Do We Owe St Ives An Apology 😱 - The Micro Tear Myth And Lawsuit - When Beauty Turns Ugly

[@JamesWelsh]

I hope this is easy to follow haha. This lawsuit was so up and down and all over the place so I found it hard to put a timeline to it but I hope it’s at least watchable haha

[@karina5917]

love this series! and u did an amazing job haha it’s kinda funny how big of a scandal this was but it was mostly user error 💀

[@DanielleNicoleMakeup]

It's all just fun n games James. Love the stories, even if it's taken with a grain of salt

[@DinkyInky2]

Your take on it was easy to follow. Their responses were what was all over the place. My Mother had us using those St. Ives products for exfoliation after removing calluses and patches of rough skin on knees, elbows, feet, followed by super heavy moisturisers to hydrate the skin after. I still use it for that. Because my skin doesn't tolerate chemical exfoliation, I tend to use physical means, though with silicone tools, lightly scrubby cloths, and gentle soothing facial washes, not gritty scrubs. Now if I can only find nice soothing products that don't use salicylates in everything, I'll be happy.

[@therealJamieJoy]

"Morgellons disease is an uncommon, poorly understood condition characterized by small fibers or other particles emerging from skin sores. People with this condition often report feeling as if something were crawling on or stinging their skin." People with this disorder believe threads, shards, splinters are emerging from their skin. It is akin to "formication" which is the belief bugs or parasites are crawling under one's skin. Both are a type of psychosis. I felt bad for the lady who said she has shards coming out of her face. She may disfigure herself with this delusion. If anyone feels they may have these issues please reach out to a mental healthcare professional. They can order testing by a dermatologist to see whether or not you have a skin condition. They can treat psychosis and/or delusions through more testing and treatment. Please take good care.

[@oevilone]

You did great! As a paralegal I was just "WTF?!" at the plaintiffs the whole time. Judges, as you saw, can be quite snarky, especially when a party has wasted the court's time. St. Ives really didn't have to do much in response here, as with the lack of real evidence, they'd have known it'd get tossed.

[@elise4026]

Predicting a bunch of influencers coming out now saying the apricot scrub was always their guilty pleasure or pretending to rediscover it.

[@stealthis]

It'll be like whack a mole but instead of whacking them with a mallet you whack them with an unsubscribe

[@jessicadeluna6484]

I never gave mine up!! Its amazing for my skin.

[@SuperCosmicMutantSquid]

I'm 2 weeks late to the party but I'm throwing my hat in because, YUP.

[@spark_6710]

​@@jessicadeluna6484 You should see your face under a microscope !! You'll be shocked !! There are bunches of scratched skin !! You might not see it ,yet as you're young ,but later ,you'll regret it a lot !! 💜🥁🐉🎤💞

[@darbirhian]

@@spark_6710 Show the proof!

[@mind-of-neo]

I think those who have used St. Ives scrubs deserve apologies, because every single one has been ridiculed and called stupid over and over again for using something that works fine for them personally.

[@ihatenfts501]

@SA The forget they’re estheticians, they aren’t even derms

[@fenbyrat]

so true their green tea one is HGGDNJSFH so good, my skin is the furthest thing from sensitive so I'm allowed to use their scrub as a treat :3c

[@kortniefrohlich6611]

💯 Facts

[@thescarletgraywitch8052]

Yes!! This ☝️☝️☝️ This needs to apply to all products. All thst matters is it works for the individual.

[@sowhat1674]

Why do you care what people say anyway? I'm rather surprised that people would just put out their skincare for random strangers to play derm and specialist like hyram....

[@jenm9099]

Esthetician here! Just wanted to weigh in on a few things. The shape of the particles used in the scrub, as well as how much pressure is applied while using the product will determine the amount of "damage" inflicted on the barrier. There is something psychological about the presence of "things" aka beads/etc whick causes most people to apply WAY too much pressure to their faces when using it. I tell my clients to pretend they are using it on a baby when they use a scrub. That makes a huge difference, as well as frequency of application.

[@cherrybomber69]

Exactly, youre trying to itch the surface layer, not push it through to the bone

[@amberhoward7807]

I just don't understand why estheticians hate it so much, then turn around and scrape your face with that tool that hurts like hell! Is that not also doing damage? I really think people have given this product a bad rap and I stopped using it bc I was told all this and my face is so broken out now. I have not found anything that even comes close to working as affectively.

[@jenm9099]

@@amberhoward7807 As my comment said, it's not an inherently evil product.

[@amberhoward7807]

@@jenm9099 I never said you did.... as my comment never said ANYTHING bad about your comment...

[@blikewat3r]

​@@amberhoward7807 I'm a retired esthetician and we were taught by sales reps of higher end skincare brands that THE scrub was inherently bad for your skin due to these micro tears and most in our profession blindly took their word as gospel, despite the obvious conflict of interest. I can think of a lot of professions in recent times guilty of the same. But being the contrarian that I am, I asked wth these reps thought we were doing with microdermabrasion and they couldn't give a definitive answer. Wonder why 🙄 I never drank the kool-aid and always recommended the scrub to my clients as an affordable option if they were looking for a physical exfoliant. One client I had in her 50s swore by the stuff and she had the skin of most 30 yr olds/no work done🤷‍♀️ All I'll say is that as with all things, the scrub is not for everyone, esp those with inflammation. If it works for you, use it. I have some sitting in my bathroom right now that I use on occasion and my skin is flawless 😉✌️

[@user-mh8qe9sz1w]

THANK YOU! I got bullied out of a skincare/makeup group for pointing out how silly it was that people touted micro needling etc. anything that injures dermis to stimulate production, and then dogged on scrubs.

[@Madamchief]

Microneedling acts on the dermis. Exfoliating acts on the epidermis

[@jesspavlichenko5745]

@@Madamchief So are you suggesting that deeper injuries are better

[@Madamchief]

@@jesspavlichenko5745 I believe that is the purpose of microneedling. The deeper "injury" should help with collagen production and possibly stimulate stem cells in the dermal layer? I only know what I've read in medical textbooks... I dunno what claims are made by aestheticians

[@jesspavlichenko5745]

@@Megasaurusify that makes total sense /s

[@suicidalalien6298]

Soooooooo... Is micro-needling good or nah? I'm sorry, I'm stupid but I don't wanna look haggard like my mother at 30.

[@janinebean4276]

The first time I went into Sephora for skincare, I accidentally said I used YVES ST LAURENT apricot scrub! 😂😂😂 I’m so mortified now

[@dMi_mi]

😂 Girl.. the first time I went into da Benefit store, I said "I brush up my eyebrows with da lill spoony. 😌" Yeah that happened.. 🙄 I still remember the look on girls face, but she didn't said anything..

[@janinebean4276]

@@dMi_mi 😂😂😂 oh man I didn’t even realize what I did until later, and it’s one of those things I randomly remember I did at like 2am and go nnnnnoooooooooooo

[@dMi_mi]

@@janinebean4276 😶🤣😂

[@GOLDENEstate41234]

@@janinebean4276 we always remember these kinda things late at night and then feel cringed😭

[@arareanddifferenttune3130]

Oh mama I’d never recover from this (kidding the person I’m sure doesn’t even remember 😊❤)

[@astralscupid]

You’d be surprised how much of the beauty and skincare industry relies on talking down popular products in order to promote another product to make it seem superior. It’s done all the time without actual proof, smoke and mirrors (cosmetic tattooist 7 years)

[@gillypiexo]

omg i could not agree more. I feel like the only thing that would help is more regulations and rules, like what the ftc had said, either end of last year or early this year. But these rules and regulations need to actually be upheld with fines or what have you, actually enforced rules.

[@gwyn.b9917]

This is what made me very disappointed in Hyram actually. I was a huge fan until I found out he worked for Youth to the People. He said that only once in an old video and when I looked back at his older videos I actually found one when he censored out the brand name when he talked about the partnership with them. Since then he never specified what brand he was working for. I bought their expensive cleanser cause I was struggling a lot with products being too drying even for my super oily skin and was disappointed. It was fine back then cause every skin is different but when I found out he worked for them as a sales person I felt flat out lied to. He lost any credibility in my eyes. I still watch him for entertaining purposes but I don't trust in any recommendations he makes anymore. He bashed a lot of brands to promote Youth to the People on his channel without a clear information he's their employee.

[@gillypiexo]

@@gwyn.b9917 wow. thats a great perspective! Thank you so much for sharing. I don't understand why the dishonesty, people are way more supportive to the truth from what ive seen(if they follow the person & share a bond to the creator) but I suppose I see the capitol gain being "simpler & easier " overall, by doing it the dishonest way.

[@gwyn.b9917]

@@gillypiexo yes, the truth is loved by viewers but still quite underrated among creators. I trust the Welsh brothers because they're very open about their sponsorships and which products were gifted to them and which ones they've bought with their own money. I like that a lot and I trust their sponsored videos more than Hyram's regular recommendations now cause I can never know what brands Hyram works with anymore. The dishonesty is a deal breaker for me.

