Kemper: Studio vs Direct Profiles vs Amp

[@jeffsmiley3213]

Super glad to see back on KZbin regularly again!! We missed you buddy!!!

[@matej_hahn]

When making Direct Profiles you can use an IR loader, speaker simulator or something similar when going from the kempers main output. That way you have a better reference.

[@bouadie2007]

I don't get it , when i did that and switching between reference amp and KPA , the KPA loaded the profile what was on the browser mode (clean profile) and the reference amp was the sound it was supposed to be . Is my KPA defective ?

[@demesisx]

It’s like adding a LUT on set to get a better idea of lighting on camera when shooting log.

[@scundoalex]

Being from the old school, all I can say is WOW! Amazing the tech these days. Some tweaks here and there but still just light years ahead of dragging a half stack around.

[@kierenmoore3236]

The real amp sound kicks arse. But the Kemper is still impressive, for what it can do / the convenience (portability) it can offer ...

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Yeah. The Kemper is a great tool, and fun. But not as fun as real amps! :)

[@mhoff7722]

I agree. The real amp sounded fuller...maybe the level was just higher? Without having the real amp a /b reference I bet I couldn't tell the difference.

[@Henrikvikinghartfeldtjohansson]

My hero! Good to have you back on the tube. Providing hope and tools for us bedroom-warriors with crappy neighbors that dont appreciate what a 100 watt Marshall can do to eardrums. Keep up the good work.

[@ultraknilch]

I think it would be interesting to compare the real recorded amp tone to a direkt profile of that same amp, but using a powered kemper going thru the same cabinet as the real amp... and then record that signal. This way we could test if a powered kemper could replace a tube amp head. So real amp -> real cab -> real mic vs powered kemper with direkt profile of that same amp -> same real cab -> same real mic

[@geoffreymerrifield5666]

I keep referring to this video for the education on Outputs. Really appreciate it.

[@vitaliistep]

Sounds like you're using Pure Cab feature, that's why the Studio one and the Amp may sound so different. Thank you for the video!

[@Dimiguitar]

I used to shoot direct profiles by taking kemper's output (direct amp signal going in kemper) and running it through IRs of my choice in my daw. Then I could just flick from "profile" to "reference" in refining A-B mode. Pretty easy to refine and make comparisons then.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

That's a great idea Dimitris. That JUST occurred to me this week. I tried it a few time, and it IS helpful. But then you're locked into a specific cab IR. I agree that right now, it's the best solution.

[@Dimiguitar]

Michael Nielsen I would think so yeah. I just use a basic IR loader in daw and test out the tones through a few IRs I like the most. Some IRs also seem to reveal differences (say dip somewhere at 100-130 bass freq, changes in mid response) more than others in terms of my perception as a player as well, so I experiment.

[@guitartoneSA]

You need to add a touch of Kemper Natural reverb to the Studio Profile to create what you call "that little bit of air around it" when you referred to the amp. Natural Reverb - Decay time 1.3 seconds. Mix Level - 50% Pre-Delay - 40ms.

[@jeffsternon5062]

Dear Michael, imho you should load an IR so that you can compare your amp to its profile with more of a decent reference point instead of the harsher-than-harsh direct profile :) that's how I did it anyways. I used this chain: Amp --> torpedo live --> Kemper --> computer (IR)

[@eddienomoney1882]

I use the direct profiles because I plug the Kemper into the effects return of my amp, utilizing the amp's power section. It sounds incredible. Where as the studio profiles sound terrible thru the effects return.

