Joker 2 Said to "HATE ITS AUDIENCE?? (was this film a mistake?)

[@johnwells5414]

The first Joker was only meant to be a 1 film and done.

[@cl20v87]

Agreed

[@Trazynn]

The way the ending implies he becomes a leader of a nihilistic cultural movement is fascinating and would make for a strong sequel. But going by the trailer, none of that seems to happen.

[@johnwells5414]

@@Trazynn Right! I was thinking they should have done a One Flew Over The Cuckoo’s Nest type story with Arthur leading the inmates of Arkham to rebel against the staff

[@skepticalsmurf]

but $$$$$$ talks...

[@peterm.4355]

Just like most movies that were turned into franchise because the first one made money.

[@johnlopez9014]

I like the idea of Harley loving the Joker for his violence and not necessarily for who he is… it’s a sad reality but I still don’t care about a second joker movie

[@MikePhillips-x6m]

Women are not attracted violence! It is money and power they like. With Harley Quinn in Batman the animated series, she fell in love with the Joker because she saw a kinder side to him that nobody else did. It was only after being with him over time Harley saw a darker side to the Joker but by this time his mind games had turned Harley into him!

[@11__11ziu]

@@MikePhillips-x6mit’s almost as if every woman is different genius. We’re not getting a comics accurate Harley quinn anyways

[@ravene9978]

@@MikePhillips-x6mSpeak for yourself, DOOM gets me going

[@leninswalrus]

No one idolized the first joker, they empathized with him. Its so absurd

[@notyouraverageharleyquinnstan]

💯

[@Seasonal-Shadow_4674]

But would they emphasize with every awful person?? Who is like joker or worse?

[@leninswalrus]

@@Seasonal-Shadow_4674 I don't understand what you're asking here

[@plantemor]

100% agree. I think the first Joker hit something very real in many people. We all go through very bleak stretches in our lives and Joker is about what could happen if we decide to give in the the bleakness inside. At least, that is what I took from it. If anything, it made me kinda proud of myself for having gotten through my own hardships and maintaining my compassion for others and still having hope and optimism. Everyone I spoke to who saw the film had the same take away.

[@The_evil_jonkler-cart445]

​@@Seasonal-Shadow_4674 man 👨

[@ariz347]

5:50 The Joker?……Thee Joker?…..The character that’s been around for decades?…..The one that’s one of the most beloved villains of all time?……That Joker? Plz, they’re acting like they created the character or something 💀 I’m so tired of people in Hollywood thinking their audience is stupid and can’t think for themselves

[@sincerelynotme3522]

Films that trash the audience tend not to do well. Hollywood hasn't learned that lesson because they inevitably keep doing it.

[@GrosvnerMcaffrey]

It's not about the money it's about sending a message

[@GambitX37]

When you're ideologically-possessed you don't learn. In fact, you drown out all other opinions or dissenting voices because you KNOW you're righteous.

[@interdimensionalsteve8172]

@@GrosvnerMcaffrey No, it's about the money. it's ALWAYS about the money. When corporations do "woke things," it has *nothing* to do with the message and everything to do with attempting to pander to what they perceive is their audience to maximize profit. IT'S ALWAYS ABOUT THE MONEY.

[@interdimensionalsteve8172]

@@GambitX37 Do you not realize that obsessing over the perceived ideology displayed in movies produced by profit-driven corporations... makes YOU the one who is ideologically obsessed? You DO get that, right? You know how irony works, I trust?

[@GrosvnerMcaffrey]

@@interdimensionalsteve8172 but yet they always seem to lose it

[@DeadFool321]

I can't believe people actually thought they would get a comic accurate harley from todd philips of all people

[@NegrondaGwimReapa]

It's an Elseworlds movie why is it a must to get an accurate movie? We got a gun wielding Batman and a Commie Superman in Elseworlds but no one said anything about it...

[@leninswalrus]

No one gaf about a comic accurate Harley. People wanted something similar to the first

[@austinreed7343]

It’s the closest we’re gonna get other than maybe the Caped Crusader version.

[@hope-cat4894]

A comic accurate Harley is just going to be the roller-blading one who's dating Ivy now. It's rarely the classic one anymore, so I'd rather it be something else.

[@mightguy3118]

​@@NegrondaGwimReapabecause besides that at least he's still Batman. This joker and Harley have nothing even in common with comic accurate versions so why make this a joker movie?

