Making Age of Sigmar | The Community Correction

Age of Sigmar got off to a rocky start, but it over the course of its first edition Games Workshop would make some decisions that changed everything forever! From embracing the competitive community in a way never before seen, to fully reversing design principles, reinventing whole armies, and resurrecting a beloved boxed game, the Workshop was all in on AoS. This new fantasy game had to be a success, because failure could end the company.
In the making of Age of Sigmar: The General’s Handbook, Jordan Sorcery looks at how things changed for AoS after its disastrous 2015 launch.
CORRECTION:
I mistakenly refer to Ben Curry of the Bad Dice Podcast as Dan Curry in the video. Apologies to Ben for the mix up.
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References, Sources, and Links:
[‪@TheHonestWargamer‬ Beginner's Guide to AoS]
• A Beginner's Guide to ...
[Goonhammer AoS Launch Retrospective]
www.goonhammer.com/a-history-...
[Goonhammer AoS 5 Year Retrospective]
www.goonhammer.com/age-of-sig....
[Goonhammer James Hewitt Interview]
www.goonhammer.com/the-goonha...
[Talking Miniatures - Amazon Affiliate Link]
amzn.to/3xAnWDW
[Jervis Johnson Interview - Jordan Sorcery]
• Games Workshop's Const...
[Facehammer - Podcast Eternals General’s Handbook]
facehammer.co.uk/2016/04/27/p...
[Bad Dice Podcast]
baddice.co.uk/
[Heelanhammer Podcast]
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Images used belong to their respective copyright owners
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Jordan Sorcery Heraldry by Becka Moor
Jordan Sorcery Heraldry and Theme copyright @jordansorcery

[@HellstormWargaming]

You forget just how wild this entire release was until its all spilled back at you in 30 minutes. Great job Jordan :)

[@jordansorcery]

Cheers mate! It's a fascinating period of GW history; I'm just glad I was able to capture some sense of it all!

[@brentnelson8137]

I worked at a large game store in the US called Mox a few months after AoS launched. The starter sets weren't selling and (somehow) the owners were able to stop carrying AoS entirely while still selling 40k. They dumped everything at 60% off (including one of those huge Chaos Dreadforts!). A few years later the same store was doing AoS events. They really did turn it around!

[@alexbarrett3832]

It's funny how many people seem to assume that AoS still doesn't have much lore. This video really highlights that that perception only really stems from the very first couple of months of the game when they'd literally not published anything beyond the starter set yet. It's not as thouh they spent a couple of years selling minis and then went "oops, we need a setting" it just took a while for the books to come out, and for enough of us to read them that people started to be aware of the lore. I'm not a huge fan of the early realm gate wars era fiction as it's a little bland, but you can't say that they didn't come out of the gate with a lot of stuff, and it deepened and developed faster than any other gw game.

[@TheDeliciousMystery]

Malign Portents was definitely the shift i saw. Before that people would actually keep the fact they played AoS secret because they would get dogpiled online by whfb fans still heated over "age of shitmar" but once MP started to drop you saw people start to talk about it more in a hopeful tone and by the time Soul Wars released the sentiment was "okay we finally have a real edition of this game" and it exploded. Honestly i don't think 3rd edition even came close in terms of positive buzz to 2nd. I think 4th looks great but i think 2nd is going to be looked on with nostalgia years down the line.

[@Rob-nq6br]

Agreed actually, Malign Portents was an excellent “event” that expanded the lore, Skirmish had just come out as well and it was all super exciting

[@akaken23]

2nd is a great game. I carried on playing it because I found 3rd edition too clunky (2 versions of battalions, extra rules for monsters and heroes, etc). 4th has stripped it all back down and made gameplay flow better.

