Jon as Azor Ahai - ADWD Jon XII read-through - A Song of Ice and Fire - Game of Thrones

Jon’s Azor Ahai dream foreshadows Jon as Azor Ahai reborn, and the action that comes in the rest of the chapter spells out what that will MEAN for Jon. Corn King, Jon Snow.
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title image used "Azor Ahai Jon Snow" by June Page

[@GreyWasteTim]

"Born amidst salt and smoke'" "The bones remember" What lays at the Heart of Winter? The frozen Weirwood of which you spoke. And beneath it, under the snow and earth, wrapped up in its roots, a skeleton - the remains of Azor Ahai/Night's King. And his bones will need to be salted and burned. Possibly the entire tree - like wiping the main CPU of the WW net - will need to be salted and burned. But a common idea in folklore about exorcising a malignant spirit is to salt and burn the bones of the body it belonged to.

[@ContactsNfilters]

The Winchesters are headed that way with a bag of salt and a fresh lighter!

[@GreyWasteTim]

Of all the chapters to read without me it had to be the one with Morna White Mask, Jon's white masked foil to Dany's Quaithe

[@samwyleblackwood4595]

Morna the White Mask is a moon. She takes her mask off and kisses Jon’s hand. The mask coming off is the moon falling, kissing his hand is the moon hitting the earth. She is both male and female to give her some dragon symbolism as well to sure up the meteor symbolism. She might even represent the ice moon getting hit. Just my take. 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@Slechy_Lesh]

Morna said I am your woman Jon, or your man, as you wish. And this is soon after Tormund implies the three women to have penisses. So I think something specific is going on here. In and of itself. Like there's a lot of sex images, symbolic or actual rape, fertility god stuff. Septon Moon is very Garth the Green it's true. But I wonder if Jon's dead body will be invaded by a woman? Shoutout to Minty for that!

[@samwyleblackwood4595]

You're definitely right about the whole chapter/scene having a lot more going on. I'm just fixated on Morna. lol

[@Slechy_Lesh]

@@samwyleblackwood4595 Yeah, that's great! Me too I love the whole Two-Spirit shamanic thing. And maybe she is like Visenya and Rhaenys - a fire moon and an ice moon

[@mikeboi1587]

I'm pissed I missed the stream, I literally came up with a whole Jon Snow/Ahzor Ahai theory recently. Stellar stream as always!!!

[@DavidLightbringer]

feel free to leave your thoughts here!

[@mikeboi1587]

Basically that the undead element is currently a specific part of connecting to the Weirwood net. What happened to Jon possibly ritualistically connects him/someone/Azor Ahai( but it is a combination of him & Nissa Nissa), a similar thing could have happened to Coldhands & is kind of happening to Bloodraven & possibly even Bran? The undead aspect being a pervasive part of connecting to a nefariously corrupted system & was achieved through dark acts(i.e. possibly Hordor for Bran, Jon through himself & Ygritte). It has to connect to something to exist, but everything has turned sideways, Azor Ahai returning could be symbolic prophecy for someone/people who amend this one day but possibly have to go through it to do so. It was just putting together thoughts I know had been covered.

[@Okcucumber]

3:05:07 - "No, it has only just begun" is an eerie parallel with Ned at Jon’s birth. Arthur Dayne "now it begins" and Ned “no - now it ends”

[@DavidLightbringer]

great call

[@annasanchez5959]

You’re always sayin “don’t get me started about the ai stuff”, but every time you bring it up I feel like telling you to keep it up, it can’t be said enough! Soulless an apt description.

[@natedavis1005]

Great stream! There was an “other” that was missed. When tormund says he wants to “look at what’s on t’other side of all that ice.” I read this as a couple of things foreshadowing the others crossing the wall in the coming books and then escaping from the frozen weird wood net they are trapped in.

[@moljabee]

Glad for Michael Talks About Stuff and his Wall Theory being mentioned here!

[@darthskele]

3:15:00 great. Now I want undead sharks in the final books. Thanks David

[@vcmedia1895]

Love you Bro. Love the knowledge you have and the respect you show to others even when they don’t approach in a respectable way. And you know your hip hop. Salute!

[@GeroldGarthcia]

Great work Dave

[@Slechy_Lesh]

Tim and David already outlined a bit more David's answer to my question in this video in the Ironborn Heraldry video, with House Wynch, which starts at 2:30:35 there

[@kimberlyduran3949]

From Jon's Azor Ahai dream, to the symbolism of the Others, to dead things in the woods, dead things in the water. What a packed chapter! Thanks for the re-through Dave 🖤

[@permiebird937]

Excellent stream!