[@someother5512]

This movie was a mistake from the very start, it was always there to undo the first movie because it was seen as ideologically problematic by the people that dominate Hollywood thinking.

[@DirtyGeorge]

Nah the first movie is jst a plain rip off of king of comedy, taxi driver and network. Nowt to do with problematic thinking jst blatantly stealing ideas from classics. Also I would like know what u view as ideologically problematic from the first film. I'm betting you viewed Arthur fleck as a good guy.

[@AmeliaRobinson-bq1hj]

Even if this movie is bad still gona make at least billion because of first movie this is so sad😢

[@luigiboyinblu]

Lmao the first one was just fine, it’s not a big deal

[@MetAlcboy]

​@@DirtyGeorge"It's not 100% original, boohoo!" Originality died a long time ago

[@taffysaur]

@@DirtyGeorge It is obviously a tribute to that era of cinema and those movies specifically, which is why it is set in 1980 and features Robert Dinero. If they were trying to “rip off” those movies, they wouldn’t hang a lampshade on it like that. You aren’t clever for noticing something they intentionally hit us over the head with.

[@BoSmith7045]

First Joker: grounded character study of an abused mentality ill man set in an large decaying city in the early 80s. Budget: 55 million Second Joker: guy in an asylum hallucinates a girl friend ( probably, I am just guessing here) and sings. Budget: 200 million. It seems like Hollywood can't let a simple success stand. It's like they have to immediately do something stupid to atone for doing something right.

[@erroneous6947]

They have to atone for appealing to young disenfranchised men. Can’t have that.

[@joshpetzoldt6344]

I can't believe they'd have Joker hallucinating a girlfriend for a second time.

[@BoSmith7045]

@@joshpetzoldt6344 yeah. But realistically, who would allow criminally insane men and women to mix in the same asylum or prison in the 80s? Probably a moot point anyway after hearing a spoiler about the ending after l posted this. It doesn't sound promising.

[@Futureacquiescence]

Well said

[@philingrouille7198]

It definitely feels like Joker was Magic in a Bottle. The controversy and politics behind its release is what made it as successful as it was. The Streisand effect my friends.

[@MademoiselleRed1390]

The idea of Harley loving the Joker only as the Joker is good, but yeah, if it comes off as preachy criticism towards the audience it's easy to see how it can fail

[@mightguy3118]

Only part about this movie that seems like it adds something interesting. Falling in love with the joker but not authur.

[@brjoser]

The Joker purpose in life is antagonize Batman and his moral beliefs. If that's not in the movie there's no reason to it being made in first place.

[@mightguy3118]

I could understand the first movie and wanting to tell a joker origin. But anything past that you need Batman. This sequel shouldn't exist

[@thatguyseb8824]

It sounds like Todd Phillips doesn't understand his own movies.

[@mightguy3118]

He must not if he went from a character study drama to a joker courtroom drama💀 nobody's watching the joker to see court half the movie

[@plantemor]

Fear will do that to you. He is probably surrounded my woke psychopaths who have brainwashed him into feeling bad about the first movie and this one is an attempt to atone for his sins. As someone who works in a field with A LOT of very woke people, I can tell you, it sometimes gets to you and it can seem like the whole world is woke, when you are mostly surrounded by it. Not all woke people are bad, but those who are, are really bad and they are all too eager to dominate everything and everyone in every space they enter. It is actually surreal to witness it sometimes. How they think they are so right in their own minds that they are openly harassing and bullying others with glee and confidence while preaching compassion and understanding. If you are around that too much, it can really fuck with you and I think that unlike someone like Todd Philips, I can at least withdraw from the woke hivemind when I want to while he probably was attacked from all sides for months or years after releasing Joker. They operate like that and they will not give up until you break to their will.

[@CTladiesman]

I don't think he wanted to make one,I think this was the studios idea.

[@canaan5337]

I think Todd Phillips wanted to do one joker movie but because it cleared $1 billion the studios forcing him to do a sequel so he’s intentionally making it suck so he won’t stuck, making joker sequels for the rest of his career.

[@guydammit3287]

I think he's kind of a hack. I've known who he is since his first movie. (well... "documentary") The original Joker struck me as a Taxi Driver/King of Comedy highjack. My opinion only. Many people loved it. I'm not going to say it sucked, because it didn't. It just didn't do it for me, like Jack Nicholson and Heath Ledger's versions of the character.

