Kathy's Jury Speech - S8

[@62SG]

People shitting on Kathy need to understand the context behind this season. Survivor was still a very new game. There were still a sizeable amount of contestants who played the game just to have a cool wilderness adventure. Forming tight, personal, genuine relationships was a major component of the game. It was not a game about blindsides or treating people like pawns, that was just one part of the game. Since the series was so recent and such a phenomenon the castaways attended a lot of charity events together and all became good friends (with the exception of Colby and maybe a few others). And they weren't just Christmas card buddies, they were ACTUAL friends. There were some very tight relationships in the All-Stars cast, and two of the tightest were Rob's friendships with Kathy and Lex. So All-Stars comes along and on paper it sounds great. The superstars all play together and have fun on TV again, it'll be so cool! Except they all (except Hatch) overlooked the dark nature of Survivor, and how it's a horrible game that does horrible things to people and wreaks mental havoc on its players. And thats just when a group of strangers is playing. When it's a group of friends it's much worse because now there are things from OUTSIDE the game that enter into the game. Case in point, Rob had a very tight pregame alliance with Kathy, Lex and Tom. Their mutual friendship was the basis of one of the first ever pregame alliances (again, this had never been done before). So when they land on the island split into two tribes theres an initial understanding that come the merge they'll reunite. Except Rob meets Amber, and forms a very tight group with his Chapera alliance (with Rupert and Jenna coming into the mix later). Meanwhile, Lex and Kathy are playing with the intention of joining up with Rob at the merge. This first means eliminating the physical threats of Rich, Colby and Ethan, and then once the tribe swap happens it means voting out Jerri in favor of Amber. This has been called one of the dumbest moves ever, but the reason for it was simple: Rob was an ally, Rob promised to hold true to the alliance if Amber stayed in the game, Jerri wasn't part of the plan. So Jerri goes, Amber stays and Lex is looking at an alliance of him, Kathy, Rob, Tom and Amber. Except they merge and Rob betrays him. Normal stuff now, but heres the thing: THEIR ALLIANCE WAS BUILT ON THEIR REAL LIFE FRIENDSHIP. Real relationships were the core of their alliance, so if the alliance is betrayed what does that mean for their friendship? Nowadays this is quaint, but at the time there had NEVER been anything like this before. This was new territory. When you're playing Survivor with friends where do you draw the line? Players now know to check that shit at the door, but the only reason they know that is because the players in All-Stars DIDN'T know that. So Lex and Kathy are betrayed and it's a very ugly scene, because Rob is going back on their friendship at a time where the game was not JUST a game. Survivor was a major life changing experience, an emotional experience. It wasn't a gameshow you played multiple times, it was an adventure about forging relationships and testing yourself. So their attitude, while quaint now, is very much approrpriate for the time. Players like Lex and Kathy don't really crop up much after All-Stars. All-Stars was a groundbreaking season that taught a lot of Survivor lessons. Subsequent returnee season are much less personal because All-Stars taught them to not make it personal. And in general post-All-Stars players are much more emotionally detached from their game. Survivor is now a game first and foremost, it's a game about numbers and it's nothing personal.

[@ajl9772]

A lot of what u say is true, but Lex and Kathy came across as huge hypocrites. While I don't know if there were pregame alliances with them, Colby and Ethan were definitely friends with them outside of the game and formed alliances with them quickly due to their friendships outside of the game. Lex voted them out explaining to Ethan that the game and their friendship are 2 separate things. Later when Rob turns on them it's suddenly a betrayal of their friendship. I certainly see Lex's point of view as he did Rob a (in his eyes) personal favor in keeping Amber in the game over Jerri who was his ally and friend and he was able to betray them as result of Lex's kindness. However, at the end of the day Lex also back-stabbed friends to get ahead. I mean Ethan and Colby would have done something different had they not believed Lex had their backs. They should have been a little more understanding that from Rob's point of this being a game and everything outside of it is separate. I mean especially since that was what Lex said himself early on. Oh well hopefully Lex learned to never mix business with friends. Too bad players like Hatch and Cesternino didn't make it further in to the game, they understood what the game was from their fist time playing.

[@AKIsAClown]

AJL Lex was hypocritical, he had no room to talk. Kathy on the other hand had every reason to feel betrayed and heartbroken

[@diegoprodriguez]

People who bash on Kathy, I like to remind them she still voted for Rob.

[@juve96]

@@diegoprodriguez Agreed. To me this proves didn't make it personal in the end. She might have felt let down/betrayed by Rob but she held up her own end, because it would have been very easy for her not to vote for him. Watching this in live time back then I hated Rob and how he played, even though I still think he should have won.