[@highmarshalbalian680]

100% this saved it. GW had to get rid of the stupid rules about being tall or rolling an impossible 13 on two dice. It was nice to see them tuck their tales for this and 40K and ask the player base to help them

[@RadioFreeHammerhal]

I was in it from the beginning, and I've actually done some videos on this history of AOS as well. So much evolution in this game happened in the first 3 years. I can't imagine just how much work went into the first GHB. In one year, they recognized the need for that sort of a book, built a functional points and army composition system, and all of the other content in the GHB, then play test it all, get it formatted and art added, and them printed and distributed. I would imagine there were some LONG days in the studio for that. A really important thing on gameplay that the GHB introduced was objective-oriented play. WHFB was perviously mostly just about the fight, while AOS leveraged the free movement in the game to create much more dynamic experiences on the tabletop. Also, AOS armies quickly became VERY diverse once the second GHB hit, which provided army rules for most of the available factions. Some armies eventually had such heavy special rules that they almost feel like youre playing a totally different game. Thanks for this! Great trip down memory lane!

[@mattl_]

I bought AoS on day one. I played a single game of it and put it away. Now with 4th edition coming out I’m ready to start trying it out again. I picked up some Fyreslayers recently. When you do 2nd and 3rd editions of AoS videos I hope we’’ll hear about Warcry too.

[@MiniatureRealms]

Cracking job on this, you’ve done a great job pulling all the threads of this together. It’s crazy how bad that launch was, AOS lost me on day one because of that far more than because it replaced fantasy. It’s mad that it took the most prominent Fantasy community podcasters & event runners to help save it 😂, there’s a certain level of irony there. The three ways to play was something excellent to come out of it though, so simple, yet so good.

[@CygnusMaximusXIII]

I sat-out the first edition of AoS - I was salty about the end of WHFB and looked at the initial rules and felt they were incomplete. All I heard about the chaos of competing community rules, inconsistent "support" from GW, etc., only made me feel I'd made the right choice. Then I watched a ton of the 24-hour launch stream Warhammer Community did for AoS 2, and I admit I was very impressed by the game AoS had become. I rallied my gaming group (who had also all sat out first edition), and we immediately started playing, and haven't looked back! I also absolutely love Silver Tower - I got it so I could play with my kids, and they were all fans as well.

[@willschoonover8654]

I used to love the General's Hand Books, but in recent years they have moved entirely to focusing on Matched play. I hope AoS4 gives us more frequent Narrative Play focused products with the retooled Path to Glory system.

[@danheelan8818]

Ah good memories. Was such an interesting time in the game, like the Wild West. Showed just how much the community wanted it to succeed, and GW embracing this after years of being somewhat closed off was a magical moment.

[@lesmartin2713]

Was so cool to be in that room, one of the biggest highlights of my hobby!

[@ChaosOverlordZ]

I remeber being blown away by how amazing the nighthaunt are in second. Takeing the ghosts of WFB and making a whole army out of them. The knight of shrouds on etherial steed looked like such a cool general. And then the Blackcoach. I loved just how narritivly driven the releases of second edtion were, the release of one army was related to the events of the narrative which lead to further developments.

[@BecauseOfDragons]

+1 for Silver Tower. Great overview of the history and can't wait for more on The Mortal Realms. I was an Old World diehard but liked the vibe of AoS to begin with. Wasn't a fan of the game but they won me over with 2nd Edition and the storytelling. Some of the novels for AoS are insanely good and deserve more attention than they get.

[@noops9220]

Silver tower is a great entry in the WHQ line

[@hermandez]

"My name is Jordan, this is Jordan Sorcery, and this is ...," - my favourite introduction to a video. Again, great work! It must take a lot of time to make such a video. Keep it up mate.

[@cooljoe500]

Great video. Started with AoS when the GHB was released, since I couldnt wrap my head around a game with seemingly no balance. Now, AoS has become my favourite GW system.

