Join the Euro, Rejoin the EU

In this new video, Brendan Donnelly and John Stevens argue that membership of the euro will be necessary to sustain the UK’s re-entry into the European Union after Brexit. They recognise that political leadership will be necessary for such a radical step to come about. But they also argue that British public opinion would be more receptive to leadership on the issue of the single currency than is often assumed.
SPEAKERS
Brendan Donnelly is the Director of the Federal Trust and a former Conservative MEP.
John Stevens is the Chairman of the Federal Trust and a former Conservative MEP.
ABOUT THE FEDERAL TRUST
The Federal Trust is a research institute studying regional, national, European and global levels of government. It has always had a particular interest in the European Union and Britain’s place in it. The Federal Trust has no allegiance to any political party. It is registered as a charity for the purposes of education and research.
Website: fedtrust.co.uk/
Twitter: / fedtrust
Donate: www.paypal.com...
Support our work:
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#rejoineu #brexit #euro

[@johnkochen7264]

The problem lies to a degree within the English psyche. They can be living in Spain or France but will consider the Spanish and French people as being foreigners. They are Brits living among foreigners. Never would they think of themselves as the foreigners.

[@jonross545]

We do live in South West France and the idea of us being foreign does not leave us for long.We feel privileged to be accepted into the community and respect the rules and regs that go with it. I would like to see the UK rejoining the Club then at least our,and everyone’s Sons and Daughters can move,study,work,live and benefit to a for superior way of life without barriers. Best wishes from a Brit/Yorkshire immigrant doing very nicely thanks living in Charente Maritime.👍🇫🇷🍷🇪🇺🥳

[@johnkochen7264]

@@jonross545 There was a game show on telly here decades ago that was shot in Fort Boyard. Meilleur voeux from Limburg.

[@jonross545]

@@johnkochen7264 Fort Boyard is clearly visible from the coast stretching from Isle d’Olerone to La Rochelle and is still shown on French TV channels. Hope you enjoyed the series.👍

[@sidneypedroso3415]

True

[@normanchristie4524]

Basically they are 'AlfGarnett'. Still one or two queuing in our sub-post office to receive their Old Age pension in cash, I can't imagine how they think the money got there!

[@samhartford8388]

Thank you for giving the correct answer to the question. Greetings from the EU.

[@Martini923]

Big question is will the EU want you back? Don’t think so, took four years negotiating between UK and EU for UK to leave, secondly the UK has done nothing but blame the EU for everything, example migration crisis, economic crisis, cross border crisis, had to put up with Boris Johnson, Nigel Farage and fellow so called MEP when they were in Brussels etc, going on about how the UK wanted their sovereignty back etc, well you got your sovereignty back, and you left, remember each country in the EU have a veto about who can join, there no support or mention in the EU that they want UK back, they EU have moved on sadly the UK haven’t, old saying you made your bed lie on it

[@andersrefstad8235]

I think the Brits scewed they'r "Commonwealth" on this one ! ROFL ... :-) ... But i think we should lend a eare to them in some 30 years... (Maybe just 20 years, if i,m in a good mode that morning...). They'r economy then ..? Something EU Would want to tutch ? My advice is NO

[@ig1henryr]

As an european, i don't think it will end with veto from EU members. We are still allies, and used to be the same family. But remember that thrust fall faster than it grown. Uk probably (certainly) won't have sames "exceptions to the rules" if they want to join back.

[@andersrefstad8235]

@@ig1henryr If they come craweling back, I think they should crawel back to theyr iseland, And stay there !

[@Pierluigi_Di_Lorenzo]

@ig1henryr One country vetoing it will be sufficient. And unless there is a non-partisan, stable and large majority among the English public to rejoin, there will be more than one veto.

[@Martini923]

@@Pierluigi_Di_Lorenzo What can EU members veto? Each existing EU Member State has a veto over any new country joining, as well as a veto over the pace of negotiations and the terms on which it joins. Any Member State can leave the EU.

[@GV-xx7vh]

THE POUND HAS TANKED SINCE BREXIT.

[@pragma5282]

Rejoin?? Not until the Britons get to understand what the EU is. The EU is not an economic block but a joint european space for citizen's protection, democratic values and aspirations. We're family, not just selfish partners. And of course, Britain should show commitment to the cause by giving up the Pound for good. That would convince EU nations that Britain is for real, and would strength the Euro, and Britain for sure, since London could resume being the financial center of the EU, and the BoE would have a seat in the European Central Bank. It's just pragmatic. But unfortunatelly, British seem to be more hotheaded and stubborn than most with this things. Like never giving up the imperial measures, despite the fact that are so random and complicated, or driving on the left side of the road, even if it means paying 24% more, for the same car model, because its limited production.

[@johnstevens1022]

Correct.

[@terryfinnie2146]

Do you think ireland, holland won't veto that scenario.?.

[@johnstevens1022]

I think it would not be in their interests to do so as the strategic advantages of having such a financial centre with such world-wide reach are enormous, for the long-term global reserve status of the euro in particular: an absolutely fundamental issue for Europe's longer term unified power and prosperity. However, London will not be, what it could have become, had the UK joined the euro whilst it was still a member state and then not Brexited (joining the euro would have made Brexit impossible anyway imv) the completely dominant centre it could have been in those circumstances. The future of financial services is one of dis-aggregation now in terms of locations, for a whole range of reasons, the advances in communications networks the changing nature of high-growth assets, quality of life, accelerating hyper-specialisation in services delivery etc. If you look at the US apart from NY there are futures and options in Chicago, venture capital in Boston and San Francisco and hedge funds moving to Miami, and Dallas. The UK (or England and Scotland) back in the EU and using the euro would not now threaten Amsterdam building on its newly acquired strengths in equities or Dublin's in back-office services (tax is another issue). And Paris' will surely have more hedge funds and family offices and Frankfurt derivatives and bond trading. The longer the UK remains outside the EU the more challenging things will be for London, certainly, and in the very long run a Venetian destiny would beckon, but it will remain a large potential asset to European global power for many years yet.

[@imastaycool]

​@@terryfinnie2146Ireland just wants its occupied counties back... then after that Britain can sink.

[@bereal6590]

Other nations have kept their currency

[@SKgeostrat]

A very pragmatic, realistic approach by John Stevens. Those who think that the US is inherently stronger economically than the EU need to considerr that the EU has absorbed a number of eastern europeran countries that started with a very low GDP per capita. However, in doing so, it has permitted those countries to increase their performance dramatically, look at Poland for instance, and the future of Europe is clearly much morer promising than that of the US, which has not solved its most dramatic problem, that of relations between the latino, african-american and the white population. Anyone who has lived in the US can see that the US has a very, very difficult future until social peace is achieved and would, I think, prefer to live and work in the EU. Britain might be permitted to rejoin, but surely only by joining the common currency, without which they might again leave.

[@MENSA.lady2]

The UK joining the Euro. No way.

[@georgesdelatour]

How do the Nahel Merzouk riots and resulting carbecues in France fit into this picture? How about the 100 grenade attacks in Sweden this year?

[@gs9140]

@@georgesdelatour what des these have to do with the EU project???

[@arthurdixon5890]

I believe our politicians expected closer relations with the USA after BREXIT. This has not occurred, quite the opposite. This illustrates how out of touch the politicians are. We are now an isolated nation. I believe we are basically a European nation, our hope is to embrace our fellow Europeans, they are much more akin to us than we would like to accept.

[@malthusXIII-fo3ep]

They loved asset-stripping the UK.

[@jeffsmith3392]

We don't want closer ties to Biden.

[@arthurdixon5890]

@@jeffsmith3392 It’s their economy we need to have ties with. Trump will be at the helm soon enough…

[@jeckjeck3119]

@@arthurdixon5890 Hopefully not, a traitor like trump is never a good thing.

[@michaelsteane9926]

An isolated nation? It's just a dinghy trip from France.

[@AllenOoflynn]

Two CEO's : "we've seen no benefit from BREXIT , it's been nothing but a pain in the backside" , no surprise Boris Johnson said "f - - K business" .

[@Volcano-Man]

When and where did BJ say 'Fuck business!' Because I am unable to locate any reference!

[@Harlock2day]

As an Italian living in Rome the picture for me is clear. Britain is a Monarchy and the Royal Family doesn't want to , one day, relinquish it's power. And being a Monarchy it is a classist society where the rich upperclass benefitted from Brexit whilst the masses were lied to and lost both financially and their human rights. To rejoin will not be easy at all.

[@jeffsmith3392]

The EU is 'Corporatism' replacing 'Democracy'. If my government in London does something I don't like, I can vote them out. You can't in the EU. UK will stay out forever. If you're hearing anything else it's just pro-europeans making a bit of noise.

[@johnstevens1022]

Dificile mă possibile e per una Europa forte indispensabile.

[@jeckjeck3119]

@@jeffsmith3392 LOL, lies like that might have worked in Brexit times, but not now.

[@georgesdelatour]

1) The UK is a constitutional monarchy. Six EU countries are also constitutional monarchies. Iceland, Norway and Switzerland have all chosen not to join the EEC/EU; one’s a monarchy, the other two republics. 2) The UK monarchy relinquished all its political power in 1689. 3) Every society is a “classist” society to some extent. How unequal it is has nothing to do with whether it has a monarchy. Norway and Denmark are monarchies with relatively low inequality. The UK is more unequal, but not as unequal as the republican USA. 4) The three biggest funders of the Remain campaign in 2016 were Goldman Sachs, J.P. Morgan and Morgan Stanley.

[@bryangeake5826]

@@jeffsmith3392'Corporatism' replacing 'Democracy'? What is the EU Parliament then? In the EU MEPs can and do vote down unpopular legislation/directives, but the point is this, it is not a corporation, it is an alliance and not a federal state either. So, the way it operates is by consensus politics, not corporatism!