[@exiaR2x78]

@@ajl9772 I think the big part of it was the pregame alliance. Which when I first watched this I though damn Lex is a big hypocrite since he said to Ethan like 2 episodes prior that its all business and friendship and game were separate. When I found out about the pregame alliance years later it made more sense (Which wasnt explicitly said on the show)

[@mongolianlovebug]

This was back during a time when Survivor was much more personal and genuine than what we see today.

[@cambed71]

yes the top 10 seasons probably have to be the first 10 seasons because of how raw and genuine they were

[@frankhahah8127]

And this was 6 years ago. Now look at now!

[@frankhahah8127]

The comment

[@cambed71]

@@mackiahhenry6261 I loved Gautemala especially the post merge. But I think Rafe and Danni played the best game. I wanted Cindy to win and Steph didn't want to vote Cindy out, it was Rafe who was able to manipulate Steph to do what he wanted to do and Danni manipulated Rafe

[@Pork_Knuckle]

wrong

[@randmperson2]

The big thing to pick up on was Kathy asking for "an ounce of respect". That's STILL the determining factor for a lot of Juries to this day. Everyone recognizes that you can backstab, cheat, and steal to get to the end, but you still need to treat the Jurors like human beings because those people need to vote for you in the end. That's the parallel course she's referring to. Kathy's speech didn't come across as bitter to me at all, but very sad and disappointed. You can't begrudge her that.

[@radicalswampert7980]

A very motherly, and compassionate approach to the situation, A LOT better than ripping ones head off cause they`re bitter. I love Kathy in the Marquesas and All Star

[@MrJkomaroff]

And in the end, Kathy saw that they were both sorry and that they never meant hurt anyone.

[@ethan6483]

She was hurt, not bitter. Huge difference. She still ended up voting for Rob.

[@joecoolberry911]

The fact that she voted for Rob showed she was a good juror. I usually think the jury system is flawed because it’s all about salt and not who had the best overall game

[@el.c.8858]

@@joecoolberry911 right because if you analyze the finalists’ whole journey based on exclusively their challenges successes and their tactical skills through idols or blindsides, there would be many other winners

[@RandomizationE]

It’s amazing that even after all that, Kathy still voted for Rob to win.

[@calvinbutler5691]

Her speech is so touching, it's not even what she says at times it's the look on her face when she says "it's fine if you didn't want me around" or " I just want to congratulate you guys sincerely for being here, however you got here, but I just want you to know". You can see the hurt. Love her.

[@Mawzeen]

Her speech is actually the best speech on survivor, we all know that this season was the darkest season. Kathy gets that it is a game, she is simply refering to that path he couldve took, and demanded him to respect their relationship, the good sportmanship. The path she is talking about will actually make you the ultimate survivor, you will keep your friends after this devilish game and get their vote, all they ask for is that you acknowledge all their hardwork in the game, and throw them that ounce of respect. They, like you have been their fighting, bleeeding, sweating, crying and they couldve took that path but they are simply better people. Some wouldnt sell their soul to the devil for a million dollar and some would. Simple as that.

[@freddytang2128]

Kathy wasnt like any bitter person trying to belittle someone, or a Sue Hawk trying to grandstand. Shes like a disappointed mother talking to a son that did something immature and horrible, and still voted for Rob in the end

[@tarheel8494]

Kathy is hands down my favorite survivor player ever. she made Marquesas, changed the franchise with it, and then made this as well. few players can be so real and such good players at the same time. she rocks.

[@Steven-wz7sh]

I was calling her a dumba.. when voting jerri off. Of course you take out amber. Fear drove that decision.

[@radicalswampert7980]

I like it a lot better when jury statements are more compassionate and understanding than when jurors are fueled with hatred all because they screwed them over. I get why they're mad, but it doesn't make it any better. Kathy in my opinion was one of the better survivor players in the earlier seasons, and totally underrated. I loved Kathy, so much compassion and understanding through her statement from start to finish.

[@Reeny125]

Kathy is probably one of my favorite Survivor players, and this is definitely one of the most genuine, emotionally-charged jury speeches. I agree with some posters below who say the earlier seasons were filled with so much heart; these later seasons have become so "frat-boy-ish" and bland.

[@Steven-wz7sh]

Just watched survivor 8. I totally didn't get why Shii Anne and Kathy kept Amber. Big mistake if you want to win.