[@EmilyFoxSeaton]

If it wasn't obvious that this was a middle finger to the fans before, when we found out it was a musical with Lady Gaga, that should have put it over the top.

[@svetlanaandrasova6086]

I think personaly they made it a musical just to have her in

[@mightguy3118]

@@svetlanaandrasova6086 Joaquin is the one who suggested lady gaga and it being a musical smh

[@LoveEachDay94]

Lady gaga is a phenomenal actress. That wasent a problem.

[@toongrowner1]

I still don't get why a sequel was made in the first place. The first movie was a stand alone character study. A personal drama at best, not an origin movie or something the like. A sequel makes no sense, it would only ruin the entire premise of the first movie. But like with any other media with obvious red flags (avengers game caughcaugh) people get hyped until its too late.

[@tmage23]

Money

[@mightguy3118]

You can tell the movie was set up to be a one and done and it was because at the time todd didn't plan on a sequel. But once it made over a billion he made an unnecessary sequel. Sequels should be made because it was set up from the first film and had more story to tell and not because the first one made a lot of money

[@muffinsdawg]

💰

[@superbatusPL]

​@@mightguy3118watch the movie first before saying unnecesary sequel lol 💀

[@CTladiesman]

I have my own idea for a sequel to joker movie.

[@ClassicHarleyQuinn]

If it's going at its audience then it'll fail like the rest of the films like that etc that have.

[@eon001]

Joker got lucky with the first one. They should have quit while they were ahead. Or at least not make a budget heavy sequel. I hear it's tracking well though. We'll see how the BO turns out.

[@VideoSmarts1]

They say it might beat out Barbie

[@eon001]

@@VideoSmarts1 Dayum.😳 All press is good press. 😅🤷🏿‍♂

[@Musical_parks]

I wouldn’t call it luck. It’s a genuinely well made movie and there was plenty of talent and hard work put into it. I completely agree with you on the point that it was not designed to have a sequel and shouldn’t but, ya know… money

[@Kaileighblue]

They should have just kept making joker movies that were different origins with the same unreliable narrator ending. Even recast him every time.

[@PunguinYoga]

Interesting idea.

[@codyraven8969]

I’ve said it before I’ll say it again. The first one was a spectacular movie. It had zero reason to be called a joker movie

[@mightguy3118]

Exactly what I'm saying. It didn't need to be a Joker movie and he had nothing in common with joker so why not just made it a regular mental illness movie?

[@theprowler18]

Simple, brand name. It’s a powerful tool in selling. That’s why it did so well with it simple messaging and humanized approach to how Joker can exist in the real world. Even if it’s blunt force to the face.

[@zztopz7090]

Because it wasnt. Todd Phillips even made the Joker way older than Bruce Wayne to make sure we dont associate him with the Joker. Its even called Joker, no article. Hes just some crazy guy with an unreliable narrative.

[@codyraven8969]

I would agree with both of you if it wasn’t for three facts. At the end of the movie it shows the death of the Wayne’s as they leave the zorro movie, it was marketed as taking place in a dc universe, and we now have a second one with Harley Quinn. Even if we left it at the first one they could have left out the it’s a dc universe and the Wayne’s dying. Then he’s just a mentally disturbed man in a movie that happens to have the same name as one of the most famous supervillains in comics. They still get the brand name and a fantastic movie

[@mightguy3118]

@@codyraven8969 But that isn't really important to plot. Those are just basic events to remind the viewers we're in the DC universe and give a tease to batman. It wasn't like those were Major important. You could take those out the movie and nothing really changes

[@notyouraverageharleyquinnstan]

I understand what you're saying now, and I agree. I am still going to judge it for myself, but I get where you're coming from with what is being said. I feel the same way, being SO invested in this character and always getting your hopes up just to be put down. Getting more into my other favorite characters and media has been a breath of fresh air. I frequently need to take a break from Harley Quinn because of all the reasons you said. It's not worth the let down anymore. I do hope I like Joker 2 and it doesn't end up being another Harley and Joker flop. That would be a shame unless someone personally enjoy it. I'm gonna see it but I can't say I'm not nervous. I've said it from the beginning, they should've just done Mad Love live action!

[@TheHorrorMiserMontyG]

I believe more people are looking forward to seeing Terrifier 3 than this one.

[@windowsVD]

Most average movie goers have never heard of Terrifier. The first two are very much cult films.

