Is ULTRALIGHT Backpacking Gear IRRELEVENT in the UK?

Is ultralight backpacking gear relevant in the UK? I'm not convinced it is. In the UK we do not have any ultra long distance hiking trails apart from Lands End to John O' Groats which isn't really a hiking trail. Most of the 'Ways' are sub-200 miles and can be completed within a couple of weeks. Furthermore, the weather in the UK often makes hiking and wild camping challenging, even in summer.
Officially Ultralight Backpacking is a base weight of under 10lbs (4.5kg), lightweight backpacking is under 20lbs (9kg) and standard backpacking is 30lbs (13.5kg). In the UK it doesn't mean a great deal to most people, but in North America is can mean EVERYTHING (to a gram-counting ultralighter!).
Backpacking Base Weight is how much your loaded pack weighs, minus consumables, such as food, water and fuel. Going 'ultralight' is not just about weight though, it's about going minimalist too. However, I think it's the same argument. Do you really need to go minimalist, but equally, do we carry far too many luxuries?
For winter camping, I wouldn't ever expect anyone to go backpacking with a sub-10lbs backpack so when I'm talking about ultralight backpacking gear in winter I'm referring to the extreme lightweight side of winter camping gear.
In a recent poll, 60% go wild camping within a short hiking distance from their homes and cars (5 miles max.). 75% fall under 10 miles which leave 25% who hike over 10 miles on average to reach their wild camping locations. Do we really need ultralight backpacking gear?
Furthermore, in another recent pole, only 40% have completed a long-distance multi-day hike. This shows there is a need for lightweight backpacking gear but I'm still not convinced about ultralight backpacking gear.
I'd love to know your thoughts on this, so feel free to comment because I don't believe there is a correct answer.
Personally, I think ultralight backpacking gear is irrelevant in the UK. However, I do believe there is a place of lightweight backpacking gear. For most though, standard weight backpacking gear is perfectly suitable for the types of backpacking trips we do and the climate we have.
If you are into your hiking, backpacking and wild camping please SUBSCRIBE @BackpackingUK
Thanks, Andy.
#ultralightbackpacking #wildcamping #backpackinggear

[@WainwrightWalksWiaLocalLad]

Been backpacking multi day trip's for over 50 years now... ultra light all the way for the last 25 years now. I camp to hike... not hike to camp... there's a difference. Ultralight enables me to hike consecutive 25/30mile days. Don't be sucked into taking your home camping!

[@Silas-lf4cc]

Say this when your gear fails you because it's too flimsy

[@WainwrightWalksWiaLocalLad]

@@Silas-lf4cc hi silas... over 50 years backpacking experience in all seasons in many countries and mountain ranges over 4000m tends to teach you to be a better judge of weather conditions than any amount of KZbin shite! Never had a shelter fail me yet... What experience of using shelters in adverse conditions do you have? I'd be interested to hear where you gained your knowledge on the subject (if it's only 1 night "wild" camping on Bamford Edge don't bother).

[@RogerHyam]

What would the base weight of your pack be for a multi-day hike in Scotland in April?

[@WainwrightWalksWiaLocalLad]

@@RogerHyam April is a tricky one Roger, last time I backpacked at this time of year I carried just over 7kg. + Food, Water, Micro spikes and Ice Axe (both of which I used). Some years you can get away with out any spikey stuff in April... depends on where you're going/doing!

[@RogerHyam]

@@WainwrightWalksWiaLocalLad Can you break that down? How is it split between bag, mat, tent, pack and dry clothes for sleeping?

[@jason-lees]

I'm still waiting for the ultralight beer - that would definitely help my pack weight! 🍻

[@bcamping1]

Take a strong beer and dilute with pond water.

[@oscartravis5740]

A wrap of beer crystals 😂

[@nathanielrose30]

Gordon’s do an ultralight beer

[@anguscowie6043]

Its branded whisky!? 😂

[@hackerblubb]

there's a german brewery that does instant beer powder now... sadly it's free of alcohol so far :(

[@shabingly]

Honestly, I'm surprised that people are under the misguided impression a solid inner is somehow magically going to make them feel balmy & temperate inside a tent in -10°c ambient. It'll add a couple of degrees at best. However, each to their own. Most people doing multi-day backpacking trips aren't pitching on summits in 50mph sustained winds on purpose. Seems like most wildcampers do, at least on KZbin. And plenty of people all over the world do in fact use single wall & mesh inners in wintering harsher conditions than ours, they're just not bonkers enough to pitch on said summit in said conditions.

[@BackpackingUK]

If you've got solid mesh but a higher fly you're still going to freeze if there's a bitter wind. You really need a low fly. If it's calm and still (rarely in the UK) I agree the difference is much, much lower.

[@shabingly]

@@BackpackingUK agreed, one of the benefits of a trekking pole tent: you can change the pitch height.

[@ianmacfarlane9454]

Well said👍👍

[@harduphiker]

"Seems like most wildcampers do, at least on KZbin." - this wildcamper doesn't! I also don't setup when it's light, and keep really quiet and try not to get spotted. I have seen it though, I find it strange, but those folks usually have the car a few miles away....whereas I am through-hiking and using public transport so haven't got a convenient 'escape' option, if it goes wrong I am totally effed. So I tend to be wary of showing off with exposed places unless it's absolutely the only place and it's dark. Agree party about solid vs mesh, but in a wood you'd be fine. It's exposed conditions that's a problem, had that in my recent video. Sadly I can't afford a Hilleberg or whatever 'storm proof' tent is the gold standard nowadays. So I got cold.

[@LisaTheWanderingGeordie]

Its absolutely relevant to me. It has nothing to do with doing 100m hike or 2000m hike. I buy some items that are classed as ultra lightweight eg XMid Pro 1 and love that tent, ive also got the XMid solid and used that all winter.... Im planning on cape wrath in April, without the likes of the Xmid Pro, Quilt and mat and cooking system etc id not manage to do it and id hate it so why on earth would i want to suffer to the point id stop doing what i love if i can replace a lot of my gear with ultra lightweight items. I am more than aware the cost is mental, but that is the cost, so i work every bit of overtime i can to fund it. So apart for backpacks as they are not good for me, im super grateful for the lightweight gear on offer

[@Phil.Oakley]

I definitely don't ultralight but I have been swapping my gear for lighter things like using titanium pots and down bags from synthetic. Smaller lightweight table and better water filter. I can adjust my gear depending on the distance. If a few miles ill gladly carry more like chairs and beers 😊

[@BackpackingUK]

Same, I've been swapping out some items for lighter ones. Not going overboard, but I've been more weight conscious.

[@dontgooutdoorproductions2574]

From UK here and do everything from overnight trips/car camping up to 2-3week long hiking trails. For me starting out when I didn’t have the money or the experience and there was no choice, I had to carry 16-20kg packs and it never stopped me once from getting out or having a really good time outdoors Saying that eventually with money and a lot of experience/testing I was eventually able to get a base weight of 5.2kgs while still having far more UK storm worthy/comfortable equipment in every sense of the word then my old 16-20kg setups and I have to say it changed everything. The freedom to go further and faster for less energy is also the freedom to go slower and take your time whenever you feel like it, have your mind more at ease when weather gets rough. You can carry and cook more fresher food, get that good sleep with super comfy airbed/pillow/down bag combo and be more immersed in just traveling through a landscape without a heavy load on your back! and those same benefits work no matter how long your trip is. Although UK conditions are quite unique and most ultralight gear from USA just doesn’t cut it in the here, I think too many people assume that means all ultralight doesn’t work or is not durable enough which is definitely not the case! There’s definitely a time and a place for heavy and cheap gear and everything in-between.........