[@oriizhaki]

Kathy is amazing. wish we could see her once again. she is an amazing person and an amazing player and the way she voted Rob even tho he backstabbed her so hard means how much she understands the game

[@gabrielcamilleri1193]

people bashing kathy, should also remember she still voted for rob

[@58twright]

Kathy didn’t like amber

[@crapolaist]

her voting for rob DEMONSTRATES that she is bitter... she had a pregame alliance and friendship with rob and said she only voted for him to honour that... she was bitter against Amber for lying to her in the game... The hypocrisy is real

[@charliez077]

@@crapolaist lol what the fuck? EVERY single vote for Amber except for Shii Ann was out of (deserved or not) bitterness against Rob. Amber played a good game but everyone knew that Rob was the one dominating both strategically and in challenges. if anything, Kathy didn't vote for Amber bc she kinda hid behind Rob.

[@Bluerock121]

@@crapolaist You don’t know what you’re talking about at all. You look so incredibly stupid judging situations you know 1% of the info about

[@svdorme]

Yeah because she was even more bitter against amber lol

[@lacheyrulez]

Everyone needs to remember the first 7 seasons of survivor were very personal and about bonds and friendships. Rob and Amber took the game to an entire new level the way it's supposed to be played and everyone else just didn't know how to handle it.

[@em-ily1227]

Yes! And that it was the first time ever there were returning players, not strangers. It was a whole new dynamic that no one really understood the ramifications of until they were out there. We're used to it now, and I think players and producers are a little more prepared for it, but back then it was unprecedented.

[@SFArasTMToomuchslays]

I agree, if Rich or Brian were playing with their friends prior they wouldn't have won so easily, but Rob I feel really did choke in what was his best performance (yes his AS game was far superior to RI in my book, except he was better socially in RI) Even then, he was sitting next to two goats.

[@MisterLyricist]

lacheyrulez What do you mean "the way it's supposed to be played"? Are you suggesting that the contestants were playing it wrong during the first seven seasons?! LOL WUT The game *changed* and *evolved*. There is no right or wrong way to do it. The contestants have simply reshaped it.

[@notapom]

Rob and amber didn't take the game to the level it is 'supposed' to be played. Hatch did that in the very first season. He set out the rules in which survivor has been played ever since, strategic and separate to personal relationships. Had he not have won and Kelly and her 'honour and integrity' game been respected by the jury and rewarded with the title of soul survivor, the evolution of the game could have gone down a very different path.

[@nostalgia9338]

lacheyrulez No that was Rob Cesternino back in Amazon. He should have been on Game changers

[@Smartphone775]

Poor Kathy, Hurt so Badly She was right about Rob abusing Friendships to get to the end and partially right Amber's flirting with Rob.

[@Debachi]

Kathy should've never align herself with a douche-tastic dip shit like Lex. She knows the rules and had no right to bitch when this is part of the game.

[@Smartphone775]

Okay, that is a good point, both of them. But she did align with Lex only to avoid his rage as seen in Africa. The second point can't be argued though

[@Debachi]

That is no excuse and all the more reason to get him out! It seemed to me that he picked on Shii-Ann and had she went to Coly and Amber, he would've been voted off.

[@Smartphone775]

It was Shii Ann and Jerri, And I think Richard would have given Kathy the majority. Richard and the women.

[@Debachi]

Oh, that's right. This makes me think that she just didn't want to associate with a gay guy. If anything, this shows her short sightedness even more. I don't give a damn what you are, if you serve a beneficial purpose to my tribe and my game I'll keep you as long as possible.

[@AnoraFan-z1v]

I wanna give her a hug... :(

[@Jsanche12]

I felt so, bad for Kathy. You can see the pain in her eyes, and her voice.

[@gabrielcarvalho1815]

Kathy you are a queen

[@HectorBarbossa]

I really hope Kathy returns for another season! I LOVE Kathy!

[@58twright]

I think she might be too old now

[@HectorBarbossa]

@@58twright I don’t think she’s too old.

[@lacheyrulez]

Kathy amazing wish she come back She was meant to have the marquesas title

[@bc5163]

Survivor was so much more human back then and had so much more heart. While some seasons in the 20s had its moments (like Brenda/Dawn in Caramoan and Trish/Tony in Cagayan) New School Survivor will never measure up to Old School.

[@musicguy713]

This season was very entertaining and memorable, but gosh it went so wrong. Richard Hatch, Jenna Morasca (though thank God she left), Colby, Jerri, Rob Cesternino, Tina, all these great players went so early. The season would have been so different. Instead we got stuck with Jenna L. Alicia, and Amber. however, a very memorable season.