[@bhosterman]

I tried many times with multiple kempers, studios, mics ect - over than span of several years to profile my modded JCM 800 and could never get a profile that satisfied me. I always convinced myself that 'close enough' would be good enough and I could leave my amp at home but I always came back to my amp after a few gigs. It never sounded the same in any venue. It sounded bad in wedges. The sound men messed it up. The only thing I could rely on was hearing my amp on stage. I use a Palmer to feed my guitar to FOH and that has given me the most consistent live sound and a great one at that. Still trying to find a way to leave the heavy rig at home but no dice yet. Side note: have you ever had a chance to play a Groove Tubes Soul-O 75? It is my all time favorite amp but my last one developed a problem that no tech could diagnose and I gave it up. Been looking for a replacement off and on for several years. The amp sounds like... Definitely like a Marshall but with amazing harmonic overtones that would sing on any single note. It was almost like an effect. It had a 'Fat' switch that gave it this rich low end that was just right. Wish I got a Profile of it before it took a sh!t.

[@mhoff7722]

That is the reason I have resisted the profiler revolution. Being at the mercy of local sound guys to recreate a sound that I can no longer hear through an amp on stage. When I show up with an amp I can dial in a sound for the room on stage and tell the sound guy that is the sound I'd like to hear through the FOH. I've heard so many local bands show up with a modeler type unit and wind up with an ice pick and chainsaw direct tone through their monitors and out front. That being said I may still pull the trigger on a Kemper Stage or Fractal AX8 for grab and go gigs as a way to get my feet wet and see how it works out.

[@themusicalmachine9413]

So direct only is best for jamming out of a cab speaker like a Marshall 1960? Preamp zone has a deal right now on direct only sounds.

[@achilleszaluar5825]

I would like to see kemper vs amp (head profile only) running with the same impulse response

[@J1Z06]

My kemper rack arrives tomorrow. I’m beyond excited.

[@zaldum386]

Wow what pickups have you got in that Gibson?? Sounds perfect

[@aleribeiro123456]

Nice to see you again!!! Your videos are awesome man!

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Thanks!

[@kaz153m]

Thanks Mike for your videos... because of you Friedman and Kemper have increased sales! Could you please keep the Kemper videos coming? As many as possible? I wound up buying a Kemper hoping to save some lettuce and NOT buying thousands of dollars of amps that I can't afford! So, the more the better on Kemper! Thanks again.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Thanks Robert!!!

[@guitartoneSA]

Think of it this way. Anyone sitting at home without any serious studio gear can make a DI profile, they don't need to own any mics or preamps, all they need is a cheap DI box. Then just add an IR of choice...that's the advantage of DI profiling over studio profiling.

[@guitartoneSA]

Use the DI profile with York IRs, don't merge the Cabinet. That's what Rod Castro did when he Profiled his Suhr PT-20, he was amazed how good the tone was, that's what he's using live.

[@gregormarini]

You need to level match the results!

[@MichaelBruceTaos]

CKemper: By our definition Direct Amp Profiles are taken from a tube power amp with a DI Box and a speaker as the load, imprinting the typical impedance curve into the Direct Amp Profile. Direct Profiles in general are identified by the Cab section being off and empty (!) Can you try this?

[@MichaelBruceTaos]

Seems like doing the preamp only misses the interaction with the power amp. Maybe..

[@BigHairyGuitars]

That's exactly how I did it. Preamp > Power amp > DI > line to Kemper, line to speaker cab.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

I've tried profiling JUST the preamp. It didn't really turn out very nice. I'd prefer a little $80 Mooer pedal over that.

[@MichaelBruceTaos]

Cool. I figured as much. The Kemper is cool but doesn't work out in every situation.

[@Twobarpsi]

Only analog for me! What are those clicks and pops I hear on the Kemper tracks?

[@Locoandchooch]

Michael is giving Britt a run for his money. These profiles are awesome. I haven’t used anything else since I discovered these. 🤟

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Thanks SO much!

[@iann8733]

I am getting my first ever kemper and this stuff is totally confusing me. If the studio profile is amp+cab and the merges is just the amp mixed with just the cab then isn't that just amp+cab (studio profile)? Like what's the point of the merged profile if the studio is seemingly the exact same thing

[@gv8452]

Did you use send>di>kemper?

