank you for the amazing video! My jaw dropped at the end bc I literally just received the "These Violent Delights" audiobook in my library holds the day you posted this! Haven't read it yet but very excited to.

[@ZYaruru]

I could listen to you for hours. You have such a simple and nice way to make people understand things that they might not fully grasp or are not aware of. As weird as it sounds, you help me become more knowledgeable and help me see further than what I am used to. For that, I will forever be grateful! Thank you!

[@Salightress]

Huh, I didn't realize that this was a common criticism of Korra, but this was actually something that had bothered me for a while. I thought the show glossed over the colonial impact of the Fire Nation on especially Republic City, and it felt weird that there were some (to me) very obvious European influences. I thought Republic City was inspired by 1920's New York, especially with the joke about cops and donuts. But I have never actually been to either the United States or East Asia, so that was an assumption made on the basis of stereotypes. Shows what I know. I agree that Korra doesn't handle the impacts of colonization and imperialism very well. It feels a bit like the show didn't want to acknowledge the years that passed between the two shows, and how avatar the last airbender would influence and shape the world after the war. A lot of what they do actually do get into feels like an afterthought.

[@vetarlittorf1807]

"I agree that Korra doesn't handle the impacts of colonization and imperialism very well" Probably because it wasn't relevant to the plot or characters. Republic City wasn't even built until AFTER the war.

[@jbark678]

@@vetarlittorf1807 It's extremely relevant to the plot and characters. It just isn't explored or utilized very much.

[@vetarlittorf1807]

@@jbark678 And how exactly is it relevant?

[@markmontes17]

Isn't that a aproblem for Aang's generation to fix? Its been 70 years, it's not like anyone young hates Germany and Japan

[@devforfun5618]

one season of the show should have been just telling what aang did in the mean time, because they changed the world too much and gave little context to how, instead they go to the stone age to explain bending

[@colinakersakers44]

Honestly the way the fire nation is kind of just let off the hook reminds me of how Japan was kind of just let off after all the stuff they did during the war (for example Nan King).

[@booketoiles1600]

yeah but that was and is still controversial, and only happened because the US needed a strong ally against USSR and commie China.

[@Kaimax61]

honestly, it's jsut a lose-lose situation at the end of the war, and what are you gonna do to them? they're still the only country that got nuked in history...TWICE. and Ironically, WW2 started because Germany was HEAVILY Punished for losing WW 1.

[@citizenoftheworld2694]

Because nuking a civilian population twice killing hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians is “being let off the hook”

[@luisdaniel9542]

@@citizenoftheworld2694 when that nation goes and denies their attrocities on their own education system and act as if they didn't do jack, yeah, is kinda being let off the hook

[@citizenoftheworld2694]

@@luisdaniel9542 I’m not denying that japan did horrible things to the people of mainland asia. Their brutality rivaled that of European colonizers. But I don’t think killing 200,000 people is being let off the hook.

[@PopChanx]

I'm so happy to see you getting sponsors!! You're an amazing content creator & you deserve so much more attention. I adore your videos, thank you so much for uploading. Much love to you ❤️

[@danirodriguez3682]

Dang that sponsorship though! That was such a smooth transition :) Glad your getting sponsored!

[@MAFDTTSdeda]

As a costume designer, who revisits often the subjects of Post-Colonialism and cultural identity politics in her work, I love this think-piece so much. It is such a reflected presentation of how culture evolves and constantly changes.

[@yermatedave4930]

Do you have a visible portfolio online? I would be fascinated to see how traditional Asian fashion might've evolved without colonization.

[@MAFDTTSdeda]

@@yermatedave4930 So I never really designed "Asian fashion without colonization". But would be a great project for someday. I approach costume design more in a philosophical way. If you are interested in Asian dress, I think the Buthan national dress is quite free from colonial aesthetic, with the only exception of the introduction of synthetic fibers (such as Nylon and anything with 'Poly' in the name). But if you are interested in my work anyway - I am on Insta @cosiamdeda. Unfortunately, it's gone cold since the start of Covid (figures why) and my descision to concentrate on my Master's Degree. The projects I did during Covid are still under wrap and I am not allowed to post stuff yet. But two Fun Facts on how the cultural exchange goes both ways: The kaftan of the Middle East and other Asian culture is the possible beginning point of the modern three-piece suit. It was brought from the last crusades to Europe and was westernized to the buff coat and evolved over centuries to the classic men's suit. And here an example during the time of colonization: The Paisley (like the pattern) is actually derived from the Boteh Jegeh imagery from, again, the Middle East to across India. During the colonization of India, traditional fabrics were shipped to England and reproduced and westernized to first the "indienne" fashion and later to something ingrained in English culture (Paisley is a town in Scotland, where these fabrics were made).