[@oli19827]

Most underrated comment on here

[@danw4490]

I have no interest in this film. I just came by to show support for this channel!

[@MrFrostien]

Let me guess its a trial drama that ends with Arthur in his cell and everything was just a product of his imagination and nothing from the first movie actually happened

[@mightguy3118]

It's just a lengthy boring courtroom drama and I heard at the end Harley breaks up with him because she realizes the joker isn't his true self then Arthur gets sent back to prison and stabbed to death by an inmate 💀

[@JoaqStan]

@@mightguy3118 it’s 100% legit.

[@yakuzajoe]

The Caped Crusader Harley dressed like a jester as a reference to Carl Jung. All of her victims were dressed the same way.

[@p.d.l7023]

I too enjoyed that version of Harley.

[@thewildcard83]

Only idiots would legitimately idolise the villain to the point they need a new movie to reinforce that you shouldn’t lol.

[@Seasonal-Shadow_4674]

@@thewildcard83 I mean, there are a lot of villains that are giving idolization or are constantly defended with their problems being overlooked, and so many characters and other balloons that are constantly demonized, and not given the same understanding (and I don’t mean justifying)

[@Musical_parks]

⁠@@Seasonal-Shadow_4674it’s sad that on one side you’ve got people with no understanding of nuance as they idealize the joker, missing the point that the story is a cautionary tale about the the consequences of a society that doesn’t have consideration for mental health, and then on the other side you’ve got people who ALSO have no understanding of nuance as they demonize the entire story, missing the exact same points that the other side misses. The two opposing sides have way more in common than they think; they both completely miss the point 😭

[@Seasonal-Shadow_4674]

@@Musical_parks Gen Z in a nutshell

[@ItachiUchiha-ut6xj]

I'm so tired of all these movies about villains which don't feature the heroes they should be fighting. Venom and Joker should be in Spider-Man and Batman movies.

[@IndecisiveJR]

Venom isn't so bad since he can stand on his own and rarely even runs into Spider-man after their initial hate for each other, Venom's creation, and when Venom is a straight up Villain. Joker really can't not for more than one movie at least

[@ItachiUchiha-ut6xj]

@@IndecisiveJR True but he still Needs Spidey to even become Venom in the first place. Also those Venom movies changed so much about the character it's not even worth watching. Hell, in those movies, the symbiote is called Venom and not Eddie and the symbiote together. That alone annoys me to no end.

[@Cameron_Levine]

So Joker 1 was a thought piece and Joker 2 is a like someone trying to imitate a thought piece but failing

[@mikewazooski5010]

A sequel should’ve never even been made

[@TigressKFP]

Says you who hasn't watched it yet

[@just_an_elli]

​@@TigressKFP The creators said it themselves. It's a fact, not an opinion

[@mightguy3118]

​@@TigressKFPYou know it doesn't need to be made if Todd Phillips originally wasn't gonna even make it☠️ and so many reviews saying it's a boring courtroom drama that adds nothing new and just talks about events from the first movie. Movie has no story to tell and no reason to exist

[@TigressKFP]

@@mightguy3118 So many reviews only from the people who saw it at the Venice Film Festival that is... When it gets released worldwide, that is when we are talking logistics here! I really want to like the sequel and keep open minded

[@TigressKFP]

@@just_an_elli What source dude?

[@theknightjester]

At least Deadpool and Wolverine delivered

[@just_an_elli]

I guess so

[@TravisW-o9q]

LFG!

[@JoeWedgwood-ik9zo]

Did it though? Apart from the cameos there was nothing to it. Even deadpool himself seemed toned down ..

[@mightguy3118]

@@JoeWedgwood-ik9zo I think it's overrated but it's about on the same level as the first 2 and pretty much did what it promised which is give the fans a Deadpool and wolverine team up and entertain you for 2 hours. Def not a masterpiece or saving the MCU but did it's job and made a ton of money

[@Nigel_Constantine75]

Kinda

[@PeterJosephRivera]

im still optimistic that NOTHING can be worse than that Jared Leto Joker...

[@just_an_elli]

What about the "recent" Suicide Squad Joker (I can't believe that game released over half a year ago)

[@TravisW-o9q]

Jared Leto morbius

[@VideoSmarts1]

@@just_an_ellidid anyone even play that game?

[@just_an_elli]

@@VideoSmarts1 Quite a few people actually. It didn't perform well, but that doesn’t mean people didn't buy it

[@andraw4002]

Well, it's easy to not be anything like Jared Leto Joker when you're not even attempting to even remotely adapt the source material.

