Kaioken Sucks

[@furiousgamerxz5141]

Kaio-Ken only sucks cause Toriyama knew it was OP so he had to make excuses for why Goku didn’t use it anymore. Goku COULD have learned to stack it on Super Saiyan after he mastered the form (thereby getting rid of the drawbacks) but he would have been WAY to OP for DBZ

[@christopherknutson8491]

I agree

[@Fusion_AV]

And remember he could use it into kaioken x20 so it could be basically be stronger than a ssj2 goku

[@furiousgamerxz5141]

@ considering Super Kaio-Ken X8 would be roughly on par with SSJ3, yeah Super Kaio-Ken X20 would be FAR greater. Which is why DBS gave us that disorder thing.

[@Fusion_AV]

@ true, but the ssjb kaioken x20 is so inconsistent, first is the most powerful form in the story (beerus is kinda concerned when he did it with kaio x10) and they nerfed it a lot in ToP

[@brabnoify]

It would have been OP if you took this hypothetical and applied it to the current iteration of DBZ, but realistically? ...Not really lol. if it actually happened Toriyama would have just scaled to account for SSJ+KK like he did for every other power up that exists in this series

[@donjuanfrogprince8421]

Kaio Ken was the training mentally and physically Goku needed to undergo to transform as a human form super Saiyan

[@donjuanfrogprince8421]

In the manga, it talks about how even he didn't know he had surpassed the limits of a Saiyan, and characters kept calling him that, till they realized his heart was still pure and filled with mercy

[@donjuanfrogprince8421]

The 100G Kaio ken training made his body strong enough to withstand the super Saiyan kii amplifier, while mentally he was in a state where he was completely calm, even he notices it and says this training might have done something to me

[@donjuanfrogprince8421]

So when he does become filled with rage, mentally he can still control the amp, and physically his body can withstand it, and because he has no tail he can't transform as an Ozaru and instead stays as a human

[@cheddar813]

"Kaio-what?" *Gets bodied*

[@SaiyanScholar]

Super Saiyan: *Doesn't Hurt* Kaioken: *Hurts* and *Weaker* Goku: "Hmm tough choice"

[@devourtoast7998]

@@SaiyanScholar Does he ever use Kaioken over SSJ? I can't think of a time after the fight with Frieza that he uses it

[@SaiyanScholar]

Even lacked against Pikkon in Anime lol

[@JayF2912]

@@devourtoast7998 lol, literally no. Only in Blue Kaiyo Ken does he use it I don't understand why this guy is do mad about it, it's a progression of power and just a fine thing to have I'm just upset the Humans don't use it!

[@devourtoast7998]

@@JayF2912 Honestly! there is no reason why Tien, Yamcha, Piccolo, and even Krillen couldn't utilize it

[@kamenrangerzeo8251]

SS Blue Goku: "I pulled it off. Combining the power of Super Saiyan blue with the intensity and raw strength of the Kaio-ken technique. I had hoped to use this against beerus one day." Beerus: "WHAT!! That cursed Saiyan has plan to use the north Kai technique on me?"

[@SaiyanScholar]

Beerus faking fear yet again in the big picture 🤣

[@NW-sm8xq]

​​@@SaiyanScholar I don't think he was faking his concern in the Anime after seeing SSBKK. Especially since his outburst was only audible to Whis. That said, I don't think he was afraid just surprised (and annoyed). Edit: My head canon is that Beerus is still training in secret. His superiority to the others is due to him being a moving target. While Goku, Vegeta, Gohan, Frieza, and Piccolo will "never" surpass Beerus, they have surpassed BoG Beerus at various points in Super.

[@ryzen1296]

Talk about how G.O.D form for Toppo is trash. Bro gets folded by SSJBE Vegeta who we assume is x20 stronger than SSJB, and Toppo was equal to SSJB Goku/Vegeta, meaning G.O.D is possibly just a x10 boost for there to be a dominating factor of x2 power difference.

[@SaiyanScholar]

Tournament of Power.... scaling.... we going there? Haha

[@Vespyr_]

Kaioken is probably what destroyed Goku during the tournament of power against Jiren.

[@IcedicStar]

Short answer: That technique kills you if used for too long so its only used when completely necessary. Tho that still doesn't remove the fact as of why Goku never bothered to teach anyone else Kaioken or why he never used in the Cell Games or Buu saga

[@SaiyanScholar]

Very good point. People letting cool scenes cloud what Kaioken's actual properties are. In no way did I say Z wasn't cool with the Kaioken scenes but the technique wasn't good at all for Goku. That was THE plot with the technique. Lol.

