It's Not Looking Good For Game Devs...

[@ThePrimeTimeagen]

OK OK, WTF DID I SAY AT 3:17 ???

[@aieverythingsfine]

pretty sure it was.... LIGMA!!! ;)

[@vimandmanyothers554]

“filed 1000 involherdnd two separate patents”

[@XantheFIN]

foorhundled..two

[@zelllers]

TTS hallucination, I have seen it with coqui and google cloud TTS, same thing.

[@LordMacko]

quick, blame it on injured voice!

[@zdspider6778]

Game mechanics should not be patented. It's like patenting the idea of hitting a hammer at just the right angle when building a house. Effff off with that shit.

[@duhproffessionallove2011]

It's like patenting Chekovs Gun.

[@Internet_User_0x0000]

Yup, next it will be "Sir you can't breath that way, our main character breaths like that"...

[@hbobenicio]

Imagine someone patenting the way a person walk... Let's patent first something the whole earth does and be rich. thats the sick mindset

[@boycefenn]

I don't think software of any kind should be patentable

[@abdul4515]

Good think that ID software didn't patent the idea of shooting an enemy with a shotgun.

[@Craftidore]

So, interestingly, we do have a bit of precedence in this: board games. In the realm of board games, there have been board games about patented game mechanics, and the ruling came down on the side of "you can't patent game mechanics."

[@felipej.oribeiro6700]

The problem is that these Japanese companies already have these dubious patents. They shouldn't have ben granted.

[@headecas]

This sparks joy

[@Suhov]

Courts tend to ignore most parts of the Patent Act. Prior art and patenting function or general idea instead of implementation, should invalidate patents like one in the video.

[@Rogueferula]

Battletech did that

[@JakeStine]

@@Suhov The problem is that it costs $300k to $500k and 3-4 yrs in court to prove a patent is invalid. That's a lot of money for a typical small studio. Though, in both cases of Palworld and Memento can probably easily afford the costs to defend themselves and, in fact, I'd wager a bet that Memento Mori calculated the cost of seeing their case through court ahead of refusing to accept Sega's 'offer.' Chances are, the offer was going to be a lot more than $300-$500k and so, why not go to court at that point?

[@RomainDelmaire]

Patenting game mechanics is beyond stupid. Imagine if a director made a movie with some really cool camera angle and they said "I invented that camera placement, you can't use it in you movie".

[@PeteTheL337]

Don't give them any ideas :P

[@googIesux]

But Intellectual Property literally means you can own ideas, so if it's not a lie and actually true that you can own ideas, why can't someone patent and own a camera angle? What if they labored to come up with the idea? Do you want to "steal" the idea and rob them of the fruits of their labor?!?

[@Rai2M]

@@googIesux Because you can come up with this idea independently.

[@joeandrew8752]

@@googIesuxno you can not own an idea, that’s not what a patent gives you. At best they could win if it was over a technique. The broader the idea the less you can really claim it. Same way that react channel years ago trying to copywriter claim all react videos. Nintendo literally can’t claim “the capture of animal like creatures when something is thrown”

[@thebluegremlin]

Warner Bros. game patented the nemesis system in Shadow of Mordor/War

[@MoDFoX]

Warner Bros patented the “Nemesis system” which allowed NPCs to remember you and what you’ve done to them and react accordingly. It was a great system and there hasn’t been an implementation of it since because nobody wants to be sued.

[@asphalt2554]

every telltale game be like:

[@hannessteffenhagen61]

@@asphalt2554 Telltale games don't really act like the Nemesis system, in fact the mechanics used in Telltale games are called out in the Nemesis patent as being something distinct (which is important because of course they need to claim novelty in their patent, and NPCs reacting to past in-game events in _some_ fashion clearly was not novel by the time the patent was filed).

[@MegaMech]

Majoras mask be like:

[@RPG_Guy-fx8ns]

what an original idea. Before they came along, nobody knew how to hold a grudge, it was unfathomable. but now we have the technology, thanks to those tech geniuses.

[@nezunskyfire292]

Warframe be like:

[@pif5023]

You can really feel the freedom of the market

[@AScribblingTurtle]

Yep, and it feels like walking through a pool of lard.

[@danlowe]

The job creators need more money printed to bail their capitalism out

[@GoalOrientedLifting]

it would end up like this even if it was free. a free market favours monopoly just like bullying favours bullies. if there are no rules they will make em to benefit themselves

[@tobyzilla]

More like the dystopia market

[@inmosh]

patents are forced by government laws. It is the opposite of free market

[@etooamill9528]

patenting the game mechanic of walking on a surface and not falling through, i call it solid walkable surfaces

[@itzhexen0]

Call it whatever you want. It's patented.

[@simonced]

Many new AAA games at launched won't be suable then hahaha

[@masrfaker]

@@simonced maybe they are just avoiding this patent? 😂

[@Raziel7171]

Remember Sega's Crazy taxi ? they patented the arrow over the top of your car for directions and sued Fox for it's use in the Simpsons Road Rage

[@ThePrimeTimeagen]

No way... Those sobs

[@SkyNick]

I remember hearing about this too awful bunch of melons they are

[@FloatingDogs]

Yeah, first thing that came to mind when I saw the Sega lawsuit. Good God, this is such a gray area...

[@donkeyy8331]

yep this is not the first time its happening and it probably should be stopped

[@MrMoon-hy6pn]

Don't forget Bandai Namco's loading screen minigame patent US5718632A, it only expired a few years ago... when it was no longer useful.

[@AQDuck]

Id Software should sue every FPS in existence for showing the gun in first person view.

[@ugib8377]

This is the same thought I had. Whole thing is complete nonsense.

[@backslashzero]

John Carmack is against software patents so he didn't patent it. Heck he even released the doom source code so people could learn from it and now Doom runs on everything. Edit: Spelling

[@itzhexen0]

You mean microsoft who owns id software?

