JAGUAR Got Everybody So Angry, We All MISSED THE REAL PROBLEM!

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[@JayEmmOnCars]

CarVertical: The History Checking Service Use this link or code "JAYEMM" for a discount! www.carvertical.com/gb/landing/v3?b=1e4c9523&a=JayEmm&voucher=jayemm&chan=jayemm

[@davidbee8178]

00 is aptly named because J will likely sell just about as many :-) Obviously the 00 introduction was MEANT to get people talking (what's the aphorism? "no such thing as bad publicity?"} But given the falling rock depreciation of expensive EV's like the Taycan you mention Jay, coupled with wealthy people's lack of patience for any inconvenience whatsoever, Jaguar has essentially written its own epitaph and has said to the world "Yep, I don't care WHAT you think of my legacy, I'm jumping off this bridge". End of a historic brand.

[@kraigantonjon]

nailed it bud, love your show.i still love my 3.0x-type. id lend it to ya but im in northern alberta..lol

[@typxxilps]

could you please stop the crappy translation of your content with terrible titles and description and even worse adds ? CarVertical: Der Service zur Historienprüfung - well, please translate that crap back into english and if you do not understand any word welcome to the mess cause I could not understand that either, but in english I would have known. You are killing your channel and your art cause part of your videos is your voice. Listen to your crappy arteficial german voice and ask anyone on the street how close that is to your natural voice. JAGUAR has no issue cause they are already beyond their legacy. No one here buys a car from an indian manufacturer that became famous for his 3000€ car called nano that even indians did not want to buy nor to ride cause they felt it was too cheap. But of cause those tata fans might buy a Jaguar, but here the marketshare is close to 0

[@Rom3_29]

People may be speaking about Jaguar for all the wrong reasons. What that particular company is trying to accomplish? Actual problem product may get lost in the shuffle.

[@bomfunk77]

@JayEmmOnCars may i ask where you got that fantastic Irn Bru cup?

[@NinjaRunningWild]

The idea of an electric car coming from a company known for cars with electrical problems is honestly hilarious.

[@gillesdebritalycars]

The next Jaguar will be the L-type. « L » for Lucas 😂😂😂

[@1258-Eckhart]

Lucas, Prince of Darkness

[@Kat-Kobold]

Tesla is huge tbf

[@glideman]

That’s unfair, they had mechanical issues too 😂

[@Neojhun]

FYI Their i-Pace already is old.

[@Chipchap-xu6pk]

My Jag dealer story. I've owned the same nearly faultless XF SV8 since 2010. Had it serviced at a dealer. Few weeks later, started getting intermittent tyre pressure monitor warnings - not big, but enough to fail an MOT. Took it in twice to my local dealer who couldn't replicate the fault. They threatened me with charging me (despite being under warrantee) if I brought it back a third time. Next time the fault came on I took it there, didn't switch off the engine and they 'replaced' the whole system under warranty. A cost of about £2k to Jaguar I was told. Two weeks later, fault comes back. Out of desperation I take a torch and look around under the bonnet... And see two antennas loose on the undertray still connected to their wires. I clipped them back in to the undertray next to each wheel arch: fault gone. They cost me six months of faffing and £2k of Jaguar's money because the first dealer didn't clip them in after the service and the second was incapable of basic fault finding. Used specialists every since.

[@hamstirrer6882]

In my experience someone who only works on one specific type of car is less adept than someone who has worked on multiple types, hence why specialists are better than the main stealers

[@Chipchap-xu6pk]

That's part of it. People normally say that they can only follow the laptop, but they didn't even manage that because the symptom driven diagnostics would have told them to check the initiators (those antennas). I wonder whether part of the problem is the labour hours that dealers make from Jaguar on warranty work. They're not just a problem for customers, they're equally bad from Jaguar's point of view. The specialists I've used have been closer to mechanics than techs. They actually understand how things work rather than blindly following flowcharts (badly).

[@Milskavashe]

Happy new year, pal

[@jamieduff1981]

I had a similar experience with a Ford dealer over a Ranger Wildtrak pickup which had an obvious 13:41 vibration at 70mph. It was at the dealer over and over. They replaced loads of parts including the transfer box, kept telling me it was "done" and ready to collect. They eventually threatened to charge me if I brought it back again. I persuaded the service manager to come out with me in it and he could drive it. He agreed and to be fair to him he very quickly agreed it wasn't right but the weird thing was how much they wasted without ever, apparently, bothering to drive it and find out for themselves what I was talking about!

[@STEVSGONE]

@@Chipchap-xu6pk truth is Stranger Than fiction, and this is the proof! This is ripley's, Believe it or not. LOL

[@TerribleFire]

Jag decided that they really wanted to sell 200K cars to people in their twenties.

[@topfuelteddy]

Exactly this .👍

[@lestrem11]

Aimed at teenagers really.

[@BeatTheSensor]

🤣🤣

[@neilburgin4257]

Good luck with that business model.

[@videosmith1000]

You mean a total of 20,000 $200k cars worldwide? And across two years.

[@andrevanstiphout]

I'm in Australia. You have referred to Lexus customer experience. I am a retired business man with a garage full of vintage BMW's. As a side gig (I got bored at home), I deliver parts to dealerships in my area. I once walked into the local Lexus dealership and having not been there before asked the receptionist where I should go. She sat me down in their (rather luxurious) waiting area, gave me a coffee, asked me how my day was going and informed me that someone would see me shortly. Five minutes later, the service manager came out to see me, thanked me very much for the prompt delivery and I then left. I can't comment on other brands except for BMW as I have purchased 13 vehicles from them for myself and my wife over the years. The customer satisfaction was high but Lexus..... another leap for mankind.

[@krugmeup2162]

BMW in Sydney are shite. We bought our 7 from Brighton Melbourne. Lovely people. We had to move tho

[@geztaylor]

Every time I took our pool car to Steven Eagell in Cambridge (I was only in Toyota but they run Toyota and Lexus) I was impressed by there friendliness and service. I have owned Merc, BMW, Jag, Audi you name it and that's the best garage I have interacted with.

[@rjw4762]

I don't own a Lexus....but 5-6 years ago phone my local dealership and asked if they had a model in the showroom. They did take my name and asked what time I'd be likey to be there. Upon arriving, it was "Hello Mr. Smith. Welcome to Lexus.........". This was very impressive. I ended up not biuying a Lexus that year, but intend to do so in the next 12 months. That excellent customer service left me with a positive impression all these years later. BMW and Audi does not offer this approach.

[@K24Z3]

I recall in the 90s, Lexus in Australia provided customer service training to every single person who worked in the dealership.

[@intellifly747]

I had the worst experience at Lexus Fourways in South Africa. They have a proud 4.6 rating in Google. They lied and left gave me a car with an OBVIOUS as daylight problem. A waterleak from the WaterPump. After they fixed it at their cost the salesman asked me if I can please remove my bad Google rating. I didn't reply. Because they only fixed it because I threaten to reverse the deal. If I didn't catch them early in this fault they would have ghosted me.

[@jayartz8562]

Should've stuck with the old "Grace, pace and space"

[@a.m.9357]

Customer service? It's the biggest problem of 99.99% of modern day businesses. They just don't care once they have made the sale. They treat their own customers like hostages.

[@peedeegt]

I cannot speak highly of enough of my local Tesla Service Centre. I’ve owned many marques over the years, some dealership / service centres have been great, others terrible, but Tesla by far and away has been the best. I know this is not the same for all Tesla owners, but I genuinely can’t fault them.

[@graemejones9707]

Jaguar used to have decent customer service until they started selling cheaper "mass market" cars - people wanted the top treatment when driving a two litre X-type. Can't happen.

[@DjNikGnashers]

100% I'm a qualified master customer service advisor, and the customer service (or lack of it) I receive these days is a joke. My father died in March last year, and the house has been empty, but trying to actually speak to a human at British Gas, to pay off his bills, has been impossible. Everything is automated, and I simply could not actually speak to a real person, to discuss why I thought the estimated bill was way too high, because the house has been empty since his death and no gas or electric had been used. Eventually I managed to get a real person in billing, but it was a call centre in India, and I could not understand a word they were saying due to their thick Indian accent. Absolute joke. The customer service I gave when I worked for Hyundai, was over and above, and it's such a shame that most motor dealerships do not live up to this standard.

[@peedeegt]

Dude, in my 25 years in the Automotive industry, not once have I heard of a ‘Master customer service advisor’. I think you just made that up 😂

[@georgechickful]

@@graemejones9707 if dealers take that crappy attitude, then they deserve everything they get. Poor service killed lots of brands in the US for example. Considering workshop prices per hour, it doesn't cost much to be nice and pays off long term, repeat dealer customers servicing, part ex upgrades and resale values.

[@grande_007]

Very poor judgement from Jaguar. The thing they’re forgetting above anything else is that now is a crucial time not to delete heritage. Chinese vehicle manufacturers would be desperate to have history and heritage. It’s literally the last bastion of hope for long established motor vehicle manufacturers, and Jaguar have c0cked it up.

[@davidblake1663]

Spot on. Why do we keep selling our automotive heritage so cheap? MG & Lotus (China), RR & Mini (Germany), JLR & Royal Enfield (India)...

[@whtalt92]

@@davidblake1663 Because you can't run it yourselves anymore, and no-one else is willing to pay big money after BMW tried it and lost 15 Billion DM on it.

[@Josh_Quillan]

@@whtalt92 Unfortunately true. Britain is laughably unsuited to the modern world. Our clocks stopped at 1969 or thereabouts.

[@manchegocheese997]

Exactly this; people don't buy Jaguars because they're the best cars, they buy them because they're Jaguars.