[@willtherealrustyschacklefo3812]

Nobody else except maybe Vegeta or piccolo could ever use it.

[@willtherealrustyschacklefo3812]

​​@@SaiyanScholaridk about that, as far as the effects of kaioken it's still the most op transformation to date, unless you count ssj 4 but that's only because it also has the same effects as kaioken+ more.

[@willtherealrustyschacklefo3812]

​​@@SaiyanScholarkaioken is not just an energy multiplier, it also multiplies all of your physical abilities and senses. Including the raw physical strength and speed of the body without energy, senses like sight , hearing, smell and even their ability to sense ki.

[@devilshooter126m8]

Great video I wish Kaioken would have been the normal power up after SSJ, a Power Boost with actual consequences, Glad SSJ 3 went back to that be it in a different way.

[@SaiyanScholar]

Thanks. Kaioken was cool but it always played catch up against the main villains and came with bad side effects. It was a cool gimmick for a short time, that's it.

[@jerryxpgaming4682]

The best ability to cripple you

[@SaiyanScholar]

But it's SO COOL 😎💯

[@hqTheToaster]

Zalama: Dear Super Shenron, my now next wish is that all my servants are idiots.

[@ivanbluecool]

Win on nappa is more that I can say about ss3 blue or grade 2 and 3

[@AhmedHussain-ju6xd]

It's issues could be solved but never were since goku got ssj. kaioken becomes easier to use at higher power levels and better ki control. So android saga characters would have less drawbacks. God ki and spirit control also helps. There's piccolo with his regen and they can also carry senzu beans. Therefore it's full pontential was never reached

[@Mikkeru]

Imo the problem is that Kaioken was told that it hightens your senses which sounds cool but simply powering your powerlevel does the exact same thing, which is stupid.

[@r.connor9280]

Wait if merely concentrating energy to a single point amplifies the strength of the output What about containing the technique to only a arm or a limb, amplifying the strike on a hit by hit basis Small, explosive damage but in a duration small enough to avoid major harm You could use compacted Kiao-Ken to a much better degree than full body activations, training pieces of your body till you can use the whole thing at once

[@TheManDude]

My favorite types of transformations and techniques are those which bring high stakes with their boosts, which is why Kaioken, SSJ3, and the Oozaru are some of my favorite forms/abilities.

[@mechajabo]

If blue was just SS on top of god ki, would it be feasible to be able to use SS2 or 3 on top?

[@willtherealrustyschacklefo3812]

It's not literally ssj on to top of it, it is the super Saiyan equivalent of the God form.

[@0ctane_official]

No brother,kaioken is based

[@gerardoa9179]

Is a suicidal technique with more disadvantages than advantages that it was useless against all oponents

[@RGaming_pro]

Kaio-Crippled

[@MysteryBounty]

Yeah i always wondered why Piccolo never learned the Kaio-Ken, he would have been unstoppable! He was stronger than a super saiyan after fusing with Kami, on par with 17 so if he learned to use even Kaio Ken x5 he would have been possibly as strong as a Super Saiyan 2 if not stronger!

[@eranshachar9954]

I know we saw Kaioken on top of SSJ when Goku used it with a dead body. What I wonder- What if he has done the same with a live body? I think that if he used it in a short burst to finish the job maybe he would survive. But I think long term would be devastating. There are times in the Androids arc that I think both Piccoro Jr. and Tenshinhan used it. Once against Dr. Gero, against #17 & the Shin Kikoho. Because Tenshinhan needed a serious amp to just push Cell. I doubt the Shin Kikoho power up is at the thousands. Remember two things- Kaioken can be invisible as we saw with Goku vs. Freeza. He used it all the time without showing it most of the time. 2nd- We never got a confirmation that Piccoro and the Earthlings can't use it.

[@hqTheToaster]

"Kaioken cannot be mastered" My fanmade Eevee with a fourth form based on Gray Goo, Zamasu's Halo, and a Kaioken 'glow': Well both yes and no. (Sorry for the half-joke or something; I couldn't resist.)

[@SaiyanScholar]

LMAO

[@supersaiyangodshallot8742]

I think Kaio-Ken is a form drawing out their hidden power, but in reckless way. Kaio-Ken said to be multiplied a warrior's Power Level, but how can they do that? Super Saiyan 2nd and 3rd grades can increase a Saiyan's PL but puts strain on their bodies and drain a lot of energy. Goku used SSB with Kaio-Ken a lot in the Tournament of Power but wasn't exhausted after each use.

[@ivoandjic2056]

Imagine buu using kaioken

[@SaiyanScholar]

Amazing for him but not Goku!