[@charliez077]

I liked All Stars way more on rewatches, when I saw it for the first time I was super disappointed by the exact thing you describe here. now - despite this - it's one of my fave seasons and still imo one of the most iconic ones.

[@bc5163]

Boston Rob, Shii-Ann and Rupert were the post-merge stars. That's half of the final 6. Jenna L and Alicia at least caused interpersonal drama/conflict. Amber who pretty much invented the meat shield strategy deserved to win. One of the best final tribal councils ever (although Vanuatu comes close too). A great season I actually think. Obviously not in the league of Micronesia or HvV, but by far better than most seasons in the 20s and 30s imo. For the other all star seasons in particular, Cambodia is far too gamebot-ish for me and Game Changers was a bit of a mess, while WAW while good still had the EOE which makes it lose points for me

[@HectorBarbossa]

I love Kathy!

[@cjfast11]

On a commentary of all stars lex an Kathy said they talked to rob on the phone once a week before the game. He asked Kathy about advice on life and shit so this really was betrayel

[@crapolaist]

no... he played the game and adapted to his surroundings in the game. he made an alliance with amber and then one with rupert and jenna to overthrow the africa-marquesas alliance that was formed PRE-GAME... their hypocrisy is just ridiculous here. Like, imagine coming into the game and not being able to play because people already decided where everyone stood based on phone calls prior... they banked on expecting Rob to do what they wanted and he showed them that you can't hack the game, you can only play it. But glad Amber won. She deserved it.

[@joecoolberry911]

crapolaist well said. Pre-game alliances aren’t supposed to be part of the game. It’s the whole reality tv dilemma. It’s a game and contest at the end of the day designed to hurt friendships if you really want to win. The show does it on purpose. It’s good entertainment. It’s sad for them but they also signed up for it

[@charliez077]

@@joecoolberry911 lol. says you watching the show in 2021 while this was EIGHTEEN years ago and the context was vastly different. this was totally new area for these ppl who were often very friendly outside the game - I don't blame Rob for playing hard like a pokergame but I also really don't blame someone like Kathy being hurt when she had such a relationship with Rob irl. and she voted for him anyways.

[@bigbuffguy9589]

@@crapolaist You make a fair point about pre-game alliances. The results of those have been fairly mixed. They didn't work out in All Stars or Blood v. Water. Cochran was definitely helped by his pre-game alliance in Caramoan. Tony and Sarah dominated Winners at War, but they're close friends in real life.

[@mcgaming8982]

This speech is so emotional

[@undefeated29]

Awesome speech.

[@jarrydfederico7272]

This was the first survivor where the cast knew each other prior to playing. Nobody could have known how pre-existing relationships would affect the game. Rob was willing to use and abuse friendships for his benefit, Kathy didn't take the same approach. It's understandable she was hurt. It's possible she saved Amber so Rob could have time with her. If she hadn't, Amber wouldn't have made jury and gone home. Kathy showed Rob kindness and he gave nothing in return. He could have at least voted out Shii-ann before Kathy and Lex. Also worth noting that she mentions during the show that he lost his temper (and defends him by saying he's normally a good guy). We the audience did not see that exchange, likely because the producers didnt want him looking bad. It may be that her hurt is related to that.

[@safehaven11]

Kathy and Rob must've shared a bond. They were good with eachother in the Marquesas. Kathy saw something in Boston Rob in the Marquesas.

[@pogodziej]

I demand Kathy to come back!

[@kevinpernod9336]

Still my favorite season.

[@pogodziej]

And I adooore Kathy in here. She did some drama but it was all true, I'm sure. She just had a crush. And Rob spit into hers and Lex's faces, was remembered as the legend of Survivor, got a woman and lived forever after rich and happy. I feel like throwing out my dinner.

[@dawggirl]

Throw it out, I'm sure the dogs will eat it.

[@mattlericain]

You can understand that Kathy is broken but Lex I mean come on for the first 15 days he's been saying "It's business, if I need to sell friendships I'll do it" at every second

[@PejaRapiLudzie]

Kathy is wonderfull woman.

[@Smartphone775]

Despite being Betrayed by Boston Rob and being emotionally devastated, Kathy voted for him because she viewed their friendship as fractured and he played a better game

[@buffgarfield3231]

If the jury could see that this ended in marriage and 4 kids maybe they would have understood better.

[@PumaOPumaOPumaO]

@Tehui1974 Kathy was friends with Rob since Marquesas, so of course it is personal. It is all personal. It isn't like they are cartoons that don't have real lives.