[@ulfosterberg9116]

It is comical seeing the English, brexiteers or remainers alike, discussing joining EU or the EURO like they can chose to this or that. It is like listening to Canadians discussing the move of New York and Washington to Ottawa. This total lack of understanding of realities is amazingly comical.

[@michaelrowsell1160]

Not true .Many leaders are for much closer ties ,especially with the USA being an unreliable allies.

[@ianworley8169]

Id take the euro in a heartbeat. When the Euro came into effect, it was worth £1 to €1.70. Now the pound has plummeted in value, it hovers around €1.10-€1.15. Sterling is fast becoming a joke currency, as the UK economy goes South since Brexit.

[@Volcano-Man]

Are you sure? The EU is blaming it's own economic problems on - wait for it! Germany is according to its own records heading fast towards a major recession, and other countries are on the same slippery slope. The ECB has even stated the euro is overvalued meaning it will face major problems.

[@hauskalainen]

The pound sterling has gone down the drain. When i moved to Finland i got 1.64 € for every £ sterling. Last i looked it was 1.12€ If you have been holding pounds in your bank account you have been losing out big time. The pound in 1940 was worth US$ 4.03. Today it has shrink to $1.25. Pounds are the last thing you should be clinging to.

[@uweinhamburg]

I remember a time when for everything economical or political it was a good rule of thumbs that a US$ was about 4.2 Deutschmark (2.1€) and a GBP was around 14 Deutschmark (7€) - just shows where the development has gone! And who thinks this development has endet? One strange side note - when i started to work in trading departments here in Germany, each typewriter of telex machine did have a GBP symbol in the upper row of the keyboard - i haven't seen any for a very, very long time now! Out means out! And the UK is so out, most Brits don't even dare to imagine it...

[@Joanna-il2ur]

Stay there then. If you’d like Putin as your neighbour, enjoy.

[@Joanna-il2ur]

@RedHeadNINTY9T9 I remember Reagan being cock a hoop when the pound slumped to a dollar and two cents, looking forward to the dollar becoming bigger than the pound. Until, as you rightly point out, the dollar had become too big, sucking in imports and harming exports. Most politicians are pretty stupid.

[@Joanna-il2ur]

@RedHeadNINTY9T9 when I was a girl, pre decimal, it was $2.40 to the pound, which had 240d to the pound, so a cent and an old penny were the same.

[@Joanna-il2ur]

@RedHeadNINTY9T9 I was a student in France for a year in 74/5 and my landlord, an older man, spoke in old francs, so he would say something cost 200 francs when it cost 2 francs. His wife despaired of him. I think they deleted two zeroes in 1961, so it wasn’t recent.

[@russmarkham2197]

The UK should have joined the Euro when it was first launched. The UK would be so much better off now if it was in the Euro and the EU.

[@jasonkingshott2971]

Better off? you mean the UK would have got to a recession before the Germans and most of the Euro zone?....you are a fantasist.

[@dirkdupont5004]

@@jasonkingshott2971 Most of the Eurozone? No. And the recession in Germany, is this the best you have? Yes, Germany is having a hard time mainly because of the war in Ukraine. The country was overly dependent on Russian fossil fuels and due to its proximity to Russia and Ukraine the economic impact is much greater than for UK. Funny how the war in Ukraine was the reason for all the UK's problems (and never Brexit), but now it's not mentioned anywhere as a reason for Germany's problems. Isn't this hypocritical? If you also take into account the rise in debt, which can be seen as borrowed economy (or GDP), you will see that the UK is actually worse off with its rise in debt compared to Germany. Drawing conclusions based on the GDP alone is for economic ignoramuses

[@jasonkingshott2971]

@@dirkdupont5004 I don't give a toss if Merkel has been funding her pal Putin's genocide, Germany is in recession! From the Pro EU Guardian - Eurozone sinks into recession as cost of living crisis takes toll - GDP shrank 0.1% in first quarter of 2023 and final three months of 2022 after revisions to earlier estimates

[@treyquattro]

if the UK fell out of the top 3 economies within the EU then it would have faced, sooner or later, the same fate that befell Greece. Maintaining its own currency is an absolute must for the UK. The really idiotic thing is that the UK was the first among equals in the EU in this regard and the idiotic Leavers completely shot themselves and the rest of the country in both feet over it.

[@dirkdupont5004]

​@@jasonkingshott2971 Compared to 2019, the Eurozone's GDP grew faster than the United Kingdom. UK has been just above the zero line since 2019. Now the eurozone is going below that zero-line. What do you think is more important? Slower growth in Britain since 2019 (2019 to even out the differences from the pandemic) or the eurozone going below that zero line because of a war right on their doorstep? Do you really think the baseline is that important? Certainly there was growth in UK compared to immediately after the pandemic, but UK had the second biggest decline, after Japan, during the pandemic. That's why your deceitful government is taking the immediate post-pandemic period as a reference and avoiding comparison with 2019. And UK has plenty of fools to fall for. In short: the zero-line is not that important. What is more important are the long term parameters like the investments (down in the UK since 2016), the increase in debt, its export. Short term GDP is an instrument for politicians to be used when it suits them to deceive their local idiots. BTW: care to explain why the inflation in the UK is still bigger than in the Eurozone ?

[@anthonyquinn5058]

I dont think you'll get 27 sovereign states to agree to let you back in

[@michaelsteane9926]

And not even the 27 puppet states that make up the EU.

[@fintonmainz7845]

It just takes one state to veto.

[@michaelsteane9926]

And that state will be the UK.@@fintonmainz7845

[@MOSSFEEN]

Ye got what ye voted for now LIVE WITH IT

[@johnwhitcher4761]

It seem UK is doing better than Germany & france apparently 0NS got the figures wrong & we lost billions of investments that went to Germany & france bet the investors are gutted.

[@bertoverweel6588]

Why would you want to rejoin the EU, you have now £350mln a week for the NHS?

[@davidweatherhead1431]

Instead of £billions to a vile political organisation, Agree

[@bertoverweel6588]

To bad the NHS hasn't got a penny.

[@davidweatherhead1431]

@@bertoverweel6588 really they operated on my leg last week. The ward was full of patients. And it was freev👌just love the NHS 👍 by the way was watching a small island in Italy being invaded by illegals on my private TV but not doubt the clowns in Brussels will sort it 😂

[@bertoverweel6588]

@@davidweatherhead1431 I am not talking about your operation but about the lies of the politicians for getting Brexit done, the UK economy is a disaster, farmers, small businesses., fisherman etc. are going bankrupt becouse Brexit is such a succes.

[@davidweatherhead1431]

@@bertoverweel6588 becouse? And your next reply will be to tell me that the 27 are thriving? And the power house of Europe ( Germany) isn't in recession. But if you believe bullshit and it makes you happy then that's your choice 👋👋

[@VirtualLusamine]

yes as a EU citizen i can say with certainty joining without entering the eurozone would be almost impossible these days, although we seem to give no timeline to join so you could probably take a while to without much fuss. But i would find it beneficial as the euro will always have more demand than the pound as we are way economically significant. Even if it hurts the british publics pride it would be very beneficial

[@wengelder9256]

Sweden doing it without any issue . First of all , even when the UK would become a member , they need to fulfill certain criteria . With any Treaty of Accession ( to the EU ) comes a binding adoption of the euro , but not immediately. First , the country , using their original currency must become member of the European Exchange Rate Mechanism II. Then it must works towards fulfilling the convergence criteria as detailed in the Treaty of Maastricht ( inflation , debt ratio to GDP , government deficit ). Only then a member can adopt the euro. Sweden always refused to be member if ERM II . Hence they don’t adopt the euro . And the eu doesn’t make too much problems about it . Sweden always argued there is no legal basis that forces a new member to be part of ERM II. The Uk could do the same …and probably will if they even become member . I think the UK better stays out

[@MrsGardiner]

@@wengelder9256 When Sweden joined, the joining criteria were different! Now you are expected to join the Euro, when your economy is sufficiently adjusted. So Sweden does not have to, having joined in 1995 and Hungary is not yet allowed to join, to avoid another Greece debacle It Britain wants to join, it is expected to also work towards joining the Euro.

[@wengelder9256]

@@MrsGardiner you are wrong . Maastricht treaty was 1992 That treaty had the euro adoption criteria . 1995 is the year Sweden joined . Sweden does not fulfill criteria , but do so deliberately . EU does not enforce it and tacitly allows countries not to implement the euro , whether they “play” with the convergence criteria ( Copenhagen criteria and exchange rate stability criteria) or not . But to be clear , Sweden joined AFTER the Maastricht treaty . It’s just that the EU does not want to force countries to do something against their will. The Swedish economy is strong enough to fulfill the conditions . They just don’t want to join the euro

[@johnjeanb]

Thank you for this great video. I totally agree: If the UK wants to join the EU, it will have to adopt the Euro: no waiver of any kind, no rebate, remember? As you said, it will also be a good test on how serious the UK is in embrassing the EU values (ever closer union, cooperation & mutual help). To some extent, the Euro has a negative image in the UK the very same way as the EU used to have. The benefits are very real but seldom praised by local politicians. Indeed also it is a multiplying factor for exchanges and trade (not only no borders, no constrains on any movements (FoM) but also a ZERO exchange rate and a serious financial policy that stops any competitive devaluations. Additionally a blocker on financial tricks at borders: roaming charges, bank extra charges, etc

[@public.public]

I would prefer the euro. It buys more food than the pound.

[@henkduym9430]

It's not rejoin, it is join the eu

[@samhartford8677]

Yeps, rejoin sounds a bit too like the old deal was available.

[@georgesdelatour]

It's not pendant, it's pedant.

[@samhartford8677]

@@georgesdelatour And politically (which is all that this thing depends on) it is a huge difference.