[@baronvonjo1929]

​@manchegocheese997 You cant sell cars based on reputation forever. Jaguar is already riding on a decades old reputation. There is no interest for the current generation of Jags. Even a CUV can build up a reputation. Look up the Porsche Cayenne. But all of Jags current line up dosent have any sort of halo affect. You can inly use a reputation for a crappy product for so long before the newer generations only remember dissapointment

[@neil1997]

I went to look at buying a nearly new lexus. They took my car 'round the block ' as part of the valuation. Picked up a puncture. They put two brand new tyres on it and lent me a ES350 for the rest of the day. I didn't buy a lexus in the end but would recommend them on service alone 👍🏻

[@xkimopye]

If Lexus would focus a little more on performance cars they would be the ultimate car brand.

[@chriswilliams6335]

@@xkimopye Lexus was originally devised as an alternative to the luxury Rolls Royce and Mercedes models - exclusive dealerships, 24/7 parts delivery and couriers to transport them, discrete recovery services if needed, etc... The fact that there are so may Lexus cars on the road now suggests the original plan failed. Nevertheless, they do seem to be good, reliable cars like their Toyota cousins. The point is, Toyota carried on producing their cars whilst Lexus tried to fight it's way into a luxury brand. The difference with Jaguar is that they are going to rely solely on the high-end market without anything to fall back on if they fail.

[@paultaylor9019]

@@xkimopye My next car will be an LC500 - enough performance for me 😁

[@krugmeup2162]

Yeah it’s a pity their cars now are shit and ugly. I was offered a car for the weekend for a test drive. （LS)

[@bigmacdaddy1234]

​@@xkimopyeThey already do focus on performance cars. Drive any Lexus on the track and you will run out of skill long before you run out of car.

[@MH30R]

I think the recent advert and their CEO response has sunk any chance of recovery. The CEO is not even customer focussed and instead of listening and thanking all for their feedback, he went on the attack. A rookie mistake! Jaguar need new leadership, starting from the boardroom down to CEO and Chief Engineer. Glad I held onto my XFR-S. It was a masterpiece from Ian Callum and is running very well to date.

[@pete4821000]

Yeah I agree-that was the wrong way to handle that. Telling his employees who would be worried for their jobs 'not to talk about the advert'

[@alanjm1234]

If I worked for Jaguar right now I'd be seriously looking for another job.

[@Volkbrecht]

That was no mistake. Always remember that there is no such thing as bad publicity. They got the attention they wanted, the whole world now knows of their shift in product design, not just the regular customers who had already mostly lost interest in the brand anyway. The only gamble is whether or not there are people interested in the new product.

[@davidc1878]

To be fair, there are an awful lot of companies (in various industries) that have either hired or been taken over by far-left ideologues who insult or even attack the traditional customer base and completely erase the company's legacy and history... all in the name of pursuing a 'modern audience' of far-lefty ideologues. I cannot believe what some entertainment companies have been doing. Disney might just kill off the golden goose that was the Star Wars franchise... something I would have thought to be impossible but here we are. I cannot believe how many times I have heard a lefty business leader say that their product is "not made for you" ('you' being the traditional fan base) and then call everyone racist and sexist when the traditional fans don't show up over the last five or so years. These people must be rookies, complete idiots, or just politically-blinkered. It is utterly bizarre.

[@WilliamOrr-v8g]

I am an expat, living in the US, and have always, in my small way, supported my heritage by buying British products. Over the past thirty years I have had at least one of each iteration of the Range Rover and my wife has driven Jaguars, XJS's but mainly S-Types. As a large, "slightly overweight", white boy with a decent household income I believed that my wife and I were the perfect target customers for Jaguar and Land Rover. Apparently we are not.... So in the inimitable words of Douglas Adams.. "Goodbye, and thanks for all the fish". I wish you luck. I do hope that this is a absolutely brilliant campaign that my small mind cannot comprehend and that your dealers are inundated by hordes of strangely dressed people clamouring for your cars, but I think not.....

[@HKFunster]

That you needed to point out your skin colour means you are correct, you are not the perfect target market.

[@WhiteWolfos]

Sounds like they shifted to rebellious rich youth-but not rich enough for a royce with a bland taste as their prime target.

[@johnveitch9702]

The dealer treating anyone like dirt is not just a problem with JLR, it's across the industry. Sure there are a few gems out there in a sea of grit, but good customer experience and main dealers are not words that I'd put in the same sentence. It may be that because I drive older models and the dealer isn't going to tempt me with a brand new shiny car. But a 13 year old Merc is still a Mercedes Benz. While there is plenty of life still in my old car I need parts and servicing to keep it running. What I don't need is to be treated like some tramp who will scare off the proper customers who are there to buy new shiny cars!

[@scottthomson9813]

Exactly.

[@georgechickful]

Merc seem to have lost their way, like everyone else. Old models still seen up and running are good for the brand. They should be littered around the dealership next to new stock, implications are obvious to customers.

[@EbenBransome]

Especially if you are there with a 13 year old Merc, you're actually advertising the brand longevity.

[@gordowg1wg145]

The stupid thing is that, being a long term owner, you would be putting more money through the dealership for service parts than they made on the initial sale.

[@Checker63]

My sister had a similar experience. Wanted a part for her land rover. Took the old part in via the showroom. LR were aghast and took her to the parts department and chucked her out of the back door. She could have been there to buy a new car but didn't look worthy. Also, I was looking around a local main dealer not long ago. I genuinely needed to get a car. I was wearing jeans and a t-shirt eating a bag of chips. I was looking at the new cars. I saw the salesman looking at me a number of times but he obviously didn't think I was worth bothering with. I could' afford any of the cars on display. They didn't want my business and they didn't get it. I used to work in retail banking. Take my word for it, you should never judge by appearances.

[@LRSTGS]

"Everyone is talking about them now though". Remember when everyone was talking about Jimmy Saville? I've owned a PR and marketing company, trust me, not all press is good press. I've also owned six Jags. Jag' have spent a decade trying to loose the middle aged white man, without considering that segment has the largest disposable income and is the most likely to buy their quite niche product.

[@Biggus_Dickus_Incontinenta_Btx]

@@LRSTGS obviously not a successful marketing company as you have no idea of demographics or where high net worth disposable income actually resides. Certainly not middle aged white men and your naive Reform party view of the world.

Had Jag actually produced the twin-turbine hybrid C-X75, I honestly would have sold all my other classic cars and mortgaged my house if necessary to own THE most technologically advanced surface vehicle on the planet. Ever. Blisteringly fast and beautiful too. But this new joke woke mess? I wouldn't trade what's in the toilet for one.

[@julianmorrisco]

I agree on your take re their targeting, as in it seems crazy. But if you are looking from their PoV of aiming for the young and wealthy - probably Middle Eastern and LA ‘arty’ Dua Lipa loving crowd, they have played a blinder with this frankly silly campaign. The petrolheads and incels hate it but that’s not who they are aiming at. And that group have pushed the JLR name to the top of the comment piece list. The question is why not aim for that bunch, the petrolheads and incels I mean - I’d have thought they could be an almost captive market for JLR if they played their cards right. It’s possible they don’t have the cash JLR requires to move more upmarket. I hope they know something I don’t.

[@schrodingerscat1863]

Yes, I always thought they should have just embraced their market and played specifically to the middle aged man. Attempting to chase other markets has really been their biggest problem. They have no chance in the high end sector, not with their current dealer network and recent image. They needed to evoke days of old when Jag was at the top of their game to have any chance of that.

[@zXPeterz14]

@@schrodingerscat1863theyve done that for the past 2 new model cycles and both failed

[@DenUitvreter]

The 50K town I grew up in had the highest concentration of Mitsubishis outside of Japan, just because the dealer was a great guy who ran his business very well. In any market segment, getting a new car must be something to look forward too, not just to the car, it should be a joyeus occasion. You're not only selling a car, your selling a brand, a reputation and so many other things.

[@patrickchubey3127]

Aside from the gay fashion show on mars ad which I found confusing and irrelevant, if what I've been reading lately is true, then jaguar's move to a high end electric only car comes at a time when sales of high end electric cars are failing. It just seems like throwing good money after bad, as if the company is deliberately trying to go out of business.

[@commanchi7]

Feels like Jaguar fell into a rift in time and the year is still 2021

[@Josh_Quillan]

Bit of a catch-22 situation though, petrol is going away and either they adapt or die. What else would Jaguar do? Can you see them making low-end electric cars? To me the only real question is why they, and for that matter every other existing car company, isn't much further along with electric already. It's not like this is astounding new tech, some of the first cars ever made were electric, and just like petrol the latest tech is simply incremental improvement.

[@BeatTheSensor]

Maybe they're working on the theory that they won't be allowed to make proper cars in the future and only a very few will be able to afford their EVs?

[@patrickchubey3127]

It's always a possibility but you really never know. America has thrown off the woke yoke and elected a conservative government that promises to tank EV mandates, Canada is up to bat next with a conservative government poised to take over from the woke liberals, and the rest of the Western nations may be next. Mandates are not ordained by God but crooked politicians who may be voted out of power by a growing number of irate citizens.

[@vaska00762]

@@Josh_Quillan the problem is certainly wider though - the small hatchback is an endangered species, really only still existing in Japan, China and India. VAG is churning out high price SUVs, and not just for the VW and Audi brands, but also on the Skoda and Seat brands, which historically were treated as the "cheap" way to buy a Golf or Polo like car. And the same is seen with Ford, PSA, Renault, Stellantis - the small hatchback is disappearing from the market. The brands still making small cars are the Asian ones - Kia/Hyundai, Toyota, Honda and (ironically) MG do make small cars, but they too are going up in price, and all those brands are all too happy if you bought an SUV instead. Look at America, where people love to buy a pickup truck, that's physically larger than the tanks used in the Second World War. It's no wonder the Ford F150 is sometimes known as the "Suburban Panzer". Car manufacturers see the sorts of margins that they make in America, and think going in that direction is a good idea.