[@KestreltheWeirseer]

Interesting how the treasures from the wildlings echo the Great Empire of the Dawn symbolism. Jade and Pearl.

[@DavidLightbringer]

there's some crazy stuff in there tbh I didn't want to get lost

[@moiz85]

'That's it then.' 'No, it has only just begun.' Sounds very tower of joy fever dream

[@adamritchie3600]

Thanks for another awesome stream.

[@violetdragon4474]

Really enjoyed this read through. Thank you for your thoughts.

[@ThommyofThenn]

It's funny, I had just re-read this chapter a few weeks ago because I randomly grab one of them and open to a random page sometimes. Just to examine things I missed and the timing for this stream was perfect because I was reflecting on some of these things we talked about here

[@MantisToboggan2291]

I'm so sorry I've missed your livestreams this year, I'm so happy you hit 100K subs, congratulations! I'm watching this now, but on the topic of AA, I wanted to toss out a nugget that popped up in my head the other day. It is highly unlikely that Arya Stark could be AA reborn, but I do want to toss out a little bit of fodder for thought-the whole "reborn amidst salt and smoke," Arya finds passage to Braavos at Saltpans, after it has been sacked and burned by the remnants of the Brave Companions (with Rorge wearing Sandor Clegane's helm). Salt (Saltpans) and smoke (town is burned). Arya is reborn through her journey to Braavos, where she literally takes a new name (Mercy). Like I said, it is a stretch, but I loved the alternative idea of how the show's Night King could have died (Arya with Bran's Face) and, as I have said before, technically Arya is a princess. Anyways, I'll be here next week, again, congratulations, I'm so happy you hit 100K!

[@Slechy_Lesh]

It's not a stretch - this is exactly the kind of thing David talks about. Symbolic parallels! Various characters, Houses, major and minor, and place names reinforce other ideas going on in the story. Good catch!

[@jenniferarmstrong8879]

Company of the Cat just put out a great video on the role salt has played in mythology and in ASOIAF. The title is about whether the wall is made of ice, but it goes much deeper than that. Totally worth a watch

[@DavidLightbringer]

I am super not a fan of that channels theories. And they hate my theories too but hey if you find them entertaining go for it I suppose

[@DavidLightbringer]

she doesn't believe the Deep Ones are real though, and I can't abide such heresy hahaha

[@BudravenOG]

She cites your theories sometimes. So I wouldn't say "hate".

[@Jermrants]

Ur absolutely right about the 30 second music ngl 😂😅 I don’t think id enjoy it as much as I do if I kept it on repeat Since whenever it Appears I’m just jamming out in my room Surrounded by a ton of smoke, definitely my favourite KZbinr-made music it’s so good🔥

[@nagamata]

This is my 2nd (and not the last) entreaty for a Grass Candle t-shirt. I can see it now, black t, ethereal wisps of smoke trailing gently into the darkness from a mystical all-seeing spliff. That’s magic right there. It is said that the grass candles are burning in the house of Lightbringer, that have burned for hundred years. Let it be so 🙏🏼

[@ThommyofThenn]

this one was a *B a n g e r* of a stream. thanks again for all the great discussion and funny jokes!

[@greygreensentinel]

Oh wow Jon Snow I love that character and his symbolism almost as much as I love liking videos and commenting on them! ❤️‍🔥

[@soapywoodswitch]

Beric is one of my fav characters, thanks for another great stream and congratulations on the 100K!

[@Darksun93]

Nice stream. Like the possible dany flint and night queen connection.

[@youseftheeb424]

Thank you brother! Your content is always informative and relatable! Bought the 5 book set, just need to start reading them! ✌️✌️🍉🍉

[@leslieshE]

6:00 Rhllor desperately trying to make Mel understand Jon is Azor Ahai "😫", probably pulling his hair as she goes "I want to see AA, why does he only show me Snow ? 🤔"

[@DavidLightbringer]

yes, why? lol

[@user-kj3lc1km3l]

​@@DavidLightbringer i hate how game of thrones fans are the most stupid fans in the whole damn fanfictions it was hinted a lot of times f it not hinted but shown a lot of times the song ofe ice and fire red bleeding star and smoke and salt in his death in the books and messendre constent dreams about snow being azor ahai and jon snow himself suprised by a dream that he had a burning sword in his arm and he was suprised by his superhuman feats in the books because only jon snow and the mountain that can peform freakish strength feats not arya who use stealth or daeghnyries who use magic and dragons and also jon snow who had the worst start than every azor ahai candidate and he also sacrificed two of his lovers like yegrite and danny who have kings blood in the series just like the prophecies sorry for my english

[@noahh2338]

