Jim Ross shoots on if Shawn Michaels was "The Guy" in 1997

For over forty years Jim Ross has been the Voice of Wrestling. From starting as referee in the regional territories to becoming the Executive Vice President for WWE, nobody has a story quite like Jim Ross. From recruiting and hiring some of the biggest superstars in the industry to providing the soundtrack for the most important moments in wrestling history, “Good Ole JR” was there for it all. Join us every Thursday morning as Conrad Thompson grills JR like you’ve never heard before, uncut and uncensored!
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[@ItsTheMunz]

WCW 1-upped WWF with not knowing what to do with Brett when he was literally the hottest commodity in wrestling history after the screw job.

[@chrisnewman2896]

When Bret got to WCW Hogan found away to buried him cause Bret was a bigger star than him

[@King1614]

I would’ve toughed it out in WWF. Everyone knew then what we all know now, and that’s that Hogan will bury anyone to stay on top.

[@Adam-vs2in]

And in pure wcw fashion they found a way to screw that up too. They couldn’t manage a storyline and that’s why vince was able to beat them.

[@shizzygotitphilly]

It should be 1 world champion I always believed that ‼️

[@msr187]

Exactly !!!

[@bradpaton3927]

WWE should've kepThe world championships they bought unified as the WWE Undisputed Championship which didn't even last a year.

[@shizzygotitphilly]

Agreed

[@murdavill1654]

Absolutely

[@murdavill1654]

Too many belts

[@edge803]

Shawn was the man but he didnt wana put anyone over in 1997 and had alot of paranoia and drug problems . I think he was a better heel especially after summerslam 1997.

[@kamfisher1714]

Ok and?

[@shibbyjim]

He wasn't the man, he was second fiddle in 97 to Bret

[@cocainecat2740]

@@shibbyjim Id argue Bret was second fiddle to Shawn he wasn’t main eventing Bad Blood or One Night Only like Shawn was

[@tee85]

@@cocainecat2740 I agree. 1997 was a horrible wrestling year for bret hart as a superstar! The revival of the hart foundation was about as big as it got for him. WWF did him wrong.

[@walterforgern2211]

Exactly HBK was never a good face that's why he couldn't carry the company in the long run

[@tonyjackson4078]

"How to figure out what to do with Bret Hart? It's f***ing embarrassing". If it helps JR, WCW did worse.

[@sese6227]

Oh look....2 accounts, that were just created & have absolutely nothing on their channels, are pushing a pushing a random app. I guess we should all head over, to open accounts ASAP🥴

[@tonyjackson4078]

@@sese6227 I reported them if it helps.

[@zt1053]

Bret hart was only made the top guy because of the steroid scandal

[@bradcsuka5054]

@@zt1053 Which, to JR's point, was f**king embarrassing that it took the steroid scandal to happen.

[@redpandaworldsquad]

Bret with the Hart Foundation at his side working with Stone Cold would have led to a far better Wrestlemania 14 match than HBK vs Austin. To have Stone Cold finally beat Bret for the title would have been better for the company and Austin. It meant less beating Shawn because their rivalry wasn't as strong or intense.

[@dougburr4192]

I don't think Bret and Austin could have topped what they did at WM 13. Stone Cold vs DX (and Mike Tyson!) was a really cool idea and they built it up really well. I think the only problem is how injured and burnt out Shawn was at that time. If HBK had been on top form, then that match could have been one of the greatest matches of all time.

[@cutekanjii]

Yeah it just had the whole "thrown together" feel about it. Just a last minute thrown together feud that didn't really mean anything other than the Austin era was now here but really thete was nobody else. Had Austin not come along at the time the wwf would have become very stake and wcw would still have been on top. The fact that Austin first major, longest & most famous feud was with a non wrestler tells u everything.

[@edge803]

Very true. Bret and Austin had amazing in ring chemistry. The build up.the history. Would have been better

[@theungreatkahli]

Yeah I think so too.

[@jamesgiampietro588]

Please. Only reason that match was sub par (still best of the night) was because of Michael's back.

[@NoOne-fo1di]

I started watching right about the time that Shawn brought Sid in as his body guard and Shawn was my favorite wrestler every since he's been in my top 5

[@kevinmcclintock5492]

I am with ya. I got back into wrestling by the end of September 97. DX was starting to take shape, Hart was champ and stone cold, and even the Rock, were already on the rise(particularly Stone Cold). I stopped watching wrestling originally by early 90's. I would check-in, now and then, to see who was champ and who is on the rise or getting the big "push." HBK was still a Rocker, but always thought he would be good as a solo act. I found out he was champ(in 96) when I was watching ET(Entertainment Tonight) and they did a quick segment on how the WWF World Champion was on the cover of Playgirl. I couldn't believe it.