[@BM_PAZ]

I feel the whole car industry is ruined. I’m buying an electric car for business reasons and it’s the first time I don’t have any emotion. No excitement, nothing. I don’t like dealerships any more, I don’t like buying cars anymore. Such a shame as I still love cars.

[@wobblybobengland]

has been ruined by politicians deciding that their ideas were better for it than market demands are.

[@guzziwheeler]

I totally agree. Finally I can afford pretty much any car on the market (skip nonsense like Bugatti and such stuff), I just do not want a new car. None of them. They are all boring. And a the dealership, the hold their nose so high that it rains in, although I bought 6 new BMWs in 25 years there. They ignore you in the showroom. And do not like to work on my 11 years old car. I do not know what to buy. I trust none of them anymore. I also had two Jags, btw. The 1983 XJ6 was a bit outdated, but the X308 XJ8 was a very good car.

[@Rapscallion2009]

Same. There's a plethora of "that would do, I guess" offerings. Very little that makes me think "I want one".

[@MikoyanGurevichMiG21]

Not enough people are saying this, but it is true. We really are in a new malaise era, despite all the technological and safety related innovations.

[@totuudentorvi7781]

It's completely normal. You simply cannot love EVs. It's the same reason you can't love your refrigerator. An appliance is all they are.

[@anonymous_bot_bot]

Walked into an Alfa dealership when the 4c was launched, it was a big deal for me to part-ex an integrale, 45 minutes later still ignored. Bought a used Lotus and kept the integrale. Still have them both.

[@no-ux]

​@@anonymous_bot_bot imagine swapping an integrale for a 4c, part exchange too. You got lucky that the universe protected you from yourself that day.

[@davidgavin7280]

Lucky escape

[@roadislandlife]

​@@no-uxI was thinking the same then noticed the username? All for engagement?

[@sweden_ove2074]

So sad. Alfa dealers are horrible in Sweden too. They do no commercial, no customer care, and you are lucky if the car gets fixed in a day if broken down. Luckily they are quite reliant nowdays. I've only had one issue, the electronics in the gear shifter (8 g zf automat). It's a known problem in BMW, but in Alfa, the garages have problem understanding it's that fault. Still I love my Alfa Giulia.

[@pokeboi5438]

I can imagine it’s even worse under Stellantis

[@originalforgery]

Back in 2010 me and the wife fancied doing some car shopping. We knew roughly what we wanted, a convertible ideally but not a certainty but something with a sports car feel to it - in other words we were pretty flexible so off to our local Jaguar dealer we trotted. Being December, it was pretty cold so I didn't turn up in a three piece suit. We hung about for 10 minutes until a sales rep slithered into the showroom (when I say slithered I mean Eel in a bucket of snot type of slithered). Couldn't afford a new XK but they had a couple outside one of which was a convertible. We wanted a car for weekends away so boot space was reasonably important for practicality. Wife asks Mr Slime how the top folds (meaning how much boot space it takes up when its down) with a smirk he replys "well you just press a button" Well, that was that - wife wouldn't have had one if it were free. So, over to the BMW dealer next door. After 20 minutes stood in the showroom I managed to gain someones attention. Interested in an M3 convertible - have you got one in stock or in for service we could take a look at? No - came the one word answer. OK, that's a shame. Have you got a 3 series convertible we could look at? "That's totally different - do you even know what an M3 is? Yes - it £57,458. Oh, we've not got off to a good start have we - he said. Not really I said, the reason I want to look at one is to see if there's any boot space when the tops down - can't imagine there's much difference between them. He then asks where we're from - told him to which he replied "why didn't you go to such & such in Barnstaple" Because its not next door to a Jag dealer like you are I replied. Decided to give up but as we were driving out we passed our local Nissan dealer - oooo, GTR, we might as well have a look before we go home. Drove in and parked about 100yds from the entrance. There were two GTR's parked outside, we walked half way around the first one when the salesman poked his head out of the door. "We've got a new one in the showroom - would you like a coffee"? 45 minutes later the deal was done.

[@chrisslater3174]

Great story, though I bet you had trouble putting the top down on that GTR! 😅 Great profile pic, too.

[@originalforgery]

@@chrisslater3174 I had a hacksaw.....🤣🤣😂😂🤣🤣😂😂

[@josephberrie9550]

yes slimey arrogant sales people are still in the game..................why must be the bosses nephew

[@Lee_Pitcher]

Brilliant. Customer service has gone down the pan everywhere these days. Really don't know what's going on. It's almost like they're doing you a favour to help you part with your money for their benefit. A friend of mine was in the market for a 488 Pista Ferrari (some £300k's worth). Spoke to Jardine at Colchester his most local dealer. Someone was going to give him a call back. Chased again. Same thing. He bought one elsewhere

[@tonyhull4978]

I bought a 3.0d XJ, 2 weeks later, i started the car, and it cut out within 3 seconds, didnt think much of it. When it happened again, it was taken to the main dealer. After a total of 6 days, it was brought back to me 'Fixed', Great ! A few days later, it happened again, so off the maindealer it went. After 19 days, they informed me that they could not replicate the problem, so therefore cant fix it ! I got the car back, after around a week, it did the same thing, so i called the dealer and told them i am rejecting the car and want a refund, which they reluctantly agreed to do. The next car i bought was not a Jaguar. It was a lexus es300h, what a difference with the maindealer experience, marvellous just like it shoukd be after spending all that money.

[@larkhill2119]

A friend's Jaguar was also returned after weeks in the garage and multiple trips unable to find a door rattle. I figured out it was the rear shock, not the door and the lack of foam in the door pillar where the noise appeared to come from, but the return was arranged by that time. They bought a Mercedes after a year they had stop-start problems. I suggested the battery which took hours of service before they replaced and fixed the problem. Pay mechanics decent pay and stop the job fixed rate so they can look at problems and learn beyond the fault code.

[@senseofthecommonman]

Have to say my experience of Lexus is way above any other dealer I’ve been to.

[@person.X.]

The mystery to me is why people still buy marques that are absolutely notorious for poor build quality and dreadful reliability. I can understand it if it is a company car so not your problem but if you are buying and maintaining a car with your own money and rely on that car then it makes sense to do some in depth research into which makes and models have excellent reliability. However superficially desirable or "good to drive" a car is supposed to be all that is pointless if the car is not dependable (unless it is a spare hobby car etc).

[@johnchristmas7522]

Well Tony, you have just found out what a lot of us already know - Toyota!

[@schrodingerscat1863]

Lexus really know how to make their customers feel special, that is one of their key strengths in entering the luxury market, they understood that people who buy luxury brands expect great service. Jaguar has no change in the luxury market with their existing dealer network.

[@wobblybobengland]

I am a chassis architectural engineer for an OEM, and I have worked with a couple of guys previously who are now at Jaguar and who are involved in these studies. I have never had a Jag, although Dad has a lovely seventies XJC 12. What astounds me is that they are putting a design study forward to the public as a future strategy direction.This is like something we would hand to our senior platform to present to senior management to consider for future concepts, this done at the stage after we would recieve the inital studies from styling and then done a few months of work with the interior engineers. It underlines to me simply that they have a huge gap in their product portfolio, XE XF F-Type are now finished, seems to me that they have some serious engineering hours ahead to keep their customers convinced they have a future.

[@lasskinn474]

if it's a design study and not an intended model they messed up the public relations regarding it's launch. I think it's more indicative of them definitely becoming a technology buyer not a technology developer, ie no more even customized engines let alone bespoke engines. so no more engineering, just styling.

[@plektosgaming]

@@lasskinn474 Oh, look - more interiors straight out of a German art museum. Not the art, mind you, but the walls and floors and so on. Austere and minimalist carbon fiber, (stone?) and "eco" materials ( read: plastic ). As you said, a complete focus on styling and looks and nothing at all to do with making it a nice place to sit in, drive, or even giving 5 seconds of thought about reliability. 100% disposable EVs. And you wonder why cars from the 70s and 80s, as bad as they were at the time are skyrocketing in value. Because they can at least be fixed and have soft comfortable seats.

[@wobblybobengland]

@@lasskinn474 they can't homologate it or industrialise it at that stage

[@markd3250]

Well since the E and F series are done. We're now in the G series which, based on what we've been shown, is the God-Awful series.

[@jimproctor4687]

Totally disagree. To blame dealers for Jaguar's woes is grossly unfair. The success of any franchise is a partnership between supplier (manufacturer) and the dealer. If the quality of the goods supplied is poor the dealer irrespective of how good they are has an uphill struggle to maintain customer expectations. In the case of JLR it is mission impossible. The churn of staff within JLR dealers is colossal as the sheer scale of quality issues overwhelms even the best dealers and staff. The reality is that front line staff find themselves trying to defend the indefensible, suffering abuse, and stress often reaching the levels of danger to mental health. JLR has consistently swept quality issues under the carpet and lambasted dealers for so called poor performance in customer satisfaction. Management at JLR are so blinkered and arrogant they fail to see the obvious. Success in customer satisfaction is a partnership. Produce a competitively priced quality product then you can rightly expect the dealer to deliver the highest level of satisfaction at the sharp end where product meets customer.

[@keithianlocke]

"High margins" really means "overpriced dressed up cheap shite".