Another banger stream, more new ideas, more great content to play video games and praise garth to! 👍👍

[@Quirkus23]

Something I just realized is this chapter has call outs for all the Huzhor Amai stuff from Sarnor. From the wiki According to legend, he was born of the last of the Fisher Queens and took to wife the daughters of the greatest lords and kings of the Gipps, the Cymmeri, and the Zoqora. His Zoqora wife drove his chariot, and his Cymmeri wife made his armor. He also wore about his shoulders a great cloak made from the pelt of a king of the Hairy Men. So we have the bone chariots the wildlings from the frozen shore use. We have Jon's armor of black ice featured in the beginning of the chapter and most notably imo the Gipps. According to legend, the daughter of their greatest ruler was married by Huzhor Amai, bringing the Gipps under his rule.[1] The Gipps were long-legged and wore lime-stiffened hair; in war they carried wicker shields We have mentions of some of the wildlings with wicker shields and this. "Gerrick’s daughters shared her same flame-red hair, though hers had been a tangle of curls and theirs hung long and straight." So Yiggrite's was the firey tangles and curls and is a NN figure but these wildlings (others) have theirs long and straight. Creating the juxtaposition between NN and Night's Queen. This all just goes to further the Jon AA/NK connections.

[@polytrashed]

51:27 Watching all the chat comments before seeing him read the perfectly timed “David ‘John Connor’ Lightbringer” and give everybody a final admonition not to discuss AI in chat legitimately had me in stitches. Like, someone in another room heard my raucous guffaws and called out asking if I was ok 😂🤣🤣 EDIT-Riddle of Context: I’m an 🍎🥧

[@queenxx1690]

Finally he looked north. He saw the Wall shining like blue crystal, and his bastard brother Jon sleeping alone in a cold bed, his skin growing pale and hard as the memory of all warmth fled from him. And he looked past the Wall, past endless forests cloaked in snow, past the frozen shore and the great blue-white rivers of ice and the dead plains where nothing grew or lived. North and north and north he looked, to the curtain of light at the end of the world, and then beyond that curtain. He looked deep into the heart of winter, and then he cried out, afraid, and the heat of his tears burned on his cheeks. Now you know, the crow whispered as it sat on his shoulder. Now you know why you must live. "Why?" Bran said, not understanding, falling, falling. Because winter is coming. (Bran III, AGOT) You can't be the Lord of Winterfell, you're bastard-born, he heard Robb say again. And the stone kings were growling at him with granite tongues. You do not belong here. This is not your place. When Jon closed his eyes he saw the heart tree, with its pale limbs, red leaves, and solemn face. The weirwood was the heart of Winterfell, Lord Eddard always said . . . but to save the castle Jon would have to tear that heart up by its ancient roots, and feed it to the red woman's hungry fire god. I have no right, he thought. Winterfell belongs to the old gods. (Jon XII, ASOS)

[@wynterashara5160]

Another great stream!!

[@jeffreybennett177]

Gods I hope we see Jon in Valyrian armor wielding dawn!!!😮😮

[@anorangetabby]

DEEP ONES VIDEO coming soon to the best ASOIAF channel on KZbin! Notifications on mythheads! 🐡🦈

[@DiegoNovello86]

Very good video! Thanks for that

[@Quirkus23]

Eastwatch is also implies watching for the sun rise as the east is where the sun rises, geotd is in the East ect. So the others go to the shadow tower while the Night's Watch goes await the dawn/ go to the sunny side ie the greenlands.

[@bebethebard]

Amazing stream, so full of symbolism. Now I’ve very interested in different themes of gender or gender symbolism within the magic.

[@ThommyofThenn]

That could be an amazing stream topic!

[@Slechy_Lesh]

Did you guys see quircus's comment above? Alchemy and gender!

[@Slechy_Lesh]

@Quirkus23

[@dirtysheepdog]

Shocked this stream doesn’t have more views yet. Hopefully it didn’t get axed by the algorithm …

[@minty.maelstrom]

❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️

[@Brellowcrop]

How the fuck is Dany too weak to be Azor Ahai? We dont even know if the job entails physical strength anyway. Plus, she's literally got dragons. Strength doesn't necessarily win wars. Strategy and intelligence does. Im sure there is a metaphysical aspect to Azor Ahai, which Dany has hands down, plus, well, fucking dragons, mate

[@Ashbrash1998]

My tin hat theory is that Dany is the ptwp, and that neither of them are Azor Ahai. Rhaegar was, and Jon is his Lightbringer but he still has the ties to AA. It's why we haven't heard any specifics of how the Long Night was beaten but we got a long bit telling us about how he made swords (Aegon and Rhaenys?) for many days and nights and that it required a sacrifice from his wife Nissa Nissa (Lyanna). It would also go with the idea of prophecies never working as promised and imagine you have a man who saves the world from doom except the second time he dies before anything happens?

