Is Thomas Ronhaar cheating?

[@JDisLimitless]

Please refrain in making any abusive/hateful comments towards the people within this video, I do not condone it nor is what this video is trying to achieve.. It is simply a discussion regarding recent events within the F1 community and how we can avoid doubting drivers entirely in future.

[@slimstrait780]

Pin this brother. Don't let this disclaimer fall into the abyss of comments.

[@TrueSonOfWalhall]

you should really pin this, took me a bit of scrolling to get to this comment

[@wedgefeyhong9756]

Ronhaar to Minecraft racing.

[@renezannini]

Can you test the cheat?? So we can compare your evolution using that Sh!T... Please?? lol

[@OK-fi4yq]

trying to avoid facing criticism yourself

[@LuizHartkopf]

With the amount of money that is being invested into E-sports, it should 100% be played at an arena. Maybe even at some GPs. There should be a anti-cheating system implemented also.

[@0nTheBrakes]

the game actually does have a "form" of anticheat. If you have anything that modifies the game files in any way... like mods, you are not allowed to play online and your time trials wont count. This also applies to things like cheat engine, if its detected, the game wont let you do anything online. F1Sensor just seems to be advanced enough to beat whatever F1 22 system is to find malware.

[@0xf7c8]

Anti cheats are worth nothing. It only stops the commonly distributed cheats. If they really wanted to cheat, if they are playing from home, they could no matter what. It needs to be on LAN with organization provided gear.

[@drewpixels]

I think E-sport is fantastic idea ever since it started and it needs to be integrated with grandprix weekends leading up to the F1 race! And on Saturday after qualifying they should have an Arena at the circuit where all E-sports driver have their races there and setups that are set up with codemasters and EA themselves.

[@saladpotet7872]

If they like make the ESport happen at certain GPs, that might actually be a way to get more spotlight on it, and also promote the game. Idk why they haven't done that yet

[@Josh_simracing]

@@0nTheBrakes It's not good system. Still you can modify the memory of the game inside of your RAM. They should've used Battleye or EAC atleast to mitigate cheating

[@macauleybrown3125]

It’s clear as day… he needs to be massively investigated

[@DrQuestern]

Good anti-cheat and zero cheat tolerance policy (i.e. lifelong pro ban for cheating) are things that are REQUIRED to run a successful esports. If codemasters and EA fail to ensure fairness it will really hurt its potential.

[@f1ology]

Needs investigation for sure but if he was using cheats at the highest level you got to question how much damage it done to F1 esports? As a series could anyone take the Codemasters game seriously ever again? I think honestly they need to build software EA/Codemasters and make sure that the game is cheat proof. Without that implementation then I don’t see a way forward in future

[@PapaBear6t8]

@@DrQuestern First of all you need a proper F1 simulator, not this piece of garbage Codies put out every year and you need it to be at least at Assetto Corsa level of simulation... only then comes what you said above! Otherwise it's just like polishing the turd.

[@DrQuestern]

@@PapaBear6t8 realism doesn't really matter in terms of competition. Fairness does. I agree that realism matters, but it's already ok-ish and at least resembles f1. You can have a good esport in a fully arcade racing game. What is unacceptable however is the amount of bugs, glitches and overall state of the game and multiplayer. It's just baffling that year over year technical aspect just becomes worse, considering that its the same game and the same engine.

[@F1_Gianni_96]

How do they cheat in F1 22 esport’s is it via a mod?

[@zUnframe]

Frede putting ronhaar in the wall will go down as a legendary esports moment

[@rubikvoncube3583]

for sure

[@DJA1599]

Agreed. I actually was blown away at first as to why he would do that. But everything has come full circle now.

[@harisserdarevic4913]

@@DJA1599 I remember seeing it the day it happened thinking how much I disliked frede for it. I was cheering for thomas but now hearing all the new context around it everything has clicked

[@internalpolitics461]

​@@harisserdarevic4913it's always nice to see someone listen to an argument and change/ take on new beliefs or theories.

[@losmandingos]

I think he is honestly. When you look at the pace of ALL the Esport drivers, they are all within like a few thousandths of each other over one lap. Then you have Ronhaar. Obvs im no f1 game genius but just with the eye test you can tell something suspicious is there.

[@keonxd8918]

Yeah, especially when he qualifies 3 tenths more than the 2nd driver on the grid when the 3rd driver is just a few hundreds away from the 2nd driver. Which for F1 eSports, is a lot, and he does it on a consistent basis

[@Djentalman]

When every driver is within a gap of two tenths of the fastest time, and someone goes and sets a time that is 2 tenths ahead of that it just doesn't seem right at all. Very suspicious.

[@keelanjones2726]

0.2 seconds with same set up against the esports champion is very interesting. Mainly corresponding with the lack of wheel spin when accelerating at slightly higher speeds.

[@pogmaster4559]

We had been investigating this guy for a while. When questioned we checked "one" of his multiple machine's and it seemed like a clean boot. And when we asked to see the other he refused, we tried talking to his Manager but they were also very suspicious.

[@willho4202]

@@pogmaster4559just for reference who are you

[@gallarrrd]

I have such a big respect for Rassmussen right now... Taking Ronhaar out screwing up his own race just to make sure he did not win Esports unfairly is great

[@Lastname6955]

Legendary move

[@RPJ84]

@@Lastname6955 Well sadly he lost the championship because of that move. But yeh Fred is one of the cleanest drivers, i was surprised he did that move but i get it now.

