Jennifer Crumbley trial: Shooter begs mom to text him back

Prosecutors introduced a trove of text messages between Jennifer Crumbley, James Crumbley and their son, including pleas from the shooter for his mom to text him back when he was struggling with being home alone.
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[@guardian1234561]

If your child is saying he is seeing demons throwing bowls in your house and u don’t respond until 2 days later there is something terribly wrong.

[@horsepanther]

She called him instead of texting.

[@CaptainDickGs]

No not really… when you get a child making up stuff like that what are you going to say? Children make up shit all the time & adults just ignore it. Nothing new

[@VioletJoy]

​@@horsepantherA whopping 19 second phone call.

[@Sea-cucumber1151]

@@horsepantherand they gave him a melatonin and allowed him to drink. Great parents!

[@deniseblackburn33]

Exactly heartbreaking 😢😢

[@Halie99.]

“Can you at least text back” speaks volumes. I don’t care what anyone says, his parents could have prevented this.

[@BunsenHoneydew001]

True. He was obviously in psychosis.😕

[@francescagibbons5842]

💯

[@jodi2462]

Reall?? Speaks volumes??...how exactly? You have never texted someone and they didnt respond and then didnt text asking them to??? And exactly how could they have prevented this???? Please explain. LIke are you saying that you could prevent your own kids from doing something if they were planning it?....Your jumping to conclusions without hearing the facts....not to smart if you ask me. Like are you always right there sitting on your phone waiting for a message ??? Like you've never not seen a message until the next day??? These prosecutors and the media are taking little things and blowing it out of proportion....your reading between the lines...without the full story...shame on all of you...

[@lee3171]

@@jodi2462 well, they could have NOT bought the psychotic child a gun, that is a pretty good start at them preventing this. They could have brought him to a psychiatrist for an evaluation. Just two off the top of my head.

[@HereForTheComments990]

@@jodi2462 Wow. Calm down. You’re sounding guilty of something. Geez. Ever heard the phrase, “The lady doth protest too much, methinks?” That’s you. ALL over the place. So tell us. What did your baby do? Huh? What did you help cover up that this trial is triggering you so much? Hmm???

[@rosemargaretmaloney2309]

Imagine your son telling you there’s someone in the house and you just don’t answer1

[@thamertanner5448]

When I was a kid one morning I saw a man in our new house, I thought it was my dad at first until he came downstairs a few minutes later. My parents searched the whole house, didn't find anyone. I was around 10 when that happened. At 17 my father told me the truth, the house was haunted by an evil presence that he had been in a spiritual battle with. As a kid I experienced a lot of strange things in the house until one day it all just stopped, turns out the day everything stopped was the day my dad had a priest exercise the house.

[@loopy1159]

And says I love u to your mother and she doesn't reply

[@Sara.Rose.]

She must have called him right after he sent those texts (which It doesn’t show here in the text snapshot) Check the dates people, it’s 2 different days... & I thought everyone was a detective here in the comments

[@Constance-cl3wg]

@@LuvlacegrlI was interested. Who are you to tell someone what they should or shouldn’t write?

[@beepboop9464]

​@@Luvlacegrl You realize Ethan Crumbley is talking about their being a demon in his house... so for you to say the comment has nothing to do with the case it is in fact based on the subject matter of this clip of the trial.

[@gena.sottile..HG..]

those parents failed that boy

[@DarlinReal]

They seem to have given priority to their horses.

[@Marilyn-e3i]

They seem to care more about their horses

[@Big_Z14]

Obviously Ethan did what he did and I hold him about 40% responsible but the rest is on his parents, 14 year old boys can't be expected to make good decisions especially if they're in a psychotic state, these two did everything short of telling him to go do this that could possibly make this the outcome. IMO they bought him the gun because they thought he would commit suicide with it, then he'd be out of the way and they could go ride horseback and go to swinger parties or whatever, but Ethan had a different idea.

[@kellybrus8663]

​@@DarlinReal And her boyfriend

[@DarlinReal]

@@kellybrus8663 did she have one? Haha

[@Angel-vb5ot]

It seems like Ethan was just a nuisance to his parents. They were living their lives as though he didn't exist and they couldn't be bothered with him.

[@stagename1031]

You can tell all this from 15 texts compared to 15 YEARS OF parent/son RELATIONSHIPS…. Yea ok 👌🏼

[@Angel-vb5ot]

@@stagename1031 It's what I've observed from the entire case, not from 15 texts or from half a million texts.

[@tammyiswicked]

@@stagename1031why you so defensive? You been a shit parent?

[@SoulDelSol]

​​​@@stagename1031yes there are dozens of hours of non-prejudicial evidence being presented to jury which supports that conclusion. You know that they were aware of his psychosis, bought him a gun, and that he murdered children with it right? How are you defending that. Anyway the reason there are so few texts is bc they don't respond to him in crisis and having visual hallucinations which is part of the issue

[@YoStYtOaStY100]

​@@stagename1031Yall defending this shitty ass mom are super suspect. Yall shitty parents too? Not taking care of your kid? Your projecting hun and it looks bad.

[@Jazlin92665]

For those saying the parents aren’t wrong for not texting back because “we all have texts that we don’t see until the next day”….. the prosecutor proved that the pics of the dad on the horse were taken at the same exact time that Ethan was texting his mother. And the picture were taken with the mothers phone. So her phone was in her hand at the time of those messages. So what now.?

[@Axolotl74]

Far out that's a cruel thing to do to your child 😢

[@syljm515]

Agree. And we all have text we see the next day but a parents natural instinct is to always be available Incase your kids need you. So they can ignore friends or even work but not a text from your child. Horrible.