[@harduphiker]

"all ultralight doesn’t work or is not durable enough which is definitely not the case! " Would I trist my Lanshan 2 in 50mph winds? Dunno, but I've camped in 20-30mph and it was fine. And it might be fine in those winds....I take my Delta anchors just in case! I suspect it would survive...as long as you keep it low and peg the doors - which is why I don't ultralight the pegs and take extra! But yes, light does not mean not durable....

[@dontgooutdoorproductions2574]

​@@harduphiker The lanshan tents are actually really good for the money! a few of my friends have them! they kinda not that durable stormworthy or ultralight and tend to be made from lower quality/strength materials but if you mostly camp summertime and are prepared to bail if weather gets really bad or find a sheltered spot then they are actually not a bad option. An example of something ultralight yet still durable and storm worthy enough would be a MLD trailstar in DCF. You can get a shelter and very small inner tent combo that weights around 600g together then add about 150g of stakes and you got yourself a 750g setup that’s in the same league as a hilleberg soulu in 70mph+ stormy windy weather, but again a heavy cost in money and the learning curve to use one in those conditions! I’d be careful using the delta anchors they are good but I’ve had them consistently fail during a storm in soft wet ground high up in the breacon beacons, they violently pulled out taking a massive chunk of the ground with them! setting up multiple lighter stakes attached to each other was far more secure and packable/lightweight or even just one deeper solid stake like an msr cyclone if you can get it in! kzbin.info/www/bejne/nHy7o3WaoMuLlbs see outdoors inspiration "Tent Pegs & Stakes" video on this technique(double/triple staking) its a game changer for ultralight yet ultra-strong anchor points ^^^ light weight doesn’t tend to mean more durable your right, but if you are able to spend the money and the time to learn you may be very surprised at what some ultralight gear is capable of!

[@underdgk9]

I see US gear in the UK all over. MLD Trailstar tarps, MLD Cricket tarps, MLD Mids. MLD packs, thermarest Neoair pads, quilts, etc. The MLD TENT/TARPS definitely can handle the wind, and are cheaper than most robust tents.

[@dontgooutdoorproductions2574]

​@@underdgk9 Your right and It was a mistake to say most ultralight US gear doesn’t cut it! I should have said some of the most popular ultralight shelters in the US like z-packs/big agnes etc that are not so well suited to UK conditions The main point still stands though, You can get ultralight gear suitable for extremely rough UK weather but its gonna cost a fortune and have a steep learning curve to use......

[@harduphiker]

@@dontgooutdoorproductions2574 yes I was fairly sheltered and found one of the Delta anchors pulled out! Luckily I tied the tent to some trees. I have heard of double/triple staking - or having more guy lines, not done it yet.

[@rickay5363]

I'd rather hike 5 miles, 10 miles, or whatever distance, with as light a pack as possible. I don't camp on mountaintops in high winds or storms, I camp in valleys. And I've camped in snow and rain this winter in my X mid 2p with no issue at all. I think a true fourth season tent like a Hilleberg or Nortent is warranted if you are specifically planning to be out on open hillsides or peaks, but if you know you're not packing those kind of shelters then you pick a site that's appropriate. Your warmth doesn't come from the shelter, essentially what you need it to be is waterproof and able to stay stood up. If your tent can't do that then you shouldn't be out in it whatever the weather. I saw a guy up on Kinder with a bivvy and tarp in the snow. He was happy as Larry.

[@BackpackingUK]

Thanks for sharing 👍

[@TheRst2001]

I have a good solid 4 season tent with winter inner and that adds a good 5celcius to the tent temp compared to outside . That is quite a difference , because I trust the tent I can compromise on a lighter sleeping bag if I was struggling with pack size and stuff

[@Im_With_Stupid]

Well, I don't live in the UK so I won't pretend to speak for anyone who does, but here's my position on ultralighting in the US: It's irrelevant beyond a fashion trend largely driven by brands and social media talking heads. If someone wants to do it, fine, I don't begrudge them. I guess it has an appeal because it is fun to see just how light you can get your pack and you *should* be smart about how much your gear weighs, but it's gotten to the point now where a lot of people believe that if you don't shed every single nonessential gram you're doing it wrong. I mean, I know people who actually cut the tags off their gear to shed weight. It's absurd! Meanwhile, my 13 year old is skipping through the forest with 35lbs on her back and she'll go until you say stop.

[@BackpackingUK]

The same applies to road cycling. Gram counting takes over their lives 🤯 I also think it takes the fun out of it too and it becomes more of a competition. Who’s got the lightest…

[@Fellmandave1]

Where do you get those load carrying 13year olds? Mine have always kicked off with 10lbs!

[@Im_With_Stupid]

The Slovak highlands. Those Gorale genes make them strong.

[@easternmenace]

@@Im_With_Stupid Have you seen Decathlon clothes tags? Because they are international they have to attach a dictionary to their clothes haha. I cut those off too but it's not just for weight, they dry slower after washing the clothes and also can be uncomfortable when wearing.

[@Im_With_Stupid]

@@easternmenace I haven't seen the Decathlon ones, but I can imagine. I have a Rab jacket that has like 3 tags all sewn in the same spot. Fortunately, it's down low on the side, so there's no risk of it sawing through my neck.

[@user-vd7ej4cw9z]

Austrian, 64, love 6-8 days hiking, no huts, offen no paths, in my Mountains, in difficult terrain, ultraleight is a matter of security, but in general, you are absolutely right, thanks

[@S1.1981]

I think you’ve got it mixed up a bit. Ultralight doesn’t necessarily mean all ultralight gear, it’s more a mindset of taking the minimum of what you need. Making the most out of a minimalist setup. Streamlining your kit. Some “wildcampers” are taking the whole house with them…Bluetooth speakers, lights and 6 cans of beer. If you can get your base weight down you can travel further with less strain and it’s more enjoyable. Less likely to injure yourself also.

[@BackpackingUK]

Sometimes it's hard to put what's in my head into a video and this is a classic case. But yes, I 100% agree it's more of a mindset, and the same argument applies.

[@S1.1981]

@@BackpackingUK I understand but I think most hikers/campers eventually streamline their gear in the hope of saving weight. But yes shaving your toothbrush and replacing the metal zippers on your tent in a bid to save 50grams doesn’t make sense. There was a good thread on Reddit the other day about losing excess body weight and/or getting fitter as opposed to losing pack weight. Which makes more sense to me.

[@KeirMurphy]

You'd say that, but there's some really "militant" ultralighters who will argue about every gram.

[@RogerHyam]

I think ultralight does have a strict definition in some quarters. It is under 10lb (or 5kg) as a base weight. Not feasible in cold/wet weather.

[@S1.1981]

@@RogerHyam agreed. However packing minimal and streamlined can’t be a bad thing surely.

[@harduphiker]

Also I am far from a ultralight devotee - I've traded down from titanium cups as they are dreadful for cooking - but I do think another aspect with wild camping in the UK is not looking like you're going to camp. Ultralight gear helps you be more stealthy, especially for overnights, you could pack what looks like a daypack with all your stuff, doesn't sound the alarm to the locals. And yes, they do totally monitor this. Whereas if I rock up with my old 100L bergen or 80L to carry the bigger tents, I totally stick out.