[@matmica2702]

@@RPJ84 exactly i thought he was mad,now it all makes sense

[@Ansee7]

but there is no concrete proof that ronhaar is cheating? All Rassmussen did was selfishly took out another driver who is better and quicker than him. If more evidence comes out in the future that proves ronhaar cheated without room for speculation then yes I will agree Rassmussen was right, but as it stands he is a sore loser.

[@icedblxxd]

@@Ansee7 He did what he had to do, it was a sacrifice for the others. Whether he looked like a sore loser or not, he played a big part in stopping an accused cheater.

[@SimoneMarra73]

I think it’s clear that Ronhaar is using cheats, but I also understand tnat, until investigations lead to something, we can’t be sure of it. However, his ability to get on the power much earlier than all the other esport drivers, and the ridiculous difference in the minimum speed he can carry through slow-speed corners are just not normal. He still manages to be much faster than everyone else despite having oversteer, missing apexes etc. In conclusion, I think Ronhaar has got the talent to be in esports already, but, in order to win, he seems to be using a slight boost in grip. It’s a shame that F1 haven’t started a full-scale investigation on this yet, but Codies needs to implement anti-cheats for the next game, because this is getting ridiculous now

[@itzmk_]

Its also difficult to investigate this stuff

[@tobiaslumplecker7666]

@@itzmk_ yep. They should just run it offline in an arena or at least require all of them to drive from their Teams headquarters. Doesn't guarantee anything but it would make it much harder to cheat

[@zachbishop5421]

Well those are the ways ppl cheat more traction and faster min speeds so it's even more damning

[@BoliveiraNTPW]

Codies is owned by EA, so no way they will spend money to create anti-cheats.

[@tobiaslumplecker7666]

@@BoliveiraNTPW they don't need to spend money on anti cheat to solve the problem of cheating in pro play. If they make Lan Events it should be fixed plus it should be better for the fans aswell

[@SWendel03]

Even if he isn't cheating, investigating drivers is always a good thing. In real F1, every aspect of the car and team is examined for cheating, the same should happen for esports as its easier to detect than the real world. If he's found to be cheating, a lifetime ban would be an appropriate punishment in my opinion.

[@Ellipsis115]

Yeah if you can go uncaught for years in actual esports events and be this elusive and cause this much harm where the whole grids annoyed at them then I don't see how you can just have them out for a few months or a year, it needs to be a massive deterent.

[@Thalanir7]

In Jarno’s latest my team video and on his twitch someone make a joke that his plane was delayed because it didn’t have enough grip. Jarno then said “if only I had 0.015% more grip”. 18:10

[@DL-nn1ws]

The “why” is best put by Karl Jobst in one of his videos about cheating: “Sometimes it’s those at the top that are most likely to cheat because they feel they deserve it or because they just lack that little bit extra to be the best” Especially in an environment with *lots* of money involved, the “risk” is meaningless. He’s always just been 1-2 tenths quicker which made this go under the radar for so long. Those 1-2 tenths make a difference but they’re not big enough to be caught *most of the time*

[@claxxz1]

Karl Jobst what a legend!

[@calebhernandez4233]

another quote form him i like is, "good players don't cheat to achieve goals or times, they cheat to achieve those times faster" that has really stuck with me

[@nuhni-no4ks]

I think you can also compare it to Master players in League of Legends, using Scripts to get Challenger. They are decent players and only toggle scripts in important situations so it's hard to prove.

[@hexhiaa]

and another common dream L

[@VentureCoinist]

damn I remember watching that Mexico incident and wondering why he got taken out. it makes so much sense now. thanks for making this JD

[@Barntos]

Did he win the Championship?

[@jamarsimms1638]

​@@Barntosno Lucas Blakeley won the esports championship

[@rubikvoncube3583]

yeah I went back to look at that recently - at the time, most of the comments were talking about how Rasmussen lost his cool and was behaving childishly, but with this context his action makes a lot more sense. He was still in the wrong, but it seems that his decision wasn't unprovoked

[@calussy8040]

@@jamarsimms1638 He would of if the rest of the field was actively trying to stop him, obviously Mexico is just one example but I'm sure there were other times where similar things have happened to a lesser degree.

[@BadWallaby]

To be completely honest until these are held in a closed LAN with pc's set up by the event organizers, PSGL and others like it will have these issues. Whether he is or is not the door is open and they're just asking for it to happen.

[@BeachJedi101]

100%. The idea that people can compete for this amount of money in an unregulated home environment is laughable.

[@nahuelarocalopez6827]

ye, but the thing is that ronhaar doesnt want to do it lan bc he feels more "comfartble" at home. Like clearly if he goes lan hes going to be violated by everyone

[@BadWallaby]

@@nahuelarocalopez6827 everyone has their preference but honestly if he can’t show up he can’t win it should be that simple

[@nahuelarocalopez6827]

@@BadWallaby yeah thats true, if he doesnt show up he doesnt win it, this is pro league so it has to be a rule.

[@RacingUnleashed]

We don't have this issue. Our competitions are held in our racing lounges. No cheating possible.

[@richardkeler9170]

Solve the problem: Esports should be taken more seriously, as the competition has been skyrocketing in the past 3 years and because of that the standards and professionalism of this "sport" has to increase as well. The races have to take place in a controlled environment and should be monitored by multiple people.