[@michaelbacon561]

Well said! There seems to be too much in these last few decades of just trying to fleece customers in all industries, not just motor. I don't mind paying a fair price if I feel I have obtained a good, properly engineered and reliable product. Instead we get shoddy engineering resulting from the desire to increase profits not just by charging exorbitant prices but also by cutting costs so that reliability goes out of the window, eg: Ford Ecotec and Stellantis Puretech wet cambelt engines, plastic thermostat housings on Minis that split and leak coolant, far too much underdeveloped electronics on nearly everything that dealers can't fix....the list is probably endless.

[@MaxStraesser]

Would you include Porsche and Ferrari (highest margin auto manufacturers) in that metric then? A touch of realism probably helps - companies exist to make profits, and if they don't have sufficient profit margins they won't exist for long, simple as. So the question becomes whether you'd rather have Jaguar making potentially, even if unlikely to be, fun cars, or not have Jaguar exist at all?

[@85NickT]

They've been pulling that off for years with LR, can't blame them for trying it with the J side of the name.

[@keithianlocke]

@@MaxStraesser well the "supercars", and extreme luxury brands such as RR, produce very low volume runs of their models. So the high prices per unit has to share out between deign and production costs. Mass volume means more units to share across same design production cost ie cheaper if mass volume. Porsche is questionable, because its more expensive cars are evolutions of the same model.. so some of the design, and production costs are already partially, or fully covered by previous iteration. And it must be added in that manufacturers can keep low volume and high price to keep "exclusive" to raise profile and desirability.

[@NubletPie278]

​@@MaxStraesser Yes absolutely 1000%. A Ferrari 296 is nearly double the price of an Audi R8. New Ferraris have mediocre interiors and sound but cost more than ever. An F-Type SVR was another £25k cheaper.

[@jaywalker1233]

can’t blame the advertising agency for creating this - they delivered exactly what the CEO +his board of muppets told them to. Heads are gonna roll…🤣🤣

[@TheRealWindlePoons]

The big cat brand symbol will become a muppet polishing a turd.

[@Tarrer123]

100% agree👍. Everyone knows, or really ought to know, that advertising agencies are full of “creative” types, who are going to come up with new and colourful ideas. They were just doing what Jaguar asked them to do. It is the senior people at Jaguar who gave the go-ahead for all this who are at fault.

[@georgechickful]

Perfume advert, for a car, as another advertising type termed it. Big old miss match.

[@rockets4kids]

To be fair, Jaguar likely made the decision to go all electric first. Then they went to the ad agency. The ad agency did a research study to figure out the type of people spending big bucks on an electric vehicle. Then they made an advert to target those people. In that context, everything makes perfect sense.

[@sunlightprism]

Messaging over profits, pay no attention to the banker behind the curtain.

[@zolnte996]

"Delete ordinary copy nothing" Then Jaguar goes ahead and puts a font on their cars stolen from PowerPoint

[@adnaanu]

@@zolnte996 looks like Dysons font.

[@liamhalford5424]

It's the exact font of the smart car

[@laurensnieuwland4657]

Don't forget them copying literally every Rolls-Royce made in the past few years with their new design.

[@citrusjuicebox]

And basically plagiarizing the 2010s queer-baiting playbook

[@RichardHarrold1991]

@@laurensnieuwland4657 and the rear end off the Chrysler Crossfire.

[@nekite1]

The Japanese attitude to quality control in their manufacturing processes has always impressed me. I did a BSc Hons degree back in the day in automotive engineering, and their attitude of refine and perfect their products I think has spilled over into their customer relations sector. The LS 400 was once upon a time the most reliable car ever and that was a good 30 years ago.

[@MarkusFolkesson]

A swedish guy have notice a few things that is line with what you say. A few years ago I check jaguar out. The information I want was ridiculous hard to find. When I finally find the list of standard equippment I find they try to sell a £30 000 car without heated seats in Sweden. The cars that was sold in a country that is partly inside the north polar zone have electric seats as standard - but not heated. Dacia have heated seats as standard in Sweden ffs! That is Jaguar Customer Care for you!

[@DirtyDingusMcGee]

Pointless comment.

[@MarkusFolkesson]

@DirtyDingusMcGee You missing my point. My point is to emphasize what Jimmy say - they clearly have no idea what the customers are looking for.

[@codyjarrett9685]

I get the same dealership problems with my BMW so Jaguar aren't on their own

[@tommyblackwell3760]

Exactly why my BMW recently became a Ford.

[@blackvulcan100]

@@tommyblackwell3760 Good move.

[@LaurentiusTriarius]

Neither my X5 or f80 ever saw the dealer's service shop floor. You have to have your own specialist who actually care...

[@richh33]

My experience too. Altho I wonder how much of that is that I'm a very experienced engineer and don't fall for their bull. Car just out of warranty so the first trip to my local BM specialist will be informative.

[@senseofthecommonman]

Part of the reason I would never buy another BM. Worst dealer service of any car I’ve owned.

[@orvillefindley8117]

Jaguar are bankrupt, they just don't know it yet. 🙄

[@Cloxxki]

Morally more so than financially.

[@adrianbennett3761]

Without Land Rover they would be

[@martinaston1715]

Agreed the current senior leadership team are already in the “ ejector” seat they,ll be gone early this year , Faguar will be in China hands by the end of 2025..

[@karlhulme8014]

@@adrianbennett3761yep Tata bought Land Rover, Jaguar was an unwanted freebie.

[@nickz4993]

Are you daft? They absolutely know it and this was their last ditch effort to get attention

[@liamrabnett3829]

Just put the XJ back in production honestly. With an updated infotainment system, it would still have a more plush & updated interior than most new cars.

[@stevenfarrall3942]

Yes. Better than a Panamera?

[@aliveRaptor2929]

I would buy that please 🙏

[@C.I...]

They cancelled the new XJ very recently. It was quite close to production - they were testing camoflaged development cars.

[@ericrawson2909]

I want the x308 shape with the 550ps V8.

[@RichardHarrold1991]

@@ericrawson2909 X308 wouldn't pass EuroNCAP even 25 years ago let alone now. Bear in mind it was an evolution of the Mk10 platform of 1961... the AJ133SC would tear that thing in two.

[@arjenootes9017]

You are so right! We went to a Jaguar/RangeRover dealer in Perth UK. There was a problem with the brakes of our XKR. We were on holiday, whenwe arrived we spoke to 6 diferent people all asking the same. Giving us the impression we are npot welcome, unless we had an appointment and a Rangerover. Than a glamarous lady came along and offered us to possibly be able to check in two days. On suggestion of another customer overhearing us, we went across the street, and we were up and running in half an hour.

[@nicklowe536]

Our local JLR dealer has been rebuilt after a fire and no longer has Jaguar on the building just range rover discovery defender. The only Jaguar badge is on the old totem sign at the entrance.

[@celki_boi]

I think one thing nobody is mentioning is that Jaguar just doesn't need to exist. There is too much competition in the car world, and the pie can only get so thin (with mass manufacturing needed to make cars actually appeal to consumers). When I go buy a phone I can choose between 4 brands and bunch of Chinese low end slop. When I go buy CPUs for my PC I can choose between Intel and AMD. But when I want to buy a luxury car (not a car, a luxury car, so we are getting more niche) I can choose between: BMW Mercedes Audi Lexus Infiniti Alfa Romeo Cadillac (if you are American) Cupra (if you are European) And if I want a "fuck you" luxury car (even bigger niche), I can buy a: Porsche Maserati Bentley Rolls Royce And if I want to buy a "fuck you" luxury SUV (we are getting ultra niche here), I can buy a: Porsche Cayenne Maserati Levante Bentley Bentayga Lamborghini Urus Ferrari Purosangue Rolls Royce Cullinan Range Rover Hell, do you want to buy an EV hypercar (THE NICHEST OF THEM ALL)? You can buy a: Rimac Nevera (for more road focus) Rimac Nevera R (for more track oriented performance) Lotus Evija Pinninfarina Battista Don't like that? Want a manual ICE hypercar? I can offer you: GMA T.50 GMA T.33 Hennessey Venom F5 Pagani Utopia Nilu27 thingy (if it gets made) Where can Jaguar go, that doesn't already have an extreamly saturated market?

[@kingoneeyed3433]

This is without doubt the best car related comment I've read in many a month, well thought out and concise, Well done Sir.

[@TheMitch12356]

While you are right in some aspects. Infinity, Cadillac, Alfa Romeo, and even Lexus (in some markets) don't sell well at all. Jaguar definitely can enter that space if they actually make a desirable product. In terms of luxury cars. Maserati don't sell, that brand has been struggling for the last decade. Bentley and Rolls Royce are almost different levels of customers. But there is potential for some customers to be had in that market. I do agree when it comes to Luxury SUV and EVs. Both markets are oversaturated. Manual ICE hypercar that you mentioned are ridiculously expensive with a very limited market. If Jaguar were smart they could create a bespoke limited edition (800 cars) supercar priced between 650,000 to 750,000. There is currently no one in that space, creating such a vehicle. But must be with the right powertrian (no plug hybrid).

[@orvillefindley8117]

@@celki_boi Jaguar comes with a pedigree the others don't have. If only the people running Jaguar understood this.

[@AbnormalAspirations]

I must not have noticed those luxury Cupras they released.

[@dorstefan]

Well said. If they disappear today nobody will notice.

