IS THE DJI AVINOX REALLY A GAME CHANGER?

[@shaneycarter8803]

There is absolutely no disputing at all that this system has moved the game forward. It's power is only one part of the story. It's the way it delivers the power, it has 42 pick up sensors along with yaw sensors to know it's angle. The first bike with a touch screen, two Bluetooth controllers. Better battery specs that can charge to 75% in 90 minutes. Dji are already a hugely significant manufacturer of quality and reliable products. It's backed up by the same 2 Yr industry standard warranty. They built a bike brand from scratch to establish this themselves rather than just sell to current bike brands. A hugely significant achievement itself. The bike frame is really high quality and spec'd with quality parts all at a reasonable price given the competition. Gee Miller dream bike builder states its one of the best frames he has even built up, with amazing attention to detail. Every review for this bike and motor has been hugely positive. They have tried to break it and push it hard to find its limits, to date it has kept on going when plenty fail, even though this is a trail bike, not Enduro. Other brands are rightly concerned. With the Amflow you can get all the power with a lightweight package from a £5999 price point. Only issue is trying to secure one like I have before they sell out 👍👌

[@ebikecentre]

Some really great points here. We appreciate you sharing them. Thanks for watching.

[@shaneycarter8803]

@ebikecentre Thanks, appreciate the feedback 👍

[@brendan1]

My friends and I own Rails, Levos, and Wilds and we've been talking about how exciting the DJI motor is. We just prefer the motor to be on an enduro spec bike and not a trail bike. So holding out to see if anything could come of that.

[@ebikecentre]

It is undoubtedly exciting tech. My gut feeling is that it will need to be fitted to some big named enduro bikes before it gets a fair crack of the whip. Thanks for the comment and watching.

[@brianbathgate4944]

It is a game changer. When people look back through the evolution of e-bikes, there’s only one bike that’ll get a mention for 2024. Am I going to buy one? No. But it’s a significant bike. Im going to keep my Levo for a few more years. Let DJI move onto their 2nd or 3rd Gens. Let belt driven gearboxes catch up. Im wanting a full powered belt driven e-bike around 21kgs, with a kw battery and built in sat nav on the top tube. Bring that to market and you can take my money :)

[@ebikecentre]

I completely agree with you that this will be the most talked about ebike of 2024. I don't think the motor alone is the game changer, but I feel the threat of new, innovative & competitions competition (from DJI, Pinion etc) will disrupt the dominance that Bosch, Shimano, Yamaha & Brose hold over the market, and THAT is the game changer I think you've nailed it with your "dream spec", the only thing I would change is to ditch the Sat-nav for a sub 20kg bike. Thanks a lot for your comment and for watching.

[@robbief1]

Yeah - I agree. DJI (With all its slick integration) with a built in gearbox and belt drive for the win!

[@ebikecentre]

A DJI/Pinion hybrid would be the dream!

[@bigadventure3797]

I like the idea of having a ton of power available on tap when I want it. Think of it like having a really nice audio system that plays loud. You may not play it at high volumes all the time but now and again when you just want to crank it you can.

[@ebikecentre]

Great analogy! Thanks for watching and sharing your thoughts.

[@dallasdrew2390]

I think this bike IS a game changer why???? because its the power to weight ratio and the software this bike it is the Tesla of ebikes.

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks for the comment and for watching. It's great to hear the differing opinions on the DJI Avinox. It's undoubtedly an incredible piece of tech, it will be interesting to see where the e-bike market goes from here.

[@leelemon007]

WOW at last a real honest and thought provoking view on the Avinox. I ride for distance so its ECO all the way, do i really need 120nm? Maybe when I'm old yes, but only 72 y.o. atm so years away!

[@ebikecentre]

I'm glad you enjoyed the video. Thanks for the comment and for watching.

[@andymtb3212]

I rarely use boost. I mostly ride eco and trail because I just want a bit of assist and don’t want to get pulled uphill.

[@ebikecentre]

I’m certainly of the same mindset. I’m mainly in eco as I really enjoy the challenge of climbing (it’s not everyone’s cup of tea) but I like how an e-bike gives me the ability to cover more ground in the same time frame. Thanks for the comment and for watching. Jason

[@michalmalanowicz7595]

I wish DJI good luck, but there is one more important element. The life of the drive components. Cassette, Chain. How long will it work with such power?