[@yermatedave4930]

@@MAFDTTSdeda Wow, thank you so much for the response and the sources- I will check out your insta and I'm off to do some reading!

[@kennyb1588]

I hate that people only see the western influences as being “white” when they literally took Jazz music which was created by African-Americans and played it on East Asian instruments (not saying that’s a bad thing I actually thought it was very creative) like western doesn’t equal white in every occasion and a lot of people refuse to acknowledge that Bipoc contribute to western culture. Also the existence of Native Americans in avatar is literally western! Edit: if you’re going to go into this comment thread with the intention of being racist or arguing a point no one is trying to make some of your pals already beat you too it so just keep it moving and argue with the wall if it helps you.

[@TheRealRightPrice]

Very true.

[@ayannabranchcomb7535]

Yeah, its really quite annoying but I’ve come to understand that since white americans took what we created, marketed it so that it appealed to other white people, and then mass produced/sold it to the east, and after WWII america became the driving force of “western culture”, western will always be seen as white

[@ayoogunsakin9223]

Western really just means western....that includes every poc that has influenced western culture...what people equate "white" to western?

[@kennyb1588]

@@ayoogunsakin9223 have you not read the comments of people complaining about there being no equivalent for white people but elements of western culture in the show. It’s so obvious that people view western as only being white. Even though the show takes influence from Native Americans and African-Americans who are also western but no once is complaining about their influence being too western. It’s just a simple fact that people only see white people as westerns.

[@ayoogunsakin9223]

@@kennyb1588 I haven't seen those comments. I've heard people talk about western political and philosophical themes, associate new York to republic city and complain about some of the cast looking white, but not about how lok was too white...

[@GloriousBirds]

Yo congrats on the sponsorship!! Also I adore this type of video, taking a small topic and talking as much as you want about it. It seems like less work for you, too and honestly I'm always all for youtube creators having less work (especially creators that already have another job like you!). Thanks for another interesting video!!

[@globin3477]

To be fair, the reason the first season of Korra is so disconnected from the other three is because the writers initially believed there would only be one season.

[@phoenixshadow6633]

The other criticism I can't stand is the "technology advanced too much." Uh, 70 years ago, our most advanced commercial computer was the UNIVAC I.

[@jerseyfrill]

A small defence of this augment, I’d have preferred are more in between environment for the tech in Korra. Like cars exist but really only rich people use them or that they are being used side by side with carts. Electricity is a thing but older buildings or homes often don’t have it. My beef is less that tech has advanced than tech is common place if that makes sense? Like even with ur example of computers - those have existed since like the 70s but were not a common item in offices until the mid to late 90s and were not consistently found in homes until the 2000s.

[@axelsaupe2751]

I am going to try and explain why I personally feel Technology advanced to quickly in Korra. At the end of Avatar we currently have basically late 18th century Technology. Korra seems to jump to early 20th century without outside influences just throws me off. Being an Engineer and loving the history of Technology just makes me think wait who figured this out. Being no indication of all the ground work required to have cars, planes and an advanced power grid. Now I am not saying that you can't like the show because it isn't 100% historical accurate. It just personally something that ruins the world building for me. I wish there was more time between Korra and Avatar to provide a better understanding on how we got to this point not just Technology but socially as well. Also computer are a bad example of technological improvement. Yes computers have advanced a lot since there inspiration. There is a cool idea about this called Moore's Law. That basically says every 18 months we will double the computing power of computers. This is insane progress and shows that computers are a completely different beast than say a car or what a generator or transformer are.

[@phoenixshadow6633]

@@axelsaupe2751 Late 18th Century for everyone but the Fire Nation who, thanks to a combination of coal, firebending, exploitation of Earth Kingdom colonies, and proper innovation, were able to be well into the Industrial Revolution with things like tanks, war balloons, and refrigeration technology used to restrain firebenders. These things being adapted for civilian use is quite an easy jump.