[@jonathanaskham3333]

Totally agree with the Lexus point (in fact I found myself saying it out loud before you mentioned it) I bought 2 CT200’s back about 10 years ago (when Hybrids were insanely efficient tax write-offs for businesses) and, although I was buying their cheapest model (and, at the time very young for a Lexus customer) , I was always treated with respect. In fact, when we had a tyre roll off the rim (caused by an errant nail, no fault of Lexus) my wife called the dealership in a panic, and they recovered her and the car; fed and watered her whilst it was repaired. I reckon that experience and the £6 sandwich they provided was a major contributing factor to us buying another without question.

[@lukeshardlow768]

Went to my local dealer to pick up some jaguar parts whilst at work (in work uniform) the parts guy was on the phone so I walked round and had a look at the cars whilst waiting. Got pointed at and told parts is back down there. Got my parts and have never been back. At one point we had 7 JLR vehicles in the family and no one used the main dealer for parts or servicing as the service staff are so rude and useless.

[@neil1997]

@@lukeshardlow768 similar experience, albeit at mercedes and wearing tree cutting gear. I pointed out to them I was collecting nearly 2 grands with of parts (for vans).. was like the stuck up air hostess from little Britain

[@erwinkruger-haye2698]

@@lukeshardlow768 same happened to me at numerous dealers…I owned very large retail stores and worked in the same uniform and name badge as anyone on my floor…Went to buy a Toyota Prado..asked about difference betweeen VX and GX….was told “very expensive” ..so I bought a Volvo XC90…Went to buy pickup trucks at Chevrolet…was ignored totally until I loudly asked that if did a bank transfer today, could I get the vehicle tomorrow….then everyone jumped…had similar issues at BMW too….that and the local BMW trying to sell a written off and rebuilt vehicle as a demo to my wife….never owned a BMW or Toyota…2 Touareg’s, 2 Tiguans and 3 Amarok cos of the people in a VW dealership… And I am sure that customers had similar issues in my store too, no matter how hard we tried to avoid it… Training is all one can do…I do find it harsh to blame the brand though…. But as humans that is what we do..

[@sunlightprism]

The real problem is corporations don't have to be profitable as long as they deliver the messaging and conditioning that bankers desire. THAT's reality.

[@NinjaRunningWild]

Because they get their income via Blackrock & Vanguard shareholders.

[@liam4010]

I'm 27, my dad had a Jaguar, and that lead me to go on to buy one, both XF's. I loved my dad's car and now my car, but of the 4 dealerships I've had to work with through both my dad's car and my car only 1 was a pleasant experience. One sent the car back to me without the issue resolved, and they didn't even clear the check engine light. One took 2 days to get my car back to me, and when they did it wasn't even washed, and they had somehow fucked up my exhaust. The 3rd wouldn't drop me off at a spot 10 km away from the dealership (The otherside of town in this case) and also didn't diagnose the problems correctly. I agree working with the dealerships is a huge problem, and like you said it's supposed to be a luxury experience that they just are not meeting.

[@1878EFC]

Their problem is that even if you like the new car (when it eventually arrives) you'd never buy one because your mates will take the piss... mercilessly... Jaguar used to be a cool brand, now its a laughing stock

[@PeteMcK500]

@@1878EFC - don't buy a car for what others think. Buy what you want for you.

Had Jag actually produced the twin-turbine hybrid C-X75, I honestly would have sold all my other classic cars and mortgaged my house if necessary to own THE most technologically advanced surface vehicle on the planet. Ever. Blisteringly fast and beautiful too. But this new joke woke mess? I wouldn't trade what's in the toilet for one.

[@TheSeventhSeal]

More of a Bud Light moment than a Ratner.

[@zXPeterz14]

People who have made enough money to buy a new one will have the self confidence to not care

[@tturtle1659]

@@zXPeterz14 problem is, there will be very few such people.

[@cluckstube]

Your point about the dealers is absolutely spot-on, at least for what my nearest dealer was like. Whilst waiting for the order books to open on the facelift F-Type, back at the end of November 2019, I popped into my local dealer. I spent 30 minutes walking around their showroom model (the old shape one), sitting inside it and then looking at the colour panels to reinforce my decision on paint colour. In that 30 minutes not one single person bothered to approach me. To this day, it boggles my mind that nobody there thought "Hang on, this guy has spent 30 minutes looking at our flagship car, touching the materials inside, looking at colour blocks etc, maybe we should go and talk to him". I hate to see anybody lose their job, but some dealerships REALLY don't help themselves.

[@chrism-e]

Friend had an F-type, religiously serviced every year Dick Lovett, sold it to his mate after 4 years, few months in the air filters disintegrated and ingested into the engine, the date stamps on the filters 2019!

[@cluckstube]

@chrism-e believe it or not, the recommended service interval for them, at least on the V8 facelift, is every 4 years!

[@xyz-md2mv]

I experienced exactly the same attitude....

[@stuchly1]

That's so wild to hear.

[@timprice5]

Experienced the same in Bristol. Now have an E Class Mercedes rather than an XF Sportbrake. To be fair the Mercedes dealer were just as poor at their after care (Bristol again) but by then they'd had our money 🙄

[@laurencemoore5737]

Almost bought an F Type a while back. The sales experience was enough of a warning to stay away. I remember waiting 30 mins beyond appointment time, salesperson was rude, car was filthy and out of petrol, drive cut short due to appointment with vip customer and sent finance details for f pace. Still, I bought a new Porsche 911 and never heard from the dealership in 3 years of ownership. No follow-up, no invites to events etc. clearly not the kind of punter they want (I refused their finance and made it clear that I was not interested in GT models and would not be churning through cars) so perhaps that was the reason.

[@JJVernig]

And that's when they are trying to sell you something. What happens when there is a real problem? I had the other way around, a acute problem with my BMW and they had a problem getting a replacement car, but at the end I worked half a day in the office of the general manager of the dealership. Just by a service rep questioning what I really needed, and that was just a place to do work and make videocalls.

[@primafacie6442]

Same experience with BMW, even after two new X5s, so buying a new car doesn’t get you any customer service.

[@johnchristmas7522]

They actually did you a favour!

[@edmontontangobar4991]

Correct on the importance of the dealer experience. For example, I drive a 25-year old, high mileage Lexus. When I take it to the dealer for an oil change, they give me a brand new Lexus loaner vehicle to use for the day and they wash my car and wipe down the interior surfaces for when I pick my car up. Will I buy another Lexus? Damn straight!

[@dannywhite132]

A note about 4:00. From multiple people at Jag, they have confirmed that the concept is very close to the production design, and if you go sit out in Warwickshire, we have already seen a few of them (in camo) driving around the streets

[@MichaelToddBurdine]

Don’t want electric.. I would never buy a Jag without a big engine in it. Who wants a cat that doesn’t purr? That said, you are exactly right about needing a great service/dealer experience.

[@Peter-y5y9i]

EV's hardly need servicing. And many will blow the doors off every ICE except hypercars. And at a fraction of the price.

[@dcarbs2979]

My experience with Ferrari really was the 3-bags-full treatment. Even though I only had a dog of a 308 at the nadir of their value, which I ended up selling almost for scrap after their assessment. i.e. I didn't spend a lot with them to get that treatment.

[@Z-u-m-a]

I'd guess it's safe to assume the staggering arrogance and ignorance displayed by Jaguar in their relaunch is here to stay. At least whilst whoever is at the top setting that tone-deaf tone is allowed to stay.

[@johnchristmas7522]

If Jaguar are still around. Go Woke, Go Broke.

[@tobiasstaley2144]

Spot on with the analysis of Jag dealers. I have always loved the cars and still do. However, it was my experience with the dealers that forced me to sell my XJ8. Despite their factory training they did not seem to understand even the basics of how a car works or how to troubleshoot even basic stuff. Every single issue took 3 visits because they misdiagnosed the issue, failed to order the part, ordered the wrong part or had to see whether the warranty covered it. I needed the car and could not afford to waste this much time. Dealt with 10 other manufacturers (non luxury) over the last 30 years in Canada and they have always been significantly better at treating me better and knowing how to fix cars. Again, I was happy with the car itself and would love to buy another one if it was not for this

[@lasskinn474]

supposedly it's been going woke for a while, stereotypically so, at the higher levels. what does that mean? the board messed up keeping tabs on the company.

[@redbarchetta8782]

That concept looks like a futuristic redesign of the Chrysler Crossfire.

[@RichardHarrold1991]

Crossfire meets R-R Wraith.

[@AnAmE4it]

I was thinking Dodge Magnum.

[@Dave-in-France]

Hi there JM, a small positive example of todays Jaguar experience. A pal of mine had promised himself a new Jaguar and eventually after loads of delays he took delivery of his E-pace and he loved it. Right up until it decided IT decided to empty the brake master cylinder of it's brake fluid. Consequences were loads of lights on the dashboard and odd-feeling brakes. He called me and we had a look to see what was going on and found that the front lhs brake flexy was defective. So we phoned Jaguar Assistance (17 hrs on the friday night) who were, genuinely marvelous. They first arranged for a breakdown truck (arrived within 45 mins) to come and have a look; then it was taken to Jaguar Limoges. My pal asked for a courtesy car and one was provided via Enterprise rental, free of charge. His car was repaired within 48 hrs of the dealer receiving it and my mate was able to return his courtesy car at a location 5 mins walk from the Jaguar dealer. So he is now feeling like all Jaguar owners SHOULD feel. Hope that 'balances the books' ever so slightly. I'm watching the big picture of Jaguars future very carefully as I am also a big fan of the marque.