[@willho4202]

I think having it played at on LAN at a small arena with a small crowd of a few hundred would add to it as well, I always feel the stream is a little flat without spectators. Obviously at the minute that’s only possible for f1 esports but it would kill any chance of cheating and raise the entertainment

[@f1ology]

I’m pretty sure Esports is done in a studio or teams factories if I’m correct? I’m pretty sure they are already done in a controlled environment

[@dgsdhsdeuye57]

@@f1ology mid year it was from home because of covid

[@CRLRosberg]

F1 Esports needs to go back to lan events. I’m aware they weren’t perfectly run and being from home makes it more relatable to an audience in the sense of “anyone can do this” which they can, at a lan event you can’t cheat. It’s a completely even playing field and to me that’s the only solution

[@timhanel9564]

the way ronhaar is accused to use it, makes it easier to detect (because of the delta to the top guys) but imagine a "slower" esport driver would use it and not be first place in every qualifying session but still jumping like 5 or 10 places .. it would be even harder to detect

[@JDisLimitless]

Timestamps if you want to skip: 0:00 Intro 5:00 Q1 performances 7:00 PSGL Spain qualifying 14:08 Time trial 14:59 Suzuka time trial lap 17:00 F1cheats screenshot 18:06 F1 Esports 0.015% grip hack 19:20 F1 Esports Mexico incident 21:00 PSGL Spain race ERS usage 27:00 Final thoughts

[@kyperactive]

Put this in the description instead, much easier to follow.

[@dbracer]

By the way, "1.015" means a 1.5% increase, not 0.015%. That's huge - a half-year F1 aero budget huge.

[@andreprinsloo7417]

Agree, at F1 esports level, controlled environment, pc’s provided, game installed and verified by organisers and the game tested prior to the actual race event by the developers

[@samgendler]

In all honesty, a fully controlled environment (everyone on the same LAN) probably isn't actually necessary, though I would think drivers would want that since it levels the playing field against network glitches and the like. But racing on league-provided PCs that are tamper-resistant and remotely verifiable is not at all hard to arrange. If drivers want to be able to race in their bedroom and in their cockpit, that could definitely be accommodated with minimal risk of opening the window to cheating, especially without racers having to pay for custom developed cheats that are specifically written to counter the league's anti-cheat efforts. Between detecting tampering with the provided PC, collecting real-time telemetry for post-race analysis of anomalous performance, and requiring that network communication between the provided PC and the race servers all occur over an encrypted VPN connection that originates inside the PC, it can be made very difficult to cheat without requiring that everyone be in the same room.

[@aevionrokusho4868]

They have league provided pc’s for the cod league (cdl) everyone plays from home, except for the major tournaments ofc. I think it could be done for f1 esports aswell

[@f1andfootballfan993]

He definitely needs to be investigated. Something just isn’t right

[@tomralston7780]

POMPEY PLAY UP, PLAY UP POMPEY

[@FLAMEalan]

BLUE ARMY

[@Utube2Itube]

It’s completely right as of today

[@harveyspecter1653]

If EA or codemasters really want to find out, they should use the telemetry of anyone they suspect of cheating and input it in their original game, let's say as some sort of automated input. If the car then spins or does other weird stuff then you know enough.

[@affectedrl5327]

Thats actually smart. But i dont know if they record the telemetry of the drivers that accurately. And then you have varying factors like the FPS of the client which makes the physics behave differently.

[@machtmonk]

AFAIK the physics in this game are not deterministic, ergo the same inputs will result in slightly different outcomes. This was discussed under a different video and this technique is used in e.g. Trackmania but will sadly not work here. Also it would be insanely difficult as you would need to log the inputs at the wheels polling rate, which the game is just not doing.

[@janbo8331]

@@affectedrl5327 I'm not 100% sure what you mean. I've used telemetry software in Codemasters F1 games. Beta tested one for a good while. The game records a lot of different things that can be sent to a PC software even when driving on a console platform. I never felt any data was missing, there was everything from steering inputs to pedal inputs and you could dissect them how you liked. I spent a lot of time studying throttle inputs in wet weather in slow speed corners.

[@TarawaS2000]

EA doesn't care. A dude won the Madden bowl by spamming the the same play all game. He would also put a punter in at QB because he was left handed and would get a better animation on the run play to the right. EA is a joke of a company.

[@xmixdx7351]

@@janbo8331 yes but if you plugged that back into the game using some sort of script, there would be very minor differences that would lead to a completely different result telemetry data is amazing and super useful and accurate, but its just ever so slightly not accurate enough

[@LionAndALamb]

I agree with you 100% that the ability to get on throttle so significantly earlier than everyone else *with consistency* makes the performances highly suspect. How can the people who run this series ignore this? I remember you having Ronhaar covered on pace in one of your leagues a few years back.

[@0nTheBrakes]

People do have the ability to improve. Otis Lawrence is getting better as well. Gotta remember how young these guys are and they do just keep getting better (to a certain point in age), but Thomas is still young.

[@LionAndALamb]

@@0nTheBrakes I don't doubt he's improved, but even Lewis and Max get beaten in Q3 by their less talented/skilled teammates once in awhile.

[@poof7492]

@@0nTheBrakes bro are you like dumb it would be like that someone in f3 would go instant to f1 and would have the highest overall speed of the whole grid by 10 kph hes 100% cheating

[@IAmPdawg]

Props for just making an honest title haha

[@MJoStriker]

I just want that grip cheat so in my career mode if I get rain I have the same grip as the A.I. seem to have.