[@neem377]

As a Bretonnian player i did not have the best relationship with WHFB. Around End Times was probably the best point for me i got rules updates via errata that meant my army could actually be played(still extremely on the backfoot) things were actually happening in the story and then boom gone. Was pretty upsetting. However AoS brought in a lot of good things, new people could afford an army something unthinkable at the end of WHFB with a playable unit sometime starting at €200. People could be more creative with their hobby as encompassed by things like the AoS28 community. AoS felt more alive then WHFB or 40k where a lot is said but really nothing happens less the 5 mins to midnight shift one way or the other. In AoS the Apocalypse had happened already and it was up to you the player to determine what you did in the aftermath There was a sandbox to play in but you could also invest your time into defending or destroying Lethis controlling the great parch or Raiding Ulgus seas. The soul wars had huge story implications that were reflected on the tabletop and in the model range My Bretonians warscrolls went away & now the Survivors of Lilith's chosen are a footnote in the lore but a lot my errantry wars knights still ride with the Cities of Sigmar The community in AoS is a part of that.Now they feel like echos of the culture in the Mortal realms as my collection and conversions grow. pushback against pidgeon holing paint schemes and armies into exact looks to use rules has allowed me and others to keep playing with models as our factions rose and fell from the Gods of Death to Anvilgaard and Phonecium. Creativity feels rewarded in AoS in a way that you dont get in many of GWs army scale games and i look forward to how 4th will continue these trends

[@Rob-nq6br]

Brilliant comment that mirrors my feelings exactly!

[@jakewu8268]

Cannot wait for you to talk about the Second and Third editions of Age of Sigmar in the future. This has been very informative and entertaining vid on first edition.

[@Fueledchaos]

I missed this period in time. So is fascinating to hear the journey, and in someways understand why there was such a backlash. But also the joyfulness in hearing how a community made it something greater than it was, and the galvanisation it had in GW to build the lore. That I think is very good. Great Video as ever!

[@alexbarrett3832]

Prior to malign portents there was also the seeds of hope and Firestorm campaign which gave players the chance to influence the development of the settlements that became the Cities of Sigmar. The ones that survived that campaign are still at the heart of the setting and really made it a living and breathing world, even before Malign portents made it grimdark again.

[@rifway22]

I'm always impressed with your research. Very well done

[@PuddleofPorridge]

This brings back a lot of memories. From talking to friends at the time, when we actually started to get stories in AoS they were excited to see the diversity being open and present in them. Even the presence of a couple of women Stormcast in the early books was something that really helped people dip their toe in. I do miss the Grand Alliance rules though

[@anotherzingbo]

What a fascinating period in GW's history! I was not in the hobby for this period, so it's great to learn about it. Plus, congratulations on getting to 19 subscribers, now on to 20k and then - the world!

[@OldenDemon]

Excellent job on gathering all of this in once place

[@JamesDavidWard]

Simple four page rules, free warscrolls and an open attitude to what models you can play with, got me into wargaming for the first time. It was a bit of a false promise, since complexity came from the interaction of all the bits of paper together. Plus, I hosted an intro game with a friend where the imbalance was just embarrassing. I totally get why we are where we are now with the game, but I think AoS1 does have an ethos that should be maintained. Having said all that, I still don't really have a handle on the setting nearly a decade in. Great job as always, Jordan!

[@majortom7186]

Silver Tower is ok. Blackstone Fortress is the peak of Warhammer Quest, and it's no coincidence that it's a 40K game rather than AoS. Cubicle 7 do a better job making the Mortal Realms interesting than GW.

[@jordansorcery]

I'm a big fan of Blackstone Fortress, especially of the way they expanded it. And I agree that the Soulbound books from C7 do some fantastic work with the AoS setting, they really add a great deal to it (much like WFRP did some terrific work to deepen the early Warhammer world)

[@kurukblackflame]

I'd argue that Warhammer Quest is peak Warhammer Quest ;) Blackstone has the best rules of the modern versions. I really like the models that came with Cursed City but the rules were not great. I wish they'd basically used the same rules from Blackstone for that game (perhaps with a more robust levelling up system).