[@axelsaupe2751]

@@phoenixshadow6633 I was also going of the fire nation as well and assumed that they were probably just earlier in the industrial revolution then you. I don't think we are going to agree when in the industrial revolution the Fire Nation where, but that gives us a time between 1760 and 1840 but that really isn't the point. Thinking more on my problem it that a lot of these inventions just seem to apear. It similar to Xiran problem with the show in general. These technologies just feel like the are inevitable without any the social or scientific ideas behind them. When did the change from private owned family business to companies happen? Why are cars and electricity so widely available? How did such specialized bending techniques like metal bending become teachable? In Avatar we never have the societies who are pushing forward for technology sake like we did in Europe with the enlightenment period. Now I am not say you need an enlightenment period for technical advancement we just don't seem to have a lot of people working on the sciences or inventions happening outside of military use in the Fire Nation or by Team Avatar.

[@TheLithp]

@@axelsaupe2751 Luckily computers aren't the only example. The time period between Aang & Korra is the same as between the rigid airship & the moon landing.

[@coleberry9827]

The fact that you ended the video with, "see you next time," makes me very happy. I hope making KZbin videos about Chinese culture and pop culture (or whatever else you may have planned) pairs well with your writing career.

[@sabikikasuko6636]

Jesus christ, this video goes HARD. Man, I *LOVE* your rapid fire take on opinion vlogs, I loved every second of it, how certain and confident you sounded and how every single piece fell back into place after 15 minutes of nonstop Chinese history review. I LOVED this and this video alone bought yourself a sub. I know it doesn't mean a lot to someone getting a quarter of a million subs before the 10 videos mark but BOY, this left such an impression on me. Amazingly commented.

[@ThrillbertMusic]

I liked the critical assessments and arguments displayed in the video. Some very thoughtful thinking went into this video essay and I respect the amount of effort that went into producing it. I really appreciated the dissemination of the convoluted ideas within the series and how the writers wrote themselves into a corner, refreshing. Offering alternatives shows really great creative engagement with the medium as well, and it's impressive the amount of knowledge you're able to combine to suggest improvements but also weaknesses to your arguments. Anyway, tldr I found your thoroughness inspiring and when I get some more moolah I'll probably drop it on your book 🙃

[@GreMnMlin]

Maybe this is just me, but I thought the Equalists actually made a lot of sense in the Avatar world. We're shown in ATLA that there is discrimination against non-benders even amongst the core cast. It's played for laughs, but the Gaang jokes about Sokka being useless for not being a bender several times in the show. Not to mention that a belief in one type of bending's superiority caused a global war that lasted a century and killed millions. Then there's the Avatar themselves. What does balance even mean? A return to the old status quo? One where peasants slave away while the upper class lives richly? Where your only hope for advancement may be your ability to bend? I honestly think it's no surprise a anti-bending anti-avatar movement would crop up. That said they handled it horribly

[@BonaparteBardithion]

I think it was also a missed opportunity to really explore the role bending had in their industrial revolution. On the one hand, steam tech made it so that they were no longer reliant on earthbending for terrestrial mass transit. On the other hand, it's implied that welding is predominantly a firebender's profession. Mako might be a broke guy working in a factory in the first season, but he still has more access to jobs than a non-bender. The factory owner doesn't have to pay for as much equipment, so he has more incentive to hire benders and the benders have grounds to demand higher wages. Similarly, most of the law enforcement seen is made up of benders - and that goes all the way back to the armies in AtLA. But, sure. Let's make the villian talk about the glorification of bending sports and gang warfare instead.

[@coldfrost3]

I feel like the equalists would make more sense if the world didn't just leave the 100 years war cause despite bending being a big power booster non benders are never treated as incompetent or useless. On 2 of most dangerous people in the last Airbender were non benders and they helped take down a entire city. And while fire benders did almost take over the world I'd file their pride in fire bending as a aspect of their country fervent nationalism that they were spreading to the world. And a return to the status que for the last Airbender meant stopping the war that was stopping people from living in peace. If you actually look back at avatar bending doesn't become a source of money til Korra and even then it barely pays cause Mako and Bolin still live in poverty and have to rely on Asami and Korra before things can improve. Most rich people in avatar are merchants and nobles neither of which require bending just connections.

[@GreMnMlin]

@@BonaparteBardithion that's the exact thing that came to mind for me too. Technology that relies on bending is seemingly way easier to develop and that is naturally going to privilege benders over non-benders. It would also make Equalism's similarity to irl Socialism way more logical and apparent as nonbenders would make up a disproportionate percentage of the working poor, and as such it would probably have a anti-capitalist bent

[@GreMnMlin]

@@coldfrost3 except non-benders kind of are treated as useless. Toph literally counts Sokka as a half of a person when they're facing off against Azula. Also Mai and Ty Lee are exceptions who prove the rule. It took training from childhood payed for by the most powerful country in the world for them to reach that level. While this demonstrates that non-benders clearly aren't useless that doesn't mean the people who live in the ATLA world don't think that way. Fuck there's a whole arc about how Sokka needs to learn sword fighting because he feels useless for not being a bender. And call me crazy, but Sokka seems way more emblematic of the average non-bender's experience than Mai or Ty Lee. Also while it's true the world was at peace before the Hundred Year War that doesn't mean things were good. The Earth Kingdom was a mess of a country which had been fighting almost constant civil wars, the Fire Nation is an autocracy, and the Northern Water Tribe is a deeply misogynistic monarchy. Now let's stack a return to that on top of the results of a century of brutal warfare, and what we get is a situation ripe for social upheaval.

