Jordan and Kobe’s Relationship and ‘The Last Dance’ with J.A. Adande | The Bill Simmons Podcast

The Ringer's Bill Simmons is joined by Northwestern University's director of sports journalism, J.A. Adande, to discuss covering the Jordan-era Bulls, thoughts about the ESPN documentary 'The Last Dance,' Michael Jordan’s relationship with Kobe Bryant, and more.
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[@mohamedkaba6934]

This is what you call a sport talk. Not the daily boring GOAT conversation

[@razkable]

or espn's stupid list.....like how can we compare the early mikan era lakers of the 50's with white stars like mikan arizin schayes pettit cousey to the mid late 2010's with kd kawhi lebron curry harden.....honestly ...two different sports leagues not just rules and body but way less teams less player pool like guys its not the same sport in 1968 to 2018..its just not....let alone 2020 to 1949 think about that...jerry west is amazing but hes not top 25 in this era he would be great but this great?...too many people grow up idolizing magic for example so they put him over bird...hes not a better player if you really look at it fairly...he should not be over bird...thats one of a hundred examples...like putting jerry west over d wade...hes not better than d wade...in what planet?...west may be 30th all time no matter what but wade is top 20 in any era...shit like that annoys me

[@toddmichaelsen788]

Bill is the best. It always feels authentic with him.

[@maxsteele4555]

Yup that gets so tiresome.

[@tpoltalksbasketball7298]

It has been fascinating to learn more about Kobe and MJs relationship since the Mamba’s passing. Kobe always knew Jordan was the master, and his role was to use his gift of storytelling to pass on the mindset it takes to achieve success at all costs. It makes sense now that Kobe was so excited for the second part of his career - wouldn’t you be if you now got to talk about how Michael Jordan was secretly coaching you to become the greatest player of your generation?! I think Jordan knows Kobe was a better communicator of his principles and has been putting himself out in the public eye more recently as a tribute to his legacy. RIP Kobe

[@floridagator1765]

Yoda and Luke Pupil learns from the master

[@KazenoniKakuremi]

13:30 for Kobe-MJ relationship

[@Joe_Comino]

thank you

[@proseminded]

Adande is always a stand-up professional, love to see him get his shine!

[@fkillah]

He’s a phony

[@eboooo]

Michael was Kobe's Senpai. That's the word you should use. I think that the stuff with Michael was known around 2016 in his retirement.

[@CP-0809]

I wish there's someone who would talk about how Kobe used to wait on Michael in the tunnel for some advise, while the team bus waited on Kobe to finish his biz with MJ. I read it on print but would be awesome to actually hear the backstory.

[@SpartanCL1989]

Awesome interview!

[@no_sourcessle9801]

Exactly the original video has bob costas talking over the video of jordan crying..

[@bikingchupei2447]

do you have the youtube video id of the original bob costas voice over?

[@no_sourcessle9801]

@@bikingchupei2447 its on the nationally televised clip its easily searchable on youtube

[@jeffreyjoseph1212]

This is my favorite video of all the recaps with bill on jordan doc

[@ruchpat1]

Rest In Peace Kobe Bryant and Gianna Bryant.

[@DenG611]

Great content. Could listen to this all day long

[@EamonnCagney]

Adande! Great stories Cool guy

[@petervang8127]

Legends

[@saads1984]

23:00 The Kobe Shaq Lakers were the same way. They would coast the whole game and turn it on when needed.

[@pauljansen1137]

that locker room scene at the All Star Game '98 says it all..Jordan respected Kobe already..why else would he be talking about this Lakers Kid? they all feared Kobe's offense..maybe it was right then Mike decided to teach Kobe about being the best in the game?

[@datguitarplayer1656]

Michael was always complimentary of young guns who were being called, "the next Michael Jordan" for one reason: so it meant more when he wrecked them. If Jordan said, "ahh, this young fella is OK but he's not quite there yet" and then Jordan dismantled the kid in their next match it wouldn't be seen as a very big accomplishment. After all, Jordan himself said the kid wasn't ready. But give the youngster compliments and then dismantle him...it's an accomplishment. Jordan said the same things about Kobe in those early years that he said about everybody. It just means more to us, decades later and without context, that he said it about Kobe. In reality it wasn't until Jordan was with the Wizards that he first took Kobe under his arm and knew he was special.

[@Destiny-ps6cs]

Great interview. I didn't know J A Adande. I hope becomes analyst on ESPN or something

[@369pendulum]

I'm assuming you're being sarcastic lol

[@Destiny-ps6cs]

@@369pendulum I was too young plus I don't follow sports that much 😩😂

[@369pendulum]

@@Destiny-ps6cs He's a reoccurring member of Around the Horn on ESPN, and he writes for ESPN i believe

[@kamikazekrush3758]

Wow so espn ranked Isaiah Thomas 40 spots below steph curry!? Was there list put together by 15 year olds???

[@KISS_MY_CONVERSE]

I like how when they do these list. They just assume jacking up 50 threes would work in all eras. That only works now. Its the most outdated playing style. Its funny.