[@NoOne-fo1di]

@Kevin Mcclintock yeah I'm glad I didn't know all the behind the scenes stuff back then because I would have really hated Shawn lol. They did a house show in my city when I was like 12 and I was sitting and waiting in the backstage area to try and get Shawn's autograph and HHH walked through. Now bear in mind I know only kayfab and HHH is a heel. He looks at me walks up and takes my notebook out of my hand and signs his name and said "there, your biggest hero signed your book" he had a small grin on his lips and was being really nice but I was terrified but I said sheepishly " Shawn Michaels is my hero. He's always been my favorite wrestler and that's who I came to see tonight. Thank you for signing my book, that was really cool" and he kept looking at me and smiled and said "Shawn huh?" And I shook my head he laughed and walked off and 10 minutes later came back with Shawn and I saw HHH first and he pointed at me and then Shawn walked around the corner. After that day HHH was always my 2nd place guy lol

[@WilliamGregg-qf4rp]

I always disliked Shawn. But to be fair I can kind of understand why he was the way he was with the backstage stuff we hear about. I know he was a dick, and he deserves heat for it, but he gets blamed for everything. Lol. That was cool that HHH gave his autograph. That's funny what you said. Lol.

[@awesomereviews1561]

That dude Conrad really dislikes HBK. Shawn lives in his brain rent free…

[@Coqui-Cariduro]

I mean look at him I would too. HBK the nemesis of every incel.

[@rofbagging9749]

@@Coqui-Cariduro Conrad looks and sounds like Marty Jannetty got stung by a bee and never forgot the barbershop window

[@chrisburns8562]

I don't know about that. Everybody hated hbk around that time, even Undertaker and hbk just helped fuck over Bret hart

[@DrHDoofenshmirtzphd]

HBK wasn't a draw. I guess you can be the man without being a draw but that makes you pretty terrible in the role. Luckily, Stone Cold decided to go on one of the greatest runs in wrestling history getting some of the biggest pops ever and started pulling in money.

[@patrickhoisington5111]

Thank you Jim Ross, this two champion idea in WWE(F) is just dumb... it's partly why I don't care anymore.

[@cutekanjii]

I'm surprised there's only 2! Last time I watched I thought there was about 10! It was very confusing, trying to work out who THE champion was. That's their problem today and why nobody is watching as any new potential casual viewer or those who watched at one time if they decide to watch don't have a clue who is the champion as it seems everyone has a belt

[@HhhHhhh-nu4lm]

jim ross says business increased when bret nash for belt kzbin.info/www/bejne/ZqSvn6mmeN6CoK8

[@Adam-vs2in]

Exactly. Two heavyweight belts, two tag team championships, no intercontinental belt. It’s not like it was in the 80s snd 90s.

[@idkmynametho8391]

Shawn Michaels reminds me a lot of Conor McGregor. Both are incredibly egotistical but that’s both part of their charm and part of their criticisms. Both also have a flashy style and have charisma for days. This is why I can’t fully blame Vince for thinking that a prime Shawn Michaels is the guy.

[@sRecollet]

I've thought this as well. Both are my favorite's also. Go figure. So your right.

[@cocainecat2740]

@@sRecollet I LOVE YOUR EDITS AND VIDEOS JUSY SAYING THANK YOU

[@bradpaton3927]

Fuck 'the guy'! That's Vince's problem with booking. He always treats his roster like a solar system with a 🌟 that everybody else revolves around and every time they leave he's fucked because he taught his dumbass "universe" noTo care ~ anybody else. Besides, all that, Shawn Michaels isn't exactly on many Mount Rushmore's.

[@dantecarroll2435]

@@bradpaton3927 it doesn’t matter what you think he’s one of the greatest of all times

[@dantecarroll2435]

Again that was the old Shawn Michaels he’s a different person now

[@Commander76]

I was always a huge Bret Hart fan...I felt he was marketed perfectly in the 80s. Tons of respect. The WWF made it's biggest mistake in letting him walk. They crush WCW a lot sooner with him working with The Rock, Austin, and HHH. Vince just didn't see the value.

[@ssgSentinel]

It’s because Ted Turner offered him $3 mil a year for 3 years and Vince didn’t want to match it. Smh Vince should have had more respect for The Hitman

[@Gregnetic]

@@ssgSentinel Even worse was that Bret was fresh under a new contract with WWE and Vince wanted out of it so Bret went back to WCW's offer.

[@HhhHhhh-nu4lm]

@@ssgSentinel vince also told hogan he did not want to match his wcw offer. he want make room for young stars. bret did not like attitude era was 40 and had knee inury

[@ssgSentinel]

@@HhhHhhh-nu4lm Bret said in his wrestling documentary "Wrestling With Shadows" that WCW offered him $9 million for three years and Vince couldn't match it, and that's why he went.