[@1stringendo]

Excellent commentary well done …… this was asking the only real question phased by Brexit.

[@AChapstickOrange]

Me personally, I would never let the UK join until it had _first_ adopted the euro (by special permission of the EU) and Schengen. Only _then_ would I admit the UK to full membership. I think the EU should be assured, this time, that Britain means it and is actually committed the EU as something more than a goose laying golden eggs into its piggy bank. That was never what the EU was but always how the British have seen it. The British need to understand that, quite frankly, if they come at membership with some lukewarm, whiny aspect and the attitude that they'll demand not to have to have this and to get out of that, there's going to be at least one, if not several, members who say "Uh uh. Stay out."

[@michaelgoss9606]

Thank you, as always a good debate during these difficult times for pro Europeans .

[@Lucid.dreamer]

Yes. A mass debate.

[@margaretbloomer9001]

I have no emotional attachment to the pound. Money has changed beyond recognition in my lifetime anyway. Any stable currency will do: money is money. Rejoining the EU is crucial for the future prosperity, peace and security of this country. The British Isles are part of Europe. Look at a map.

[@Lucid.dreamer]

Twaddle.

[@klaudio29751]

Not part of Europe ....NEVER was NEVER will be..

[@andersrefstad8235]

WHY ON EARTH Would we EU/EØS let you in again ..? ... I think you have destroyed your economy by then. (I hope some 20 - 30 years from now). Enjoy your Brexit !

[@Lucid.dreamer]

@@andersrefstad8235 Don't be alarmed. They're only remoaners. Nobody takes them seriously. And most of them are not even UK residents, let alone voters. We're never going to get dragged into the the EU quagmire again. Anti brexiters have not one good reason for UK getting entangled in the awful EU. You have nothing to be concerned over.

[@imastaycool]

Britain and even the UK as a whole is disunited politically, socially, culturally and linguistically. The poor political choices and decisions of Brexit have made the lack of unity ever clearer for the entire world to see. It's not just disunited, it's also completely imbalanced. Politically, it has devolved governments, but most of the power lies in Tory Westminster which has the UK at political loggerheads. These devolved governments squabble and fight amongst each other which details the disunity. Brexit was divisive and it shows how disunited the UK is with the occupied region called "Northern Ireland" and the country of Scotland voting No to Brexit. The UK is literally split down the middle in the Brexit debacle which makes it politically disunited. Furthermore, the UK isn't a voluntary union because Scotland is actively being denied another independence referendum post Brexit - this, again, makes it a disunited partnership + an imbalanced and undemocratic one. Welsh and Scottish independence is growing while talks of Irish reunification are on everyone's lips - this, again, demonstrates a disunited and imbalanced union. Socially, culturally and linguistically it is also divided and disunited as the different parts have their own culture and language. Brexit itself limits multiculturalism and encourages exclusive nationalism and nativism which in effect breeds racism and xenophobia (the very core of Brexit and Brexiteers). Great Britain was never united, but instead it's DISUNITED and IMBALANCED as well as UNDEMOCRATIC and UNJUST. And it's actively breaking up which is the ultimate win 😅

[@noelfleming3567]

Well said ❤

[@windowman929]

Britain jumping from the European union to the CPTPP and back again, is a very bad look on the world stage.

[@johnstevens1022]

Britain persisting with the pretence it is a Pacific not a European nation on the strength of Pitcairn Island is an even worse look imv

[@davidmcintyre8145]

Scotland is a European country England never has been

[@Purple_flower09]

Hard agree! And I don't think the English will want to join the EU.

[@johnwhitcher4761]

By all means have Scotland in the EU. Its been a burden for England for years it will be a burdon for EU as well.

[@loneprimate]

Sure it is! England is simply a bunch of transplanted Germans, after all. :)

[@Lucid.dreamer]

@@Purple_flower09 we don't. And Scotland can't. It cannot.

[@AllenOoflynn]

Remoaner , someone who voted to stay in the EU and moans that we left , Bremoaner , someone who voted to leave the EU and is still moaning .

[@johnstevens1022]

Would that therefore make you a Monad?

[@hardouindelagrandiere8446]

The UK (more precisely England) was undermining EU effort in any fields since it joined, constantly wanting the benefits of it without it's inconvinients. Frankly speaking, it never worked better than when you left. I love so much earing "we might need to join the UE in the futur" from brit's politics, as if they had a say in it now. Sad, but you choose to go your way, started digging your grave, and when finaly shoulders deep in it, you are starting to doubt the process. Play stupid games, win stupid prises. I really hope for Wales, Northern Ireland and especially Scottland to not suffer the consequences of England's pride, for they are not to be held responsible for it. And to all UK's citizens that were pro stay, your job is not done, the country has only you to held it up. Please stay strong.

[@Harryset1]

Sir, you can not re-join. You can apply for a "brand new" membership. Please inform yourself about the "The Copenhagen criteria" -- the rules that define whether a country is eligible to join the European Union. The criteria require that a state has the institutions to preserve democratic governance and human rights, has a functioning market economy, and accepts the obligations and intent of the European Union. And there is NO new membership possible - without adopting the €!

[@johnwhitcher4761]

"Phew" for a moment l though you might allow us to rejoin Relief you won't 😅😅😅

[@Harryset1]

@@johnwhitcher4761 Sooner or later you will join EUrope again - and you are very welcome! It's a very hot evening over here - have a nice evening too --- cheers............

[@loneprimate]

@@johnwhitcher4761 Buddy, I'm Canadian. Ethnically British on both sides. I've been watching the slow motion car crash that is Brexit from across the Pond here and let me tell you this... from this equidistant standpoint, it's not the EU that's in trouble. The UK has been becoming less safe, less free, less wealthy, less fair, and less admired with a breathtaking rapidity. I'm constantly reminded of a 1960s US space mission, Gemini 8. They were attached to an Agena docking target and they started an uncontrolled spin. They blamed the Agena, undocked, and started spinning wildly out of control. Only then did they discover the fault wasn't the thing they'd been attached to... it was their own capsule. They got out of it because Neil Armstrong was the pilot. But I haven't seen you guys elect a Neil Armstrong. You seem to prefer the guys who land Russian moon probes running your country. Good luck with the soft landing, there.

[@Tay12345]

The only way we can join Euro is if we have some very nice banknote designs

[@kallebengtzon5240]

As an eu citizen i would welcome scotland in a heartbeat, England not so much due to the problems they have caused for us so far.

[@uweinhamburg]

As a EU citizen, i would welcome Scotland with open arms, as long as they meet all the conditions we do have for any applicant! And - let's be honest, that will 100% depend on their divorce settlement with the rest-UK.

[@Joanna-il2ur]

Ok. Scotland has the worst drug problem in Europe, the worst alcoholic problem, a government £1.9 billion in debt, an education system that had plummeted down the PISA table so fast that it left it. Its government is in free fall and can’t account for millions. The recent leader is in danger of being charged for theft, and her ‘husband’ was the party secretary covering it up. Then there’s the ferry crisis, where they overspent many millions of pounds in bribes and still have nothing to show for it. You are not allowed to join the EU anyway if you have a budget deficit of more than 5%. Scotland is 28% in debt. So if you want drugged up, drugged, ignorant and corrupt Scotland, please break all you laws and take them with the blessing of the UK.

[@kallebengtzon5240]

@@Joanna-il2ur those are minor problems and problems we in the eu could help with. England on the other hand have tried to destroy eu with their lies and propaganda both from politicians on all levels and the right leaning media. This has been ongoing for decades and the lies has severe negative effects. It seems as they have used eu as a scapegoat for their own shortcommings.

[@mrstevecox7]

Britain is European. The Euro is better than the pound. We should not pander to half-hearted luke-warm ideas that we can get a partial joining momentum to drift us into the union. We need to be honest and directed about this.

[@Harry-tb8yo]

The UK doeswn't meet the criteria to join the Eurozone. Without joining the Eurozone the UK will not be able to become an EU member.

[@loneprimate]

Given this would be their second run at it, I wouldn't admit the UK as a voting member again until it had demonstrated its seriousness this time around by joining the euro and Schengen FIRST. I'd even pass the enabling legislation to give them the means of doing so. Then, and only then, would I put their flag back on the table with a seat behind it.

[@jasonkingshott2971]

Have you just discovered geography?

[@johnstevens1022]

Correct.

[@mrstevecox7]

@@loneprimate I think that is absolutely right. Both the Uk and the EU need to return to the UK being in the union. BUT trust has been smashed. The way through is to regain trust through little movements , well thought out, but with no doubt that the end of the process is a Federal Europe with a common currency , army and passporting.

[@fje1948]

Excellent analysis - Thank You!

[@dmoreyn]

Great talk, gentleman. Very informative, as usual.

[@Lucid.dreamer]

Yeah. For a circle jerk.

[@michaelgoss9606]

Thank you, I agree with JS , will it be a forced debate or one we freely enter into as a nation.

[@uweinhamburg]

No country can join the Euro! After meeting all convergence criteria and applying for membership, in the end the Council of the EU decides if a country is allowed to join. Joining would mean that a country would get a say (rule making) within the ECB. On the other hand, each country can in theory use any currency they want! Without any control of this currency ad without the right to print money (rule taker)! The Euro is de facto the currency of 20 EU members, several smaller states in Europe but with a fixed link to the CFA Franc also the only official currency for 14 countries in Africa, with the also pegged CFP-Franc in some smaller French ex-colonies as well. Unofficially, the Euro-area is much bigger. Anybody in Egypt who has a few Euro as tips as a waiter will try to change the money in Euro banknotes as soon as possible, as the local currency means nothing to them and for Euro coins you can buy nothing. The same for all other Northern Africa states (except Lybia where they prefer the Dollar), Turkey and most of the countries which developed out of the old communist Soviet Union. Wild guess - the Euro and pegged currencies are the main currency for between 1 and 2 billion people! Many companies in these countries with an unstable economy have 2 bookkeepings - one in their local currency for the tax people and one in Euro for the banks and anybody else...