[@coldfrost3]

​@@GreMnMlin Feeling useless and being useless are not the same thing sokka can fight but hes not the person who's gonna take down Azula in a fight, in fact until the Final episode no one can beat Azula in a fight. Toph made a disparaging joke about Sokkas battle utility because Sokka is not the ganngs best front line fighter hes their best tactician and planer. I doubt Mai and Ty Lee are examples of Fire nation super soldiers because despite knowing Azula they were never meant to be fighters. Mai's parents wanted her to be a quiet kid and if knife throwing meant she didn't cause trouble they let her have that distraction. Ty Lee was born to a group of Septuplets and eventually ran away to find individuality I consider it much more likely for her to learn Chi blocking while on the Road or in the Circus than as a example of Fire nation training. Like we travel across the world with the gang and were shown non-benders as members of all the army and get shown good weapons fighters like with Jet, and Sokka feeling useless when he's on a team with some of the most talented people in the world is normal Aang is the avatar the literal embodiment of god in there setting and the most powerful member of the team from episode one, and Toph is the Strongest bender in the world despite being blind and has the honor of the first person in the world to figure out how to bend metal which everyone thought was impossible before that moment. And feeling useless in comparison is normal when Katara found out and could bend water she got jealous cause he could do it better than her than went away when she was able to find the water scroll and get more comfortable in her abilities. I'm of the belief that multiple things can be bad at the same time and the world before fire nation Colonization wasn't perfect, but the state when colonization is happening during the Fire Nation war is worse. The elemental nations have issues but they aren't the type of issue's that would lead to a Equalist movement. The clean up from the War is obviously gonna be messy but Korra skipped over that and gave us antagonists who where dishonest about their beliefs the first 2 times, had a middle school understanding of their ideology the 3rd time, and Nationalism but unironic the 4th time.

[@olinaw5145]

As a Chinese person, I remembered watching Korra in primary school and absolutely hating it, leaving the show with a sense of shame rather than fulfillment like I did with ATLA. Now, my feeling is a bit more neutral and I think your explanation sums up why I felt so disappointed at that time. Westernization is not an inevitable process but something causal directed relating to the cultural background. The political representation in the show clearly shows that the writers approach it with a singular western perspective. Don't get me wrong, I don't think Korra is a bad show. But it did not live up to the predecessor to me. That's because instead of focusing fully on their (the writers') strength, which is the characters' dev that is "universal", they choose to focus on something that they have less understanding of, which are political issues and commentaries.

[@RooftopRose079]

I always believed LOK had what I'm beginning to recognize as the Popular-Name curse. Everyone always believed Lucas was this mad genius when it came to Star Wars and that he had all these brilliant ideas that built up the universe into what it began as. The reality is that there were a lot of other people including other writers, production staff and artists weighing in on his decisions for the first three movies. However, because his name got to be so be so large, the audience started believing that he was capable of such feats without introspection or review from others. A similar thing happened with Batman. Bob Kane is the one often credited with Batman's creation when, in reality, it was a joint creation with Bill Finger. In fact, the Batcave, the Batsignal, Robin, Batman's iconic cape and cowl costume and the Batmobile were all Bill Finger's additions to the story, yet it's always Bob Kane who got the credit for them. It's rare that Bill Finger is ever even mentioned concerning the character's creation. I think LOK fell into the same trap. The creators had made something good, ATLA, but started believing in their own hype and fell away from whatever processes had worked before.

[@pokemasterx4244]

Bro. Why are you watching western shows to see Asian stuff in general. Sounds kinda dumb.

[@olinaw5145]

@@pokemasterx4244 Bro. Go figure ;)

[@lainiwakura1776]

I think Korra didn't live up the AtLA because Bryke are better idea guys. If they had someone who was good at story development, it could have been good. Aaron Ehasz is the reason we didn't have a stupid Katara, Aang, Toph love triangle and why Toph is a girl in the first place, he's good at taken ideas and giving them a road to walk on. I would think motorized vehicles and technology would develop regardless of intervention and different cultures are more advanced than others at different points in history anyway.