[@diegoprodriguez]

Jury Management. You can be good in every other aspect, but if you don’t have Jury Management, you don’t win Survivor.

[@mhalbe1984]

Was this the season the birthed Jury Management? I think Amber winning was a great example for future seasons to show players you can't be a jerk and expect to win. And this was reiterated in Samoa.

[@mcgaming8982]

@@mhalbe1984Amber won due to a miss conception

[@mhalbe1984]

Kathy really touched on something very important in this game when she told Rob he couldve 'thrown her an ounce of respect'. This may have been the defining season that spotlighted the importance of jury management, where a sharp competitive player can lose the game by being a douche to those you vote out. Rob learned a valuable lesson here. If Russell had seen this season and taken not prior to Samoa (i doubt he watched this one) he could've learned that jerks don't win, regardless how great of a player they are.

[@PumaOPumaOPumaO]

@fencingwerewolf Kathy has been friends with Rob since they first were on survivor in the Marquesas 2 years ago, so yeah, she did have a personal relationship with him

[@mohawk393939]

@NeuroCross Yep she was a savy player, a workhorse and socially very respected. Should have been on the heroes. Don't think she wanted to come back though.

[@ZeldaPotato87]

Waffles are awsome

[@musicaleclecto]

I'll admit she was very emotional and it made her look weak in the eyes of the viewers. Bottom line: I still loved her as a person and I wished she was on Heroes vs Villains

[@psychokinrazalon]

The best Survivor player would do the following: 1. Piss off the competition every chance they get in order to keep their allies loyal. 2. Avoid making friendships with the competition so their feelings won't get hurt in case they must be backstabbed. 3. Openly admit the above two points to the jury.

[@TheOfficialTeamz]

I understand why people don't like this jury and say this jury is bitter and don't like bitter jurors, but if have to side with the jury. although it is a game feelings do get involved and what happens outside of the game, and outside relationships often do interfere with the game. rob should've been more careful with how he voted people out and when he voted people out. with what led did for him, rob should've take him to at least the final 5. so I do understand where Kathy is coming from

[@bigbuffguy9589]

Rob mostly brought this on himself, but I still feel a little bad for him. He's clearly shaken.

[@Packerfan130]

I wanna see Lex, Kathy, and Tom play again.

[@diegoprodriguez]

The jury really does look broken. Idk if it’s the lighting or that they’re mostly pissed, but that jury looks defeated and destroyed like no other jury.

[@KBonilla]

Kathy should have been back for a third season.

[@musicaleclecto]

Actually, she didn't vote him out in Marquesas. The night he got voted out, Kathy voted for Zoe.

[@PumaOPumaOPumaO]

@tallderektoronto Well see, Kathy was the fan fav during Marquesas, but that was many years ago, and if you asked the average viewer now who Kathy Vavrick O'Brien is, I bet only 30% would remember her. It'd be different if she had won like in Sandra's case.

[@TheCoolerBrother]

Kathy just couldn’t figure out that survivor isn’t a game for the hero/loyal types.

[@PumaOPumaOPumaO]

@thesir27 It isn't just a game to them, it is their lives, who likes being betrayed and lied too?

[@Ashley-ef1fi]

in my opinion lex and Cathy shouldn’t make rob guilty when there reasoning for not voting amber out was that they were scared of rob and he would be so mad he would do everything to beat and vote them out, I guess some of it was friendship but the fact that they voted jerri out while her being loyal from the start was them being assholes too, I just don’t buy it that they wouldn’t do the exact same thing to win when there’s a chance of voting their friends out

[@psychokinrazalon]

@Tehui1974 In that case, Russell really SHOULD HAVE won in Samoa and HvV.

[@AkronJosh]

Honestly think rob would've gave a completely different set of answers IF he was sitting next to anyone other than amber. I think he didn't put effort into planning his answers or his speech because he was so in love. It happens 😆

[@clintfowler1526]

He didn’t give a shit 😆. He believed that he and amber were going to be a couple anyways and they’d have the million together. Amber of course wasn’t banking on that, but she wanted it to. It could have gone either way. Rob didn’t alientate Rupert or Jenna L. He did hurt Kathy, but she saw amber as the one who poisoned robs mind against her and would still vote for him. Tom, Alicia, and Lex all got blindsided and took it personally. Shi Ann actually was a very sincere and legit vote: she admitted Rob was a more physical and threat and had been cutting people off he didn’t want. But Amber had out played him socially by letting him be the villain and kill their alliances. Rob allied himself with a lot of different people and it crushed them when he voted them out. Amber didn’t carry the baggage of being a backstabber and was tied 3-3 when in reality it should have been 6-0 in favor of rob. That in Shi Ann’s mind was an amazing job done by amber and earned the deciding vote