[@terrystorey]

Because you can take pics with your phone, does not mean you are getting texts or are able to text. This is easily provable. Js🤷🏻‍♀️. Btw, the way it seems to me so far is that the son seemed like he threw a fit every time he wasn't getting attention. Yes, he had issues. Yes, he should have gotten some serious help. But, parents do have a right to have some sort of life outside the home without being emotionally manipulated and guilt tripped.

[@syljm515]

@@terrystorey are you a parent? Did you see that home? That home was completely neglected. If the home is taken care of then they can have a life as a reward for sure. But neglect comes in when all you do is have your own life and not care for your kids/home.

[@SoulDelSol]

​@@terrystoreyyou said it yourself "yes he had issues and shouldve got serious help". That's where parents neglect comes in. A minor can't receive counseling or psychiatry without parent/guardian's consent

[@VestalVisions]

In other words, Ethan was so desperate for attention he was willing to kill for it. It’s clear his parents couldn’t have been more emotionally neglectful. As heartbreaking as that is he still had options and chose to end lives. I hope his parents also do time, even though their guilt lies more in what they didn’t do than what they did do. That includes purchasing the pistol, imo; that could have been a chance to teach him responsibility and to bond with him. Instead, they basically said: here’s a gun, we couldn’t care less what you do with it, just leave us alone.

[@kaitlanparks8061]

Guilt when it comes to overall prevention is blatant. I just hope that a jury realizes that action/attention from his parents at seemingly anytime leading up to the incident-including both parents just an hour prior-more than likely could’ve yielded a different outcome. I couldn’t fathom not taking this kind of thing seriously especially as parents, but even more simply as responsible firearm owners.

[@Annette-z1h]

It sure sounds like it. 😢

[@mellie4174]

Exactly. One I. 3 children are abused by thier parents and the vast majority are not killing people. I'm reserving judgement on the parents though until I have all the facts

[@OddWoz]

He was screaming not just for attention, but for help.

[@OddWoz]

@@muadhnate wouldn’t surprise me if that was in the back of their mind as wishful thinking.

[@sunnin1671]

The defense attorney is so emotionally needy 🤷🏼‍♀️ like it’s overwhelming and I’m sure the jury is over it too.

[@CharlotteFerrariBreton]

No she is just very dramatic, which makes her look crazy and unprofessional.. I can understand the pressure the parents were on to hire a lawyer they could afford as quickly as possible, Here is the result.

[@Sara.Rose.]

She’s making this whole case like it’s ALL & ONLY about herself! Her emotions, her sleep, her break ... wow 🙄 So immature

[@beepboop9464]

​@CharlotteFerrariBreton I'm starting to wonder if it's a tactic of hers. She has had one of the other most notable trials in Michigan, Larry Nasser.

[@CharlotteFerrariBreton]

@@beepboop9464 Did she win that one? No right?

[@beepboop9464]

@CharlotteFerrariBreton I didn't say it was a good tactic. But also both cases would be pretty hard to win.

[@redcharm6173]

I’m embarrassed for her. Her misconduct and temper tantrums is not going unnoticed by the jury imo. I would be appalled if she was representing me.😞

i was thinking exactly the same just now

[@My2centsarenecessary]

So much snark in her voice... just saying regular things.

[@rhiannonrose4841]

She is way to inexperienced for this trial.Its quite sad watching it.Her unprofessional behavior should definetly be addressed sooner then later.Not just all the fake tears.shes walking a fine line of many complaints and being disbarred

[@eeayquetting5963]

She has 16 years experience... This is an act

[@angelathomason4465]

Has anyone else noticed her hands shaking uncontrollably at times

[@mrobertsbeck]

Shannon, the fact you are so unprepared is getting annoying. Get it together. And keep your voice down when you are speaking to the judge. You are just rude

[@Arlo360-Official]

Shannon is actually a well respected and effective lawyer. Trouble is this case is WAY out of her "wheelhouse" (as they say) and I think she's lacking the experience a slimy, crooked defense would bring to the table.

[@Thatguyboogerbush-gp9db]

​@@Arlo360-Official😂😂😂

[@river8760]

@@Arlo360-OfficialShe thinks Nassar is a good guy apparently. I’d say she’s pretty slimy.

[@PBJELLYx2]

How is she one of the best defense attorneys in the state LAWD HELP

[@river8760]

@@PBJELLYx2 🤣👌

[@lovesphynx]

dang they pulled the meta data to show she had her phone great job

[@BeautifulSoul-zk6lo]

Wow, I jump out of my sleep to text or call my kids back. A child should never beg for attention from a parent. They failed this boy big time😢. What he did was awful and he deserves to be punished, however his parents contributed to his behavior!

[@genomic_]

I live in a different time zone than my mom and there is a 13-hour time difference between us. Sometimes, when I really feel like talking to her, I call her in the middle of the night for her. She always answers and tells me that I never bother her and that I can call her anytime I want to talk to her. Although I don't know much about Jennifer except the information available to the public, I can't imagine how she could treat her child that way when he was looking for love. It's heartbreaking. 😢

[@shannon_w.]

I TOTALLY agree with you!

[@jlb56]

Exactly

[@BeautifulSoul-zk6lo]

@@genomic_ That is what any good Mother does! The fact he had to beg for a response is actually really sad. I always lie to my son amd tell him he didn’t wake me up lol. I literally panicked if I don’t notice a text or call from my babies. I have one minor child that is down the hall from me and I still wake up out of my sleep for her or run to her room if I am up. I go to bed early and I never turn my ringer off so my kids can reach me at anytime!!!