[@olinaw5145]

@@lainiwakura1776 You raised a really good point :D! I do think Technology would develop either way but the way they design modern technology would have a bit of difference.

[@evelynavila5492]

I know you are probably not going to read this, but I love your channel. I love to learn about your culture, but it is so extensive that I don’t know where to start. So comparing it and analyzing it through western productions that try to portray Chinese culture and traditions is really an interesting and educative start point . Thank you so much please keep doing these videos. Love from Chile 🇨🇱

[@Kattaccino]

Every single time I see one of your videos pop up, I get absolutely giddy. I learn so much and you have such an amazing presentation style. Thank you for doing what you do!

[@inkblotCrisis]

"Theoretically" Love that.

[@lemonstarofficial]

ok

[@sherlocksmuuug6692]

For saying this, the ghost of Chiang Kai-shek will now haunt your living room as its self-declared democratically elected leader. No, you can't remove him, he has declared that your living room is now under martial law and will remain there forever. And as a consequence, Mao's ghost has now taken up residence in your fridge and the two are now fighting for control of the kitchen.

[@cedartheyeah.justyeah.3967]

@@sherlocksmuuug6692 I love this comment

[@isray89]

I teach anthropology and have students do a "create a culture" assignment. Guess which video is now included in the assignment description! (Seriously - Xiran has some of the best content out there!)

[@iiiiitsmagreta1240]

That is the coolest assignment ever! I want to be in your class XD

[@magikallynx68]

I agree with them, I think there should've been at least some acknowledgement about Bolin and Makos mixed heritage. Also, I didn't really like how Aang and Katara kids didn't seem to be biracial or embrace both of their heritages. As a biracial person myself, It was really weird to see Tenzin only embrace his Air Nomad culture and Kya with her Water Tribe culture. It just sort of felt like a slap on the face, I doubt it was their intentions but it made me feel like they could only choose one and weren't allowed the other by the writers :/ we love to see it with Bumi tho 👌 although maybe I forgot but I don't remember if he embraces either of his cultures he just does his own thing which is cool too

[@Sableknight]

"To my long time viewers" Damn I remember you being like "here's my first video I want to talk about how bad Mulan is". It's been less than a year and look at all the cool stuff you've made here!

[@dariapack8906]

Long response. TL;DR: You are right. I'm a history student who has done the research (at least when it comes to western biases) that backs you up. There's a few things that as a historian, I find westerners fall into when examining history. First is the bias that people of the past knew that things would turn out the way they are now. So your point that the creators simply assumed that western ideas about what progress or modernization looks like is exactly spot on. Because the idea that our modern ideas, politics, and technology is inevitable- this can make world building based off real world inspiration feel shallow or one dimensional, as writers can "skip ahead" so to speak because they believe their audience shares this same expectation. A second point I'd like to make is a concept known as Orientalism, that was coined by Edward Said. It's the western compound of ideas that 1) Western culture is the positive opposite to Eastern cultures. 2) Western civilization is filled with nuance and change over time, while countries in the East are stagnant and stereotypical. 3) Western influence in the east is necessary because Eastern cultures are inferior. Western people have been fed this bias over the years through media and propaganda. So for westerners, when we see a world inspired by anything from Asia, the Middle East, Africa or Pacific Islands we automatically assume people there are still living in a world the same as it was hundreds of years ago. Or worse, absolutely mythical. So yes, you are absolutely right that Legend of Korra is western. It was written by people with a bias, one that not many people even realize.

[@mastermarkus5307]

I thought that part of Orientalism associated the "historical, mystical" sense of East Asian countries as positive, at least sometimes, though I'm guessing that this I'm thinking of is a more modern sort of Orientalism? Like the sort of thing that spawned the New Age movement where a lot of Asian medical practices and spiritual beliefs were given credence essentially because they're not "Western".

[@SharonVeeLee]

It was written by westerners, Americans. Do people not know this?

[@olinaw5145]

This is very informative! Thank you.