[@stealthis]

@@gillypiexo you can only trust hyram as much as you can trust James Charles. Stop watching him

[@rubynibs]

St. Ives needs a warning label: This product is a facial skin exfoliator, not a scrub for moldy bathroom grout; use accordingly!

[@JamesWelsh]

😂😂😂

[@karenebdenmonty]

how old are you

[@BreannaBaozi]

@@karenebdenmonty weird question

[@JordiRaeMac]

I would rather use this on my grout over my face. 🤷‍♀️

[@Star-po6gq]

Same with chemical exfoliants Burns from acids are just as bad

[@idreamofparis7233]

I used that scrub for yrs. It didn’t damage my skin at all. I don’t use it anymore because there are better products on the market. When I was teen our choices were limited.

[@Cheekypowpow]

Exactly that

[@nadia562010]

Amen! The apricot scrub kept my skin super acne free! Also I used it twice a day until I got one of the beads in my eye and then I stopped using it....lol

[@kendallstark4302]

THANK YOU 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 I *never* had a problem with St Ives, *ever*. I just knew instinctively not to use it on active acne, plus I only ever used it once a week. I don't use it anymore, either, but just because I've moved on to lactic acid. But, I'd use it again if I had a tube.

[@kayk480]

Yeah, I lived in a small town and as a teen in the early-mid 2000s, our skincare options consisted of st. Ives, neutrogena, oxy, and clean and clear. I remember everyone getting really excited when the drug store brought in olay.

[@kendallstark4302]

@@kayk480 I love their total effects day and night moisturizers! They both have niacinamide at the top of the ingredient list 💖

[@MissJeriB]

I used St. Ives for years up until my mid 20's because I felt bullied into using chemical exfoliants which never did well for my skin. I think a bit of economic elitism has a part to play because St. Ives is super affordable and accessible compared to other exfoliant options. Edit: A lot of women of color used St. Ives and a lot of black women in my life had used it before the hate train. I wonder if that had anything to do with it.

[@mrselfdestruct7605]

It definitely comes from a lot of classist beliefs, that I guarantee. If you look at the broader “opinions” those people in the community hold, it almost always boils down to “cheap = bad” and notoriously will shame items that simply have a lower pricepoint, as well as often overhyping overpriced items that are actually terrible. It also often comes with the shaming of those who use the cheaper products, youll see them always acting like everyone in the world is able to just splurge on their skincare if they really wanted to and love implying that those who dont are just uneducated on skincare and all that stuff

[@MissJeriB]

@emi SAME! My skin was always so irritated and broke out badly. No matter how I tried to incorporate the chemical exfoliants. I have sensitive acne prone skin and it just always flare my skin up in the worst ways.

[@infinitive7654]

No, it has absolutely nothing to do with race, unless there's a hidden photographic database with St. Ives users of colour.

[@hb7021]

Y’all will make anything about race it’s a damn face scrub

[@laserkeyboardpro4239]

@@mrselfdestruct7605 but even educated dermatologists and estheticians agree that it isn't a good product to use on your face

[@jackthecat4924]

Apricot is the first scrub this "boomer" ever used. More recently, I was working a warehouse job, sweating and covered in dirt every night. I started getting milia and the thing that got rid of them right away was the St. Ives Green Tea Blackhead Clearing Scrub. It seems to have a bit of antibacterial soap (like Dial Gold) effect and helps clear up underarm breakouts and minor underboob irritations. I just rub it on and let it sit a little while, not much scrub. St Ives is OK by me.

[@trenchrock]

Yup, I use it too and honestly...I really love the smell for some reason, lol

[@pagesinked]

The Green Tea one no one had a problem with because it does not contain walnut shells.

[@sydneywilliams4796]

What’s with the “boomer” in quotes Jack 😂. You’re either a baby boomer or you’re not. It’s the name of a generation. Y’all are really trying to act like it’s a curse word or swear

[@agirlisnoone5953]

@@sydneywilliams4796 you must be a boomer too 🤣 you've seen the "ok, boomer" memes? It means a (typically older) person who isn't clued into what's trendy or current.

[@darbirhian]

My daughter has one milia under her eye. I'm going to use some scrub and see if it clears up. I also have some BHA toners I could sweep on once or twice a day to get rid of it. Thanks for the tip!

[@doodlebear7958]

The phrase “a little knowledge is a dangerous thing” continues to ring true in the skincare world. I’ve seen so many examples of bandwagon jumping to spread misinformation based off people just not digging deeper into claims or comments.

[@MadDeviSri]

Just shocking. Everyone in the skincare community just repeated this like sheep

[@Takapon218]

It's the same as the "hyaluronic acid dries your skin out" myth where people think applying it with no occlusive when the weather is dry it'll suck the moisture out of your skin which is flat out incorrect. It's a myth that is so prevalent it's like... entirely untraceable in origin (although it's believed to be a study that had HA on a plastic tray and tested how long it took to dry.) But there's a ton of studies that disprove it ~in skin.~

[@londonmellow]

the giggling before saying why they stopped using the products was everything 😂 if i stopped using every product I accidentally got into my eyes. I would be sitting here without any products

[@JamesWelsh]

Omg me toooooo 😂

[@minimini550]

Bestie, you need to be more careful with your poor eyes! 😂

[@londonmellow]

@@minimini550 it's ok. I deal with chronic dry eyes. they've been though worse 😅

[@shendisackett]

Same!

[@dmmarklin]

Seriously…..same. 😩😩🤦🏼‍♀️

[@sarahelizabeth7547]

I just always assumed when a product says 'dermatologist tested' it just meant a derm had tested it to confirm it was safe for use. Like a yes this won't melt the skin off of your face. I never viewed it as an endorsement or recommendation, I just thought it was a legal thing to confirm safety testing 🤷🏼‍♀️

[@cabbagejuice]

Products dont have to be derm tested, just tested in some way in order to be put on shelves. However having the claim "derm tested" will increase sales, and you only need 1 derm for that. But a lot of ppl have pointed out that you can say that as long as 1 derm "tested" it but they could be a bad derm, ex: getting paid by the company, they believe in pseudoscience, etc.

[@sarahelizabeth7547]

@@cabbagejuice absolutely I had just clearly not understood this for years! I think it's because almost every company slaos it on their label so I just assumed it was a basic safety test!

[@cabbagejuice]

@@sarahelizabeth7547 yea most ppl also think like that bc they dont know the actual laws and practices we do. or even how much pseudoscience is used in marketing for makeup/skincare. stuff like blue light protection and the "natural" ingredients trend are all pseudoscience or marketing tactics to make consumers think that its better. but its rly not better or worse than the other kinds of products :/ most ppl dont know this tho, so everyone falls for it

[@sarahelizabeth7547]

@@cabbagejuice oh I completely agree about all the pseudo science and 'natural' skincare and make up its utter BS. I think I'm usually quite cynical so when I see claims like 'dermatologically tested' I just took it with a pinch of salt and assumed it was pretty meaningless... I was right but for the wrong reason haha

[@noemitellez3098]

This reminds me : y’all, think about the difference between derm tested & derm recommended !

[@FrootLoop31122]

"I’m just not a fan of stupidity.” Best statement of any skincare KZbin channel.

[@maireadsg1]

St Ives kept my skin under control all of high school and college, but I felt like I needed to sophisticate my skincare routine so I started investing in more expensive products and shying away from physical exfoliants. My skin is worse than ever now and I’m glad I still have st Ives stashed away in a drawer 😂

[@savageaf1943]

ive been using it 10years now.. the product was so good it remover discoloration in my skin... may body scrub are great exfoliate dont listen to some beauty guru that says its bad because its a scrub.. the product exist before they were born lol

[@DanaBeeee]

lmao right! From Barbara Sturm to Biologique Recherche, I've tried it all! ...just to come back to using my trusty St. Ives scrub and a dove bar mixed with products from The Ordinary lol 😂

[@Singlerose55]

Ditto!! I love apricot scrub ❤

[@Abigail-fw1cw]

I can't even say how refreshing it is to see you use St. Ives products without some dramatic negative reaction. Most brands have some (or at least one) decent products!

[@peggedyourdad9560]

Oh, I really like their body lotions. But that's one of the only products I'll use from them since my face skin has become very temperamental in recent months.

[@leahsanders798]

@@peggedyourdad9560 love your name.

[@peggedyourdad9560]

@@leahsanders798 Thanks! Picked it myself lol.

[@annabananaSplitz1]

I remember when I discovered hyram and hr said St Ives was for your feet. By then I was already using St Ives for over 10 years and had no issues with my skin. I live in the Caribbean so 90% of the stuff he talks about for acne isn't readily available and/or doesn't work. St Ives till this day is the only thing that works and doesn't burn my skin as I have eczema on my face. I quickly unsubscribed to him.

[@pagesinked]

No one said their other products were bad, I used to use their lotions and the green tea scrub but I HATE they have fragrance.