[@ivanleelivingston4902]

25 years in Psychology .Look, to the very accurate Behavioural Science ( CSI ) for Narcissism in unloving parents who do not text back due to a higher EGO. They are unloving, uncaring monsters that do NOT feel love , protection or empathy for their children. This leaves the child alone, desperate disturbed and emotionally unstable. So buy the child a gun and go horseback riding because they just want the child to shut up or run away or whatever ??

[@elycezynski]

“Can you at least text back” 😔

[@mrobertsbeck]

So so sad. These “parents” should be ashamed.

[@truthhurts2879]

TWO DAYS LATER... "where's your dad" smfh.

[@sandigrace2271]

😢

[@jeannineharrelson1201]

Speaks volumes. 😡😡

[@jodi2462]

@@mrobertsbeck ...nah..the people judging them when all the evidence hasnt been brought out should be ashamed...

[@frankelezaj7640]

If this defense attorney is playing stupid for a mistrial she needs to be disbarred.

[@wrmlm37]

She is killing her career with 1 trial. She will be doing contract or family law after this. Is this before or after she visibly cried and shuddered at some evidence not shown to the media that upset HER SO MUCH she had to ask for a brief "recess"? She is unprepared, unprofessional. Frankly it is unbelievable that she is even there. This will establish ground for incompetence, an appeal on that ground, and a retrial. Insufferable.

[@Stray..]

Well, she won’t find a more tolerant judge to her antics so she might want to think twice about that.

[@isaiahlaitinen]

That was what I noticed right away. Her behavior reminds me of Alina Habba.

[@gwynhyfer]

I'm still trying to get my head around the text where she says she's going to get drunk and go for a ride on her horse. 🤔

[@Rebecca-hc5ju]

Right?!! I mentioned it above to the *one* person who is defending her in the above comments.

[@seasonofthewitch7249]

😂😂😂

[@melissafraser2190]

I thought it was a figure of speech until I saw the horse pic 😂

[@galndixie]

These parents both knew, for quite a while and without a doubt, that this boy was a raving lunatic, and yet they bought him a gun. Should they be held responsible? Absolutely, to the fullest extent of the law. They rightly should have to pay for the funerals and medical bills of all those victims.

[@jturtle5318]

Gave him a pistol in direct response to him complaining about trouble at school, and when called to the school and told to take him for immediate treatment, they told him work was more important. That's no different than refusing to take a child for urgent medical care.

[@earthlingsandy]

Ethan was not a lunatic but I understand for some people who lack empathy it's easier to label people as such instead of trying to understand why people do the things they do which says more about you than him. 🤷🏻‍♀️

[@JustaDudeTryinToLearnPiano]

What a closed minded view

[@nukeputin420]

​@@JustaDudeTryinToLearnPiano explain how instead of trolling, then

[@JustaDudeTryinToLearnPiano]

@@nukeputin420 i don't think they looked at their son as the rest of the world looks at him. Even if they were shitty parents, he was still their son, so I don't think they "knew he was a raving lunatic, and still bought him a gun". They didn't know anything about him, hence the neglect and their ignoring nature. That was the only part I was referring to as close minded. Their terrible parenting had direct correlation to his actions, and I do agree they should be prosecuted to the fullest extent.

[@theriddlerUSA]

Jennifer cared more about her horse than she cared about her son.

[@2008aa6]

Someone please tell me, were they letting their 15 year old son consume alcohol regularly. I cannot think of any good excuse for this either.

[@VioletJoy]

Crazy! I can't believe I hadn't heard about that until now.

[@jenicdarling9425]

And was giving him Xanax! If they see nothing wrong with their 15 drinking & drugs then wouldn’t be surprised if they shared more with him like pot & other pills, even mixing them. Sounds like they gave him the Xanax when he was still drunk after drinking all night too, and not even half but gave him a whole Xanax!?! Instead of making him their priority which he should’ve been whole time! To just spend time with & being there for him, getting him to psychologists & such but they didn’t wanna go that route, to step up as parents and put in all that work. Naw instead it was easier & less work for them just to ignore & sedate him as they tried self medicating their teen son themselves. Yeah I sure that’ll help 🙄. What neglectful sorry excuse of parents. He’s still accountable for what he did but his parents played a part and need to be held too.

[@lunarbeauty]

I bet they had been drinking with him.

[@ZA-co9vj]

Part of me feels bad for this kid. He clearly needed help and even asked for it. His parents are total selfish losers and failed him!

[@innocentnemesis3519]

This case is so important. It’s clear that the grave emotional neglect of these “parents” caused innocent people to lose their lives.

[@2008aa6]

That boy did not have a single adult in his life that cared. I guess he wasn’t going to get any help from adults at home, they put him on the path of destruction. The only way this tragedy could’ve been averted was if he reached out to someone himself, like a counselor or mental health provider. It’s just so sad and incomprehensible that someone could have “parents” that simply don’t not give a damn about them.

[@nightknght]

Comments like yours finding compassion for this kid, has renewed a bit of my faith in humanity. We’re all products for our environments after all.

[@samsai1761]

Sad part is, he did all those things. His counselor knew about his mental illness since he was showing signs at school and had hard evidence such as notes and drawings talking about guns and voices. He also asked his parents for a therapist for his birthday, which his parents ignored. This boy tried everything to save himself and everyone around him before he lost his mind. But what did his parents do? They went drinking, horse riding, and bought him guns. Everything could have been prevented if the adults that knew him took even some amount of action.

[@lilyflower6511]

Why is the mother going through the father to see our their son is? Why is she not contacting Ethan, texting or calling? Being present with him, emotionally n physically comforting him, getting him help, giving Ethan a moment of her time.. the horses could have waited, the are being boarded and have people paid to care for them. Very selfish individuals!