[@EllieD.Violet]

..... and these blokes consider themselves to be 'experts' 😂. Every 15 years old in a German school knows more than these idiots. Given their age, they'll have been pushing the daisies for decades once we 🇪🇺 merely *consider* not to dump their application instantly in the bin. These geriatrics waffle about rejoining as if it was a potential option for them. Someone should bang their noggins against a wall until their 2 or 3 brain cells finally produce a spark.

[@anitagorse9204]

Among non-EU member states, Andorra, Monaco, San Marino, and Vatican City have formal agreements with the EU to use the euro as their official currency and issue their own coins. In addition, Kosovo and Montenegro have adopted the euro unilaterally. Unofficially, many tourist contries with many europeans vacating there have euro as a parallel currency.

[@EllieD.Violet]

@@anitagorse9204 Those are micro-states with a population the size of a midsized to bigger company. All of them sharing borders with or being entirely surrounded by EU memberstates.

[@johnstevens1022]

GrussGott. Als ich das letzte Mal in Bayern war, war ich auf dem Weg um den Beitritt Kroatiens zum Euro zu feiern, da ich der Zagreber Regierung dazu geraten hatte. Und ich glaube das ich bin noch nicht so alt das ich die Rückkehr Britanniens in die EU erleben werde.

[@ziggymayer4093]

​@@anitagorse9204⁸

[@eveb.6568]

absolutely!!!! EU

[@verttikoo2052]

Both EU and USA doesn’t need the London anymore.

[@johnstevens1022]

That is indeed the danger for London. But it is a little way yet to becoming crystallised.

[@verttikoo2052]

@@johnstevens1022 It will crystalize 31.12.2023. Don’t worry about that 👍🏻

[@johnstevens1022]

Why do you choose that date? The June 2025 deadline on euro clearing is the next major break-point imv.@@verttikoo2052

[@uweinhamburg]

@@johnstevens1022 Right! The next major step though will be the end of CO² certificate trading in 2024 By far not the same values as Euro clearing but a very representative step as it will show that EUrope means business!

[@johnstevens1022]

Not really key to the issue of London as a financial centre, however important in other respects.. @@uweinhamburg

[@jeffsmith3392]

'There some that say we would have to join the €uro"... The treaties say so.

[@howarddavies8937]

Excellent idea.

[@jeffsmith3392]

@@howarddavies8937 glad you're not the Chancellor then 🤣

[@public.public]

I'm all for it. Only the billionaires profit from the pound by their offshoring the pound. You get way more food to the euro than you do to the pound.

[@aukebij3193]

If the UK is ever allowed back into the EU, it will also have to accept the euro. As of 2024, a new EU law will come into effect that every country that joins the European Union from that date onwards must adopt the euro within five years. That creates a double barrier for the EU because it does not meet the Copenhagen criteria and has never met them and it also does not meet the Euro criteria. And barrier number three is also coming because in December a vote will be taken on whether newly acceding countries must also meet the Schengen criteria and be obliged to comply with them. In other words, the UK is approximately five hundred years behind the EU's policy

[@rmamon2554]

Not only the €. All measures must be metric, you have to drive on the correct side of the road, and any stupid exception will be as death as your incest monarchy.

[@Purple_flower09]

​@@rmamon2554the English won't want to join the EU. This is just social media chat. None of the serious politicians are even talking about it.

[@alfredttarski4521]

@@Purple_flower09 The English are fickle.

[@Harry-tb8yo]

@@Purple_flower09 There are serious politicians in the UK?

[@julianshepherd2038]

🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿❤️🇪🇺 Long live the Auld Alliance

[@Pierluigi_Di_Lorenzo]

Britain can adopt the € anytime, like Kosovo and Montenegro.

[@Raggman42]

Which is true about these countries but here the real problem Britain is outside the EU right now and many EU members just don't want England in the EU but have no problem with Scotland or even Wales rejoining but under no circumstances will Britain or England be allowed back into the EU.

[@AndyHenderson26]

@@Raggman42I mean Scotland isn’t going to leave the UK anytime soon if ever and time makes it even less likely with their demographics but wales will never leave it’s Union with England 🤣 it’s actually funny that you think it could

[@johnstevens1022]

I advised the Montenegran government on their essentially currency board regime which gives the euro its status in that country. I can assure you such a regime would not be viable for the UK. Whether the UK could, with much more elaborate mechanisms, join the euro, without re-joining the EU, is an interesting abstract question, but I fear has no political reality.

[@johnstevens1022]

What demographics are you referring to? @@AndyHenderson26

[@Purple_flower09]

You need special permission to use the Euro.

[@moniquehenry4041]

from a French. I agree with you 100%. Of course the core of the debate in the UK should be the European identity AND admitting that the world has changed (blocs that an isolated "great" island cannot dominate, nobody cares about the British exceptionnalism.....). It will probably occur. The crisis is needed to be put in front of the realities of the world. It is exactly the same thing for a man who has been living in illusions and denials during decades. A depression, a hard time, is needed before being able to wake up , start thinking with clear ideas and then move ahead.

[@Lucid.dreamer]

The UK is a European country. Of course. The problem you have is that you seem to think the EU = Europe. The contrary is true.

[@imastaycool]

@@Lucid.dreamer you read what you wanted to read...

[@Lucid.dreamer]

@@imastaycool Did I? And what, precisely was that?

[@EllieD.Violet]

It's comforting to know that les rosbifs fail to meet 50% of our 🇪🇺 present accession criteria. So we 🇪🇺 won't need to bother ourselves with merely wasting a thought on their next application until ca 2070. By which time I'll be an old lady 😊.

[@Lucid.dreamer]

@@EllieD.Violet it's nice to know that les *Frogs* have plenty of garden snails to dine out on

[@121evans]

The pound is going down anyway..... yes join euro..... would be so convenient for business, holidays, no exchange rates, unity.

[@annother3350]

The EU is a toxic, fascistic organisation of ever-more centralised power and control

[@Harry-tb8yo]

There is no need in the EU for the UK to join. We have no desire that our currency is being dragged down by the UK economy. Stay away from the EU.

[@AllenOoflynn]

Some people on the left voted to leave with a vision of a left wing BREXIT , unfortunately we got a right wing BREXIT.

[@laurawalker6431]

Warning: It would be a disaster to rejoin the EU, because we would end up like Spain and Grace, bankruptcy and bankrupted , and begging for help, at least now we can create something new and something similar to Switzerland if we had the right leader!! The problems now are not only Brexit but Dictatorship like Putin and around the world wars! We are doing not bad compared to many….so we should all stick together and stay with Brexit, and just get on with it, the worst thing is indecision, if we just get on with what we have - we can make it work like Switzerland or Singapore etc whom are not in the EU , we can learn from them instead of being in tunnel vision with indecisions , step down Sunak if you don’t know what you’re doing , give it to David, we have huge amounts of resources and we can build on them…and have the best country ever without joining the EU. We are their friends and they are our friends in the long run, we will be better off being independent and build something extraordinary. Come on boys and girls, we can do this, we are British, be proud of who we are! 🎉 celebrate! Goodness me!

[@romanjimenezgil]

From Spain...we are not banrupted

[@laurawalker6431]

@@romanjimenezgil you were more than ten years ago and Germany had to bail you out! Do you not remember?

[@ulfosterberg9116]

​@@laurawalker6431and uk was before it joined EU. And uk is on the way of going bankrupt again.

[@MrsGardiner]

Neither do you appear to know that Switzerland has a long history of being neutral, but nevertheless wanted to be in the EU institutions de facto! This resulted in a lot of mini deals with the EU. And the EU was very clear that no other country will ever be able to do this. So a Swiss relationship, was not offered during the negotiation and is never going to be on the cards now. You advocating such a thing is a non starter. I can only assume that you are speaking from an unjustified stance of British 'entitlement' that assumes that despite what has been clearly stated by EU, 'mighty' Britain has the power to negotiate anything that Britain wants. The flipside of this, denigrating countries who are doing better and better by being EU members, also shows that you are an entitled Brit, who feels special and clearly better than all these other EU members. Yes indeed, go ahead and make something proud and extraordinary (your words) out of Brexit! The very thing that proud Brexiters are seemingly unable to achieve! Leaving the option of the slow decline as your future. A big price to pay for all this British entitlement and feeling superior to others. And thankfully, not a universally British attitude either, I am glad to say. Most young Britons are not of your mind set at all.

[@laurawalker6431]

@@MrsGardiner the problem we are facing came from Covid and the Monster Putin war, so get your facts straight. Of course you are entitled to be and choose as you wish but my views came from daughters being kidnapped and shipped to the EU without a trace for sex trafficking and EU to Britain, our police were not able to do anything about it. Being proud is being a human being not only being British but being in a country that we need to support, now that we are out of the EU. So that we don’t keep doing yo-yo yoing about without anyone to lead us proudly as human beings. We need to be something rather than nothing for our children’s sake since we have already left, our children need to be the first to protect and feel they have a system that will benefit them in the long run. We are better off than many countries in the EU right now. Rome was not built in ten years. We have a great opportunity to rebuild a wonderful nation with a multi cultural society and we have nothing against the EU, they are still our friends, but after 40 Years of being in the EU poverty shouldn’t happen, kidnapped children for sex trafficking so easily shouldn’t happen, we shouldn’t ignore these social injustices for a healthy country to thrive. The EU has clearly abused the easy access without caring for our children, corruption was on the rise and it wasn’t going to end ! So get ready for a brighter future for us all, and you can also contribute to help build something extraordinary as a multi cultural nation! Switzerland decided not to join the EU in the end after Britain left!