[@KNURKonesur]

I'd still argue it's very relevant, we do a lot of bikepacking in Scotland, quite often we cycle to one place and then leave the bikes in a safe spot to hike from there, often it's several days of cycling, trails of around 200-300 miles, so the weight of the setup makes a massive difference. When we go out hiking properly, that's usually 3-4 days, 10-15 miles per day, so one thing is weight, the other is volume, with Scotland being quite windy, being able to use a smaller backpack means less struggle.

[@chrisbardell]

Agree. Definitely relevant for bikepacking on gravel or mountain bikes with less gear space and weight carrying available (tail-packs, frame bags, fork bags). Less relevant for more trad cycle touring like I do (primarily on road with panniers and strapping stuff on top of rear rack). But yes, big $$$ penalty for ultra lightweight.

[@BackpackingUK]

Absolutely in your case, this is the exact sort of discussion I'd like to see.

[@anguscowie6043]

My bikepacking setup under 10kg for scotland....sweet spot for me....i think thats rideable up most hills in a 13kg hardtail

[@benhikescamps]

A good video Andy. I started long-distance hiking last year and did the 100-mile South Downs Way. For that I used lightweight gear and a average weight tent. I think it's all about balance between what you can afford and the conditions you're likely to encounter. I took a lightweight sleeping bag and ended up buying a bag liner en route to stop me from getting cold! Conversely, hiking 15-20 miles a day for a week or so can take its toll and so lighter packs do, I believe, make a difference and make the whole experience more pleasurable. On the other hand, I think we all need to spend within our means and then just get out there and hike. That's what people did 40, 50 years ago: just packed a rucksack and took off! I think we can get tied up in knots over weight and gear and brands. It's all about balance in my view. Great video topic! Thanks - Ben

[@jontron380]

Well done Andy on raising this question, I see from the number of comments it is a popular subject! Like most hobbies back packing can suck you into buying gear you don't necessarily need but want. I have certainly fallen foul of this in the past. I think in hindsight the most important aspect is to gain experience in what you do, be it overnight or multi day trips. Use different equipment types and try to dial in your kit to what suits you for that particular trip. This will help you gain the confidence you need in the kit you have chosen. Look towards the well travelled amongst the community, and you will find a variable approach based on conditions, time of year, trip distance and a host of other variables. Take only what you need to be safe and comfortable and question everything you pack, can I do without it, if not can I make it lighter/ less bulky this is what I ask of everything in my pack. Thanks for your content.

[@andrewblackledge6616]

really interesting point, the ultralight stuff definitely gets pushed as the be all and end all so its actually quite refreshing to hear someone like yourself pushing back on it's relevance a little. Keep up the good work 👍👍

[@Chilternwildcamper]

I do overnights and carry a 4 season tent as I found 3 season mesh type tents so draughty! its the cold wind and rain that we have in the UK, especially in the hills where we tend to wildcamp.

[@Happyhiker58]

I do multi day backpacking/ wild camping. during the winter i carry around 16kg in total but during the "summer" i do like to shed about 6kg of that because it's just more comfortable to carry lighter in the warmer months 😊

[@BackpackingUK]

I’m pretty much the same as you 👍

[@bernardscott1783]

Great topic mate, winter is about 15-16 kgs as it’s my hobby and like to eat well and wear what I want if it’s cold,wet etc and walk roughly 2 hours to a camp.

[@BackpackingUK]

Nothing wrong with that at all, and I bet you speak for the majority too!

[@sprokthered]

Nice video and well put Proper robust, quality kit everytime for me. British weather can bite you at times even when you’ve prepared thoroughly and your gear is your only protection. Pack light - cold at night !

[@matthewcollis6259]

Interesting subject Andy - I think half the battle here is that we always seem to want to apply labels to what we do ie 'Ultralight' '4 season' etc. I don't want to be branded as any type of walker/camper. I take the best gear relevant to what I have planned to do. I'm not into summit camping in high winds - it's too noisy for me, I would rather be lower down somewhere more sheltered - and that means I don't need a bomb proof tent. A lot of my kit is old school and i've had it since I started camping 30+ years ago - hence not exactly lightweight!! But I have bought lighter tents recently as i'm just not as fit or light as I used to be :) I find (personally) that a decent 3 season tent is enough for anything I want to do all year round, you can insulate yourself against the cold, and I don't want to pitch anywhere massively exposed (seems daft to me) horses for courses though and each to their own. Do what brings you joy!

[@raymondwright8963]

Hi Andy - two years ago retired and started backpacking, I initially kitted myself out with Go Outdoors type gear and carried 16kg (including food) on the Cleveland Way and found it really hard work and injured my feet. I have gradually purchased lightweight gear including a DCF tent and now carry 10kg which I easily manage. 10kg isn’t ultralight but if it wasn’t for the ultralight components; pack, sleep system, tent and stove etc I wouldn’t have been able to lighten my pack and enjoy my multi-day backpacking as much. Hats off to stronger people who can carry heavier loads.

[@pootlingalong8928]

You have touched on an important point. I’m near pension age in UK. I’m a small female. I’ll go backpacking forever strolling along gently on a ten or so mile day with a 7 - 8kg pack. Ask me to do 20 mile days with a 15 - 20kg pack and you’d kill my love of backpacking. Each to his own, but lightweight and easy miles are my love.

[@charles-mr4oz]

A good topic to consider. I did three days on the Cambrian way in November. In that terrain the weight that I was carrying was very important. My tent was too heavy so even being careful with everything else my pack weighed in at 18kg. I want to do more remote sections which will require carrying more food but I will have to think very carefully about how to keep that pack weight down. I have bought a much smaller, quite robust, mid range tent now which will save a coupe of kilos I think. I will miss the space though.

[@IvanDP1967]

Although I don't backpack, I do think about weight as most of my solo camping trips are in my little lightweight sportscar and the last thing I want is 30-40kg in the boot while I'm blasting around the back roads. I don't have to go ultralight, but I do consider weight an important factor. I also want everything packed in 1 bag too for convenience. Current set up (not including food and drink) is normally between 12-15kg depending on what I take with me. Although for a sneaky overnighter I can get that down to about 10kg by just taking the bare essentials.

[@jackmccann7147]

Getting a bit older now so, for me, lighter is better. The knees appreciate it but I'd still take my 4 season tent between Nov - March. I don't tend to do short day hikes so will grab any potential benefits I can. Scotland can be unforgiving at the best of times. I'll be interested in your other comments. Still looking for a viable, and stormworthy, 3 season for the Cape Wrath. Definitely down the rabbit hole. Take care mate.

[@BackpackingUK]

Absolutely, I’d still highly recommend lighter gear to anyone with niggles. My knees started playing up last year hence why I started to look for some lighter weight options.

[@anguscowie6043]

I only do a.couple of days hike usually over a weekend...but try to keep the pack under 10kg...that said, i always take a double skin dome tent, as like the strength and support the poles provide, and additional space to sit up inside to change while it rains... most of the year i have a 3 season bag and mat, as Scottish summers can still be cold!