[@raysmetaltracks6782]

VERY helpful, wasn't too sure how that whole thing worked. Been kicking around the idea of picking up a Kemper - but I guess if I have the amps (just a few) that I really like, is there really a need for a Kemper? What are your thoughts on some of the Sturgis stuff? Thanks!!

[@ctGONZOles]

Great video, is it safe for amp head to plug into that DI for direct without a load (cab) also connected?

[@BigHairyGuitars]

NO. The amp MUST be connected to a load or cab. The line can come from the amp line out, or a line out from the load.

[@batpigguitar]

So when making a direct profile you can't have the cab in the room with you and switch between the actual amp and profile to compare through the cab as you go?

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Not really, but maybe... Thinking about it, I suppose that you can setup a 2nd clean power amp, and cab and switch back and forth with minimal re-routing. BUT, that's not to say my cab setup will be anything like yours (for example). The profile will undoubtedly require individual tweaking for each rig. (I think). ;)

[@batpigguitar]

@@BigHairyGuitars yeah I'm just thinking this would be good for creating direct profiles with 'your own' cabs so that if you want to use your boutique or vintage amp live you could then take the Kemper and use the same cab you created the direct profiles with and get exactly the same tone without worrying about damaging your original boutique/vintage amp.

[@wingee]

If you had a powered Kemper you just plug that into your cab to hear the direct profile through a cab for refining. If you don't have a powered Kemper grab a Seymour Duncan power stage 700 as a clean power amp

[@MikeScott32]

Michael - If you could only have (personal use) 1....real amp or a Kemper?

[@Utube-s8m]

He hasn’t seen this yet. He said it here somewhere real amp always ftw. It feels different and it sounds better. Especially, if you’ve worked your way up to a great amp like a Friedman.

[@danc3746]

That Bowie riff was actually very good! LOL

[@geoffreymerrifield5666]

Thanks for explaining this concept!! Appreciate the quick, concise way you do and explain things. Joy to watch and learn! Do you have Kemper Packs available for sale?

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Hi Thanks! Yes I do! bighairyprofiles.com

[@geoffreymerrifield5666]

@@BigHairyGuitars Enjoying your Profiles and the excellent prices!

[@codsterblue]

Question. So many of the comparisons I hear with the Kemper are with very gainy distorted amps where the preamp is pretty much a square wave distortion. If you profiled a more medium gain setting or something like an AC30 type Tom Petty tone or juiced up Fender SRV tone and worked the volume control on the guitar to clean up the sound and then hit the amp hard would the Kemper respond and sound the same as the profiled amp?

[@Yahoomediaclub]

I’m hoping to use with Studio only, plugged into StudioLive 32 S which goes into Fluid 8s Powered Monitors...with this work for me, do I get max sound and quality for the buck?? Hope someone has a similar issue out there

[@Kessellish]

I have a silly question can you use the Kemper through an audio interface into studio monitors for practice when you dont wanna use your cab at home.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Jarkess yep. Works great like that

[@Chris_Porro_Land_o_Naps]

watched a few of these videos now. the kemper seems to be reliably rolling off low end.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Yes they do. It tighten up the bottom. That's one area that I'd like to see improved. Also why i think metal guys LOVE the Kemper, because it can get super super tight. But it loses some of the bloom and blossom of the low end, especially on Fender type tones. I have yet to hear a great 60's Fender profile. Don't get me wrong. It's still good, but there's definitely room for improvement.