[@planetdisco4821]

You know what, you’re absolutely right mate! Watching this reminded me that back in about 2017 I was working on a high-rise development over the road from Melbourne’s main Jaguar/Rover dealership and being somewhat of a fan of the brand (my uncle owned a classic and truly beautiful E-type) I was seriously considering trading in my V8 SSv Ute and getting something a bit more stylish so after work one afternoon I wandered over to the dealership and wandered into the foyer where because I was wearing hi-viz construction attire covered in the miasma of an honest days work, I was studiously ignored by the receptionist for exactly long enough to remind me of my status in the social hierarchy before with an audible sigh she looked up from her desk and said “May I help you?” in a tone that suggested the opposite was the preferable option. “‘Yes luv,” I replied, deliberately laying on a really thick Aussie accent “I was wunderin’ if I cood speeek to a rep ayeee” “Please take a seat” she replied coldly, pointing towards the sort of cafe area with plastic seats and tables “and I’ll see if one is available” Ignoring her I walked over to the white leather couches in the show room and sprawled over them while checking the time on my phone. Ten minutes went by. Twenty. Then after half an hour i walked back up to the desk and asked the ice-sculpture carved into the shape of a receptionist how much longer it would be. “Oh, I’m sorry, none are currently available” “Well thankyou for letting me know so promptly and have a nice day” THIS IS WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED Thing is, despite the hi-viz and grease, I was a rigger on the tower crane on that job over the road which combined with the long hours and high risk-work allowances literally made me one of the most highly paid construction workers on the planet. And I was prepared to spend well over 100k on a vehicle that afternoon. Glad I didn’t! wound up holding onto the SSV V8 Ute and selling it to a mate. Recently brought myself an almost new V8 turbo diesel land cruiser Ute which probably cost as much as a mid-tier Jag or Rover but will also be RELIABLE. Plus the instant I walked into the Toyota dealership in hi-viz I practically had to beat the reps off with a stick. Those guys worked out about two decades ago that it’s the random walk-ins in orange shirts with reflective strips that are the most likely to point at the car on the turntable in the window and say “I’ll have that” I’d actually forgotten that this even happened until I saw this video. Nice one mate!

[@1stglass]

Sony Bravia advert. Thank you! I knew I'd seen it somewhere else and couldn't remember where.

[@hamstirrer6882]

I know, copy nothing by copying every generic mid 2010s tech advert ever 😆

[@longsighted]

From Australia, all the complex cars are suffering from support because of low technical grade of personnel. The technology has pushed the standard technical ability into the lower end of the rocket science level when problems get difficult. Where has elegant simplicity gone?

[@mattiapresti7295]

More than low skills of personell, I would point that most off all theese electronic technological features do not require technical personell because there's nothing to repair. If the infotainment system fails, there's nothing to do than changing it. I broke a piece of plastic related to the infotainment system on my car some years ago, the only solution to repair it would have been buying a 1200€ new keyboard, fortunately the car was under warranty, you could also hire an engineer than a redneck who made a professional course, but if the pieces aren't meant to be repaired there's nothing to do with

[@Peter-y5y9i]

Into EVs. Far fewer moving parts, much less brake wear, fewer fluids to replace, no plugs, injectors, timing belts etc etc.

[@citrusjuicebox]

Fewer moving parts don't make a less complex car, especially when the manufacturers aren't keen on repairability

[@johnchristmas7522]

Its called Greed is Good.

[@noname-gp6hk]

EVs move away from mechanical failures to electronics failures. You can get mechanical parts from anywhere, electronics parts have closed source software that can only come from the OEM and they can just stop making them and then you simply can't fix your EV anymore.

[@richarddownes5762]

Jaguar seem to have been treating their dealer network as 'optional' for some time - which is a big mistake. Asking dealerships to invest huge sums to upgrade their facilities whist telling them that they will not have ANY new cars to sell for over a year is madness - why would any business do that? No wonder that the 'Jaguar experience' has gone down the tubes... Let alone the Ingenium engine problems. A shame, as I have owned Jaguars for over 45 years....

[@Kalepsis]

I absolutely agree with you, the dealers are the worst. And in my experience owning a top-of-the-line XJL, their service centers are solely responsible for the brand's reputation for unreliability. They keep trying to tell me the car needs things it definitively does not need, like brake rotors that I personally replaced less than 3000 miles ago, or telling me that new engine air filters will cost $218 to replace; I did it myself for a grand total of $14. The car itself is actually extremely reliable. They really need to fix the dealer/service network.

[@darylwalford8697]

You are spot on, customer service is very important and even more so with cars (EV's) becoming more like very expensive appliances. Some months ago I was at my closest Porsche dealer picking up a part for my 986, I went for a look around the showroom and despite it being obvious to the salesman that I was never going to buy a new car he was still very welcoming and helpful, put a smile on my face and makes me want to go back.

[@GazMoby]

If you really want a terrible experience visit and Audi dealer, the buying experience is awful and after sales is worse.

[@OliverBrowne-g3m]

@@GazMoby VW/Audi group are in a very bad position in the current market.

[@JohnAdams-kc8wx]

Yes that was my recent experience BMW in Preston however was excellent (family owned I gather)

[@tepidtuna7450]

I had 2 Audis, down to 1, aiming for 0.

[@geztaylor]

Have tried the Jaguar experience it's hilariously bad. I don't want to type to much but let's just look at what happens even you walk in to a dealership. They have a reception desk right at the front well away from the sales and service desks and with a big screen behind the desk to block your view from the rest of the view. So when this is unmanned (and this happens frequently) you stand there like a pudding unable to speak to anyone and no one spotting you. Honestly I kid you not.

[@Cuzzazbuzz]

Agree. I was treated like an idiot at the local dealer in Teesside so I went over the road to another manufacturer and bought from them.

[@nickb-]

The fact that people are talking about Jaguar is, sadly, fairly irrelevant. They are still the best part of TWO YEARS away from actually putting a new car into a customer's hands. What a way to kill a brand.

[@Kulumuli]

It's the cardinal sin of any brand to think their customers are idiots and they can sell sh*t when the brand is attractive. It takes time to build up a reputation but no time to lose it.

[@billyccall5774]

No one ever talked about Jag now everyone is and by the time a car drops no one will remember the add beacuse they'll be triggered by the next thing...

[@jaspervanderploeg6199]

Jaguar was 90% dead already

[@sub7up.]

@@nickb- This add was the official funeral of the brand, now it will be forgotten..

[@lewlewis6511]

I drove car transporters for decades, many dealers treated us with disdain at best especially German marques, Toyota/Lexus dealers always treated us like one of the family let alone the customer, even down to my local dealer, whom i used to deliver new loads to regularly, letting me have a new car at staff discount cost. Attention to QC at Burnaston factory and the import centre at Portbury was something else, this wasn't always the case at other marques. The thing is when a maker takes responsibility for its product and treats all people, as well as the customer, with respect throughout the production and delivery chain too it has an effect, everyone in that chain takes more care because you want that company to succeed and be there for ever, you're quite right Jay about this 'family' thing.

[@kathrynmorgan6718]

I used to be a trade plater, the only dealership that offered a coffee( every time) was Lexus, the car was always ready , keys to hand, so impressed was I that I bought a ls400 at auction, had the local main dealer do a full check over(free) , unfortunately,during the test drive the drivers wife was involved in a crash ,so he dashed off to the hospital. When my better half arrived to collect car ,she was given their ls 460 demo which was swopped round the next day……..was there a bunch of flowers …..indeed there was! Actual very little cost to dealer but a happy customer……….who the went on to buy a fair few Lexus cars!

[@kevinmoffatt]

Used to deliver new motorbikes to BMW dealers and they had the same attitude; deliveries were an inconvenience and they made it hard work. Add to that the fact the truck was usually blocking a main road in the town centre and it all made for a hardday.Never, ever got offered a cup of anything.

[@nunyabidness3075]

People who are jerks are jerks. There are a few talented suck ups, but they are just jerks being phony.

[@RichardHarrold1991]

@@nunyabidness3075 and then there are Lexus dealers who sincerely want to do business the right way.

[@steve5772]

My only experience of a toyota dealer as a customer was buying a rocker cover gasket for a 18 year old car. I truly appreciated how I was a waste of any dealerships time, i really would have blamed them if they hadnt bothered. The part i needed was a devil to find on the system, and they got me a coffee while another member of staff came to look it up.

[@andyevans2000]

Thanks

[@cartagenapirate]

I had my Aston Vanquish in for yet another 8000 Euro repair (one of the last I have put up with). Walked into the show room. Two sales guys were watching me from a glass cubicle. When I reached the second car one of them stuck his head out the door and called "ey, can I help you" in the same voice he would have shouted "don´t put your paws on that car" and made no effort to leave his office.

[@gc7820]

It’s not their Ratner moment, if it were that the CEO would’ve had to have come out, launched the product then told everyone it’s really crap. It’s their BA project utopia moment - when BA rebranded in around 2000 and ditched the Britishness by having ethnic tail art from all round the world (except on Concorde which got a stylised Union flag design called ‘Chatham’) then after about 12months of doubling down on it they quietly fired the chairman who came up with it and spent the next few years repainting all the planes with the Concorde tail art.

[@john1703]

But Jaguar (and Land Rover) SUVs really are crap.

[@citrusjuicebox]

A British airline decorating their planes with the colors of the peoples that the British have terrorized? Sounds quite British to me.

[@Skiddins]

@@john1703 If they were only 'crap' we wouldn't see so many on the roads, they're everywhere. Their problem is reliability.

[@BeatTheSensor]

@@Skiddins Which is the same thing as "crap", but they look nice and they appeal to a certain type, irrespective of their lack of "reliability".

[@topenglish6674]

You don´t see many JLR SUV´s in West Africa, unless they have Lagos plates. In that hot, humid environment with poor roads many of which are unpaved medium size Japanese 4X4´s are favoured, rugged, reliable, easy to work on and ideally suited to that environment.