[@HhhHhhh-nu4lm]

@@ssgSentinel that was just for dramatic effect. he also said in that movie his dad taguht him sharpshooter and he never did steriods

[@garrenluce1984]

I have something that nobody does and that is simply the will to be the best sports Entertainer in the WORLD - HBK

[@maximodiaz8054]

.. because I have something that none of you will never have, and that’s THE WILL to be THE BEST.

[@garrenluce1984]

@@maximodiaz8054 Not hulk hogan!....NOT RANDY SAVAGE !..NOT ANYBODY!....cause in the end OF THE DAY ..I will out WILL ANYBODY

[@My19812011]

Austin was on the rise but wasn’t yet the top star, it was between Shawn and Bret and Shawn was the way Vince kept going so that says to me that Shawn was perceived as the top star in the company because that’s who Vince pushed as such

[@J.P.G.78]

Shawn was protected by Vince.. had he not been.. he wouldn't have been the man, the guys backstage wouldn't have let it happen

[@boblablaw1939]

He wasn’t protected. He was a top 3 wrestler in North American that alone protects you from being fired.

[@J.P.G.78]

@@boblablaw1939 how do you sit and listen to JR basically tell us this time and time again, that Vince saw himself in Michaels, that he was protected.. and still disagree? Do you just comment without even hitting the play button? Legit question

[@boblablaw1939]

@@J.P.G.78 If he wasn’t “protected” he would still be protected. He was the top wrestler in the world.

[@sese6227]

@@boblablaw1939 being one of the top wrestlers in N America, doesn't automatically mean he wasn't protected. You've basically conceded as much, so not quite sure what you're arguing about?

[@Thebestoutthere]

Vince knows who is a star and who isn’t. There’s a reason why hbk’s peers call him the goat.

[@80srocknroller]

The Man! The Myth! The Legend! Mr. WrestleMania! Mr. Hall Of Fame!

[@garrenluce1984]

RESPECT

[@AD-ur1fk]

The headliner, the showstopper, the main event, the icon

[@DirtyDeeds403]

The pill head

[@yes-wo7qn]

@@DirtyDeeds403 the best of all time

[@jaybreacher4430]

@@DirtyDeeds403 your name is john doe you're so corny nigga

[@waynesalisbury]

Shawn Michaels is an excellent wrestler. In my opinion HBK is a light compared to most wrestlers and he still held his own. HBK wrestled Taker, Triple H, Mankind, alot of heavyweight guys and still manage to be WWE Heavy Weight World champion multiple times. as JR would say that's a tuff SOB

[@drvn8]

I've always found Bret to be the best in ring performer by far but I think Shawn is the best promo (even over Flair).

[@DrHDoofenshmirtzphd]

Now that's a bold take. Shawn was great in the ring and on the mic, but best ever on the mic? Over Flair, Macho Man, Austin, Rock... Macho Man's cream rising to the top promo might be the most popular promo in history even among people who don't watch wrestling. That video is all over the internet. You got football players quoting Flair promos before games to get hyped up. Austin 3:16 spawned the best selling piece of merch ever.

[@drvn8]

@@DrHDoofenshmirtzphd I understand, and you may be right. But no one made a wrestling fan want to strangle someone quite like Shawn did. A '97 coked up HBK, just legendary heel work!

[@hotchoclateguy]

Conrad doesn't like HBK, we get it.

[@dantecarroll2435]

Conrad is an oxymoron

[@chrismale9976]

Hbk is the greatest ever

[@jaysco5257]

"OK you got it..." Lol JR a fool 😭😭😭

[@leestens419]

I agree with JR about the world title situation. When they first did the brand split. I'm talking before they reintroduced the world heavyweight title, and the deal was that the wwf champion could appear on both shows, that to me was the best way they've ever approached it..personally I think all of the secondary champions should have been able to compete on both shows

[@richcoggeshall9944]

Nobody could even compare to hbk at this time. Not even close

[@AceAcabras]

My biggest memory of Shawn Michaels title reigns as WWF champion was watching WCW instead

[@douglasjarnagan3835]

If it has to be asked or explained if someone is 'the guy', then that person is not the guy.

[@brandonfranzen5191]

You can tell he talks to JR alot he's starting to sound like him 😂

[@neonmoon4123]

As far as wwf/wwe goes, The top guys/the chosen ones were Hogan then Austin and Rock then Cena. Bret, Shawn, Macho Man, Triple H, Jericho"goat", Piper, Orton etc were all either transitional period top guys or top supporting roles.. Flair obviously was the king outside of wwf.. Then the likes of Andre, Taker that are just in the special attraction type thing no titles needed.

[@robgbaby]

Shawn missed a lot of time in 97. Id say Austin, Taker or Bret before him.

[@markeric3364]

I'd give Shawn January, February, August to Dec. The rest is Bret Hart. Austin was popular but he wasn't THE GUY. Taker had the belt but he wasn't the main focus until Summerslam 97.

