I love/hate Betaflight 4.5 Angle & Horizon Mode

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00:00:00 - Angle and Horizon Mode have totally changed in BF 4.5
Betaflight 4.5 release notes: betaflight.com/docs/wiki/rele...
00:02:21 - Snappier angle mode response with Angle FeedForward
For more information about PIDs and what P term and Feed Forward are: • Betaflight 4.2 PID tun...
00:04:33 - Rate curve now applies to Angle Mode
00:07:14 - Angle Mode is now Earth-Referenced
00:09:27 - Have I earned your support today?
00:10:34 - Why I always discouraged Horizon Mode in the past
00:12:51 - How is 4.5 Horizon better?
00:13:33 - Flight testing New Horizon Mode
More documentation and Horizon Mode presets are available at: github.com/betaflight/betaflight/pull/12231
00:19:01 - Want to learn more???
Learn more about Betaflight 4.5 in this playlist: • These Betaflight 4.5 F...

[@VasylDemianov]

Angle mode is super useful if your VTX/goggles suddenly died on you/someone jumped your frequency: angle mode, throttle above hover point, goggles off, find your quad LOS, and so on. If your quad is BVLOS, then GPS rescue and then all of the above.

[@serang]

Position Hold is way more useful. Oh wait, BF don't have that.

[@VasylDemianov]

@@serang most BF quads don't have GPS. :)

[@temuerasamuel]

Angle mode came into clutch when my DJI goggles lost feed for 5 seconds once.. so glad I had it set as i quickly switched and throttled straight up

[@likwidkool]

I keep it on a switch for that reason.

[@coltonmcdonald9448]

Yeah I used angle on a switch for months to use as a quick exit if a trick was going south. I still have flight modes programmed to a 3-way switch, though I never really need it anymore.

[@matthewcawley9437]

I watch Bardwell precisely for the opening scene, he could be a pompous know it all because he does actually know it all but instead still is and acts like a normal person who doesn’t take themselves too seriously. I will forever watch his videos.. for the info but also because I appreciate his humility

[@Quadcopterguide]

Dadbods unite! Excited to get my quads back up to date and flying.

[@-SevenOfNine-]

OMG, i've been flying around your garden a lot! :)

[@pinkroomstudios]

Thanks for the great content always, Joshua!

[@leftright9022]

I like the Horizon Mode a lot🙌🏼. And the new change helps to do tricks more consistent. Thx, for the detailed review👍🏼

[@DanielSingerX]

I 100% agree on HAAATING the new angle rate feeling! BUT I fixed it with another method u didn't mention. U can use the ADJUSTMENTS tab and select what ever switch you use to change from angle to acro (aux 2 for me). set the range for each according to which position you have across or angle set, then apply RATE PROFILE SELECTION! and in via channel I select same channel (aux2) the switch is on, tho I'm not sure that is necessary.. this is seamless and changes the rate profile as you go into angle mode or acro.. The trick is you gotta enable 3 adjustment parameters and assign them to same switch, for me it's AUX2 a 3 pos switch. the first one will select rate profile 1 and second profile 2 and so on. I put my custom rates on profile 1 and the others are stock Betaflight rates which feel almost ok in angle mode. so you could also tune the rates differently for angle which is cool! there should just have been an option for angle rates to begin with.... I'm not sure if the dual rates you mentioned is this same thing I'm trying to explain 😅

[@robert-gille]

Yea I think that's what he meant.

[@DanielSingerX]

@@robert-gille yeah that’s what I thought! Shame on me thinking I can teach the great JB 😁

[@LilwickedFpv]

Mad funny luv the humor keep up the great Fpv work 😎👌🏽

[@tiwidub8809]

Great video. Thanks a lot. ❤❤

[@MCsCreations]

Very interesting indeed! Thanks, Joshua! 😊 Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊

[@gregorydahl]

You can use your transmitter settings for channels to put negative expo curve to" linearize" your pitch and roll in your new angle mode .

[@helitoftere]

that's great that rates can be applied to angle mode. Because when angle mode was needed the quad was flying with stock rates not personal rates.

