Justice League vs. The Snyder Cut - Filmmaking Comparison

[@George-vn7co]

I know BVS has a bad rep, but the opening scene with Bruce racing to Wayne towers amid Superman & Zod's destruction of Metropolis, was a great example of using pedestrian/ human perspective to make things more relatable or immediate.

[@Merdicano]

And detractors say that these versions of the characters don't have any humanization, bs

[@biggles258]

I really enjoyed BVS

[@joemubusisi5638]

@@biggles258 me too, its a pity the world doesn't see it that way

[@calebandrews1333]

@@joemubusisi5638 the extended cut is a genuinely great movie!

[@BB-ed4om]

That scene is fantastic

[@laksha2234]

The very fact that there are 2 versions of the same movie allows for so much case study into film making. Its a great opportunity.

[@SimplifyingTechh]

Yes bro

[@jedit2586]

you're right!

[@XgoodbyeX]

The only case study you can do is to see why both failed in there own way

[@XgoodbyeX]

@Silver Fox Sports so why are they rebooting the timeline to start over

[@infinitespace2520]

@@XgoodbyeX Because of some dumb corporate decisions by Warner

[@_moondream]

The Joker scene wasn't part of Snyder's original plan, he wanted to add it now due to the fact that he knows he won't be doing any more of these DC films. It's basically just there to give us a taste of what could have been in future installments. I think most of the "Epilogue" part of the film is there for that purpose. Jared Leto wasn't even paid for this role, he did it out of respect for Snyder and to help show the world what Snyder had planned. Sadly, we'll now never see these films.

[@REDDAWNproject]

The movie ends when silas' tape monologue ends. The rest is just MCU-style post credits scenes.

[@CC-dm3iy]

@@REDDAWNproject yeah because mcu invented post credit scenes🤦‍♂️

[@slimtim1782]

Who knows. Snyder's epic vision works well for streaming. I think that's why this was so successful. Maybe they will allow him to finish his vision and have his own universe on HBO Max.

[@REDDAWNproject]

@@CC-dm3iy never said they did. but post-credit scenes teasing multiple movies and directions for superhero films are pretty commonly associated with the MCU.

[@patoloquend0]

Have faith. #RestoreTheSnyderverse

[@mediamanjamessmith251]

What’s interesting is the various different runtimes this film went through: - 3h 40m was the version the WB execs saw - 3h 20m from a photo Zach shared of JL film reels (likely his would be Ultimate Edition) - Studio mandated it to be shortened (implying around 2h 30m) - Zach leaves due to unfortunate circumstances and they get Whedon to make it 2hs. - HBO Max get involved years later and say “not the 3h 40m version you trimmed, give us all 4hs”. Crazy what this movie (and Zach & Deborah) went through, but it’s nice we all finally got this in the end

[@tmac731]

If only they gave us a 3 hours version of this DC would be in better hands

[@peterp2153]

Actually the ‘film reel photo’ version was 3:34 (214 minutes on the reel) and in line with the 3:40 version execs would’ve screened. Unless I’m completely mistaken. If you remove the credits and the Knightmare scene from the epilogue, it does get things down close to that 3:34 mark. I was going to also exclude the Martian Manhunter scene that ends the film but there was an original version shot and scrapped that involved a couple of alien Green Lanterns. I don’t know if that was ultimately going to be cut from the original Snyder version but if so, that gets things very close to 3:34. Apparently there were several edits by Snyder before he left that got the film under 3 hours (and I believe as low as 2:30). Apparently

[@swap9649]

tbh i wouldve prefered a cut that was 3hrs 30mins. lil fluff throughout couldve been cut and made the film tighter

[@mediamanjamessmith251]

@@peterp2153 The photo he shared on his social media account (Viro I believe) I took a screenshot of and it was sub 3h 30min

[@mediamanjamessmith251]

@@swap9649 Agreed, there’s definitely a decent amount that can be trimmed down (and even removed)

[@kthxbi]

I'm almost glad the whole original vs snyder cut thing happened, because it has provided us with one of the best case studies of just how different two different tellings of the same story can be, how much a different directorial vision and edit can radically change even the most innocuous of scenes

[@valeria262]

It really doesn't no matter how many clowns say it

[@aegerman6317]

@callmecatalyst Get a grip

[@SimonWakefieldUK]

I disagree because Whedons version is still very much Snyders version just with much less run-time allowed. I feel for that kind if analyse Whedon needed to have been given the chance to reshoot so much of the movie that he would have been well over the point where Directors Guild rules would have seen him and not ZS get the director credit (Whedon after all got $25mill to do the reshoots and reedit, ZS got $70mill to finish his cut). A better example would actually be if the Lord and Miller version of Solo came out as Ron Howard refilmed something like 85% of the film using almost the exact same script. That would really highlight what two different people would produce rather than here where we have Whedon basically just editing ZS content around studio mandates some of which were pretty extreme, for example while ZS film is way too long even when focusing on the ones introduced in solo movies already the studio dictated run-time of whedons is way too short, its 23 mins shorter than Avengers where we have already had the majority of the main characters introduced to us over atleast 1 and in some cases 2 films, IMHO there is a pretty good Justice League film in there in between the length of the theatrical cut and ZS's cut

[@p28-nx4qs]

but at what cost😭😭😭

[@TheFunnyGuy9000]

Ayer Cut vs the studio cut wouldn’t be different

[@c76_7bsvxl5gjejqirylydzw]

The saturation is definitely part of the reason the original version looks fake. 3d artists know about the effect it can have, especially on bad renders.

[@XaviKun]

in addition it made the corn fields look like plastic 22:16

[@govind9402]

I agree like these movie who heavily depend on over use of green screens favour dark settings to hide minute flaws. It's even avident around Thanos, most of his sceans are dark lit.

[@wisespidey]

ZSJL is the original.

[@DETHMOKIL]

The t-rex in Jurassic Park still looks great today precisely because of the dark rainy lighting. It desn't help that a lot of the original Snyder stuff was shot with that expectation of dark lighting in mind.

[@squidstone8399]

Snyder shoots his films on set with his own color grading in mind. That's why even if you tweak it off his style,it's gonna look odd

[@ourania_a]

Honestly, I think DC should stick to the more brooding and dark films. Marvel has already very much cornered the market on the lighter toned movies, and DC's darker movies always seem to do very well (The Dark Knight, Joker) edit: alright, i don't actually care that much but i'm tired of people being all pressed. honestly, i don't even think what i said is right. usually i say my silly opinions and nobody notices. so actually, you're all right and you're also all wrong

[@ca8550]

The sami raimi Spiderman Triology was dark even though it was Sony and not Marvel at the time all 3 had dark aspects to it where tobey maguire(Peter) had to make real life altering decisions and was actually going through mental breakdowns and relationship problems with family, girlfriend and best friend

[@MonikwithDaButter]

they should just use the serious tone for movies that are important for the central point of making the dcu, ad for other movies like aquaman or shazam they should try new things just like they did

[@maximeteppe7627]

Not to say it can't be done, but I feel like a more serious tone also sets the expectation of a somewhat more consistent world, which can make the expansion of the world into a massive franchise more challenging. Even though I find a lot of the MCU movies underwhelming, the fact that they are so light in tone makes it easy to accept the more whimsical elements of it. Not that dark stories are automatically more grounded, Snyder's vision is far more stylized than the dark knight for instance, and in many places he's more pessimistic than Nolan is. But as a general rule I'd say the darker movies lend themselves better to a singular author's vision than lighter ones that can more easily be industrialized. Which is why DC seems to have moved away from their interconnected universe and have come back to mostly standalone franchises.

[@somnathsurve7449]

Now The Batman

[@tydshiin5783]

@@ca8550 I wouldn't call Raimi's spiderman dark per say, but more like a dark only director making a light film, trying to hold back the darkness as best

[@corbinpearce7686]

DC's selling point compared to marvel is how dark and gritty it is. It's what the universe what written on, and it's a theme it pulls off very well. Not everything needs to be family friendly.

[@gadpivs]

Cases in point: Neal Adams' Batman versus John Romita's Spider-Man, or the art of John Buscema versus the more reserved and mature art of George Perez from the same era. Or, I don't know, one has Rocket Raccoon and Howard the Duck, and the other has Swamp Thing. Not to say that Marvel isn't obviously dark quite often, especially in the comics, but the foundations and the persistence of themes are different.

[@XgoodbyeX]

dark and gritty comes off as cringe most of the time

[@A93ken]

@@XgoodbyeX Quite the opposite actually. Cracking lame jokes while people are dying in a city seems more cringe(family friendly)

[@XgoodbyeX]

@@A93ken the characters are so plain feels like they have been dumbed down to constantly make stupid mistakes

[@diegoparra1035]

@@XgoodbyeX quite the opposite

[@mattragusa210]

The messed up part is that the film is still very upbeat & hopeful. This is probably Snyder's most lighthearted movie yet. Even the jokes are better in this version.

[@knightofberenike9633]

The whole point of Justice League is that Superman’s heroic sacrifice against Doomsday inspires Batman and the other heroes to be better; igniting a lighter, more hopeful tone.

[@davidw.2791]

And if you take out the human blood splatter and f bombs this would still have made it to pg 13.

[@internetdinosaur8810]

This movie is probably the most family friendly R-rated movie ever

[@dajokahbaby1506]

@@internetdinosaur8810 yeah honestly it’s a hard PG-13 like the animated DC movies

[@MrImastinker]

I think Man of Steel's a close second. It's pretty serious and intense, but not *dark* .