[@CaptainRufus]

If AoS had been any other company besides GW? It wouldn't have just killed the game it would have killed the company. GW and Wotc are such giants with massive fanbases they can get away with mistakes no other tabletop companies could survive making. And they don't as XWing and Warmahordes have shown. It's why there is an adage that you don't just buy a game for itself but also the player base\community that's already there. Now in GW's case we have it's near monopoly setup in the UK and that 40k Dawn of War bringing in new fans that also helps it. I also think in Battletech's case the MechWarrior computer games are almost singlehandedly responsible for keeping the brand alive given how isolationist the playerbase is to the point I wonder if most of the Old Guard even want to play new people and grow the game. Games need to be both good and have thriving welcoming scenes to survive.

[@PutYourQuarterUpGaming]

Table top battletech where I live at least, is insanely gate keepy to point I just shrugged and took my starter sets to play with a single friend who plays *drum roll* mech warrior 5 with me. And yeah, like had the axman toy as a kid, and watched the cartoon AND played mech warrior on dos growing up, but like wasn’t till last decade…I even knew the table WAS mech warrior/what that toy and cartoon were really based on(literally never gave show much thought, they’re marketing was Abysmal back then to degree, didn’t even know a table top game existed). Problem with bt therefore I see two fold, a lot of accumulated gate keeping compounded by long history of companies doing a pretty piss poor job of promoting their own product…let alone the licensing issues that basically put entire IP on ice for what? Close to 20 years? Boils down simply to this, it’s confusing and obtuse branding for no reason. I buy dawn of war, what is it? Is it Dawn of War Space Blunt Weapons 40th Millennium?…no it’s Warhammer 40k Dawn of War, with prominent and consistent branding throughout. And like Pro tip from guy now works in marketing, don’t make it hard for your consumer to understand your brand…or end up like BT 😂

[@rodgertoner5705]

Doing my work listening to this. Great stuff. Thanks!

[@jordansorcery]

Thank you Rodger, really appreciate it!

[@stevenray8737]

I remember the introduction of 2nd edition and it quickly became my favourite "jack of all trades" game, and was also drawn to the Soul Wars narrative. Not only was it a fun game to play vanilla, but there was also the addition of a skirmish supplement, rules for Skybattles, creating ones own heroes, and solo and cooperative campaigns. Having on-line warscroll pdfs made it instantly accessable. It wasn't perfect mind, but it was open and experimental. Sadly, some of that charm has been forgotten by GW and are now more interested in the tournament scene where balance is all that matters. For me the final blow is the removal of the Sacrosanct Chamber which, along with the Nighthaunts, were the reason I was visually drawn to the game in the first place. There's also been no more solo-coop campaigns since 2020. Going forward I'll be putting my AOS models towards Frostgrave and Five Leagues From The Borderlands, and starting a fresh model collection for Middle Earth SBG and Rangers of Shadowdeep. One chapter ends, another begins...

[@caseybox7816]

Hey man, you need to add the link to the first part of the Making of the Age of Sigmar @2:48 loved the first part and this one just the same - keep up the great work 👍🏻

[@entropy2100]

Glad you are doing this, hope it grows the Channel

[@eduparraf4196]

As always, awesome work Jordan. It's a pleasure to paint minis while listening J&S

[@blackdenim23]

Great job on this Jordan! I never quite gave in and played Age of Sigmar, so getting a background look on its development is surprisingly interesting to me!

[@jordansorcery]

Cheers mate, glad I could bring it to life a little!

[@mirbeau111]

Good summation thank you. It’s a shame you didn’t touch on the seeds of hope - the first global campaign that following the narrative re-entry in the realms via the realmgate wars. It really helped ground these parts of the realms in story and in real life - and they have evolved with the in-universe setting moving in time. They get glossed over a lot but they were the thing that pulled me back after dismissing the whole thing initially as a poor replacement.

[@tomsteer3485]

Absolutely brilliant video for 4th Edition Eve, Jordan. Thank you as always 🫶

[@Jackalblade9]

Impeccable as always, Jordan! I always love a good redemption story and in many ways it sounds like AoS was exactly that. I only find it unfortunate that GW truly began to double down on not crediting their artists and designers in that period.