[@val882]

About the Azor Ahai symbolisms i have noticed two things that i dont know if you have mentioned yet though im sure you already know what they are. 1)In HOTD episode 10 Jace makes a "mistake" and says that aegon killed the trees and Rhaenyra sweetly corrrects him and we take it kinda like a joke but its not if all you say about azor(who is basically an ancestor to targs)harming the trees is true. 2)The blackwoods accuse the Brackens of poisoning their weerwood tree.The blackwoods have a weirdwood sigil and the brackens a very red sigil which would suit well with what you have said about the color red being tied to azor ahai being either the red swor of heros or daemons blood dragon or in this case Brackens red horse. Thats it im just happy that due to your videos i can see some symbolism myself 😆 Have a nice day David.❤

[@DavidLightbringer]

yeah the Bracken one I have found and you got that exactly right. Bittersteel's sigil is a fiery dragon horse, so even better. and he hates the Blackwoods most of all. Good catch on the HotD thing, Ryan knows the material well so he might have intended that

[@Slechy_Lesh]

Also the Stallion Who Mounts the World, who rises into the sky after Drogo's funeral pyre

[@Slechy_Lesh]

The wooden ear is probably also a reference to BR's information gathering. And the tall wildling with a baby's face! Well that's a vote in favour of your Secrets of the White Tree theory

[@Slechy_Lesh]

'forged in the fires of Old Valyria' makes me think of 'forged in the fires of hell' - that's a phrase from somewhere right?

[@soxpeewee]

Random thought: There are a bunch if unexplored Stark crypts lower down that are supposedly "collapsed." What do you wanna bet there are Valyarian steel swords guarding the kings of winter? Sorry if this was already said. Edit; it's also funny that John is literally a wolf in sheep's clothing

[@austinmassie9891]

At 51:04, Cleo is trying to read along with you in the background. "As Mormont's raven muttered across the room."..."TUT TUT"

[@icy_skywalker631]

In the event danny does need an actual sword to be azor ahai. Her family has some famous ancestral swords, blackfyre and or dark sister, and she could certianly get her hands on either. Dark sister disappeared at summerhall, and danny's brother was born at summerhall. I wonder if dark sister will come into danny's possession in a similar way to the dragon eggs.

[@TheThrashingBurton]

Then she would have to spend years learning how to wield a sword. I think it is more so Jon being one form, bringing the long seasons and the others to a final point. The ultimate end. Dani is probably stabilising the realm. Think of the Tri-Force, Euron is the outlier, Ganondorf.

[@icy_skywalker631]

@@TheThrashingBurton My thinking was if danny is using a sword it would be a spur of the moment thing similar to Mary and eowyn stabbing the witch king in LOTR.

[@jorahtheexplorer3262]

People are only "down" on Jon because you could replace TV Jon with a cardboard cutout and no one would notice the difference

[@johnbuxton4484]

Another interesting thought about how both the wildlings and Kings guard who are paralleled as others, the free folk don't kneel to John yet Arthur Dwayne and company's "knees do not bend easily"

[@nikkishears6402]

"Jon has not woken dragons" Jon is the dragon, but doesn't know it yet. When he finds out he is actually a Targaryen, not a Stark, this will be symbolic of a dragon waking from stone. It's probably tied into the resurrection of Jon, but it's already established without it. We can also establish him as Azor Ahi birth among salt and smoke. Born under a bleeding star. Jon's birth coincided with the death in battle of his guardian, Ser Arthur Dayne, whose sword was made from a fallen star. Alternatively, Jon died and reborn. In the show he's reborn in front of Davos and Melissandre. Davos is a perfect symbol of both salt and smoke. His last name being Seaworth, representing the salt from the sea, and smoke, represented by Davos surviving the Wildfire of the Battle of Blackwater Bay. Of course Melissandre is obviously a symbol to represent smoke. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

[@queenxx1690]

Azor Ahai is Born Beneath A Bleeding Star and Jon Snow is born beneath Beeding Stark

[@squisherking]

On your musing about Toregg. I was thinking maybe it can read Tor Ygg. Tor meaning door/gateway and Ygg, the world tree and inspiration for the weirwoods. The gateway to an other world.

[@DavidLightbringer]

ah okay that makes more sense

[@Philographicks]

A dozen pelting themselves with snow. Pelt - animal - taking an animal skin - skinchangers. A dozen of them warging with Snow, a thirteenth, the last hero.