[@brianinnes3778]

I've been pondering this exact thing as I've given myself a wee budget for new gear. I do all my hiking in Scotland and some of these tents would rip in 2 with 1 gust of wind at high elevations especially with no shelter from trees ect. I agree that lightweight is a good investment especially if you summit camp or put the miles in but you could easily walk across this island with lightweight gear that's durable and in the end you'd be more comfortable with the piece of mind knowing that if the wind gets up during the night or a constant week long rain forecast comes in you will still be sound

[@deangoodall]

As usual with wild camping equipment, it is a personal thing in terms of how uncomfortable/tolerant you can be. I think to judge the relevance of UL gear by the country/region where it is being used is irrelevant. When I began wild camping I would hike 8-12 miles at most carrying 14-17kg. Now approaching 55 years of age, my body is not as it was, with squeaks, cracks and popping noises providing a soundtrack to my walks. So still wanting to enjoy a good walk to camp, UL gear has reduced my winter backpack weight to just under 11kg, (one night food and 2.5L water).

[@ashfanman]

I only camp as part of longer hikes (two days, 25 miles minimum, lots of elevation) and find weight matters a lot. I don’t cut my toothbrush in half, but I do try to choose lighter options where I can, so long as they don’t compromise on performance. I recently changed my trowel from a heavy metal folding one to one of those lightweight numbers and saved 100g. That’s obviously not noticeable in isolation, but do that across your gear and it makes a huge difference overall. That said, I wonder if I also feel it more than most because I’m 6’6, so packs are never quite long enough (I have an Osprey Atmos 65 in XL), which means my back does end up hurting lugging much more than 13kg over long distances.

[@davidhale1568]

That’s a good question and you are broadly correct unless infirmity or planning to walk at least two hundred miles without a food re supply is a factor. I have done a few long routes in the US, Australia, NZ and parts of Europe they all require a different approach as to gear. I guess some guys priority is carrying beer up a mountain rather than light weight whisky and will prioritise a scimpy tent! I’m guessing that everyone knows that the UK has more tornadoes than the US as a whole. None of my tents are less than 1200grams or heavier than 2.8kg

[@dylanreeve49]

I do most of my hiking on Dartmoor. I used to carry heavy stuff about with me but now prefer using my 35L back pack. As long as I can fit some decent food to cook and beers + whiskey I go as light as possible. If I wanted a good nights sleep I’d stay in a hotel. My friends I go with do tend to take more what you described as light gear over my ultralight set up though. Personal preference I suppose. I usually bivy so this helps enormously with my pack size, it’s fine as long as you don’t mind waking up with frost all over the foot end in winter

[@rodoutdoors]

I'm in California and mostly do overnight trips. But I'll hike from 8-10 miles day with thousands of feet of elevation gain. So going light in any way helps. There's also a balance with comfort since most of time I just like to chill. So it depends. Overall it helps my joints as I get older. It'll keep me getting out there since my pack weight will eventually get lower and lower. It really depends on what you're prioritizing. Comfort while hiking, or comfort while camping. Thru-hikers most likely will choose the former, but for weekend warriors, it's wide open. One example for Winter camping.. for my last trip I checked the weather and it forecast it wasn't going to get below 4 deg Celcius overnight. So instead of bringing the bulky puffy, extra liners, and hoody, I just used the 3.4 oz Polartech Alpha Direct midlayer fleece and hard shell jacket to keep me warm. If I go light in some areas, it allows me to bring more luxury items like a fishing pole or musical instrument.

[@BackpackingUK]

Absolutely, finding the right balance for you is the most important thing.

[@UnkemptBushell]

I have only wild camped when on a long-distance walk, so there's a sweet spot for me. I like to be light enough that I can move reasonably quickly, but I'm not one of those that will sacrifice a pillow, proper sleeping mat or tent that I trust to withstand winds for the sake of getting ultra-ultra light weights.

[@smellyoldsock1553]

My biggest weight saving options were to leave the Osprey UnLtd Airscape 68 (regret the purchase) at home for the Exos Pro 55 backpack and to ditch my Rab sleeping bag for an equivalently rated quilt, the -12 EE Revelation. My current tents are at different ends of the weight scale, the Black Diamond 3P Mission, Rab Ridge Raider and the Durston X-Mid 2 Solid. Winter camping has a greater appeal to me, so I'm looking at a compromise tent. The Kuiu Storm Star 2 I think balances great performance with price compared to the Hillebergs of this world. The rest of my kit is as light as can reasonably be expected. I definitely don't go counting double or single digit grams.

[@carletonlong3374]

I think generally you are correct but for me on the SWCP ultralight is the way to go with the constant elevation gains and losses keeping weight to a minimum in my opinion is a priority, but I wouldn’t walk it in the winter.

[@carlrichards5250]

I think you’re right Andy. As a kid who grew up in Sydney we used to go to the blue mountains with basic gear like $20 sleeping bags. We were fine! In the U.K. I tried a lightweight down bag (rated to 2 degrees) and tent with lightweight mesh inner and was cold and damp in the morning. The U.K. weather is different and needs stouter gear.

[@life-outdoors]

I'm mid 50s and my feet limit me to around 15 miles per day. It doesn't really matter with the weight, i have the fitness and strength for multi days. I do try and go for lighter and especially more packable kit, such as down bags. I'll also take stuff i don't really need, like a table. The comfort isn't just the carrying, its when you pitch up, i want that to be comfortable. Ultra light is about making do, I'm passed that, I want comfort now.

[@BackpackingUK]

100%, comfort has many meanings. A comfortable hike can lead to an uncomfortable camp and vice-versa. The trick is to find the best of both 😁

[@LOCKEYJ]

It’s very easy to pack light in winter. I use a dd pyramid and mesh tent. Amazingly light and compact and good all year round. In winter I use exactly the same kit as I do in summer, I just throw in an extra bivvy

[@AndyZ-hz7oh]

‘Need’ versus ‘want’. I have some ultralight gear bought for multi-week long hikes in Scotland and through Wales. I certainly benefited from it as carrying 5 days of food plus water was a weight that could not be avoided and carrying more than 15kg for multiple days while trying to cover 40km per day over very rough ground gets to be a grind rather a pleasure. Upside of ultralight is my total pack weight stayed at around 15kg fully loaded (carrying kit suitable for early Spring), downside is that the ultralight gear starts wearing out fairly quick which is expected because of the materials used. Do I use ultralight kit all the time? No. I prefer my standard gear. I use suitable kit for the weather conditions and ground I’ll be covering, take into account the duration of daylight and plan my trip accordingly. Most importantly I think about what I want to achieve on the trip, consider my own limitations, what is reasonable and enjoyable. Nice video and good food for thought. At this time of year I’m looking at new kit and ultralight is a good excuse/temptation to spend big money! Perhaps I’ve scratched that itch. Finally, should you buy second hand ultralight gear? IMO If it’s used, definitely not as it may well fail on your next trip

[@Fellmandave1]

It's a good debate Andy, with space though there is a sweet spot between space and how cold a tent is as we 'self heat' the tent. So too much space is just cold. I agree with the use of mesh inners in the winter though, overrated! Having said that, I have a series on lightweight hot tent camping as you need a lot of kit to heat a tent, so the more you can save weight the better. In the end though, each to their own, if they're having fun reducing weight, then great. In my latest video, out today, I am carrying around 17kg, but my friend is skipping along with 28 litre and 7 kg! We both were happy!