[@robgbaby]

@@markeric3364 IMO there wasn't a main focus after Shawn lost his smile. Bret, Taker, Sid and Austin were all getting a lot of shine going into Mania and after. Id agree that Shawn was bringing the most to the table when he was there, but Austin was most definitely the #1 attraction after getting dropped on his head at SummerSlam. They were just building him up for Mania, but Bret coulda put the belt on him on his way out and business would've went up sooner.

[@markeric3364]

@@robgbaby After Shawn lost his smile. I'd put Bret. He was THE GUY. Austin was getting more popular per month but he wasn't the guy, the face of the company. Taker and Sid even though they had the spotlight were always overshadowed. So I still reiterate Bret was the guy from March to Summerslam. After that it had to be Shawn with DX, feud with Taker, attitude then Austin still the hottest guy coming. Austin became the guy in 1998.

[@fmthebaron]

The man of 1997 would be 1. HBK, 2. Undertaker, and 3. Bret Hart. HBK was the man of 97 for 7 months...Jan. Feb. and Aug-Dec he main evented every ppv (even when Bret was Champion, Bret fought mid card against Goldust and The Patriot while HBK main evented against Undertaker). Undertaker was the man for the other 5 months. Bret had a few main events but nowhere near the amount HBK and Undertaker had. Austin was pretty much a mid carder the entire year with only a few main events.

[@fmthebaron]

@@markeric3364 Summerslam made Undertaker the Top Face and HBK had become the Top Heel leaving Bret Hart left out of the Main Event scene after that.

[@miamimouse3167]

JR 🐐

[@lucag.lisickza425]

he was the man, i think

[@412StepUp]

Definitely should be just one champion

[@BBsReality]

The quality sounds better in audio form.

[@zt1053]

Talent alone is not enough in wrestling to be the top guy.

[@countdooku2781]

Elite wrestler 🤘

[@cathaldowdall7467]

Austin and Bret were the guys in 97

[@sese6227]

While the Hitman was definitely all of those things Jr mentioned, he also wanted to be the "the guy", & didn't seem to accept anything less, in WWF at the time. It's doubtful that it had anything to do with him not doing hurricanrannas or performing off the top rope. HBK was a douche, no doubt about it, but he was a talented douche, who was about a decade younger than Hart. Eventually, the torch would be passed, & since he didn't like his predecessor, he wasn't exactly keen on being in the number 2 or 3 spots

[@ssnadera6498]

How was shawn the guy in 97? Wasnt wrestling for half the year, then spent a few months in tag team division, and taker's run as champ sucked, was defending the belt mostly against midcards other than sid and austin till bret beat him.

[@jonsantiago9357]

1 champion is a old school remark and belief. 2 champions is a great idea alot of guys didn't get a chance to be world champion bc there was only one belt.

[@King1614]

It taints the meaning of having 1 title. The best performers and actors only get a shot at the title. You should have just said “everyone gets a participation trophy”

[@echad6259]

No. He was the man.

[@RealFuckingReviews]

Absolutely never was the man... Ever.

[@chrismale9976]

@@RealFuckingReviews possibly the stupidest comment ive ever seen

[@RealFuckingReviews]

@@chrismale9976 when was Shawn Michaels ever the guy you imbecile?

[@chrismale9976]

@@RealFuckingReviews lmao, are you for real I thought you were joking but you really are the stupidest person ever to comment on KZbin!!! 96-98 NOBODY even came close he was THE MAN!!!Shawn was absolutely eclectic in and out of the ring in his prime. He is rated by virtually ALL of the legendary wrestlers as the greatest ever Rick Flair, Sting, Diesel, Razor, Booker T all say he's the MAN. When you're the greatest ever im pretty sure you're the MAN....jeez dude wake up ffs

[@denisesiddon7241]

Can rely on Jr to say how it is

[@SkySoFew]

97?? Dude was the 90s.

[@seankelly4594]

Stop it bret was

[@RealFuckingReviews]

No one cares about shawn michaels.

[@SkySoFew]

@@RealFuckingReviews 😂😂😂🤡🤡🤡

[@RealFuckingReviews]

@@SkySoFew shawn michaels was a phenomenal in ring talent, but so what?

[@RealFuckingReviews]

@@SkySoFew no on cares, or remembers any of that. He was a below average promo, and you couldn't pick him out of a lineup of waiters at a cheesecake factory. Im Sorry to burst your mark bubble, but it's the truth.