[@margauxf4321]

3yrs ago I became friends with a coworker who used to be an esthetician. We were getting ready to go out and she saw the St Ives scrub in my shower and you would think she discovered I was a murderer who hid a body in there the way she snatched the shower door open and pointed at it freaking out! She went on about hypodermal scarring (micro-tears) that will cause premature aging, etc etc. I said I had been using it for 17yrs, and never had more than 2 zits at a time throughout puberty, sleeping in dollar tree makeup in my teens and early 20s, and throughout my military career. We're talkin deployments or field exercises in blood, sweat, tears, helicopter grease/fuel/oil, caked with layers of built up spray on Banana Boat SPF (VERY greasy)- Then using ol' faithful with parasitic well water (that gave me dysentery) the few times we got to shower. Also my EMS career of 36hr shifts, makeup, SPF, sweat, other people's bodily fluids, and so much oil production from stress + sleep deprivation. Had a travel size of that "sinful scrub" to bring to the station. But I started seeing my first wrinkles and I blamed the scrub after she told me that (not the fact that I just turned 30, never used a moisturizer, and spent my adult life stressed and sleep deprived). I put the scrub in my cabinet and spent $100s on skincare products in the past 2yrs, had a chemical peel, even bought the salon products, and my skin has never looked worse. Acne, blackheads, dark spots, dry patches, red patches... Now I don't know who to believe.

[@alfwinnn4224]

Estheticians are not dermatologists. If it worked for you, use it. If you like it, use it. She's probably had worse on her face, but didn't complain. 😂

[@Ellaodi]

Use what works for you boo

[@missjoasia123]

I use St Ives scrub since I was 13 years old and I’m a lot to be 30 and nothing is wrong with my skin. Everyone compliments me and people think I’m 23

[@aloraholdeman9995]

I use St. Ives every now and again and nothing else. 🤷 Just a soft hand towel and lukewarm water in the shower. I use sun screen and lotion on my body. I get compliments on my skin all the time.

[@heathermartini1373]

At the end of the day, use whatever works for you and your body. A million people on all sides telling you what to do, none of them know your body like you do, so use whatever you want.

[@bambistarlight9673]

Using the scrub for your feet and knees is actually a god tier idea I might actually get myself some to use on my feet...

[@erinruth7758]

That’s what Ive done for several years. It’s an amazing foot scrub and really inexpensive too.

[@krisdiane]

That's what I bought and use it for, though i tend to not need it now that I use O'Keeffe's exfoliating Lotion on my feet.

[@shawnaferguson8721]

It's great on the feet! I also exfoliate my legs before shaving. Works wonders.

[@dumbartonyankee]

The body is where I use all the products I'm not crazy about.

[@ladylark10884]

that's really smart, gonna go do that now

[@iisdumb9098]

the apricot scrub kept my skin clean for YEARS, no acne, no nothing but i stopped using it when everyone was crying about micro tears etc :(

[@zr3933]

I used to use as well but developed and allergy to something in it 😢 still mourning the loss.

[@MadDeviSri]

This video came just in time. I guiltily started using st ives again but now I can do so without guilt. Can’t believe everyone in the skincare community just blattered the same thing without doing this research

[@JR-lw3ms]

"Research"! LOL Now tell us about clean products!

[@AsterLane]

I love the green tea scrub and made myself stop using it for years because of everyone saying how horrible it is. I just recently started using it again and still love it.

[@jodi_kreiner]

“I sound like st. ives biggest fan - I’m not, I’m just not a fan of stupidity is all” omfg this is iconic 😂😂

[@barbieblue3336]

Awful initials

[@AshaClarke]

LOL I literally scrolled down to look at comments and read yours EXACTLY when he said this line. What a funny coincidence

[@MarcOnell1205]

20:43

[@gintokisstrawberrymilk]

@@AshaClarke Same 😭

[@K1k1Cupcake]

A study of 14 people with no variants or controls should never be considered a scientific study 🤦🏻‍♀️

[@graciekiracofe]

yeah like we dont know how sensitive, oily, dry, etc their skin already is. they could have found 14 people with dry skin to begin with.

[@Paula-tf3zv]

AMEN!!!!! And people should stop being pinballs and do their own damn thinking for a change. When so many (if not all..) beauty influencers started saying St Ives was the boogeyman I stopped and thought about it. I've used the apricot scrub for *literally* decades and my skin always feels wonderful, even before using moisturizer. A 'study' where N=14 is not a study, let alone without controls, and by 1 dermatologist (credentials??) is a cesspool of bias.

[@literalmomfriend]

THANK YOU. When I saw that I was like WTF lol... Your sample size is small and your results skewed, Mr. Dermatologist, sir.

[@kagitsune]

Tbh it's very difficult and expensive to get people to join a derm study where their skin might be damaged... Sometimes you gotta use what you've got.

[@K1k1Cupcake]

@@kagitsune I think at that point you admit the study doesn’t show anything 🤷🏻‍♀️ I get that it’s difficult, but putting forth inaccurate information because you couldn’t get enough people is irresponsible.

[@SailorLavender]

Skincare channels: "DO NOT EVER USE ST. IVES!!!" Me, nodding in agreement, then caving in every few months because the scrub feels GOOOOD!!!

[@jeffdiggs7030]

That’s how I was to the tea cuz I loved using it and stuff but then I completely stopped using it

[@josephinenelan4204]

It always worked amazing for me.

[@animaeanime8815]

Agreed

[@ThisisJenn]

same 😖

[@0MissElizabeth0]

And thats the thing: every once in a while is Ok! Just dont scrub hard 👌

[@janizadasig9380]

I have been using St. Ives blemish control for more than 20 years now. Whenever i remove it from ny routine, and opt for other exfoliating stuff, i get breakouts and my skin gets dull. I’ve tried them all. Drugstore and expensive ones. Nothing beats St. Ives for making my sensitve and acne-prone skin clear of pimples and dirt.

[@janizadasig9380]

P.S. My senstive skin can’t handle the Fresh Skin variant but definitely loves Blemish Control and Green Tea

[@danasarsembina7685]

I've been given a lot of low-quality both insanely expensive and cheap cosmetics by family, some of it new, some as old as 15 years and way past its due date. This is how I've been using it: face scrubs - scrub legs, elbows, bum, feet (face) cleansers - shower gel, if irritating then hand soap, if white or translucent hand wash sneakers, if too bad then the inside of a bath etc lip balms - mix into body lotion, but best as foot mask (tie plastic bags around feet) (face) creams & hair oils - use on the body and also shave with it face cream that has curly girl friendly ingredients (i.e. the good ones) - hair conditioner

[@ellaocean]

I meaaan, a LOT of ppl just started to jump on the bandwaggon, just like how everyone was hyping them tf out. And honestly??? A lot of ppl who jumped on the "let'a trash this product and exfoliants like this in general" are the same ppl who put their skin thru the worst ish. So idk. Always use products that works for u.

[@ellaocean]

Also. A lot of ppl just wanted to blame something for a lot of other reasons their skin is going thru it. Babe, maybe ur using St. Ives as if it was a pumice stone...for ur face??? Gtfo

[@Cutthecamerasdeadass1899]

Exactly

[@darleneelizabethjoiner1329]

@@Cutthecamerasdeadass1899 exactly. I should have never stop using my physical exfoliant

[@RubyBlueUwU]

I know someone irl who straight up lies and pretends she used this and it’s the reason she has skin issues now lol

[@carolinesc3615]

I can't use any chemical exfoliants bc they burn my skin. I need to use a physical one.

[@mariannewm26]

I have always thought it's weird to not want micro tears, but an ablative laser or microneedling damage is fine? I think it just needs to be used gently and sparingly, not every day

[@mariannewm26]

@@arieanderson8302 true, but it's still the act of damaging the skin

[@_Laura.Marie_Sierra.Destiny_]

I mean microneedling and all that is very controlled by a professional, controlling how deep the needles go, how much “damage is actually done” but I agree to a point

[@anarchyneverdies3567]

LITERALLY MY EXACT THOUGHTS!!! I was wondering if anyone else made that connection

[@soumia117]

you’re comparing apples to oranges here

[@SuperCosmicMutantSquid]

The instructions on the back of St. Ives even says you only need to use it 3 times a week if you choose to do so.

[@persephone.rincon]

i hated when ppl would tell me to stop using and recommending St Ives bc it was annoying obviously but i used to have severe cystic acne and it hurt at first but over time, it was the first product that ever helped me with these giant cysts. i have acne scars everywhere but my skin is perfectly clear now💕 i still use it too. the green tea one smells amazing and i also use the blemish control.

[@aquatiger8]

I'm gonna be taking this recommendation because I have really bad hormonal acne and have been thinking about finding a new face wash to try and help

[@persephone.rincon]

@@aquatiger8 remember to start gently at first bc the more you irritate them, theyll get bigger and more painful. i use the avocado and honey now every other day, very gently on sensitive areas. make sure to pat dry, not rub, your face w a clean towel and then apply a water/gel type moisturizer. all of this helped me keep away from acne which i am still very prone to. i hope your skin clears💗

[@Name..........]

​@@persephone.rincon i think thats half of the problem. People start to quickly and try to rush to the end results with everything, exfoliation should be started slowly yet we still have people using tretinoin every day the first week they started. Same thing with hobbies, learning new things exercising and more

[@persephone.rincon]

@@Name.......... thats very true. i remember when i got prescribed that a few years ago and i used it too much and my dace got all dry and peely and irritated

[@Michellee970]

I love St. Ives for the occasional use. I have a bottle in my shower to this day for when my skin is peeling. Being smart about how you use your products is necessary in all occasions. I appreciate you, James!