[@samus17]

I was a mainly 40k player back then. Picked up some lizardmen, just to have the announcement that everything was going away, and then got all the followup info that this vid went into. Dropped my models HARD, and didnt get back into Warhammer until a year ago. With Spearheads announcement, Ive dipped my toe back into the non-40k models; things seem to have corrected into what I liked about Warhammer

[@staalforsfh]

I think it did. It was the true birth of the game, if not the setting

[@margaretwood152]

26:29 ~ If _only GW had done _*_this_*_ for _*_The HORUS HERESY,_* perhaps the Game & it's Rules Set(s) would not be in the state it's in today (nigh on broken in 50%+ of places)

[@The_Captain40k]

@@margaretwood152 That's the first time I've ever heard this opinion. Most people I know absolutely love the Horus Heresy game, what is broken about it to you?

[@stevenkennedy4130]

Thanks for the share!!

[@andrewjamieson7178]

Excellent video. I remember playing 1st edition, and like you I credit Silver Tower for hooking me on AoS. It remains a tremendous game. You should get the designer on for an interview....

[@jordansorcery]

Check back in a couple of weeks

[@andrewjamieson7178]

You tease!

[@drpretzel2086]

I still have my old generals Handbook. One of the first books I bought when getting into the hobby. I remember going through the book not understanding a bloody thing good times

[@CrimsonTemplar2]

Excellent video! A great example of course correction.

[@weirdocollector]

You're spoiling us with these great videos 😅 Thanks Jordan!

[@user-yd7gf4ds9r]

Early AoS gets alot of hate, but hyper mixed army building was really cool, i still wish that some other wargame did something similar

[@adampriestley7732]

Very interesting video, I'd forgotten how odd the game was at launch, and just how much GW has changed.

[@jacobturnerart]

Playing devil's advocate here - I see where they were going with not having points values etc. Complaints about imbalance in the rules always hangs over enjoyment of the game and AoS was almost an acknowledgement that it's impossible to properly balance this many armies and units.

[@Elliot-ou6lb]

I do remember bumping into the balancing issues early on, but my group and I had come back into The End Times in a big way, where army listbuilding had been relaxed and there was a greater mixing of factions. That really helped soften the less rigid army building aspects. I remember really struggling with the lack of lore, and I think with the benefit of hindsight, it should have been either a totally clean break from WFB or a more direct evolution with the realms literally being in the world that was as opposed to awkward carry overs that still endure.

[@Mr_Waffle.]

I'm fascinated by the early days of AoS which I wasn't around for, reading the old books on Warhammer Vault has been a hoot. Must've been pretty frustrating for fans at the time!

[@Rob-nq6br]

Coming from a historical/narrative gaming perspective I honestly enjoyed the “no points” era but I can see why they had to do it eventually. I do still have nostalgia for those early days though, felt like RT launching again!

[@icebearcriminal1265]

Warhammer just has a vocal minority that come from a competitive backdrop, be it video games or TCGs. It's unfortunate but that they're consistently pandered to.

[@thebigapplegate5404]

That's the internet vs real unfortunately

[@infinitedm5396]

I think the problem was there wasn't a way to Opt-in to that style, It was the default. I think of a narrative set of rules that were like "Go crazy, no points" would be fantastic alongside pointed units.

[@The_Captain40k]

OMG are the dwarfs ever going to show up?! They seem to have dropped off a cliff!

[@danielpapst8698]

I remember me and my brother just being perplexed. We wanted to play fantasy battles after the release of the total war adaptation, but fantasy had gone the way of the squat. We had a choice between 40k and AoS, and we both loved 40k from other games we’d played. I made the point though, that it would be really cool to get in on the ground floor of something new, and be there to watch it evolve into (hopefully) something amazing. It was a mess, we got the starter box and if I could use a single word to sum up my initial experience it would be ‘huh?’. No points, maps and lore that just confounded me. I tried looking up new lizard men lore, only to find that GW had made it so vague that rather than being mysterious, it was straight up annoying. And don’t get me started on the lack of points or initial rules! Just tell me how many are in a full squad of Retributors so I can play effectively with the three you gave me! It was a blast. I look back on those days so fondly, so does my brother. We painted miniatures to the tune of Doug from 2+tough, rolled absolutely astonishing (or abysmal) rolls, and generally just enjoyed the game more and more as the months and then years went on. I love this game, been playing for eight years now. If I could go back in time knowing all the frustrations, retcons, and that the dudes I got in that first starter box aren’t going to be supported in a year… I’d still be going back to paint up some Sigmarines. Thank you for all your efforts documenting the history of these games