[@SurvivorYo]

@Tehui1974 i dont think being lied 2 was really what upset her. it think it was just the way she was lied 2. he could have been nicer about it. i truly respect boston rob and hated 2 c him leave early in Heroes vs Villains but him losing this season was justified. yes he was dominant but he was dominant in the worst way, kind of like Russell. i give him credit though 4 being a lot more mature in Heroes vs Villains. he could have won if not 4 Russell

[@exiaR2x78]

The biggest issue with this season is the pre game alliance with Kathy, Tom, Lex and Rob. Without that context it doesnt really make much sense in terms of the bitterness and hurt Kathy and Lex had. Like 2 episodes before Lex said to Ethan the game is business and isnt there real life friendship before Ethan gets voted out. Then Lex looks like a hypocrite when Rob doesnt go with him

[@Raddy2k]

Best season ever its a joke now

[@jessenorwalt3936]

“Are you playing Rob” 4 years later they have 4 kids and they’re still happily married 😂

[@TheOrionKnight]

Rob played the game wrong. He betrayed everyone that helped him from the start just so he could stay with Amber.

[@58twright]

Kathy was pissed at rob too however she only voted for him because she didn’t like amber

[@Dragoondaniel]

@thesir27 It was probably the way they were voted out.

[@ecwecwecw1]

I agree with Kathy that there was away Rob could of did what he did without ribbing as much salt in the wounds as he did.

[@ElectrikkPaperClipxx]

i agree with you completely

[@bigtoechambers9431]

0:08 why the hell does she call it Marquesa 😂

[@tannergrinzel5123]

Because the s is silent

[@whale144]

in the end she voted for rob

[@zimdelinvasor]

SHIT SON, I looked it up and you're right. Either way she was abhorrent this season and one of the biggest reasons why it was such a huge letdown

[@yamamotokun80]

@Homeandawayguy However, Kathy was a challenge dominator while Cirie was a social game monster...

[@HomesliceBrice]

This is the most bitter and personal final tribals ever.

[@ajl9772]

justifiably so by Lex and Kathy tho. Tom and Alicia were being being ridiculous to me.

[@Tehui1974]

Telling lies and manipulating people in survivor, is like bluffing people in poker. It's part of the game!!!!!

[@yellowlemon8765]

It's not like poker. You're starving for long periods of time.. well the earlier seasons at least.. and you're living with them 24/7 for 30 days.

[@Tehui1974]

@@yellowlemon8765 nah, really?

[@charliez077]

@@Tehui1974 yeah really. Mr. Sentai pointed out really well where the poker/Survivor comparison is actually really flawed.

[@Tehui1974]

@@charliez077 Just because a person draws a comparison between one thing and another, it doesn't mean that everything single thing has to be exactly the same. Even Boston Rob makes the same comparison.

[@psychokinrazalon]

Whatever. The point is, jurors take all the blame for someone losing, hence why people say Russell was robbed twice.

[@psychokinrazalon]

Except you have no control over whether or not you win. The jurors are not mindless robots that follow specific commands fed to them. They need to be responsible when choosing who to vote for, because they'll naturally receive all the blame for someone losing or winning.

[@nickp3949]

Guys...let me break it down for you. Boston Rob decided to put the game of Survivor as more important than his friendship with Lex. Lex told him straight up that it was crushing him on a personal level (and it was) and immediately when he said that, Rob should hve realized that his friendship was on the line. When it comes down to it, Rob made a scumbag move, something that a good person lie Kathy would never have done because she IS a good person. You guys are right, it IS just a game, which is why Rob should have said "fuck it" and kept his friendship, because that's more important than a game. Yes, Lex shouldn't have gotten personal about it, that's on him...but the reality is that it DID effect him that way. You change the way something effects you. If something truly rips you apart then it truly rips you apart, nothing you can do. Emotions are real for a reason, it's not like Lex CHOSE to feel that way. Rob said point blank that the game was more important than his friendship with Lex, so Lex isn't his friend anymore. It's really not complicated.

[@Ktc99999-b]

Amber was a better player than Rob in this season. For sure. She didn't pissed the jury

[@zimdelinvasor]

"You ruined friendships that took years to build..." Girl, it takes two to tango. He didn't ruin anything unless you decide he did. He wrote your name on a piece of paper to vote you out of a game that lasts a month - you voted him out of the same game two years earlier! It's not the end of the world. This speech was ridiculously uncomfortable.. I don't tune into my favorite TV shows to watch middle-aged women break down in tears to kids half their age about friendship. What a depressing ending.