[@DaughterOfTheEve]

Absent parents

[@btrotter4775]

It was all within 1 minutes and it looks like she was on a horse

[@btrotter4775]

I don't always text back within 1 minute. He sent like 7 text in 60 sec

[@Allthhegoodonesaretaken]

It clearly shows the ‘can you at least text back’ was 30 minutes later.

[@beepboop9464]

​@@btrotter4775 So she stayed on the horse for two days? He texted her on 3/17 Could you at least answer and she didn't text anything back for two days. Not saying she couldn't have called him but I am sure that would be entered into evidence too.

[@TRVBAL]

if that defense attorney apologizes ONE MORE TIME....

[@karenlevine8076]

There is an " I'm sorry" ticker counter in Recovery addict's KZbin channel. Up to 212 last count. Great channel. Follows the case live 8 hours a day

[@karlmel15]

Must have never visited the midwest

[@lisal2018]

I hope this judge gets control of her courtroom. She is wasting taxpayers money. Stop giving defense, train wreck a pass.

[@rls25132]

I know this judge, let's say in my experience she surprised me with her ruling as basic and simple as it was. I still believe 20 years ago she must have hated women. Now I understand she probably just didn't pay any attention and didn't care about the case.

[@horsepanther]

WTF are you referring to?

[@HarryDirtay]

​@@rls25132seek professional help for your delusions.

[@janedoeseph]

Normalize blaming parents. As a parent myself, I would, and have, taken full responsibility for anything my children do. Because I’m raising them. While anyone that would take up arms against children is a fucking monster, their PARENTS created them. This woman categorically failed as a mother, and she is also responsible for any and all lives lost by the hands of her son.

[@parthenocarpySA]

Thank you, yes. Responsible gun ownership used to be a point of pride in this country.

[@heathernks8]

Absolutely agree! The only ppl mad about this verdict are keyboard warriors, not us actual parents!

[@jamaruperi5715]

Athena would disagree with you all

[@AndreaCain-y5y]

How can you have a horse but in debit card trouble

[@bornfree0507]

And why all the Facebook messages? Just text. Actually call them if it’s an emergency. Or do they not have money for phone bill after buying guns?

[@cinder7183]

The cheapest time you have with a horse is when you buy it. They're very expensive to keep

[@Allthhegoodonesaretaken]

@@bornfree0507how would Facebook messenger work if they didn’t have a phone plan? We know the dad was out door dashing too.

[@TheDowntown02]

@@silentcatshhhhYou just answered the question that it’s easy to get a horse but you befuddled the second part lol

[@THEPRK]

Horses can do a lot of cocaine between races. Nearly bankrupted me.

[@thamertanner5448]

This is the strangest text communication I have ever seen between two adults, the lack of communication skills is glaringly evident as is the lack of basic grammar. I would not be able to make sense of half these texts if someone said these things to me. The mother is beyond strange. Cold doesn't even begin to cover it.

[@gphunkera8731]

Well, she was cheating on her husband so communication probably wasnt great to begin with.

[@sticeda5985]

It seems like the parents bought him the gun hoping he would end his own life so they could just do what they wanted

[@veggiesoul]

That's what I think

[@glamoroussunset5361]

I got that vibe also. What horrible people!

[@shelleybullen6191]

Wow talk about ignoring signs

[@alllifematters]

Dont have kids if youre not gonna make them your first priority!!! Im sure this little boy is gonna thrive in prison because he will have more structure and input from guards than he did his own parents sadly

[@robertandkristinhall5006]

"This little boy is gonna thrive in prison" are words that do not belong in a sentence together. First, he is not "a little boy". Second I would sincerely hope that little boys do not go to prison.

[@fredv7349]

I don't know about that, he's like a minor going into an adult prison. A minor with mental health problems at that, I can't see this being a positive experience but I can't predict the future so who knows.

[@laurasuzanne7307]

That boy was so sick. Now life for him. Sad

[@Carebearstare....]

These parents should sit not Ethan. That child was screaming for help! He should really be in a hospital. Im not excusing his behavior but they caused this mess!!!😠

[@lynnkayee1015]

I somewhat feel the same. I filled with a lot of rage as a young teen (14/15) and had a lot of homicidal and suicidal ideation. I wrote a lot of disturbing things in a journal my mom found and she casually mentioned it to my sister like it was the weather. I'm talking detailed plans to harm people and she acted like it was nothing. Thank god my sister stepped in and forced my mom to institutionalize me! It didn't help too much but lead to me leaving the home and getting what I needed from a grandmother sent from heaven. I honestly believe I would have ended up harming my mother or someone else if nothing had been done. I remember seeing my mom passed out and thinking how easy it would be to overdose her on insulin since she had tried to kill herself that way before. But my body just wouldn't move to do it. Now I'm a completely different person who has to work on not being a pushover because it hurts me so much to even hurt others feelings for just a second. Lmao Can't help but wonder what could have been for kids like Ethan if ANYONE had stepped up. I know some people can't be changed, but it is sad to never know. Especially in cases of such obvious neglect. 😩

[@drugreen123]

Emotional neglect is abuse. I'm glad you got help.