[@lesscott4301]

Nice to see 20000+ on the march. Also t's exiting to see the YouGov survey, which shows that only 73% of those that voted leave would do so again. In a new vote to return to the EU, 51% of Britons would vote to rejoin, compared to 32% who would vote to stay out. That means that potentially 27 million voters might vote to rejoin, and only 18 million would want to stay outside.

[@martinhambleton5076]

😅😂🤣. Hilarious. 20 000+? That figure is as reliable as the eu accounts that can't be signed off. It is a ridiculous organisation. Never about business and trade, but everything to do with control, by beurocracy or self-importance.

[@121evans]

We are Europeans ..... we are equal and valuable nation.

[@howarddavies8937]

Excellent idea.

[@rogerbeesley-lo5tj]

Britain is different: Britain is a feudal country, the last in Europe. Scotland and NI are the rump of the Westminster/Whitehall (AKA British) Empire. As the economic outlook worsens, as it is, and will, the UK will break up, England will be the remaining European political fossil, complete with its princes, dukes, earls, lords, barons, etc, all the deleterious nonsense that the English seem to revel in. All the major countries of Europe have had political revolutions that eventually produced genuinely representative societies. England had its chance but blew it with the restoration of Charles II. The class system, divisive and destructive as it is, is essential to the continuation of the political farce that is Britain. There is not a single agency of the British State that is fit for purpose; not the monarchy, central or local govt., the military, the "justice" system, education, industrial and infrastructure policy; none of it works. It took three attempts to get into the EU, it will be impossible to rejoin. Although it is essential that extraordinary political efforts be made to limit the damage BREXIT has caused and will continue to cause. That will mean that Britain will have to beg for favors. That will only happen when England is suffering much more than it is now. That is coming.

[@andersrefstad8235]

I am glad you are out on that iseland. ... Don't need more of your UK Bullshit ! Just stay out there ..! Remember: Enjoy

[@Tay12345]

Terrible comment

[@rogerbeesley-lo5tj]

@@Tay12345 True though!

[@Tay12345]

@@rogerbeesley-lo5tj it’s not true at all.

[@rogerbeesley-lo5tj]

@@Tay12345 What about is not true? Come back with facts, not emotional claptrap.

[@Joanna-il2ur]

Ever heard of this new idea? It’s called democracy. We had this idea, that the government should do what we tell it to. Your boss Putin would be so keen on this.

[@smoozerish]

It;s going to be a slow but steady decline for the UK. NI would be better off uniting with Ireland to save itself.

[@charrogate]

Richi said that NI is in a unique position which is unavailable within Britain 🤔

[@imastaycool]

The occupied counties will be reunified with the rest of Ireland sooner than thought 💚🤍🧡☘🇮🇪

[@andrewblewett2300]

Seems to me re the Euro that the problem will be dealing with popular sentiment attached to the £. Very different discussion. It has always seemed curious that equally « patriotic » minded countries eg Ireland, France just don’t see a problem culturally. Whereas for the UK ..

[@petergaskin1811]

Since the end of Empire this country has just become some sort of nostalgia theme park. We've become too attached to inconsequential symbols of our not-quite-so-illustrious past.

[@johnstevens1022]

The interest rate differential, the locked in need for sterling to have higher rates than the euro will be the critical factor in shifting general public opinion. During the era of ultra low rates this passed un-noticed. But that era is over, and will not return for a very long time.

[@normanchristie4524]

Not such a great problem since, thanks largely to the brexiters, the £GB and the € are close to parity.

[@loneprimate]

The UK, which lives perpetually in either September of 1940 on the one hand or May of 1945 on the other, still thinks the pound is what it was back then. If these people ever psychologically leave the Second World War in the rearview mirror, they're going to come face to face with the real world, and they're not grown up enough to be in it, it seems to me.

[@Blindbrick2]

I was sad when the Dutch 'Gulden' was replaced by the Euro, But now I think the Euro is damn easy.

[@michaelsteane9926]

As your food production systems (farms) get wiped out by the EU. Hey, what could go wrong with that?

[@adrianwhyatt594]

There is a requirement to promise to join the Euro, but as Sweden, Poland and other countries show, no time limit on doing so. It is a good idea to join anyway because the majority of UK and Gibraltar and UK dependency trade is denominated in Euros, and this would immediately save up to 2% on transaction costs and also help with investment. Geographically the UK is a European country. Whether it, politically, moves beyond membership of the Council of Europe, withdraws from it, or moves beyond the European Political Space or withdraws from it, or remains in European Standards Bodies or withdraws from them does not affect the UK´s being part of the continent of Europe, itself part of the Eurafasian tribe-continental area. We should go the whole hog, moving towards the creation of a single European state, which also includes those countries which span part of Europe and Asia (Russia and Turkey), expanding out to creating a single Eurasian and then Eurafasian state and finally a global, fully accountable state with direct democracy through referenda and a full written constitution . This can then endure until the Antichrist occupies all or most of it, followed by his defeat, the end of this world and the creation of a new world as this one is finished and burnt up through the second coming of Christ and the Final Judgment. Efforts need to concentrate on getting a favourable Initial Judgment for as many people as possible followed by a favourable final judgment. As CS Lewis pointed out, political arrangements are temporary, but we will each, individually, either suffer eternally or enjoy bliss and union with God´s energies for ever. The eternal fire will either warm us pleasantly or burn us, for ever.

[@remainertears]

Polling suggests the number wanting to rejoin sinks when it includes joining the Euro, with 26% in favour.

[@johnstevens1022]

Which is precisely why re-joiners must explain the advantages for the UK of joining the euro (which are substantial).

[@remainertears]

@johnstevens1022 the benefits are no xchange costs. Downsides are no control of interest rates, losing the ability to devalue, no democratic oversight. I think selling the Euro to the UK is a tough ask

[@johnstevens1022]

The benefits go far beyond no FX transaction costs. FX uncertainty and volatility (and hedging to protect from same) is a major barrier to trade, operating like a tariff. Lower interest rates, economies of scale and competitively in financial services provision are others. Independent control of interest rates and the right to devalue are paid for in today's world by structurally higher and more volatile interest rates. Democratic oversight, again in today's world is a fantasy. Any suggestion of resuming political control of monetary policy (ending BoE independence) which for example that ass Lord Frost is floating again today, would frighten the markets and cause real capital costs to rise. @@remainertears

[@public.public]

euro buys more food than the pound.

[@remainertears]

@@public.public Euro is an unstable political currency.

[@julianshepherd2038]

It takes 1 country of 27 to veto UK membership.

[@rmamon2554]

Than lets program my answering machine to 'veto'.

[@petergaskin1811]

You've forgotten Wallonia.

[@petergaskin1811]

@@rmamon2554 ?

[@EllieD.Violet]

It will be more than one. More like half a dozen 😂. Greetings from the EU 🇪🇺

[@nickdoughty518]

Any thoughts on the revisions to UK growth vs other G7 countries? Will their figures be revised too?

[@johnstevens1022]

Quite possibly. The exceptional conditions of the Covid and Energy shocks, and the impact of enormous increases in the money supply via QE have already produced volatility in EZ stats (though not as extreme as those from the ONS, for which I can find no real precedent.) Imv. praying in aid these revisions as vindicating Brexit is ridiculous, especially since the improvements have all been in measures for services, tightly linked to the very exceptional levels of net immigration we have had, whilst the most Brexit-impacted sectors, notably manufacturing, have been further revised down. Only one thing is really certain: the ONS needs a major upgrade in its capacities.

[@nickdoughty518]

@johnstevens1022 yes, the significant delay in issuing the 'proper' figures is unacceptable.

[@jasonkingshott2971]

Just like those Spanish sun beds, the Germans got to a recession before the Brits.

[@tomwaller6893]

Scotland is joining the EU and leaving England with her greatest mistake. Enjoy.

[@Lucid.dreamer]

Let me know *right away* when that happens.

[@michaelsteane9926]

It's happening right now. In his dreams.@@Lucid.dreamer

[@Lucid.dreamer]

@@michaelsteane9926 anti brexiters / scottish independentists ,,, They have to console themselves by telling everybody that something they want is happening, when it isn't. Fantasy is the closest they get. it's the consolation prize of losers.

[@Lucid.dreamer]

@@michaelsteane9926 Walter Mitty ..

[@Tay12345]

No it isn’t.

[@JohnnyinMN]

You ultimately have no choice on anything. Once you finally accept you are an average country, then expect another generation after that until ‘joining.’

[@geoffreyhughes9979]

Time to apply to rejoin the EU.

[@malthusXIII-fo3ep]

How do we fund the £25 BILLION annual membership fee? Pay even more tax?

[@Paul_C]

​@@malthusXIII-fo3eptake it from the wasted money of 'track and trace'? That 37 BILLION fiasco?

[@jeckjeck3119]

@@malthusXIII-fo3ep LOL, your lies about EU have no power here.

[@malthusXIII-fo3ep]

@@jeckjeck3119 And also the CAP and CFP scandal which was a massive rip-off of the UK taxpayer. And also £300 BILLION net we shoved down the Brussels shitter during 47 wasted years.

[@jeckjeck3119]

@@malthusXIII-fo3ep Brexiter speaks = Brexiter lies.

[@stewartjones2173]

I really am appalled with myself. I' m such an inverted snob that listening to posh people pontificate really irritates me even when I agree with them.

[@johnstevens1022]

I am very sorry that I offend you aesthetically. Please do not let it impact your intellectual judgement.

[@samhartford8677]

As a foreigner I can understand that. Having lived in the UK for almost a decade, the posh accent is one of the basic things that perpetuates the feudal political culture in the UK. Greetings from Finland.

[@johnstevens1022]

Do you think the same of your Swedish speakers? @@samhartford8677

[@jeffsmith3392]

Brendan, do your homework. Yes rejoining would entail €uro membership. Hence we'll stay out of the EU.