[@Widflyinghigh]

Never use angle mode because of JB! Awesome video fit man. Thanks. B

[@MochaboyRC]

Let it all hang out! :D

[@rodgersrcaviation2785]

You can do the separate rates by making flight modes in the tx. I’ve done this with a dji naza and it works fantastic tx16s tx

[@marathi22]

I've always liked to fly whoops in horizon mode, but with the threshold angle set to 180 degrees. This way it actually does kinda feel like angle mode, but with rates and 360 rolls and flips. Acro mode never kicks in, and it will always level when you release pressure off the sticks. I like it.

[@TheCivildecay]

That quad is huge!

[@DigitalCruzer]

I only use angle as an emergency like if i loose video so the drone self rights and comes down a little easier flat or maybe it will help if i hit something, but rarely ever use it, but horizon i never use as fpv at all, but its really fun to fly LOS! Add headless with horizon and LOS is a blast and super easy, I always had troubles keeping orientation LOS...

[@DroneOn]

New features thank you bf team! My humble opinion is with hard core whoop angle people, they probably will go with what they already know or use. But this is cool stuff for betaflight. Woot

[@rishavagarwal2924]

Horizon is great when you are flying indoors or in tight space. Let’s say I did a roll and just centred the stick, the quad would self level but in acro I would have to make corrections and level the quad which is difficult in tight spaces and for begineers.

[@Todd_Gerhardt]

Ive seen ut all now! Haha thanks for the laugh man!

[@VladVortal]

Thx😊

[@buddyadkins2432]

Ok, I got to ask. I hear many ACRO stunt pilots tell folks to fly only in ACRO mode and NOT to fly in ANGLE mode because you get bad habits. Yet, no one will say exactly and explicitly what those bad habits are and why they are considered to be BAD. I mostly fly ANGLE mode, but have occasionally kicked in ACRO mode and didn't seem to have any problems. The sticks seem to work the say way, except the right stick was no longer synchronized with the quad. Instead, it acted more like a cruise control. Not too big a deal, just pull back on the stick to slow down and no autolevel when centered (bummer). So, what exact and explicit bad habits does one get and why are these "habits" considered BAD? By the way, I like the new series on learning to fly ACRO mode. Excellent. Good Job.

[@JoshuaBardwell]

I don't think Angle causes bad habits personally. It's just a different way of flying and can be helpful for learning throttle control and which stick moves which axis.

[@mjodr]

I don't believe in the learning bad habits thing either. I can fly Angle or Acro and my brain switches over very fast. Same as I can ride a motorcycle or bicycle with the brake levers reversed and it's not a problem, not even for a second.

[@leftright9022]

At first I was so bad at Acro Mode (I thought I could never be able to fly Acro good enough). So I try Angle Mode first. Then switch to Horizon Mode and stayed there for a long time. At some point I give Acro Mode a chance again, and was suprised how good enogh I was flying.

[@mjodr]

@@leftright9022 I like to hear reports of people who successfully worked their way up like that. Especially when so many people like to downplay it like "Oh, you'll learn bad habits."

[@danielharris3827]

are those the new gen 2 Xing motors on your Chimera Pro?

[@CloneTechDrones-619]

Horizon mode is great if flying your quad Line Of Sight and not too experienced with acro/air mode using LOS. I feel it provides the safety of doing flips and rolls with the help of the quad leveling itself when sticks are near center.

[@tunerfpv6930]

i could do power loop on the old horizon mode too as long as you don't centre the stick of pitch! try it! you need to control all the way the move but is quite easy on the old one too :) looks like this new upgrade just adds smoother self levelling that's all for me :) love your videos though:)

[@661FPV]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but there has been angle Expo adjustment in Cli since mabey 4.3? I know this isn't new.

[@caujka]

Thanks for the review! Actually, I thought, setting different rates and expo curves for acro, horizon and level mode is the default behavior in Betaflight. At least, this is so on all my whoops :) And horizon mode is a lifesaver for indoor freestyle, especially for beginners :-) It allowed me to do chairlympics challenge from IGOW4 one month into the hobby.

[@matheusfpv]

This is the pyrodrone face plate for the G2?

[@CallowayVisuals]

What you described in the expo is almost exactly how drones act in liftoff. Nothing, nothing, everything.