[@irishandscottish1829]

@@lynnkayee1015 I remember when my son who is autistic and other conditions was young told me he was ‘hearing voices’ the first thing I did was not make a big deal of it to my son so he wouldn’t be scared/panic but then discreetly called his psychiatrist he saw in the nhs (over here psychiatrists handle the diagnosis and management of autism/adhd etc) though the continual involvement doesn’t go on the severity so to speak of the diagnosis but how it is actually impacting their day to day life. So while my son was diagnosed with aspergers they classified it as severe because when little it had a profound affect on his day to day life. Due to the family history of one of my aunts being diagnosed with schizophrenia as a teen the consultant wanted to see my son asap because while it would be very unusual for schizophrenia to occur pre pubescent the family history made it a possibility. However after in depth assessment and the psychiatrist talking to my son to understand what he meant by ‘hearing voices’ it was realised it was his countless thoughts running wild due to his adhd and his internal monologue that he couldn’t identify due to his difficulties but it was something they kept a close eye on during the years schizophrenia can develop in teenage years. Though my sons consultant was amazing (or consultants should I say as they often moved between the children’s psychiatric department and the adults department to keep their skills up so whenever they switched to adults my son would get a new consultant) every one said to not hesitate calling their secretary if I have any questions or concerns no matter how stupid I think the question may be and they will either give advice/info over the phone or arrange to see my son (if it was an urgent matter they would see him the next day) they also had a very close relationship with our GP so if push came to shove we could seek urgent medical help from the GP and they could then liaise with the consultant on next moves. In fact my sons consultants were so amazing they came to nearly all school meetings because his primary school had a bad habit of refusing to implement strategies either the OT/physio/consultant/specialised one on one special needs teacher etc said needed to be put in place. Such as given my son control to chose a quiet corner to retreat to when he felt overwhelmed, going there would mean the teacher knew my son just needed a moment and to leave him for a little bit before going to him - instead the school refused to do such things which would just escalate my son which resulted in all my sons specialists at times having shouting matches with the head teacher in meetings telling her to stay in her lane

[@jturtle5318]

​@@lynnkayee1015I'm glad you're doing well now.

[@earthlingsandy]

If you see the video where they played his recorded message he made the day before the shooting you will hear a very sad defeated kid who lost hope bc he saw how fuked up the world was and how the school system + G0v are bra!nwashing ppl which is so sad bc he's right. I'm not excusing what he did but Americans really need to look at themselves + their attitudes/behaviors + lack of empathy + how they feed kids + put them on harmful pHARMa drugs as all these factors contribute to ones emotional/mental state bc when ppl are mentally abused/neglected they will do awful things as we've seen time & time again. ☹

[@allieGirl146]

This judge needs to watch how a real, strong judge controls the courtroom. Charles Adelsons ,Judge Everitt, would have none of this behavior from attorneys.behavior.

[@blackqueengenius7341]

Racist

[@donnahague8983]

Nothing condones what Ethan did but you can kind of see how he got to the point he said “screw it”…. His parents were very neglectful… he was begging for his parents attention and help and they did nothing… both his parents need to do time…

[@jimremedes8576]

Parents seem to demonstrate that they cared about their horses MORE THAN THEIR OWN SON!!

[@arcticgoddess]

Another reason blocking abortions is a horrible idea. I don't know if these two wanted their child, but they sure didn't act like it.

[@madday9589]

Like 95% could be also avoided if people just used proper protection but they just don’t care, like they’ll have a kid without a second thought or want one for messed up reasons

[@LP-ct9nk]

Seeing how in some red states they’re going after different “protection” options (namely birth control) after abortion rights were repealed the number of unfit parents having kids for the wrong reasons will grow for sure

[@j.c.7555]

I honestly can’t believe this is how the parents responded or rather didn’t. Those parents are responsible for this horrible crime. Horrible horrible horrible!

[@sherrythomas3028]

The fact people think she isn't guilty, is disgusting. This proves she cared more about her horses and side piece. And said on the stand there is nothing she would change. Just shows not everyone should be a parent.

[@SandiByrd]

Ethan's lawyer is useless...and based on the text messages alone is parents failed him on a daily basis. They're useless too.

[@shannonslutzky4754]

Your teenage son is telling you sees demons throwing things and it takes TWO DAYS to respond? And he still doesn’t go see someone? And then they BUY HIM A GUN!?? My daughter told me once, in hysterics, that she was feeling bad about herself and scared she would hurt herself. She was talking to someone 2 days later. It’s really not that hard to pay attention and try to help. This is your child! Not downplaying what he did but shame on you mom.

[@shcl3329]

The defense attorney really needs to calm down, tone down, and be more professional.

[@kims7287]

This poor kid 😓 (and no, I'm not forgetting his victims but he's a victim too...)... Such a horrible situation all around. Neglectful parents need to be held accountable the same as abusive parents

[@cinder7183]

What is wrong with this defense attorney? Its like this is her first trial She doesn't belong in a courtroom. Shes well respected? She acts like shes had too much Adderall.

[@jh-kv6pq]

I just want to say, not saying this is the reason but I have a son who was taking melatonin to sleep. He then started having nightmares, really bad and vivid dreams. He would wake up screaming in the night. Fast forward and he started being very aggressive during the day and having full out fits. I stopped the melatonin and it all stopped. Melatonin does have side effects

[@x-Clover-x]

Maybe he needs a lower dose or something else. But if he was having trouble sleeping before then perhaps its not the Melatonin..he probably needs some other meds... or he needs some professional help. There are meds that block dreams all together too. I wish you and your son all the best, dear ❤

[@alyssaleatham8544]

Thank you for sharing this information. You pay attention to your child, as this woman should have.

[@drugreen123]

Considering they were caught with xanax I think she was lying and that's what she actually gave him.

[@Naveen-tx8be]

melatonin gives me very vivid, lasting, recurring nightmares. It’s not as harmless as people think! Especially if you’re taking other medications that regulate mood.