[@MichaelBruceTaos]

the merged profile from your Demeter preamp is.. not great but I appreciate you doing it

[@BigHairyGuitars]

They better than nothing. But some of the Studio Profiles REALLY come close. Certain amps profile better than others too. The ADA MP-1 get super close, and the profiles are sometimes better. ;)

[@wyattmcconnell5993]

The relevance of the direct profiles becomes much more obvious when you work with cab section off. In that scenario, say you recorded a track of the amp, a track of the studio profile with cab section turned off through clean power amp into same cab, with same mics, etc.; and a track of the direct profile through clean power amp into same mic'ed cab -- you'd notice that the direct profile track sounds really, REALLY close to the amp and the studio profile sounds different. The usefulness of this is limited, really -- if I'm playing live and monitoring through a cab onstage but piping a direct sound to front of house, I'd much rather have the tone I'm monitoring through the cab on stage be a little off than the sound I'm piping to FOH be a little off, so I'd still use a studio profile with the cab turned off to the monitor out and cab turned on for the main outs. So only in a scenario where you have no need for a direct out to board/recording interface etc., are direct profiles useful.

[@BFahz]

Hi Michael, I got a powered Kemper a few days ago. Do you find in playing the Kemper that you prefer going through a guitar cab or playing back through studio monitors? I also have a Friedman SB 50 w/ the Friedman 4X12 cab and the Kemper sounds very "studio" like with the monitors but doesn't push air or have the presence of the SB 50 when going through the 4X12 cab.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

I only use my Kemper through studio monitors. If I'm gonna got through a cab at home, I use a Friedman Mini Dirty Shirley. I haven't had much success with 'amping' my Kemper. Honestly, I haven't put too much time into getting a great amped sound, since I don't really use it that way.

[@BFahz]

Michael Nielsen thanks i am going to return the Kemper. Too much work and doesnt keep up with my small box. May try the Ox!

[@Utube-s8m]

BFahz idk if u still have your kemper but I was just feeling meh about it. Prefer my amps etc. but I recently put a Revival Drive in front of it and it sounds and feels much better. I’m using it much more now. It can handle the high gain channels great. I was kindve surprised. But I’m never getting rid of my amps or dirt or fuzz pedals. I can feel and hear the difference and that’s all I care about because I’m not a performer. If I was I definitely would use the kemper, helix or the Yamaha 100hd which is completely overlooked. I think it’s the best modeler out there. Simple to use too.

[@fensterputzernuernberg]

That first one sounds more like " since you been gone " by Rainbow

[@jessec6402]

hey Michael I have some questions about kemper. I noticed in an earlier post you profiled the Demeter tgp but I believe you were using the vht amp along with the profile as well as an external effects for modulation and reverb. My main question is can you profile say the Demeter, the vht and reverb unit and be able to playback using all three simultaneously ( looking for that sweet dean Deleo sound) I don't have a kemper unit yet but am trying to research what exactly it's possibilities are. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Jceezmail@ gm

[@Smart-Alex]

It ALL sounds good to me. What kind of LP is that?

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Alexander Acker I’ll have to figure that out. It had a long name. It has a really fat neck. I wonder if I can figure it out from the serial number

[@BigHairyGuitars]

It has Lollar Imperials in it (pickups)

[@Smart-Alex]

Michael Nielsen Thanks but don’t worry about it. Sounds great!

[@timburle4980]

Question: Does KZbin loose a lot of definition compared to what you’re hearing in the studio? You talked about how bad the direct sound was, but it didn’t sound that bad in here to me. I hear a lot of Helix clips that sound good on YT, but at home it sounds like crap to me. Just curious.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

I'd say that you lose 1% or something like that. The direct sound is just a loose fuzzy thing. It's useful for loose fuzzy sounds! ;) But doesn't sounds like a Friedman.

[@idontanswerquestions.271]

dat sound YAR ya matey!!

[@hockeycanada18]

A direct profile is ment to be used with a physical power amp and cab. Do not try to use it with an FRFR speaker like in this video.

[@Lushoverthebridge]

Thank you Michael! ;-) Greetings from Switzerland ;-)

[@stephenchow5161]

yeaahhhh. he is back!!!!!!!!

[@vladzubac5360]

better juice from the Kemper!