[@JurassicRod]

I can't stand musicals so I was out as soon as they revealed J2 was a musical. I've had enough of Harley Quinn too so that doesn't interest me. A lot of people who went to see the first Joker movie expected it to be more traditionally comic booky. I suspect they won't come back for the sequel. It will be interesting to see if this film is anywhere near as successful as the first. I suspect not.

[@GrosvnerMcaffrey]

I just hate Lady Gag Gag

[@RedMoonSolitary]

Someone who usually loves musicals, the idea that this movie was one makes me cringe. Some things just should not be musicals. Lol

[@ratskigoblinski4963]

hrmm, "People who didn't get the Medication they needed" the Modern day Audience ?

[@Zaden_KT]

My first turn-off from the movie was when they announced it would be a musical. But when I keep hearing more and more about the film, I somehow got less and less interested

[@svetlanaandrasova6086]

Me too. Sequel makes no sense and musical even less

[@jspaingreene6350]

Wow! You are really speaking to my concerns and thoughts... I'm so torn. This is the most I've head about the film. I always avoid info before seeing things i care about, even remotely, and i want to give it a chance...i want to see a different, better, portrayal of Harley.

[@hope-cat4894]

I'm a bit skeptical because sometimes the media will give a film unnecessary bad publicity by attacking fans preemptively when the film actually is normal. It's like they can't help themselves. I hope the rumors are wrong because I loved the first film, and the critics who hated the first one just wanted to have a soapbox to lecture on.

[@BeezeeChutter]

There’s a second?!?!?! Hollywood really be milking every golden goose they get

[@oppenheimer6321]

Todd made this movie determined to piss off everyone who liked the first one.

[@TDM1138]

You know I’m not going to get into the specifics of this, but very odd how when a movie like Joker does well and people resonate with the character, it’s bad and the character’s actions should be condemned. Yet when the Acolyte pushes a very similar idea, pushing at least a morally gray message vs outright condemning the evil of the Sith, the people condemning Joker suddenly see the Acolyte as something to praise and messages we should push more.

[@just_an_elli]

A product's perceived quality goes a looooong way 😅

[@esyphillis101]

Partisan politics, friend. The people saying these things are predictable that way.

[@Seasonal-Shadow_4674]

@@TDM1138 I think this is why I like the idea of the Joker 2 questioning audiences on their double standards. Because people will condemn one thing and not condemn Another thing that could show a stance in hypocrisy.

[@victoriagarcia3078]

I am normally skeptical when it comes to movies doing these types of things, but for now I’m gonna refrain from casting my judgement until I see it for myself.

[@anastasiazhdanova1578]

The thing is - Arthur Fleck is not the Joker. He never was. They just used DC skin and DC elements to sell the movie. He is not Clown Prince of Crime , he’s not Batman’s sworn enemy, he’s not mastermind. He’s just mentally ill middle-aged loser guy who put makeup on

[@DavidMartinez-ce3lp]

Exactly, this movie would've been fine as it's own thing and not a DC movie.

[@Chronic41745]

@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp it’s a dc else worlds movie it’s already it’s own thing

[@DavidMartinez-ce3lp]

@@Chronic41745 notice how I also said "and not a DC movie."

[@chandlerburse]

@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp yes because you’re the total authority on what DC did and didn’t do.

[@Seasonal-Shadow_4674]

@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp there were so many other DC characters that deserve a tragic villain movie much more than the joker. And black Adam could have been that if not for Dwayne Johnson.

[@GrimdeathGriffin]

For years when a movie gets a fallowing after the fact they blame the audience for not being there.Instead of saying the truth which was these were not movies that anyone wanted to make and lucky people liked because lack of content.Alan Ritchson spoke about how no one wanted to do the CG Ninja Turtles movies years ago.

[@mikeburkhart8336]

Joker 2 is nothing but a pointless cash grsb from a desperate WB needing a hit comic book movie.

[@ereini0n]

Unplanned sequels are always a mistake

[@superg50zero32]

These so-called top reviewers are more than likely to trash the film on a personal level because the first one was so successful. On the other hand, I was worried that Todd Phillips would lecture the audience that everything the Joker did was bad so you shouldn't like him. We'll see, I will check it out in the theater but my expectations are pretty low especially since it's a musical.