[@itzhexen0]

@@backslashzero John Carmack does not work for id software.

[@itzhexen0]

It looks like you guys are stupid.

[@Octamed]

This should work like music. If the COMBINATION of ELEMENTS of the game is so close to another IP, then MAYBE you can claim copyright. Exactly like music, when there's enough notes that are similar. What they're doing is like patenting... the note E. It's insane.

[@spacegoat_3d801]

It’s like patenting chord progressions.

[@skilz8098]

Maybe I ought to have 1+1 = 2 patented and then sue everyone else who uses it. Or perhaps have the idea of anything written in cursive handwriting patented and then sue someone else for that. This is how pathetic, how stupid, and how asinine their greed really is.

[@misterbeach8826]

Marching Cubes was patented in 1987. When the patent expired, a bunch of 3D game devs appeared, of which Infiniminer proved to be the most promising. Notch took notice, cloned Infiniminer, and developed a better game design -- and Minecraft was born. But nobody dared to touch Marching Cubes for decades before that.

[@Blankitte]

Minecraft does not use the marching cubes algorithm.. it's a voxel game.

[@michael_1010]

In the EU, software and game mechanics cannot be directly patented unless they provide a technical solution to a technical problem. Pure ideas, rules, or gameplay principles are generally not patentable, but innovations tied to specific technology might be. Most game protection in the EU relies on copyright and trademark laws instead of patents.

[@loganmedia1142]

Unfortunately copyright and trademark are also heavily abused by companies.

[@hannessteffenhagen61]

@@loganmedia1142 Copyright and trademarks are somewhat harder to abuse than patents. Yes, of course Trademark trolling is not exactly _uncommon_, but it'd be very hard to successfully troll with copyright claims (I mean in the actual legal realm, not the auto-modded world of platforms like KZbin).

[@hannessteffenhagen61]

The main issue is that even though in the EU you can't _file_ such patents, the EU still _recognises_ US patents.

[@NihongoWakannai]

​@@xvutq706xcrt the patent office is staffed by people who have no idea what they're signing off on. The patents wont hold up in court at all, but they don't need to. The patent gives justification to take someone to court and throw a bunch of legal fees onto them. When going to court is the punishment, the entire legal system breaks down into uselessness.

[@salvanwezel]

@@hannessteffenhagen61 Copyright trolling definitely exists. @AdamNeely has a few good video's about this concerning music. For example: kzbin.info/www/bejne/g3Kphpd_j9N8a9E

[@daltonyon]

This type of lawsuit kill the creativity, because small dev can wake up with a lawyer in your door saying that you violated patent!

[@zbyniew]

Lawyers exist to suck all the creativity out of the universe. Only engineers and artists matter

[@lack_of_awareness]

Small dev? You mean the other fucking way around. A large ass company can just suddenly come and kill you if your random indie game happened to have some random ass patented game mechanic that you never knew is patented

[@danlowe]

Lawyers send staffers to go to people's doors because they know there's a nonzero chance you'll kick them into a hole while telling them this is Sparta

[@kreativwiebetonblock1327]

@@lack_of_awareness 1. It was just formulated badly (cool nickname btw). 2. I guess you mean because it also has game mechanic that a large company has already stolen from a developer, that is to poor to sue.

[@nickm.4274]

​@zbyniew you do realize it's possible to have a level-headed opinion and not be all or nothing, right?

[@xslashsdas]

As an indie game dev, this makes me so fucking angry. It's just so hard to produce a game as a solo dev, or as a small team, we DO NOT have the resources to hold our own against fucking Nintendo or EA. Most of us will never even see outstanding success, and those of us that do, guess what? A big company can come in, squash the indie studio and take their earnings, because the way they fondle their balls is too similar (and they try something new with a mechanic and genre that has been stale for decades).

[@cahva2]

EA Sports: It's in your game, we will sue you.

[@DingDong-bw7mq]

Soon Nintendo will sue everyone who made a side scroller

[@NicodemusT]

Not before Sony sues for likeness

[@soundspark]

Patent on sidescrolling ran out ages ago. They even happily license sidescrollers on their store and even manufacture cartridges for them.

[@astroviking3414]

Int array [69] ; Thats Are Code !!!! STOP SIR !!!

[@monad_tcp]

Someone will patent int arrays, then everyone will have to use floats. That's the end of performance, brought to you by Intel.

[@daylordd0752]

Hold up u gon confuse them Python devs

[@DagarCoH]

​@@daylordd0752Can confirm, after two years of python I have no clue what that means. Wiped a decade of c++ and java right out of my wet disk

[@rawbmar1166]

*our not are. Please change your ways sinner 😂

[@astroviking3414]

@@rawbmar1166 i are smart

[@sentel140]

I just filed a new patent for my unique game mechanic, its called ''jumping" and your character will rise and fall back to the ground when you press a button.

[@tigerkralle1997]

allready patented

[@agmenos47]

This isn't just the most recent in Japan. Konami vs CyGames happened quite recently too. And you can see the pattern there, CyGames is a rising new company, have quiet succesful titles before such as Shadowverse, Grand Blue Fantasy and Princess Connect Re:Dive. After they released Uma Musume:Pretty Derby they blew big, really really big, in Japan, not just the anime able to break the 2 decade standing record for most bought BD/DVD copy of Evanglion for TV anime series(season 2 was released around same time as game) but also breaking records with game(can get toe to toe with genshin global even tho it's JP only). Then some old company that already made a name, Konami, tried to suck off from this success.