[@ilikethischannel5719]

Took out my brand new £400 copper spur Big Agnus tent for the first time a few days ago, buckle and zip broke on the first pitch, weighs about 1.3 kg, my decathlon £30 tent weighs about 2.4kg, had it out on wind gusts of around 70 mpg, it was rock solid and has never let me down, I always guy line it really well and tension things nice and tight. So its a tricky one, I think testing where it is safe first is so important, just bought the cloud up 2 that's 1.7 kg with the ground sheet and about 1.5kg without, looking forward to testing it, if it holds up and I have confidence in it, the saving of 1kg bellow my decathlon tent to me is quite a lot, combining with other weight savings by using down sleeping bag and X therm sleeping mat which I find keeps me much warmer in the cold, these little weight savings can really add up and make a big difference, all the best to you Andy. Thanks for your always clean content, which never has bad language in it, I really appreciate that!

[@shahids3055]

Hi Andy, personally I am not too worried about using ultra light gear over here in the UK, as I don't need it. As you mentioned this is more relevant to ultra light American hikers who are going long distance and have great warm weather conditions. I do wish sometimes that we had a similar climate as the Americans do, as I would love to test out some ultra light gear, If I could afford it. Over here in UK though, I am happy with a light pack weight, however a couple of things I never compromise on are the shelter, the pad, and the sleeping bag. As long as it is sturdy, weighs under 2kg, preferably around 1.6kg to 1.8kg and pad is around 700 grams, with a decent down bag, I am very happy. The other factor as you mentioned is the changing weather conditions we are experiencing here in UK in recent years. I can't see this getting better, I think we will continue to see worsening conditions each year, so just makes sense to gear up for it. Thanks for the video, very interesting stuff : )

[@BackpackingUK]

I think our weather is the biggest factor for not going ultralight. The nights can still be really cold even in the middle of summer with wind and rain too. It's crazy!

[@oscartravis5740]

Really interesting topic and so on point. I went with a group on the West Highland Way some years back and we took way too much cheap, heavy gear, carried it most of the way before we discovered the pack-mule vans, and it was a painful and depressing slog. Ultralight gear would've made a massive difference. I also motorcycle camp and weigh my gear for an even distribution in each side pannier. The only thing I obsess over the weight of is my tent and always go for a sub 2kg one

[@wad6216]

Middle ground for me seems best as I don't go in the middle of winter I don't see the point in being in a tent from 4pm in the dark in a tent. I will go in March up until October so I find my Durston X mid 2 tent will do me on my own, me and my dog, or me and my girl friend and dog all together, I have the mesh inner Durston but that is fine as the outer goes far down to the floor unlike my old Lanshan 2 that had a massive gap and let draughts in and was very cold even spring and autumn. The tent is light enough for all scenarios for me and I have had it in a couple of ridiculous storms and bad weather so have a lot of confidence in it. Back packs I don't care on the weight its about fit an comfort, I would take a pack that weighs 500 grams more, that fitted great and had lots of features and carried extra weight better. I have tried many packs and the ultralight ones are not comfy for me at 15kg and also sometimes on week trips with my dog the weight can hit 20KG! so they are just no good for my needs. I would try to get a pack no heavier than 2kg but get one that is really comfy with a comfortable carry weight up to 20kg. A tent around 1.5kg for a sturdy two man and sleep pad I would rather have a nice large one that is comfy and pillow but still trying to keep an eye on the weight. I'd choose a large, square shaped Big Agnes Rapide SL all day over a mummy shaped Thermarest Neo air for example 200 grams in weight extra or so and also a big pillow like the Exped REM or Exped Mega pillow over some half sized sea to summit at 100 grams lighter, I prefer a quilt over a sleeping bag but wouldn't go too ultralight on that again as I'm a big guy I don't want a too narrow and not long enough quilt to save 200 grams and have it riding up my feet and back all night and getting draughts and tying to pull it over me all the time etc. Also cook kits I'd rather have a Jetboil Minimo which isn't light, but not heavy either, but can cook anything and also really good on fuel consumption and wind protection. The alternative is carrying meths and little titanium pots to boil one cup of water and be worrying about the wind all the time cooking and not being able to do anything just boil a cup of water for one person! I use it for fishing, multi day hikes, single day hikes and it can be used for two people! again Titanium pots, alcohol burners, wind shields might save a couple of hundred grams for something that is a one trick pony

[@NathanAtton]

I've only got 1 lot of kit that I use due to funds and when I pack everything I'm carrying around 15kg including food and water. I did scafell pike and camped at sprinkling tarn not long back and was fine with the weight

[@BackpackingUK]

There isn’t much I can’t do with 15kg on my back and I’m a smaller person. Is it a mindset thing? When I say a forget about the weight after 10 minutes I genuinely mean it.

[@NathanAtton]

@BackpackingUK yeah I guess it is, doesn't take long to get used to carrying it, I suppose it might be a different story if the pack doesn't have a waist and chest bands because I presume that makes it 1000% better for me personally.

[@davt8615]

Just go middle of the range, wild country or a propa terra nova if budget suits! A use a osprey kestrel 48, lovely bag that is ❤, Your always on point bro, honestly pack for your plans, my mate nearly died up at scafell, so unavoidable bro

[@jeremymanning2132]

Hi there. I'm a dinosaur who's been hiking/wild camping since 1970. Before the age of social media and online shopping, wild camping was pure and only those of us who loved the outdoors did it. We carried the few items of kit we could get hold of locally and most of it was bulky and heavy, canvas tents and rucksacks etc. However we would compensate by only carrying the absolutely essential items. Today there is such an array of equipment and gadgets that some people become obsessed with it and must have it, yet in reality is not at all necessary. Ultralight gear does have a place for some but in reality a lot of those who buy ultralight do it to reduce weight to allow them to carry electronics like ipads, action cameras, phones and powerbanks etc. Oh and things like electric pumps for their sleep pads. I did chuckle when i saw you talking about that. Someone who walks miles with a fairly heavy backpack then needs a pump to inflate a little mattress??? What are the men of today becoming...😆😆👍

[@pauledwards499]

The best weight saver is a water filter , also a lightweight stove for boiling and cooking. People can be obsessed with weight saving, often compromising comfort and enjoyment. I once worked with a bloke who would buy a new toothbrush then snap it in half to save weight in his pack, then fill a 2 litre bottle with water and carry that. Filter water if you can then boil it if necessary, get fit and let your fitness compensate, also learn how to pack your rucksack and adjust it properly to fit you, you'll be surprised...

[@st1ffee]

This is so obvious i dont know why i havent thought about this.I believe your absolutely right.i dont go ultralight i have the x mid 1 winter tent ,Terra nova pioneer,lanshan 1 plus and Alpkit tarpstar.Also some tarps.I use a bike sometimes and occasionally my e bike so weight is no issue on the e bike.

[@greyhikes5236]

I've hiked a lot of the long distance routes in the UK, longest was 14 days straight. I use the same kit for all of them only difference is the amount of food and water I carry. My pack for the CWT was 22kg lowest I've had is about 18kg. As I get closer to 60 I will probably start looking at lighter kit just to allow me to do what I love. Your absolutely correct on the storms, you may want to look into how the media is manipulating us slightly for clicks. This week snow storm isn't happening but we were told last week it was a winter blast? 🤔

[@swithuncrowe]

You're not wrong in saying that ultralight gear isn't necessary in Britain. But when the weather allows, one can go a lot further in 3 days with UL gear that with traditional stuff. For example, I hope to do Hadrian's Wall in 3 days with a 5kg 20l running vest pack in May. With heavier gear, I would struggle to do that, and the wear and tear on my body would be greater. And I can use the same kit for 3 weeks in Romania in the summer. My compromise is to not go hiking in winter, rather than have different kit for different seasons. There is a limit to how far one can go in Britain, but not to how fast one can go.

