JABBI & STAVN CONSPIRACY THEORY / TWISTZZ IS STILL BEHIND ELIGE IN CS2! - Hot Take Point Made 16

[@renaldasp1]

RIP BTN, now this show is the best. Please do more episodes...the gap in between episodes were too big...

[@5k00n5]

Richard Lewis would be a perfect guest for this show

[@Mizzraim]

Even if he'd lose everything else, kassad can always find joy in finding a way to disagree with maui..

[@phoenixfireblazz1545]

Been waiting for this last night when Kassad said on twitter that they finished recording this episode! Excited to see what's in store for me today :> Thanks!!

[@dsv-banshee52]

Funny how Richard Lewis pretty much confirmed Maui’s first point in a recent stream

[@F1stzz]

Maui's point came from one of his Twitch followers typing it in the chat, lol

[@dsv-banshee52]

@@F1stzz yep, I saw that too. Pretty sure that was before Richard said anything as well, so that guy made a nice prediction.

[@schwabies8125]

@@F1stzz Starting to wonder if Maui has had an original take in his life after he pulled that from his chat and called it his own conspiracy theory.

[@nofluffagain]

Conspiracy chads stay winning Occam's razorcells btfo'd

[@TheFlurre]

Also dont really think Kassad and Thorin understood the "conspiracy", it wasnt to fuck heroic, is was to get kicked from heroic and get to Astralis quicker as they thought Heroic would do as they should and be like "We dont care if all 4 of you will leave if we keep Cadian, have fun on the bench and fuck you".

[@IsaacSable]

This is the best CS2 podcast by far. Wheezing 5 minutes in.

[@c01d_h4nds]

mate get that checked out..

[@dp6036]

Freezepipe not doing it's job

[@zueler]

fr

[@dari191]

Ive been waiting for this after all the drama. Thank you so much guys

[@schmeed0000]

YES ive been waiting for this to drop

[@MrBa143]

What do you get if you combine Jabbi and Stavn? Stabbi in the backi

[@romic8427]

Any day with a new LFN video is a good one

[@AlexMiamorschh]

I really enjoyed the Johnny Depp cameo.

[@johnk_32]

It felt like an eternity, another great episode!

[@whitedaniel53]

Loved Kassad on desk in Syndey

[@mauriciobetimpaesleme8702]

I came back just to laugh at the first point where both thorin and kassad think it is ludicrous what Maui said about Stavn and Jabbi and it turns out it was true.

[@elem_nt]

the jabbi chin comment 💀

[@VCM5]

A chronic mouthbreather like him would be a backstabbing snake ☠️

[@Tophe]

THE WORLD'S GREATEST PODCAST IS BACK

[@Tophe]

And donk is the GOAT

[@SaintedPIacebo]

In the NFL they script the first drive or two of each half and then adapt. If you shorten the length of the NFL games then the scripting stays the same and the adaptation is even less. Its the same here, less rounds lets the scripted part go farther.

[@LookerCS]

Maui is looking glorious this episode. Properly glowing.

[@FrozenGaming99]

Finally i been waiting 10 years for this banger

[@delatroy]

Hard to imagine simple can continue with Navi based on the way he's acting

[@EntrEsprit]

I feel like shiro benching himself has something to do with his adaptation in NA, I don't think he'd give up on that newly built team that quick otherwise

[@lohvrti]

You don't fundamentally change your team's structure and core group and switch orgs if you're enjoying yourself.

[@karlbottorff1779]

Let's just say these make going to work on Saturday better. Thanks!

[@emperor1e]

7:47 Maui lowkey rubbing his chin to make sure it’s still there so he doesn’t get roasted by Thorin next XD

[@JAYCS2]

Us saying "CSGO was also shit at first" doesn't really work anymore. Valve made so much money with cases they just can't be protected for what they delivered.. Its not a small indie studio, also shutting down CSGO entirely is not acceptable if CS2 isn't even close to been ready.

[@botesz20]

Yesterday's interview with Valve confirmed that CS2 in beta wasn't played enough to generate the right amount of data for completing the game. They needed more people playing CS2. Without disabling GO it wouldn't have happened.

[@JAYCS2]

having less then 5% of your playerbase been able to access the beta for almost 4 months but then saying "wasn't played enough" is just a joke mate. They fucked themselfs by handpicking who would be "allowed" in.. And the "privileged" were to thankful for been let in to the cool kids club to actually complain and do what betatesters are suppose todo@@botesz20

[@peepopoo4387]

@@JAYCS2 I got in the first day and it wasn't even worth playing until they let everyone who had an MM rank in(in actuality, it gutted CSGO's MM servers so badly that you were forced to switch if you wanted competitive games). There was no ranking/balancing for months and you would just play stomps over and over. I didn't bother playing a match of CS2 until premier was implemented.