[@Jack-Lack]

Shawn Michaels, Stone Cold, and the Undertaker were all in the mix in 1997 as biggest draw. Casting aspersions on his maturity is pointless when he's doing some of the best promos in the company, immature as they may be. Question is: which of these three guys is healthy, working the most ppv's, and selling tickets consistently? In 1997, The Undertaker was in 7 ppv main events, Michaels in 6, Hart in 5, Austin in 4. I don't have stats on who wrestled the most televised matches or the most ppv matches, but I'm inclined to say the biggest draws were 1) Undertaker 2) Stone Cold 3) Michaels 4) Bret Hart. In 1997, Hart was showing that he was capable of getting great heel heat. However, I don't think he was particularly good at emotionally engaging the fans, the way that Hogan, Sting, DDP, Stone Cold, The Rock, and John Cena were able to. When he worked as a babyface, he needed to do more pandering to the gallery, more selling, more big comebacks. Hart often wrestled even Steven matches, rather than falling behind and making epic comebacks.

[@bradcsuka5054]

Couldn't agree more with JR about having two titles. Have always felt that was stupid and lazy.

[@garrenluce1984]

Yall dont even know how much MONEY HBK USED TO BUY CONSTANTLY NEW RING ATTIRE ...Austin's was roughly 1g imagine HBK ring attire ...3G minimum

[@Epsilonsama]

Bret Hart is a better guy to have on top because he is mature and easy to work with, but Vince being Vince saw himself on a immature pill addict.

[@iLLBiLLsRoastBeats]

Vince loves the nose candy so people say. If you go back and watch attitude era shows and know what to look for, you’ll see a bunch of the guys on drugs especially coke

[@LaidBack--]

Bret was stuck in the past and against the direction WWE was going in, hence why he decided to get rid of him. Y'all gotta know more context before y'all just comment anything.

[@yes-wo7qn]

Shawn was better than bret

[@anthonycampos8057]

He was a place holder until Austin was ready.

[@TekkLuthor]

He was the boy TOY

[@nothingfancy4024]

I think that austin promo was more of a diss towards shawn micheals than it was for bret lol!

[@josephsuarez8178]

Ok..Without Bret...You Have Vader. And Phycho SID....Put Vader And Sid Over Simple as That. Bret Should Have Won the Iron Man Match. Bret got screwed on that one too,,.fucking pisses me off

[@crylittlesister6377]

Hell no Shawn was not "The Guy" in 97. He spent the first half of the year coming and going while Bret, Taker and Austin all carried the show without him. If anyone was The Guy that year it was Bret.

[@jakethemuss3]

HBK is my all time favorite wrestler, but let’s be real, he was never in the same stratosphere as Hogan or Austin in terms of drawing money.

[@iLLBiLLsRoastBeats]

Not many people were lol

[@LaidBack--]

Love how you conveniently left out the Rock, and tell us something we don't know...

[@jakethemuss3]

@@LaidBack-- You seem butthurt...

[@LaidBack--]

@@jakethemuss3 people tend to comment dumb stuff like that when they can't respond logically, so no offense taken over here, lmfao.

[@jakethemuss3]

@@LaidBack-- The video was specifically about Shawn Michaels trying to be made as the next Hogan. My comment about his ability to draw was perfectly relevant to the topic. You just got butthurt about me not mentioning the Rock, and it was obvious with your response. You're a tool.

[@Dario_Mazzella1975]

No one ever knew what to do with Brett Hart

[@NovaaktheKING]

Gimme HBK In his Second run over Bret in any era!!!!!

[@silxix2599]

Steve Austin & Bret Hart match in 1997 is one of the most memorable perhaps the best match that year. Bret Hart's character before turning heel was more like a James Dean. He was just cool. Others had to go overboard showing their ass to get attention.

[@Dakatari]

Austin definitely was the man in 97

[@jeffkeys8703]

Not until 98

[@Dakatari]

@@jeffkeys8703 I have disagree with you there

[@acidmack1041]

No not in '97...rising star but not there yet

[@flyyyj]

Not yet

[@richieporter5124]

Bret was one of the best in ring performers however as a Babyface I always found him to be boring. He was much better as a heel in 1997. Kurt I always compare with Bret but I would say he was a better in ring performer and he had charisma in and out of the ring! Shame we never got to see them two square off!

[@dantecarroll2435]

Bret wasn’t boring he was cool Bret was great both heel and babyface but I think he was better as babyface in my opinion Bret had a different type of a charisma he connected with the fans he was one of the most popular wrestlers of all times

[@estefanguerrero2371]

Bret was better in the ring than Kurt. Kurt was more athletic but he lacked Bret’s supreme selling and psychology

[@richieporter5124]

@@estefanguerrero2371 I do think Bret sold better absolutely but overall i would say Kurt is better. If U seen one Bret match U basically seen them all lol

[@estefanguerrero2371]

@@richieporter5124 Bret does get repetitive in 1997. Too much working the leg lol his earlier stuff was better

[@richieporter5124]

@@estefanguerrero2371 😂😂😂 not for nothing but 1997 was imo one of if not the best yr in WWE/F!

[@richardbarlow7337]

Straight answer no bret was the man. Steve austin nearly ready to take the man title.