[@Yayo509]

Have him race outside of his room. I think the result is going to be VERY surprising.

[@0nTheBrakes]

The Esports pro exhibition which got him into a Esports seat was all LAN, on their equipment and he dominated.

[@nahuelarocalopez6827]

@@0nTheBrakes when was that? bc Ronhaar said many times that he doesnt want to do lan bc he feels more "comfartble" at home.

[@imcairoaguero_]

@@0nTheBrakesu don’t really know how easy is for people to cheat on this game.

[@Remzly]

​@@nahuelarocalopez6827 Which is a legitimate answer. If you've ever been used to a sim setup, then try another one you'll realize that you will be slower for a decent period of time before you can adjust. Same thing here where someone might be used to their own setup, and dont feel comfortable when they switch.

[@aevionrokusho4868]

But every other driver has that same handicap then.. so being comfortable at he’s own place is true, everyone feels the same that way. But it’s no excuse. and tbh it’s a shame they don’t race on LAN😢

[@willho4202]

Surely an organisation would be happy for him to come race at their facility for a little bit so he can prove his innocence. I just feel like things are stacking up against him to the point where it’s difficult to ignore and Jarno’s comments basically confirm it

[@Jejking]

@@AaronMartin7193 Ronhaar clone account detected.

[@machtmonk]

Something similar was done with the csgo pro ropz. He was accused of cheating in FPL (an invite only matchmaking league for pros and very good players by a company called Faceit) by many pros, Faceit invited him to play in their office and his name was cleared afterwards.

[@guyanaboy7]

I really wanted a video like this. After PSGL Spain i went to twitter to see what people were saying. But i got no "actual" information. People who hate ronhaar saying he cheated, and his fans defending him. I like being able to see the full picture, thanks 🙏🏾

[@zyn_id]

Even people who recently joined the community can see it: The last 3 rounds of the Spanish GP, Jarno with ERS + DRS vs TR with ERS Only. That's Crazy; even the gap in the last lap is more significant than before.

[@connoroleary3932]

they really need to introduce LAN esports like other games have, no cheating just pure skill, u use what ur given

[@thijsvons2510]

It used to be like that before COVID

[@connoroleary3932]

@@thijsvons2510 hopefully they reintroduce this, bet ronhaar drops far back in the grid

[@jordanharris5013]

Thing is as long as your a "good" driver. You can tune the cheats to make your time align with everyone around you. It's actually quite scary that it might be a few people in esports considering they race in their home.

[@claxxz1]

Just wow🤯 Mate i don't know how to thank you because at the moment you are the best thing that the F1game community could have had! the man who's working the most to change something in EA/Codemasters, this "investigations" videos are spreading so much awareness into the community, they're so great. and are also bringing together f1 sim-racers. It's been a long time since I've seen the community so united. in this case against cheating. (this regardless of whether Thomas is cheating or not)

[@Eat-MyGoal]

Such a clever hack. Adding just a tiny amount of grip makes its use hard to detect but its impact meaningful. Fascinating story for someone who just stumbled across it via KZbin algorithms...

[@zhzh3132]

I also felt quite surprised that he could make such great progress in this game. He just suddenly became a F1 esports champion fighter from no where.Until this video.

[@reasonbeexd4642]

i want to see him at LAN, thats all. Jarno drove so fucking great race tbh

[@andrecarrato6359]

Man, someone that is clear and clean wouldnt generate that kinda rage as it was with Frede. It is, at least, suspicious

[@GameKanaal37]

Some lap times should be rare to achieve.. a Lewis Hamilton Singapore style.. a Senna Monaco.. a Max at Belgium. Sometimes their is just that 1 perfect lap that someone puts out at some tracks.. but it should be impossible to achieve it constantly as Ronhaar is doing.. what is sus is that Ronhaar is gaining time on corners and exits.. while Opmeer.. has more downforce and just can't get the throttle down

[@ishowspeed_page4fans]

That is what we were all waiting for!

[@phokiii8327]

0:37 I slapped my ear thinking there was a mosquito

[@zilla9676]

its great to have an actual former pro analyze these clips and give insight as to why people think hes cheating. Someone who been in the game and actually understands the game has so much credibility, doing a great service to the community

[@nassargeorgio5309]

imagine cheating in f1 esports and still losing 😭 i wouldn't think he's cheating tbf

[@MegaSturrup]

Right?

[@jangalaba4626]

do you not see how that would be beneficial to not win everything? he's playing it smart, really hard to catch him, but a proper investigation will do the trick. Seems very fishy when in the barcelona chicane he gains 2 and a half tenths with a lower downforce setup...

[@D-AM11]

Imagine thinking pace is the only thing that matters when it comes to results 😭 Have you heard about incidents, strategies? Ronhaar has without a doubt been the fastest when we’re talking about pace. But that’s not everything.

[@dominicansharingan]

If he is cheating, what is the cheat that he is using?

[@deakksyy]

@@D-AM11 you don't gain 3 tenths in a corner in a competitive esports grid.

[@scottmeredith3359]

The most convincing element to me is the consistency. This is how most high profile cheats are caught, they can’t “fake” losing enough (so to speak) to allay suspicions. Hell, it’s how they got Bernie Madoff. No human is perfect everywhere, especially in a video game with so many variables affecting performance. A 2/10 gap is essentially a giveaway applied across so many tracks. I’m convinced.