[@olinaw5145]

@@SharonVeeLee People do know this. When I watched LoK as well as ATLA, I don't expect everything to be fully authentic, because after all its a fantasy series of fictional land and characters created by writers from another cultural background. If ATLA did not exist, I would personally not take issues with the western elements in LoK, because nothing needs to be justified. We are introduced to this new world that we have no prior information on so it would pointless to complain about a fictional setting. However, we do have information of the cultural and social background prior to LoK. In ATLA, the writers established a world with 99% asian and indigenous heavily inspired cultures. In the real world, the changes and "evolution" of asian culture were highly influenced by the introduction of western ideas through interactions with western countries -- western countries that did not exists in the previously established Avatar world. So it is safe to conclude that the modernization and evolution of asian culture in the ATLA LoK universe will be drastically different than that of the real world. However, in LoK the culture changes and evolves just like that of the real world, which contradicts our logical inference. This demonstrates the underlying idea that westernization is an inevitable route for asian and indigenous society and culture, which is an example of western bias that can offend people from the represented culture. Hopefully I my point make sense but free to correct time if I'm wrong. :)

[@dariapack8906]

@@mastermarkus5307 I will admit I'm not an expert when it comes to how Western culture interacts with East Asia, though I am reading more books about Chinese history. Most of my studies have been centered around the Middle East- specifically the Ottoman Empire and post 19th century Turkey, Egypt, and Iran. I want to discuss your point about the "historical, mystical" as a good thing. On one hand, seeing the positive aspects of another culture's folklore, medical practices, religious ideology and social rules is not inherently negative. Being open to learn from another culture, and valuing their contributions to the human story is always a good thing. That being said, it's the concept that if you were to step foot in modern day China expecting everything to look like the cartoon movie Mulan, or going to modern day Turkey expecting the world of Alladin, is when the historical and mythical lense is problematic. If you picture a country east of Europe based solely off the historical or mystical stories you've read or watched that's Orientalism. It's not bad to enjoy the story or the setting. It's the equation of "this is an accurate representation of what this place/culture is like" that we are not always conscious of. I want to note that I am not saying you view the world this way, but merely pointing out a common perception of cultures not our own. If you would like to learn more about Orientalism, you can read Edward Said's book by the same name, or watch his documentary. Lindsay Ellis also did a great job explaining Orientalism through western media in her video "The Most White Washed Character in History."

[@Sophie-of2up]

Gosh you just put to words everything that was only a vague dissatisfaction in my mind! I lived the show too but there were definitely issues. I always thought it was a bit jarring that there were western aesthetics (the swimsuits especially bothered me) when there was no "west". It does kind if imply that western fashion goes hand in hand with the efficiency of the industrial era, and it didn't make a lot of sense culturally. Like with the swimsuits, why would they be wearing these modest garments that are rooted in victorian morality when they were wearing bikinis in the airbender series?

[@origamipein18]

I don't know. '20s fashion? 🤷🏿‍♀️

[@pendragon_cave1405]

That's a good point. I think the argument could be made that ATLA costuming was based on more traditional Asian inspired clothing, perhaps the bikinis were a nod towards some of the Asian island cultures? As for the modest swimsuits of Korra, perhaps the merging of cultures that happened after the War ended created a backlash against certain fashion/cultural wear items? Looking at western history (what i know best at this point), fashion has fluxed between what is acceptable vs unacceptable in some very drastic ways as culture has shifted. I doubt the creators of Korra really thought it through to that extent, though. 🤷🏼😁

[@origamipein18]

@@pendragon_cave1405 True.

[@silvereyes242]

Everybody acts as if the Western influences in Korra came out of nowhere, it didn’t, it started in ATLA. The technology of this universe has always been western oriented, as Avatar had; blimps, zepplins, jet ski’s, steam boats, tractors, gondola’s, tanks and submarines. None of those are eastern concepts. All the Legend of Korra did was expand on that concept.

[@olinaw5145]

Same. This is the first video that vocalised my dissatisfaction.

[@Yearofthetiger25]

I loved that you reference the Disguiser in here, the cast for that show are all so good and I've enjoyed watching it so far. Also just in general learning more about the Republic era was interesting. For my bachelor's I'm learning about the political and cultural sides of the Kangxi era of the Qing dynasty which has also interested me so far.

[@-cMc-]

This is the healthiest discussion ever. It fills my heart and answers all the questions I've ever had in my head. This is so satisfying.

[@AHealthyDoseofFran]

As a Korra lover I absolutely love hearing your perspective on it, especially in regards to the aesthetics of the show. I definitely do wish Korra had discussed the war more like you said - I think if they'd had a bit more of a chance to plan the series they may have? But who knows - it definitely would have been an interesting take on how Republic City is seen by the world

[@astrobookwormsinger]

I'm glad to find a Korra lover here, I've seen quite a few people pretty much just bashing it

[@arcturionblade1077]

@@astrobookwormsinger I love Legend of Korra but I won't pretend that it's a perfect show either. I love how it tried to tackle much more mature themes and political complexities but they kinda handwaved away the solutions with each big bad villain vanquished at the end of every season. That and the teen angst and love triangles were kinda eyeroll-y but young adults have to make their own mistakes and all that.