[@Jim-Tuner]

Shawn Michaels was only "the guy" in January 1997. By main events after that in 1997, he wasn't "the guy". The guy in 1997 (After January) was the Undertaker. He was by far in the most main events of anyone in the WWE in 1997. Nobody else was even close.

[@flyyyj]

Shawn was in a bunch of those main events with him. When you think about 97 HBK stands out. He was even the story as the special referee. All of the biggest things that happened involved him except Austin getting dropped on his head and that was the “B” feud HBK and Bret was the “A” feud.

[@chrismale9976]

No chance. HBK and Bret were far better

[@tokesalotta1521]

JR os wrong about Shawn Michaels being able to be a big draw. He could be a draw for the ladies, or a decent draw as a heel, but he could've never been a huge draw like Hogan, Austin, and The Rock. 1

[@mangamegs]

Wow. it's good to hear j.r's real not under wwe's thumb opinion. His opinion on their 2 world titles has always been my "unspoken" opinion on it as well. I would have preferred a traveling champ ala nwa champ. It's just an opinion. I'm not saying it would be better or worse or impossible from any point.

[@leokeleher5289]

hey Jim watch out for Roman. He wont be liking how you're talking about the tribal chiefs universal title

[@NatrajChaturvedi]

WWE should be ashamed of wasting Owen Heart as well! He was red hot when he came back after a few days after Bret leaving. The fans were dying to see him get pushed as the Hitman replacement and WWE just steadily burried him and gave him such a stupid gimmick which eventually cost him his life!

[@elp3035]

Imo, Bret and Stone Cold ran 97

[@geraldgibson1896]

Taker was the Camp going into SummerSlam. You have to give him his credit also. Stone Cold was an under card going against Owen for the Intercontinental title, that’s not running anything.

[@davidangelo5830]

I always agree with Jr except for the fact that you have to have 2 titles one for each show. The belt not only leads to great champion versus champion matches at say Night of Champions and Survivor Series. But it helps give you the chance to build up other stars and given them rub off the other main eventers for the other main title.

[@RedFive03]

Imo that is why you have an IC or US title. One world champion made a world title change a big deal. Now it is just meh.

[@homedeezyfasheezy5662]

It devalues the world championship to have 2 of them. Champion vs champion matches rarely live up to the hype.

[@leestens419]

I enjoyed Brets work during his career but in every interview I've heard/seen since he retired he sounds ridiculous. He took himself way too seriously and sounds like a crybaby, talking about how he "beat" this guy or that guy so why isn't he getting...blah blah". It's a WORK, Bret

[@Raydensheraj]

Exactly....he just didn't have an personality. He would have done better to remain cool, quite....on the mic he sucked.

[@Bobby.2000]

Nah he f'd it up by being a selfish a hole and there are at least 3 people who's year it was above him. Bret beat Austin at mania, won the title from the undertaker at summer slam and had a good few months of being WWE champion before being screwed in the biggest single moment in WWE history. Taker was in main event after main event. Won the title at mania, beat almost all the top guys in a dominant run, then had and dominated the first ever he'll in a cell before his character brother made one of if not the most impressive and special debuts in wrestling history, to begin one of the greatest fueds ever. Then there's Austin, who although didn't hold the title that year, or even have a particularly impressive ppv record that year. Still won the rumble, stole the show with Bret at mania in the best double turn match/moment just about ever. Had a bunch of main events, including a title shot at taker. Before being very successful with the IC title. As well as capitalising on his injuries to truly build his toughest sob in the WWF stick and overall character/entertaining personality. All while building up the foundations for what was to be his year, in 98. I would say all 3 of them had greater years than Shawn. I don't think he was the guy. He might have thought he was. He may have even felt like he was to others. But he really wasn't the guy.

[@zt1053]

Hulk Hogan is still the best draw wrestling ever had.

[@RedFive03]

Austin is right there though.

[@flyyyj]

Austin and Rock are close

[@zt1053]

@@RedFive03 Steve Austin did have the cross-over appeal Hogan had.

[@thomaswillingham4084]

Come '98. Shawn/Bret who?

[@cutekanjii]

I don't understand why mcmahon seen Michael's as a reminder of himself when younger considering they seem nothing alike whatsoever! 🙄 Vince was all starched perfectly ironed shirts, expensive suits, perfect slicked back old fashioned style hair. He was all business and stiff, everything has to be proper and a certain decorum where as Michael's was all loose, long hair, a completely different style of dress, chewed chewing gum, bad manners & not a business type at all who had a different girl for every day of the week where as vince had a family & went into business with his wife at the age 21 or something. I think it's more of an image of what he wanted to create for himself as he wants others to believe he was like rather than what he REALLY was! I mean a man that's known nothing his whole life but a business that's based in a make believe world that spends most of his time creating manufactured characters & gimmicks is obviously going to inject some of that falseness into his own life, image & character

[@CP-kb1du]

Shawn was Vince's bOY Toy and Pat Paterson's play thing

[@TL2354]

You know this because you were there?