[@tobyzilla]

Literally what Nintendo did is Literally causing other companies to also start sueing for patent infringement as well it's like Nintendo is a virus and it's spreading

[@TheDanVail]

Man, patent lawyers need to CHILL. We’re getting to the point where it’s going to be “HE’S PUTTING HIS FINGER ON MY SIDE OF THE CAR”

[@Xyzair]

You run over pedestrians in greatest car game ever and they smudge the paint, so you need to take it to get detailed and remove all the fingerprints from that and other pedestrians lovingly running their fingers down the length of your car like supermodels.

[@Charalyn0010]

Intellectual property is a ridiculous idea in the first place. People would think it protects smaller competitors from big companies. It in fact does the opposite of that, as we can can clearly see.

[@MichaelPohoreski]

When even a *patent attorney* write a book *Against Intellectual Property* you know the whole imaginary property system is cooked!

[@loganmedia1142]

I would also say that if they want it to be considered a good, then it must come with the same provisions as those that accompany physical products. If I buy a stove and it is substandard or does not do what the manufacturer or salesperson claimed I can return it even after having tried using it. But we don't get the same right with this intellectual so-called property.

[@test-rj2vl]

I dislike the whole idea that you can keep asking money for the same thing over and over again. Like if plumber wants new money he needs to find next pipes to fix. When car mechanic wants new money he needs to work on next car. But creative people for some reason want to work once and then keep asking money forever.

[@einher1]

I tend to agree. Patents were not supposed to cause harm. The idea was that an invention gets documented and utilized, and the inventor gets his/her share. Everybody wins. In theory, maybe. I'm pretty sure we'd be better off without patents. We would still do R&D, but in a different way. It might not make sense to invest heavily on something huge, that others might simply copy. Instead, it would be a more incremental and collaborative process.

[@MichaelPohoreski]

Looks like YT is censoring comments again. 1/2 A *patent attorney* wrote a book ...

[@TheBaldOne]

Just three comments: 1 - I really like this format of videos 2 - Nintendo, or better, Pokémon Company also took some "artistic liberties" with some of the Pokémon and the Dragon Quest series. 3 - The point of the Nintendo lawsuit is to exactly set the precedent you spoke of, send a message to smaller studios that they don't mind the lengthy court process and have the money to do so. So they either play ball by settling or incur on the risk of bankruptcy. As soon as I heard about the Palworld lawsuit I went to steam and bought both the Pocket Pair games, at least they'll have a bit more money to fight Nintendo. Fuck them, this lawsuit made me jailbreak by v1 switch and order a rp2040 chip for my switch lite.

[@estebanperalta59]

I got into a point in my life that I gave up on modern gaming because of this kind of crap, the pinnacle of creativity when making game went from the 80s to late 2010's, but it's clearly the industry is worn out, and big companies can't stand that indie developers, people that are actually creative, take a piece of the cake called gaming industry: "don't be more creative than us or we will sue you". If you have an industry were AAA games sucks and indie game devs can't make games you not gonna have great games in the future, despite some indie gems here and there. I think i'm trap in a loop replaying SNES games forever.

[@doltBmB]

creativity died in 2008

[@Eichro]

replaying SNES games? you can't do that either unless you own a Nintendo Switch OnlineTM subscription

[@Sonario648]

@@Eichro Pirates, Emulation, and actual owning the old console itself: Am I a joke to you?

[@Eichro]

@@Sonario648 Then you better get ready for the next few years, when even emulating will be outlawed in practice, even if it's technically within the law. Not that the law stopped any pirates.

[@maxpayne2323]

And now I see a bunch of Nintendo Fanboys crying "But...but...but they have to deffend their IP"

[@imyergranpa]

Why won't someone think of the multi billion dollar company 😭

[@Number376]

nintendo fanboys would literally eat the poo coming from this company and say "thank you"

[@iddn]

Had the same meeting about defensive patents with a previous employer. We were also warned that reading patents is for lawyers and that engineers/developers should never do it as you’ll unwittingly contaminate your brain with someone else’s idea.

[@mattymerr701]

Pretty much, just reading patents can open you up to a bunch of legal issues and is a total blocker for clean room development

[@lockekosta9014]

As a 10+ year game dev I think... you're absolutely right. It would crush the gaming industry in Japan if either of these lawsuits are successful. And yes, it is a nightmare scenario if it is successful and catches on. Game mechanics should not be patentable - one of the main reasons being that these companies with these patents generally aren't even the first ones who created said mechanic to begin with!

[@tato-chip7612]

Patents are simply the government giving companies the rights to be monopolies. They are a mistake. ESPECIALLY for creative works.

[@TehKarmalizer]

The intent is to give innovative people an edge by preventing big companies from running wild with their idea and grinding them into dust by undercutting their prices. How it works in practice is sometimes those same big companies, or sometimes companies dedicated to farming settlements off of patents, abuse the patent system to stifle or extract fees from competition over absurd patents that are overly broad. A lot of regulation has that reverse slope where the appearance of holding companies accountable really kills their competition, and a company with less competition may be less accountable in the end.

[@saniel2748]

@@TehKarmalizer So, reduce amount of legal protection proportionally to how big/influencial company is (let FTC figure that out or something) Microsoft should get 1 year out of patent while smaller companies could get more. But anything more than 10 years is ridiculous

[@tato-chip7612]

@@TehKarmalizer or you could just remove it.

[@alexcornflow]

the us has been trying to dissolve monopoly. this gives us some hope for change

[@AlejandroGonzalez-rz3ml]

0:38 nintendo is not "also" taking palworld to court because of the patents, it's only taking them because of the patents and nothing else because they know that suing over designs would make them lose immediately, if nintendo tried to sue palworld over the designs and somehow win, they know they would be sued to the dirt by square enix because the designs of pokemons are even more of a ripoff of dragon quest designs than palworld to pokemon, from decade before pokemon existed

[@og_skullkid1387]

The thing about the lawsuit doing it with patents is a big deal because it happened after palworld was developed. These patents were made AFTER the fact. That's what's so messed up about this entire thing. They can't catch em on design. But they can get them on sneaking a patent in before palworkd had the chance. Meaning if palworld had just put this under patent protection then it could have been avoided. Nintendo winning would screw them. So many Nintendo fans would drop them completely as an entertainment company here in the US. The only way Nintendo can stay alive after that is to switch to Hollywood instead of gaming. If Nintendo wins this gaming is doomed.