[@redvapez6771]

I learned to fly acro from hours of flying horizon mode with transition and angle strength turned way down so it would take its time to level out.. I can't remember if it was Libre, cleanflight, or beta but you could do it way back when.. been flying acro only for 6yrs so stopped tuning angle mode 🤷‍♂️

[@Badoonk]

whoa your trees and grass look really pretty! Cali would never have that kind of grass. Bet it looks nice when you fly!

[@crackhead2able]

Cali probably has some dope spots to fly.

[@lameandboard]

you need to do a hard banked turn coming into it with a lot of speed...where you pass that threshold....where the quad is pretty much sideways....

[@omit.the.boring]

Fit check in the beginning was on point 🤌

[@Lost_Hwasal]

Not sure if you've seen it but Garand Thumb (makes gun/military videos) did a video on lessons learned during the ukraine war and there was quite a bit of drone talk, specifically the DJI mavic was brought up. If you are looking for content it might be worth commenting on, or at least watching.

[@jlarson42]

Interesting changes to horizon mode. When I was learning to fly, I went from angle mode to acro trainer. It really helped get a feel for acro, but with training wheels. Several packs in acro trainer I knew I was ready for acro. Never looked back. 😎

[@Tydud3]

what is acro trainer?

[@ZerStoiber]

Acro trainer is acro but doesn't let you go beyond a certain angle (e.g. upside down). So similar approach to angle in terms you will never accidentally end up upside down, but no help whatsoever on leveling the quad.

[@ZerStoiber]

In my opinion acro trainer is really just for your first few flights if transitioning from something like a DJI where you always do full stick to the side and now you want to try acro but are afraid of your old muscle memory and can't handle being upside down. But in my opinion that's the thrill of acro (I mean why did you leave a DJI style concept if you're not eager to flip 🙃)

[@mjodr]

When I was learning I used horizon mode a lot to learn flips. Then found Acro Trainer mode useful too. All various levels of training wheels and I feel they work great.

[@blackjungle308]

As someone that messes around in angle mode from time to time... That earth-referenced yaw seemed REALLY smooth, if compared to regular angle mode!

[@koycdjartage2571]

Hey JB I have a Nebula pro nano and my image goes dark when I arm in low light

[@bigsmokerc]

We've had this on fixed wing for 30 years. Angle mode is essentially a gyro mode in fixed wing - and the expo curve is programmed into the radio. It's fantastic for control and the majority of people use it extensively. You essentially get two sets of rates out of one. The potential for advanced fliers is huge if they can change habits. It's a shame you can't control the curve intuitively - all it would need from a UX perspective is a couple of sliders.

[@Qdronefpv]

great video teacher, I just turned 30, my belly is bigger than ever, I'm afraid I'll look like my uncle

[@bluerex7400]

What quad are you using?

[@ominguti6345]

What is this huge frame called?

[@dalemurray6834]

the old horizon was ok for me, i just turned the self leveling strength down to 15%.

[@rafalosip8025]

hi i just got the iflight nazgul evouge f5 v2 and its on betaflight 4.3.2 i would like to update to betaflight 4.5 how do i keep all the iflight settings so the quad runs good in betaflight 4.5. im scared to update so i dont brake my quad.

[@thatnissan]

What are you flying in this video? I like that frame.

[@piratefpv3773]

What's that drone? I need to build one

[@wwdawdwadawdaawdwa9337]

hellow, i have Pavo Pico Brushless Whoop Quadcopter HD version can i connect analog VTX?? if yes , how? thank you

[@TechnicallyTom]

Imagine I was standing next to you and every time I saw you start yawing into a turn I went “Let me help you!” and started pushing on your roll stick. That’s about how I feel about most of these new and some of the old flight modes. Acro trainer actually makes sense to me for a beginner. Acro mode but you can’t flip over and you didn’t even mention that one. I think it’s probably better for a beginner to fly in the simulator maybe using angle to begin with but then progressing to acro mode and to either not fly until they have acro down or fly only angle for real until they have mastered acro.

[@lameandboard]

I agree I used acro trainer for a couple days before I switched to full acro. also I didn't start with sim at all....