[@israelbenitezjimenez533]

Soooo this aged very well, presential event, and he is still a beast

[@akp_6797]

It needs to be investigated honestly its very very suspicious. Furthermore F1 esports should be LAN and I think there needs to be some kind of checks within f1 esports because this kinda thing needs to be monitored.

[@marcelluspowell2069]

@Limitless How does his short shifting out of a corner play into this? For example, in the screengrab at 15:56 (and in the following screengrab of a different corner), Ronhaar is at 100% throttle before Lucas and at a lower speed, but he's also in 4th gear which would require more throttle than Lucas in 3rd gear to produce the same power. And its not simply that he "gets to 4th gear sooner" because his car is going slower than Lucas' when he's in higher gears. At the end of the Catalunya chicane, you can see he also shifts up to 5th before Jarno and at a slower speed (141 kph and Jarno is still in 4th at 145kph). Assuming he can produce the same power at 100% in the higher gear as other drivers can in a lower gear with less throttle, wouldn't he also have the additional benefit of not losing power when upshifting? On the other hand, if he can't produce the same power in the higher gear at 100%, wouldn't that be further indication that he might be cheating? TL;DR: He seems to short shift out of the corner when other drivers don't, which I would think is a significant difference in driving technique. Do think this might help explain his speed coming out of the corner or would this make him even slower and provide further evidence he's cheating?

[@teaguepot9744]

F1 games need a system similar to the old NASCAR Racing 2003 game, basically no matter how modded your game is in NASCAR 2003, the whole field will always be automatically set to the hosts game settings, from acceleration to grip to any car performance thing you can think of.

[@TrueSonOfWalhall]

The issue is that in the f1 games there isn't really that host thing where everyone joins on one server, everything is calculated on your device and results are sent to the other devices in the lobby so that they can show where you are on the track. That's why it's so easy to cheat, and it has caused issues before with drivers not seeing other drivers and crashing into them because of that, or everyone having good weather except for one driver who gets rain.

[@n.anup89]

Very well articulated video about the current happenings in the F1 esports. There could be one of the 3 reasons why Ronhaar is quicker than other: 1) He's legit fast. 2) Found some bug in the game and is exploiting it to give competitive edge over others similar to the 60fps one. 3) External means. Even if he's legit I think it baffles all of us how someone can be so faster in the slow corners and still be rocket ship on the straights. It would make sense if he's using high downforce and is quick on the slow corners but then would have higher drag and be slower on the straights which should have allowed the person following behind closer the gap.. If he's using lower downforce then how was he able to pull off a tenth or 2 in the final sector. It seems somehow Ronhaar has high downforce in slow corners and low downforce on the straights. Also the fact that sometimes he never hits the apex but still doesn't lose grounds is something to think about especially considering how quick he's able to get more minimum speed and getting on the power much quicker. You also don't often see any wheelspins, understeer/oversteer. Most of the time, the car is always planted to the track to perfection which is probably why he's getting these insane corner speeds.. It would be better for all if the next F1 Esports is held at a venue where everything in under monitor and controlled. If he's still fast and legit then props to him and F1 esports community owes him an apology. If he's not on pace in the next esports he can always say "this new game physics/gameplay doesn't suit his driving style".

[@khebazzz]

Its very weird that there is no 3rd party anti-cheat required for these kind of events

[@sopvp7719]

I think its very important to at least investigate it instead of just hoping he isnt cheating and just ignoring him entirely. If this goes on for to long other people in f1 esports are going to be using cheats because its not even investigated.

[@BeachJedi101]

You said it. The solution is so simple. LAN. They’ve been doing it for decades in MLG.

[@nahuelarocalopez6827]

Ye like the did before covid, i mean if he races in haas factory that works too bc he is getting monitorint all the time and if they know that hes cheating but doesnt say anything it hurts haas image. But he doesnt want to race from the factory bc he is more "comfortable" at home

[@ianfitzpatrick3231]

And maybe, he just learned about the "extra rotation" from a certain KZbinr... Idk who that could be Limitless..

[@SELFVERIFIED]

Really hope he is not cheating, I am rooting for him in esports

[@gumzinator]

Hope so, but the gap is too massive for that skill level.

[@SELFVERIFIED]

Let's hope he agrees to race from haas factory or somewhere else just too prove he is not cheating. Really rooting for him

[@GODxLIFTS]

well , hate to say it youre going to be dissapointed ngl

[@nahuelarocalopez6827]

@@SELFVERIFIED I mean if he does that and he still dominates then thats it, he isnt cheating, buuut, he said himself that he doesnt want to race from haas factory bc he feels more "comfortable" at home. So thats already weird not wanting to race from the factory while the other 19 drivers have no problem doing so.

[@taipizzalord4463]

@@nahuelarocalopez6827 True, tho playing on a new rig/setup will make you slower at first.

[@PPedroFernandes]

Deleting the Q1 footage is honestly the last straw for me... I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, but that just ticked me over

[@jeremysimpson-b1y]

One thing I'd love to know is why does Thomas always race in his bedroom? Even during eSports

[@0nTheBrakes]

I don't imagine Haas actually provides a facility for their drivers, they cant even hit the budget cap for F1.