[@GreedoShot]

border radius is not a legitimate patent who tf is letting this happen

[@mattymerr701]

Yeah, it should be at best a trademark

[@kingbr47]

The existence of patents is ridiculous. Or at least the possibility of its blatant abuse like this. Companies should be sued for trying to be rats like this and wasting everyone's time and possibility to make better products. I really don't understand how this type of crap isn't considered monopoly in some way, and treated like it.

[@CommanderRiker0]

Patents are not ridiculous. Its not perfect and needs slight reform, but this generations insistence that anything non perfect must be destroyed is really strange.

[@Skumtomten1]

The idea of patents is to stimulate creativity and innovation. It is assumed that without patents, no one has any incentive to innovate and take risks because other companies will just copy what you (possibly spent alot of time and money on,) did to a fraction of the time and costs. So it ends up in a stalemate. In reality I think patents are pretty damn harmful for creativity and innovation but its a pretty difficult subject. I still think that without patents, there would be a great incentive to innovate because the first move advantage is so huge anyway. Patents and licensing can be abused very hard as we have seen, and generally cause alot of harm, I mean you even have companies that entirely exists to buy and sell licenses/patents as their business idea. I don't know, its a strange world we live in.

[@CommanderRiker0]

@@Skumtomten1 The only people who think they cause more harm than good have never done R&D and produced anything of value, or oppositely have so much money it just doesn't matter to them. Most of us need some type of IP protection.

[@Random_dud31]

​@@xvutq706xcrtsoftware is kinda weird because of open source. Like Mac Os would not exist with Linux What i hate(from an ethical pov) is that a company can take a software that is open source and patent any changes after that. In my opinion, if you use open source software, then all changes made to cannot be patented. You don't have to release the source code, but you cannot sue it other companies implement it

[@NormalPerson229]

And by "sued", you mean the board of directors and senior executives should all be stripped from the waist up, and flogged inside an arena while on live broadcast. We can bring in some consultants from Saudi Arabia for pointers in this area. It would be very diverse and inclusive.

[@CarelessOcelot]

Aren't we long overdue for kickstarting an easy app for buying politicians. At least we can all get in on the game then.

[@hugofontes5708]

You know, sounds absolutely wild but I wonder where things would go with this. How many sets of regular people would need to get together and each fund a single politician so that they have any chance against the several politicians backed by several corporations and multimillionaires and beyond

[@RedactedBrainwaves2]

It won't work because it's not just about money. In fact politicians already receive a lot of small donations by voters alongside big donors. They don't care, they betray the voters anyway and the voters have no power to remove them.

[@parmesanbrawler7183]

@@hugofontes5708 There's also the matter of trusting that our money wouldn't be embezzled.

[@fusiongg92]

Rename them to Agents 😅

[@funicon3689]

it's called Grindr

[@cajonesalt0191]

1) It also goes beyond game mechanics. It starts a chain of events establishing precedence that extends to whatever point a judge or jury is willing to consider it. How different is a game mechanic from a functional call? If you think companies wouldn't try to patent the concept of a function call it's literally only because they don't think they could win (yet). 2) Adjusting the mic was not effecting the audio at all, but he adjusted it so hard the boom detached from it's anchor point. He beat that mic like it owed him money, for absolutely no reason.

[@deudaux]

"Ability to patent encourages inventiveness" Not if patent ownership is transferable. Big Corpos: "Isn't that great? No need to encourage disruptive competition"

[@test-rj2vl]

Wait, what, Your video wasnt't hour long and got actually to the point?? That's something new. But I like that.

[@damianabregba7476]

Remember when Candy Crash Saga owners sued Banner Saga creators for usage of word Saga?

[@hugofontes5708]

Even worse, Remedy tried disputing with Rockstar over the letter R on their logo. It's wasn't even the same font.

[@yannick5099]

Abolish patents in their current form. They should be limited to maybe 1 to 2 years. We all stand on the shoulders of giants (and a guy somewhere in Alaska maintaining a critical library). Humanity is at the current level of technology because we share knowledge. Every tool and process was invented by someone and builds on top of mountains of prior research and experience. Fine, you invented something, take a cookie and enjoy a reward for a little time, then share with the rest of society.

[@aieverythingsfine]

spot on bro

[@CommanderRiker0]

2 years is a little short for some of the risk being taken on by some R&D. Problem is it varies.

[@hugofontes5708]

​@@CommanderRiker0 if it is indeed R&D and takes several years and investing, sure, 2 years is short for an actual patent to be worth it. But then there's also the detail that Japanese patents require no actual implementation - you imagine, sketch and write, file and forget. No need to have an actual tool, device or system.

[@doltBmB]

@@hugofontes5708 same in the US, even though it's technically illegal, such vague patents are protected all the time

[@felipeemanuel5790]

Yeah, genius, just imagine, a small company, or a single person create a thing, and a big company wait 1 year to steal the idea, and make huge marketing.

[@angry.sparrow]

please keep us posted. This is important!

[@ShinSpiegel]

Copyright is the big final boss.

[@greenheart5334]

You cannot kill me Jack

[@ShinSpiegel]

@ noooooooooooo…… xD

[@attribute-4677]

Louis Rossman had a similar fight with a microphone arm

[@xXx_Regulus_xXx]

I get it, corporations are going to be given an inch and take a mile, but honestly how similar should games be allowed to be to one another? If I make a game called Schmokemon Red and it's just a rom hack of a nintendo game should I be allowed to sell that? Or if you can't sympathise with nintendo, imagine it's some hack ripping off your favorite indie dev.