[@ebikecentre]

Agreed. The lifespan of the drivetrain will be a very important aspect in the success of the motor. Given the extreme power output, one might have expected them to have fitted the Shimano LinkGlide drivetrain to the Amflow as it can take far more punishment than a standard 12 speed drivetrain from Shimano or SRAM. Thanks a lot for watching and commenting. Jason

[@scottpratico1315]

Depends on your definition of Game Changer. I think it does change the game because the big brands will have to catch up.

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks for your comment and for watching the video.

[@hein_mcleod]

The big names need to start the efficiency race. More range out of smaller batteries is what we really want. 85nm/600w is enough, even for my 105kg frame!

[@ceriway380]

I Agree with you a hundred percent 85 nm is plenty. Smaller better battery ,more range .

[@ebikecentre]

I am with you on this one too. 85nm is plenty, what I want is lighter weight, longer range batteries and quite / lifelike motors. Thanks a lot for watching and commenting. Jason

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment. Jason

[@mattshepherd3412]

@@ceriway380 Although this seems like a reasonable request, not much is going to change. We are all limited by physics and chemistry. Motors and batteries are already highly developed products. Any improvements moving forward will be very small incremental improvements. That is why DJI went the way they did. Bigger numbers sell bikes, higher Nm motor, faster motor, bigger display, higher energy density battery and faster charger etc. I was talking with a bike shop mechanic about why we don't see more link glide bikes being built by the bigger manufacturers, his answer was why have 11 gears when you can have 12. That's what sells bikes unfortunately, not good value reliable and cheap to maintain bikes. The industry wants built in obsolescence and high maintenance of expensive parts. Most consumers don't know any better, and buy what ever is put in front of them (my self included).

[@megane230f1]

im running a 2018 focus jam 2 with a 378wh battery and a shimano e8000 motor and i find it is still more than i need, still getting 50 mile out of it and on the plus side its lighter than most of the so called SL bikes, its a just over 20kg bike

[@AndrewUpson]

I am not buying for the power. I am buying for the tech. ebike-centre should become a DJI dealer and ride/sell the bike. This is simply a promo to sell the bikes you stock. My Turbo Levo has had 2 failed motors, can't tell me they are reliable.

[@shaneycarter8803]

It does seem to be unnecessarily biased and without substance 🤔 Amflow have already chosen their Dealers in the UK. These are not available to non agreed suppliers.

[@ebikecentre]

Hi Andrew, thanks for watching and and for your comments. It is great to hear your opinions on the motor. Out of interest which DJI tech is most appealing to you? Just to clarify, I am very impressed by the DJI Avinox, and I say as much in the video. However, my point is that I don't believe that the motor alone is enough to be a game changer, but I do feel that DJI and Pinion have together changed the market, in that they have disrupted the status quo of the big four (Bosch, Shimano, Yamaha, Brose), who now need to step up their game for fear of new, innovative competition. Personally I think the gear-boxed motor of the Pinion MGU is more of a game changer than the DJI, but what DJI have produced at a first attempt is staggering. And no, I wouldn't tell you that the Levo motor is reliable (although, they are vastly better than they were 2/3 years ago)... All the best, Jason

[@michaelcalandrillo9704]

yes

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks for commenting and watching our video.

[@bikemad]

Its not just the motor the fast charger is where leads other brands

[@ebikecentre]

Agreed. It has brought other innovations apart from just motor power. Thanks for watching and commenting.

[@utube091116]

I went for the other game changer, a Rapcon Pinion. That's what i've been waiting for: no chain nor derailer , finally. I don't need 120Nm ( i only weigh 65kg) and almost never use the top power set. We'll see how long the Avinox system will last, with a 1000W peak out and a fast charge (with a ridiculous max Amps charging).Dji has more than a decade of Batt/motor/software experience, but if it's not well used...

[@ebikecentre]

Great choice with the Rapcon Pinion! It’s awesome to see eMTBs moving away from the traditional chain and derailleur setup - that Pinion drivetrain is definitely a game changer. As you say it will be interesting to see how this DJI system holds up long-term. Thanks for taking the time to comment and for watching.

[@nomad-pq4yw8iy7v]

It has changed the game it's up it! There calling out the major players.

[@KarlMaldenarino]

I don't care about the 120nm of torque, I'm excited for the efficiency. It already gets about the same range at full power as a bosch with equivalent battery capacity. Turn it down to about the same power level and get way more range.