[@meciocio]

you are gonna pay to watch a musical lol

[@owenharrison761]

Was it a good decision for the R-rated movie that made a billion dollars and won awards to have a sequel? Of course it was, that's obvious, especially if there is a good idea. Any executive who said otherwise should be ignored. Now, was it a good creative decision to make the sequel a musical with a different message? That's debatable. For now, let's wait, the audience after the pandemic is more unpredictable than before.

[@RacingSnails64]

Oh no... I don't want it to be bad... I loved the first movie, the emotions and themes it went through. I hate gun violence and revenge, but I loved Arthur as a character and was super grateful to hear we were getting a sequel. I think Gaga is a fantastic pick for Harley and want to see a new take on their relationship. I think "they hate the fans" is a really histrionic claim of bad movies, and think the sequel criticising Joker's actions isn't an inherently bad premise, but hearing Harley/Lee only loves Joker for his violence and not Arthur as a person is kind of heartbreaking. I wanted her to be another loner who got his struggle, and wanted to "let loose" with him with the clown costumes and try to make a statement to the people who refused to help them. Hearing she only loves Joker and not Arthur in his entirety feels super flat and boring, for her character and the film as a whole. Hearing it has a "wasted your time" ending as well also sucks. I just looked up the spoiler and honestly I'd need to see the execution of it to know if it's a good or bad idea. It doesn't sound all that ridiculous or far off in terms of plausiblity for the characters. I tend to always have a slightly different opinion to everyone else, so maybe I'll still find enjoyment in it. I'd hate to be disappointed by Folie a Deux :(

[@mightguy3118]

I heard if you liked the first one you won't like this one. It doesn't add anything new from the first one and is a just a boring courtroom drama

[@harleybtasfan90s]

They should've just not made this a musical and I think it would be waaaay better received. I'm excited for this. Bad reviews or not. But I do see what the problems are. Regardless, we can't judge till we watch so I'd just wait

[@PhilRiveraMedia]

I was never into the first movie because I knew it wasn't the actual Joker; it's just stealing the name to make money. I was somewhat surprised how well it did and always felt this was a very bad sign because Hollywood can't leave well enough alone and would want a sequel. But, a sequel can't really go anywhere. He can't fight Batman and interacting with anyone else from the rogue's gallery would be very odd. These aren't the actual characters and it shows. The more you use them, the more it will fall apart. They should have quit while they were ahead.

[@mightguy3118]

The fact it's just a courtroom drama that talks about the events from the first movie wtf is even the point of this movie? It's showing why this movie didn't need a sequel.

[@RedMoonSolitary]

Honestly Lady Gaga would probably make a good Harley Quinn but the writing for her in this movie was just not it

[@erroneous6947]

I’ve been saying since this was announced. This sequel only happens because the original joker was super popular with disenfranchised young men. That couldn’t stand. Hollywood hates men and masculinity. This movies only goal is to subvert the first film. Just my opinion.

[@dragonhitman1071]

Kinda don't wanna see it anymore. Was interested but if this what we're getting then I'm good. Not worth going outside.

[@arnoldc4394]

Joker 2 its a musical, thats all you need to know

[@greenentertainment3428]

0:10 Moonlight? If so, cool to see you talk about my favorite A24 film

[@megmurray8544]

I am looking forward to seeing Joker 2 because I was heavily involved in the fandom after the first one came out, and I know there are lots of people who misunderstood the first film and idolized him because I used to be one of them. The message of the first film is not super coherent, so I am looking forward to seeing the sequel’s response to audience reactions. The original Joker had a very negative effect on my mental health and I’ve had to work very hard on changing my relationship with it so I can still enjoy it. I personally will enjoy the social commentary on girls who get obsessed with serial killers, the sensationalism of true crime, and the deconstruction of the Joker.

[@aolegion35]

The movie lost most of its momentum with one word "musical." That killed a lot of interest. The first movie was going to be almost impossible to follow up anyway. Just because of the more realistic take on the character.

[@goatbrook9065]

Oh man, i am interested in seeing if this film is actually ass or not. I am nervous for me but the first joker probably should have just been 1 movie, it didnt need more films

[@BillLaBrie]

The first joker was enjoyed by the wrong people, so they need to fix that. It’s a religious thing for them.

[@wet-read]

I think it was enjoyed by the right people for the wrong, or at least inadequate, reasons as well.