[@TheCasualSubculturist]

Original was so forgettable to me that watching Snyder cut actually felt like a new movie.

[@sharinngan5084]

Yeah, I still didn’t think it was some crazy masterpiece or whatever and there was times it dragged. But it felt like it had actual purpose and I didn’t want to stop watching it

[@practical_theory]

Exactly. Thank God I don't remember shit from that movie.

[@Lucky_Chase]

It was. He developed the characters. Were not watching the second installment of Serenity this time around. Snyder adds levity. He returned with a fresh set of eyes. That's what it really needed. Wonder Woman is a antihero in the comics. I'd take Snyder's perspective as a happy medium over Whedon's brain fart in a heartbeat. She can't be bothered by comic relief.

[@Lucky_Chase]

@@sharinngan5084 That's the point. Whedon just fondled the film like an incel allowed to get some touch by an indecisive yet desperate wallflower girl at a high school dance. 😆 Just all thumbs.

[@SwolPanda]

This comment is what I’ve been looking for.

[@ZA-7]

I watched the movie with my mom without telling her it was a 4 hour long movie and she didn't even fall asleep, she didn't complain. She wanted to see more!

[@richardabraham1101]

That's a cool mom.

[@Muleek.420]

Bro my mama mind was blown watching this masterpiece

[@rianmacdonald9454]

i really like the zach synder version, was much much better. made a lot more sense - the cut up version was so confusing it made it un-watchable.

[@gt5836]

My mum watched it TWICE, and she's not even a fan of superhero movies at all

[@dadiysbest9513]

Yes...snyder made us want to watch more...

[@phoenix_in_crimsontruth6184]

8:20 - I really liked how the opening shots in the Snyder Cut were longer and able to breathe, and it's already telling us exactly what is happening rather than just leaving us to guess the context of the scene as it jumps right into the action sequences. I also liked how different WW felt like as a character in that instance. The scene actually looks like it's setting up a character instead of just showing off cool effects or something like that.

[@hunterkiller1440]

I think the Znyder cut has a better balance of humor and darkness. Let Flash be the comic relief, other humor could based on situational and shouldn't be forced. I kinda wished the story had a bit more moral dilemma and a philosophical debate whether there should be a moral obligation to ensure the dead should stay dead or life deserves a second chance of living.

[@Redactedredacted5837]

It would be hard to implement the dilemma in there when the JL absolutely needs Superman to defeat the enemy. There was no chance of them beating Steppenwolf without him.

[@beatstar2]

It's Snyder, Snyder Cut.

[@W3irdWombat]

I do miss the “just save one” like from Batman to flash scene though.

[@j2174]

@@W3irdWombat There were a few bits from Whedon's that I think could have stayed. Personally I liked the rooftop scene with Batman, felt very Gotham. We haven't got to see that for Batfleck. I also didn't think the video part of Superman was all that bad - although it should have been the Shazam kids clearly filming it! (of course the cgi skin is the biggest issue with it)

[@bachnguyen7411]

I like this but they tried that with BvS and got crucified (No pun intended)

[@Leinarth_]

The whole Snyder's Cut felt like reading a comic book. If you read comics you know that they are filled with scenes like the WW/Alfred tea scene or the Cyborg helping a stranger woman scene.

[@jasonsitu]

Yes that's it! The Snyder cut felt like I'm reading a graphic novel where the original felt like an episode in a TV show.

[@rolanddeschain6089]

Good comics. There are a lot comics, especially superhero comics, which have a pacing that is way too fast for my taste. Two sides or even two panels are sometimes intended to describe an important plotpoint or relationship. That of course depends on how you like it, what age group the story is aimed at and for example whether you are more used to reading novels but I often think to myself "Come on! Where are the emotions? Create characters and not just a plot . "

[@IvanoForgione]

yeah, I've always said that Snyder nails comics in movies like nobody else. Love his style in direction

[@86lanzo]

Ye it did..but that wasn't a good thing in my book... nearly every shot in the snyder cut felt like it could be a comic panel... But..alot..was just style over substance...a good example of this is supermans death scream at the start... screaming when his whole chest got pierced...good shot..but doesn't really make sense...the movie looks good but you just can't think about it.

[@twsartadventures3660]

No, it doesn't, at all. Comic book pacing is much quicker because the stories are much shorter. Have you ever read a comic book? They aren't novels, people dont just blather on for pages. Even just two paragraphs is pushing it one page... plus, all of your praise is the literal opposite intention of Alan Moore with Watchmen. Snyder doesnt understand the source material whatsoever for anything he makes. Go re-watch Sucker Punch and say anything positive other then "well, the CGI looks good"...

[@JesseWilliam95]

I really enjoyed Cyborg giving that woman the money.

[@painepunk8947]

@@user-bl1zt9xg7f you mean like your marvel movies making lameass jokes every minute? Okay.

[@thepinkjournalrehearsalpro5390]

Yea but wasn’t he standing a little close lol

[@JesseWilliam95]

@@thepinkjournalrehearsalpro5390 I'll give you that

[@JesseWilliam95]

@@user-bl1zt9xg7f to each his/her own

[@rokaanalzeer7148]

It was a sweet moment. And showed that he does have a good heart and sees the potential of what he can do with his powers. The good that comes out of it.

[@chrisdavis2161]

The Knightmare scene with the Joker was used to expand the story arc past just one or two films--both , in past and future. It gave great depth of how Batman and Joker's individual character arcs brought them together for an unlikely alliance. But, it also highlights the fears of Bruce (because afterall, it is a dream): Him actually working with the Joker, uncontrollable alien Superman, him being responsible for Robin's death. To me, the scene was very perfect and very necessary

[@luffytaro1237]

felt bad for afleck. I felt like he was humiliated as to how he looked from whedons version, to the point people hated him. Because prio to the release of justice league, he was ready, very excited to do solo Batman film, but suddenly he turned it down. Man i feel him.

[@zant2278]

It's crazy how Josstice League destroyed so much of the DCEU

[@LeoMessiHD3]

it’s the same case with Andrew Garfield as Spiderman too i think. they both would’ve been so good but the writing let them down.

[@alastor1227]

@@zant2278 It wasn't doing well after BvS or Suicide Squad what do you mean lmao

[@thenaysays]

@@alastor1227 was probably the straw that broke the camel's back

[@transfo47]

@@alastor1227 If JL did well, ZSJL would not exist.

[@marcovi2806]

13:36 In the Whedon cut the janitor looks at the parademon without expressing any emotion. In the Snyder cut another shot is used in where the janitor is actually terrified and his facial expression sells it

[@ThomasFlight]

Yeah good catch. Another great example of how forcing something down because of running time hurts the emotion/drama of the film.

[@patfer1189]

To be clear, it wasn't "$70 million for reshoots". It was mostly for finishing VFX, specially many scenes that were 100% digital, plus music, editing, etc. The only 'new' things that were shot were the epilogue Knightmare scene and the outside of Louis' apartment when Martian Manhunter appears for the first time. The rest was post production work.

[@TheUltimateWriterNZ]

Wasn’t aware that the entire MM shoe-horn was reshoots

[@jacowboy]

@@TheUltimateWriterNZ Yeah, the ending was even a weirder case, because he origianlly shot an Affleck scene, but it was all with green lightning since he planned to do a GL cameo first, but WB said no, so he put MM instead and had to reshoot Ben as well (hence why he looked soooo different). As for the Martha/MM scene, that was supposed to be the only MM cameo, and he had shot the Martha half of it, but in 2020 he shot Harry Lennix's half (probably on a green screen). The "reshoots" were minimal... 99% of the movie he shot back in 2016 or whenever he did.

[@DAMNBros]

That first MM scene was no a reshoot if Im not mistaken. Snyder drew a storyboard for that scene. I think the MM scene at the end was a reshoot or at least they changed it from GL to MM

[@MrJ1Horrordirector]

@@DAMNBros ur right The scene with Martian and affleck at The end was new because if u guys take a closer look at ben he is sninny and healthy like he looks today and The rest of The movie he's fit as hell. An example: in josstice League some scenes with ben he looks fit and in many others he looks bloated cuz by The time of reshoots he wasnt fit no more nor sninny and healthy he was drinking alot and it shows. (Pardon my weirdd english Btw Lol it aint my lenguage)

[@ajreyes1262]

yeah, the most of the casts even said they're not contacted for a reshoot

[@scotchwars3425]

I love the scene where Cyborg fills the struggling mother's bank account with a few hundred thousand dollars

[@rob6912]

You should check out doom patrol, he's introduced the exact same surprisingly

[@joshportie]

Cyborg causes inflation and crashes the value of the dollar. Good job cyborg.

[@Excalis3344]

even bruce wayne having more shadows on his face makes ALL the difference.

[@antreasfournarakis1373]

yes

[@onkkell]

and him not being a complete alcoholic at the time of filming certainly helps the look

[@DeathCluntch]

dude even a hairstyle too...Wheadon trying to make Iron man copy ...Snyder Bruce wayne

[@shanok3]

Just shoot it in chrome filter, better yet, don't take the cap off the camera. ALL BLACK. GRITTY. DARK.

[@dominiquejones3805]

Real talk

[@kianlimbos689]

The fact that they made Steppenwolf look badass and cute on the eyes at the same time... I mean, the fact that they made Steppenwolf isn't just a normal villain who destroy earth because he's a villain but really just wants to go home really made me feel sad for him, good job Snyder

[@Tzgrey77]

Your like aww poor guy, Then he gets his fricken head cut off

[@westaquil]

I agree. I find myself feeling sorry for him everytime he’s on the screen, especially when he’s talking to Darkseid and Desaad.