[@stephaniepowers-tanguay6346]

I have to wonder what’s the difference between “micro tears” and dermarollers that purposely damage the skin with the goal of encouraging rejuvenation?

[@nargrfg]

Dermarolling or microneedling is a more controlled method than physical scrubbing it is much different, however this particularly shouldn't be done at home as it can be done wrong very easily . You are right though with scrubs they can cause trauma to the skin very easily as lot of people go overboard however they're not really supposed to be used for the purpose of causing physical 'trauma ' they are marketed more toward exfoliation however there are much more gentler and effective methods of exfoliation out there for different types of skin .I just think with scrubbing I don't think rejuvenation instead I think trying to slough away dead skin cells 😊

[@gigi.sovanny]

Dermarollers and micro needling have the ability to penetrate into the dermis where fibroblasts are then triggered to promote collagen and elastin. Microtears just encourage inflammation and perhaps pigmentation as a result of scrubbing using abrasives that are jagged edged

[@hannahstanden1395]

@@gigi.sovanny micro tears arnt a thing.

[@gigi.sovanny]

@@hannahstanden1395 even so, the scrubbing has possibility to lead to inflammation/pigmentation if not careful

[@hannahstanden1395]

@@gigi.sovanny its because people are using them too often and rubbing too hard. It says gently. User error. As any side effects only happened to a few like most of the skin lines out there have at least one skin type reacting bad to a product. Do we cancel them no we move on and find something that works for us.

[@_w_w_]

I used to worked in the beauty chemistry industry in my younger days. A lot of "rumors" are started by competitors and often without basis to play on the fear factors. I will give you a data point to think about. If you think grounded up walnut shell has irregular surfaces and can cause all these microscopic damages, what about the endless amount of sugar and salt based exfoliants on the market? Just take a look at the sugar and salt crystals - they are basically cube shapes with 8 sharp corners. When suspended in oil, as they usually do for scrubs, this shape is maintained on use for quite a while. If ground walnut shell is bad, I'd argue sugar and salt are equally bad. On the other hand, I am sure all of us have experiences that the Polyethylene Microspheres in some cleaners and scrubs can get stuck in our eyes and it's very difficult to rinse out because of the round shape simply roll around and doesn't come off easily. One can easily start a lawsuit against the Polyethylene Microspheres manufacturer for that and for the environmental pollution they cause.

[@esmeraldagreengate4354]

The micro beads have been banned in a few of countries.

[@jessicaconti5215]

Well the difference is that sugar is a humectant that dissolves in water. So does salt. Both of these scrubs when applied to wet skin and massaged together with the water will partially dissolve and won't keep those sharp edges. Walnut shell, or microbeads will not dissolve at all in water and will keep their sharp edges.

[@xoxorosequartz]

those scrubs are typically made for your body, your face skin is a lot thinner and is more sensitive

[@cheekyb71]

Polyethylene microbeads are illegal here in New Zealand, I use a St Ives "pink lemon and mandarin" scrub which has hydrated silica as the physical exfoliation. I LOVE IT and have used it weekly for over a decade.

[@toriladybird511]

@@esmeraldagreengate4354 should be all!

[@dajadame4214]

FINALLY THANK YOU!!! Im an esthetician and I have always loved st Ives and recommended it to some of my clients. I hate how the beauty industry tries to lie to get people to spend more money than necessary!

[@tabithalarue]

My dad uses the apricot scrub as his only "cleanser " daily. I believed this myth but considering my dad certainly doesn't look his age, I should stop sleeping on st ives

[@MariellaRivera]

Not saying St. Ives is bad but also remember men have thicker skin!

[@GabbieCh]

It can work, as long as you don't rub it harshly on your skin. Besides, a lot about your skin's appearance is still influenced by genetics, nutrition, hormones, etc. Many people who actually do objectively bad things to their skin still have good skin.

[@Catglittercrafts]

@@MariellaRivera that’s a myth Mogensen et al. (2008) found no sex or skin type-related differences in epidermal thickness using optical coherence tomography imaging, which is based on infrared light reflection/backscatter from tissue. Gambichler et al. (2006) studied 83 subjects using optical coherence tomography imaging in vivo and performing intra- and interday repeatability measurements. The results showed that epidermal thickness did not significantly differ between men and women except for the forehead skin, which was significantly thinner in older women than in men.

[@stillnotstill]

@@Catglittercrafts citations in a youtube comment! I love that.

[@JR-lw3ms]

@@Catglittercrafts www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6116811/#:~:text=The%20studies%20show%20that%20the,pH%20is%20higher%20in%20women. THIS STUDY DISAGREES! It's newer (2018) and is based on the review of dozens of other scientific studies!

[@jacquikv5560]

I am a such a fan of your “When Beauty Turns Ugly” Series, it is Everything!! I love that you do such extensive research into the cases. It makes this series informative and educational, in a good way. Thank you and your crew for all of your hard work! 👏

[@lucyjane3803]

I worked for a brand that had a clay mask with PUMICE scrub in it. It felt to me like rubbing gravel on my face. The scope of this lawsuit was so broad that they couldn't just sue St.Ives, they would have had to sue EVERY brand that sold a harsh physical scrub - there are def worse ones on the market.

[@camelliahyacinth5926]

That sounds extremely painful... But! I'd love to use that on my feet...

[@JamesWelsh]

That sounds like THE MOST horrific product omg 😭

[@lesfibresfantastiques7265]

I wash my hands with a pumice stone soap, and it's perfect for gardener or mechanics. I don't know about my face though…

[@gnette9548]

I used st. Ives srub for around 15 years of my life. Everyone always compliments the appearance of my skin and say I look 22 when I'm 33. When I try other products I develop loads of sebaceous filaments. Nothing really lives up to the challenge like st. ives

[@tifKh]

When you say “you try other products”- what do you mean? What do you try that gives you sebaceous filaments?

[@gnette9548]

@@tifKh I've tried many facial scrubs from brans like La Roche Posay, Pixi, Kate Somerville, Tatcha, Olehenriksen, Origins ect. They all claim to be gentle or even have AHA/BHA's in them. Don't get me wrong, they were all nice products... but I have a very oily complexion and even with the AHA/BHA's they didn't seem to cut through the build up in my pores as well as St. Ive's. I suppose they were just too gentle for my particular skin type and couldn't cut through all the build up therefor sebaceous filaments started to shop up on my t-zone. It took a while to get them back under control. Hope this answered your question...

[@yuuya2111]

I just went back to St Ives. I am using it three times a week and I feel great and look fine, no break out.

[@thewildadversary]

Because of this comment I learned what sebaceous filaments are… I always thought they were blackheads

[@GabbieCh]

@@gnette9548 I think that most of the brands you mentioned add a lot of fragrance. That may be the issue at hand. My favorite type of "scrub" is like the Wishful one by Huda Beauty. It's really gentle, you could even use it on your eye contour if needed and it would be very hard to hurt yourself. It's important to keep in mind that everyone is different and may have a higher/lower resistance towards a specific ingredient in any product, whether it's low, high-end or whatever. Something that's objectively harsher may be okay for you if you use it carefully and it happens not to have some specific ingredients which your skin doesn't like. Makes a lot of sense to me.

[@aleccino]

This was absolutely fascinating. Classic mass hysteria and hearsay from illegitimate sources. I have always been curious why it still sells so well despite the skincare community hating it, but the truth is that it must be fine for a lot of people.

[@JR-lw3ms]

Because a random person on the internet made a video? LOL

[@aleccino]

@@JR-lw3ms What?

[@eric6cartman9]

it is a BOMB ass body scrub for (my) butt acne

[@eclecticraeen]

If you don't have larger pores like most POC you'll be fine...but if you do you'll be like my cousin and I running to the emergency room convinced bugs are coming out of our skin and everyone thinking were on drugs when no....we both just used the dam scrub 😂😂

[@Insertia_Nameia]

I know this video is old now but I'm fairly new here. Lol I have used it for yrs now because a tube of their original apricot scrub was gifted to me. I keep using it because of my bc I sweat a lot more and my face gets a LOT greasier. As in its greasier now than it ever was as a teen. Plus most of my jobs are working in kitchens of diners, taverns, and casual sit downs. So lots of very greasy foods which add to it. And it helps a lot for controlling it and keeping it face clean and clear. I prefer exfoliants because that's the best way to deal with skin issues for me. When I exfoliate, even without moisturizers, my skin doesn't get that stripped tight feeling. It feels soft and smooth.

[@sugarxsnap]

I got a 'piece' of Apricot scrub in my eye before.... It happened whilst cleansing my face in the shower. I used the shower water to rinse and rinse and rinse, though to no avail. I panicked and spent the rest of the day crying because it hurt so bad, and horrified that it was going to cause damage. I sought medical attention, and found nothing. Turns out, I'd merely scratched my cornea whilst trying to remove it, or possibly after rubbing my eye when it initially happened. So the rinsing likely helped remove it, and the pain and soreness was from the scratch attributed to my initial rubbing. My eye was red and sore for about 3 days after that.. .... And that's the last time I ever used an apricot scrub.