[@cervelo9465]

I used to work in 3D imaging for dental implants. I worked for Henry Schein (formerly Minerva), and the supplying manufacturer was Sirona (formerly Siemens). The standards of customer care - before during and after were so high. Car manufacturer's and their car dealership could learn a hell of a lot from other industries. Other industries have customer service which is super high and this is where the car industry needs to be.

[@kevinmoffatt]

It doesn't cost any more for the staff to feel they have brand ownership and they're being paid anyway. Everyone enjoys their job more if they feel they are part of something worthwhile.

[@discovermetaldetecting]

.....I remember buying my first RR Sport at a dealership. They ploughed me with soft soap and proper coffee! When I returned after 4 weeks because the air suspension failed on one side of the car.....it was like I'd contracted leprosy. No further coffees followed and I was confronted by very rude staff.....they had my money! Gaz.

[@cliffm6566]

Jay you so right about the “dealer/customer” experience. I own 2 Lexus (Lexi?) and they have nailed the customer interface. Wherever I take either of my cars for service it it the same, I feel respected and valued as a customer. This oddly enough is not easy to copy, I’ve owned Cadillacs, Benzes, other Japanese brands and though they sometimes try it never really works the Lexus way. Thst is why I will always come back to Lexus. I cannot even imagine Jaguar replicating that experience. It breaks my heart to see such a famous brand flush itself down the toilet.

[@Rob02138]

I had an XJ8 (two actually). Took it in for routine service including new brake pads all around. I asked them to rotate the wheels as well. When I picked up the car there was a ~$60 charge for rotating the wheels (not balancing). I complained to the service manager that the wheels were off the car for the brake job and all they had to do was put them back on in a different position! He reluctantly agreed to drop the price to $30. Told him congrats on making $30 today, you just lost many many thousands more. Never went back except once when they had just acquired Maserati. I was looking at the new Gran Turismo and a sales guy and sales manager came over to chat me up. I told them this story and that I just wanted to see the car in person locally before going to the adjacent city to purchase a Gran Turismo there. The look on their faces was priceless, almost worth it. Never considered buying a Jag after that, and certainly now never will. They are a dead brand. Unplug the ventilator and call the funeral home to pick up the body.

[@krugmeup2162]

Yep stupid cheap people.

[@adow77]

I had a Discovery. There was an extra $80 service charge for 'inpecting the suspension' because I’d ‘taken it off road’. I refused to pay, and they backed down. They were rude, superscilious and inflexible. The dealership was closed eventually. I would never buy another JLR product despite the Disco being a lovely car in many ways. I now have a Pajero Sport. The service experience (friendly, excellent communication, remember my name, great listeners) could not be more different than JLR.

[@adamscarchannel5578]

I'll tell you another thing about Jag dealers, as a former USA dealer tech. Their warranties suck sometimes. It's a know fact that: the 3.0 and 5.0 liter Supercharged engines have massive coolant issues. Their CPO warranty won't pay for the rear coolant manifold part unless it's leaking. You change both manifolds and the thermostat all at once if you're smart. They are plastic parts and they always break.

[@nothingtoseaheardammit]

I've only bought a JLR product in July of 2024. I've only had 2 interactions with the dealer... one for a warranty job and one for an oil change. On the former, it was done according to expectations, even though it took longer than I had hoped (1 week for a windshield replacement). Communication wasn't great but it was adequate. The oil change/wiper replacement/cabin air filter job was done quickly while I drank their coffee in the showroom and looked at all the fancy new shiney things. But it cost me $760 to do it. Which I thought was ridiculous. I'll be doing them myself from now on.

[@aaronhussain3873]

It seems to follow a similar pattern to some of the other defunct manufacturers in the past including BL and the like. Jaguar didn't invest enough in its past lineup, causing them to fall far behind on the Germans. It also didn't invest enough in making the cars reliable and top notch in quality, breaking up trust and ultimately future purchases. The Autocar podcast reckoned Tata had enough cash to be able to do so. Rather than focus on the above for the last 10/15/20 years, Jaguar is rolling the dice again - ignoring the past and opening a fresh book. It's really worrying in my opinion as the brand could've been fixed years ago.

[@bigchopper14]

Totally agree, customer experience is crucial to JLR's survival. My mate worked at a Land Rover Dealership, and the way customers were treated when their brand new or used cars were faulty was, he felt totally unacceptable. More training and investment in their technicians

[@Purlee100]

You are absolutely right about customer service. I work for a company whose ethos is, ''If we don't look after our customers, someone else will''! As a result, our product, which can be between 50 and 100% dearer than its competitors, and is available only through our outlets, sees people drive from towns up to 200 km away to buy it. It goes without saying that it is a premium product, but even so! I drive the very good but much maligned 2009 X Type Jaguar, the local Jaguar dealer does not want to service it in any way, so much so that they won't even change the battery in the key fob! Fortunately I have a local mechanic who headed up Jaguar Servicing for a South African company, and he basically has done himself out of a job, he has my car running so sweetly I hardly ever see him! But perversely the best service I have received in some time from anyone was from a Jaguar dealer in Moorabbin, Australia, with whom I recently did some online business, so there are some good ones out there.

[@davidgriffith8292]

My thought follows on the point about customer experience and the fundamental issue is that when you buy a new car or approved used you buy NOT from the manufacturer but a franchise dealer. I experienced it in the mid 90’s (before the web was a thing) when I bought a nearly new Pug 306 - was a great car at the time, fitted my criteria etc. a few weeks into ownership and the rev counter kept intermittently not working so I went back to the dealership only to find that they’d changed the weekend before from being a Peugeot dealership to Fiat and would not help in the warranty claim. Found another Peugeot dealership who eventually realised that it was a manufacturer warranty issue and helped liaison with Peugeot UK and got the problem fixed within a couple of weeks. That dealership then got all the service work etc for the next few years until they too changed franchise to another brand. If Jaguar want to be successful, and most people want the brand to succeed, then they need to own the dealerships and have a direct relationship with customers.

[@lasskinn474]

people actually responded to emails in mid '90s. anyway playboys website launched in '94 already.

[@PutSomeDsonThatBlink]

JLR dealer in Cambridge have all of their cars in the showroom locked and don't allow you to sit inside without making a deposit. Surreal.

[@jasperpike242]

@@PutSomeDsonThatBlink If you have a dog maybe he could leave a deposit on your behalf. See how that gets you in!!

[@richardgilyead7640]

I went there to cut a deal on a s/h car. I told them my budget. They came back with a more expensive option. I walked out. Went to local Taylor's Jaguar Approved Service Centre in Dunmow where they listened to me, sold me a great car, and have looked after me ever since.

[@whylie74]

The new logo is the least of jaguar's problems, but I did think "has Slazenger started making cars now?".

[@jplslo8213]

Honestly that is exactly why people love alfas. Basically no dealer ive seen was happy or nice, all grumpy and or angry

[@Coen80]

Some say its a rebirth... I'd call it an afterbirth 😂😂😅

[@enwins]

James, once again you nailed it. Plus JLR have focused so entirely on LR and riding the SUV fad (and we all know what happens to fads) that Jaguar has been criminally ignored. Once again you nailed it with your recent XE V6 review. Plus, what has hit JLR reliability most? Over complicated electrical systems that don't work. It makes me cry, when we all laughed so hard at Renault doing electric cars for much the same reason, that they never doubled down on simplifying and improving before going fully electric. I have no problem with electric luxury cars per se, wasn't the stated aim of luxury cars to be silent and waft on a wave of torque. But this is Jaguar. C-Type, D-Type, Group C and XK120-E-Type road cars. That's where the image came from to sell Mk2's and XJ6's. Am I wrong?

[@oilygr1n]

That £200,000 Jag will almost certainly depreciate to £70,000 within 3yrs but, is that with batteries included? I think that your new office set up will be splendid, once you’ve given the kids their Christmas presents:) If prosperity is still legal in 2025, I wish you a good one.

[@LaurentiusTriarius]

It won't be worth 70k 3 yrs later because nobody will buy a 70k EV from a dead brand.

[@kodek1234]

Still would love to find a decent V8 F-type.

[@bobeyes3284]

The F stand for Fairy now. You'll never hear the end of it.

[@kodek1234]

@@bobeyes3284 Don't really care about that. I drive cars because I like them not because how they make me look. I already own a Defender so a Jag would be convenient, same dealership and all that.

[@hamstirrer6882]

I still think the old cars are worthy of respect, anything before the f face generic suv crossover thing is still a proper jaag, even the mondeo based x type in my opinion

[@zachdebuhr6347]

@bobeyes3284 i drive a '02 XKR. A lot of people talk about the ad but don't associate my car with it and I still get a lot of respect. So no I don't think people will automatically group the F type in with this current nonsense

[@bonusb2924]

@@kodek1234- most LR Dealerships are losing their Jag support. Mine did. Hopefully yours doesn’t. We recently sold our F Pace type S.

[@jonnya245]

I have a 20 month of Model Y. First issue was a tiny bubble on the spoke of the steering wheel, really not an issue but I thought might as well report it. Booked via the app, sent some photos, repaired on my drive with out even talking to someone. Second was a slight misalignment in the driver window, this time i booked with the new center in town. Dropped of in the correct section of the car park. Got the train to work. They were shut when I got back, but just got in my car and drove off. Perfect seamless service. For Jaguar your right, they need the same seamless service with a pampered personal touch if they are after the high end market only.

[@philipmccracken697]

Their future car looks like it was created by a 16 year old with a deadline of 5 minutes while using AI.