[@vetarlittorf1807]

@@arcturionblade1077 You're missing the point, just because the villains were politically motivated doesn't mean it's Korra's job to solve their problems, but to learn from them in order to find a common ground and becoming a better Avatar in the process. That's how the series tackled the villains. Through Hegelian dialectics.

[@ipaunski]

Another Korra fan here. Korra was definitely a great show and I'm glad it dealt with more mature themes like mental health and equality, but unfortunately it didn't handle everything perfectly. And that's fine with me, though I hope they deal with some of these criticisms in the comics

[@j0hncarp]

> sees an asian city that is industrialized, modern, people looking sharp and seems to have a stable working economy > "they made it too western :/"

[@Cecilia-ky3uw]

well western usually = modern ie japan is quote unquote "western" same with sk hong kong and singapore I think the reason is because everything we use today is either invented by people in the west or contributed so heavyly by the west

[@ChangedMyNameFinally69]

I think they meant the aesthetic. People wanted it to feel more Asian

[@ChangedMyNameFinally69]

@ Beforehand most other countries were more advanced than Europe, Europe only got so powerful from colonialism

[@j0hncarp]

@ and paper was invented in the east, in china. But i dont say its too eastern or chinese when i go to the library.

[@KRYMauL]

@@ChangedMyNameFinally69 So, they want it to look like San Francisco Chinatown? They do know that Chinatown was deliberately made to look that way, right?

[@sputnikmann6541]

So, if I understand this correctly, it's less "The style is too western" and more "why would it look like this without the western influence IRL China had?" Am I getting that right? Because if so, that is an interesting discussion.

[@melodyborg6164]

I loved this video, your take is very nuanced and insightful. And I love that you brought up that comic, too! When your started talking about the subject of reparations I really hoped that you would bring it up and then you did. I love Korra a lot but I also have serious issues, especially with how it resolves its political storylines. The politics in the original series were a lot less complicated so I think there was a little less room for missteps. Anyway, thanks as always for your insight and I will check out some of those recommendations!

[@509wildflower]

Never thought about the political issues and conflicts that could have been carried over from ATLA into the Korra series (which also happen to be relevant to our own world). Very educational!

[@vintheguy]

Shame the politics of korra is garbage

[@estherhale7459]

@@vintheguy Ew you're so edgy. Atla fans toxic af

[@alaina4070]

@@estherhale7459 You can still like Korra and say the politics suck

[@kenshin5792]

@@alaina4070 It didnt though. Just cause it tackles more mature themes doesn't make it bad.

[@vintheguy]

@@estherhale7459 No, it's that this show is pretty much a Libertarian wet dream Where no one really brings up any underlying systemic issues An underground city filled with animals and poor people? It's a jolly wonderland (Don't think about how this city came to exist) hell even the like only important poor person is a happy go lucky guy to the point you wonder if he's ignoring reality There's tons of other shit in the show and it's a real shame

[@rml2765]

On the topic of political climate of the Avatar world, that’s why I really loved the Kyoshi novels because it did talk about politics and how the nations influenced each other. I think it would’ve been really cool to get more of how the nations influence each other (fashion, architecture, etc) but the Kyoshi novels have a great start on the political aspect

[@Fralexion]

Out of curiosity, did the bit of lore about Kyoshi being the one who created the Dai Li (which was only mentioned in an obscure Flash game on the Nickelodeon website) show up anywhere in the comics about her? I could see reasons for retconning or keeping that.

[@rml2765]

@@Fralexion it didn’t directly mention it, the story of mostly about her early Avatarhood

[@strawberrylemonadesorbet2886]

THANK YOU this is a great video and thank you so much for making it! I'd just like to add that the bender vs non-bender conflict did have some precedent in the comics (Toph has a great bit in that arc!)

[@00noenoah]

Wow !!! Your analysis on Korra's politic storyline is awesome ! Great work, and thanks for putting time to do those elaborated videos. I'm learning and discovering a lot throught your videos, about China culture. I have to say, while I've been into Japanese and Korean culture and history for a long time, China did not really attracted me (Don't understand why, when it is so entwined with Korean history). Yet you've come to captivate me about the huge heritage and history of the country. You've won a new follower in me !