[@jeckjeck3119]

And? Small price to pay.

[@alice1374]

@@jeckjeck3119 Infact it might not be that small, considering how trashed the pound has become. Granted it's been recovering however Truss and her lot want tax cuts again.

[@jeckjeck3119]

@@alice1374 We are sending weapons.

[@bryangeake5826]

If we did, we would replace a currency that has devalued by 27% against the Euro with a currency (the Euro) that is an internationally respected reserve currency that rivals the $!! Food inflation would vanish over night!

[@michaelsteane9926]

We also don't want to rejoin.

[@frogandspanner]

When Cameron tried to renegotiate UK's position in the EU an opt-out from _ever closer union_ was offered - a signal that many took to mean that UK membership was more important to the EU than its vital principle.

[@johnstevens1022]

There is no question the EU were trying to help Cameron. But the full story of that fatal episode has yet to be told. And that was then. Now, there is no question a re-joining UK (or Scotland and England) would be required to accept Ever Closer Union and demonstrate that commitment by joining the euro.

[@petergaskin1811]

@@johnstevens1022 And Schengen.

[@jmolofsson]

Several steps in the Brexit saga were hard sells in various EU-capitals. Cameron's achievement was one such. Barnier's Labour adapted Withdrawal Agreement was another. The then unhappy governments have no reason to announce their relief with London's rejection too loudly. But do not underestimate it!

[@pragma5282]

Wrong, the UK was important while it was inside the EU. UK was blackmailing and vetoing many things, and the EU states were just trying to appease Britain. That is not a healthy relationship and I'm glad that ended. Now the decissions are more streamlined and EU citizens see a much more agile EU than before Brexit, so I doubt anyone wants to allow that toxic ex-wife to comeback to our lives.

[@alfredttarski4521]

Such an opt-out was what the UK demanded, not what the EU offered.

[@treyquattro]

the single biggest benefit in all of the special considerations extended to the UK in the EU was the maintenance of the UK's own currency. I see this as the biggest stumbling block to re-joining the EU fully. I can't imagine that the UK would ever give up it's own currency and central bank, nor should it. I was and am entirely against the UK leaving the EU, but I'm equally against the UK relinquishing its own currency.

[@rmamon2554]

Not only your currency but your braindeath measurements, your driving on the wrong side and give me back my Krügerl 0.5 Liters of Beer instead of your poisond soup called a Pint 0.4 Liters of pisswater may be ok for the UK but civilized Nations don't drink dogspiss.

[@loneprimate]

_"I was and am entirely against the UK leaving the EU, but I'm equally against the UK relinquishing its own currency."_ Well, here's the solution: keep the pound and stay out. I'd go so far as to making sure you adopted the euro (and Schengen) PRIOR to being readmitted. I can't imagine they'd ever let you in again as anything less than a fully-committed member, nor should they.

[@loneprimate]

@@rmamon2554 You're confusing the US pint with the British pint. The US quart is smaller than a litre; the British quart is larger. A British pint is 568mL, not 400.

[@treyquattro]

@@loneprimate I think the issue will likely be resolved by CBDCs. Individual sovereignty will be less of an issue with currencies tied more closely to trade and with finer control over macroeconomic data produced by currency exchanges. Currently central banks have very little control or knowledge of what happens with their currencies: they can "print" money via treasury instruction, or they can manipulate interest rates. It's these broad, essentially political decisions over central banking that result in significant effects in national economies (and world economies if the central bank in question controls the world's reserve currency). The promise of CBDCs (one of them) is finer-grained control of where central bank money goes in the economy. By necessity of international trade CBDCs will be interlinked, making sovereignty less of an issue. Banks could end blanket interest rates and instead apply rates entirely on individual bases per user, company or sector. It's quite possible that CBDCs become a nominally nationalized variant of a supranational CBDC issued by the BIS for example.

[@EllieD.Violet]

The € is a conditio sine qua non for any new applicant. Take it or stay out. That simple. No more opt-outs, no more rebates, no more special whatever. Same conditions for you as for Albania. Since you fail to meet 50% of the accession criteria anyway - don't bother your little head with the €. We 🇨🇵🇪🇺 will block your application anyway for half a century. Greetings from the EU 🇪🇺

[@trevordaviesable]

Would the rigidity of the Euro hamper the money manipulators so loved by those putting their money offshore.?

[@gs9140]

Do you even know that the UK as countrly would still exist by the time you decide to rejoin. I think that Scottish independance and Irish reuion are more probable than the Uk rejoining. Let us see what happens to the UK in the next 10 or 20 years

[@johnstevens1022]

I agree that Brexit has completely re-opened the issue of Irish re-unification and largely invalidated the result of the 2014 Scottish referendum. However, the real danger is not that either or both of these outcomes actually happen, for they would definitely massively increase the chances of England (and Wales) wanting to re-join the EU too, but how disruptive, destructive and difficult the process of reaching them could prove to be. I see, for example little change in NI Unionist opinion as yet and if anything a hardening of attitudes. Likewise, Scotland is clearly split down the middle and a democratic path to resolution of the issue seems increasingly remote, which is obviously especially dangerous.These constitutional arguments are going to increasingly overshadow Brexit UK, I fear. That prospect should be a powerful argument for the UK to rejoin the EU as soon as possible, but no one is making that case, out of fear essentially (rather like the euro issue).

[@gs9140]

@@johnstevens1022 ​ @johnstevens1022 I agree with you but from an EU citizen perspective, many of us think that brexit has shaken the UK integrity and unity at a political and institutional level, I dont think anyone who is in the EU considers a British rejoin to happen any time soon. Even if labour wins the next election there discours is still unclear about the eutopean project; the SNP has another agenda; the Irish Unionist and republicans another one. I do not think that EU members can renegociate anything zith the UK as it is. It has been already very painful and hard to negociate the brexit DEAL so the risk is quiet high; AS well I think the angloxanson nature of having two parties in Westminsters is not helping the UK as they they have the cuture to form coalitions as it is the tradition in continental Europe. Another issue is that the debate in remain camp was always driven by economical arguments only, there are many obstacles for a rejoin. Anyways; maybe in 20 years. It is easier to integrate Serbia or North Macedonia than the UK in the European project. AS long as the UK doesnt have the tools or the cultural basis to fully understand its situations; limitations, and selfcritisize its instutions I dont think that the other countries would be in favour of the UK rejoining. The Brists and especially the English have to undertand that no one is exceptional; that they need to discuss with each other first and commit to a full European integration. I do not see that hapening anytime soon. Cheers from France

[@johnstevens1022]

@@gs9140 I think you will find Serbia and Macedonia raise all sorts of problems until there is a clear European commitment/perspective from Russia, which is another order of magnitude greater as an issue even than the current doubtful European commitment of the English. Moreover, you underestimate our record of radical and rapid changes of direction. Brexit was one perhaps. But it is part of a process which many British historians consider very reminiscent of our crisis in the 17th century. when went from having the most absolutist monarchy in Europe in 1640, for Charles I controlled the Church as well as the state, unlike in Catholic states, to executing him in just 9 years.A decade later we had a less absolutist monarch back, then attempted a restoration of absolutism until settling on a parliamentary oligarchy following a Dutch invasion in 1688. More recently we rapidly reversed our extreme isolationism towards Continental Europe in 1901 to the entente Cordiale in 1905, and total war in 1914 and again from 1935 to war in 1939. This current British crisis of identity, governance and grand strategy has barely begun imv.

[@remainertears]

Scottish independence is now further away than at its heights in 2014. Never going to happen. Irish reunification would be a financial boost to the UK as NI is a benefit junkie which is why Ireland doesn't really want to merge

[@gs9140]

@@remainertears delusional

[@howarddavies8937]

Absolutely 🇪🇺🇪🇺

[@jonaen24]

Joining the Euro is a wonderful prospect and no problem at all.

[@annother3350]

The EU is a toxic, fascistic organisation of ever-more centralised power and control

[@lavender0666]

​@@annother3350think you're talking about Tories

[@annother3350]

@@lavender0666 Of course not, we can vote them out soon. EU citizens cannot vote out the evil von der Leyen

[@Purple_flower09]

​@@annother3350I think the president is elected by the representatives of the people. So it's not a dictatorship is it?

[@annother3350]

@@Purple_flower09 I'll say it again - EU citizens cannot vote out the evil von der Leyen. Once they're voted in and reveal their evil nature, such as von der leyen has, how do you get her out?! How can normal, decent folk like you or I become EU president?! Stop fooling yourselves guys...

[@MrsGardiner]

So true! Right at the present time a majority of people want to rejoin the EU 'for the economy', even cherry pick to just rejoin the single market, or just rejoin the customs union. Options that are not on the table any more, irrespective of having been offered during the negotiations! These options were rejected and are now off the table! And to hope that the EU will change its rules in Britain's favour anytime soon, just because, is not very likely to happen, now that Britain is a third country. Britain simply has lost the influence to affect how the EU wants to deal with third countries. Britons have not realised that the EU has equally 'brexited', negotiated, signed and ratified the new arrangements with Britain. And has moved on, knowing that they made the best job possible of a terrible situation and an awful shock for the EU. This leaves the option of Article 49, ask to rejoin, which is on the table, despite Brexit. But the discussion whether Britons actually want to do so because they now feel more European and now support the EU's philosophy and aims and institutions, is nowhere to be heard. Britons now would still be wanting to be in the EU for all the wrong reasons, solely for Britain's own economy and clearly not for everybody's economies. At the time of the first join, de Gaulle saw it, but since the Brexit drama, there will be de Gaulle's everywhere, who will point out this British mercantile stance and lack of proper commitment. Which means that work has to start in Britain to decide what Britain actually wants. And Brexit is a very good starting point. Does Britain want to be post empire 'global', however deluded, 'Singapore on Thames' whatever that means in reduced personal human rights and worker's rights for Britons to follow a pure neoliberal path, reminiscent of the 'dark satanic mills' of old, a state of the USA, that the USA does not want. Or indeed a return to Europe, which is only possible by showing proper European commitment - accepting the Euro in good grace would be a good test of commitment here. So far, Britain simply has not decided what its future is going to be. Never mind how to get there! Which leaves the 'do nothing' option of a depressed future as a mostly unaligned not very powerful lower status country, that can be exploited by others relatively easily. Rather than 'sitting at the table of a more powerful EU and collegially making joint decisions', this could even mean falling prey to Putin's long term plans. Britain has to make a decision if Britain wants better than a depressing, slow decline.