[@blitzkreg335]

Imagine in the future when you see a message saying "Press "E" to interact" and it's deemed illegal. xD

[@Rai2M]

Some keyboard manufacturer would patent "E" press/release before and would sue them to hell )

[@gabeowser9881]

0:21 imagine being forced to exchange such a good domain name for an xbox. actual worst settlement ever

[@سنابل-الفردوس]

I WAS JUST READING THAT LMAO but all jokes aside he shouldn't have added the "Soft" in the domain name because that isn't part of his name and that's alone makes the case be for microsoft if his domain name was MikeRew it would be fine

[@NaudVanDalen]

3:18 That's the weirdest way I've ever heard someone pronounce 40.

[@ThePrimeTimeagen]

NOT SURE WHAT HAPPENED

[@elcapitan6126]

it's dutch

[@user-ii7xc1ry3x]

2:06 IT'S ALIVE

[@daltonyon]

WHAT?!! ahahahha microphone arm is alive!!

[@Shigan4059]

Copyright has gone so clearly off the rails that it needs to be abolished. The idea that you have ownership over an idea is just ludicrous. The patron/artist system was better, and with modern technology we could (and have) democratize(d) patronage to provide incentives to artists. It's probably already too late to turn back the clock, because too much power has been vested into the hands of highly moneyed interests, but if we ever get the chance to do it over, we need to remember what happens when you try to make property out of the intangible.

[@fastestdraw]

@someolddude-j8i Patent and copyright are so deeply connected that discussing them seperately is pointless, and the words are used interchangably. In particular, this is a case about the Pokemon IP being diluted (copyright) with patent infringement included as part of that case, because Japan has a whacky ass legal system.

[@ThePrimeTimeagen]

@someolddude-j8i you are completely right. this isn't copyright, which i am on the fence about some of its applications. but patenting game mechanics just seems common sense too far. like it should just be obvious that this isn't good to anyone

[@fastestdraw]

@someolddude-j8i Whacky ass Japanese law, the US isn't the world dubass.

[@MrInsanityInBlack]

100% agree, patents in the software world need to disappear. The thought that someone coming to the same conclusion to you code wise, is just a matter of fact. Sure there might some variability here and there in code. But like science, code and solutions are general fact. Ideas can be shared by multiple people without them ever meeting, without ever knowing the other exists, without ever seeing their code. I get it, a lot of people are inspired by seeing what other's do, but all patents do is stomp down on the inspiration of others under the guise of "theft". I hate patents and the idea around. But, in that same breath I can understand why they exist, but I think that all patents need to exist same way medical patents do. Not the full 20 year one, but say 5 years. I think for 5-10 years you should be allowed to reap the benefits of your patent, but thereafter, free game for anyone else to use. In my mind, I think this is the right way to do things, have a time limit of patent depending on the industry, I think code should be around 3 years, that is enough time to dominate any market really. And after that, anything related to said patent should fall away. It's mind boggling to me how someone can claim dominance over and idea/conclusion that thousands of others can do. Sure have you king of the heel moment, get your bag and then move on. Corporate America has ruined so much of the world. Your standards and thought processes or just plain wrong. Sure you can say, but it's only these people, or just those. Well those are the people who represent you at the world table, it's why America is straight up hated by the rest of the world.

[@aieverythingsfine]

yeah their culture is utter dog shit

[@_Mamimi]

I laughed irrationally loud in a Italien restaurant when you pulled your mic stand out of socket

[@angelacevedogarcia1895]

This is getting ridiculous, some of these smaller game companies need to come together and fire back

[@shanematthews1985]

Problem is they still wouldn't be able to afford to fight it, the companies looking to defend parents would just band together and bury the opposition for a decade in court to run them dry of cash

[@Jerler91]

100% agree. Game patents have been out of control for a while now. I hate the greed destroying a medium i love

[@GravitoRaize]

This is why I've always been anti IP when it comes to software patents at all. There just isn't clear way to define both "what you own" and "when someone else violates what you've own". Anything could be considered derivative, and even if someone goes through the hard work of building something on their own, independent of any knowledge of how another system works, the onus in court somehow shifts from the plaintiff having the burden of proof that there was a violation of copyright to the defense having the burden of proof that they developed the system on their own. In short, the laws don't solve any particular problem, they only prevent competition/innovation, which is the argument that people have why patents should exist in the first place. Software patents thus undermine their own intended purpose. Take "video card games" for example. How many different independent implementations of fanning out a hand of cards are there? Yet many of them use the same ratios per cards and we get very similar workings. All of them fan out the deck while focusing on a single card, when you "apply" a card, they all have a system of "hiding" the deck, etc. Now imagine if Blizzard or Hasbro (Wizards of the Coast, MtG) tried to patent it. Games like Slay the Spire couldn't exist, despite their system being developed independently, and them competing in almost a completely different genre.

[@SupremeKeyboardWarrior]

That's like suiting for human actions: lawsuit for having eyes and seeing the same things. Lawsuit for breathing the same air. Lawsuit for pooping.

[@Pear64]

As a game developer I am constantly worried about randomly getting sued for something I didn't know existed (If I can think of it, I don't think it's original enough to be patented)

[@felipeemanuel5790]

If you don't copy nobody, you won't be sued.

[@keeganmcfarland7507]

God, I hope indie game developers and AA game studios fight back against corporate greed.

[@felipeemanuel5790]

@@xvutq706xcrt it's pretty easy to see when the game is copying other game, if you look at palworld for example, it's pretty obvious.

[@funicon3689]

@@keeganmcfarland7507there isnt much they can do

[@ParasBansal10]

2:04 Even the mic couldn't believe that news.