[@Lenlon703]

after rewatching and rereading issues about face srubs mainly st.ives I saw so many people experiencing the same thing as you and some that even still has the srub itself in their eye until it's removed by medics. even if the microtears was overexaggerated, this problem is still why I avoid and don't recommend them..

[@PK2191]

That's kind of scary

[@Mittzie]

Fun fact, if you get dry eyes from allergies you can do the same thing by just falling asleep and not taking allergy meds and eye drops because your eye lid will adhere to your cornea and when you wake up and open your eyes it gives it little tears wherever it decided to adhere… wanna ask how I know 😅 I’ve done both I still use the scrubs only did it once, but the allergy eye abrasions?…. I do that at least once a year sometimes twice a year… 😅 I figure if my allergies can do it then I’m kind of meh whatever about if I accidentally get some scrub in it again 🤣

[@Syd448]

@@Mittzieaha I know this is a bit old, but my mom has chronic dry eyes and about 3-5 times a year she wakes up and rips both her corneas. It’s usually a night she accidentally forgets to put this thick ass gel in her eyes. It is so horrible and she can’t do anything for at least two days. I’m sorry you deal with someone similar! It has to be so scary to just wake up and hurt yourself like that - I know it causes my mom a lot of anxiety

[@Mittzie]

@@Syd448 honestly with my ADHD i forget about it until it happens then the anxiety of remembering the drops i gotta use kicks in but its a good anxiety in a sense by the time the adhd has me stopping im outside my allergy season normally xD

[@darkydoom]

You know what's funny, people go on about microtears yet they rave about microneedling 🤣 or you have people saying waxing will make your skin sag and then others say it encourages collagen release and repair. One reason I left the beauty industry because the science is so shady

[@HillbillyYEEHAA]

This ^^^ I said this exact thing on drays channel like 4 years ago and the comments I got... 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂

[@ioannastergiou6068]

I was thinking the same, microneedling, acid peels , face shaving wth!! Im 48 and have always used physical exfoliators , StIve’s being one of them, followed by a moisturizer, and never had an issue.

[@darkydoom]

@@ioannastergiou6068 exactly! If anyone wants to talk about microtears then don't ever shave!

[@darkydoom]

@Jessica Fitzsimmons please explain?

[@stellac3047]

@@darkydoom microneedling pierces dermis at specific depths to cause specific reactions. Clean, thin, sharp needles produce the least damage on the skin and allows it to heal easily than irregular scratches across the dermis.

[@gabriellecathleen7535]

And people forget they have other scrubs. They literally have one with no walnuts and colloidal oatmeal and I will use it maybe once a week and it’s very nice.

[@she7061]

Ooooh that sounds lovely

[@teonasbrk]

yessss i love the green tea scrub (although i use a chemical exfoliant more often ngl)

[@monicaprzestrzelski4677]

They also are the same people who use 5 different actives in their daytime skin care routine every single day and risk worse damage than a physical scrub could ever cause because chemical burns are no joke….even if minor

[@BIIANCARH]

How you so calmly said “I accidentally ate a bit” when opening the cleanser… I was in stitches 😂

[@eh337]

As a former user of the scrub, I’ve gotta say, I never believed that it had such negative effects. Saint Ives was the star of a routine that significantly improved my acne in high school. I wouldn’t use it today, but I still use a physical exfoliator (dermalogica) because that stuff works for my skin.

[@amandareynolds8930]

I’m just catching up, but St Ives did actually tear my skin up. But that’s because I have very sensitive skin. I started using the scrub on my legs to exfoliate for shaving, which wasn’t a good idea either because it did actually hurt. Everyone is different - if it works for you then by all means.

[@Lacycsgo]

same i stopped using it and my skin improved, i used it randomly one day and bam lil rips and tears and irritation. i do believe it can cause a lil scarring

[@eclecticraeen]

Yeah I can't use scrubs at all...the particles get stuck in my pores

[@BeautifulCrazyy]

When I first saw all that about St. Ives I was in shock. In grade school all the way up into my late 20s I've used that product once a day. I never had any skin problems and would always be complimented on my skin. So when all this started I just figured everyone is different so I got lucky I guess. I still use it but not as much because my skin has changed which does happen as time goes on. Thank you for being so open and honest with us.

[@leighhamrick]

Micro-tears resulting from harsh physical exfoliation is a concept I was introduced to by a well-known, well-respected, licensed esthetician here on KZbin. I didn't question them; they know what they're talking about, right? By the time I took this as fact, I'd gotten serious about skincare and wouldn't have bought St.Ives anyway, but I'm disappointed that I didn't investigate further. By the way, I used it for years growing up with no problems.

[@loveneoperana9938]

Also your reaction to using St. Ives products is reminding me of when Robert used Maybelline Dream Matte Mousse foundation and actually liked it😂☺️💖

[@kym28]

This is eye opening. I always believed 'micro tears' haha. But the loss of hydation after exfoliation is very obvious. You're scrubbing away the at dead skin cells on top so your skin is bound to react and dry out. That's why hydration is a must after exfoliation. Might buy St. Ives again.

[@ToastontheEastCoast]

I like the coffee scrub by St Ives, but not on my face. I use it for the kp on my upper arms and on my feet, and the smell is lovely. They aren't bad products, but you can get not great results if using incorrectly or too often.

[@brady_cll]

Yes! I still use the coffee scrub on my KP too! I go back & forth with that, the OUAI body & scalp scrub, and First Aid Beauty scrub. I will say, ever since I started using goats milk soaps and the KP scrub by First Aid Beauty, I’ve seen SUCH a reduction in my KP. But that coffee scrub is still a bath night pleasure. ☕️ I can’t believe I used bath&body works shower gels all through high school & college & didn’t know why my KP was so bad. Young & naive lol.

[@MissMystery1412]

I’ve only tried the traditional and the grapefruit St. Ives scrubs for my KP but they’ve been the only products to give me even a little relief from it. I’ll have to try the coffee scrub now!

[@RubyBlueUwU]

I’ve never used these products but I’ve never really liked the very intense anti-physical-exfoliator talk in online skincare circles, because as someone with severe eczema everywhere it’s a necessity for me, it just has to be gentle. My skin does not cope well with chemical exfoliants, no matter how mild, and it doesn’t help with the kinds of flaking skin I have to deal with if I don’t exfoliate it.

[@carlymatthews3532]

Hi! I agree with this, as I have eczema too! I’m having a severe flare up and I’m wondering what products you use to cope with your eczema??

[@katsumiis4699]

Not them but I find that keeping the skin moisturized helps keep any eczema flares at bay. The aveeno oat moisturizer has worked well for me! Or if you're into Asian skincare anything labeled as ATO moisturizers/lotions are great for eczema. I gently exfoliate any flakes off with a microfiber cloth and just slather it on whenever I start to see any redness/skin flaking and its helped a lot. Mind you mine is more on the mild side as far as eczema goes.

[@kianawilcox253]

@@carlymatthews3532 I know it sounds strange but I’ve found that the white Dove Beaty bar helps my facial rosacea, and gold bond ultimate healing lotion with aloe and pure aloe Vera help with my eczema. If it’s really bad consider seeing a dermatologist, like if you’re getting blisters.

[@RubyBlueUwU]

@@carlymatthews3532 honestly I’ve found just sticking to a regular, gentle cleansing and moisturising routine has done absolute wonders, I just use cerave hydrating products and then Vaseline occasionally for any chapping. I use a micro fibre towel to cleanse which provides gentle, regular exfoliation and have one of those facial exfoliator brushes for occasional stronger exfoliation. Skincare is, unfortunately, very personal and therefore very trial and error, I hope you can find something that works!!

[@Sam-si6wf]

I was diagnosed with eczema since birth but I've always been sceptical and believed it wasn't actually eczema. I started researching and now believe I have chronic biofilm build up due to a bacterial infection I got as a baby that was never treated correctly. Years of hydrocortisone and Prednisone etc never solved the issue. I've started using products to address the biofilm and my skin is improving ☺️.

[@fyxation]

Just a reminder: don't use any product with "micro beads" in them which don't dissolve. After they wash down the drain, they wind up in the organisms who either live in the water or drink from reservoirs. A lot of companies have moved away from using plastic micro beads but always research a product like exfoliating scrubs and toothpaste.

[@K.B.P.]

At least in the US, I believe those beads are outlawed.

[@simransimran9339]

A lot of companies have started using cellulose beads. Off the top my head, i remember Nivea made that change years ago.

[@pagesinked]

I used to love the Clean & Clear Morning Burst orange cleanser until I read the ingredients. 😭 Idk if they've changed it now.

[@CeeTee380]

@@K.B.P. I wish! But sadly they are not outlawed and very much present in many products.

[@cataubawoman]

nanoparticles terrify me....