[@JAYCS2]

aye I feel you on that, limiting the beta to 1 map mostly for the longest time without proper ranks to ensure some balance was a horrible decision too.. The horrible decisions just keep on pilling up when you look at it@@peepopoo4387

[@rare8567]

@@botesz20 would help if when people found out you could play in third person, or mirage was fucked, they changed it asap instead of leaving it up for ages. why would people play it and take it serious in that state, its supposed to be fast to work in so prove it. Also plenty of people wanted beta access and didnt get it so its a weak ass arguement.

[@davids8127]

The way Thorin says Nafany cracks me up, its like a weird twist of naht funneh 😂

[@bilboswaggens2975]

Ahhh the Mr. Bean Astralis villian arc. It's his world. Heroic is just living in it.

[@Nathan-hs2ut]

Chin joke was insanely good

[@everything-has-a-handle-now]

Valve won't adjust the economy until after the Major. Valve is pretty notorious that like their data a bit too much and I think they want too see how the Major will play out with the current system

[@everything-has-a-handle-now]

Do think they will adjust it eventually

[@HerbaceousM8]

and then they will over do it after months of nothing and wont admit a mistake.

[@sirdetmist3204]

The game should be in full working order from day one.

[@t3h51d3w1nd3r]

Yes!! I fucking love hot take point made!!!

[@goguyoutside]

41:30 what are u talking about , zonic joined Astralis around the time the coach communication restrictions were introduced , so he did play with Karrigan the same way he played with glaive , the difference was that he won everything with glaive and won nothing ( really 0 trophies with Karrigan ) , and it would work better if you have a genius coach that can talk all the time and 5 superstars , like football or basketball , the captain doesn't really change the team's tactics the coach does ... in real sports there are defined positions maybe a player could do something extra but if u stick to the plan you will always win in the long run , that's why Guardiola's teams always won the ligues no matter where and no matter who was playing .

[@ShreN_]

46:53 Kassad's point above pros having a gentlemen's agreement to not use molotovs is missing context. At the time molotovs slowed down your player massively and they didn't explode mid air. So you could mass molotov a site and CTs couldn't do anything. I also don't know if smokes always extinguished them, I can't remember now. The pros didn't even use molotovs before (I think friberg was the only one using it at the start?). That's what they should be clowned for. But banning the molotov was perfectly understandable. Valve had to nerf it later on anyways because it was broken.

[@samuelbelko6469]

I think actually u couldnt extinguish them with smoke in beggining.

[@Cheezperson]

WE BACK

[@ObjectiveGamer]

Maybe before 10 years it'll have VR

[@pkftw4166]

Hope these guys work the major.

[@johnsmith-hy5te]

Maui’s getting fit brehs

[@JrKdM]

dude is getting big

[@Polyvalent]

@@JrKdM mauiswole

[@liam3104]

singlet = big

[@vktje]

It is insane how many people are complaining about cs2 that it is gonna die and that it is bad. Some people actually say that valve doesn't care. Just looking at the amount of updates is insane, we have never seen this. 48:11

[@HerbaceousM8]

player count of csgo was inflated by the Chinese market and valve decided to hide regions when it started getting obvious that NA and SA have been losing players for 5 years and EU was stagnant. player count over all is now down, the market is in panic mode. the game doesnt appeal to pro players , high elo players (no demos, anti-cheat is bad high elo), or low elo casual players (lots of missing casual game modes) or investors (nearly a year past a new operation was thought to be, no new collections for the release )

[@Ansee7]

we do want to see this show cause its a banging show

[@sn1pe34]

Very great take by Kassad about Elige and how its all Relative, Mauisnake saying Liquid will outpeform Complexity is an L take, his predictions are always wrong anyways so its not very offensive.

[@Mad1Lee]

Great podcast but it's a shame that you guys don't use the word "sportswashing" and not discussing the moral side of this whole Saudi takeover.

[@Expanses02]

You prolly haven't followed Thorin and Richard for quite a while. These guys have repeatedly scrutnized explicitly for years before it became the norm.

[@Mad1Lee]

@@Expanses02 I am following both for years now. Richard is very explicit about the whole situation, while Thorin and his guests are tip-toeing around the subject and not really calling spade a spade: i.e. not bringing all the human rights violations and atrocities done by Saudi government that are being sportwashed.

[@slayinkittys2843]

Kassad makes a great point on the value of good IGLs. Cuz if just strats and playbook won the game beacuse of the new format being shorter then a load of other teams would have won over Karrigan who is the GOAT igl.

[@davidcirovic8620]

loved the jabbi can take it on the chin, almost choked on my sandwich.