[@ebikecentre]

Judging by the comments, you're not alone in being impressed more by the battery and efficiency than the motor's torque output. It's mightily impressive. Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment.

[@peterlundgren8867]

I have a Levo. I rarely use Boost and I do not need the power of the DJI. But it is the total package with controllers, charging, big battery, power, light weight that does it for me. If it would be available right now, I would buy it. But the standard spec. But let’s see at the time they offer it in my country, what else there is on the market when I want to upgrade.

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks very much for your comments. It’s undeniable that the total package DJI/Amflow have launched is mightily impressive. It will be fascinating to see what the established brands fire back with. Thanks for watching.

[@Theolegit57]

Obviously you haven’t ridden one yet?

[@Yogi5D]

I take Pinion MGU anyday over this

[@ebikecentre]

I'm with you on this. I think this is the way the ebike market will go. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Bosch have already started work on their own version. Unlike Shimano & SRAM, Bosch have nothing to lose by going all-in on a gear boxed motor and ditching the derailleur. Thanks for watching and commenting. Jason

[@davidbraun2923]

Interesting argument but as you say only time will tell 👍👍👍

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks David, much appreciated. Jason

[@billydeewilliams8909]

I don't live in the EU, so obviously I don't have to contend with weird paternalistic garbage like a limiter, but I'm a pretty experienced e-MTB rider, and honestly, I don't want the motor interfering with my downhill, and the lighter the better in this regard, mostly. At least on my 2022 Trek Rail, the way the bike leaps ahead a bit when you first put the power down after coasting is something I'm used to, but still messes me up when I'm timing and adjusting speed for jumps and drops. 25 km/h or 15 mph is insanely quick on the climbs, and where I come from, people are looking for a built-in chairlift or shuttle, essentially. I now almost always turn off the motor for the downhill, also to conserve battery. All that said, I'm concerned about the amount of power in this bike, as I regularly break drivetrain components on my Rail. Part of that is because I'm kind of weirdly cheap and old-fashioned in some ways, and I really don't want to bother with electronic transmission, but insist on using SRAM (which doesn't have e-bike rated mechanical components) rather than Shimano. Knowing what I know now, I'd probably have gone with Shimano drivetrain for my fleet, but my three other bikes (gravel, trail HT, and trail full squish, all regular bikes) all use SRAM XD driver components, and I've invested in quite a few spares, etc (mainly cassettes). Once I go through what I've got, I might switch back, but that won't be for a few years, by which time I'll probably have a new e-bike (probably a Santa Cruz Bullitt or Norco Sight VLT), or SRAM will finally nut up and release mechanical transmission.

[@ebikecentre]

The limiter is certainly a bone of contention amongst riders in the UK/EU, but as you say 15mph for significant climbing is extremely fast and beyond the realms of human ability. The drive train element is an excellent point. We have seen riders destroy a drivetrain within 250 miles with an 85nm motor. I dread to think how quickly someone could chew up a cassette with 120Nm of torque to play with. Thanks for taking the time to comment and for watching. Jason

[@LlenadeMalo]

It’s a bit of a watershed moment for e-bikes. For years companies have not done anything to reduce weight or add really any features. Ranges have not really increased. The top tube screens look like a calculator from 1987. DJI has shown what a future could be. A more powerful motor, a sensor suite to deliver the power better, increased efficiency, longer range, a price that for the bottom model is not terrible with a decent spec, all with much lower weight (a weight reduction in the range of 6-7 KILOS - That’s insane weight reduction). This is going to cause many more people to be interested since it looks like a normal bike. It doesn’t weigh double what their current bike weighs. My Rocky Mountain Instinct weighs just under 14KGs. The ebike I was looking at weighs 25KGs. The other e-bike motor companies got caught in the status quo with minor updates here an there. Like the Gen 5 Bosch. They reduced weight by 200g. 😮 And now it doesn’t rattle, something it should have never done. Shimano is way behind. Like unless they pull some rabbit out of their hat, they are not competitive at all. So, yes, game changer.