[@russianskatingfan]

Many others, especialy Grant (Redemption Island) and Lex (All Stars) stopped being friends with Rob for good because they voted him. So I dont see why you are singling out Kathy. Rob needlessly ruined many friendships through the game. He is just a bad person.

[@ANTMFabuous]

Frank, Kathy voted for Rob to win this season, and she didn't vote him out in Marquesas, so honestly shut up

[@shot1897]

Actually Kathy never voted rob out in marquesas, she voted Zoe in the tribal council where rob was voted out so get your facts correct dumbass

[@pogodziej]

Now I would prefer Rob to win this damn season (one of the worst I admit) so he just didn't come back in Redemption Island anymore. He just screwed up that season. Heroes vs. Villains? Of course! Cause Russel (who I hated also but whatever) kicked him out so fast. But with newbies? Seriously?

[@zt1053]

Kathy was the one really responsible for Jerri being voted out over Amber.

[@slimbish605]

I’d say it was more of a team effort.

[@jinxIomI]

Something about this throws me off. What close bond does a 50 year old woman have with a 20 year old man? And her resentment towards Amber? This speech did scream like jealousy to me. Hope it wasnt like that though, would be hella weird otherwise

[@GNRACDCAIC]

Are you playing Rob? Twenty years later still together with 4 children….so no!

[@Tehui1974]

@PumaOPumaOPumaO Yeah, I can appreciate that feelings are feelings. However, when I'm playing poker with my best buddies, I don't cry when they bluff me out of a big pot and I end up folding with the best hand. If people go into survivor aiming to be "honest an righteous" then good for them, but they shouldn't expect people to tell lies and deceive them. It's part of the game.

[@lacheyrulez]

Very Very personal season Jeff Probst didnt wanna do it because of this, ruined friendships

[@Claronium780]

I can't believe none of them were smart enough to take Rob out - I mean even Shii Ann voted for Kathy I think did she really think she was even going to make it to the final 5?!!!???

[@TeamGametimeFitness]

People seem to forget that Rob was a nobody in all stars. he was fucking shit in marquesas. That's why he wasn't a threat.

[@TeamGametimeFitness]

All the big threats and winners were targeted first, and the players who ranked lower went further. And this season had the worst survivor winner ever.

[@SFArasTMToomuchslays]

Yeh, he made good game moves early (like Peter and Hunter) but come the tribe-switch he was completely flat and an easy first out at the merge, Sean Rector was originally going to be on S8 but was unavailable so Rob replaced him (despite finishing 10/16) so yeah he was a nobody.

[@walterhughes2720]

Shii Ann voted Amber, not Kathy. Amber was the bigger treath then rob

[@nostalgia9338]

claronium 780 Exactly. Jenna Lewis must have felt like a stupid ass being in the final 3 with a potential married couple! And this is the reason I hated this season. All of the people sitting in the jury and Amber and even Rob are bottom tier players. Flip the other side of the game and you wouldn’t see Miss Amber near the final 2. Every single one of them stupid to play with a couple and thinking they were going to reach the final 2 with either of them.

[@thesir27]

"people left in carnage"????? they fucking got eliminated from a game show. its not like Rob marked them for death when he voted them out

[@thestrangers90]

Oh please. You don't know anything about friendship? She said he was like a son to her. Go there with someone that close to you, try to vote him or her out and see how it feels. She understood what the game was. She understood better than any of us. She was just hurt by the way he voted her out, without any respect. Go on an island, live in misery with people, and see if the friendship you built together isn't strong. By the way, she never voted him out. She had his back always. So you are wrong

[@psychokinrazalon]

Ahhh, but he still didn't win All-Stars. Honestly, Rob should've just bragged to all of them like Russell did since he wasn't going to win no matter what he did.

[@Ktc99999-b]

Kathy, you keep your friendships in this game till the end? No wonder you lost.