[@GhoulKingR]

Don’t forget, Apple patented the touch screen interface and gui. Sued Microsoft for patent infringement because they made a gui. Android faced the threat of being sued by Apple, but the never were. And I think that’s because they lost the case with Microsoft

[@mage3690]

Didn't the Microsoft phone exist before Apple? No wonder they lost, that looks like the funniest patent trolling of all time to a judge. You might as well say "I patent this hammer, and sue everyone in existence who has ever made a hammer, because my hammer is the best hammer of all time" for all the good it would do you.

[@pixels_per_minute]

For the industry to not actually crash and burn, software and game patents need to be abolished. The AAA industry is already failing, and if they stop all smaller devs from developing games at all, then we'll be stuck with a dying industry and no innovation.

[@silpharion]

The Nintendo vs Palworld is more complicated that it seems, mainly because it's more like NIntendo vs Sony against the dilution of the Pokemon franchise. At any case, this already has happened in the west, with Shadows of Mordor's Nemesis system. The gaming industry was cooked way before this, since this is just one of the many branches of the Tech Industry

[@AshnSilvercorp]

at least that system is incredibly specific. The fact "the way this card combines with another" is patented, patenting "concepts" makes no sense. Patenting anything non-tangible makes no sense. A baby could come up with an idea and patent lawyers could say it could qualify.

[@pixels_per_minute]

It's even worse because Nintendo filed those patents after Palworld had released, meaning they filed those patents just to sue Palworld.

[@jordanjackson6151]

Growing up I was more of a SEGA kid due to the edgier yet lively aesthetic of their product. Even the music was better for 16 bit. I was pissed off when Sega Saturn wasn't as talked about as Sony and Nintendo in the late 90's. Even though it wasn't until I was employed enough to buy one at it's 20 dollar rate. Dreamcast is also hot. At least Sega had more room for fandom appreciation. But yes. Even our heroes need to lose sometimes in order for the new bloods of a generation to stand a chance at having exploration for victory. There isn't a creative company in the world that hasn't taken inspiration from another. Be it either another form of media or a rival unto themselves.

[@DavidM_GA]

Its called "the rich pulling up the ladder". They can't have the non-rich getting the idea of making lots of money.

[@memory_leaps]

there is a great video from a lawyer who explains the palword case in deeper detail and how it isnt as simple as a lot of people think, even shows up an example of a game that was sold, if recall correctly, and used pokemon firered assets (the thing is that it was a new game using the assets and of course not about pokemon). nintendo over all the stuff just protects their trademark (having a big company selling plushies of creatures that are so similar to yours that have guns kinda damages their image), and patent sueing is kinda long procedure so it doesnt happen thaat often (at least a bigger studio with another), the video i mentioned is named 'It's a Palworld After All! A Lawyer Explains Nintendo v. Palworld' highly recommend watching it super cool and entertaining and cool it has a realllly pretty good explanation for this

[@lucass5852]

Wow we are really going to live the cyberpunk dystopia ey, next is going to be books and stuff like that

[@189Blake]

At this tempo, we'll definitely get Cyberpunk dystopia before GTA 6

[@BB-848-VAC]

Let's take it easy with the doomer shit

[@hugofontes5708]

Depending on how you define cyberpunk, we're already there for a while now

[@TheRealCelerate]

The reaction to the mic arm coming off the desk was the highlight of this video for me.

[@pitfriend]

How do we make game mechanics patent proof so that big companies don't take the opportunity to steal money from successful smaller companies?

[@arthurfelipe9980]

We can't, just accept that the Cyberpunk dystopia is coming and that's it.

[@aieverythingsfine]

@@arthurfelipe9980 yeah nah fuck that

[@aieverythingsfine]

patent them yourselves and allow it to whoever wants it

[@TheAtticus82]

Oh my god this is such a terrible precedent to set. If we follow this train to its natural conclusion, games like Stardew Valley wouldn’t ever exist.

[@asphalt2554]

we need to patent every game mechanic to ever exist, and have people use them for free, then nintendo, cant do more of patenting game mechanics

[@aieverythingsfine]

actually a good idea

[@Skumtomten1]

@@aieverythingsfine I'm going to patent that idea.

[@aieverythingsfine]

@@Skumtomten1 XD

[@asphalt2554]

@@Skumtomten1 NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO i spite you with bumpy roads. and potholes.

[@shanematthews1985]

​@@aieverythingsfinenot really, the costs involved would make it essentially impossible, you're looking at multiple thousands of dollars per patent and multiple years to get them granted, you would need thousands and thousands of patents, meaning unless your name is Elon musk you're not affording that

[@snowSecurityneeded]

lol killed me with the sudden technical difficulty with the mic mount

[@TheThreatenedSwan]

This is clearly violating what patents were supposed to be used for and is now just a way to grift. For most of the game sruff that is patented there is no benefit to the consumer by a particular company having exclusive rights. Unlike say chemical/biomedical patents, most of them don't even take a significant investment to make and are just a combination of existing works

[@choom8ug]

@ThePrimeTimeagen this format is FIRE!

[@MichaelPohoreski]

0:45 _Craftopia_ (made by the same company as Palworld) had a "throwing mechanic to capture animals" *years* before Nintendo brought up their lawsuit. Does anyone know if Japan law respects *prior art* ?

[@hugofontes5708]

From what I've gathered over many comment sections and videos, Japan allows for "child patents" to be retroactively attached to "parent patents" and then be enforced retroactively counting from the parent patent timestamp. Nintendo went back and stapled throwing balls in 3d space at creatures to capture them on top of a Pokemon Legends Arceus patent. Not sure whether craftopia came first or not but that might only excuse craftopia in specific unless they pull a similar move, in which case I don't know if Nintendo's patent evaporates or Pocket Pair can't file because there's a more recent equivalent

[@MichaelPohoreski]

@@hugofontes5708 Thanks for the information! Looks like _Pokémon Legends: Arceus_ *announced* in 2021. _Craftopia_ was *released* on September 4, 2020 so POCKET PAIR, inc _might_ have a shot?