[@Logan21063]

Nice Vid Michael, but here are is my objective opinion on this topic: Your "Quick Refine" is not what it takes to get an 100% authentic Studio Profile. Put more effort into the Refining and you'll get what you put in...Especially the Dynamic Range (Highs and Lows) of the Profile tends to suffer from too quickly Refining (and that is what you are exactly hearing in your A - B Comparison). The Kemper has to get something to listen to and that is not possible within 2 seconds. He has to analyze the Dynamic Range of the Signal and that depends on how you play und push the tubes of the Amp. At the End you have to play around with it (iterating results) and get your personal Refining Routine for getting best Results ! And of course different Load Boxes / DI Boxes ---> different results (I've tried a couple and got different results for the Direct Profile) - at the end i went with the Kemper Di, because Signal Flow was pretty short and crystal clear an there ist not too much in the way for the signal (when you know what i mean) -->check the Tom Mc Kenzie Vid for that You can argue about, if it is necessary, to also refine the Di Profile for better results. At least it gives more information for the later on "merge process" to have a merged profile which can calculate a sharper "Studio to Direct Portion" of the finished Profile. - So if you merge a Studio Profile with shitty Refining and a DI Profile with a "certain DI / Load Box" you will not get what you want to expect . - At the end it is no surprise that you are not 100% satisfied with the result you are hearing, because you did not put enough effort and detail into making the profiles the best you can.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

I just did the quickly for this video. But I’ve also found that if you refine too much, you can move too far away from the natural profiles sound. IMHO, it’s a fine line.

[@Logan21063]

@@BigHairyGuitars Hi Michael, that's for sure ! I made the same experiences with that. Sometimes it's a little try and error. But when knowing how to refine you can get pretty serious results comparing to the real deal

[@daniwest1370]

Hey is that a R8 or R9?

[@nuttavut2528]

So Nice Video

[@MatoMisik]

Thank you. Great video again.

[@bikeman1x11]

i cant hear the difference between amp and studio profile

[@p_1210]

Awesome. love your channel man!

[@anthonycosta2662]

I got no time for that. Good video thought.

[@jackbenson8228]

cant beat a 5150ii with a spark/boost in the front and a decent delay/verb in the loop. and a noise gate ;D

[@markinthemix6055]

I never really know why direct is sold. A cab can always be traded out.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

In theory it's a great idea. I tried capturing a preamp, then running the profile through a power amp. Unfortunately it didn't sounds anything close to the real deal.

[@Dartheomus]

Dude, you really need to run a humidifier in the winter time. Your hair is standing up and you have lightning bolts shooting from your fingers!!! Your acoustic guitars are gonna crack! :)

[@BigHairyGuitars]

😂😂😂

[@kimseniorb]

the real deal sounds so much better.

[@MultiGuitarDave]

My Kemper sounds amazing with poweramp and cabinet. My Kemper sounds mega aweful in the studio. My bandmates prefer plugins as guitaramp and effects. Maybe time for my oldschool 80's rack.

[@grudgetank3127]

keep on it!

[@freightdawg6762]

Very good

[@NO-TALK-GuitarPlugin]

Having both Kemper and AxeIII.... Kemper is still the best...! That’s why Kemper don’t make hardware update... they know competition is not even close. Unfortunate because Kemper fx aren’t good.

[@johnbuell8035]

Samuel Guymer I would have been interested in your experience and what you have to say about it if you weren’t insulting and aggressive. Wtf can’t you just say what you think instead of calling people with a different opinion delusional, idiots, and liars... I’m watching these videos looking for good information, not schoolboy spew outbursts.

[@NO-TALK-GuitarPlugin]

@@johnbuell8035 just use your ears and order both. Then keep the best.

[@johnbuell8035]

@@NO-TALK-GuitarPlugin not practical. Not everybody lives in the US. Shipping and duty are ridiculous for me, and I have no market to sell the one I don’t keep.

[@NO-TALK-GuitarPlugin]

@@johnbuell8035 kemper and fractal/g66 offer both worldwide shipping and free return for a month without any condition. Couldn’t be easier.