[@samdustinchris]

The biggest guy in the company in 97 was Vader

[@detroitheath288]

WCW didn’t know what to do with Bret either, you really hate to see it.

[@Bretisstillaboss]

Shawn was not a draw compared to Bret in regards to in-house shows.

[@aaronneville1164]

The overall hs attendance numbers say otherwise.

[@ranielalmaria6612]

@@aaronneville1164 not according to Bruce Prichard.

[@aaronneville1164]

@@ranielalmaria6612 I've seen the numbers and overall averages in comparison. Where does Bruce discuss this?

[@Bretisstillaboss]

@@aaronneville1164 I've heard it said more than once house shows went down after Bret left. Ratings were also at the lowest ever. Show me the numbers that say Shawn was a better draw.

[@ranielalmaria6612]

@@aaronneville1164 Bruce said it in one of his podcasts. Now I can't find it. But articles have been released that said Michaels was NOT the draw WWF wanted him to be.

[@walterforgern2211]

The bigest draws in wrestling have been faces, whether it was Bruno, Hogan, Austin, The Rock or Cena. HBK was simply never a good enough face to draw people because the fans need to love the face and Shawn simply wasn't loved he was only a likable face. Bret may have not been loved either but he was loved in Canada and the rest of the world.

[@jaybreacher4430]

Saying shawn wasn't loved as a face is like saying a baby could beat Muhammad Ali in a fight

[@HhhHhhh-nu4lm]

the company was in great shape then. it was not doing as much as golden era but it always profitable .ime for some number crunching, as Dave looks at both WWF and WCW and compares TV ratings and house show attendance numbers for the last 5 years in great detail. There's a lot of numbers and stuff here but I'll try to sum it up easily. When it comes to WCW, they're obviously in the midst of their hottest run ever. But there's a misconception that WCW winning the cable ratings war is some new thing, when in reality, WCW has pretty much always beaten WWF in cable ratings, with the Saturday Night show beating early Raw and Prime Time ratings all the time, but they weren't in prime time. And no one really paid attention until the companies began going head-to-head on Monday nights. The truth is, yes, WCW is winning the war but the alleged "decline of WWF" is overrated. 1996 was WWF's strongest house show year since 1991, even though their TV ratings have hit new lows. But overall, WWF is still doing strong business everywhere else and TV ratings haven't shown to have that much effect on ticket sales. In fact, WWF's house show business grew at a faster rate than WCW's did last year and with increased ticket prices, their house show business became even more profitable. There's a perception from people who believe the Monday night ratings are the entire business and believe WWF is in trouble because they're losing the ratings war, but overall, they're still pretty strong (I find stuff like this interesting, because the revisionist version of history is that WCW damn near put WWF out of business until Vince heroically fought back and conquered his enemy. Reality is, they were never even remotely in danger of it and aside from TV ratings, they were doing their best business in years on every other front. Sure, they were a distant second in TV ratings but in all other aspects of the business, WCW was only barely winning).

[@donaldsalkovick396]

Shawn is twice the man either of these dufusses will ever be

[@jellydamgood]

Of course, He was a way bigger prick than these two combined. Not many people in the world can ever be a bigger prick than 90s hbk.

[@KB-hh8rt]

Shawn was a fantastic in ring worker but he was never professional or mature. He didn't want to drop the belt or put anyone else over. Bret was the man who always put wrestling first and made others look like rock stars in the ring, plus he had that international draw also. The fact that Vince chose Shawn over Bret is still head scratching to me since Bret is the one that convinced Vince to sign Austin and Bret is the one that worked with Austin to get him over and was wanting to pass the torch to him. Shawn only cared about himself, was a pill popper, a prima donna and then he 'lost his smile' because he didn't want to return the favor and drop the belt to Bret at WM13. Shawn also sabotaged Vader's WWF career which was totally unprofessional. Why would you want to have Shawn as the world champion when he's acting that way? You had Bret, The Undertaker & Austin as better choices. It's not like Shawn was a Hulk Hogan and was selling out arenas. I just don't understand the favoritism Shawn received from Vince when Bret and the Hart family were loyal to the WWF for all those years.

[@kamfisher1714]

Shawn put people over 1991-1995. It was his time.

[@user-sp4sp2qd6p]

Bret also stopped The Rock from being buried by HHH n Shawn.

[@KB-hh8rt]

@@kamfisher1714 Shawn never liked putting anyone over and never straight up lost the belt to someone. He didn't make any stars or tried to help anyone. In fact he was one of the guys that sabotaged other wrestlers.

[@kamfisher1714]

@@KB-hh8rt Who did bret ever make?