[@JohnStevens-gp7ge]

You describe the task ahead accurately, but without, if I may say, evidence of the energy and resolve needed to escape the decline you deprecate. I think there is still strength and spirit enough in England for the transformation pro-Europeans aspire to unleash.

[@jeffsmith3392]

You decline if you want to. Most are getting on with life.

[@walterbakker2690]

I doubt if the "Europeans" would ever want the UK, and particularly England, back in the EU

[@EpRoos]

Yes they would, no doubt about that. Its better for everyone, specially the UK itself.

[@alfredttarski4521]

@@EpRoos Wishful thinking. No one wants the toxic Brits to join again.

[@imastaycool]

​@@EpRoosBritain and even the UK as a whole is disunited politically, socially, culturally and linguistically. The poor political choices and decisions of Brexit have made the lack of unity ever clearer for the entire world to see. It's not just disunited, it's also completely imbalanced. Politically, it has devolved governments, but most of the power lies in Tory Westminster which has the UK at political loggerheads. These devolved governments squabble and fight amongst each other which details the disunity. Brexit was divisive and it shows how disunited the UK is with the occupied region called "Northern Ireland" and the country of Scotland voting No to Brexit. The UK is literally split down the middle in the Brexit debacle which makes it politically disunited. Furthermore, the UK isn't a voluntary union because Scotland is actively being denied another independence referendum post Brexit - this, again, makes it a disunited partnership + an imbalanced and undemocratic one. Welsh and Scottish independence is growing while talks of Irish reunification are on everyone's lips - this, again, demonstrates a disunited and imbalanced union. Socially, culturally and linguistically it is also divided and disunited as the different parts have their own culture and language. Brexit itself limits multiculturalism and encourages exclusive nationalism and nativism which in effect breeds racism and xenophobia (the very core of Brexit and Brexiteers). Great Britain was never united, but instead it's DISUNITED and IMBALANCED as well as UNDEMOCRATIC and UNJUST. And it's actively breaking up which is the ultimate win 😅

[@EpRoos]

@@imastaycool I can not be more agree with you unfortunate. Question is if Scotland will be able to rejoin on his own and if N-Ireland will join Ireland again.

[@Harry-tb8yo]

@@EpRoos No, certainly not. The EU runs much better and smoother since the UK left. It is much more cohesive and unified and there is for sure no need to get back the trouble making UK.

[@derekmckeown4478]

I wish the interviewer would let him finish his sentences

[@121evans]

We lost 110 billion annually from Eu .... that’s why economy is suffering now.

[@petergaskin1811]

Get your facts right - according to the ONS, the annual nett cost of UK membership was £8.9bn.

[@121evans]

@@petergaskin1811 I’m doing the red bus policy... I’m sure you are familiar with it. Still not even 10%.. of the privileges!

[@Harry-tb8yo]

So you lost 110 billion when you were in the EU. Now you are not in the EU. Where are the 110 billion gone that should have been available now?

[@cosmicdebris2223]

"rejoin the Euro" re.... rejoin? We never had the Euro to leave to now think about ..."rejoining" it. Strange.

[@michaelmayo3127]

"Rejoin the EU" New Eyes, can probably help!!

[@cosmicdebris2223]

@@michaelmayo3127 not sure what you mean. We were never part of the monetary union, so we can't "rejoin the Euro". We can rejoin the EU albeit under much worse conditions than we enjoyed as members.

[@michaelmayo3127]

@@cosmicdebris2223 No-one made any reference to " re joining the €" The reference was rejoin the EU.

[@cosmicdebris2223]

@@michaelmayo3127 at 1:21 he clearly states (repeatedly thereafter too) _"I think we would have to re-join the Euro"_ What more can I say? If you go to 1:20 + you will hear him say that. He should say "join the Euro" (which by the way is an EU pre-requisite when joining the EU). To "re-join" a Euro (the Euro is a currency) we need to have one been in the monetary union before i.e. _have had the Euro as a currency,_ but we never did have the Euro, so we can only join the Euro, we can't *_re-join_* ...it because we never had it.

[@daviddack1595]

Re-Join Now.

[@markmuller7962]

Identify crisis are dangerous, always have been

[@1957mattes]

To give confidence after this "hard" Brexit you need to do some things that give confidence. In any case, it will be a long battle of persuasion to convince all members of the EU that the UK wants to join not only for the tasty cookies but also for the bitter bites. Introducing the Euro, the metric system, and driving on the right side of the road would be a good start to show that the UK (and other EU countries too) have learned their lesson.😁

[@Purple_flower09]

They (English) don't want to join the EU.

[@mildandbitter]

The British people have to be told how to vote.

[@public.public]

It was not a legally binding referendum so the people did not decide. Parliament decided to leave. If it had been the people's decision it would have been a legally binding referendum and the result would not have been a sufficient majority in law to leave. So Parliament decided to leave so Parliament doesn't even need a referendum to rejoin. REJOIN THE EU NOW.

[@roddychristodoulou9111]

The UK is fundamentally a European country of that there is no doubt . What makes us different is this British exceptionalism which alas still exists to this day .

[@johnstevens1022]

You are right it is the exceptionalism which must change, if Brexit is to be reversed.

[@georgesdelatour]

The idea there’s such a thing as a statistically average country is far more ridiculous than the idea that one’s own country is unique or “exceptional”. There are countries with less than 12,000 people, countries with over a billion people; landlocked countries, island countries, continent-spanning countries; countries brimming with natural resources, countries with barely any; you name it. Europe alone includes everything from San Marino to Russia. Is Germany a “normal” or an “exceptional” country, for instance, and what would be the criteria you’d use to determine its normalcy score? Within the UK structure, both Scotland and Northern Ireland have arrangements which are "exceptional". The same people who tend to sneer at “English exceptionalism” often support these other exceptionalisms. Apparently they’re the good kind of exceptionalism.

[@roddychristodoulou9111]

To understand what I'm talking about is to understand geopolitics . America and the UK as far as I'm aware are the only two countries that practice exceptionalism . They have brainwashed their people into believing they won WW2 and they are the most powerful and leading nations on earth . Yes it's much more complex but if your struggling to understand exceptionalism whatever I say you will not understand . Of course it's all fake and false and the only reason this exists is because both establishments control the MSM so in effect control the narrative of any and every story .

[@verttikoo2052]

We in the 🇪🇺 don’t want 🇬🇧 anywhere near the 💶 Be sure about it. If you send an application then here is the address 🗑️

[@Joanna-il2ur]

Sod off then and enjoy your recession.

[@Siranoxz]

@@Joanna-il2ur Man, cope and seethe Joanna.. You know the UK is in a mess that it created itself and call on the EU to get into recession?. So delusional and funny you Brexiteers are lol.

[@johnbrereton5229]

How deluded ! Especially after even the head of French bank BNP Paribas has told investors to ditch the euro and invest in £ sterling in the city of London financial market instead.

[@christianmccann9400]

What rag of a brexit paper did you get that in .. the UK s economy and NHS is wrecked because of people like you tbh

[@natbirchall1580]

Looking from a historical perspective and from the mainland this is pretty silly. Everything in Britain came from the mainland.

[@georgesdelatour]

Common Law?

[@natbirchall1580]

@@georgesdelatour fish and chips?

[@georgesdelatour]

@@natbirchall1580 It's debated, but supposedly it was started by Sephardic Jews. It was the 19th century development of the railways which sped up the delivery of cod and haddock across the country, and helped spread the culture of fish and chip shops.

[@elwynjones8125]

Join the Euro for a stable currency and lower mortgage rates.

[@johnstevens1022]

Correct.

[@Harry-tb8yo]

The UK cann't. It misses the debt / GDP ratio limit by a few lightyears. Also the EU is not in place to help you out of the mess you created upon yourselves.

[@tonyholmes962]

Waiting for the pain to reach the brain.

[@johnstevens1022]

I am sorry you are suffering.

[@andersrefstad8235]

Why vould EU consider UK in ? There is no "rejoining" EU... Get real, it is i think 8 seriouse nations in line. Maybe some 20-30 years from now, with good behavioir, and you might be alowed to make reqest to be alowed a new aplication ? - You had your vote, now live it ! Would your economy qalefy then. ..? Brexit a smart move by England ..?

[@katywalker8322]

We had fraud, and are victims of it.

[@Seekeroftruth191]

Yeah all 3,000 of you marched in London haha

[@ajward137]

Try 20,000 (and stop deluding yourself thast what GB News reports are facts!)

[@Seekeroftruth191]

@@ajward137 lol GB news haha I was there watching the joke. Show me the 20,000??

[@howarddavies8937]

Join the €, Absolutely.

[@MENSA.lady2]

Selective deafness lures KO.

[@terencemacsweeney3667]

Thanks gents. I think a bespoke arrangement which would make trade in goods between UK & EU seamless will become a priority for the next UK Govt. This can be done for practical & economic reasons, not political ones, and such a soft Brexit option was supported by many before the referendum. It would not undo Brexit. Not necessarily going as far as Single Market membership but effectively being much the same thing. It's too soon to consider EU membership, Brexit wounds are raw. Thank you for your work.