[@vladd.i]

ultralight backpacking gear is always better GIVEN that it meets the minimum necessary bar for weather protection you're seeking on a given trip. for example, if you're going hiking in a place like Norway where there is reasonably close access to safe & dry mountain huts in case a storm rolls in, I see absolutely no reason to haul a Hilleberg Soulo and would prefer a sub-900 g ultralight tent. on the other hand, if you're venturing out in the area where there is no alternative shelter, the bar gets progressively higher and you need to make sure that whatever you're carrying is going to stand up to the weather. that said, I still went with the nearly-ultralight Tarptent Scarp Ultra (1.2 kg) as opposed to Hilleberg Akto (1.7 kg) or other heavier options, as I believe Tarptent meets that minimum safety bar for me.

[@drawnbody51]

I tend to go for British army surplus, either good condition or brand new unused. At least you know it's kind of designed to be battered about so I don't baby it like I would other more expensive gear. I did a multi day hike in Scotland and the rucksack alone completely empty is about 3kg. Then the sleeping bag was about the same so just 2 items already at 6kg. I didn't weigh it but fully loaded with tent food water cooking stuff etc etc it was probably a good 20kg and we were crawling through bushes climbing insane inclines even some dodgy bouldering type descents and I never really thought about the weight too much except when you stop and take it off it feels like you're floating away

[@Benzoff]

Great advice. Found this very useful. 👍

[@outsiderswalks5460]

Depends, as you dig into - if you are camping or hiking - if you do longer distance, definitely weight matters, if you just go a short way and camp, matters less - UL gear for winter - a mid and proper warm sleeping gear works just fine. But again depends if you mostly stay in the tent or you just use it for sleeping :) - most people tend to do longer trips in the 3 season window, where winter perhaps is more for short out camp. having done the WHW some 5 times, skye trail 4 and cape wrath 1 - all using UL gear with no issues - its all a matter of knowledge of choosing right gear - but of course if you only insight to UL gear is US PCT hikers i understand your reservations. Have you tried UL hiking for a longer periode of time ? :)

[@stewartgregson8479]

Each to there own, there is no right or wrong. Personally I like to take a balance between comfort and a light pack, for example on a long multi day hike, I don’t want to be sleeping in a single person tent, especially as I’m 6’3 so I’ll take the weight penalty of a two person tent but use a trekking pole tent to minimise that weight. I do review the gear I take and have honed my gear down to about 7.5kg base weight depending on trip and season. I do want to put an ultralight kit together, but this will probably consist of a cheap tarp, cheap lightweight quilt, and cheap 3 quarter length Matt that I’d use in good warm weather for a 1 or 2 night fast packing type trip. One thing you didn’t mention is that going ultralight takes experience and skill, honing your kit down over years, not just going out and buying the most expensive kit. That doesn’t work heavy or ultralight, having the nouse to know your own and your kits limitations is what we should concentrate on.

[@2649]

You never NEED ultralight gear to go hiking. Also there’s a big difference between saving every gram possible or just choosing and paying for lighter gear which is still comfortable (which can be ultralight).

[@harduphiker]

You mention the South Downs Way - I have walked that...with ultralight tent...in winter!...Not the lightest - the Lanshan 2 and 4 season...but if I'd been carrying my old 2.8kg Coleman tent I'd not have got as far as I did. Wind can be an issue...but in the UK we have trees, valleys and shelter unless you're going on to the top of a mountain? So yes...Hillbergs are nice if you can afford them, but fully storm proof gear is really expensive. (P.S. can everyone stop camping on the top of peaks for clicks? That IS dangerous! Half the thing of camping is choosing your site, I talk about that a lot whne it goes wrong because I think it is key...but I think a lot of people now think wild camping is going to the top of a mountain, exposed, and toughing it out - or even worse, camping by nice photogenic lake or river where the midges are, where flash floods can happen and where it's easy to pollute the water source....).

[@suewheeler5795]

I take an average of 15kg all in and general walk 5-10 miles. I would love to get the weight down but I don't want to be uncomfortable. My big issue is needing a tent that can take the wind and rain but not storms...so many to choose from 🙈😳🤣

[@BackpackingUK]

I think that’s what stops most of us from going ultralight. For the vast majority of the time you always need a decent tent, bag and pad.

[@suewheeler5795]

I'm pulling my hair out over a new tent at the moment. My Hubba Hubba won't take wind and whilst everything else is sorted (I'm a S2S girl rather than thermarest) the tent concerns me in wind. But ultralight, not for me thanks 😂

[@blond-in-blue]

I’ve been backpacking, bikepacking, and camping for a while, and I feel that ultralight is a marketing scheme to get people to spend more money for cheaper gear. Lighter weight doesn’t necessarily mean more comfort. A 2kg Deuter or Fjallraven pack is easily more comfortable and durable than a 1kg Hyperlite.

[@dp13579]

Agreed. Ultralight no use in UK or Ireland. I Like to do 2 to 3 days minimum, heaviest item is always the tent but thats one thing i wont compromise on. Like you say we want to be comfy and safe. Just got the Vern 1 new ,never had the cash for a hilleberg so delighted with the Vern, yeah its roughly 2.8kg but for what your getting, comfort wise and space wise its a no brainer. Plus if your really into camping for campings sake your not under any pressure to do so many miles a day....why pressure yourself ,we are outdoors to enjoy ourselves and our surroundings, even if you dont have the best views it beats concrete and cars all day every day!!! 4 seasons in one day....4 seasons in one hour!!! Thats the beauty of it......

[@bcamping1]

Ultralight backpacking is under 10 pounds base weight. Hilleberg soulo is perfectly ultralight if you don't bring much anything other than big3. Beer and sandwich don't count as base weight. But black label ultralight might be pretty challenging, might have to leave the innertent home. Which I have done.

[@jimbothescot4282]

wind is the enemy here, so I will not compromise on bomber 4 season tent for high camps unless the weather is nailed on, everything else I try to cut down where I can

[@Moffatmountainadventures]

I never weigh my kit or worry about it. I except my winter gear is heavier so it’s packed with safety in mind. Last 2 camps have been summit camps in full winter conditions in Scotland and if I packed my bag with weight as a priority I’d had been in trouble. Summer time yeah it’s lighter but then you also need more water in the summer and as streams tend to be drier you often end up with a bag almost as heavy as your winter bag. That’s my feelings on it anyway. I try and train in the gym to allow me to cope with those kind of demands on my body.

[@pootlingalong8928]

Optimum for me would to be able to afford a high end tent with full inner for “most of the year” camping and a mesh inner for those few weeks in the year when the UK bathes in a heatwave. Perhaps one of the Hillebergs or similar. Expensive, maybe, but confidence-giving in storms and they last.

[@BackpackingUK]

Totally agree. For the vast majority of the time, a 4 season tent will be the better option. We get so few warm nights in the UK, especially when out in the open.

[@raytaylor4199]

There’s definitely more freedom with lighter gear, one thing I’ve found over the past few years though that you can find cheaper alternatives, I’ve just bought a Therm-a-Rest vesper 32 down quilt, cost me £300 weighs 440 grams, however you can get a one tigress down quilt for £59.99 weighs 700 grams and I swear to you there’s not much difference in warmth, my Mrs uses the One Tigress quilt, she’s a colder sleeper and she’s never complained. To be honest I enjoy buying and using high end gear but honestly sometimes I wonder if we’re getting a bit ripped off with the ultra light stuff!