[@Clambamthankyoumam]

Oh yeah no Joker 2 IS A HUGE MISTAKE but will still be better than Disney’s live action remake of Snow White!

[@rufus001]

Get to the point!

[@Malaclypse_the_Third]

On the Chani subject. I've ran into a bizarre amount of people who still don't understand the message in Dune's ending even though they made it more obvious than the book. Frank Herbert was supposedly a bit mithed that people kept missing the point of his book so I have some sympathy for the film trying to spell it out a bit more clearly.

[@sammysstopmotionoas2004]

The way you feel about Harley, is the exact same way I feel about Spider-Man and Mary Jane; Hollywood and the bosses at Marvel don't understand and hate them.

[@iraford5788]

The current ultimate Spiderman Marvel comic books are doing very well with spiderman and Mary Jane are understand them well.

[@sammysstopmotionoas2004]

​@iraford5788 yes.... but how long will it last? We need that kind of Spider-Man and Mary Jane in the movies and cartoons more so we can normalize the idea of an older Peter Parker that's married, and a Mary Jane who is a kind, compassionate and loyal person.

[@Seasonal-Shadow_4674]

@@sammysstopmotionoas2004 I mean, there is the spider verse movies

[@sammysstopmotionoas2004]

​@Seasonal-Shadow_4674 true but that is only one somewhat small part in a movie, I am talking like it being the center of an entire live action Spider-Man movie or a Peter B Parker and family cartoon, or even Spider-Man 98 if that happens.

[@Oliver.Verdant]

It was only meant to be a single Film. But it became successful and beloved. The creators resent how much Men resonate with Joker, so them making a spit in the face to that audience wouldn't surprise me.

[@Seasonal-Shadow_4674]

@@Oliver.Verdant I mean joker doesn’t need an empathy film to begin with

[@mightguy3118]

@@Seasonal-Shadow_4674 If they're going to make a joker origin at least make him comic accurate. This is absolutely nothing like the joker

[@ruslanchernikov650]

@@mightguy3118 The Joker not having one is the point of the character. His memories are always in flux, so his identity changes depending on what he remembers today. It's the same with Arthur.

[@Cheattoe]

I hope you’re wrong jester but we’ll see

[@ArtfulDodger566]

Phillips and Phoenix got high on thier own supply. I smell a box office b omb

[@ValyrianPrince]

It will flop

[@Mannam237]

I wouldn’t take these critics seriously after all they said the first film was that it wasn’t. The argument that the film hates its audience is weak due to the reasoning for it. Arthur was already portrayed as a false idol/symbol at the end of the first film so this just seems to be a progression of that idea. Todd Phillips has also denied the film is a response to critics of the first one.

[@Mannam237]

Again, it could be true but I’d wait till you see the film to take anything the critics say seriously.

[@samflood5631]

So, are you going to do any videos on your thoughts on Kite Man Hell Yeah?

[@beauscott4607]

Well, at least there will always be Kirby staying the same.

[@MoleyRusselsWart_]

People should wait and see it before judging and if you hate, cool. . It's like someone judging the shortfilm you're making without actually seeing it.

[@peterm.4355]

Personally I think things like that should be discussed after the actual release. As nervous as I am for this film, I want to watch it for myself and not judge it based on the reviews and other people's opinions.

[@jackburton1455]

I thought the first film was all in his head? Also, I'm really looking forward to your video on Malignant! Such a dumb yet hilarious and fun movie.

[@jairusjackson7799]

Well let's review. How well has hating on the audience worked out for studios so far...........Exactly

[@dornravlin]

I saw the first joker movie many times in the theater. It made me want to improve my life think more positively be the opposite of Arthur

[@DJJunkfoodJay]

Saw Joker once, barely remember it. Definitely not watching 2.

[@michaelm9211]

I thought the point of the first joker was that society is cruel to people considered outsiders, abnormal, or strange. And that if we don’t change, that men like Arthur could become heroes to the disenfranchised and downtrodden people of society.

[@DisabledDoll]

This obviously should have just been an art house styled take on Mad Love that’s all they had to do..🤦🏼‍♀️

[@Daneiladams555]

I’m not gonna see it after watching this thx

[@pluckstrummer]

Lady Gaga musical... that killed the hype for me. Joker works as standalone imo.

[@DanielBMaximoff]

''M and ends with a T'' Mortal Kombat? lol

[@hannamaryann0705]

Oh I thought it was Minecraft hahaha

[@Kane.JimLahey.]