[@TonyStarSmif]

Was he still alive with his head cut off ? D stepped on it and the eyes stopped glowing

[@fabuloussecretstandopawaaa9340]

@@TonyStarSmif well living beings do get a few seconds of consciousness when they get beheaded

[@Tzgrey77]

@@fabuloussecretstandopawaaa9340and the mother box energy absorbed into him so I bet there some residual enegy left in him

[@randychimp4298]

I would argue that the scene showing Cyborg exploring his abilities, it's not necessarily redundant to show the idea that he can manipulate the world economy and then showing him adding money to someones account. The first step is his father explaining how limitless his abilities are with regards to the world economy, but then he singles out one person, someone who struggles and works hard, and helps them. A guy who could topple governments with a thought is focused on helping one person in that moment. It's his humanity shining through the "limitless" machinery and access he has.

[@bagelized]

That's a very good analysis of the scene.

[@ExtremeMadnessX]

It's weird how some people have problem with that. Like how he supposedly stealing from someone else. I assume that money is from some billionaire who won't even noticed missed 100.000 dollars.

[@chemax79]

@@ExtremeMadnessX Yeah, nice morality you have here, it's fine to steal money if the person is rich. It's still stealing

[@ExtremeMadnessX]

@@chemax79 They already stealing all that money with avoiding taxes. It's fair play to steal what they don't deserve to have.

[@TheJas20]

Exactly. "The question/challenge isnt how to do it, it's how _not_ to do it".

[@pandalandalopalis6515]

i dont know if this was intentional but i love how you parallel the differences in tone with how you film YOURSELF talking. one version has a monochrome shirt with you almost in the middle, right behind the light so it feels darker; the other version has a coloured shirt with you on the side of the frame with other things in the shot that make it feel more open, and the lighting source to the side which makes it feel brighter. i see u.

[@Kelly99844]

In terms of tone, editing, and effects, Zack Snyder has always been able to make dc films look like comics on screen which I really appreciate.

[@reat964]

especially with the size of the screen, the square reminded me of a comic panel

[@planetfrank1994]

@@reat964 ikr! Batman and Supes look so epic and larger than life in that aspect ratio. Would love to watch all 4 hours of the film in IMAX for sure

[@John-X]

I like 300, and Watchmen. Watchmen in particular I thought was a masterpiece, but I really hate Snyder's mainline DC comics movies. Man of Steel, BvS & Justice League, none of those movies are anything like the comics, the characters don't act like they do in the comics, and basically just made Justice League emo. The best adaptation of DC comics was Paul Dini and Bruce Timm's DCAU.

[@josiahcruz9678]

@@John-X I understand why, but movies really should not be held to the comics they are based on (as weird as that wording sounds). Movies, just like comic books, cartoon movies, etc are just more avenues of approach for telling stories of characters. Plus, people say "The characters don't act how they do in the comics" as if every comic involving a specific characters has ever been the same and the characters traits have been the same as well. There's multiple stories and multiple versions of many characters in the comics. Why is it a problem when a movie protests a character a little different?

[@garagemdeluxo]

I was thinking exactly that when I was watching the movie earlier.The cliche things, the details to bring emotion, the little things (butterfly at the Superman fingers...), seems a lot with comic books.

[@kyrios0307]

Stakes in Joss JL: Russian family in the middle of a shithole city Stakes in ZSJL: Resurrecting Superman hints a possible future where he would succumb to the Anti-Life Equation and the world gets fucked. The boxes did achieve Unity and the explosion even disintegrated Superman. Darkseid was about to walk out of the Boomtube. It's up to The Flash to save the day.

[@sanderwillems8603]

Epilogue: Add to that, the Flash being indecisive and insecure about his power yet entirely aware of what he "could" be, and placing the Flash in a situation where he has literally no time to ask for help or think about consequences. Forcing him to believe in himself, and running faster than the speed of light, breaking the Speedforce and reversing time just enough to stop this from happening. This scene cemented this movies superiority over the Joss cut.

[@BRAZILIAN_MIKU]

@@sanderwillems8603 I saw some people commenting about his speech while reversing the time, some say he was just trying to encourage himself, but what I understood was that he was so scared in that moment that he started to say his last words, and if that is true they made him a more believable character

[@KSA9495]

@@sanderwillems8603 That was without a doubt the best scene in any of the versions. Gave me freakin' goosebumps!

[@sam-pnw]

stakes in joss jl, release now; stakes in zsjl you have all the time you need.

[@liggerstuxin1]

The opening death of Superman with his scream heard around the world was powerful to me.

[@potterslaw1463]

The God is dead The bell has rung

[@ShirazEsat]

Actual this opening really confused me, but after watching this comparison I'm going to have to watch the Snyder cut again

[@dd_doesit]

@@ShirazEsat it means that everyone around the world heard superman’s dying cry. basically means that the “God” who was being talked about for years actually died and it’s a huge moment in the world

[@liggerstuxin1]

@Lujack Shaw lol when was that story created? I heard there’s one where he moves a black hole. Sneezing and destroying a GALAXY is a bit overpowered lmfao. His strength has to be the most inconsistent in all comics. With all that power and we see him grunt or grimace to pick up a big rock or a plane or whatever. Seems like he can do any physical feat but HAS to grunt no matter the weight.

[@thedarkfrost2351]

I thought it was really dumb tbh. I get the metaphor but Snyder over kills it

[@thecamposkid]

Snyder Cut is the Original Film. The 2017 release is an example of how actors were told to go back to work after clocking out. And the new guy is put in charge to manage.

[@jonseyjones321]

2:11 The $70 million for Zack Snyder's Justice League went to a lot more than the two scenes of additional photography. The $70 million went to finishing the visual effects that weren't originally finished, redoing the visual effects on Steppenwolf, paying for the editor (and all the other personel responsible for the film, like colour grading, foley, and whatnot), the score, the marketing, and probably other things we don't know of. Lots of people seem to think the $70 million was just for the end scene in the Knightmare timeline, and grossly disregard what it was used for and how far that budget was stretched to complete the film.

[@therealsteel1634]

The knightmare scene was also filmed in snyders backyard

[@jonseyjones321]

@@therealsteel1634 it wasn't. They filmed Wayne T Carr in Zack's backyard for a Green Lantern scene, but that didn't make it into the film.

[@tinapaytinapay]

Well spend IMO, steppenwolfs armor was so freakin cool

[@adzappin_2567]

@@jonseyjones321 no, the knightmare scene was filmed in snyder’s back yard. He literally talks about inviting jared leto and ben affleck to his house to finish

[@npcimknot958]

right? they went back to the original design. i follow the artist he was freaking out lol. and that nightmare scene. so good

[@filmflim]

God, that iPhone intro with the kids...I forgot how much it made me cringe.

[@margarethmichelina5146]

And they straightly copied it from Spiderman Homecoming opening when Peter recorded himself in Germany airport which came out few months before Josstice League!

[@tylerthompson9822]

I literally never made it past that and never went back until Zack released his cut 👏🏾👌🏾🙌🏾👑

[@Jose-se9pu]

The scene was ok, the problem was Henry's face

[@Shockguey]

@@Jose-se9pu No the dialogue was still bad.

[@rajulimbu8932]

@@Jose-se9pu ,?,fzd,,!!

[@MINDSPARK-u6e]

The scene with Alfred in the tea made me feel that Alfred loves doing what he does and he does it with class and prestige

[@dominiquejones3805]

Very subtle scene but added depth 2 his character

[@luthorpca]

I loved the video and the way you strictly approach the cinematographic theme. Just one thing... I would NEVER call Whedon's collage "the original".

[@crazyinsanepenguin]

It literally is by definition the original though

[@luthorpca]

@@crazyinsanepenguin I wouldn't call it original. Original was what was recorded first, and Whedon created his own collage of that original material with reshots that he recorded.

[@Deadbeatcow]

​@@luthorpcait's the originally released film

[@glugchugjuthunga1887]

@@luthorpcayou are partially right, but Whedon’s version was released as the original first Justice League; there is a reason why Snyder’s version is called Snyder Cut

[@peterp2153]

For purposes of the discussion, ‘original’ is fine. Usually, I just refer to it as the theatrical version.

[@Zach-kz2sk]

Flash overcoming fear, the symbolism of fathers and father figures, Cyborg’s transformation, it was all such a wonderful addition

[@ThreadBomb]

Except I think the point in this video was that the Flash fear arc was in the Whedon version, not the Snyder version.

[@raphulali8937]

@@ThreadBomb but it was in synder cut too ...the convo between him and his father shows the conflict.

[@guycoburn1633]

"Josstice League" made Flash into a wimp, afraid to "do battle." I much preferred ZSJL's Flash, who jumped in to do his part, including battles. I'm still not crazy about the casting of Ezra Miller, but he was much better in ZSJL.

[@ZA-7]

@@ThreadBomb Josstice league's Flash is a clown

[@AndrewKeyz]

"I'm not broken... and I'm not alone." Sold it for me.

[@protodevilin]

Would have liked to see you address the villain, Steppenwolf. Aside from his fake, plasticine appearance in the Whedon cut, he also completely lacked any meaningful arc, and seemed almost non-threatening. In the Snyder cut, not only was his appearance more real and intimidating, he was more expressive, more emotional, and he was given an arc that almost makes you sympathize with him a bit. Steppenwolf in the Snyder cut seemed like a powerful, intractable threat, and the implication that he was more or less a slave to Darkseid made you realize that Darkseid had to be a truly scary bastard.