[@hugofontes5708]

@MichaelPohoreski I don't know if the patent is tied to the same date as the game. Japanese patents apparently can be fully conceptual with no actual implementation to back it so the Arceus patent might predate the game itself. Otherwise, yeah, AFAIK

[@MichaelPohoreski]

@@hugofontes5708 Wow. I knew Japan's patent system was bad but I didn't realize it was _that_ bad.

[@hugofontes5708]

@MichaelPohoreski hey now, it's only bad for people. Works great for the companies that have been there forever, let's not be biased here ☠️

[@DonaldDuvall]

completely agree. And as an independent developer of software and games, it scares me to death, that I could come up with a fun idea, and just because it is to similar to some idea someone had a long time ago, and decided to write it down is some vague language and illustrations, they could come and demand I give them money or take me to court; even when I have zero knowledge of their idea they had. Could you imagine what the world would be like today, if Tesla had patented his Polyphase power system? It is how our entire electrical grid works today. The world is just better without these sorts of patents.

[@InvasionAnimation]

Holidays are being ruined, art of all kinds are being ruined, information is being muddied, and hate is on the rise, at least where I am (America), and constantly being replaced by tech to the point learning any skill is pointless. Honestly with no purpose, joy, or meaning what exactly is the point of existence these days. They took the good parts of humanity out of humans and it feels like it has run its course, we need to go extinct.

[@1Ent.]

Gosh I feel this comment in my soul. Everything in life seems to be about profit, doing a 9 to 5 till you die, instead of entertaining ourselves with art (Games, music,etc.) and enjoying life's little pleasures. This might be a doomerist take to some, and it is. This is the reality I see everywhere near me. It's hard to ignore.

[@InvasionAnimation]

@@1Ent. I know right. Everything is profit driven. And I have no doubt in my mind that it will never change. They are claiming automation will liberate the workers. It will, but they won't help us once it does.

[@InvasionAnimation]

@@1Ent. I know right. Everything is profit driven. And I have no doubt in my mind that it will never change. They are claiming automion will liberte the workers. It will, but they won't help us once it does. They even censor comments about it.

[@InvasionAnimation]

@@1Ent. I know right. Everything is profit driven. And I have no doubt in my mind that it will never change. They are claiming automion willsave us. but they won't help us once it "does". They even censor comments about it.

[@Sonario648]

You need to get out of America. The point of learning a skill these days is still applying it to what you do. AI can't do everything for humans, and this is coming from someone who was surprised at how good ChatGPT is now.

[@mVic8]

When did this new format start? Recorded offline Solid editing I like it!!

[@marcelo55869]

Software Patents needs a revamp ASAP.

[@MichaelPohoreski]

Yup, either abolish them, or limit them to 10 years.

[@CommanderRiker0]

@@MichaelPohoreski They need reform, 100% agree on that, but abolishing them is absurd. They serve a very important function for entrepreneurs. Having lived in China where IP law is non existent you see the consequences of it right away, and its not good.

[@CommanderRiker0]

@@xvutq706xcrt Having lived with out them, no thanks.

[@CommanderRiker0]

@@xvutq706xcrt My comment keeps getting deleted. China has a tech sector that dwarfs America in terms of size but they do virtually no R&D. All of it comes from the west because economics is all about incentives and human behavior, and there is no incentive to do R&D if its just stolen without compensation.

[@ConcavePgons]

​@@MichaelPohoreskiMaybe we should consider basing them on the ideas on how the Creative Commons or how the GPL License works.

[@Volk_]

Game mechanics should be common ground, restricting users from operating similar ideas due to patents just creates lackluster games. I love competition in the gaming space, it always allows that one publisher to outperform the other and polish the shit out of gameplay

[@tododiaissobicho]

It's always morally correct to pirate Nintendo

[@MichaelPohoreski]

Civil Disobedience is the last resort against corrupt laws.

[@NotGarbageLoops]

Loving the short videos man.

[@rign_]

Love Prime has just become a KZbinr. Now I can watch his videos, news, and rants without my data plan cooked because of streaming.

[@keeganmcfarland7507]

God, I hope indie animation studios will put an end to streaming service once and for all!

[@Christopher-ty2gc]

this is going to hurt indie game developers so bad. It gets worse for gamers every year. I grew up playing games all my life and they got me through hard times.....what am I supposed to do now ?

[@DMPROD03]

Love these vids

[@nexus4662]

like the new format. hope the voice is doing well

[@0e0]

This is a great format for videos btw

[@maxsamarin9002]

The big problem is that game mechanic patents are possible in the first place. Because it’s possible, companies do it. I can’t think of any reason why game mechanics would need patent protection. For fields like medicine, I get it - it’s expensive to develop new meds so the fear is that without patents there would be too little incentive to develop new meds, so not enough new meds would be made. Games and many other industries that have patents dont have the same arguments. Making a novel mechanic in a game already gives the devs a first mover advantage, and there is already IP protection for game worlds, characters etc.

[@s1v7]

copyright sucks

[@davidhilditch]

No copyright is great - it stops people actually copying your actual source code and renaming it to whatever and making money from it. Copyright protects an implementation and all the effort that went into it, Patents protect an idea which is crazy in the software world and should really not exist. Imagine someone had patented the idea of text input boxes on the screen? I wouldn't even be able to reply to you.

[@Charalyn0010]

@@davidhilditch Nah, the entire idea of intellectual property is bs and needs to be left in the past where it belongs.

[@MichaelPohoreski]

@@davidhilditch Wait till you find out about Johanna Blakley's TED talk: *Lessons from fashion's free culture* /s *TL:DR;* Fashion Industry still flourishes despite: HAS Trademark NO Copyright NO Patents

[@Wolfsword9]

Copyright is outdated and abusive. Stop simping for a broken system

[@s1v7]

@someolddude-j8i I don’t bother sorting through crap.