[@ariadnasaftoiu3967]

The whole micro tear thing rubbed me the wrong way from the beginning. People were saying these kind of exfoliators damaged the skin creating micro tears while promoting at home derma rolling?!? Makes 0 sense

[@darbirhian]

During my first pregnancy, I developed bad congestion. I couldn't use the chemical exfoliants I had because my skin was too sensitive. I bought a travel size St. Ives apricot scrub and the congestion was cleared up within days. I just bought another one to use this summer as I enjoy it. I never bought into the "micro-tear" spiel. As a bonus, my retinol cream goes on like silk afterwards! I swear it helps my other active products work better!

[@aoifecalderon383]

Thank you for mentioning how it works with retinol!!

[@TheWhore2culture]

I'm impressed you managed a coherent video,regarding a court case which was simply about pure greed & stupidity on behalf of the anti St Ives brigade. I'm a man of 60,who started modelling in the mid/late 70s,I was head hunted on King's Road, Chelsea, London. At that point in my life I had zero skin regime apart from soap & water and oil of Olay,which my mother,also a model used. I spent a LOT of time in the sun&on the beach,in my leisure time,I was still at school at this point ,leaving school in 1981 at that point I started to model pretty much full time,it payed better than other jobs & allowed me to travel. I also started a skin regime,of which St Ives APRICOT scrub,was a main part,but,only twice a week. Steam,sauna& exfoliating with a clean dry towel was my prefered way to get rid if dead skin. Then at some point Clinique - sorry about spelling/ other mistakes, I'm very dyslexic - came out & I actually landed a contract to represent it,thereby having a seemingly endless supply of it. It was beautifully packaged and some of the products were nice,but,the face scrub had micro plastic beads in it which really irritated my eyes, a nightmare if you're in front if a camera! So I continued using St Ives and have done so for the last 45 years,the only change they've made is they now use crushed walnut shells whereas before they used crushed apricot pits. They've also expanded the range,with a bunch of different products and versions of the original product. As a moisturiser, I've always used whatever is at hand,it's better than nothing; but,for years used E45 & now use Cetraben after a shower. I exfoliate still only twice a week & put vasaline around my eyes before going to bed,I've done that since I was 15 /6. I was very lucky apart from minimal breakouts when I was a teen,I've never really had to deal with spots,blackheads & certainly not acne,for which I'm truly grateful. I've been around the beauty industry my whole life because of my mother,my godsons mother was one if "the faces of L'Oréal" for years,she also uses E45 or Cetraben,both of which in the UK can be prescribed as medication by a GP,a much higher accolade than a beauty bloger or play for pay dermatologist! As I'm sure you know,the cosmetics industry is a multi billion dollar industry,but, that does not mean that because a tub of cream costs £300 , its actually going to be any good. I don't drink ,smoke, take caffeine or "anything else" & haven't for nearly 30 years,I do drink a litre&1/2 of Evian - or equivalent - a day,I've NEVER drunk tap water. If in the USA I buy imported bottled water. As for my daily skin regime,I'm afraid to say I do use St Ives as a head to toe exfoliant,followed by one of the creams above & having visited my dermatologist only last month just before Xmas,was informed I have the skin,particularly on my face ,of a man in his late 30s/early 40s,which is fine by me,being 20 years off my actual age. The reason I stick to this basic - but successful - regime is its cheap and works really well,if it didn't,I'd be trying other things. Most people whom I know who've been in the business long term stick to a similar regime,unless we get "freebies" because it's daylight robbery to spend vast amounts of money on creams and unguents,where the main mark up is for the name & are 90% water!. Yes,there are a few products that are amazing,but,in real terms VERY few. It's always worth changing your regime once a year,so you can see if there really is a perceptible difference, but,I've got this far with out chemical peels,fillers etc and would rather spend the money on books & travel.And am still on my very basic regime. I'm not surprised the case was thrown out if court;even I agree that using ANY exfliant more than twice a week isn't good for anyones skin. I watched a few of your vids and enjoyed them,so belated Happy New Year and very best wishes to you&yours 👋⭐💯✌

[@janesmitson7404]

I've got the st. Ives apricot scrub, and drunk elephant, the ordinary, and I use it every few weeks, but I use it GENTLY, and it's great. No pressing into the skin. People complain about anything....

[@zhanelsh5857]

I used it for couple of times and it made my ance much much worse. I also used it on neck and shoulders where I ever had acne but after using apricot scrub I got acne everywhere I used it

[@micnik3573]

I havent tried a lot because money but this product makes my skin the smoothest its ever been

[@alfwinnn4224]

@@zhanelsh5857 it may have been an allergic reaction

[@gosick442]

@@zhanelsh5857 that's called an allergic reaction

[@zhanelsh5857]

@@alfwinnn4224 it wasn't allergy

[@sarah-jaynehullena5059]

I mean, when I get products in my eye, I definitely shed a few micro-tears 💦😂

[@brittanynicole4370]

😂😂😂😂🤣

[@kensleyhorner8897]

Underrated comment 😂

[@minimini550]

My skin loves an occasional St. Ives scrub down to remove “dry skin buildup” in the t-zone. For me it helps serums to properly sink into the skin again. I would prefer a fragrance free version, but you can’t win every time

[@shawnaferguson8721]

Agree! I tried to stop using it because it is so vilified, but my skin texture was awful.

[@jeishiikanzaki]

Saaaaame but I need to start having a better moisturizing skincare routine too lol

[@TheMarincicka]

Same here... delicate/periodic use works well for me.

[@alwayshopeful7587]

I also use this scrub on the nose only .and ohhhhhhh myyyyyyy GODDDD nothing removes the blackheads like this one.after I scrub with this I dry my skin and I take a warm soaked towel and press gently on the nose and a tonnnnnnn of sebum and dirt comes out soooo soooo easily from the pores leaving super clean skin behind .on the other hand chemical exfoliation, no matter,how much quantity or percentage, never ever clears my blackheads and pores even after prolonged use.🤷🏻‍♀️

[@alwayshopeful7587]

also chemical exfoliation always damage my barrier no matter how careful I am about using it.

[@bohobellenails]

Thank you for the deep dive, it’s a shame that St. Ives didn’t do the proper testing but also I’m shocked to learn that those girls/women sued preemptively based off of blogs?!? Like wtf is wrong with people? I kinda feel bad for St. Ives, considering this lawsuit brought so much negative attention to the scrub.

[@annihilxte]

Thank you for covering this. I remember being very confused hearing about micro tears. I have used the green tea scrub for about ten years and it has always left my face smooth and much glowier but I never had an issue with that one or even the apricot one which I used in middle school for a short period

[@rhaenyra176]

gosh i knew it my skin was literally perfect when i was using it years ago & recommended this to my friends, also loved it 🙂 had no problems with it but stopped using it bcos of the microtears fiasco. well atleast i discovered acids/chemical exfoliators 💁🏻‍♀️

[@esmeraldagreengate4354]

Me too. I actually brought a tube last will because I was so broke I couldn't afford anything else (I live rural and there aren't a lot of options) I didn't realise how much I missed it.

[@t_ylr]

I think a lot of people who talk about skincare online either have sensitive skin or a skin condition, but they forget that most people don't lol. Like if you have normal skin scrubs and fragrances aren't as bad as people make them out to be.

[@kategallagher852]

@@t_ylr i agree with you. They talk about specific things they avoid and demonize in the process, and in turn people cling to the "x product is bad, avoid it at all costs" when in reality, unless you have specific skin concerns that prevent you from using said ingredient/product, it should be fine

[@rhaenyra176]

@@t_ylr or they just didn’t know how frequent they should use the product & that they should always follow with the right moisturizers after exfoliation. hating on a specific product just because it didn’t work for you (personally) is so unnecessary.

[@kathyrnhutchinson9524]

"I'm just not a fan of stupid..." 😂 this is why you are the best James!!!

[@HRwoeking]

When he said that I truly hit me at a deep level. I often say “I’m triggered by stupidity” and I’ll stand by that! Haha.

[@liteflightify]

I still don’t like the shards in that scrub. They’re so inconsistent and random. While it is very drying. So, I had to stop using it. But still, if you don’t overuse it and don’t go in too hard, it’s a passable and cheap physical exfoliate. The issue was mainly the way people were using it and then not doing their proper skincare after using it.

[@JamesWelsh]

Yeah this whole comment is exactly my feelings. I feel like nowadays there are so many better alternatives to walnut. But st Ives are just holding on to a tradition and nowadays almost lazy ingreidnat?

[@_w_w_]

Yes, there are better exfoliants for your face, but this one is the better one for your body... cheap, effective and readily available. I still use it for my body and keep coming back to it.

[@lexwithbub]

And it should definitely not be used on acne, which unfortunately that's what everyone in the 80s and 90s did. There was this mindset that all you needed to do was scrub hard enough to get rid of the acne, when using physical scrubs on (particularly cystic) acne absolutely DOES damage the skin (ie. take the top off the pimples) and we really need to push the concept of just being really gentle on acne skin.

[@annettewilliams0219]

Exactly ! It so inconsistent the shaping i refuse to use it on my face but i will on my feet lol

[@foxycinnamon7307]

@@_w_w_ Same! I found it at a discount store and bought it in a tub for the shower/bath -- never thought of using it on my face. Later I bought a Queen Helene scrub for my face which I used once a month. No problems.