[@randommiker]

Darkseid made Thanos from MCU look primitive. Darkseid didn't talk hot air and rather just jumped to the point.

[@iunderstanphotography2780]

" In the Snyder cut, not only was his appearance more real and intimidating, he was more expressive, more emotional, and he was given an arc that almost makes you sympathize with him a bit" This was so true. Steppenwolf was a real creature with desires, fears, etc vs the Zealot in Whedons cut

[@goldenhate6649]

@@iunderstanphotography2780 Yup, the entire plot line with Darkseid holding his family hostage makes steppenwolf a more meaningful villian as well rather than just another villian to kill. Albeit, the chances steppen's family was alive is probably 0.

[@jordank6961]

Bruh best thing for me was Steppenwolf was Darksied's uncle. And he was trying to get redemption. I can't remember where i learned steppenwolf is how uncle

[@ben2808]

Jesus Christ loves you

[@davidjames579]

Snyder's looks like a movie, whereas Whedon's looks like a CW Show.

[@OVETMUSIC]

Whedon's version is a parody and, forgive me, a piece of $hit. That’s right! A. Piece. Of. SHITE! Snyder Cut is one of the best movies I have ever seen. And I have watched billions n trillions of movies.

[@李建国-q6s]

exactly.

[@pepsififa3205]

Lmao

[@tazojj3717]

@@OVETMUSIC lmao

[@EFun5273]

With all due respect, i think calling Josstice League a CW show is an insult to CW show

[@riddhabose9653]

Its been a very long time since I had seen such a brilliant video. Straight from the accurate analysis to the appropriate analogies through the editing. Superb effort man! True creator.

[@jamesb4263]

Snyder Cut helped me understand why I hated the Whedon version . I feel sorry for Ben Affleck as I think the terrible Whedon version actually contributed to negative press he was getting for his Batman .

[@darthkek1953]

The new Batman movies is going to be a disaster.

[@ImTheReverse]

​@@darthkek1953 You mean the Robert Pattinson movies?

[@jvincent14]

@@darthkek1953 pattinson is gonna be great

[@seriyooow310]

@@darthkek1953 When the director and lead actors hate each other, it's gonna be a disaster.

[@dominiquejones3805]

I like Affleck as Batman definitely the physicality of his scenes

[@SerhatUzunbayir]

These two versions should be discussed in detail to the students during their filmmaking educations.

[@Indigo_1001]

There are FAR more important and influential films for film students to watch then Justice League my dude.

[@dradra2day]

@@Indigo_1001 no it's a good idea to include. My dude.

[@ludwinggonzalezarroyo1743]

Well, yeah! Consider that a blockbuster movie was done by different directors and look what came out. You don’t see that everyday.

[@Eruerucamicaminono]

Why

[@planetfrank1994]

@@Indigo_1001 considering the impact and popularity of superhero films these days, who's to say they aren't influential in this era?

[@VeeDCreate]

I like my Marvel movies at lighter tone and DC to be dark. They both have their place. This way when there’s a dark moment in Marvel, it stands out and the other way around for DC.

[@TGHunter]

With marvel being lighter with little dark moments, you feel how interesting their characters are, making you see the struggle they have. With DC being dark with light moments, you feel the human side of the characters, it gives you hope in gods again.

[@Concord003]

Good point! I agree completely.

[@jasonbat5537]

I like my comic book movies to be true to the characters, Batman dark & gritty, Shazam, light & fun. Wonder Woman had the perfect tone, Man of Steel was hit & miss for me because Superman isn't dark

[@MultiStrings123]

Marvel can do dark stuff too, especially with their Netflix adaptation of daredevil, the punisher, Luke Cage those are dark undertones, but DC is more recognizable tbh

[@youdontknowme2913]

@@jasonbat5537 superman was having a journey of self discovery while everything wanted to kill him or the planet so it was supposed to dark. The reason why I liked this version because still being dark I can clearly see the optimism of superman comming out as the snyderverse story progress

[@thecasualfly]

I am team synder cut.. The 4:3 perspective threw me for a loop at first but after getting the framing of characters etc it made so much more sense..

[@manu1990v]

The grandiosity of the scene explaining Cyborg's powers was part of the point of the scene itself. It's meant to build/hype him up, to make you wonder what he will do with this godlike power. The next scene? He helps someone else he doesn't even know in a lifechanging way. It tells all you need to know about him, I think. Exposition-wise? Yes, redundant, sure. As a character note? It's invaluable.

[@edgeofvision]

Yeah I felt like a lot of the bits called extraneous here are part of what makes the movie so special. I mean, the Flash's intro shows up here in the montage of extraneous bits when he's talking about pacing, but I couldn't imagine the film without it. It's the most beautiful thing I've seen in a superhero film and it takes on a tragic resonance in light of Snyder's loss.

[@seabass5214]

yep, ill admit when it first started I was like yeaaaah I could see why this was cut. but by the end my only thought was damn cyborg is insanely powerful lmao, before that I never really had a sense of what exactly his powers were.

[@planetfrank1994]

@@edgeofvision the Flash intro scene was one of the best! My bf is a huge fan of the series and was horribly let down by Joss's cut. When he saw this scene he was on the edge of his seat with a huge grin on his face. I love how Zack gave every single character so much love and screentime.

[@Merdicano]

@@seabass5214 Same thoughts, I feel like it really gave a massive exploration at how incredibly valuable and powerful Cyborg's powers are and how intelligent he is without making him look like an all-mighty Gary Stu beyond his physical strength.

[@formoftherapy]

Going off the trailer I thought the grading was too dark and desaturated and then I saw the film and it looked great. I feel like Snyder’s style is interesting where he has a strange uncanny valley style of VFX and CGI. It looks fake and real at the same time and the color grading being darker compliments that look. The studio cut being bright and vibrant made the whole film look so cheap? I watched the studio cut right after Zack’s and it’s borderline unwatchable from a visual standpoint alone. All the characters look so apparently in front of a green screen but then the Joss reshoots shots are somehow even WORSE and stand out more.

[@alwaysricebeforeguys2343]

I have to agree with you on that. The lighting and darker, less vibrant tone has an immense impact on the overall look. I like the darker look more... I love your videos by the way!!

[@meric2363]

I think it avoids uncanny valley because he embraces it. The problem with the valley is attempting perfect realism and falling short. But if perfect realism was never the goal, the mind accepts it. Snyder's scenes are so manicured with such an obvious color grading, that it stays consistent. They're always behind green screen, but that's so that Snyder can have the scene composition and color he wants. Michael Bay does a similar thing with making his humans look orange standing in front of a way oversaturated sky and while it would normally look abysmal, since Bay's style is garish and over the top to begin with, so the mind accepts the consistency.

[@dheazahrap]

Wow PD!! Nice to see you

[@SOPHOCLESIFY]

100% The Snyder cut felt like an epic saga, a cohesive artistic vision being realized. The theatrical cut felt flat and lifeless despite being more bright and vibrant. Snyder had a vision and goddamn did he know how to bring it to life.

[@fnfn9229]

Just look at steppenwolfs armor before and after

[@Connor_Baldczus]

I think the Cyborg giving Money scene did exactly the same thing the Wonder Woman talking to the girl scene did. It humanized him and showed, that even though he is angry and depressed about everything going on, he still wants to do good for the world. And not only that, but it showed him the good sides of being a Cyborg and that those in fact ARE gifts he has, like WW said. It was very important to build his arc of acceptance and to build his character.

[@billywashere6965]

Well said, and I agree 100%. In fact, the Cyborg scene of him giving money to the woman and her kids is one of the few scenes that actually really stood out to me regarding the character development of Cyborg. I think if the audience manages to remember a scene without being reminded of the setup, then the director did his job right.

[@TTHEREV]

i agree,from my point of view was like reading a one-shot comic about cyborg introducing his character to the later movie and that gives him more taste

[@TheDeathmail]

It wasn't the scene with him giving the lady money that he said was bad, but the scene with the bull and bear fighting. He said that since the scene with the mother already showed that anyways, the weird fight scene was redundant.

[@Connor_Baldczus]

@@TheDeathmail well no he didn't say that, which was the problem. I mean with the bulls fighting, yes he did say that and I agree with him, but right after ( 18:39 ) he basically just says"Cyborg hacking the atm to give money to the poor family was redundant, because it established the same thing as the bulls fighting scene" which I don't think due to my above explained reasons. The bull scene explains how easy it is for him and what he COULD do. The atm scene on the other hand also shows his humanity and his good heart and really fully shows what a gift these skills really are.

[@robertoortizespinoza795]

Hardly anyone realizes that Cyborg committed a crime. Either the money the mother received with her daughter had to come from someone else's account, or it was counterfeit bills. There is an irreverent undercurrent to the law in Snyder's filmography. He breaks them needlessly. The scene of Wonder Woman talking to the girl is also demagoguery. She knows that the girl cannot be what she wants to be, because she is not an immortal goddess as she is. Snyder's philosophy is deplorable.

[@TheMuseHouseOfficial]

The more i see them side by side the more i appreciate Snyder's cinematography.

[@severedmetal]

I feel like there is no reason to ever watch the Whedon version again in my life.