[@irishandscottish1829]

@@Naveen-tx8be over here in the uk melatonin use in children can only be started by a consultant psychiatrist and only after sleep studies etc have been done. After the consultant starts the prescription then the GP takes over prescribing them. However dosage and potential side effects are monitored closely. My son is 20 now but when he was 9 and went on melatonin it was still unlicensed for children here (unsure if it is licensed in use for use in children yet or not). I was asked as his parent if I was willing for anonymous data IE male aged 9 and dose could be collated and used for the study that is assessing the use and effectiveness of melatonin in children and how frequent children were having side effects etc. As a nurse I said absolutely but more importantly it was explained to my son the purpose of this and that if the study showed x results it would mean prescribing in children could be started by the GP instead of consultant. My son gave his consent saying he wants to help if it helps other children regardless of outcome of the studies. It baffles me that in America you can just buy melatonin over the counter and just give it to your kids especially when over here were are told during school holidays etc we should allow our children to have breaks from it so the body doesn’t completely lose the ability to produce melatonin naturally

[@ellemarr7234]

This makes me hurt. These parents are disgusting

[@Sookielein]

Man whenever the horses had any issues they called the vet and attended to them and their son literally cries for attention and help and gets treated as inconvinience.

[@patricialk4996]

This is why, though the boy killed those children, my heart breaks for him too. His parents basically unalived him.

[@Skaði]

fix the subtitles please it isn't there for show, people actually use it

[@crimegeek]

This is damning for Jennifer’s fate.

[@byrondaniel4410]

Cared as much about the kid as they did there horses people may still be here

[@GataKwe]

*their

[@DarlinReal]

Both the defense attorney and judge need a lot of training.

[@davidjones-vx9ju]

from who?

[@TheDowntown02]

@@davidjones-vx9juYour mom.

[@davidjones-vx9ju]

she is dead@@TheDowntown02

[@girlfromsouth214]

LOL, what law school did you go to? Did you even finish high school? Many of you are so clueless, you don't even realize the difference between discussions in and outside of the jury's presence.

[@DarlinReal]

@@girlfromsouth214 did you answer all your questions to yourself?

[@Max_N]

The closed captions are for a weather report not for the video. Someone might want to fix that. Not very accessible. Thank you.

[@70n24]

This!!! I thought there was something wrong with my browser.

[@houseofrio1960]

This defense attorney is just not capable of!!

[@Bia08121975]

He is a troubled kid with bad parents. If instead of buying him a gun, they had taken him to a doctor that was a better spent of money. When parents like this take kids to therapy it doesn’t work per se if the parents are not envolved. And therapy can be rough for families because you have to acknowledge lot of bad shit in your life’s and how influences the family dynamics.

[@gatdemun]

He needed parents. She was behaving like his buddy not his mother. I’m 45 old and I don’t speak like that in front of my parents nor my or any children

[@crazygreenlady7907]

Non-American here - can someone please explain to me any other non-Americans watching : Ethan is/was prosecuted as an adult (?) despite being 15 at the time of the crime. In principal why is this done? Does it affect sentencing? What kind of crimes is this policy used for? 15 is a difficult age, you want to be a grown-up but you also still want parental love and care. You understand the finality of death, but you aren't capable of appreciating the enormity of it. I feel for the teen who just wanted his parents to text back, and acknowledge his existence. But please be in no doubt my compassion for those affected by this particular tragedy is boundless.

[@doubletrouble469]

Often a youth offender can be charged as an adult if the crimes are severe enough. Yes it effects the sentence time, place of imprisonment, and lots of other stuff. There are lots of restrictions on punishments for children and they I believe have more opportunities for parole and other ways to lessen their sentences

[@dgatsf]

He was charged as an adult to placate the community and for no other reason. However, he will be granted a parole date because of his age. No love in this boy's life.

[@jodi2462]

Hun..the entire American justice system is screwed up....innocent people are convicted everyday because we have people sitting on the jury that dont even understand what beyond a reasonable doubt means....and then Im sure you can tell by all the comments on this page...Americans like to judge and jump to conclusions before they even hear all the facts....Its all one big mess!

[@Jazlin92665]

@@dgatsf he was given life without the possibility of parole. He will get no parole date.

[@abkl1]

Texting his parents about demons and ghosts, either for attention bc they ignore him and/or bc he suffers from mental illness. This all could’ve been easily prevented if they got him the psychiatric help he desperately needed & restricted his access to firearms.

[@CourageUnderFire87]

In all honesty I feel like Ethan is a victim to some extent too. The parents are the REAL culprit of school shooting and I feel they should be the ones serving life without the possibility of parole ! Ethan I feel should have the possibility to parole after 40 years or so. Ethan did attempt multiple times to seek help and legally needed his parents to facilitate the mental help for him as he was a minor. His parents denied Ethan care and emotionally neglected him.

[@stephenj.schneider5185]

wtf is "playing" when you turn on closed-captioning

[@sapphirerain70]

Lmao! Right! Whole different show right there lol

[@ibelf2465]

Something about hot sauce & I got kinda scared & turned it off. 😅

[@thamertanner5448]

@@ibelf2465 hot sauce?? I got a weather report

[@divinetiming8422]

​@@ibelf2465The Mother gave him hot sauce and video taped it. He was only like 8 y/o. She waved a hundred dollar bill at him to do it and he lost then got laughed at. What a Mother, not even caring it burns up a child's mouth,esophogus, stomach, causing pain after. What a cruel joke to do to a little boy!

[@SL123-zd6kf]

It really pisses me off at this kid wasn’t sent to a mental institution, since clearly, he was neglected, and had mental disorders!!! Why was he sent to jail for life?!!!!

[@johndalton3180]

Because we live in a heartless country

[@98f5]

What do you think happens if you're a raving lunatic who kills a bunch of people?