[@BackpackingUK]

Thanks for sharing 👍

[@andrewgovan1872]

Interesting discussion I have this dilemma I’m planning on backpacking all long distance trails in Scotland next year and love the idea of ultralight but prefer the robustness of a 4 season

[@duelfreak4359]

I tried to make a kit that was under 13kg and managed 11kg including food and water - but I cheaped out on the sleeping pad and I regret it but the warmer ones start to increase in weight so I ended up buying foil roll mat, cut it in half and it’s worked a treat and weigh nothing - I brought the cloud up 1 for shorter hikes and stays and cloud peak 2 for longer stays

[@marshallward9971]

I’m getting some lighter weight kit, not all of it but things like having a poncho instead of rain jacket. Or getting “ultralight gear” as the odd thing like a bottle holder on a bag. I’m used to carrying a 26kg bag for 10+ miles, and I actually get bruses on my hips and shoulders. I’m aiming at 10-15kg pack weight, the problem is Im willing to spend a fair penny on kit that lasts, but I won’t buy the expensive dehydrated food, so I just bring like microwaveable rice or a steak in a flask with ice. Tinned food as well, so it ends up being about 10kg of food. I just shaved a kilo off by swapping my berghaus sleeping bag for a oex fathom.

[@neemancallender9092]

At 69 My max pack weight is 15 kg for 15 to 20 km for multi day trips That is 10 kg base weight Including a watercolor painting kit

[@harduphiker]

ooh watercolour. I went ultralight to make more space for art supplies 🙂

[@3180mick]

I think there's a limit to how light you can go given the typical British climate. Maybe on trails like the AT or PCT you can get away with going properly ultralight, but I think here in the UK Ultralight, freeze at night even in summer the climate can be unpredictable. I have trimmed my kit down, Atompacks, Durston XMID etc but there's a limit where comfort starts to suffer.

[@Northeast-SouthwestOutdoors]

I care more for packability rather than weight, can't remember the last time I weighed a rucksack? As long as it all packs down tidy and distribution is good...except for the excess liquid I always put in last😂

[@BackpackingUK]

Last year I was all about packability. I personally don't mind the weight, but I don't want to be carrying a 70L pack everywhere!

[@LoremIpsum1970]

I'm only just looking at talking up walking again, so the more info the better, and I'm only looking at trails in the South of England and East Anglia. My only point of reference for UK ultralight is Liam Brown's channel, where he has a kit list. However, if money is stretched and you want to go further afield, say Spain and Portugal you're only going to buy once, that is the dilema! I don't do hostels btw...😴📯s

[@angusogilvy8250]

As you get older, I am now almost 70, weight becomes more of a consideration. Comfort too! So it is a question of give and take (out) . I normally carry about 12kg and have gone the way of trekking pole tents when I can. Exceptionally lightweight makes no real sense to me,but I am not running over Munroes. I don't carry beer ever! Water is heavy enough.

[@2pegsshort]

Personally the standard of comfort still has to be enjoyable when trimming pack weight. Getting to a location a little bit easier is not worth sacrificing your basic luxuries at camp.

[@chrisjwoodall]

Like all these things, it’s about diminishing returns. I’d say if you’ve got the money trying to get your three season base weight to 10ish kg then it’s money well spent - but within that you may prefer a little extra weight for a bigger tent, warmer sleeping bag or more practical and comfortable items. Beyond that I don’t think the cost vs improvement makes sense for most people. That said, one of the tutors on my ML training could and did do the one night exped in a 30 litre bag, even in October…

[@JamesWilliams-rw6qc]

With hobbies, there is certainly a bit of G.A.S for me and the ultralight stuff does have its appeal when the disadvantages are minimal. However, comfort and practicality have become more important to me over the years. I still don't see the point of dehydrated meals in the UK (possibly an emergency meal in the car if getting to your destination late due to poor traffic) as most people are not gathering water from streams so why not just take a nice homemade stew you made batches of rather than mass-produced bad-for-the-environment gunk just because you want to make use of that titanium spoon that's the fad I don't see the point off because if I really wanted to save weight I could just add a pub to the route and support the local community and maybe even grab a carry out.

[@Grievemere]

For me it's not just distance, it's the total climb too. I'm not fussed with ultralight but if I'm up there in the Lakes and have 3500ft of climb I definitely feel the weight so I'll take as light a tent as possible. I don't have one, but I wouldn't lug a Hilleberg up Bow Fell. If the weather was bad enough to really need one I'm not going to be out anyway. Much happier with my X mid solid.

[@kirstykelly9540]

I do multi day hikes and I like light weight without being ultra light I still like my home comforts and a tent I can rely on I’d rather the extra weight and be comfy

[@Jim553just]

I’m a pensioner , I don’t carry excess weight, but I have never needed ultra light. I have changed to down sleeping bag and trekking pole tent. 😀

[@RogerHyam]

I did the first four days of the West Highland Way last week camping on sites. I carried 12kg total pack weight - including 1.5kg of camera. I used everything I carried and 1) Don't see how I could go much lighter safely - especially if I were to continue to the Northern section. 2) Don't see how I could go much lighter in summer in Scotland: Three season down bag nearly always, 3+ r value mat, kilo for a trekking pole tent, base layer to keep dry to sleep in and for safety, trekking poles, backpack, kitchen (500g), food, water etc. soon adds up. If the weather were 100% predictable then things would be very different. It is mainly an oceanic Vs continental climate thing I think. On the plus side we don't need to haul 🐻 canisters around because our ancestors killed them all!

[@davegalloway7531]

Ive been out in my Lanshan 1 in some bad weather and snow.

[@johnmiddleton4753]

I do short one night trips and multiday distance trips, my longest to date being 650 miles in the UK. For me personally I will never reach try ultralight, especially for uk hiking as I like a bit of comfort especially on longer hikes. However I do use ultralight as a kind of target to lighten my load. At present I’m down to 7.5kg but still looking to get a bit lower. I think it’s all relative but I don’t want to sleep in a 8mm closed foam mat😂😂 lighter loads increase pleasure and reduce injuries especially when you are an old bloke like me 😂😂

[@easternmenace]

It depends on what you do. Just camping? Don't bother with being ultralight. But I personally don't do short camping trips that much and mainly do long distance hikes so it makes sense to be ultralight. I aim for walking comfort and not camp comfort basically.

[@mulreid]

Depends where you’re camping. I often wonder if they have wind in the USA because the wind resistance of their tents compared to European tents is seriously lacking. For me I have some light US tents and they are only used in sheltered spots and woods so they are great for that. Would I take an American tent on the top of Kinder, absolutely not even in the summer. The ultralights backpacks are the same. I would rather be comfy with an Atmos AG which I can’t even feel the weight of than take a stupid uncomfortable frameless bag which feels heavier because of the poor fit.

[@BackpackingUK]

Most photos of tents in North America are on flat-as-a-pancake pitches in valleys sheltered by trees. I guess, we can’t do this most of the time because wild camping is illegal (in theory) and we need to pitch higher. Even at campsites, you’re still going to get wind though with little shelter.