[@TheBigEmstos]

you people are so stupid acting like snyder's version is some sort of masterpiece all ruined by whedon. Theyre both absolutely awful, and thats because whedon was given the impossible task of fixing snyders piece of poop

[@spider-manunknown9193]

@@TheBigEmstos your opinion is not a fact it’s an OPINION it’s our OPINION for think Zack Snyder Justice league is a masterpiece. I think it’s perfect but I’m not going around and saying wheddon version is complete garbage but I can say it’s bad but not to the Snyder cut because we finally have a good life action Justice league film. My opinion

[@youdontknowme2913]

@@TheBigEmstos heh, I agree u have an opinion, but not gonna matter since millions already disagree with u

[@severedmetal]

I never said the Snyder version was a masterpiece, but that doesn’t need to be said to acknowledge that the Whedon version is the inferior version.

[@Ryan-pg1tw]

maybe you should express yourself more respectful

[@smile612]

he made every character feel as important as superman. on the other hand, superman felt too overpowered In whewhe's cut. everyone had their part to play In snyders cut.

[@lex_rodriguez]

But he felt more like Superman in the Whedon reshoots.

[@caddlife5619]

@@lex_rodriguez I agree he felt more like Superman, but he didn’t feel like Clark. He felt like some dude took control of Clark’s body, like a doppelgänger, and had to learn to be Clark.

[@alanuchiha]

soo true

[@serdsouza6670]

Agreed! Flash's time travel scene and all the Cyborg scenes were a great improvement, and all the characters felt individuals in the Snyder Cut, compared to Wheadon's, where they just felt like they were playing second fiddle to Batman, Superman and Wonderwoman

[@Indigo_1001]

@@caddlife5619 Funny, that’s how I feel about this Superman in general since Man of Steel. A Superman that looks and sound like him, but have non of the charisma and hart of the character. Cavill is a great guy in person, but I never see that in any of his rolls (I find him better as a badass quite type). When Batman is more emotional, charming and funny then Superman WITHIN the same movie, you have a problem,

[@izzyr9590]

I think the atm scene really gives you a sense that Victor Stone is still a kid. And that makes him very different from everyone else (other than flash)

[@abhibhoir027]

Yup, it actually shows that how superheroes would save people realistically. It's not necessary for superheroes to always save people during alien attacks and bank robberies. There are people in the real world who need saving like this and this scene makes it much better.

[@P.Whitestrake]

It's also to show a hero who saved someone in distress realistically & it fits his mood at that time. People on twitter complained about Cyborg screwing up the monetary system & overthinking about how the money came by, while in the movie through Cyborg's perspective, he just saw a single mum in a deep financial trouble that could ruin her life & her son's future. Also, we then saw that Cyborg actually didn't give a shite about the world in general, that could include monetary system, money, & the society. His focus was on an individual that he considered needing his help, not the world. That's why he said, "F**k the world."

[@John-X]

no way dude this version of Cyborg was so depressing and boring. Teen Titans (2003)'s Cyborg was the best in personality and design.

[@badelle5303]

@@John-X cry harder

[@John-X]

@@badelle5303 it's the truth, cope & seethe fanboy

[@taranjeetgill7696]

I notice how even your video is also edited the same way. Your left side of the frame is colorful and bright while the right side is dark and subtle. It helped me stay focus on what you were saying when the comparison was not in screen. If it's thought and done then you are brilliant and genius.

[@wickedchild8501]

3:21 in the Snyder Cut the theme actually fits Arthur's personality trying to compensate his emotional weakness whereas in the Whedon Cut he just looks like Lobo

[@Jetix34]

This comment aged well

[@RonsaRRR]

Because he is Lobo.

[@yimpyoi9808]

tbh i like both scenes. they paint different pictures for the character of arthur but both are effective in what they are trying to accomplish. the synder version definitely fits this film better though.

[@mahendrakrisnamurti9599]

Fun fact, he really wants to be Lobo

[@Warriorten10]

20:56 Snyder did this exact thing in Man of Steel having named side characters on the ground during the destruction of Metropolis. People criticized how the destruction made them feel (when that was the point) so at the end of BvS and ZSJL, they specifically make it clear that the places they're fighting are uninhabited.

[@fearedjames]

@Rōnin Legit tho. I love that portrayal in MoS. It gives a fairly upbeat film with a grandiose tone feel significant, because every moment you can tell shit is getting much worse, and the entire final fight is "This is what happens when you have DBZ characters battle in a populated area". It ties into BvS so damn well because it reinforces all the films points home. Fucking plebians.

[@YannickTMessiah]

@@fearedjames Exactly

[@azelynhirano]

Not for BvS, actually. Superman specifically questions why Batman brought Doomsday back into the city in that scene.

[@Warriorten10]

@@azelynhirano "Because the port is abandoned"

[@sunsetman22]

I found it extremely interesting how Steppie and his forces went for a secret invasion. a stark contrast to Zod and the kryptonians with their bombastic approach. had there been no Justice League, the unity would've wiped Earth clean as a plate without a warning!

[@ZX-Su]

Snyder cut allowed me to use my brain, actually think about the story and the meaning behind it, also appreciate the mind behind this film.

[@Urbxx]

Seeing this, the original version made flash dumbest, unnecessarily stupid, and that is one of the reasons that I didn't like Ezra's flash.

[@georginatoland]

Whedon Cut = A TV show. Snyder Cut = An epic opera. I’m glad that I waited to see the Snyder cut first.

[@almostshawn3230]

Dont insult tv shows like that

[@govind9402]

Luck you , I saw the Whedon cut in 17 and he made Bats look like a fool,. If you didn't want it , don't try.

[@Sujeesh_Bhosri]

I like Joss Whedon's Justice League. It was fun to watch. Snyders cut is too boring

[@ApolloCalrissian]

@@Sujeesh_Bhosri Absolute Plebeian-tier shit taste.

[@flipflappoo7571]

@@ApolloCalrissian probably just a troll. Every being with eyes can see which one is better (snyder obviously)..... Or he doesn't have an eyes.

[@ThomasFlight]

Yes there are spoilers. - I just released a bonus video for my $5 Patrons that explores the distinction between "Film Form" and "Film Content"- while it's not directly about The Snyder Cut it's a commentary that expounds on some of the things I talk about in this video, and that grew out of some deleted scenes from this video. If that sounds interesting to you, become a Patron to support my channel and get access to this and other bonus videos: www.patreon.com/posts/49463884

[@ryanedwards7487]

Why is it better? Because if you are going to have Steppenwulf, Desaad, and freaking Darksied in your movie, you can't have it all being lighthearted or a "romp", there has to be some darkness. That's why I don't think Age of Ultron was as strong as it could have been (James Spader was a great Ultron even without the utter disdain and Pym love/hate from the comics, because even his jokes had that "Reddington Menace" underneath them), because Ultron and Strucker are some very dark characters in the comics, so witty banter only works when it's Spider-Man breaking tension...otherwise no one is quipping during those battles. This is a DC Universe story with Steppenwulf, parademons, Mother Boxes and New Gods. Aside from Barry Allen, no one is making jokes, and even he would be very toned down. This, for the Justice League is like that scene in Infinity War where Tony has only heard the name "Thanos" and is already stretching and mentally preparing. The stakes are too high, even the jokester is getting into combat mode.

[@Lksz-l9k]

You should make some graphic with the data [mostly the numbers] you've gathered. Post it here and somewhere else, it could really go viral. At least it would be fun for us to see.

[@ThomasFlight]

Someone should feel free to use my numbers and do it if you want! Just send it to me if you do: [e-mail]

[@tesspulido]

Brilliant point about Whedon also being limited by forcing a lighter tone on the darker existing material... it's about consistency. It's also cool that you started with looking at which scenes worked for you *then* try to find out why. Great analysis!

[@mati.jaimee]

the money that the Snyder Cut uses wasnt for reshoots was for the cgi

[@V2040V]

The best parts of the snyder cut is Flash & Cyborg's character development. Hands down my favorite parts about this movie. The movie showed a better character arc for them as well as Steppenwolf, you could actually feel sorry for him since his motive was trying to redeem himself. There are so many other things I could say about how good this film is!

[@pepsififa3205]

There's a scene in ZSJL where I genuinely feel bad.. when he's talking to dasaad.. that was just epic.. whedon screwed us.. if the ZS version would've come out in theaters all those years ago and not the crap we got im sure we'd still have a Zack Snyder DC universe

[@ChristianGabino]

5:13 That one scene where Barry Allen as ‘The Flash’ landed on Diana as Wonder Woman on her strong breasts. That one part was *FILLER*

[@fattestallenalive7148]

It's more like whedon's personal fetish. It's also in avengers 2 and some of his TV shows. It's very much a pattern

[@miragiyuu1886]

​@@fattestallenalive7148did you mean the avengers age of ultron? where the scene between black widow and the hulk yk...

[@protato911]

They cut down the movie so much that even Steppenwolf lost 2 of his fingers on each hand.

[@BB-ed4om]

He’s so cute.