[@Ash-op2ql]

I really appreciate you attempting to debunk these bs rumors that KZbinrs promoted. Please keep it up this push towards “green” beauty I feel, KZbinrs have played a major role in perpetuating misinformation.

[@anniemilakovic7683]

Best video you’ve ever made! Thank you so much for doing the legwork for the deep dive into the lawsuit and accompanying evidentiary documents. We know it was a ton of work and we appreciate you!

[@persimmonguitar]

I think all the people experiencing adverse reactions have sensitive skin like me... any sort of walnut/apricot shell in an exfoliant and I can IMMEDIATELY feel it, it feels like dragging knives across my skin even when I'm being so gentle and it leaves my face angry and red.

[@joann.5041]

Hi, Yes, to me it sounds like you have sensitive skin like I do!

[@Cheshirestog]

Maybe but these people didn't have that. They just read it would harm their skin and were like oh it must have. They didn't feel that or they'd have said it.

[@jojoone1099]

Could be allergies for some.

[@Happytravellerkimmy]

I have super sensitive skin and I have to careful with exfoliants because they generally hurt especially if I scrub too hard. My skin is like a picky toddler screaming "NO!" at everything.

[@Lacycsgo]

yessss! never thought i was the one to have sensitive skin but i feel you on the walnut/apricot exfoliants. my skin has a lil scarring and st ives is what ive used for about 15 years. huge mistake. it works for some but not others. paulas choice is clearing it all up since its so minimal.happy skin care

[@MotoGPForever4527]

The apricot scrub is the single best thing for my skin. It smoothies it, allows moisturiser to sink in better, and brightens my skin while helping to prevent scarring. I never stopped using it and probably never will

[@ghoultooth]

Tbh I only stopped using it because of how everyone was sh*tting on it :( I never had a problem when using it around twice a week.

[@afro.disiac]

Same. I truly might start using it again

[@faishaga]

Same I stopped using physical exfoliators because of "microtears" and started using chemical exfoliators, which really don't work well for me at all :( it just ruined my skin, I shouldve stuck with physical ones. I'm gonna start using scrubs again and I'll never listen to these "skincare influencers" and "KZbin dermatologists" again.

[@MsKatze]

Same.

[@yoga1freak]

I have used apricot scrubs for 15 years now and still do. I never gave into the popular narrative that rose few years back that chemical exfoliants>physical scrubs. Chemical exfoliants just don't work for me, and apricot scrubs do the job just right!

[@WatsonAndDaughter]

This is actually so relieving for me... I'm allergic to BHA and AHAs and can't use them directly, so I've been agonizing over finding exfoliators. I actually used to use St. Ives and stopped because of these claims and that made me worry that it was making my cysts worse. I really would like to use it again.

[@stephaniecuzner8147]

Same. Plus I have really large pores and the little bead things get stuck in them. I'm going to start using St Ives again.

[@maryelmore478]

When I first heard about microtears on some other dermatology KZbin channel I was like WTF? Isn't shaving your face giving the same effect but you're not discouraging people from doing that! So yeah I've always thought this term was BS. Now, I did use St Ives for a hella long time. I like a good exfoliation. But a few years ago I came around to chemical exfoliants and found that they just did a much better job especially as my skin has become more sensitive over time. I will still use the physical exfoliant on other parts of my body though. Wouldn't it be easier if we just shed our skin all in one go like snakes? That would be very satisfying.

[@TheLaurelRose]

My beef with the whole throwing out of the "dermatologist-tested is misleading" claim is that, how would someone who doesn't know what it means know to complain? There's a clear implication, like James said, that tested means approved, and brands know that and that's why they make the claim at all. You have to know about the problem to complain about it in the way that they did. I just really hate that brands are allowed to use that term as blatant manipulation of consumers.

[@esmeraldagreengate4354]

Yes like the gyno tested claims on femfresh products, like Mama Doctor Jones says, Which gyno

[@BlisaBLisa]

brands do this kind of thing a lot but idk if its something you can really sue over or how much you can really restrict them making these kinds of misleading-but-true claims. most advertising is misleading or manipulative to some extent, like ads using weasel words , or referencing a study done on their product that the company itself paid for, or telling everyone how their company is donating to a cause but the cause is something they greatly contribute to (like oil companies donating to help climate change, or coca cola donating to help plastic cleanup) and their donation amount is very small for what the company has and regularly spends, etc. The vast majority of ads just suck and are misleading and manipulative and wed have to get really strict on advertising laws to counteract stuff like the "dermatologist-tested" misleading claim, which I personally wouldn't mind at all but I think its unlikely to happen lol

[@Elspm]

@@BlisaBLisa I think they should be required to show the methodology and outcomes of any claimed testing

[@SlpBeauty333]

YES!!! "Dermatologist tested" and "Dermatologist approved" are completely different things.

[@jazwhoaskedforthis]

Physical scrubs feel amazing when used correctly. Everyone picks on kids who use chemical exfoliant incorrectly and give them a bad rap, but we can’t tell adults not to scrub their face like they’re stripping rust off a grill? I have that stick face wash and the scrubs in tubes, and my skin feels really good.

[@juhitaguptaunofficial]

Fear mongering in general and also in skin care particularly always makes me cringe. Thanks for creating this video to bust some myths in a way that the general public can understand. Hope you cover more of such topics in the future too.

[@aradaevyre361]

Remember when thayers witch hazel was a hit 2018-2019? Then came beauty influencers saying it's drying for skin. But I've been using it and my skin loves it

[@suchafknladyyy]

Period

[@joyfuljaj]

I just bought some yesterday!

[@DiorLamour]

I use it on my eye(lids) when I cry too much and my eyelids get swollen

[@shannonlouiseh.9316]

Love this series! So informative and interesting. You are hilarious, charming and a breath of fresh air in the you tube skin care game.

[@JamesWelsh]

Aw thank you so much 🥹💜

[@momopeachies]

This whole microtears thing seems like the skin care version of the McDonald's coffee law suit. People think they know what happened until they actually look into the court documents, then they find out that most of what they "know" is just the result of marketing around the "scandal".

[@emilylerman9028]

I would say it's kinda the opposite. in St. Ive's case, people supported the lawsuit until they saw the evidence. In the McDonald's case, people blame the lady until they look at the evidence.

[@stealthis]

@@emilylerman9028 the thread is that people don't look at the evidence either way, they go with whatever feels best to them

[@nomdeplume2213]

the McDonald's coffee lawsuit was so sad. that poor woman got raked over coals for a "petty" lawsuit THAT WASNT PETTY. She almost died. McDonald's fcked that alll up

[@nomdeplume2213]

@@emilylerman9028 yea... thats exactly the point haha being ignorant and following everyone else instead of doing proper research

[@mackenziekirk26]

It’s the exact opposite. People made a mockery of that poor women suing over hot coffee. Look up the photos of her legs. There are parts of her leg MISSING. No coffee should be that hot and the lid should be properly secured. Anyways, this st.ives case was taken seriously when it was all just bullshit. They’re polar opposites.

[@kimberlykay1495]

I rewound the laughing part at 14min 20sec, many times and died laughing. Your laughter is infectious. I can’t even begin to tell you how much I needed that. Thank you dearly, @jameswelsh

[@pastelk]

Honestly physical exfoliatiors like srubs have helped me with my skin so much and even helped a lot with my skin picking disorder

[@Bee-uy2cn]

I used to vicariously scrub my face with the apricot scrub. I mean it was violent. I dont know how much damage i did or if said damage even occured. But my skin was so soft after.. it was addicting. After everyone said to stop using it i used it on my body. It does help with ingrowns after shaving and waxing.

[@jakecorshia]

I just don’t touch products like this it scares me every time I look at facial scrubs I’m going to scrub it on the bottom of my feet or not do anything with it

[@GO-sz1nv]

I don't think that's what vicariously means.

[@Bee-uy2cn]

@@GO-sz1nv so right i typed vigorously and must have spelled wrong. Im gonna leav it cause its funny 😆

[@GO-sz1nv]

@@Bee-uy2cn I was like "ummm... is there another meaning?" for a second 😂 had to double check

[@JamesWelsh]

Same here! This was my go too as a teen and I used to scrub until I was red on purpose!

[@faceonnailsdonehairdid]

Lastly, there's still a lot of confusion around the whole "dermatologically/dermatologist tested" claim. These terms aren't regulated but most commonly, "dermatologically tested" just means it was tested on human skin. "Dermatologist tested" means it was tested by a derm but both don't tell you what was thought about the products after application.

[@darleneelizabethjoiner1329]

I just started to use a Buf Puf for the first time in over 10 years and I noticed that my skin hasn't look and felt this great since... I discontinued using the St. Ives Apricot Scrub. I hate that I got on that microtear bandwagon. My skin is very oily and I felt that my skin looked and felt the best, when I used some sort of physical exfoliant. I never had a problem with St. Ives Apricot Scrub.

[@siobhanmairii]

Now that’s a blast from the past! My mom used to use these in the 80s-90s! I seriously haven’t seen them in stores in ages

[@3llevate]

I eventually stopped buying scrubs, not because there was anything wrong with them but because I realised it was SO MUCH cheaper to use my daily cleanser with an exfoliating sponge or cloth instead!