[@mow-zr6ni]

Interesting perspective. Standard off the shelf gear today is a lot better and lighter than gear at the inception of long distance trails like the Pennine Way in the 1960s. Just looked at the tents and materials- cotton duck rucksack(showing my age). That said a multi- days trip is a lot different to wild camping that populates KZbin. No way am I carrying an over priced 3.5 kg tent in the summer or winter when lighter options available- terra nova voyager 2 KG(kilo saved there). Used terra nova solar photon 2 for 3 seasons in this country and Sweden and never let me down. A lighter rucksack means you enjoy the scenery rather than focusing on getting that pack off your back. It’s all about what you’re happy to do and carry. If you’re comfortable carrying 15kg plus but me I want to be as light as possible without compromising safety.

[@normanhadley]

It depends, doesn't it? I'm running, so getting weight down to a minimum is absolutely essential. Pack size even more so. OK, so I’ve taken it to extremes most people wouldn’t want to go (5L race vest, 5lbs base weight). For me, the creative challenge of getting there has been phenomenally rewarding. But I’ve also felt an incredible sense of freedom from having such a small kit - much less encumbered on the move, and less to worry about in camp.

[@BackpackingUK]

Running is a different ball game, I absolutely 💯% agree ultralight is the way to go, the lighter the better.

[@normanhadley]

Yes, it's really interesting how many subgenres of backpacking there are, all with different priorities. I've written about this on ukhillwalking, and inov's Inspiration hub if you want to hear the case for super-mega-silly-light.@@BackpackingUK (Don't think I can put links in YT comments)

[@iwasapirateonce1639]

Warmth should come from your sleep kit and your clothes, not your tent imo. 100g of extra down in your bag or quilt will add more warmth than bringing the 2.8kg tent over the 1kg tent. Solid mesh is the way to go in the UK imo; but you still want a tent that will not hold too much water and can be ventilated well; the Hilleberg is just not that tent imo; for example, if you get a dry day, you can pitch the trekking pole tent much higher from the ground and get it aired out, or reduce condensation; with the Soulo it's always sodden by the morning. The Hilleberg is a 4 season overnighter summit camping tent, you do not need it for long distance trails even in UK winter conditions, not suggesting some silly ZPacks 500g tent without a zip but something in the 1-1.5kg range is far more ideal if you are smart about where you pitch, avoid wind traps and don't go out in named storms. And if we are talking deep snow, that 2.8kg on your back is really going to slow you down even or shorter multi day trips and can make steep traverses and ridges much more difficult.

[@BackpackingUK]

One thing I think a lot of people are missing, is the low fly a proper 4 season tent offers. A bitter wind ripping through your tent is no fun at all. The other thing is the protection your sleeping bag offers. Personally, I only use my bag for sleeping in but I get the feeling a lot of ultralights get in their bag as soon as their tent is pitched.

[@iwasapirateonce1639]

@@BackpackingUK I actually totally agree with your last point, US long distance hikers are often restricted by permits and need to keep a certain pace, and often don't have much time to sit around after pitching their tents, usually in the UK there are not such 'hard' time restrictions. I personally still prefer to bring some better clothing (down leggings for example) rather than an extra 1kg+ in a heavier tent; then again I carry around 3kg on camera equipment so for me ultralight gear allows me to keep my overall pack weight manageable. I do agree that it is important to be able to get a low fly when their is snow and ice, although most trekking pole tents can actually get a really good low pitch, they just require a fair bit of tinkering and modification to do so.

[@thewestonfront]

I think you make a very valid point, but some people (myself included on occasion) like new toys and thus expand from light to ultralight just for the fun of it. But is it necessary or valid? I agree with you that most of the time it probably isn't. What makes me smile are certain prominent KZbinrs you show themselves with a big range of ultralight gear on a camp, but this then includes tables, a second cup, down trousers etc etc. Actually they could have carried the same weight with a lesser amount of stuff and that stuff need only be 'light' - what is certain is that they soon have an ultralight wallet!! In my experience, the best way to cut weight from your back is simply to take less stuff, and where possible have things which serve two purposes - so a mug you can cook in for example, a hat which doubles as a pot cozy...

[@thewestonfront]

I do have an ultralight tent (a Nordisk Lofoten, ex eBay) and this comes into it's own in summer for fast and light walks of 16 miles / day for 2-3 days. I know this is an extravagance though and I would not have bought it new / full price.

[@Im_With_Stupid]

Those certain prominent KZbinrs are primarily social media marketers who get that stuff either for free or on loan. When they go out just for the pleasure of it they don't pack all that crap, either because they really don't care about it or they had to send it back after they made their last video and would never pay the ludicrous price themselves to own it. It's nice to see that gear and a lot of it is really innovative and cool, but it creates a misconception in the mind of inexperienced and/or gullible viewers that a person needs that stuff or that they'll be part of some stylish clique if they buy it. It's psychological manipulation to create demand where none existed before and then profit by filling it. The unfortunate thing is most of the victims will defend and encourage it to the death, even if they know they've been conned, because doing that is easier than admitting they were conned.

[@wesleyhendricks4219]

Its all about personal preference ,i don't get uk backpackers obsession with the Hileberg Soulo when youve got great brands like vango and terra nova . 🤔

[@Bluemerleoutdoors]

I do more trails and multiple day hikes than I do just going camp for the night so I do like to have a light pack and there are plenty of people in the UK that do ultra light backpacking so yeah it definitely has a place or people wouldn't do it

[@deadkennedy9140]

It depends whether you're out for the miles or the smiles I go out for distance hikes at a fast pace, its more trail running than "camping" so I pitch when I'm too tired too push further, at the first spot I feel comfortable that I can be stealthy. First time I took a sub 8ish kg load was an absolute game changer. Not interested in the fat lad wild camping "influencers" who pull up in a car park, walk a mile up a hill before drinking 2 cans of beer and eating a grab bag of M&Ms then raving about the newest thing a sponsor (declared or otherwise ) has provided.

[@ajcoops5919]

I like carrying everything and to have a big pack,as I'm older I prefer the home comforts with me and don't mind carrying it,I'm 6'2 and 17.5 stone so the extra weight I'm prepared to carry it

[@BackpackingUK]

That’s a great point, it’s all relative too. I’m a bit of a lightweight, but my mates are 14-16 stone. They don’t notice a few extra kilos!

[@naturebydylan]

The only ultralight long distance hiker I know is Liam Brown. he does some absolutely insane hikes

[@harduphiker]

He inspired me along with Paul Messner...but yes, Paul isn;t doing the long distance. I am working up to those longer hikes.

[@alanriozzi421]

I am 5'4" 9 stone and 54 years old , so lighter the better for me. But late spring to late summer.

[@TheRealCAPerry]

In the UK, we don’t have the altitudes that would make slightly heavier kit more of a burden.

[@BackpackingUK]

Great point. There’s a limit to the elevation we have unless you’re doing hill reps!

[@TheRealCAPerry]

@@BackpackingUK even then, the atmosphere isn’t going to thin out on you, which was more the point I was making.

[@vvs3796]

Good topic .I agree. It s becoming ridiculous sometimes.

[@simonwiltshire]

Realy you need sturdy gear that will keep you safe in uk wether, light gear tends to be fragile and i don't trust it, a bit more weight well you don't realy notice it that much.

[@TheRst2001]

I think ultralight is still important in uk. Ultralight is also at the forefront of new tech new innovation. And the standard tents of today from millets and stuff will be likghter and better made thanks to the innovations of ultralight . My hips are dodgy so the lighter the better for me :)

[@jdunn101ify]

The prices for some of the lighter weight stuff just feels like a ripoff

[@leavenotraceUK]

Perhaps not ultra light but lighter gear does help when doing long or multi day hikes and especially more so when you are older in the bones.