[@lioleigh9791]

How many raving lunatics do you know who can control their impulses and outbursts without being medicated or treated for their illness(es)? That's the damn point. He is a minor. He never got treated or even seen. It was his parents responsibility to get him treatment and now it's the state's responsibility. They both gave up on him right off the bat and he never stood a chance. If he had no psychosis, abuse, and no motivation for killing other than for fun, then I'd totally agree with you. But that's very clearly not the case here.

[@johndalton3180]

@lioleigh9791 Uh huh. If he's a minor why was he tried as an adult? The outcome of this mentally disturbed child shooting up the school was NOT obvious and foreseeable. As much as I dislike the mother, the outcome of this trial was ABSURD.

[@no.1fan156]

​@@johndalton3180Have you considered that if his parents never failed him and he actually got professional help, he wouldn't be shooting people? The point is he's a minor that never had guidance, just because the crime he committed qualifies him to be tried as an adult, doesnt excuse the fact he's still an underdeveloped teen, lol.

[@juliav.mcclelland2415]

These are the type of people who tried to make parenting have as little intrusion into their lives as possible. If you don't want to have a 24/7 highly labor intensive job, DO NOT HAVE KIDS!

[@ChangeIsEverywhere]

Holy hell…this case is a very complicated school shooting… no matter how wrong this kid was…I feel he practically begged for help…..and a horseback ride kind of stuffffffff just ignored their son begging for a response….I hate all of it but I hate this most….might be wrong at 9 minutes in

[@truthhurts2879]

You're absolutely right my lovely, this poor son pleaded for help while simultaneously experiencing terryfying psychotic hallucinations he mistook for ghosts in his home while he was completely alone begging his no good mother to text him back, which she finally does TWO DAYS LATER asking "where's your dad?". 🤬😡👹👺☠️

[@ChangeIsEverywhere]

@@truthhurts2879 it’s really unbelievable….I didn’t know how accountable she could be until the details have came out. They are going to eat her up. The jury, the public, the general population in prison. Put her in jail. She didn’t fail him, she outright said fuq him by her action. Or lack of.

[@thamertanner5448]

He was literally begging for psychiatric help and they refused to take him to a therapist. They refused to get him help on multiple occasions, no matter how many people told them he needed help. I read up on the whole thing shortly after it happened. It's absolutely sickening how much they clearly did not care one bit for their child's wellbeing. Some people really and truly do not believe in mental illness or mental health support.

[@ChangeIsEverywhere]

@@thamertanner5448 crazy all the way around

[@narojamir9356]

I fell very sorry for Ethans life, hoping those victim families will reconsider his case just us our heavenly father forgive us for our sins. Everyone deserves second chance in our life. Yes, it's very hard to forgive for what Ethan had done, it's terrible. But from my point of view, Ethan too was begging his parents attention. In the end only Ethan is the loser. Life without paroul is too harsh for him in his case. Everyone is using him . 🙏 for Ethan.

[@MommyinJuly]

Some people don't deserve to be parent's.

[@J.E.Lockwood]

Closed Captions are of news broadcast someplace else

[@tigerpaw1982]

The visual transcript doesn't match what is said.

[@lNoWayAroundItl]

I am surprised that defense hasn't been reprimanded and a mistrail determined. This trail is a mess and if I was the Defendant I would not feel my representation was competent for the workload. It is obviously overwhelming and not seeming adequate.

[@thedarknorse]

I wish the judge would speak up, I can hardly hear her.

[@sharons5074]

They more worried about the horses than their son that is crying out for help… she can’t even be bothered to text him back at least

[@OddWoz]

Kid was literally screaming for attention and help. As much as I can’t excuse his actions, it’s hard not to expect such things from kids that are ignored in crisis like this. It was so easily preventable, and the school system failed him just as much as his parents did… and by extension they failed the victims as well.

[@GrandmaLoves2Scuba]

2 days!? to respond to her son, who is obviously screaming out for help? No words...smh 😢

[@TheStephsimpkins]

This is so sad, that boy was screaming out for help

[@davidbennett9691]

The defense attorney thinks constant irrelevant interruptions are a good distraction tactic. They're not.

[@brookelynnwu8016]

This is so sad, no child should have to beg their own parents for attention. They severely messed this child up, and now he’ll spend his life in prison for their mistakes.

[@Gimpygladiator]

Is it just me or are the captions (which don't start until 1:20) for a WEATHER CHANNEL!? I'm Deaf.... and reading these texts, then reading what's being said ... they can't possibly be discussing the weather in the courtroom! And then they're talking about SPORTS (Lions and 49ers!?)? Baffled. Who the crap is dumping random captions into KZbin videos during a trial!?

[@genomic_]

This is so sad.

[@AnnWurtzbacher]

They should get a mistrial on the basis of the incompetence of her lawyer

[@nadinenc3097]

That was probably the plan from the beginning

[@GrannySmith123]

OMG Shannon is almost as bad a defense attorney as darrell brooks. I wouldn't let her represent me on a jaywalking ticket.

[@bearswithglasses]

But if you don't have $50,000 to spend on a private lawyer, you'd be stuck with one. The problem is the US justice system and we should all be outraged.

[@GrannySmith123]

@@bearswithglasses The problem lies with ourselves and the appalling lack of accountability....

[@lucy0541]

She doesn’t have to worry about that job she hates anymore

[@BooPeek13]

My children are grown with kids of their own and unless I'm sleeping and have somehow missed it, which is rare, I call/text/DM my kids right away. I have been in therapy and I texted my daughter back immediately. That kid was utterly failed by his parents. I'm not justifying what Ethan did, but his parents deserve to be on trial.

[@dandres5681]

So their house is haunted???