[@nahuelarocalopez6827]

@@0nTheBrakes They can race from ferrari facility too btw. If im not wrong jake did race in ferrari facility when he was racing for haas. But the thing is that Ronhaar doesnt want to race from factory bc he is more "comfortable" at home and that sounds weird already

[@realalexsmith]

Great video. Clearly there is an issue, the main thing being across all the tracks, its just not how driving works. Considering you can search for cheats and find them so easily the issue should be laid at the developers. Grip hacks should be possible to detect once the car is loaded so an esports game has to take this problem on especially with the F1 branding. Its crazy its been allowed to happen like this.

[@zalanfarago2581]

Thomas did showed his wings in Q1. I saw it. I think this is why he started a new stream and deleted the first instantly.

[@bpack16]

Why should he hide his Setup F1 esport is already over in F1 22

[@Mario7746]

@@bpack16 would be easier to prove he's cheating by using the same setup. Couldn't claim the plausible deniability that he's just using a specific setup that works for him

[@MikeSavageF1]

@@bpack16 Reason for this is actually pretty simple, they can be fined for leaking their setups, so it is understandable that he deleted it. Despite that, there are too many other things that do not line up for how he's racing.

[@aaronpalmer4997]

The league needs to provide the PCs that they race on. They can then scan these PCs for cheats before races. This is what has happened with the CDL in Call of duty as they have online matches. 0% chance of hacking in that so surely its the way to go.

[@ccg20001]

No one has pointed out, the 1.015 esports grip hack, is not 0.015% as said in the video, it's a whole 1.5%!!! No wonder he can pull such a gap in every lap, as all esports drivers are easily within 1% of each other, he then has an additional artificial 1.5% gap on top.

[@kayy5290]

Another thing that wasnt mentioned here, Ronhaar refuses to race anywhere besides home. Which could be for so many reasons, but thats just another thing to at least take in. I personally think hes cheating, Hes the record holder for times at so many tracks, Runs low downforces setups and has so much grip, and is faster than f1 esports drivers in race pace. Thats just too much for me. But I dont want anything to happen with it until its proven, I live in America where people are (Or should) be innocent until proven guilty.

[@samgendler]

refusing to race anywhere that can be monitored for cheating is pretty much all the evidence that is required. There's no good reason for that objection. If you want to be a professional competitor, you have to adhere to the rules, and being subject to monitoring that would prevent cheating is the bare minimum any competitor should expect. Being unwilling to race from a common location is reason enough to disqualify him, if you ask me, and not just from events where everyone else races in a common location. You either participate in full in the league or not at all.

[@Haru_VR]

I personally believe Thomas is cheating tbh. That aside, great video, you did a good job remaining impartial and I think that is very important when it comes to videos like this. Props.

[@doubleboy2388]

If I was an eSports driver and I thought very much that one of my competitors was cheating. Especially a guy who's right up there at the top about to win it all. I would be sounding the horn. There's absolutely no reason everyone should stay mum about this. Ronhaar needs to go to a neutral site, race on a sim that everyone knows is legit and has no cheats, and prove his skills there. Either that there needs to be a very thorough investigation into his driving, just like there was here. Breaking down the analytics and get to the bottom of this. Bottomline, find out if this guy is cheating or not! It's crazy that were even having this discussion about such a prominent driver.

[@xmixdx7351]

i reckon silenced by the brand essentially, or not wanting to risk it, jarno really wants to just complain on all his socials, but is constantly shushed by his engineer

[@RahulJC]

so... as soon as jarnos face disappeared... i almost yelled yooooooooo. thanks for making these videos!

[@ViN86]

With how much money is involved in esports now, they should just issue each driver a locked down pre-built PC. The machines can be managed/updated remotely and there wouldn't even be a question as to whether a driver is legit or not. That way you don't need to wait for EA/Codemasters to fix/patch/detect anything, you just ensure that the field is running the exact same software.

[@nathansoltis9966]

I think something you also have to remember is, since he is 17, he may have tunnel vision on the rewards of winning and the attention he could get from winning. It is very easy at that age to not think about the consequences of your actions.

[@danieldorn9989]

If there is no investigation, there will be no consequences for his actions.

[@tsuniso]

I like one quote from the video about cheating in Trackmania game. Maybe there is a case. "Great players don't cheat to get a good time. They cheat to get a good time faster."

[@FerencKranicz]

but the one thing i dont understand, is ronhaar was insane at lan event too. i think its really 50/50 about the cheating.

[@JobeRacing]

Which lan event?

[@0nTheBrakes]

@@JobeRacing The esports pro exhibition that landed him his esports seat. I also watched it, and he did indeed dominate.

[@samgendler]

Being insanely good once is possible. Being insanely good on occasion is possible. Being insanely good over and over again with a consistency that defies probability is pretty questionable at this level - the other drivers at this level are too likely to have their own moments of equivalent genius which would negate his own. Deleting footage of potentially questionable laps and resisting calls to regularly race in a controlled environment would definitely add to suspicions, and we know that at least that first thing has happened.

[@willem666]

@@samgendler The other thing is, that if he wasn't insanely good at first place, cheats would put him in the mix with other pro drivers and not 0.2 above everyone else.

[@JobeRacing]

@@0nTheBrakes oh no I wasn’t disputing, I just wanted the name so I can watch it myself.

[@ericmcmanus5179]

You know that F1 esports is becoming more like real F1 when cheating is one of the most talked about discussions during a season.