[@darrenrichardson6146]

I think for me the original General's Handbooks are what turned the poor launch of AoS into a solid gaming system with their plug and play rules expansions and of course, points values. The various Grand Alliance, Faction and subfaction abilities and items were also a massive improvement, as those added to factions that didn't get a Battletome early on and started to add character to each army, something sorely lacking until that point. I do wish the amazing "Hostiles" sprue from Silver Tower would get a reissue, there's some great monopose models on there and the acolytes really help increase that AoS unit's weapon choices greatly.

[@batjutsu]

Thank you for this overview about AoS's history and what a fasinating mess it is, plus how things have improved so much. Squeak-squeak! 🤩🐀🌠

[@fredrik241]

Interesting video even when I'm not an AoS player. One thing though there's some slightly odd edits in this one where the audio for s cut starts before the video going along with it. Its a bit unorthodox way of doing things but maybe there's a reason. Anyway, good work as usual interesting to hear about the fan contributions!

[@Walshy1Jojo]

I was pretty devastated about the end of WHFB and invested a tonne into Bretonnia and Tomb King’s when they were going OOP. I studied the new free rules for AoS and found the silly rules kinda comical and soon saw them in early 8th 40K. I can still remember a game in store between Savage Orcs and some Zombies before pts values… I regarded Age of Sigmar as heresy since 2014 but now I think I respect this game 🫡 The community saved it and GW made the right move by going with what was working. I’m still diehard WHFB and Old World and have probably 10 Bretonnia Battalions still to assemble some 8 years on 😂 but AoS has come a long way it seems. Can’t wait to hear more about the later editions 😊

[@MarkStorey-dc4tm]

At the time I was following the setting but not playing the game or collecting the models. I got the seraphon book (for instance) to find out about their new lore and look at the pretty models. (At the time I definitely didn't see myself buying and painting models of my own.) While I was aware of the Generals Handbook it wasn't something that affected me. I definitely enjoyed the increased depth the setting was getting and remember being quite excited for malign portents.

[@davidmckay335]

Thanks

[@jordansorcery]

Thank you!

[@vzgg1973]

I appreciate getting some more info on how AoS evolved. It interesting as a mini game player. However, playing a skirmish game on the grave of what had been a life long game/ setting meant I like many took up other games (Bolt Action, Oathmark, KOW) then switched to resurgent WAP/ 9th or classic 6th and 8th fan run WFB. All healthy as it showed to GW fan-people that you didn’t have to play the games the company happened to be promoting at that time and there is a space for other fantasy wargames. You can DIY your wargames.

[@ironbomb6753]

I just love this history, even it's recent. 😊

[@LeeHobbies]

Great stuff as always. Will I see you at another Warlord open day this September Joran, assuming it's on as normal. Big month for them with BA3. Can't decide if I'm going to Britcon as well, wanted to take Mel (Terrain Tutor) but he's struggling atm, might go anyway if I can. All the best, Lee :]

[@andreaskonig8702]

yes it did

[@MasterShake9000]

I totally forgot about how we used to use wound totals to “balance” armylists, lol. Crazy in hindsight.

[@KleineKassiopeia]

Could you give me a few examples of those whacky rules? I only really heard that that was a thing but not more than that.

[@tigerstein]

In our club we tried out fantasy in I guess the 7th edition but weren't fans of it so we dropped. When sigmar came out we tried out but haven't jumped on it until the GHB came out, then we started to play it for real. But for us the 2nd edition was the real deal. 40K started to get not to our liking at around that time but sigmar with its 2nd edition sucked us in trully.