[@applehazeva2739]

@Scom Tott dont we all sometimes

[@elcucuy493]

The last scene of Zach Snyders Justice league was actually put in by him to give you an idea of what he wanted to do for the sequels. I see a lot of people being confused as to why the scene was there but to me it just seemed like another after credit like scene

[@utsavdhyani8839]

I think the last half hour was just an extended trailer for the batman solo film(Deathstroke), JL2(Martian) and JL3(Knightmare). More like an attempt to show his vision to the fans because as an artist it really hurts when you know you can't make more art. So he just shared it so the fans could know what was. That's just what I think

[@BebeSoule]

@@utsavdhyani8839 I feel like it was a little bit of both

[@calantheshaman]

He did that to try and force Warner Brothers to let him take over the DCU so he could make every movie his way. Warner Brothers said f*** off b** we will let you make this one last movie since you manipulated social media for your self gain and you can get the hell away from our studios. That's pretty much happened

[@elcucuy493]

@@calantheshaman even if that's true, which it isn't, the fans loved his movie. They've hated pretty much everything warner bros has been putting out without zach Snyder as the director

[@calantheshaman]

@@elcucuy493 you realize that his version of justice league flopped? You know it was the lowest viewed new movie for the quarter on HBO Max. Not even 30% of people that started watching it made it through a third of the movie. It bombed hard. So fans may of loved it but there isn't enough of your Snyder fans to warrant wb to give him another movie with how badly it performed. Facts buddy all facts

[@adgreenfield]

So delighted you brought up the Diana/Alfred making tea scene. In a low key way, it's one of my favorites in the film and represents a big reason why the Snyder Cut is so superior for me. These little moments of connection create more genuine humanity among the gods than all the jokes in the world. Happy to have stumbled on your channel.

[@hello-gx6oi]

I somewhat understand that scene Because I watch anime They show you unimportant scene but it shows you what there relationship is and he they interact

[@politereminder6284]

That was the only scene that I liked in ZSJL. It was a sweet moment of character development.

[@Dxntoo]

​@@politereminder6284 really? Because they added so much more little scenes like this. Cyborg and Flash talking about WW in the grave scene, WW and Aquaman talking about their respective heritage, Flash and Aquaman during the breach, Bruce and Diana in the Batcave, Flash and Aquaman talking about Cyborg after Silas' death. And so much more.

[@politereminder6284]

@@Dxntoo It's my prerogative. I didn't like the movie and I kept falling asleep. I don't even remember the flash and cyborg talk or flash and aquaman. Glad others enjoyed it though. 🤷. It's a nice piece of film history that this got made. 😁

[@Dxntoo]

@@politereminder6284 fair enough lol

[@ram3973]

It is so refreshing to hear someone talking about all these points who has more than just their opinion to fall back on. GREAT analysis, my friend!

[@botbot3698]

it's crazy how significantly better the film felt

[@2ofusriding]

@@90sindianmisc61 EVERYTHING

[@ahsanrazakhan007]

@@90sindianmisc61 the opening, the cyborg backstory, the star labs sequence, the first steppenwolf fight, the Superman flight 2.0, the Flash's whole arc, the final fight. And at last F**king DARKSIED.

[@Reykh24]

@@90sindianmisc61 the whole damn movie

[@BoTheJo]

@@90sindianmisc61 bruh i think u haven't watch ZSJL

[@thetruestrepairman7423]

It did, but is it crazy?? I mean the original one was awful, really really bad. Horrible. Almost anything would be better. I liked the Snyder Cut, is still a flawed film and had some things that i personally dislaked, but i liked it, and yes it was 1000× times better than the original

[@JonAddisonFilms]

With the Snyder cut, the weird sexualization of Wonder Woman in the 'original release' feels far more obvious and forced by Whedon. Makes me shudder a little.

[@ThomasFlight]

Yeah so cringe and gross.

[@vivthefree]

Joss Whedon puts women on a pedestal so he can look up their skirts.

[@TheGeorgeD13]

It’s fascinating how Snyder and Jenkins (director of the Wonder Woman movies) frame Gal Gadot as empowering and as, well, a god (or Demi-god technically, but anyway...) whereas Whedon objectified her and as a result of that lens made her feel a lot less of a Superhero and an actual presence.

[@PotatoMaGobinus]

@@TheGeorgeD13 and keep in mind that warnerbros wanna stick with the 2017 version...yeah...says alot about them

[@Reykh24]

He did it with black widow too

[@seanaguayo]

I don't think Lois was just going about her day, she was persuaded by MM to get back out there in life, to move on from Superman's death and pick up her life. So by Snyder showing her getting back out there and moving on it becomes extremely impactful to her to see the one person she never thought she would see again and who she had finally accepted as dead, to be there, alive.

[@reat964]

Lois felt so out of place in the Whedon version, I’m glad Snyder made her presence meaningful

[@aditsuskianditapratama1720]

@@reat964 & she is "Thirsty"

[@andreacamp936]

@@aditsuskianditapratama1720 I actually liked it. Even though superman has all the powers and glory, it reminds you that Lois (even w/ no powers) still has an impact in this world. At least, that's how I took it.

[@JonathonPrieston]

Yeah it was so powerful. She was finally deciding to perhaps move on even just a little. It was her last time going to his monument

[@alexchambers6488]

That scene between Alfred and Diana was one of my favorite scenes in the whole movie. It really humanized the characters and helped you connect with them. Scenes like this often get overlooked but are such a great storytelling device.

[@danicleckley5404]

If Whedon took out all the scenes with that one Russian family, maybe he wouldn't have had to cut so many scenes.

[@Violet-Spark]

Bruh... you’re right.

[@boboboy8189]

In every whedon movie, he need outsider

[@aditsuskianditapratama1720]

Mustache "Key" opening, Brunch, Random Fams, Barry on Top = 25 minutes

[@UnliRide]

Damn, I totally forgot about that scene lol

[@P.Whitestrake]

He included it because the studio asked him to show the heroes literally saving civilians. Like, really the on-your-nose kind of way of showing it because they think the audience are 100% idiots. That makes the scenes looked boring & bland. Ironically, Snyder Cut showed the heroes saving much more civilians & even the whole world (The Flash reversing time) in a much more epic way.

[@alvinbengeorge8638]

Actually I love the "cyborg discovering his power" scene, that little smile in the end of that scene is a lot emotional

[@vanmeilleonardallego5187]

The main problem literally is identity crisis. DC is mostly known to be dark. Snyder understood it more. Ps: I'm an MCU fan.

[@guts-141]

Ahh a fellow Marvel fan that understands DC

[@ThreadBomb]

You're really talking about 90s DC. For decades before and after, DC's tone was much more balanced.

[@Mybasedworld]

Anyone with a brain would know this

[@apiratp.8289]

man finally Mcu fan who really understands Ty so much

[@guycoburn1633]

I don't know that I'd agree -- Shazam is a light and fluffy kid-oriented DC movie. The tone of that movie fit the comics, including the original Fawcett Comics version back when he was "Captain Marvel." Batman is dark and brooding, if done right. Tim Burton and Chris Nolen showed how to make a dark Batman film, giving a mold for the other films. Superman and WW can go dark or be bright. Aquaman has to go wet -- which it did successfully. Because of his origin, I think Cyborg really needs to go dark. Flash (Barry Allen version) can go either way -- as his background (father wrongfully convicted of killing his mother) is dark, but the character and his powers are more "light." Marvel generally has fewer "dark" origins. Spider-man and Black Widow are the most tragic. The movie version of Scarlett Witch and Quicksilver are different than the comic version. Most of the other characters have origins that may involve personal sacrifice but not the loss of loved ones.

[@aliu292]

I think the slow burn of the snyder cut reminds me of arthouse films and more atmospheric video art. I think it's also fair to criticise if snyder actually understands why it works in these other meduims/ genres, and if it fits well, it makes the film so much more interesting.

[@gqn2]

4:46 Fun fact, every scene in the Snyder Cut looks like a comic book frame. Meanwhile, The Original looks like a set from The Office.

[@conyo985]

Joss Whedon should not direct another DC movie ever again!

[@orlondoruth3562]

Like Snyder did with Watchmen

[@chrisvalenzuela7911]

I feel like I know what video review you watched but won't bring up his name because his name alone angers certain people 😂 but AGREED.

[@gqn2]

@@chrisvalenzuela7911 Facts don't care about your feelings.

[@chrisvalenzuela7911]

@@gqn2 😂💯

[@restercorcega6104]

zack just wanted to add the joker scene because they did him dirty in the suicide squad and he improved him 100 times better

[@Kaliospectre]

Jared’s voice and laugh still needs a little work, but by god the delivery and expressions are really good.

[@nickmilo932]

But that fucking laugh tho

[@darthkek1953]

@@nickmilo932 it's the penguin laugh

[@bhargavram4027]

Nah he just improved him 721 times

[@razaleighwiseman1744]

He look like Marilyn Manson

[@andreymagnuss]

I don't think they ever mentioned that Snyder received $70 million for additional shooting. He only shot two epilogue scenes (which he first intended to shoot at his backyard, but then WB provided him with a studio). Most of the money were spent on VFX.

[@n4ko]

exactly, it was all for post production, and one of the conditions for the snyder cut was that he could not shoot any additional footage. He did it anyway though xD

[@davidw.2791]

For example, that rather muddy looking Darkseid with a mace in the fandome trailer. Fixed to be more “realistic” by the end.

[@G-man9009]

Yea it was mentioned in the beginning not 5 min in.

[@jeffs8330]

When the majority of the movie is CGI, you might was well call post production 'reshoots'. Don't act like he didn't get a do-over because that is exactly what happened. Snyders cut at 2 hrs had it been released would've been a pile of crap...it's easy when you can listed for years about what people didn't like and change it with 70 million dollars.

[@davadh]

The VFX alone in this movie helped some VFX studios stay out of bankruptcy during the pandemic. Kodus!

[@FASynergy]

*Justice League* is such a gift to filmmakers who are learneing the craft; two vastly different renditions of essentially the same story, with both renditions having huge budgets.

[@George_Glass]

This is interesting, because I was blown away by how the Snyder cut was literally like watching a different film. I couldn't understand how it was so much better with what I assume to be nuanced edits. A very comfortable and entertaining watch for a 4 hour film.