[@Utube2Itube]

A bunch of people owe Thomas Ronhaar a f****** excuse

[@tobyrobertson8265]

Ronharr is guilty clear as day. Why delete your own fastest lap from the leaderboard when you’re P1? It’s so obvious and other drivers know it too!

[@MoreLibz]

Thanks for making this. 100% obvious, no doubts.

[@jackse82]

Its exactly the same as people trying to sneak cheats into the warzone pro tournament community. Loads of 'average players' call people out constantly, even people like myself get accusations / shadow bans due to bots mass reporting etc. But when other pros / people at the top of the game call you out, then you know your in trouble because its truly only that top 5% that can see very slight cheats due to knowing what is possible / information on positions etc when playing COD. Im not sure why he hasnt been made to monitor / setup cam, fresh reboot of windows, task manager check, and then straight onto a track to get the same lines / grip / lap times as he does when hes ''cheating''. Im not even an F1 player, i just see it pop up all the time, and its baffled me why its taken so long for something like this to be done to put it to bed, when someone gets called out in a tournament on COD, its there and then - Monitor check, task manager check, and sometimes a PC check, loads have been caught out. But when the bar is so high for F1 at the moment, the other pros know the limits of the car / throttle / track, and for them all to call something out, is screaming pretty obvious to me.

[@OnBrandMedia1]

Jarno said "0.15%" as well but you're both misstating it. 1.015x grip is 1.5% more - which is considerably more than .15%

[@0nTheBrakes]

I think at this level, 1.5% would make him ALOT faster than just a tenth or two. If he is cheating it must be less. I think .5% could give him this advantage.

[@samgendler]

@@0nTheBrakes Not necessarily. The extra grip will have no impact at all anywhere where the car isn't already right at the edge of grip, which is most of the track. It would only come into play in the tiny number of milliseconds at corner apexes where drivers are consistently right at the edge of grip. This is precisely why it only amounts to much of anything in the slowest corners of the track, when downforce has the least impact because it tends to vary proportional to the square of velocity. 200 milliseconds over the coarse of a lap seems very much in line with how much time cars spend at the apex of the slowest corners at most tracks.

[@UzzyT.]

You’re correct and Thomas being 1.5% slower would put him nowhere, but imagine if an extra 0.15% hack did exist and someone like Lucas or Jarno were using it, that would start becoming undetectable.

[@boudicajones6524]

I think this was a very fair and level headed spotlight on a situation that has gotten more and more well-known and controversial over the past few months.

[@kingjasko]

are there any instances of him ever racing in person (not from home)? how did he do? we could use that as comparison

[@NicoAle96]

You can see visibly from comparison video that I post on Twitter and start at 7:00 than this Haas has more grip than Mercedes. This is not even close to 0.25% more grip but more 0.50% or more. Is visibly gripper.

[@dashappi1313]

Is it true that Thomas is the only eSports driver who competes in F1 eSports from his own home, while all others compete at team facilities? Again, this would just raise even more questions as to why he is allowed to even do this when all other drivers are competing out with their own home.

[@pokeboi5438]

Do HAAS even have such a facility?

[@elvenmaiden7027]

When you ask the PSGL mods what the league plans to do about it, they just say ''oh since F1 e-sports didn't investigate or discover cheating, PSGL won't be investigating either'' which completely tanks the legitimacy of their league. They were banning and timing out like 80% of the chat during the Belgium race because they were questioning Ronhaar.

[@Dolek135]

Funnily enough, they guy you raced in China, Jernej, has been caught cheating.

[@boued]

graphics can also be included there. compare ronhaar and opmeer's graphic at 8:15 -this has also happened in Forza Horizon 5 in time trial

[@legvalmont]

I think it's suspicious. Like you said, sure, everyone is allowed to improve. That's the end goal. But the signs of cheating are quite strong. For the next eSports series, I think it should be hosted on a controlled LAN where no other equipment is allowed inside the network save from the PCs and stewards computers. Also, drivers should use standardized gear.

[@pali1H]

I've raced against some of the F1 eSports drivers in iRacing and it's hard to comprehend or explain how fast these guys are. I thought I was really fast with sim racing for 15 years but even at my best, these dudes are 3-5 tenths a lap faster, no matter the car.

[@SebuTK]

I'm sorry but in this level of play, there is no "new level" to breakthrough to. It's at the peak already and if someone is consistently that ahead is seriously questionable.

[@kiwiexotics1982]

I heard some drivers program the pit stop button to 150+ so when your coming upto a slow corner you can turn on and off your pit stop and it slows you down faster but also helps your speed out of the corner faster.

[@keonxd8918]

I found it suspicious that he's the only one that is able to do 110 Ai bots in the eSport challenge when everyone can at most do 109 or 108

[@tavishverma5396]

Mate i think you mean 110 ai whilst everyone else does 109 or 108

[@tavishverma5396]

But i agree it is hella suspicious

[@keonxd8918]

​@@tavishverma5396 yeah I mean in that order

[@Macke31]

If he is cheating - I think it's really really bad for the sport, because he's setting the standard. I can imagine that other F1 E-sports driver will follow him and then Houston - we have a BIG problem.