[@Danny-iq8rv]

On kassad's point about twistzz underperforming in the playoffs...He was highest rated in the quarterfinals, 2nd highest rated in the semis. Yes he did underperform massively in the finals, which is a factor but saying that he underperformed in the playoffs is not true.

[@sn1pe34]

They're not really watching the games when on the desk, very few are...it's like the generic regurgitated mess Mauisnake says.

[@sn1pe34]

But tbf Kassad made good points about Elige and Twist and Relativity

[@pkftw4166]

One reason Maui laughs when kassad tells him he’s wrong.

[@eduardgrigoryev4791]

Wait what... Maui's apology wasn't REAL?!

[@beefler472]

S1mple did sorta do that by playing with edward and zeus for 2 years.

[@B_Tannen]

The CS2 launch was a failure in terms of available content as well as marketing. The end of GO had far more maps and modes to play. Also Valve did a terrible job of pushing this game to try and get new players.

[@bananavlogs5167]

reggiN UFTS

[@SLiiNKee]

My hot take is Simple won’t even be a top 5 player in CS2 ANY year.

[@Alix777.]

Who cares about cs2 this mobile game, s1mple still the goat of the only true game csgo

[@bananavlogs5167]

Who gives a fuck

[@Salsasports]

How did twist underperform? I dont think we watched the same IEM sydney. Makes me think you didnt even watch faze games

[@peepopoo4387]

They probably meant in the Grand Finals.

[@VikashSingh]

And then Twistz did what he did today vs Monty. ✌️

[@lafarga2330]

With the state of the cs2 pro scene this ought to be good

[@lafarga2330]

Jabbi can take it on the chin 😂😂😂😂😂

[@peepopoo4387]

who would've guessed that rosters would be a bigger mess than the game?

[@sn1pe34]

Thank god Mauisnake called out Dexter, Fnatic were a dark horse now are terrible, Bring in Brollan w AUG Krieg cs2 meta let Krimz cook

[@hughwoodford]

Mauis starting to look like a haitian gangster or something

[@M3atheadGaming]

Maui trying really hard at looking like Pablo Escobar ?

[@WayStedYou]

Navi heroic and possibly G2 all imploding back to back after being in the top few teams before CS2

[@tObito687]

vitality too. already lost zonic and now probably losing magisk

[@tech4172]

Idc if we keep letting devs put half assed games out especially at Competitive level it's ridiculous. Yes early access is a great way but not for Competitive play, so stop backing the same fucks who took 4ever to do anything with all CS. Granted could take a yr or 2 to get fixes but they should've stayed with CSGO than. To sit there and say pros should just stfu and just play a shit game that shouldn't have been released that early because we all know VALVE when have they ever been fast and competent

[@kentadespe3924]

Lets goooooo 🗣🗣🗣

[@BatMouse-1989]

27:24 As a Brazilian, I see nothing wrong with nobody being better than Fallen, since he is one of the best AWP in the world in CS2 at the moment. (for me one of the greatest of CS history) It's like being mad that Argentina still doesn't have a better player than Messi with 36 yo.

[@Tnik6780]

I get why as a pundit commenting on a profesional player they will say “s1mple should have more grace and respond to valve in a cordial and respectful manner and the way he responds to valve sets a precedent for the community because he’s a profesional” But I understand why you’d be disgruntled as someone who in this iteration of counter strike will be considered a goat for many and put in an absurd amount of hours and work into csgo just to be the greatest and then poof the game you sunk your life into is gone. Pundits like to say you’re a pro you should be treated as so and then go on to say profesional in esports should be considered as having their maturity stunted by 5 years. This is a point repeated repeated by RL and Thorin if I recall correctly. I understand it would be ideal for s1mple to say valve contacted me and I said this this and that are why this game is not good, but I would look at it like if Michael Jordan at his peak was given a pair of ice skates and told this is basketball now your careers hard work is up in the air if you can’t adapt to this game. Mans entire life pretty much is in csgo. Richard Lewis himself said he thinks the way valve went about ending csgo is anticonsumer; I agree. Thats all I am, a consumer with an absurd amount of hours in csgo considering it didn’t make me a dime to play it. Imagine having your life in the game. The game itself never disappeared with any other new version of counter strike coming out but it did with this one and I feel for s1mple in that regard.

[@Tnik6780]

I’m a normie and I’m pissed I can’t play my fav fps anymore imagine being the fucking goat Jesus Christ poor guy tbh, at least in that respect, he has more money than me so that means I should cease empathy, right?

[@ЕвгенийСоболев-г6д]

Is it John Depp on the right!?

[@HerbaceousM8]

51:45 s1mple taking a break is good for his mental. maybe they will fix things and people will have learned bad habits, he will come back and be fresh. its ok to take a break, i think people shouldnt be paying for keys and opening cases etc until the game is fixed.