This is going to be the best DC Film ever made. Best version of Joker & Harley Quinn. This is how all DC movies should be. Some folks just have it twisted, don't get it twisted holmes. I hope when it comes out folks will recognize that it's the best DC movie yet, an show some respect for the film.

[@Christian_Ada1]

We have to stop kidding ourselves had the first one not been titled the joker and just titled Arthur it would not have made the billion dollars in the box office because that film was five previous films welded into that one with the title joker DC comics tagged on it It was neither new fresh or original It was bland AF

[@crakhaed]

Damn, maybe it was all a dream in the end? That would waste a lot of people's time 🤔

[@mightguy3118]

For someone to say a movie felt like it was bad on purpose and made to troll fans is wild lmao. But who watches a joker movie for a boring courtroom drama that literally only talks about events from the first movie and adds nothing new 💀

[@alexmeyers2274]

Remember oscars 2024 is best year ever i seen live stream watching it and okay through jimmy kimmel jokes

[@grantmiller6570]

I think we are all tired of not getting what we want from our favourite characters, whoever they may be, DC, marvel or anything else.

[@TheGlobalForce]

There was ZERO point in creating a sequel 😂

[@mightguy3118]

💰

[@V4Now]

The first film did point the finger at the audience to, albeit more subtle. Pissubly this film is doubling down

[@EternityKingdomsHeadHoncho]

You know what would’ve made this great? If they did it like All That Jazz. Would’ve fit right in with the distorted worldview of Mr. Fleck and how he drags Miss Quinzel into it…

[@Sanderus]

Thank you for the warning. I will check the ending before investing my time and money in this film. If it ends with a variation of "it was all a dream" nonsense I am out.

[@blazingmonolith4323]

Let me guess...it was a pretentious mess?

[@oscarmauricioibietamoreno7634]

I must admit I'm somewhat happy about the ending because at least is not what I feared, that Harley was going to be an imaginary GF like Domino in the first film.

[@thomasbobo9967]

All I have to say about anarchist Harley is: Paint the Town Blue, Riots All Around You!

[@cttommy73]

The first film was meh. I don't know why people act like it was better than it was. As for the second movie, if it does go down the fan bashing move, it's not surprising. Have you seen the actor and people involved with the movie and have you seen what they said? Not surprising.

[@tonygriego6382]

If you're still emotionally invested in an IP that is corporately owned, you have to prepare yourself for the inevitability that it will eventually suck. And suck hard.

[@pinehawk9600]

Never gonna see it... Ty Hollywood

[@qui-gonrick7002]

I liked the first movie. A musical sequel was not what I was expecting. Nonetheless, it could still be good. However, the trailer didn't do anything for me. I'll see what others have to say before seeing it. So, yeah, I think this is definitely an uphill battle for the studio.

[@blairbrown4812]

I wouldn't worry about it. Business will pick up in the third movie when Batman makes his inevitable appearance.

[@mightguy3118]

What 3rd movie? There won't be a 3rd movie ☠️ and Batman isn't showing up. He's a child. This was meant to be it's own thing

[@graylykan2739]

Well, there goes my excitement and hope for this film. Hearing that it might be boring, that it might minimize Harley Quinn's existence despite hyping her up in the marketing, and how much it might hold our hands and claim that we idolized Joker in the first film when that was NOT the case, are just disappointing. I saw the first Joker movie and really enjoyed it. As someone who was officially diagnosed with ADHD last year, I understand that its a cautionary tale about what can happen if society fails the mentally-ill, the outcasts, the homeless, and even the workers who are trying to help improve society. Even back when I first saw it in either 2020 or 2021, I never saw Joker as someone to idolize and root for. So to hear they might be actually catering to the idiots running the mainstream media and the news, even using his followers and Harley as stand-ins, is just disappointing.

[@princessmarlena1359]

“Joker: Foddio-Doh” 🃏

[@chris_player2995]

in 2019 I said "this doesnt need a sequel this is too good" 2024 : ..

[@rosesinthe13thhour]

It should have stayed as a stand alone film and done because they ruined it once again by making a sequel. I was so excited when I saw the trailer stop but then I got disappointed when I saw that Harley was just another patient. Lady Gaga was perfect for the role especially if they portrayed the real Harley as a psychiatrist that joker toyed with her mind made her fall so madly in love with him that she goes off the deep end for him. She isn't suppose to already be crazy and just join him.