[@3llevate]

I used St-Yves, Avene etc.. and always found that buying these on top of my really good sensitive skin cleanser was a waste of money. I felt like exfoliating sponges/cloths gave me such a better exfoliation!

[@vintagecherries]

Interesting enough actually using a towel to scrub your face or a sponge or those electric brushes that wash your face are more harsh than this scrub.

[@rayniebee]

This is so interesting. I used to use St Ives as a teen and sporadically as an adult and always loved it, so when then whole micro-tear backlash happened, I was kind of sad because I felt embarrassed buying it, or like I was stupid to actively damage my skin. It can be really hard to filter out the actual facts from the court of popular opinion, so I just erred on the side of caution and didn't buy it. But, everyone's skin is different, and at almost 40, I know when my skin is angry about something, so, I think I'm going give St Ives another go.

[@vintagecherries]

Yes you can use it, just gentle and not everyday. But it's nice for 3 times a week following by a face cream.

[@ElenKarin]

This is such a mess, the time and effort you must’ve put into understanding this is admirable😅 Really interesting to watch!!

[@JamesWelsh]

Glad you liked it! Omg I was so stressed lol! Im not a academically clever person so I kept having to take breaks and calm down 😂

[@lucianas661]

the gag is ever since ppl started fearing st. ives it went on discount, it’s been $5 for a few years and i’ve been using it ever since LMAO. i use the apricot scrub every once in a while just for the scent, i’ve never had any reaction to it

[@roxi_lovesmakeup]

I've used St Ives for years, and never had a problem. I've used it even when I had bad acne, but when I hear things like " is compelling to scrub hard ", is bs. I've never scrubbed till I bleed ,even if this scrubber is quiet intense. If you are are careful, is fine. I'm not using it at the moment, just once a month maybe, because now I use a chemical peeling instead.

[@ljohnson1908]

This is what happens when people take a one size fits all approach to skincare. My dermatologist told me not to use physical exfoliates or the Clarisonic face brush because my skin gets inflamed easier than others. She never said no one should use these products.

[@jesseleewhitson3271]

Thanks for going into the details on this! I trust you bc of things like this and the fact that you're open about changing your feelings on products or trying to illustrate a point from different perspectives. You're aces at explaining why you do don't use something but why that's a personal choice and how someone else may have an opposite experience. Personally, with sensitive skin, I've never liked any scrubs or harsh exfoliants but I've used St Ives collagen and elastin moisturizer for years. It's the friendliest to my skin until I start using moisturizers waaay over my budget.

[@dominiquetheeasyminimalist]

I’ve used this scrub for decades to soften my heels 😁.I tried it once to exfoliate my face and after a few seconds I stopped because I found it too abrasive for my skin, but love it for my feet.

[@alphawhiskey2922]

I can safely say that this is my favorite series on your channel.. I think you're doing everyone interested a service by getting to the root of the rumors about a product.. even if you weren't so pleasantly surprised I think these stories need to be talked about... plus we love to spill the tea with you! 😇

[@silkenaria]

never had an issue with the apricot scrub, if my skin was feeling extra sensitive I wouldn't use it on those days. Using common sense, no skin tears, no irritation. On another note I have been cult level obsessed with their collagen elastin cream since I first discovered it on my grandma's vanity. Her smooth, wrinkle free skin might not have been because of it, but it certainly didn't hurt

[@sugarxsnap]

St Ives Apricot Scrub was THE FIRST cleanser I ever used. My stepmom let me use hers, and then bought me my own after my first bought of breakouts at 12 years old. I can still recall the way she showed me to use it. And I remember that it came in a tub/jar, not a squeeze tube. I liked the smell, and it felt sort of soft in my fingers... Though not so much on my face. I used it as a go-to for many years.... Well throughout highschool and even a few times in my 20s. While I'll not say that Apricot scrubs RUINED my skin, they're certainly not my mode of cleanser anymore..... And it has nothing to do with recent claims (which I didn't even know about). My skin merely doesn't tolerate physical exfoliants anymore, and I find even 'soft' ones like Huda's Wishful uncomfortable to use and not helpful for my combo-dry sometimes dehydrated skin. Maybe the reason I could tolerate a physical scrub years ago is because I had oily skin then.... It's really been with age and since having children that my skin has become more dry. Though, weirdly, I feel like my face is less sensitive than it used to be. Skincare is so complex..... That's why I always advocate LISTENING to one's skin. Listen to its needs.... Moisturize, even if you're oily.... Protect that moisture barrier, and you're good to go. (Oh, that's exactly it -- the reason my skin is less sensitive today compared to the past is because I've a healthy barrier. See, anecdotal proof.)

[@cthulhucult3230]

The thing my mom gave me is also in a plastic tub. Their products last literally forever.

[@HiruHeart]

Im lucky enough to have been living under a skincare rock while using scrub all these years. As a brown girl with thick, very very dry skin - I only ever used it for one thing. And that was for little pimples! Actually, when I would leave concealer on too long or go through periods of high stress, I would see the formation of small bumps of pimples. Because my skin isnt acne prone, I usually knew the cause of it was my makeup/stress/sleep etc. My go to ritual for getting rid of the pimples was always just to place a bit of the exfoliating scrub on the skin around the pimple for a minute or two, sometimes rubbing very gently with breaks in between, and rinsing with cool water. I actually figured to use it like this based on the instructions. Aside from the 3-4 times a week (id barely use it monthly) I just followed the instructions... With this my pimples were always gone or significantly reduced by evening. Obviously this product isnt going to work for everyone and I only got into skincare recently, but I think its really silly how people are shaming each other about the skincare products they use. If it works for you, then it works. Its YOUR skin, and if the skincare industry of all things cant accept everyone has different skin types, what is the point of it anyway??

[@bridgetw8688]

This honestly made me realize I had a really bad bias against this company since that lawsuit and everything. They had an amazing reputation before that from before I was even born. I also thought, while this came as a silly thought, possibly a decent idea, the scrub might be good for feet.

[@TyrTallAsATree]

I used a different exfoliant that also had ground up walnut in it, and it was wonderful for my skin. But, because of the drama around it, they changed the formula and it's just not the same, and I've struggled to find one that works for me. Guess I'll check out St. Ives if I can find it!

[@KimberFarms]

Give Queen Helene Mint Julep scrub if you haven't already. It has ground walnut in it. Available at Sally's or Amazon. Cheers!

[@xoxobeauty_by_lynne2895]

I found St. Ives at my local five below. I use it only on nights where I feel like I need a more abrasive scrub. My skin has never been healthier. I can’t do chemical scrubs at all they literally do nothing for me besides burn my face and make me breakout.

[@TyrTallAsATree]

@@KimberFarms I'll give a look to see if I can find it locally, I am Canadian so it might be a little more difficult, but I'll keep an eye out for that, thanks! :D

[@shamelessstacib7351]

I've been using it for like 30+ years, have EXTREMELY sensitive skin, and the only issues I've ever had are not being able to find it as it's often out of stock

[@GracieLions]

TRIGGER WARNING! Me from my late teens to mid thirties using St Ives scrub: *Scrubs face in shower* 'Why is my face still dry with little red veins showing?! Never mind, I'll cover the broken vein cheeks Maybelline mousse foundation, applied with my fingertips, followed by one colour of eyeshadow applied with the sponge plastic stick thing that came with the eyeshadow (but only if it's a 'posh' eyeshadow single). *Takes make up off (allegedly) using one removal wipe. Add 'night moisture' with Sudocream until geisha level is achieved.* Repeat until KZbin vids, including yours, @James Welsh save me. I now have a 16 step skin care routine from am to pm and people think I'm about 30 years old 😁❤️🌹 (I'm 43). xxx

[@terramiax]

As a beauty therapy student I’ve learned that you should only use facial scrubs once or twice a week because using scrubs too often can harm your skin (eg stripping the skin of oils which will cause overproduction of oil, especially for those with oily skin). I also have been told by my tutors that St Ives apricot scrub is bad for your skin because it’s “too abrasive” for your skin but I’ve also learned that ALL scrubs are somewhat abrasive to the skin and that’s why you should always be gentle when using scrubs and only use scrubs once or twice a week. Also “micro tears” don’t exist if you’re getting anything that remotely seems like a “micro tear” you should probably be more gentle with facial scrubs OR just change your skincare routine. So I’ve personally come to the conclusion that if a product works for you by all means use it, as beauty therapists we can only make suggestions to our clients but at the end of the day nobody knows your skin better than you! But in saying that, I personally wouldn’t recommend St Ives apricot scrub for those with sensitive skin.

[@goodgirl140]

I loved St.Ives Apricot scrub when I was a teenager. I especially liked using it before putting on a full face of makeup because it made my skin so smooth. Then I stopped using it as an adult because of the micro-tear claims.

[@wrenwear4754]

Same

[@sassywasthebestcat]

When my skin is having a reaction or is really mad at me I use the oatmeal st.Ives exfoliate! I lightly rub and then put a thick a layer on my skin and wait for it to dry and then rinse it off! Works wonders for those times.