[@ivoandjic2056]

@SaiyanScholar Do you belive there is a limit for the kaioken

[@gerardoa9179]

Cell?

[@SaiyanScholar]

Just a limit to the person using it... with negative effects.

[@ivanbluecool]

Or course it's not supposed to be good. It burns through your energy and damages your body for short burst gains. Same problem with ss3 where it doesn't absolutely nothing. Or worthless like blue where it can't get a win in the plot and gets replaced by a replacement. Sad god didn't get much use either.

[@lorumipsum1129]

For once I want too see Kaiden actually go wrong. I want too see it actually end goku or whoever uses it so people remember those risks

[@SaiyanScholar]

I guess the best we got is watch the Kaioken x4 against Vegeta where even Yajirobe tapping him caused him immense pain lol. Or watch post Goku vs Hit when he's got onset ki disorder. But yeah, I get you

[@AhmedHussain-ju6xd]

U know if Goku wasn't so focused on having a fair fight, using high levels of kaioken then immediately healing with a senzu and getting a zenkai chain going would be OP

[@patrickbronson5117]

I hope they do UI kaioken lol

[@iJakku]

A better gate of death.

[@lightyoshiman]

ok now two more questions, why didn't king kai teach those bum's on his planet the kaioken? second question the kioken and eight gates are almost one for one the same if goku learned the 8 gates would he have access to powers much earlier that he wouldn't normally have? like say if he had the 8 gates when he fought vegeta would he have ssj level's of power or would he have like kaioken x20 level's of power?

[@Heracles851]

Kaioken doesn't suck lol. Goku would be dead against Vegeta, Frieza and even Captain Ginyu if he couldn't multiply his base power level for short bursts. Being able to temporarily overwhelm his opponents by a signficant margin; even briefly is all that was required to keep the plot going.

[@SaiyanScholar]

Goku didn't even use Kaioken when Frieza was below 50% and even when he did it was pointless because Frieza intentionally played with him and stalled. He didn't even beat Vegeta with it anyway and even when he did use it to delay the inevitable... it caused insane damage to Goku. Ginyu? Didn't save him in that fight either lol

[@harana5595]

​​​@@SaiyanScholarGonna have to disagree with you on that one. Goku did use Kioken against Frieza at 50%. He used kaioken x20 and it did help. It kept him in the fight. Otherwise Frieza would have killed him before he could attain SSJ. Against Vegeta it helped him a lot too. If it hadn't been for kioken Vegeta would have killed him too. Vegeta beat him cause he went Oozaru and caught him off guard with a mouth blast. Goku used the solar flare on Vegeta before this but Vegeta was too fast for him. Goku's only chance was the Spirit Bomb, but he obviously failed. Kioken may not have been powerful enough to beat these enemies. Then again it bought Goku time. Which ultimately helped him find a way. In the case of the Vegeta fight it gave time for Krilin and Gohan to rescue Goku alongside Yayirobe who came out of nowhere. Against Captain Ginyu, Goku lost becuase he was caught off guard by the body switch technique. If he had gone all out from the start, he would have killed Ginyu with kioken. Instead of taking so long to powet up.

[@SaiyanScholar]

I said below 50% lol and Frieza could have killed him at any time when he was doing a x10. X20 only shocked him which sped up Frieza to kill him if anything lmao

[@Heracles851]

@@SaiyanScholar Vegeta would have killed Goku in the beam struggle if not for x 3 kaioken lol

[@BenSelah]

Broly on kaioken

[@aster4jaden]

Kaio what?

[@destridax]

No it doesn't!!!!!

[@SaiyanScholar]

The technique does, even if the drama was fire.

[@kidmods]

I like it tho😂

[@SaiyanScholar]

It's cool drama lol

[@blue-12316]

seriously?

[@favoroceanloy6440]

Funny how you had to lean on the Kakarot graphics to explain your story. Why not use Sparking Zero? Wasn’t it supposed to have PS5 quality graphics??! Wait . . . You can’t, can you?!

[@SaiyanScholar]

Lmao. Let's be honest... DBZ Kakarot has superior cutscenes.

[@willtherealrustyschacklefo3812]

​@@SaiyanScholarprobably so. Tho I've never played kakarot. But let's be honest, the absolute worst part about sparking zero is it jumping to a cut scene every 40 seconds, I could just watch the anime if I wanted to watch more than play. And not having created characters is just whack at this point when like the last 4 games have them. Those are my personal issues with it, and the extremely short storyline. However it does have worse graphics than xenoverse. And it's too exaggeratedly bright and colorful to play for more than maybe 30 minutes at a time.

[@VicoX-u9m]

It does?