[@julielogan2915]

Jaguar already blew the idea that customer service would be any better by making it clear that they did not care about their existing customers, writing them off as dinosaurs. They have rubbished the idea of Jaguar's luxury interior vibe, that made up for the inconvenience of waiting for the AA. Yes, the 00 is a concept, but even more than the brutal exterior, the interior concept has all the luxury vibe of a public bathroom cubicle.

[@swheelman7231]

Went to volvo dealership, they was busy so we had to wait. They also had a half decent free coffee shop with snacks inside so we waited with no complaints and had little chat with others who were waiting. They had no idea if we was there to get a car or order a new lightbulb.

[@theobserver9131]

...or applying for a job maybe... "they was busy...."

[@albanana683]

When we were looking for a replacement for our Subaru estate, we tried a number of dealerships. Mercedes were the worst, after 30 minutes standing around no one could even be bothered to get up from their desk and say sorry for the wait. The Volvo dealership was totally different. Attentive but not pushy, cup of coffee or soft drink. Happy to have us clamber around the interiors with a tape measure to check the load space. Would you like a test drive? Here's the keys, bring it back by the end of the day. An easy purchase decision, and subsequent dealer service has been top notch.

[@Marek-co7fr]

"If you could afford RR Spectre you dont need luck, do you ?" - That was a good one 😂😂😂

[@jonathanrichards2898]

You are absolutely correct about the quality of the dealer experience and it impact on the viability of the brand. That said, Jaguar of Tampa, Florida, US has made the purchase and service experience a true pleasure. I’ve purchased and serviced my XF and F-type from them. My prior experience with a Jaguar dealer in New York from whom I acquired two X-Types was equally a pleasure. Do I have brand loyalty, you bet I do.

[@msalzberg4962]

I've bought 3 Jags and 2 Land Rovers from Jaguar Land Rover of Freeport, NY. In 45 years of car ownership, hands down best dealer I've ever dealt with.

[@tomcarr1358]

Don't let them tell you that marketing is a profession.

[@James-oo1yq]

Ratner told the truth, and that never works well for most businesses

[@SpacedOdyssey]

It's called Customer Service, Very Rare anywhere in the UK these days, I have driven Toyota for the past 35 years and never been disappointed

[@kevincross9206]

Completely agree, having had both Toyota’s and Honda’s in the last 20+ years, any quibbles I did have were extremely minor, but more importantly, quickly dealt with, fuss free.

[@pelleskanal7660]

Jaguar has (had?) the same problem with the dealer in Sweden, bought a new XF in 2014, a car that the dealer already had in stock. When I came to pick it up it wasn't ready, and they told me it would take another week, no phone call to inform me before I made the journey, a week later I had to wait for three hours before they gave me the car. Not a good experience. Loved the car but the next one was a Merc.

[@alexgallacher5720]

In Queensland, Australia, I have an excellent dealer who does everything you mentioned - coffee, biscuits, bottled water - all whilst getting my XE serviced. Then a sit-down and discussion an what was done, anything needing done next service - and it gets a wash and vacuum prior to me picking it up! And the seat is in my preferred position. Am I lucky, or what?

[@jamesplotkin4674]

I believe the trouble with dealership repair departments has to do with their "technicians" who come up the ranks from the lube-boi division and expect them to know how to do anything beyond plugging in a laptop. Those guys graduate from teenage drain-bolt thread strippers to mechanic and it usually doesn't go well. Then, you have the up-selling service writers whose first job is to get you to buy filters you just installed and then play gawd and scare you into huge repair bills. Indie shops are the way to go.

[@Cydney1066]

Spot on mate. Over here in Ontario Canada the dealership problem is the same. At the local Vw dealership I actually had to sit down in front of a salesman and ask if he would like to sell me a car! I now drive a Hyundai,why? because they paid attention to me,they let me take one for an extended test drive and so on. Sadly the new owners of the dealership are just business men not car guys. Looking forward to and interesting 2025 with you.

[@nigelw4119]

Exactly the same experience here in the UK. After buying new VW's for the last forty year's a recent visit to the local VW dealer was a customer service disaster. After finally getting a test drive of the latest Tigua, the salesman got angry when I questioned that I didn't like a particular feature. Went next door and bought a new Hyundai, a totally different attitude with a long rest drive and nothing too much trouble combined with a decent discount.

[@kevinmoffatt]

Decided in 2002 to buy a new Beetle so hired one for a three day family trip to make sure. Went to the local main dealer to place the order and was ignored for 45 minutes except when attempting to enter the showroom model when a salesman shouted at us to 'leave it alone'. Walked up to the desk of an older person (it transpired he was the sales manager) and he handed me an order form to complete which he threw back at me because I had ordered cream leather and that wasn't listed as the colour. He then complained that the order was for a red car with cream leather because 'if I cancelled it would be tricky to sell'. After a three month wait he told me to collect on a Saturday morning as 'it was all ready". Then sat in showroom for two hours while it was cleaned.;they closed a couple of months after I collected it.

[@nk53nxg]

The biggest problem with all Western business just now is the Shareholder is absolute king situation we are in. Shareholders expect massive returns at the expense of employees, training, R&D, QC and material quality. Boeing are a prime example of a western engineering business losing it's way and reputation. This all happened due to the business model changing from being an engineering institution of impeccable integrity and a bench mark of excellence to a shareholder stripped out shell of a joke. They traded of past reputation and built under developed badly built shite, all to increase profit margins so that bigger returns could be made to shareholders. Boeing is no longer an engineering company first, that comes a 3rd or 4th now. JLR, Ford, GM, Stellantis, VW, Merc and BMW are all going the same way as Boeing, building over priced, over complicated unreliable shite, with poor long term planning. The Asians are laughing at us, China will be building better cars than the West soon,,,,, ohh wait, they are already on the cusp of cuffing is with that too???

[@krugmeup2162]

China make EVs that catch on fire and spy on you. They do not make cars

[@katocmd]

The big issue I see with Jag is they seem confused in their direction. They say they want new younger buyers but want to compete with Bentley and Rolls Royce. But only older people can afford those. Also, who is spending Bentley money on a Jag when you could just buy Bentley or any of the other established brands? So I'm struggling to see how this will work for them, and with their design concepts looking worse than they ever have, I fear we may see them go away.

[@AnyoneSeenMikeHunt]

Older people haven't bought Jags in years. Go look at the numbers, it's pathetic.

[@Not_A_Paranoid_Android]

I reckon there’s about 3 or 4 Top Gear episodes where they showcase the latest Jag concept car, that never get made and never improves the companies bottom line. They should focus on racing and bringing race cars to the road.

[@j.j.911]

Bitcoin bros won’t want to buy comic sans jaguars anyway.

[@JsausageandbunEaterWithoniOn]

@@AnyoneSeenMikeHunt True, but that is not so much the market, but rather that’s just because their cars and service suck

[@colinwhite5355]

My pal’s low mile 2020 F Pace. Went into limp mode and needed recovering. Ten week waiting list just to be seen. Final bill £5300 for failed fuel pump which had the destroyed all six injectors.

[@beto12345]

9:38 Yes there is one, the J-LR dealer in Costa Rica is really good, but the "products" are a problem, so in the end is difficult and an expensive decision.

[@MR_THINQ]

Jaguar’s brand ‘rebirth’ was stillborn.

[@thisiszaphod]

Never go to a main stealer/dealer garage and showroom who, exclusively appear to be peopled and represented by those who otherwise would be finding themselves working in Dixons and clueless of a Saturday. Always use independent specialists who genuinely love, are passionate and enthuse over the marque, and their mechanics who also love and know the vehicles and range inside out.

[@alfredthegreat9543]

Will say this though, Jaguar have got more attention because of this than any other car company ever has that i can recall. I'm guessing they would have known the reaction beforehand.

[@arthurmiles-c9z]

I worked at a Toyota dealership early 2000s , there was a problem with engines in some Corollas , nicasil bores if I remember correctly, , customers would be asked to bring their car in for a service, engine would be checked to see if it was affected, if not just carry out service, if it was affected a new engine was put in. Customer totally unaware, perfectly happy with no future problems.

[@teekster69]

I’m based in the US. I was treated poorly by my local Lexus dealer 20+ years ago while kicking the tires on an LX. The JLR dealer treated me very well (they were combined before the corporate merger). They have continued to do so and I have since purchased about a dozen new Land Rover products from them since then (mostly range rovers), a jaguar, and a lotus. They do exist on this side of the pond.

[@blzebub2]

"JAGUAR Got Everybody So Angry" "Everybody" = Gammons

[@LRSTGS]

Gammons = A derogatory term for the only people who actually bought Jaguar's.

[@271production]

Every electric car is fast and quiet (staples of big Jag sedans) nowadays, so what on earth is this car going to offer anyway? A local magazine did a comparison between a Porsche Macan electric and some Chinese e SUV, guess what, besides slightly better handling the Porsche didnt offer anything above the chinese suv. Not even interior quality. And dealers for these chinese dealers are no worse than Jags

[@hamstirrer6882]

Well yeah that's because car marques usually stood out from others by having a defining characteristic, I.e quattro for Audi, rwd and inline 6 for BMW, rear engines for Porsche, saloons estates coupes etc etc etc, if they are all making an electric crossover suv then there is nothing to differentiate them except the bonging noise and screen graphics when you press the start button...

[@MikeEves]

Nobody at Jaguar had the spine to disagree with their CEO. Pathetic really. Bet their CEO has never even visited one and hides away in his ivory office. Equally pathetic.

[@thomas316]

I think what JaGuar is doing is wonderful. Of course, I do own shares in a rival brand so my opinions may be bias.