[@Vousie]

Yeah, if people use a sim, then the trainer stuff isn't really even necessary - do enough practise in the sim in and get all your crashes in there, then when you go to the real quad, you'll be fine even in acro. That's what I did. I thought acro would be so hard as people said, but then it flew...pretty much like it did in the sim, which in hindsight isn't that much of a surprise. The problem is, a lot of people are too impatient for that - they just want to go directly to flying the real quad...

[@terminsane]

I like horizon for LOS. You can blip the throttle and do a little flip.

[@Tydud3]

Hey I'm new, why does it seem like your right stick is inputting yaw instead of roll? does angle or horizon mode input yaw? you werent really moving your left stick at all and yaw input was happening? isnt right stick pitch and roll, and then left stick is throttle and yaw?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

I was definitely inputting yaw with the left stick. Probably just not a lot. Not enough to make the OSD move? I don't know.

[@Tydud3]

@@JoshuaBardwell okay understood, thx for confirmation JB!

[@JoshuaBardwell]

If I was pitched forward past 45 degrees, then right stick would input yaw and left stick would input roll, from the camera's position.

[@kieren7763]

I feel my angle mode experience is different to everyone else judging but content online i find its fast as all hell very intuitive and i think i know why think rc helicopter angle mode is very yaw oriented like a heli when i find acro is very roll oriented so up your yaw authority so your almost coming into a sharp corner backwards and swooping around leaning forward. another tip turn angle limit all the way up and strength down and get your pid tune as good as possible and turn up your master multiplier up as much as possible this will make it more sensitive i personally dont like acro as i like to race and there is alot of wasted stick movement's with acro at least for me anyway and angle is just more intuitive for me as im used to helicopters and video games but please dont sleep on angle mode it is very fun once your used to it

[@Couldntellya]

how did you get the OSD to removable media through the goggles?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

The goggles 2 and Integra can record the OSD.

[@KYLE_FROM_THE_FUTURE]

What quad is this? I don’t think I’ve ever seen you with a big deadcat quad until recently. What ya got going on there Mr.Josh? 7” ? 10”? 😮

[@1Kingsman_]

What goggle is that is that integra?

[@thefreezezone4583]

I have two questions I hope you, scratch that, I know you can answer....Are most quad ESC's today bi-directional? And do you have a video on how to setup a 3D mode in BetaFlight? Thank You for your knowledge and time......

[@thefreezezone4583]

@Joshua Bardwell

[@glitchunicorn]

Interesting

[@DeadCell765]

Angle mode is extremely useful when learning how to fly LOS in full acro cause if you lose control or orientation of the quad you can just slam it into angle mode to keep from crashing.

[@ZerStoiber]

Exactly. Angle and the old horizon mode both could save your quad LOS if you lost track of your orientation. New horizon mode won't do that...

[@matusnovosadek5426]

what kind of face foam do you have on your goggles 2 ?

[@dwn681]

just emailed him asking the same question (no reply yet)

[@matusnovosadek5426]

@@dwn681 let me know pls if you find out

[@dwn681]

@@matusnovosadek5426 JB said iFlight. looks like they have a narrow and wide, and he didn't specify. think I'll try the wide.

[@asotelles]

folks, just fly acro pls all those mods sux. Josh you are the man

[@dieFPVler]

For transitioning from angle to acro mode was a question of around 30 minutes - 2 Packs on a Baby Crocodile. - Although the first pack was like flying drunk ^^ Now it´s almost the other way around, that I can´t fly angle mode anymore, because it feels like flying a tractor.

[@konradlindblad7860]

I am a totalt noob, could you explain how to set up angle and horizon mode and assign it to a three way switch on a controller? I am still just practicing in a sim with a Jumper T20 controller, don't want to crash my Mobula 8. 😬

[@buddyadkins2432]

First, you have to configure the switch on the transmitter. There are videos on how to do this. The first 4 channels are for the basic sticks. Normally, the first open channel is channel 5 which corresponds to AUX1. I generally set a 3 position switch to channel 6 which is AUX2. In Betaflight, go to the MODES tab, find Angle on the left side and do "add range", find Horizon and do "add range". Set both of these to AUX2. Move the switch and watch the "tick" mark move. Move the switch to the 2nd position and move the slider for Horizon so that it is over the "tick". Move the switch to the 3nd position and move the slider for Angle so that it is over the tick. These two sliders should NOT overlap. When the switch is in the 1st position, the tick should not be under either slider; this is ACRO mode. Move the switch to the 2nd position, the tick should be under the Horizon slider. Move the switch to the 3rd position, the tick should be under the Angle slider. Done. Give it a try.