[@shanematthews1985]

I agree that they have to lose, issue is i doubt they will because they have deeper pockets Yes its 100% unfair, but sadly that is the world we live in

[@brianviktor8212]

Software patents are insane. The point of patents is to protect from others 1:1 copying what you did. But if I create a game and it is 100% self-made, with some ideas accrued from all over the space, there is no way it should be subject to ANY patent. If anything, source code deserves patenting (although it would have other means), or original IPs that are a unique set of world building ideas. What, can you now patent "procedural generation" too? Or "shooting"? What's the limit? Just what some boomer thinks is reasonable?

[@GTexperience_Channel]

fun fact: Nintendo's cost to file a patent was about 1000 dollars each. so lets say: 10x1000 = 10.000. They sued palworld with a single lawsuit for all patent infringement cases lets say 100.000 dollars. Palworld now either settles, or has to counter sue each individual claim stacking another 100.000x10 ontop of the already existing 100.000 dollar from the main lawsuit. this is lowballing it.

[@GTexperience_Channel]

I ab obviously sarcastic with the "fun"

[@kirpich158]

patenting gaming mechanics is stupid af. but, if nintendo would sue palworld for the designs only, cause they are obviously "inspired" by pokemons, then that's totally fine for me. cause they are basically cloned some of them. but mechanic of pokeball? man. that's too much

[@sunsetguys]

your video editing its so good now, raise editor salary!

[@MadNekUA]

Solution is simple. Ignore any release from big company involved in such greedy behavior. They must learn

[@hexerei02021]

People will never learn to do that

[@RedactedBrainwaves2]

Boycotting doesn't work, especially with gamers since they are an easily manipulated demographic.

[@TomNook.]

The mainstream don't care about this stuff

[@gamemusicmeltingpot2192]

I always pirate Nintendo, EA and Rockstar games

[@vandalpaulius]

Holy SH.... I knew things were dire in the gaming industry, but I didn't expect this O.O

[@jouniosmala9921]

Nintendo suing Palworld is all about stopping Sony putting a franchise that's too similar to Pokemon in every single possible channel Sony would be capable of pushing it.

[@HyenHks]

This. Highly recommend watching Nintendo Forecast's video on this topic, it illuminates the reasons for this happening in Nintendo's case

[@turtlefrog369]

and i am with nintendo on this one. why should they allow others to steal their pokemon game and profit of it?

[@davidhilditch]

@@turtlefrog369 steal? What was stolen? The idea of having characters you can capture and then put to work in your base? So no game other than Pokemon can do this now? That's ridiculous. We already have copyright rules to prevent theft, you should not be able to patent game mechanics.

[@turtlefrog369]

@@davidhilditch its called intellectual property.

[@Charalyn0010]

@@turtlefrog369 Intellectual property is pure bs. It's used by big companies to bully smaller competitors out of the market, as we can see in this very case.

[@daleryanaldover6545]

The fact that people are surprised by Japanese companies using copyright to monopolize tge market is understandable. The thing is, Japanese are really strict when it comes with things such as copyright, they have no words such as freedom and creativity. This is why when you look into major game companies in Japan, you'll see no similarities between each other's work. People outside Japan have no idea that they work in the industry like this for a long time now. They would go as far as sending the copyright letter to your address by physical mail if given any chance, that is how serious they are. It kills competition yes, and that is the hard truth peeps.

[@plaidchuck]

What about jiyu and sozosei

[@MartinWoad]

Abolish all copyright, patents and intellectual property and then we can finally have peace. No other invention of humanity has caused so much distress to the creative mind than them.

[@TheXBoy5]

If Nintendo and Sega were KZbinrs they'd abuse the report system against their critics. Oh wait, Nintendo already did that, nvm

[@leZigoute]

I can't wait for the gaming industry bubble to burst

[@windows99]

What is the bubble you're reffering to? Salaries in game dev are crap, and the environment is toxic almost universally

[@gamedevinn]

@@windows99 huge amount of money invested in game industry in 2016-2020, those projects now released and having shit sale numbers.

[@RedactedBrainwaves2]

@windows99 what bubble? Don't you see the gigantic investment bubble on corporations churning out garbage and closing studios for not making more millions of dollars than what they made? It's pretty hard to miss.

[@damianabregba7476]

Ubisoft already bursted. It's only a matter of time.

[@lipnoodle117]

What's interesting about this case was the devs of Pal World made Craftopia, in which you can throw (not) Pokeballs to catch animals (much like in modern Pokemon games). Craftopia came out in 2020, which was about a year before Nintendo's patent.

[@mattomwit]

What a moment to be alive. Soon they will patent story telling ideas.

[@alexandrecolautoneto7374]

>some company makes a lot of money. >Then uses that money to destroy competition with juridical harassment. >Monopoly.

[@Sonario648]

>Break up by both the US and EU

[@alexandrecolautoneto7374]

@@Sonario648 >US offloads its debts on other countries via liberalism. >50% of the world hungry so Elon can play as tony stark.

[@eltreum1]

Amazon has a patent on the shopping cart icon and tons of things related to online sales even though they were nowhere near the first inline retailer. Google patented aspects of search and ranking results. Companies get away with this stuff because patents get ignored in the review and public rebuttal phase so they get patents unchallenged for all kinds of dumb things that shouldn't get patents. The gamble is it not only stifles competition but forces capitulation because the cost of fighting the company and challenging an approved patent no one objected to before at the same time is too long and expensive to be worth fighting it. Maybe Elon will buy a pet game studio since most are or will be fire sales soon to reform it lol.

[@martinmicheals570]

wait... we need more anti-cheat engines to go to court..