[@Scarface615]

Rob deserved to win,if this season would have happened these days no one would care if u back stabbed someone to get to the final 3

[@josharguello4313]

louie 52 I respectfully disagree. I think the result would be the same. Survivor is all about relationship management, especially when it comes to the jury. The jury is made up of people, and people are emotional beings. To discount people's feelings as being bitter is simply unfair because we all have emotions and have experienced anger, disappointment, bitterness and betrayal. You can't just "check it at the door" especially in the heat of the moment. Many posters think that players nowadays are less emotional than they were in the early seasons. That may appear to be the case on paper, but I'm not sure if its true. Take HvV which is several years after AS, Candice and Amanda had played with Parvati before and were friends with her. In the end, they gave their vote to Sandra. That tells me that Parvati mismanaged her relationship with both of them, as getting their vote should have been relatively easy given their previous association. At the end, it all comes down to respect, which is what Kathy is getting at in her speech. If you don't respect the jury, don't expect the jury to respect you and vote for you. As I watch Rob's responses so many years later, I feel the same way I felt the first time I saw it. Rob is still playing them, the jury can sense it, and continues to feel disrespected. I feel like Amber's victory over Rob has more to do with her answers being perceived as more "sincere" than Rob's. Whether or not that's truly the case is besides the point. What matters in Survivor is perception.

[@loynco9299]

@@josharguello4313 i know I'm 5 months late but I just want to awnser this. First of all, All Stars seasons are NOTHING compared with normal seasons, because here you play with real friends, with people that you know. It has been proven a lot of times(AS, HvV and Caramoan the most notable). It's not the same as Samoa, because there it was "Well, we re bitter, we don't like you, and hopefully we never see you again" Wich is fine. But here it's a whole different story. That's why All Stars seasons are the most difficult, there are more emotions in play, you know who are you playing with. The second point and may be unpopular. I was one of those guys who defended the thing of "If the jury is bitter Is the finalist fault" and I'll defend that to death. However, AS jury wasn't just bitter. Was also hypocrite. Why I mean this? Because Lex is still bitter, without no reason, with Rob. What I mean by saying "without a good reason"? Simple, he did the EXACT same thing to Ethan. He even said in a confessional that he doesn't care that Ethan was his friend, he just want to win. Something really curious since it is the EXACT same thing that he criticized Rob. Big Tom and Alicia had reasons to be bitter, but Lex didn't. In my opinion, he shluld have voted for Rob, or at least(if he really thought Amber played better) not doing that awful speech.

[@josharguello4313]

@@loynco9299 I agree with you. Lex is the biggest hypocrite in Survivor history. The interesting thing about Survivor is that jurors don't necessarily get to be "right" or justified in how they vote just because they were outsmarted. Although I do believe that most jurors reward the right player with their vote and voting based on personal reasons is perfectly valid, the thing is that voting based on personal reasons can easily put you on a negative light if your reasoning seems to contradict your own actions in the game, which was exactly the case when it came to Lex. His gameplay was exactly the same as Rob, but he thinks he can claim the moral high ground because his strategy blew up in his face. Nope! I don't think so. We all saw his actions on All Stars and his confessionals. Lex was always delusional, entitled and a sore loser. His behavior in AS solidified that.

[@cerulean739]

The jury this season would never survive today’s standards. Some of these people didn’t understand this was a game, they thought this was a holiday trip.

[@JudeMarchisio]

This woman was a massive hypocrite. Smh.

[@Raddy2k]

It's a game. For a million dollars. All the jury members and just jealous and bitter. Too bad. Were here and youre there .....go cry

[@mylifefornick]

I don't think she gets it...haha.

[@slimbish605]

It was in 2004... haha

[@sunflowerhopefully7395]

What a baby….she would have done the same thing for a million dollars… sour grapes

[@mhalbe1984]

This was a weird season. Playing against your friends in a high pressure season... I don't think these people were ready for it. They took the game too seriously. Understandably, the show as watched by 20+ million people. She was right about the 'respect' part, which is the key ingredient to a good jury management, something that was still being developed at this stage in the series.

[@gordoncorroon7652]

How the hell did Amber make it to the end, she did nothing in this game!

[@alexisdiva9]

She didn't do anything in the Outback season either except hang around Jerri as if she were joined at the hip so Amber should never have been cast here - the only reason she was cast was on account of Elizabeth Hasselback (then Filarski in the Outback) declined the offer since she was just starting her co host job on The View. Instead she acts like a kind of Jezebel sucking in Boston Rob while hiding behind the facade of being a "good Catholic girl" and Boston Rob with his mafioso attitude comes a kind of Ahab but with his manhood intact.

[@psychokinrazalon]

Like I said, he wasn't going to win either way.

[@NYChica23]

@drealityfreak How much do you wanna bet she was jealous of Amber and that's where all this drama is coming from?? ♥♥

[@drealityfreak]

Kathy guess what, Rob is not your son!!! It is completely ridiculous and unfair of you to hold his deception as like betraying his own mother. It's a game, u got played, and made bad strategical decisions. Get off your high horse!!!!