[@PaurushChaudhary]

For me one of the main issues with the 2017 JL was how Batman was portrayed as a puny and powerless individual

[@juliandavidac]

true

[@verdugo7974]

He can't do anything in Josstice League Went from unstoppable badass in BvS into a useless cosplayer. Fuck Whedon.

[@kyrios0307]

@@verdugo7974 bruv Batman is straight up bussin' in ZSJL. Badass both in and out of the Batsuit.

[@jothishprabu8]

He's the same in zack's version too. A background character.

[@Pistachio2410]

@@jothishprabu8 he is literally the main character and leader of them all. Makes all the most important decisions. Has the most on screen time. Him not fighting Steppenwolf head on doesn't mean he does nothing. He's smarter than that.

[@PrimarisChan]

That moment then Desaad told to Steppenwolf about debt of 50,000 worlds, I felt that.

[@delicedeluna1629]

Maybe Cyborg could help with that :Þ

[@nbucwa6621]

Steppen shouldn't have taken out those student loans

[@zenitsuthunder3946]

steppenwolf could easily kill Desaads ass tho

[@juliesa3422]

They talk about 50,000 worlds like it's balls.

[@connordirks]

Late to the party, but the Joker scene is there to establish what would've been probably the third entry of the three planned JL films by ZS. It's hinted at in BvS, and it's not hard to imagine now that Steppenwolf has failed, the 2nd JL involves Darkseid attacks earth in search of Anti-Life, is victorious, and then in the 3rd, an "Endgame" type of story where what the final JL scene involves is reality. Batman, Flash, Joker, and co. have to put aside their differences to reverse the tides and save the world from Darkseid and Superman.

[@rae1107sky]

I think for most people, when superman is mentioned they think superhero/good guy and "alien" is further down the line. But that scene after he's resurrected and he's hovering in the sky..wow...it made me feel like he was something foreign, powerful and dangerous.

[@boboboy8189]

Superman is dangerous. We already saw why Batman want to kill him in BvS

[@hello-gx6oi]

@@boboboy8189 yeah I really like what Zack did to Superman

[@BB-ed4om]

My comment just mentioned this scene too… It was a little anxiety-inducing the way he shot it. Like he could be a villain now.

[@John-X]

Zack Snyder's Superman is nothing like he is in the comics or the Paul Dini/Bruce Timm DCAU. He's not dark, edgy, scary, moody or brooding or ridiculously overpowered to the point of destroying cities like he is in Zack's terrible version. I feel like what Zack really wanted to do was Homelander from The Boys. If you want the best version of Superman, watch Justice League/JL Unlimited, or his tv show from the 90's. That's who Superman is, not this boring shell Zack made him. Oh yeah and his Batman is nothing like the comics either.

[@josiahcruz9678]

@@John-X "Zacks terrible version" Ok buddy, go cry in a corner. Snyders Superman is one of the top 5 versions of superman to date

[@haydenelliott3654]

You switching shirts, camera angles, and lighting while talking about how the whedon cuts tone felt disjointed was a nice touch 👌🏻

[@dominiquejones3805]

Alfred still being a butler and knowing how the tea should b made is a small but huge part of his character

[@erismo2138]

Except that it's demonstrated by him teaching someone who is hundreds of years old (her mom is 5000+) and speaks dozens of languages how to do it. I should maybe mention she's the only female member of the team, so this was not a good look IMO. You could have him do that with Barry, who needs to slow down. Or you can do it with Aquabro and Alfred can be horrified when he adds booze to it. I'd love to have Cyborg do it and have it be a father figure moment but he's pretty inorganic in this movie.

[@Junoleda]

As a Brit, wondered why something so obvious needed explaining.

[@rossmilne4489]

@@erismo2138 I took the scene as him being particular about how Bruce is pedantic about how he likes his coffee. And showing how Alfred is perceptive of this. Wonder Woman seemed capable, it was just a moment for him to be like “hey that’s my job, I take care of Bruce”. Kind of heartwarming, and nice bonding moment between Wonder and Alfred. I liked it, perfect pairing.

[@kaine438]

@@erismo2138 nah alfred didnt try to teach her he just point out something that he usually does

[@ChristianFrates1997]

The Snyder Cut is like The Prince of Egypt. Dark, artistically bold and uplifting.

[@ozzy1599]

I personally think the ending scene was put in to get the fans pumped for a sequel even tho they’re not continuing his universe. Or to at least give us a taste of what could’ve been

[@Merdicano]

Yes, it was certainly meant for fan-service only because we didn't saw these versions of Batman and Joker face-to-face, and that it was the only chance that Zack had to do it before we never saw it again

[@drfifteenmd7561]

Writing fanfiction right now.

[@Merdicano]

@@drfifteenmd7561 Good luck with that 👍🏻

[@danatedawg1018]

Good change tho.

[@blurryface5287]

Wow their just going to let this universe die? Fuck WB

[@thomasrichards460]

Even if it was tacked on, I absolutely loved the knightmare scene. It was extremely moody and atmospheric, I felt the history between Joker and Batman from just their dialogue.

[@kusakabe3264]

one thing that bothered me about it was when batman says "Harley Quin" with her full government name. it's a little out of place when he's talking to THE mr J, they both know who "harley" is.

[@thomasrichards460]

@@kusakabe3264 fair.

[@ruairimcgreevy8670]

actually made me somewhat like the joker's casting to some degree

[@thomasrichards460]

@@ruairimcgreevy8670 ya he actually got a fair shot. One honest scene, beat all the badly edited scenes of Studio Squad.

[@kusakabe3264]

@@thomasrichards460 I mean, the best editing in the world can't save his "you don't want no beeeeef? scene

[@juliandavidac]

About the 4 hours..... "I think films are long when they bore you" -Sergio Leone (after Warner butchered his movie xD )

[@tajcee]

And not once during those 4 hours was I ever bored with the film, whereas with the butchered version... 2 hours felt eternally long

[@darkseid856]

I wanted more and more and wanted the movie to never end even though it was already 4 hour long .

[@skyforce911]

The craziest thing bout snyders cut runtime is that , the rooftop jim gordon scene in snyder cut is 2 hours in. Exactly where josstice league would be ending...........

[@d.t.o-xin6237]

See look this might be an unpopular opinion. But Zach showed everyone that you do not need to make solo movies to build up to cameo movies like this. These 4 hours worked. No matter what you say. Each character had their story arc with enough info to see who you’re gonna be dealing with in the long run of the film and they all had their own character development at the end. I know 4 hours for some people is too long but I’d rather watch a 4 hour film that gives a better story and show you everything you need to know than a 2 hour movie that’s too quick to not waste your time but has no good story telling. Ironically your time was wasted there

[@juliandavidac]

@@d.t.o-xin6237 100% agree with you, i'm using the Sergio Leone quote, for his masterpiece Once Upon a Time in America , 4 and a half hours , and we can go beyond the magnificent Kurosawa's Seven Samurai is 207 minutes 3 h 45 m, and every single character was very well writen

[@RealityLifeHumanity]

The joker scene is put there because Snyder knew he wasn’t gonna do the other two movies and he wanted to show the characters that would appear on the next movies, like the joker, death stroke, and others!!! Also everyone wanted an answer to the Easter egg on BVS regarding Robin’s uniform with the writing “you did this”!!

[@waitnodani]

Whedon literally made Gal do ADR where she would add extra sexual moans and a different “Kal-El no!” Some of the weirdest shit. Thank god we have the Snyder Cut.

[@rubssi8741]

Can you tell me where you heard that?

[@waitnodani]

@@rubssi8741 You literally see it in the film. Go watch the Superman vs the league scene. The whedon cut has Gal moaning and groaning while getting hit in the head by Superman both times. The Snyder cut never had any of that, she doesn't even make a noise. That's all ADR. She even did the "Kal-El no!" line differently too for some reason. It's just weird. It's the same dude who added the Flash and WW boob scene.

[@rubssi8741]

@@waitnodani There's a difference between groaning and sexual moans.

[@waitnodani]

@@rubssi8741 who groans like that after getting hit to the ground though? Why change something so small for no reason? That's my point. The fact that something so unnecessary was added is just weird.

[@rubssi8741]

@@waitnodani idk if I got hit on the head so hard that my body got slammed deep into the ground, I feel like I would make some sound to communicate that this was painful

[@Bee-zr5pb]

The things I liked most about the snyder cut is that it's written like a mythological epic and it's dripping with an atmosphere that mirrors actual comics! The characters were handled SO much better and the stakes felt legit.

[@pabriny]

Best quotes: "SHOW THEM YOUR FEAR: WE HAVE NO FEAR!" and "I AM NOT BROKEN!!!!". Thank you Zack

[@darthkek1953]

Total call-back to "SPARTANS, WHAT IS _YOUR_ PROFESSION?"

[@Privatte]

The Cyborg arch is enterily perfect for me. The scene with de bull Market and de ATM machine was one of my favorite. Then the prologue works for the universe and continuity, so was important too.

[@teresaluz975]

Thank you for this. I'll just say this: I'm glad I saw Cyborg helping that single mom because my mom raised me and my sister alone. I connected with that heroic moment. That's truly heroic to me. In my world it would have made a huge difference if someone had helped my mother in her times of need, she struggled to raise us, it was so hard. Not only Zack had a scene like this but he had a Black young man be the heart of the movie. I felt seen, I felt a connection to this movie that I carry with me on my day to day life. I can't stop thinking about it. I adore this movie. I've seen it 6x times.