[@Lucid.dreamer]

We have a tariff and quota free TCA. That is a remarkable achievement. The UK is making significant FTAs around the world. India is closing in fast. Any lurch to the SU, ECB, ECJ would wreck that. So, no.

[@Lucid.dreamer]

We're not interested in membership. Only remoaners are. And they are a bit "radio rental".

[@johnstevens1022]

Thank you. However the longer Brexit is not reversed, the more negative will be its effects. Mitigation of Brexit is not an effective strategy as there is no real half-way house between membership and third country status. Which is why returning as full members, euro Schengen and all, must be faced up to now, not postponed until politically convenient for any particular party. Our people, if the polling is accurate, are ready for such a process, but our politicians are not.

[@terencemacsweeney3667]

For me being in the Single Market, or it's equivalent, would be a half-way house, and an important stepping stone, and it would not require to reopen the can of worms of Brexit because during the referendum a soft Brexit, or single market membership Brexit, was part of the leave manifesto. It was only after the referendum when May took office she delivered her Lancaster House speech, a political sleight of hand, and in which she redefined Brexit and effectively eliminated any soft Brexit options. My suggestion is not ideal but wasn't it Voltaire said something to the effect of not letting perfection be the enemy of good. Softly softly catchee monkey !@@johnstevens1022

[@imastaycool]

@@Lucid.dreamer you've replaced European migration with Indian, Pakistani, etc. migration hahaha You're probably an Asian Brit that's why.... or you're a deluded white man.

[@bertoverweel6588]

But the British have their sufferingty, sovereignty now.

[@bobleitch3610]

So?

[@didierlemoine6771]

Join the €uro wd be a good step of confidence for EU :)

[@johnstevens1022]

Correct.

[@a.r.stellmacher8709]

II think England is more American than European. It doesn’t fit in the EU. Westminster should make Brexit work.

[@michaelrowsell1160]

That's like trying to make a pig fly.

[@cdl0]

As somebody who has lived, worked, and travelled widely in Europe and US since the early 1980's, please be informed that according to my long experience, British people are culturally European rather than American. Much as I love and admire my many old American friends and colleagues, it is a great place to visit; however, there is no way I would want to live there, but would be happy to live in any of the countries in the EU or EEA.

[@ralfjanser4733]

so relocate your island to texas. keep in mind that the us don't like to feed your week economy too.

[@cdl0]

@@ralfjanser4733 Urg! No thanks, not Texas, that would be horrible. Oddly Texas is one of the two American states that I have never visited; the other is a remote island.

[@Pierluigi_Di_Lorenzo]

Be advised that specific legal processes for territories and regions to become part of the United States do exist.

[@samhartford8677]

Thanks, a good and realistic discussion. The ever-closer union and the euro are clear prerequisites, given the Eurozone vs Poundland controversy was the basic cause of a lot of British obstructionism.

[@fintonmainz7845]

"Realistic discussion"? 2 arrogant entitled Brits who think we will allow Britain to "rejoin" the EU. Absolute nonsense.

[@Raggman42]

J9hn let me be very honest and straightforward with you under no circumstances will Britain be allowed to rejoin the EU, now there's a chance that England Scotland and Wales will be allowed to rejoin the EU because if England vote again to leave the EU it's only England. Unfortunately I have to remain you John that Westminster politicians went out of their way to tell us in the EU that they are rulers not rule takers 😂😂😂😂😂, well they are now rule takers as a third country 😂😂😂😂😂. These same people threatened to invade my own country not once but several times, Johnson came every close to starting a civil war on the island of Ireland.. Unfortunately we in Ireland 🇮🇪 and other EU members countries still haven't heard the British public calling out these brexiteers people who were allowed and still allowed ( Sammy the snake) from the dup unionists loyalists terrorists bigots party club who insults every person on the island of Ireland but also someone like yourself John who has a Irish name still we hear nothing from the British public. Yet we're expected to just allow England back into the EU something that's just not going to happen, at least not for a very long time but the British public shouldn't blame us but the British brexiteers who liked throwing their insults at not just Ireland but other members of the EU too.

[@benjamindejonge3624]

Brexit is a good thing to show the Uk how really the way a country is ruled and reflects all impurities and injustice the Uk really is, carry on old bean

[@itkapatanka]

I'd vote for that!

[@elipotter369]

I wonder if the view on "being European" is distinctly stronger in parts of the UK, such as Scotland- and that the "we're not European" view is mainly focused on the least educated and people who are mostly in England.

[@jeffsmith3392]

A rejoin campaign will fail because it's full of remainers calling voters they need to flip.. think, racist, sexist gammons. Will Straw and Mr Rudd can't connect with us. 🤣

[@georgesdelatour]

I feel intensely European. The EU feels profoundly un-European to me. Monnet wanted to turn Europe into a mirror USA on the right side of the Atlantic. His model’s always been a bad fit for a culturally, linguistically, politically and even legally diverse patchwork continent such as Europe. The USA is more inherently unified than the EU. This is hardly surprising. As a colonial settler society founded by people from a single country, the USA was able to set up its institutions shortly after independence, and pour most of its population in afterwards. The EU cannot do this, even though it sometimes seems to want to.

[@crackerbarrel210]

I think the EU will have the UK back without it accepting the Euro. But the UK will have to at least accept Freedom of Movement, which it will.... Everyone's figured out Brexit is going nowhere, very fast....😇😇

[@Harry-tb8yo]

Be assured that that won't happen. Giving a failed state like the UK unreasonable exceptions again? No. The EU has learned its lesson. Put your exceptionalsim into the bin or you are getting nowhere.

[@imastaycool]

​@@Harry-tb8yowell said 👏

[@bereal6590]

@@Harry-tb8yo how do you explain Hungary and their Russian gas supply then, even the uk refused Russian gas

[@Harry-tb8yo]

@@bereal6590 What has that to do with the UK and its relation to the EU? Nothing. The UK won't get exceptions again. It is a third country now.

[@EllieD.Violet]

€ is a conditio sine qua non for new applicants. But rest assured - we 🇨🇵 will veto les rosbifs anyway for half a century. If only because we can 😂. Greetings from the EU 🇪🇺

[@kevinhime-knowles5198]

Yes I do think Jacob cares, I have worked for Jacob, and found him a very pleasant man

[@christianmccann9400]

Was this after he moved his business to Dublin .. Jacob works for himself

[@howarddavies8937]

He's a self-serving waste of space What has he done for anyone but himself.

[@alphabetaxenonzzzcat]

Remember the ERM debacle during the 1990s? That should be a warning as to not proceed towards the Euro - let alone things like CBDCs.

[@johnstevens1022]

It was the failure of the ERM which made the creation of the euro inevitable and indispensable as it demonstrated there is no half-way-house stable enough to sustain the Single Market between free-floating FX rates, which would destroy the SM, and a complete single currency. Everyone was burnt by the ERM collapse, but only the UK did not accept (or misinterpreted) its lesson.

[@jeffsmith3392]

Correct.

[@georgesdelatour]

@@johnstevens1022 The proposals and plans for economic and monetary union were not hastily created in the aftermath of Black Wednesday in 1992. They date from the Werner Report from 1970 - before the UK was even an EEC member. The logic has always been political - i.e. "we want to amalgamate into a giant, ass-kicking country like the USA!" - not economic.

[@johnstevens1022]

Correct. Which is why it was Conservative erstwhile imperialists who, post WW2, were the most enthusiastic pro-Europeans. The significance of the collapse of the ERM was that, contrary to most British expectations it would mark the end (at least for a long while) of moves to monetary union (see John Major's 1995 "raindance" speech), for everyone else involved it dramatically accelerated the creation of the euro.@@georgesdelatour

[@georgesdelatour]

@@johnstevens1022 The connection between British Imperial thinking and the EEC/EU is even more close than that. Many of Monnet’s ideas were adaptations of Joseph Chamberlain’s ideas for Imperial Federation, introduced to him by Arthur Salter. My own thinking derives more from the opposite tradition, from “The Troublemakers” described in A.J.P. Taylor’s book of the same name.

[@paologat]

There is no way UK is going to rejoin the EU in a decade. Given that both main parties in UK are currently excluding any form of rejoining, a decade might not even be sufficient for UK to firmly make up its mind on whether it wants to join again (which is the first of many steps). In my estimate a full Breturn will not happen before the late 2060s. 15 years for UK to make up its mind (a stable supermajority will be required), 15 years to make the extensive constitutional reforms required by the Copenhagen criteria (remember that when those criteria were adopted UK was grandfathered in), and another 15 years to account for the typical duration of accession negotiations.

[@johnstevens1022]

A decade is a long time, especially perhaps for at least one part of the UK on this issue, Northern Ireland. Above all, the geopolitical forces necessitating the unity of Europeans are becoming almost daily more powerful.

[@johnbrereton5229]

​@@johnstevens1022 Only in your head, in the real world the recession and fraud hit EU dictatorship is under strain and so might not even be around in 10 years.

[@paologat]

@@johnbrereton5229when you speak of fraud and dictatorship you surely mean in UK, right? But don’t worry, when you reach Calais in a dinghy you won’t be deported to Rwanda.

[@petergaskin1811]

@@johnbrereton5229 You must really give up this deluded view of the EU. It is not a dictatorship by any stretch of the imagination. It is certainly less "fraud hit" than the UK, given the £37bn nonsense for Dido Harding's test, track and trace fiasco or the £17bn GIVEN to the Tory's mates and funders. By your standard then, the UK must necessarily disappear within 10 years, which is, in my opinion, a much more likely occurrence.

[@ozzie2545]

@@johnbrereton5229 Keep shouting the same dumb rhetoric that has been debunked years ago, it makes you look smart....