[@shaneycarter8803]

@@LlenadeMalo couldn't agree more with what you have taken the time to say. I've pretty much stated the same in my response. There is absolutely no doubt at all that this has moved the game forward, and disrupted this market. Now it's the so called big brands playing catch up.......literally 👍 I've put my money where my mouth is and I'm picking up mine in the morning. Received a confirmation text today that it's ready to collect. Happy days 😁

[@lidarman2]

I want to know if if ebike-centre understands the difference between power and torque and energy. Apparently not. Maybe they meant 'buying power' every time the term power is used. :O

[@razorree]

Unfortunately Bosch integration is quite bad (no Ant+ and displays on handlebar are quite big), also Bosch batteries are quite big which makes difficult to position them in frames low and close to a motor, most of the bikes have battery quite high and forward (comparing to Levo for example), or they have batt non-removable (like Orbea Wild) - disqualification. Up to this point I think Specialized had the most "moving forward" system, the best integration, sleek design, amazing geo with low and close to a motor placed battery - best handling thanks to that, however reliability problems with a motor ... :/

[@TCscot]

Terrible video, being negative whilst trying to not sound negative. Some real BS here

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks for your feedback. I’m sorry to hear that the video didn’t resonate with you. My goal is always to provide honest and balanced content, but I understand that different perspectives can come across in different ways. I appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts.

[@TCscot]

@@ebikecentre mate I dont believe you, your reply to my comment stands out as BS again. Im not one to comment like this but tbh you are coming across really fake, im a big fan of e-mtb but you are not the guy to listen to.

[@link6032]

Finally a measured response to the more powerful motor debate !, excellent comments. All other reviews seem to completely miss that as long as a motor can get you up to 16mph limiter, then the rest is irrelevant!. Also what about drive train wear, conventional chains and sprokets will wear like butter with this much torque all the time in a muddy winter !

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks very much for your comment, much appreciated. Your point on the drivetrain is incredibly important too, it’s a hidden cost that people won’t have thought about.

[@JamesGoddard-i7s]

Its too soon to call it. We need long term real world tests. Its either a Bugatti moment (heres a veyron this is what we could do with a Passat) or the Betamax of e bikes (better than the competition in everyway but totally impractacal) One thing i am sure of is that motor is pushing if not surpassing current drivetrains

[@ebikecentre]

Agreed. It’s a difficult market to break into. Car manufacturers have been trying for years, but have failed miserably. However, DJI have taken a far more innovative approach, so it will be interesting to see how they fair. Great point about the drivetrains, they don’t stand a chance against 120nm. Thanks for watching and commenting. Jason

[@LakesMTB1964]

Shame it’s in a trail bike

[@ebikecentre]

It certainly is. Enduro bikes would be the biggest benefactors of the Avinox motor. Thanks for watching an commenting.

[@dunklhof]

Great analysis but jumping video and silly clips are only an annoying disraction

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks for for watching and for your feedback. Our channel is always open to improvements, so we take you comments on board. Jason

[@Timbodacious]

not in any way shape or form is this a game changer. its just another mid drive with some "fancy" software you won't really use while riding your bike. it's like everyone is praising this motor when they are still years behind the ebike industry...... i don't get it. props to them putting it on a light frame though. we've got 160 and 230 nm torque mid drives already on the market. This is just "selling the name" to make it seem more special than other mid drives haha.

[@ebikecentre]

Thanks a lot for watching and sharing your opinion. I agree with you that the weight element of the motor system is the most impressive part of their package. Like you, I'm not fussed by more torque output.

[@stevejones7956]

Nice video

[@ebikecentre]

Thank you, we’re glad you enjoyed it. Thanks very much for watching.

[@msjj000]

Other than a gimmicky boost mode there ain’t anything game changing here, same same otherwise.

[@waichungsham1578]

fast charge,better screen user interface,more likely to see updates in software,anti theft mode.

[@shaneycarter8803]

@@msjj000 hardly the same. It's a huge leap forward in tech. More power and control that blurs the lines of a lightweight mid powered / full fat. It's has a more efficient battery with better charging and management . It has a touch screen showing all data, theft prevention and location. Bluetooth twin controls. Higher IP rating than any other motor out there also. All backed by approved Dealers with an industry standard 2year warranty.

[@Mark71GENX]

It’s prob no more of a gamble than a Shimano motor…..

[@ebikecentre]

You make a valid point. We haven't personally experienced many Shimano motor issues, but we have heard of some of this issues riders have faced (particularly with some of the early EP8s). Thanks for commenting and watching.

[@jamesbird7399]

Well put sir

[@ebikecentre]

🥰

[@JamesGoddard-i7s]

Can we stop talking about power These motors dont laydown peak torque figures, its more like half and that drops again when you hit a proper cadence Its a pointless stat unless you crawl about on the eagle ring at 15rpm