[@kushalbhola2339]

More power to you. And your mom's amazing. You guys deserve everything.

[@P.Whitestrake]

That's so wholesome. It's also the fact that the character he helped was a mum & we know he lost his mum in a tragic way & felt like a piece of his life was missing. So, to fulfill that missing piece, he helped a mum in dire struggle. IMO, when he was smiling as he looked at the mum so happy getting so much money she needed, I feel like he saw his own mum being happy after a long time.

[@BB-ed4om]

That’s a great takeaway. I loved that they explored this idea that his father made him a monster. He even saw himself as such and therefore he had this motivation to be a hero to prove that he is not a monster but a human who was unwillingly made into a machine. He was a complete outcast after being a star athlete and they even delved a bit into the isolation he was experiencing before meeting with Diana. It really hit me that he was grieving after losing his most important relationship in his life (with his mother) and he was completely alone yet still doing good things for others. When people say he’s the heart of the story I agree. His story should have never been cut out.

[@t10god]

the part where the Flash's head is in Wonder Woman's chest just has me... shaking my head....

[@Ordoabchao-x9k]

brrrrrrr

[@youdontknowme2913]

When superman said Batman likes him, ffs.

[@myaowchi5337]

true its like in anime, where they force the two characters to fall on top of another even though physically the position that they were in isn't even valid in to how they fall to begin with

[@vijaeaanchanan1123]

Whedon blackmailed gal Gadot to shot that scean

[@entiemeh]

DeSaad: There won't be any Justice League 2 Darkseid: Ready the hashtags, we will use the old ways. #restorethesnyderverse

[@walkergibbs6984]

Oh god please no

[@powerofberzerker9487]

@@walkergibbs6984 Why not? The way DCU is goin atm, it doesn't look good. Snyder's JL is the best movie from DC since the Dark Knight days.

[@theroguerider]

@@powerofberzerker9487 the way it’s going? One movie streak, and arguably not even that? I get it, Snyder is to DC as Trump is to evangelicals, but this FOUR hour movie, is still NOT good. Yes, it’s better than Josstice League, but that’s like saying one turd is better than another. Snyder should just be a DP and not direct, Eva use he sacrifices so many things to “look cool” rather than tell a strong story. I want DC to be as strong as Marvel, as I do Image and Valiant, but the ONE thing they should copy that Marvel does or has is Kevin Feige. A man with a deep love for the source material and willing to make unpopular choices to achieve the ultimate goal. I thought Geoff Johns was it for DC but he’s shown that he is definitely not up for the job.

[@powerofberzerker9487]

@@theroguerider I don't know what you are talking about. Sry, not sry... What I'm saying is that the new WW film was bad, Aquaman was also trashy, theatrical JL was shit, Suicide Squad was also bad. The Joker film was solid but that's something completely different. I don't personally like Marvel, because of similar reasons as Marty's. They are just well made joy-rides that are fun but nothing more. They did a bold move with Infinity War but then shat upon it with End Game which we all knew was gonna happen. Still, most of those films aren't any close to being art. While DC, although worse as fun money-making movies, are still ahead at being at least slightly artistic but their new (lets try to Marvel it) route is going in a terrible direction. I personally want to see more of Snyder's JL even though that film had a lot of problems and only was kinda above average.

[@theroguerider]

@@powerofberzerker9487 I’m saying it’s all shit and thinking this is the best of the recent is all fine and good, but this movie is still in that same slag heap of bad DC movies. Not hard putting that together. Also, fun and that’s it for Marvel. Well shit, you don’t even get fun from DC. And End game was pretty much beloved by most, the fact you think it sucks mans nothing to anyone other than you, and that’s fine. Just don’t kid yourself to think he’s doing anything special. Desaturated, slowed down, lens flared, dark undertones is the ONLY thing he does. If ANY DC movie is considered “great” it makes me wonder what you think of Nolan’s Batman. Like I said, he’s the Trump for DC fans (#releasethesnyderverse) now, but know that they are capable of SO much more if they only had someone in charge who loves those characters as much as the fans.

[@jacobpaint]

I haven't gotten around to watching the Synder cut yet this was an interesting, seemingly balanced comparison. I guess there are more rewarding films I could probably watch before this stuff but it would be interesting to compare the 2 for myself... Which would probably mean I’d have to go back and watch the “original”. I wonder how much of a boost Whedon’s film got from people curious to watch or rewatch the original after seeing Snyder’s. This video made me realise just how little of the original I actually remember which I’m guessing was due to it's failure to engage me emotionally.

[@RedVelvetUnderground333]

This is why Snyder one of my fave film makers, makes big dumb action movies but so much artistry behind it. The lighting makes it more dynamic, the color grading is perfect for cgi and so interesting in the presentation, the score is powerful bold, aspect ratio is such a big difference in the framing of shots, everything is in full view and looks glorious.Symbolism and certain imagery invokes feelings in the subconscious or if u know the reference makes u think about the connections. And of course the cutting out of characters that have much more impact to the story, now it’s all back. There’s so much more that could be said, Snyder and the production team brought the artistry that is in comic books to comic book films

[@zachmalta9158]

Thank you for regurgitating the marketing.

[@JC-kl3uc]

Yep, they're dumb for your typical moviegoer.

[@alastor1227]

"Perfect for CGI" is that why it looks decent and fake at the same time? Tbe Color grading is nice and all but to have every scene devoid of color defeats the direction of the hopeful tone.

[@matttheradartechnician4308]

I like how all of Snyder's shots look like comic panels. Like you can take any screenshot and it looks cool

[@nolen602]

this w the batman too no lie

[@BullyMaguirejr]

@@nolen602 No.

[@calantheshaman]

Take any screenshot it looks cool? any screenshot of this dark grayed out over length movie that flopped super hard on HBO Max? The movie that had the lowest quarter ratings for new movies in HBO Max? Yea sorry but the majority of people would disagree with you.

[@EagleRiderStudios]

👆🏻 Someone didn’t like the movie

[@ndo533]

@@calantheshaman please get help. That much hatred for someoje will rot your insides

[@sampause7783]

My favorite part was the aquaman and flash relationship. It’s a very brotherly relationship, like Donatello and Michelangelo from the original tmnt movie.

[@hororobetosky8516]

Yesss donny and mike great comparison

[@mightguy7265]

I think it is more like Raphael ond Michaelangelo.

[@Rvbs235]

@@mightguy7265 haha yeah

[@dougbrigham5207]

I think the biggest thing people miss about the knightmare stuff is that it was a setup up for a future film. Where the Events of that timeline turn for the worst and Superman becomes evil while darkseid takes over the universe. It was meant to be undone but the current timeline. Things that seemed out of no where before, like the flash scene in BVS, make more sense at the end of the Snyder cut. It’s easy to see where it was headed.

[@littlelily9366]

Whedon : cuts 10 minutes by rushing vital scenes Proceeds to add double the time by showing Russian family

[@SweetBabyJesusOnTheCross]

Right? I mean if I wasn't so concerned for what was going to happen to that poor Russian family of, what was it, 3 or 4? I'd never have been able to accept the rest of the steaming pile of shit as a human story. Whew! Thank the Wee Baby Jesus on the Cross he put them in there!

[@InnerRise]

@@SweetBabyJesusOnTheCross STFU! LOOOOOOOOOOOOOLL

[@prajwalkrishnabhat5539]

@@enzobenzo09 except one is biodegradable trash, which can give birth to new life(movies, shows etc) while the other is a big plastic bag floating around in the ocean making life difficult for everyone else.

[@Stefano_Rodriguez]

@@enzobenzo09 your opinion is not a fact. it's your opinion.

[@Johangd]

What's even worse...weadon's version is canon

[@potiguaya5201]

The extended Knightmare scene at the end was a fanservice, to show the extend of Snyder vision for the franchise. Because the probability of his future visions to materialize now is extremely low.

[@nicoduran98]

But a fanservice that was well put and served a purpose to the whole nightmare visions.

[@potiguaya5201]

@@nicoduran98 Yeah to further explore the Knightmare scenes from BvS. Too bad we probably never will see the full story of Knightmare.

[@worfsonofmogh323]

That part was fucking stupid and kinda deflated the real ending.

[@potiguaya5201]

@@worfsonofmogh323 Not stupid, because the concept of multiverse exist. Knightmare is an alternate reality, like Flashpoint.

[@seraby7151]

Yeah the ending is more for Snyder's closure to his Synderverse since WB doesn't want him anymore.

[@WowThereBuddy1]

People really undervalue Snyder’s music choices. Some of the best songs ever written like There Is A Kingdom and Song To The Siren are just such wonderful choices to fit specific moods cinematically. It reminded me of how he used Times Are A Changing by Bob Dylan in the opening credits sequence of Watchmen to great effect.

[@nateds7326]

You can tell Snyder's version is a more carefully composed movie in it's shots, where as Weidens shots look like they were just slapped together on the fly.

[@summertyme5748]

Pure bullshix. Snydercut is one of the most plot hole ridden pieces of garbage i've ever seen.

[@asain3586]

​@@summertyme5748what plothole lol

[@Vainone009]

to me, the whole "Russian family/civilians in peril" mini-plot felt like it was only included to give Superman a reason to have to be somewhere else other than kicking Steppenwolf's ass. thereby allowing the Bad Guy to last longer than 40 seconds Once Supes stepped into the ring...

[@clickycrust]

And to make it look like Flash did something since they didn't want him to reverse time until his solo movie.

[@mercury2157]

@@gsmokezz848 in Whedon's cut, maybe, but absolutely not in Snyder's