[@Rob-nq6br]

AoS 2nd ed was one of my favourite times for playing GW games

[@ImrahilToChaos]

And then they blew up the majority of stuff that made 2e so fun for souping and using old minis once 3e came along, before driving in the stake come 4e. Good times.

[@tigerstein]

@@ImrahilToChaos We enjoyed 3rd edition too. We have yet to play a game of 4th but reading the rules it looks promising. We will see.

[@ImrahilToChaos]

@@tigerstein I don’t think they’re bad editions(including what we’ve seen of 4th so far), but they’ve been mired in a lot of meddling that made the game less enjoyable, such as killing soup synergies and killing off entire ranges that had been in the game for Six to eight years.

[@Basil_Ghothickovitch]

I absolutely affirm that 2015-2019 were the best in all of Warhammer history. I call it the "Era of Enthusiasm", we saw so many unexplored paths and opportunities ahead. So many possibilities! But everything changed later, stagnation set in again, - the “Era of Cheap Fanservice”. The result of this, for example is the rotten policy of “one model for one system only.” This is definitely a consequence of pleasing the “patrician” public, who are very jealous and are offended when "plebeians" play with THEIR toys.

[@MadMax-el2el]

All I know is we had a game, with 8th. Then we were given a steaming pile of half baked BS. The agreement had been changed and i did not agree with the slop they were peddling. From what I saw of aos 2.0 they had made a game finally. Imbalanced AF so a game I had no interest in. When I can get almost 4k worth of models on the table in a 2k game. Someone has made errors. Tried tzeentch saying it was funny and painful is a half truth. The endless spell exploitation was funny. The list was painful. Honestly when GW dumped aos 1.0 out. I was already on my way out. I had been neck deep into warmachine for 5 or 6 years at that point. I was only playing whfb because friends kept on insisting. So for me walking away was easy. I had sold off 4 of my 5 whfb armies. I held onto my daemons for 2 reasons they work in both systems and they really don't change much model/unit wise. So if a friend ever wanted a game we could play. We also used them for dnd, 9th age and kings of war. Things changed when warmachine mkiii wrecked the community, I got dragged back into 40k... what I found with 8tb ed 40k, was pleasant enough. Then ironhands happened. Thar is when I checked out aos 2.0, slaanesh was busted, khorne needed morrals not a daemon army your mortal woes sre nit my problem, tzeentch was a troll army for the player and opponent. And i still hate nurgle. So i just quit GW.

[@PutYourQuarterUpGaming]

Ha…ugh…Nagash…deeper. Put that in just to see who was still paying eh? 😂 My first impressions were sneering at it in my lgs while first getting into 40k cos it was weird and yuck and we were so cool and Chad with our space marines. Dial ahead 4 years and we’re all talking about what armies might get (morathi’s girls, without a question for me, that model is awesome and love her lore for aos/end times) while playing bloodbowl. lol. Never did get into, stopped buying models few years back(no real reason other than I mean, armies for nids, wolves, dark and normie eldar outta do it right? 😂) but did enjoy few of the horror story collections and that game by frontier. I find it to be a neat setting all things considered, like magic’s planes but badass.

[@FizzyMcPhysics]

Re: Warhammer movies, watch season 5 of the new She-Ra cartoon and tell me it's not about Necrons!

[@Davyagnew93]

Love you Jordan! Excellent content. I'm not so interested in the interviews. The content of the interviews though I like. Possibly a more edited version? I've became a patreon, however, I should point out I'm pro old world, I'm not here for AOS. The history of GW in all forms is excellent. (Including AOS here) I just don't want to promote the AOS view.

[@elijahherstal776]

Unpopular Opinion: GW can make some fantastic models (thought it's hard to justify the price tag). However, their wargame rules are, at best: Mediocre. They'd be better off licensing the IP to other companies to make their rules for them- and have variations of their war games. GW could then just focus on making models.