[@MrMartinRome]

When will 4.5 go into full release?

[@JoshuaBardwell]

When there aren't any bugs left.

[@PashaHeaven]

How can i get this OSD feature with display Sticks position for DJI ???

[@InfluxFPV]

you just add it to osd in BF

[@PashaHeaven]

@@InfluxFPV got it! Thx!

[@DoctorrMetal]

I learned my lesson the last time Betaflight came in a new version and I'm still on 4.4.1

[@iCrazy414]

What does that even mean?

[@matt0725]

Horizon’s mode best use was line of sight flippy floppy’s that would blow my friends minds on how I level back out 😂 not that they cut it it’s coming off the rotation

[@marinehm]

How’s Vanover’s mom? Hahahaha. I haven’t heard that in a long while!

[@TaseenAli]

4.5 has issues it changes radio protocol from crossfire to sbus like 8 times for me now and only when i change some other settings and then save it!

[@_.kvng.ky_1081]

I used to actually like angle mode but now idk if it’s just buggy 4.5 or if it’s like that for good but it seems like it literally has no affect on stick input until 100% no matter what I do to rates etc 😂 acro only for me until it’s solved but it was nice being able to flip it in angle and letting someone else give it a go

[@kieren7763]

Try turn up your angle limit and turn down the angle strength

[@JoshuaBardwell]

This video shows the exact phenomenon you describe. I'll be releasing a video explaining how to solve it soon.

[@_.kvng.ky_1081]

@@kieren7763 I’ll give it a shot and see I don’t use it much but it’s nice to still have it setup when I do choose to use it!

[@stst8301]

​@@JoshuaBardwellThat will be great!thanks

[@dfgaJK]

Horizone angle mode strength configured to a pot? 🤔 Adjust it down depending on how confident you're feeling.

[@Dronelover1812]

Hi

[@edcbabc]

Seems like they'd have done better to leave angle etc well alone, looks like it's trying to second guess what you might want to do rather too much.

[@mihavuk]

It should be set to 0, maybe I'm wrong, but it was on 100, Joshua entered value 100 again and saved. But on Github it was written to set this parameter to 0. But maybe I'm missing something.

[@JoshuaBardwell]

No that's backwards. Please refer to the release notes. "The earth referencing behaviour can be disabled with set angle_earth_ref = 0, or its strength halved with set angle_earth_ref = 50."

[@mihavuk]

@@JoshuaBardwell Oh, I'm sorry Joshua, my bad. I'll have to try it I guess.

[@Vousie]

I feel like Betaflight really just needs something like ArduPilot's Acro Trainer instead of trying these strange things with Horizon mode.

[@elxero2189]

Man this really is a beginners channel

[@ChainsawFPV]

Just a FYI Bud, right is the other way........

[@markwilliams5654]

You say acro but on screen it says air mode ...I'm confused Joshua

[@JoshuaBardwell]

Acro is the absence of Angle or Horizon. There is no Acro mode. Acro is just the default way the quad flies when Angle and Horizon are not used. Air means you are flying in Acro with airmode feature activated. Air mode is also not a flight mode but a modification to Acro mode.

[@TheWalter777]

goddamm what a pose. a divine shape hihihi gj. must have a laugh ..often. 👍👍

[@thefreezezone4583]

ok ok, stop it, im now learning too much now :)

[@ProjectMockingbird]

It really is too bad Emuflight is stalled, they are still light years ahead of Betaflight in Angle Mode for angle racing and cine-angle flying. I commend the work the Betaflight devs are putting into their PRs but honestly they should just trust Kevin's work and NotFastEnuf's work before him...

[@freya2551]

4.5 is heavy sh*t, i flashed back 4.4.

[@user-qi1zf2iq8p]

🤔

[@payjota777]

Try basement tuning with angle in 4.5....almost couldn't do it in angle mode and I would be aware that it is not the same if tuning indoors unless you want to do dry wall repair hahah