[@DavidLightbringer]

💯

[@tracymetherell8744]

Please remember to leave a LIKE AND A COMMENT to help support David! SUBSCRIBE! Let’s help support some of the very best ASOIAF content on the internet!

[@Jonjzi]

I had a thought recently that Blood Raven might believe (or want to make others believe) that Jon is Azor Ahai. He might have sent the image of Jon to Mel to plant the fulfillment of prophecy in her head. Along that same thought, I believe Amon might have been able to potentially counsel Jon in a way that would have protected him from his short-sighed mistakes. Maybe Blood Raven influenced the decision to send Amon away, so as to allow Jon to die intentionally.

[@KestreltheWeirseer]

“I mean to be the last one through the ice. I will join you at the feast.” I wonder if there’s something here about joining them in death, as it seems that many beliefs in Westeros liken feasting with family or entities with an afterlife. Ex. - feasting in the watery halls.

[@Gnardonic]

The egg is symbolism for the magnetic field, just like a TORus....im telling you, Dave, George is putting metaphysics into his stories because the metaphysics have a mythological meaning and purpose. Its all different sorts of archetypal marriage coming together and breaking apart and coming together again in different fractal sizes. Its all one big mosaic, one big magnetic EGG, ya egghead Thx for crackin eggs of wisdom and for yo big eggnoggin. Ever notice how many egg jokes are in always sunny in philadelphia? Eggs are hilarious too

[@martinkrog5943]

"A bunch of Berics from the barracks" Hehe, that reminds me of that vault 108 in Fallout 3, the one with all the Gary clones :D Also checked the number 998(as in the 998 Lord Commander) didn't really find anything, but this: Olaf Tryggvason sent a Saxon missionary, Þangbrandr, to Iceland. Many Icelanders were angered by Þangbrandr's proselytising, and he was outlawed after killing several poets who insulted him. Animosity between Christians and pagans on the island grew, and at the Althing in 998 both sides blasphemed each other's gods In an attempt to preserve unity, at the Althing in 999, an agreement was reached that the Icelandic law would be based on Christian principles, albeit with concessions to the pagan community. Private, albeit not public, pagan sacrifices and rites were to remain legal Hmmm. It's reaching But 'Althings' are indeed exactly the same thing as when The Nightswatch votes for another Commander ...Idunno Anyway, keep up the good work :) Skål, år og fred

[@Slechy_Lesh]

I think the poets, or skalds, are analogous to minstrels - followers of the moon goddess, according to Barbara G Walker's Women's Encyclopedia of Myths and Secrets. These guys are always angering people! They seem like fools who are the only ones in court who can tell the king the truth to his face. Walker speaks of them as the last gasp of pagan culture, making fun of the priesthood and the whole new way of things the Christians were bringing in.

[@Slechy_Lesh]

There is a similar cultural tension between the Wildlings and the southerners

[@jt5765]

I don't think GRRM has read anywhere near the amount of mythology that gets suggested sometimes. Especially not the niche stuff like Carribean as mentioned early in this stream. I think it far more likely that he took some inspiration from his contemporaries. I definitely see very big similarities between Jon Snow & FitzChivalry Farseer from Robin Hobbs Realm of the Elderlings series. Ghost & Nighteyes strike me as being similar & different in interesting ways too. Just waiting on TWOW to confirm whether GRRM has taken inspiration regarding resurrection & its effects/recovery period.

[@denniskeith2006]

Thank you this was awesome

[@KaritKtana]

11:03 - "... drawn by teams of dogs as big as ponies" has the SAME ring to it as Old Nan's "stalking him with packs of pale white spiders big as hounds." The spiders are as big as hounds, hounds as big as ponies => spiders as horses?

[@DavidLightbringer]

they have to be yeah

[@nagamata]

I strongly feel that the Wall was made with ice dragons. I think it reinforces the idea of it having magical origins as it strikingly parallels the Five Forts, which were likely constructed using dragon fire. I don’t think GRRM would have mentioned ice dragons in the canon at all if he wasn’t willing to flesh it out. Grey Waste Tim’s ideas that there might be something waiting at the heart of winter might also be wedded with another potential parallel to the Dragonbone Chair (MS&T), which I won’t spoil, but iykyk. I couldn’t think of a more epic climax to close out the fantasty action/adventure side of the story than a battle of ice and fire in the sky. It still leaves room for anything else GRRM might need to wrap up

[@a6ay9anda]

Hey I just thought about this but thought you might find it interesting. I think the sword in the prophecy is a man anatomy reference, and the stabbing through the heart is them falling in love and having a child. This child is what I think ended the long night by being given over to the white walkers.