[@toddirvine5886]

I still find the world and story of AoS to feel just sort of empty and uninspired. The AoS stories that motivate me are from players, like Amberfall (look that up if you haven't seen it!). I must have been the only guy who didn't mind the lack of points. I absolutely get where other players needed a points system, but I play casually and my group sort of just makes up little stories as we decide who will fight what. The lack of points felt in line with how we play. A necromancer ambushing a protected caravan, a bunch of dwarves fending off a troll, etc. But a points system doesn't prevent us from playing that way, so I'm glad they added it for everyone else.

[@nostalgiahobbies]

There's quite a bit I could say about AOS but unfortunately very little of it is good. I can say that this video is still really well done and goes into the detail any true GW nerd wants..

[@Oceanides]

Great video, as always. Age of Signar is just a terrible idea and everything that came after it are just patches to hide this fact.

[@Basil_Ghothickovitch]

A lot of people said the same thing about Warhammer 40,000. "Putting fantasy in space is a terrible idea", they said. We all know the result. Time will tell.

[@Oceanides]

@@Basil_Ghothickovitch perhaps. Although It has been already 8 years since its release…

[@samurdyne1461]

They should have just left Warhamer fantasy alone and just added to it. 👊

[@margaretwood152]

🤔Nothing except perhaps (some of) the Models is *_exceptional_* about Age of Sigmar....when compared to WARHAMMER FANTASY, it just feels like something is missing.

[@thewellandvalley2103]

Warhammer Fantasy is a direct analogue to the medieval world, thus having the same immediate resonance of that many versions of that genre of fantasy have. AOS is a very different beast with a far bigger departure from standard tropes. It will take a long time for an IP like this to build up depth, but having been a part of it for the last three years there are huge strides being made. Some of the novels are really good and give great flavour to the world, and the ongoing narratives and brilliant minis continue to forge something different.

[@Basil_Ghothickovitch]

The only exceptional feature of the old fantasy was black powder weapons and a bit of steam. Everything else is very generic and ordinary. Is the world a copy of Earth? Is the map a copy of Europe? Historical nations but with dragons? You will find all this in every first popular fantasy, somewhere more talented, somewhere less. Just look at how much The Elder Scrolls took from "Fantasy Battles" (including RPG guru Ken Rolston) and how far it was able to go when the Old World remained in place.

[@brett7773]

4th edition was the time to actually make the game good but they keep on attempting to polish a turd.

[@bennconner1195]

Let’s be honest they could have just given warhammer fantasy the same level of support.

[@LSOP-]

Good thing the world exists again soy you don't have to play age of sigmarines anymore.

[@thesoothsayer9223]

Your Jervis interview was excellent. Really appreciate this concise but insightful content. The community is 100 percent what took this game from an insult against WHFB to what I feel is the greatest spiritual successor and evolution of an IP

[@danielpapst8698]

I remember me and my brother just being perplexed. We wanted to play fantasy battles after the release of the total war adaptation, but fantasy had gone the way of the squat. We had a choice between 40k and AoS, and we both loved 40k from other games we’d played. I made the point though, that it would be really cool to get in on the ground floor of something new, and be there to watch it evolve into (hopefully) something amazing. It was a mess, we got the starter box and if I could use a single word to sum up my initial experience it would be ‘huh?’. No points, maps and lore that just confounded me. I tried looking up new lizard men lore, only to find that GW had made it so vague that rather than being mysterious, it was straight up annoying. And don’t get me started on the lack of points or initial rules! Just tell me how many are in a full squad of Retributors so I can play effectively with the three you gave me! It was a blast. I look back on those days so fondly, so does my brother. We painted miniatures to the tune of Doug from 2+tough, rolled absolutely astonishing (or abysmal) rolls, and generally just enjoyed the game more and more as the months and then years went on. I love this game, been playing for eight years now. If I could go back in time knowing all the frustrations, retcons, and that the dudes I got in that first starter box aren’t going to be supported in a year… I’d still be going back to paint up some Sigmarines. Thank you for all your efforts documenting the history of these games