[@truthhurts2879]

No, their son is experiencing psychotic hallucinations.

[@HereForTheComments990]

@@truthhurts2879 Yup. And instead of getting psychiatric care, they dismissed it as bad behavior. Terrible parents.

[@Finny_finn_finn]

You would think that lawyers, of all people, would have put the text messages in a specific color for a specific person for continuity...but no...they have to continue to explain with each page that the blue text is Jennifer, James, or Ethan. For fux sake. Let's do your best to confuse the jury

[@chrissyscholl816]

The fact that some people are defending these parents saying "they never could have known what was going to happen... They seem like loving parents..." You're just as sick as them. If this is "loving" then I'm so sorry you have never known what love is. If they cared about their kid even a little bit they would have noticed the signs of mental illness, they would have taken him to get help when he asked for it; when he said he was seeing and hearing demons, they would not have bought their underaged, mentally ill child a gun for Christmas, they wouldn't have ignored the school when they were showing evidence of his mental illness. These parents are almost more responsible than Ethan himself and I don't usually defend the shooters in these scenarios but this case is so heartbreaking and now Ethan has to live with what he did, alone. And the parents of the victims have to live with it as well as their friends with PTSD who had to witness this. It could have and should have been prevented because the warning signs were there!!!!

[@ISEEKSPACE]

I understand the prosecution wanting to pursue charges on these parents just by this alone. Primarily his mother. This is one of those cases where the parents couldve done something to aid their son and possibly prevent a tragedy. I doubt very much had his mother done her due deligience and gotten him help, even if he would've chosen to act regardless, the case for these parents would've never made it to court. These parents need to be held accountable. Maybe then this cautionary tale of neglecting your children will be heard around the world and parents will start to do better. Neglect is the perfect word here. A lesson to those obvious with the public who are viewing this case and who believe these parents are not at fault that negligence is as simple as ignoring a chilling text from your son who is crying out for help and who you choose not to respond to for two whole days.

[@sweetox_9690]

I couldn’t imagine my child behaving this way, speaking this way and ignoring them. I would be jumping through hoops to try and get my child help and these two are off riding their horses and completely ignoring their child’s cries for help. So heartbreaking 💔

[@TheLostTones]

Curious why this is not showing in my livestream. Only cameras in those desks and the judge. Anyone knows?

[@leo_zero1879]

😬😬😬 her attorney does not have her head in the game.. she needs more experience..

[@CluelessClozie]

I thought the exact same thing! … well, until I looked up her resume. She’s been a licensed attorney for 18 years. She represented Larry Nassar, as well. I’m not going to criticize her for representing him (everyone deserves to be defended in court) but I will criticize her for her behavior in court, it’s not like she hasn’t been in a highly publicized trial before - she knows how she should behave in a courtroom full of cameras!

[@divinetiming8422]

Strategy for a mistrial imo

[@barbaradonlin3675]

She's been a lawyer for 16yrs And defended Larry Nasser So she's Not a newbie

[@HereForTheComments990]

Look. Maybe she’s doing this on purpose. Clearly she didn’t get Nassar off. Maybe she throws trials of clients she actually knows are guilty.

[@leo_zero1879]

Yeah , I think she’s trying to get a mistrial. Her saying she couldn’t think straight after a specific video was played and had no questions for the witnesses bc she was so “upset” is enough for her to say she had ineffective counsel… the victims deserve better. . 18years!? Yikes..

[@cald1421]

I can’t believe I almost pity the kid. These parents are atrocious

[@LaidBackLora]

She has some nasty language what a class act lady

[@Genie519]

The defence is bad! Is this her first case?

[@truthhurts2879]

She defended Larry Nassar, the Olympic gymnastics team sexual abuser.

[@jetsetter8945]

No, she defended Larry Nasser.

[@BanFamilyVlogging]

I’m honestly not surprised that her kid is messed up 💔

[@Reish-0-]

News station needs to fix the captions because it’s a Weather segment, and not focusing on the trial 1:51

[@mallori6610]

This kid was crying out for help!!! Not even just some attention.. he literally needed professional help and the parents just ignored him!!! What selfish and horrible people

[@carolinestreeter975]

I bet the defence lawyer was a brat as a child she definitely hasn’t grown out of it! They failed as parents I hope they get long sentences

[@juliadillaman3632]

I know what he did was wrong, but he clearly needed, and asked for help, and his parents didn't care! I have two sons, I always answer ever text and phone call! This boy was scared and asking for help, his parents should have gotten the help he needed! My mother was mentally ill, It isn't their fault that they were born like that, they need medication and counseling!

[@CR-qf1dd]

Your son is seeing things, yet u do nothing. What kind of parents over look this and don't even nurture him

[@sunsensational]

The defense attorney is horrible. She seems completely clueless constantly.

[@logicrealitytruth]

The prosecutor needs to learn how to pronounce, ”picture.” He keeps saying, “pitcher.”

[@ritaagopian4150]

Michigan accent.

[@annemariefurlong5048]

He is a child … his parent bought him a gun for Xmas … his parents are the one at fault here , how can u blame a kid for making the wrong decisions when he had no guidance or proper adult supervision from his own mum & dad .. he was a trouble kid with a lot of issues and problems … and then to give him a gun for Xmas … completely irresponsible parenting …!

[@mentallyillustrate]

exactly

[@GetOfflineGetGood]

These parents remind me of my parents and that is not a compliment

[@sparkysmom7149]

Both parents were FAR TOO SELFISH to have EVER been parents. I cannot imagine your own child having an obvious psychotic break without immediately running to help him. Horseback riding was waaay more important, huh? Its clear their son had been hallucinating for a while.