[@Matatabi6]

Given that George has admitted the anarchy from English history is the inspiration for hotd. I think a historical analysis of the civil war between empress Matilda and king Stephen would be amazing

[@Slechy_Lesh]

Close your drawers, lock up your microphones, hide your wires, Cleo is here! Honestly I didn't notice her yelling in the background until you mentioned it, don't worry;) @DavidLightbringer

[@Cookie_chris]

DO NOT MISS THIS STREAM Hot news and reveals in this stream, @David Lightbringer love your take on the creation of the others at the nightfort and completely agree its something along those lines, still think maybe someone is isolated within the black gate weirwood tasked with guarding that passage, personally i think the heart of winter is more likely to be an ice moon meteor site than a weirwood site. Also did azor ahai become possessed when using meteor magic (lovecraft entity) then infect the weirwood net thus creating the need for the severance we see in the present weirwood net

[@ragnarlothbrok8755]

At 3:08:00 with the 12 men pelting eachother with snow. You said whenever 12 men plus 1 are mentioned its a symbol of the last hero. I think you missed that the plus one here is Snow as in Jon Snow. 12 men pelting eachother, WITH Jon Snow.

[@mercedescreates]

I'm excited for this!

[@Quirkus23]

If the wall is like an ice dragon (belly) then if the comet hits the wall it's like that one story of AA. When he thrust the sword through the belly of the beast, its blood began to boil. Smoke and steam poured from its mouth, its eyes melted and dribbled down its cheeks, and its body burst into flame." A Dance with Dragons - Jon III The comet stabs the ice dragons belly (the wall) like Lightbringer stabs the monster. The eyes melting and dribbling down the cheeks are like the tears/comets and it burst into flames, like the Weirwoods (and the world at large when the comets hit) There is also the scene of Donal Noye (the Smith so AA) fighting a giant (NN/Weirwoods) in the tunnel (belly) of the ice dragon. They both end up dead inside the belly like Night's King and Queen inside the Weirwoods. If AA is the Smith that makes him like the hammer (the comet) and that would make NN the anvil (the world/world tree) The hammer uses the anvil to shape the sword like AA uses the comet to shape the world in his ideal.

[@DavidLightbringer]

that's very well phrases, thank you!

[@Quirkus23]

@@DavidLightbringer No problem. I started thinking about all this when you asked about Bran and the anvil idea in the Hodor stream. There seems to be a whole thing with Weirwoods as forges and making people by putting souls in bodies (skins). I've been gathering quotes but there is a lot. Back in the Undying stream you talked about the Weirwoods/ebony doors and I thought of Tobho Motts forge and have been thinking about this ever sense. Great stream.

[@Slechy_Lesh]

I'd love to see the quotes you gathered!

[@Quirkus23]

@@Slechy_Lesh are you in the discord? That's probably where I will share the write up once I'm finished.

[@Zach-sx8cm]

Close the drawers! And all I can think is "hold the door!" Lol. Did you name Cleo after miss Cleo the tarot reader from the commercial?

[@DavidLightbringer]

no but I do think of Miss Cleo aometimes

[@Slechy_Lesh]

2:40:00 Tower of Joy

[@alyswesthill3562]

Triple goddess or three graces from greek mythology where they're the 3 daughters of Zeus

[@Henbot]

Got the calendar but hadn’t thought about it. No way GRRM would miss that

[@carloshenrique6406]

2:18:58 what if Jon wake up as a wight, and his objective is to kill Gilly's baby, the baby that was promised to the others, his spirit inside Ghost, and his dead body trying to kill the baby I could see Jon (Ghost) trying to stop himself, maybe that's the way that Ghost dies, and Jon spirit goes into the WWNET

[@ReviewerGarcia-vz2du]

Im probably way late on this but when you mention that Azor Ahai may have directly or indirectly banished the Thera from the Wier net I recall the line from the Bloodstone emperor legend where he “cast down the true gods to worship a black stone from the sky. And I understand better the Children’s reverence for these trees beyond environmental. They were once Gods alive and that’s why the Children bury their dead amoung the roots and eventually learned how to pass this worship to the first men. Maybe they await the Wierwoods reawakkening with the help of the Starks like thier own prophecy not yet known to us.

[@ReviewerGarcia-vz2du]

I also think the Starj-Targaeryan blending was long overdue and Howlan Reed was specifically allowed onto the Isle of Faces to receive instructions on accomplishing this necessary union.

[@Quirkus23]

Arrow shafts shoot upward (axis symbol) burning with sacred fire that ignite the scarecrows (dead) sending them hurtling off the wall like the burning brand (similar to the moon door or the antler men and the 3 whores casting out people) very interesting stuff. It's like the burning Weirwoods are being used to make the burning men out of the dead. So does a frozen Weirwood make icey men?