[@pauljansen1137]

yes ofcourse...older NBA fans don't let their voices be heard all that much compared to this twitter/facebook/instagram generation lol..let the legends speak and it all will be clear!

[@ethanennis8]

More Skittles I think Steph’s a greater player than Isiah, he’s got the MVPs, more titles and finals appearances, and he was truly an icon, the way Isiah never was. But obviously Isiah should be way higher on that list

[@bigboner23]

Two time mvp? Best shooter ever? 😂

[@KISS_MY_CONVERSE]

@@ethanennis8 well you said greater not better. So i can agree with your point. The lack of finals MVP really hurts though.

[@senorfrog5605]

any of the jordan teams that had rodman. they match up really well with the warriors.

[@JoeSmith-iv3sf]

This was a good convo

[@GRIZLAH]

Solid interview.. J.A. is a dude

[@falsetto213]

They both use to slander Kobe all the time.

[@bikingchupei2447]

if you really want to hunt down who slandered kobe the most when he was alive, i'll give you two names, nick wright and amin elhassan.

[@jjj.3]

moresources facts Amin is a bitch always talking shit

[@Ap32023]

@@jjj.3 He doesn't know shit about basketball either.

[@ejkboxing]

No book of basketball audiobook?

[@mikeg931]

What happened to the redraftables?

[@heyhooyaayaygba3148]

I miss that

[@tashrif46]

17:32 it was really no secret really. Just because they did not go out of their way to show that they were close, doesn't mean they weren't close. They were both competitors thats why they wouldn't openly discuss anything but they were close but not public thats it I guess

[@tashrif46]

25:58 to have Gary Payton number 53 below Jason Kidd and Steve Nash, and Isiah Thomas below Allen Iverson, Steve Nash, John Stockston is just plain wrong, he should be top 15 easily. Hakeem Olajuwon not being in the top 10 was another one which was just blasphemous!

[@earlr.s1368]

I don't get the Isiah Thomas disrespect. I get that the Jordan sycophants don't like him, but damn did you see him play? And Vince Carter is a top 70 player of all time?

[@tashrif46]

@@earlr.s1368 its not about Jordan sycophants. Because Jordan himself said he is the second greatest PG of all time. It is the modern day fans who think that Steph Curry and Steve Nash and Allen Iverson are more flashy they think they are better

[@billyfresh23]

the fact that vince carter and tracy mcgrady were ranked where they were made that list a complete joke to me. they shouldn’t be on any all time players list in my opinion. ad, dame, westbrook, etc. being that high i was like are they just not even considering pre merger ?

[@JoanneJaworski]

I have a different take on MJs sobbing reaction and don't think it was at all about what it took to win. I think it was a trauma/shock/grief release that was triggered by the win without his father being there. When the mind can't handle a trauma, it hides from it, (wearing #45 vs #23 is an attempt to disassociate). #23 played with his Dad alive and being able to share in the wins! Shutting down emotions, especially with trauma/shock, can be associated with illness, injuries that won't heal, physical and emotional pains that won't go away, addictions, and career blocks. That loss had to be monumental for MJ for so many reasons. Emotional traumas can be released/resolved though, when you know how!

[@Seraphim2611]

I think they were talking about him saying ‘break’ during the interview, in which he stopped the interview because he was becoming upset when talking about his approach to the game. Not the crying after the win; I think most agree that was to do with winning without his father there

[@JoanneJaworski]

@@Seraphim2611 Oops, you are right--my mistake. I bet there is a ton of dormant pain locked up just revisiting all those memories. I think the director said that MJ's reaction during the interview happened early on in their interview talks. It was added in later in the episodes. I can't imagine all he went through...

[@Seraphim2611]

Joanne Jaworski you raised good points though, which I meant to acknowledge in my reply, sorry; but my parenting duties were calling I had to run off quickly :-)

[@pfunk42]

Joanne Jaworski....STFU!! You don't know shit about sacrifice and becoming a champion!!

[@JoanneJaworski]

@@pfunk42 You must be having a tough life to be so snarky! I've trained athletes at the Lake Placid Olympic Training Center--have you?

[@leonfdawson]

0:18 nailed it from the start!!! Had the exact same feeling!!!

[@Atlas365247]

Bulls had a problem against legendary centers, Hakeem nd Shaq. But J.A. Dande is rite 92 Jordan I don't think no one stops tho. If we're talking a playoffs wit Shaq Kobe Lakers, Jordan Bulls, nd 2017 Warriors

[@CadChamberlain]

Adande got closer and closer to the camera

[@88smjls]

Kobe got all that advice and it still took till 2008 to become a good leader and really understand basketball vs just being a hyper talented guy.

[@369pendulum]

He didn't get Pau till the 07-08 season just remember that.

[@NathanDav42]

Well it is one thing to give advice, and another for it to sink in. Try giving advice to someone who’s as young as Kobe coming into the league and see how they internalize it. 18-19-year olds don’t truly feel that anyone older has anything of value to offer them. Jordan learned that he couldn’t win without help because he didn’t get Pippen or Grant until the 1987-88 season (ironically, Jordan’s best statistical season, first MVP, and the year he won defensive player of the year). Kobe started out on a team with Shaq, who is far and away better than anyone Jordan ever played with, so Kobe didn’t have brutal defeats that could be hung on him as being the Lakers’ primary focal point until Shaq left for Miami. Kobe needed to go through those bad years between Shaq and Pau to learn a lot of those lessons.