[@virtual_GaRy]

Wouldn't 1.015 be +1.5% not +0.015%? 0.015% I doubt it will give 0.2 seconds

[@mierenmans]

Something similar like this happened in 2017 on CS:GO Robin "Ropz" Kool. He got accused of cheating and to prove it he played a few matches on Pro League at the HQ of Faceit. Why not do this with Ronhaar aswell. Identical setup at Codemasters HQ as Ronhaar has at home and let do qualifyings on that sim. If he has the same pace at home as on a controlled setup then we know he is legit and just on another level.

[@chrinbo6938]

The effort put into this video was so good loved that you went into every detail 😉 , seems kinda sus to me

[@webrevolution.]

I am a big fan of chess also and I find this story about cheating in F1 games being as difficult to deal with as it is in chess. The same that applies for top tier esport drivers who can gain a very impressive advantage with only 0.15% more grip, also applies for top tier chess players who get the advantage of knowing if they have a dominant or a losing position (evaluation bar) during mid/late game. They don't even need that much advantage cause they are already very good at their respective game even without anything. And the same kind of thing that happened with Thomas in F1 esport scenes also applied with Hans Niemann in competitive Chess scene. They both improved at an impressive rate, so impressive that other top tier competitors have started to actually doubt the legitimacy of their progress.

[@TrplNine]

his fame was short lived bro, the truth is being revealed

[@bcolerl8915]

for having a lower downforce set up if you look at 21:59 and onwards it is insane how much cornering speed he has on Jarno who is presumably using a setup with more downforce. He has unreal exit speed as well. It looks like a Williams trying to chase down Redbull in 2023. It just isn't gonna happen.

[@ctone12]

Got a little awkward when Ronhaar hosted Jarno on twitch right after those comments 😂

[@BlueBand3]

Lol it was

[@kapa2909]

And thomas came to his chat to say gg but jarno just ignored that comment

[@WilliamWallace42]

The only reason I know who Thomas is is because of how well he's done on F1 Esports so if he wanted extra attention on his KZbin channel etc it worked.

[@shaneryan9076]

put them all back in the arena. Give them a different wheel rig every race

[@samgendler]

No, no. There's no reason why they shouldn't be allowed to race with their own control hardware any more than we force track and field athletes to all wear the same shoes. Don't give the drivers any reason to object to anti-cheating measures that are instituted, and forcing them all to use arbitrary rigs would definitely do that. There's not much cheating you can do via the controlling hardware. There's already no requirement for how much or little force feedback you use, is there, or how much play you calibrate into each control? So there's no good reason to prevent the use of any given hardware, so long as the drivers are audited and installed by the league in-advance. Plug in whatever cockpit you desire.

[@shaneryan9076]

@Samuel Gendler it's the way esports was before covid, it helps with connection issues too

[@pdxholmes]

My guess is that he’s not running some third party cheat or whatever, but he’s figured out a way to edit the setups outside the parameters the game normally allows but that it also doesn’t validate. This is probably why he’s so quick to hide any chance of his setup leaking.

[@remyga999]

I already thought about him cheating like 3months ago

[@GSSimRacing]

Thanks for highlighting this. When you put hundreds/thousands of hours into practise and setups etc, and then some guy comes along and hack the game open to cheat, it is the most disgusting and dirty thing you can do. Sometimes it's very obvious. Or guys finding stupid amounts of time in a short period of weeks/months. At a certain level it becomes easier to spot, and in esports, it's a lot easier. The guys are so closely matched that outliers are always worth investigating. Nice and detailed video man. Thanks.

[@VolkanKurtulus97]

As his steering settings he plays 340 degrees instead 300 which is quite better feeling while driving thru racing lines along with it being much more physical and completely realistic. In F1 2021 300 degrees felt 100% better than 340-360 ranges but in this game it feels like im not even steering the car(rather than 340 degrees).Even in time trial his lower downforce setups gives the difference as in turn exit speeds, better racing line, I really felt comfortable while going to the limit of the car(with lower downforce setups). As he mentioned in barcelona Q1 lower downforce thru some corners should be more punishable but its not indeed. So i'll take it. But this game actually needs anti-cheat anyways along with its own servers in multiplayer..

[@fplcraig647]

Excellent video JD. Thank you very much for keeping us informed with what is really going on behind the scenes! Keep these videos coming - I love them!

[@ZachMiles79]

a 1.015 multiplier is 1.5%

[@dazzasnipes1911]

i don't know how to do the math but does the .015% improvement of grip hack directly corelate to an .015% improvement of lap time? For example, does the Lucas Blakeley Suzuka lap time of 1:27.354 minus .015% equal the Ronhaar lap time of 1:27.174? And if so is that same pattern consistent across all the qualifying's and races mentioned in this video? just a thought.

[@rahdirigs]

Better grip correlates to better performance in slow corners. One can get on the throttle pedal much earlier and not lose balance. And as for the 0.015% improvement, every car has attributes that relate to its performance. The game engine interprets those in some way. 0.015% improvement means if the grip stat of your car is 100 it will trick the game engine into believing it is 101.5. To the naked eye might not look like much of a difference, but in esports could very much be the difference between pole and p20.

[@fishymaxim]

Every beginning of limitless his video sounds like mosquito am i right?😂

[@JDisLimitless]

Yup 😋

[@hansvanoosterwijck5969]

Wait i'm not listening to a mosquito ?

[@fzlgod]

today at WOR Abu Dhabi I noticed that he turns into corners always at the same speed, almost like a pit speed limiter... that robotic consistency doesn't exist tbh. 5k+ iRacing driver here btw