[@Slechy_Lesh]

@DavidLightbringer When you read about the others clinging to the trees and coming out - as part of the mist - my wife and I realised that this is reinforced by this phenomenon you noticed - all the lower case 'others'. People have criticised you as reaching on this, but particularly in this chapter we can see it's a thing. The critics have failed to see the Others all around them! (Tormund doesn't) This writing technique of - is George referencing them? Or not? Is clearly building up the sense in the story that the Others are always 'at our heels'... but not. Surrounding us - and also maybe not even there?

[@Slechy_Lesh]

TLDR; the unknown is the most powerful kind of fear. George makes the Others part and parcel with this unknowable-ness, this ambiguous materiality, real or fairy story? by continually sort-of.. not-really.. referencing them! with the commonplace word 'others' (basically the same word but he has made it distinct with his myth-weaving)! The meaning of the writing itself has an uncertain-ness, like the beings it conjures into being! Uncanny valley. What could be scarier than something that seems graspable - in both senses of materiality and *reality* - but also not?

[@DavidLightbringer]

haha yeah you're right, the writing technique does very much add to the ambiance of what Tormund is saying about the Others, great call

[@AshtheGreenMan]

Praise Garth

[@queenpersephone9685]

Winds of Winter needs be blowing soon. I need some answers dang it! 😂😂

[@Ashbrash1998]

I've always had beliefs that Jon is tied to Azor Ahai, though my tin hat theory was that he was Lightbringer not the savior. Rhaegar was really supposed to be but he died too soon and like Dany with the Stallion one, the phrophecy moved and changed.

[@Slechy_Lesh]

To me lightbringer/good side of Azor Ahai is a savior and that's it basically. So what are you saying when you say he is lightbringer?

[@robertmanley4828]

I don't know if look at old comments but Harle the Huntsman! Have you heard of the Huntsman spider. A species of spider that's indigenous to Australia. They can grow very large and actually hunt their prey and don't spin a Web but are harmless to humans but their size and spidery nature can still be very frightening when you see one on your bedroom wall. Martin might be aware of this species because this species was used as extras in the movie Arachnophobia. You kept saying Huntsman and it was ringing in my ears with the symbolism to ice spiders...

[@rivermistfae]

2:34:57 Sacrificing the white bull to get thru the door of death.

[@KestreltheWeirseer]

Hmm. Was Varamyr’s body raised as a wight after his consciousness went into One Eye? This could give us a clue about the required level of consciousness of a person/animal once they become a wight, or needed in order to become a wight. Are they just empty shells animated / puppeteer by the Others, or is it a hive mind including some semblance of memory as indicated by the wight Brothers who attacked Mormont?

[@DavidLightbringer]

it's not said that it is, no. We can only wonder... but I tend to think so, Varamyr no longer had a connection to his body. For Jon to repossess his body from the Others, he will need help

[@xxfaerietalesxx]

That’s why the DOOM was in all caps in the books

[@saulgoodman3620]

To the relevance of Jon being the 998th Lord Commander: the Cross Sum of 998 is 26. 26 is two times 13. Jon is the second 13th Lord Commander. Aka the Night King aka the Last Hero aka Azor Ahai?

[@Henbot]

Well, in Elden Ring you have Queen Marika who also is King Radagon. Maybe Nissa Nissa is two beings, with second being the corpse queen after she was stabbed

[@jt5765]

Shout out to all my fellow The Wheel of Time enjoyers! Lews Therin Telamon FTW 😎

[@teemuhakkarainen7728]

It is known that Rayder as a name refers to both Tolkien's Straider (St. Raider = holy rider) and a Germanic name that refers to a baby's counselor and protective hand so that the baby will grow up to be the voice of reason, a skilled leader and develop a comforting spirit. Mance refers to a Bengali word that can be translated as men at work or at war. And in French man ce means this man. So the name Mance Rayder can be understood in the sense that this man is the hand that protects the baby, a task that Crown Prince Rhaegar Targaryen gave to the commander of the Kingsguard, Arthur Dayne, Sword of the Morning. Aragorn, on the other hand, was in Tolkien's story the protector of its protagonist Frodo, just as Arthur is the protector of the rightful king's heir.

[@Slechy_Lesh]

Wondering if Jon's dead body will be invaded by a woman, I did think of Val - she has to do something. But I feel like that would be going off track too much, bordering on a general criticism of women. Melisandre's controversial nature is already established. I'm thinking this will further establish her as a Night's Queen figure. She might even be tricked or corrupted by the Others to turn Jon for them.