[@KB-hh8rt]

@@kamfisher1714 Lot's of people. He made 1-2-3 Kid look like a rockstar on RAW. He even made Diesel look good in the ring. He got his brother Owen over that lead to the historic match they had at WM X. He helped The Rock not get buried by Shawn and HHH but the most notorious is Bret convincing Vince to sign Austin from ECW and specifically working with Austin to get him over and he did. He specifically chose Austin to feud with to build him up and they did the double turn at WM 13. That was all Bret's idea.

[@ssgSentinel]

Shawn Michaels was the guy because they didn’t have much of a choice - most of the Veteran’s left for WCW so 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@dantecarroll2435]

And he was the best don’t be a hater because eventually true talent always rises to the top

[@ssgSentinel]

@@dantecarroll2435 Definitely not hating on Shawn Michaels. He proved that he had a lot of talent when he lasted an hour against Bret Hart in the Iron Man match for the WWF championship at Wrestlemania 12. I am saying that they had no choice because all the top guys left, and he was the most capable to really give opponents a tough challenge. It forced Vince’s hand, so to speak.

[@TL2354]

Sooooo? Finish your sentence

[@ssgSentinel]

@@TL2354 so they had to make Shawn Michaels the guy. Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, and The Undertaker were pretty much what they had to work with in '97 with main events, and with Stone Cold really getting popular, his feud with Michaels helped to make HBK enough of a main event guy to make it work.

[@Gardenhoser86]

Stop JR, Vince didn’t see anything in Shawn except himself literally inside Michaels, lol sorry

[@zt1053]

Shawn Michaels as the champion was the reason wcw started to win in the ratings

[@chrismale9976]

No lol, wcw taking all WWF stars took the ratings for a while. Then the attitude era with DX Bret and Austin got it back

[@zt1053]

@@chrismale9976 Bret was gone by the time WWF started winning the ratings again.

[@souryabanik]

Bret hart was the guy really!

[@theALmighty66]

That opening second was funnydisgusting.

[@joemcshane3878]

HBK was fantastic, but......slightly overrated.

[@chrisgavin2794]

Shawn Michaels is a better wrestler than Bret in the sense that he will do a moonsault, Bret will not. That’s it. Bret tops Shawn or is equal in ever other category.

[@Thebestoutthere]

Bret is the better technical wrestler but Hbk’s better overall. Mic skills, charisma, personality, you name it. Hbk had “it”.

[@titanhades4331]

A lot of people forget that Bret is fully capable of doing those flashy moves. Problem is that they make no sense in terms of telling a story in the ring. Plus it gives that holy shit moment when ye breaks one out. Shawn overdoes them so makes them less impressive, which is why the wrestling business is dying now.

[@chrisgavin2794]

@@titanhades4331 best had said in the past that he can do them too. He just doesn’t because it gets you hurt more often. When you wrestle many times a week it’s bad business to be hurt. You also have a longer career assuming a bald muscle head doofus doesn’t kick you in the head

[@titanhades4331]

@@chrisgavin2794 Yep. Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

[@shibbyjim]

He definitely wasn't... He was always the guy who worked with the guy

[@cjrich7720]

You heard that said about HHH & thought it sounded cute. Wholly inaccurate in regards to this conversation

[@ronnycrypto8986]

Hilariously inaccurate. Shawn was 'the guy who worked with the guy' maybe in '95 before his push. He was the man in 1996 and 1997.

[@shibbyjim]

@@ronnycrypto8986 You could call him the guy in 96 only because Bret took time off... Shawn then failed badly in that role... When Bret came back he was then the man again which caused Shawn's infamous lost smile meltdown

[@ronnycrypto8986]

@@shibbyjim Oh yes - Bret was so 'the man' in 1997 that McMahon pushed him to go to WCW even while he was WWF champion. HBK ran the WWF from the time he became champion in early 1996 until the Steve Austin era started.

[@shibbyjim]

@@ronnycrypto8986 HBK just didn't put butts in the seats it is why they tried to take the belt off him quickly. Bret was making more then double HBK at the time too. HBK is just the same as all his clique buddies...the guys that work with the guy, just HHH was lucky enough to marry into the family

[@dman50amm]

HBK HBK HBK

[@brianwestmoreland3836]

A very pointless snippet

[@lostNxbox29]

Michaels was never the man, he was overrated his whole career. His title reign in 96 was absolutely boring he didn't have any feuds just a revolving door of people to job to him. When Michaels wanted to quit in June of 97 they should have let him walk and let WCW misuse and keep Bret.

[@RealFuckingReviews]

There wasn't a guy in 97 until after wrestlemania 13. Shawn was about as much of the man as kevin owens or jinder mahal were.

[@zt1053]

Do you mean stone cold?

[@RealFuckingReviews]

@@zt1053 obviously, who else would i Mean?