[@pfunk42]

@ 88smjls You're ignorant....His responsibilities were different than Jordan's early in his career, but he was ALWAYS leading by example, unfortunately the combination of Phil Jackson and Shaq egos crippled his ability to lead a team that was 5 years older than him.

[@369pendulum]

@@pfunk42 How did Phil cripple Kobes ability to lead?

[@JoeSmith-iv3sf]

@@pfunk42 I may be willing to give you Shaq's ego could have been a problem, but saying Phil's is a joke. Any great coach would kill to have great leaders. Are you even doubting that Phil didn't have something to do w MJ mentoring Kobe? If Phil did anything( key word anything) to get in the way of Kobe being a leader it was because he wasn't ready or was making a mistake. Star players empower coaches in the pros. If star player buys in, everyone else has too. Look at Tim Duncan. Look at the way Coach K talks about MJ compared to LeBron. MJ approached Coach K for help to work on his offensive stuff after practice. Called him coach, ask would you, said thank you after. Coach K said that alone gave him the ability to coach the rest of team. It also made Coach K feel like Jordan was saying hey let's bury this N. Carolina vs Duke stuff, we are here w same goal. As to when coaching LeBron at 25yrs old had to stop in the middle of talking to make LeBron look him in the eye when they are speaking. Coach K said I am not sure Jordan even knew what he was doing exactly but his leadership was just natural.

[@belak1551]

Come on golden states guards couldn’t handle real, physical defense. Bulls would beat them without question. 90s basketball era is the golden era for a reason.

[@panchuasca9820]

Head of sports at NW can't figure out how to stay in front of the camera?

[@ChiCitySoLrebel]

LOL! I was scrollin down here to see if anyone else noticed that.

[@misternogood]

24:15 this documentary has exposed how much Bill dislikes Rodman, more than anything else lol

[@Pksoze]

Bet he never forgave Rodman for calling Larry overrated for being white.

[@car9melo]

Rodman is very overrated when he was with the bulls

[@misternogood]

@@car9melo I mean, he only led the league in almost every rebounding category his entire time there especially RPG, and Rebounding %, and thats with highly efficient shooting wings on the team...and was an outstanding defender on bigs...he's being grossly UNDERRATED by Bill especially

[@misternogood]

@@Pksoze With Bill, it can always be traced back to the celtics lol

[@car9melo]

@@misternogood he was an excellent defender with detroit when he was on the bulls he only cared about rebounds, hes overrated because of the team he was on

[@yenibanwo3985]

I don’t trust Bill Simmons. His always 50/50

[@pfunk42]

The only revelation that comes from this conversation is that how clueless these clowns are...specifically about Kobe and Jordan. You need people who've actually played the game and understand being a champion. Jordan was close to Kobe because game recognize game. When Jordan looked at Kobe, he saw himself. "A fisherman always sees another fisherman from afar "___Gordon Gekko

[@russellbell8973]

Bryant's 3 titles with the Lakers, Shaq was the best player. Bryant couldn't win without Shaq until they fleeced Memphis for Gasol. Stop comparing him to Jordan. 6 titles when he was clearly the best player on the team.

[@obiwan3993]

GOING TO WORK IS NOT WORTH YOUR LIFE. MONEY IS NOT MORE IMPORTANT THAN HEALTH. NO TESTING NO ECONOMY. NO TX NO ECONOMY. JOBS DONT MATTER WHEN YOU ARE DEAD. CALL ELECTED LEADERS. DEMAND RESULTS, DEMAND ACTION!

[@yung_zucchini4137]

redraftables !!

[@KISS_MY_CONVERSE]

i would like to debate you bill simmons in sports. How can we make this happen. I feel i could defeat in the topic that todays players are bigger, faster, stronger debate. And i could also defeate you in the which era has better competition "the 90s or today's era."

[@datguitarplayer1656]

Get popular. Gain a following. Use your following to pressure him publicly. Until then...well...he's probably heared that same thing from 12 random guys a day, every day, for the last decade and a half.

[@zpacify]

More Skittles it’ obvious athletes are better now than 20 years ago. But that’s not am argument , you have to compare these players vs their eras. Obviously dropping Lebrun in the 60s or 70s he will look like a mutant. But if he was born during the 60s he won’t have the same moves , nutrition, training etc. so he might look like Elgin Baylor when he grows up.

[@KISS_MY_CONVERSE]

@@zpacify lebron body would also shrivel up because he cant take performance enhancers anymore. And he would constantly be called from traveling palming with the way he dribbles. And he would have zero finals appearances because he cant create superstack teams cause theirs no free agency. He also wouldn't be able to get his coach fired and whatever system the coach runs he would have to run.

[@Heem_B]

2001 Lakers beating everyone.