[@AiltonOfClawIsland]

azor from azor a hai as azure as blue comes from the cherub image. An angel with a flaming sword. Blue represents heaven.

[@Andrew93752]

Is Qhorin half hand a “Corn” King? I feel like he fits the bill.

[@Quirkus23]

I think all the gender stuff ties into a lot of the alchemical themes (the incest as well) in the story. Alchemy sees the union of opposites and one of the central ways this is expressed is the divine hermaphrodite/rebis idea. The rebis has two heads a man and a woman (bringing to mind Tyrion's dream) and represents the Philosopher's Stone. George does all sorts of juxtaposing throughout the series to emphasizes the alchemical ideas in the story. The Others for example seem to he clones of the Night's King, but many of the parallel characters to the Other's are either eunuchs (Varays, Theon, Unsullied) or belond to celebite orders such as the Kings Guard, Night's Watch, or Septons. Characters like Jon or Karl the Maid are connected to maidens and many Wilding woman (or Brienne) are quite masculine. The girls dressed like boys with the juxtaposed attitudes are a great example of all this stuff. Also this could tie into ideas about skinchanging and shamanic masking (with Morna) Spirit/God is androgynous (I know you are familiar with Hinduism so think of the concept of Brahman) and it is human consciousness which creates the binary. The GEOTD emphasizes a unifed world. The og Weirwoods and Greenman watch allude to a unifed Order. The binaries are unifed and the cycle is complete and whole. Until the world breaks and Azor Ahai our demiurge figure remakes it in his image.

[@rhaevan.maniyara]

This may come across outta nowhere........ I've always wondered..... A Direwolf can beat a Lion, right?

[@chicotheworld9763]

aint no way a 14 year old is as mature as jon is in the introductory passage there. Hes gotta be older by that point in the story yes

[@DavidLightbringer]

yeah he's like 16 by then

[@leslieshE]

3:00 I think there is something endearing about dark Dany, I personally wanted to see her go crazy a little bit but not to the point of burning innocent people alive. That was NOT Dany, that was just terrible. What I thought would happen was Dany would go a bit dark with Cersei and the war (fAegon in the books) and as a redemption arc go north and help save the world from the WW as she realises she is not made to sit the iron throne, Westeros isn't her home. Her home is where her people are, and she goes back to Essos with an army as well as those she already has and create a better life for those she freed and those she didn't yet. ❤

[@DavidLightbringer]

Voltantis and whatever happens with fAegon will the most violent / dark points I believe

[@leslieshE]

@@DavidLightbringer YES, so do I.

[@Quirkus23]

On and on the wildlings came, as the sun crept across the bright blue sky. Just before midday, the movement stopped when an oxcart became jammed at a turn inside the tunnel. Jon Snow went to have a look for himself. The cart was now wedged solid. The men behind were threatening to hack it apart and butcher the ox where he stood, whilst the driver and his kin swore to kill them if they tried. With the help of Tormund and his son Toregg, Jon managed to keep the wildlings from coming to blood, but it took the best part of an hour before the way was opened again. The sun reaches its midday zenith (summer solstice) and this should be when the sun is killed and the season changes to fall/winter in the cycle, but then the cart gets jammed in the tunnel. You talked before about the cart or wagon and the drivers eye as a pole star/zodiacal wheel idea and thats what I think is being expressed here. The tunnel is the inversion point between the life and death realms and this is where the sun passes into the night realm to eventually be reborn. A fight almost breaks out where the people in the dead lands waiting for rebirth are stuck and cant pass so they want to break the cart and ox (kill the axis and the god who turns it NN) and the driver and his family wont allow it. This is all in the tunnel (Weirwood net) Jon and Tormund and his sons (the wildling/others) work together to stop the fight and free up the jam. This fixes the flow issue and allows the cycle to continue. Thats my idea anyways.

[@DavidLightbringer]

oh okay good analysis! the ox cart and the ice wayn, yes. Turning the cycle of the seasons like the big dipper. and once again the emphasis is on reconciliation and restoring the flow

[@lizardbreathh]

A comment! Thanks for the content!

[@molleh3180]

I just rewatched your video on why George is stuck on Winds. Do you still think George will sideline Jon in Winds? I don’t think it’s a bad idea with all the other plot points he has to cover in tWoW

[@MofTheVale]

Horn theory - the horn of winter. When Jon gives Sam the broken horn he mentions drinking from it. I almost wonder if the horn of winter is supposed to be used as a drinking horn.

[@Slechy_Lesh]

18:55

[@Slechy_Lesh]

32:47