[@Stfugb2s]

24:30 - you guys have been beating around the bush of ELO for so long. Trophies or ratings? Which events had easier or harder fields, blah blah blah. Almost like you’re searching for a number which describes relative performance 🧐

[@caged3249]

Please tell me you don't think Faceit ELO is a definitive assessment of a player's skill or value

[@Stfugb2s]

@@caged3249 oh lord no. I was suggesting more an ELO system for teams based on officials. Then maybe a composite ELO for the individual players which is some calculation between the team’s ELO and their individual rating/stats.

[@caged3249]

@@Stfugb2s oh my bad. I assumed a little too much lol. However, I think an ELO rating of that nature would ultimately have to take most of these factors into account & would likely just result in a relatively meaningless representation of these discussions. Feels like you'd lose a lot of nuance in that approach

[@Stfugb2s]

@@caged3249 the fluidity of rosters makes it difficult. You could maybe smuggle the principles of ELO in under a more comprehensive points system than what we currently have. But at the same time points reset on a schedule whereas a core+coach can stay together multiple years. I don’t think it’s unrealistic but it would take a lot of tuning.

[@skillezkillez]

Dexter is easily the most fraudulent and overrated IGL in tier 1-ish CS right now

[@vokuhila6913]

cant believe 3 years ago I was practically begging for cs2 just to want csgo back 😢

[@scouthatesrainbows]

You always want what you can't have

[@mymicisasian1410]

I mean, it'll get better for sure. No doubt it's rough right now though.

[@maxxlanglois]

This whole "we can criticize everyone but nobody can criticize us" look ain't a good one fellas. What kind of shit argument is this?! "hurr you defend someone ergo you have to play with him". Are we in middle school or something. Also, Thorin, you defended mauisnake. Ergo you have to do EVERYTHING with him for the next year. It's your own perfect and totally unbiased logic mate, so will you walk the walk?

[@pkftw4166]

Not understandable.

[@TonyBalogna23]

jabbi can take in on the chin LOLOL

[@lazizzakhitdinov2126]

Короче руководство Хероик не нашли ответ на уход Кедиана и свалил вину на stavn and jabbi.А они с свою очередь просто хотели уйти после ухода капитана ,и их посадили на банку.Вот и всё!

[@goguyoutside]

Thorin for some reason is always either with Kassad or neutral whenever kassad makes a take , he is the guy who said Fallen has been shit this last few years then now he sits here while kassad is saying Fallen is the Best awper outside of EU , Zevy , Heni , oSee , saffee , Hallzerk they all have similar if not better fragging output , but yeah Fallen is the best just like that ...

[@peaceling9826]

❤

[@pinkfloydfan22]

Fallen as a pure awper is not better than saffe or osee and they are all trash

[@Jerome-iwnl]

How is Elige ahead of Twistzz? Elige's highest peak isn't even as good as Twistzz right now!

[@Polyvalent]

because america #1

[@thereportoftheweek787]

Most accomplished? Yes of course it’s twistzz, but the important discussion is who is the best NA player and of course it’s not the guy who is the 4th best player on his teams.

[@peepopoo4387]

Elige used to drop 30 bombs and hard carry Team Liquid against some of the most legendary rosters while Russ was on Misfitz/TSM still learning the game. It's like people didn't watch Elige's whole career and then want to crown whoever else does decently in NA. It's very reminiscent of people crowning Zywoo over S1mple. People used to say Stewie2k was better than Elige. I feel like the guy gets disrespected for how great he's been for almost a decade now.

[@kappacat]

@@peepopoo4387 The amazing thing about EliGe is how consistently well he's been playing for so long. NA has always had consistency problems (players and orgs) but he's always been a sure bet on doing well

[@VikashSingh]

@@peepopoo4387 I think an important point is missed here, Elige has a different role in comparison to Twistzz. Faze as a team is not built around 1 player, whereas Elige has played exactly like that. So it's better to compare Elige with the likes of Niko. And compare Twistzz to JKS, Hunter (Maybe) etc.. In the end if you can lead your team to win tournaments both in and out of servers with amazing decisions and calls then you are a better player, it's not just about score. I see that way more in Twistz than in Elige. Elige is just like Niko in my opinion, very good. but that does not make a player better than others. Else Tyloo would be the best team in the world just by score.

[@pineapple9893]

It's dissapointing to see Hooxi still being critiqued when he won much more with g2 than Aleksib in his whole career with Ence, OG, NIP, G2 and now Navi.

[@Hornnnnnn]

he had jks and prime monesy, aleksi had fucking jackz

[@TopOnTops]

​@@Hornnnnnnaleksi is shit

[@TopOnTops]

​@angelofthenorthcoasteye test frok aleksi is thw worst trash igl

[@GGSATANGG]

maui cosplaying as CJ from san-andreas