[@mr.williams6972]

That teleporting Cat is wild. First it's in front of the cam, then in her hand then just waltzing away😂

[@origamipein18]

That's Kokochin for you! 🙂 😃

[@BoredInNW6]

I love Xiran's signature death stare when it walks into shot

[@origamipein18]

@@BoredInNW6 Kokochin's all, "What? What is it, Xiran?"

[@debishvebishwish4839]

Ah Taiping Rebellion, where a guy failed his exam eventually went on and creates the bloodiest rebellion in the history. Wait that sounds familiar

[@cestalia]

Moral of story: let kid passed exam or they'll be a dictator 😂

[@LukSter18998]

Lmao

[@georgeoldsterd8994]

Familiar how?

[@quickman2663]

@@georgeoldsterd8994 A certain Austrian dude had the same idea.

[@chenoaholdstock3507]

As someone who's only really now getting into Chinese history, and Chinese stories, your channel is an amazing recourse.

[@AZ-697]

I’ve never understood the complaint that ATLA and LOK being “too western.” The Avatar World has had Eastern and Western influence from the beginning. It has been explicitly stated to pull inspiration from ALL cultures around the world.

[@ezrazhang7541]

Me when I found out my great grandparents were accused of being spies for the chinese national party and she changed her name multiple times: 👁👄👁

[@thatasianplayer]

Welcome to Chinese people still being divided and the Kuomintang just being dead on an island but yet it's an excuse to accuse someone.

[@cestalia]

Drop the story, I want to hear more 😂

[@appleslover]

@Crow me when my ancestors fought a war just to let china import opium so it would be profitable for our oligarchs 👁👁

[@absolutelynotellen]

I wanna drop, i would like to see your take to these chinese animation movies of "White Snake" and "Ne Zha" 😳🤚🏼

[@misterminutes4504]

The White Snake is a beautiful movie. Didn't expected the ending

[@lemonstarofficial]

ok

[@Playlist-sq5wu]

I second this

[@absolutelynotellen]

@@misterminutes4504 i know right? But i'm so glad both of them reincarnated. Edit: oops i spilled spoiler 🙃

[@origamipein18]

I've never heard of Ne Zha. What's it about?

[@Ninkira]

I loved this video so much!!!! I've had to figure out the PRC vs ROC history on my own and I realized now I missed a few details. Thank you so much for your fantastic videos, I love learning more about Chinese culture and history from you, and I LOVED your conclusion critique on the Korra writing. Really great points to think about, and will definitely check out the youtube series you recommended.

[@chickennoodlesoup1102]

6:07 me, who literally was JUST studying Sun Yat-Sen for the APWorld test: *laughs in knowledge*

[@ashe1317]

You finally vocalized my issue with Korra's aesthetic: it's based on Western European influence, but in the world of Avatar... WHAT Western Europe??? 8:58

[@15jewjew]

I actually would say it's not that European and what she says in the video is more about the colonial Asia influence. But republic city 8s actually more Asian than a lot 9f Asia was in the colonial period.

[@civilengineer3349]

My guess is that the Fire Nation is supposed to be the stand in for Western Europe because of all the machinery they used in ATLA, but that still leaves the question of what is with the clothing and the buildings

[@15jewjew]

@@civilengineer3349 The buildings are actually more Asian that colonial Asia. The windows and designs are Asian inspired where during colonial Asian the windows had arcs which are more roman. I guess at the end of the day the point of republic city is that these buildings are just inherently western. For instance the constructs during atla was more so built during times with monarchs. The politics is RC are different and it's a small city home to lots of people. Tall rectangular building just make sense for practical reasons. I mean even the satomobile is nothing more than a carriage with an engine which is a model t yes, but for ATLA and LOK the satomobile tale inspiration from fire nation carriages. It's kind of like the reinventing the wheel. No matter who came up with it first doesn't mean Other can't come up with the same invention.

[@Soroboruo]

The first series goes all over the literal world without a single European-analogue appearing! Idk if the Korra writers didn't, like... watch ATLA, or if it just never occurred to them, but c'mon...

[@15jewjew]

@@Soroboruo Atla had iron clad airships, hot-air balloons, and literally Alcatraz. It had some western influences for sure.

[@umbreonic766]

as a fellow adhd, can i just say you balance the epic infodumping you do while also being succinct? that’s something i WISH i could do and you have MASTERED it!

[@rolldecode]

YAAAS thanks for the recommendations!! And great piece on Korra! You went in detail and unpacked big ideas (as usual)! Loved it