[@johnbuell8035]

@@NO-TALK-GuitarPlugin until you understand what ‘shipping and duty’ means for someone else in different circumstances. Leave it alone - you don’t know what you’re talking about. Drop it....

[@watchtheskies]

Hi, how did you hook up the DI box? the only way to make this sound right is to keep the exact same setup, then put the DI between the amp and the cab, To match the sound you still need to use the same cab to get the same interaction between the power section of the amp and the speakers, which will give you the correct impedance curve, if you are using a load box instead, even an active load, the DI sound will be completely different, in my experience nowhere near as good surprisingly the choice of load on the end of the speaker cable makes a huge difference to the DI sound, Pete Thorn made a video which demonstrates the effect quite nicely: kzbin.info/www/bejne/n2iaYYBvpbJjlc0

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Yep. 100%. The same cab and setup were exactly the same. Only the DI was inserted in-line, but the cab was still cranking. I've tried using load boxes, and they impart their own thing.

[@watchtheskies]

Hi Micheal, I have profiled all of my amps this way, and if I plug the speaker out on my powered Kemper directly in to the same cab it sounds fantastic, the profiles sound pretty accurate to the original amps, in fact I usually add a little bit of sag on the Kemper and it feels and sounds even sweeter

[@BigHairyGuitars]

Interesting. Perhaps the powered Kemper is the key to this. I’ve tried other solid state amps and i didn’t like it.

[@watchtheskies]

Hi I am using the Kemper DI box, maybe that is the key? shop.kempermusic.us/profiler-di-box.html

[@КанадаКреативно]

3:02 3:37 3:55

[@MrDavemiley]

I regret selling my original Egnater IE4 Pre-amp Dumb dumb dumb !!! Wish i still had it !

[@RockSiffredi]

Real amp sounds much better, Kemper profiles always have those spongy congested mids..hope Kemper 2 will have better AD/DA converters, more transparent tone and truer picking response.

[@pastorkev777]

Profile the Peavey Musician.

[@BigHairyGuitars]

I've tried. The distortion and drive of the Peavy seems to just confuse and confound the Kemper.

[@pastorkev777]

@@BigHairyGuitars doesn't surprise me. It is super complex in a way most amps are not.

[@vox1962]

Maybe I’m missing something but I don’t see the point. While the Kemper studio profile sounds good, the actual amp sounds better in every way. I’ll just use the fucking amp

[@BigHairyGuitars]

100% Scott. 100%. If you have the opportunity to use the actual amp, vs Kemper or AxeFX, you 100% should use the real thing. However...for instance, getting an ADA MP1 into a VHT power amp to sound amazing, at low volumes or in headphones is incredibly difficult. Most people have VERY hard times getting good recorded guitar sounds. Because it's hard, and often requires insane volumes. And... most people don't have access to a rare piece like a VHT Classic power amp and a Bogner Fish preamp. That's over $5000 of gear, and honestly, it's not worth the money, or weight. But it's pretty dang fun to 'kinda' try out some of the old gear that we lusted after as kids with a MUCH lower price commitment. It does get a little use in my studio for real work, but I almost always prefer to use the real deal, unless it's 1AM and I need a screaming loud guitar sound. It's really the same reason that many of us (myself included) has purchased plugins that look like Neve EQ's, or Fairchild compressors. They DO NOT at all replace the real thing, but sometimes they get the job done, and sometimes it's the best we can swing at the time. Sometimes I want a Lamborghini. Not really, but it would be cool to kinda try it for a few hours one day. Kemper. *I forgot to say "decaf" at the coffee shop today* Best wishes, Michael

[@JLP-333]

I've heard many profiles that sound every bit the same as the real amp. Its a game changer

[@johannesmayer4839]

Do yo know this video about the Kemper Di box kzbin.info/www/bejne/gZCWnp6jh5Krf5o

[@FYMASMD]

Dude!!! More sleep. Less studio.