Kevin Spacey Talks About Democracy - Call of Duty Advanced Warfare

Kevin Spacey (as Jonathan Irons) talks about democracy and US foreign policy in Call of Duty Advanced Warfare

[@AFGuidesHD]

"I promise I won't get political" Irons after one drink:

[@murphyjackedoff5970]

“CNN harder on Biden than Trump” give me a break.

[@detectiveluck2899]

🦖

[@AFGuidesHD]

@@murphyjackedoff5970 what ?

[@murphyjackedoff5970]

@@AFGuidesHD Hey, CNN said it not me. I guess when they aren’t being sexual deviants with children (look it up) they apparently are harder on Biden than Trump.

[@murphyjackedoff5970]

LOOK UP “Don Lemon Hamptons Bar”

[@ManofHalal]

You know it’s bad when even the villains start talking the truth about society

[@pagion3169]

The joker

[@SteveVi0lence]

The rapist tells the truth? About what?

[@reckergamer1879]

@@SteveVi0lence Judge the character not actor

[@RaidenTheRipper950]

@@SteveVi0lence He did what?

[@SteveVi0lence]

@@RaidenTheRipper950 he's been accused of sexually assaulting at least 15 kids

[@Fulcrox]

He might be a villiain but he rightfully roasted the entire United States outside policy in *1* minute

[@guadalupe8589]

Definitely a critique of the position USA was in at the time, Iraq War and all

[@Fulcrox]

@@guadalupe8589 yup, it described it perfectly

[@dakinoytc986]

Rip we can't choose to help him. We only choose Betray. He is really à vilain or he try to do à better world with less freedom?

[@Fulcrox]

@@dakinoytc986 the freedoom is a ilussion Made by politicians to enforce their flawed rule, we dont really choose, because being a politician is today a career, not something earned and won. He is evil, but only a villain because he want to destroy the status quo Made by the United States

[@magatrone100]

@@guadalupe8589 Nothing's changed

[@Tasos04252]

When a video game character has more common sense than actual politicians.

[@AlGhulkazim]

Another example senator Armstrong from Metal Gear 😂😂😂

[@AlbertAlbertB.]

Let's see Paul Allens opinion

[@shortleader0958]

that's not even mentioning he is the villain

[@ididntaskverified3663]

How about we get Paul Allen’s opinion first

[@Delta-Snake]

Video game writers > politicians

[@getserious4958]

Damm, for a villain he sure knows the world he's on.

[@AFGuidesHD]

that's why they're the "villains"

[@andrewiannelli7635]

@@AFGuidesHD what do you mean by that?

[@Fulcrox]

This discourse is based on the United States involvement in Iraq

[@canaluludorel5838]

@@andrewiannelli7635 he means that ppl speaking facts are considered the villains

[@andrewiannelli7635]

@@canaluludorel5838 meh I guess. You can’t apply that often though.

[@scsutton1]

To be fair to him, he's hit the nail on the head.

[@NYG5]

The biggest argument against democracy is having a 5 minute conversation with the average voter

[@dunearksmith9869]

In part yes, he's wrong about democracy being a bad thing, but he isn't wrong when he says the US has a horrendous track record of actually successfully setting up other democracies besides there own.

[@mwroleplay7950]

That is a very meaningful speech. I agree with his speech. I am from China

[@whitezombie10]

@@NYG5 or 1 minute with the average villain

[@alphaares6027]

@@mwroleplay7950 Indeed

[@ZeGreatStick]

I’ve seen a lot of villain monologues but this was an eye opener.

[@spartangaming1352]

I know, it’s truly touching.

[@sammywilliam8156]

When the so called bad guy basically says exactly all the things that were thinking yes he's a bad guy but he's right people don't want f****** freedom they want rules order they want to protection they are like children humans are like children they need protection not just from others but from themselves you look on the TV and you see if you arguing over not getting a f****** shot or people arguing over which f****** book is the best give me a break

[@Hawaiian_Pizza_Enjoyer]

Villain?

[@everythingsalright1121]

@@Hawaiian_Pizza_Enjoyer Well, within the context of the game's story, he's a villain. He has prior knowledge of a terrorist attack that plans to cause a nuclear meltdown at a power plant but he lets it happen so he can make money and influence off of intervening, and there basically ends up being a small scale chernobyl. He also blows up the Golden Gate bridge while there's tons of civilians on it. He might say a lot of things that make sense, but that doesn't really justify his actions if you ask me.

[@kidfox3971]

For edgy 14 year olds maybe

[@imgvillasrc1608]

You know, this scene can relate with another cod villain's speech, Gen. Shepherd "We can't give you freedom, but we can give you the know how to acquire it."

[@Deathmare235]

When did he say that?

[@imgvillasrc1608]

@@Deathmare235 Team Player

[@sebastiankrueger6209]

Jingoistic and realistic are two different things. Shepard gave nothing but war. He didn’t want to give tools, he wanted to save face and be a hero. There is a big difference here.

[@imgvillasrc1608]

@@sebastiankrueger6209 Shepherd's speech is as realistic as Irons' speech on democracy. You can't give a country democracy right off the bat, they must be given the tools to learn how to use it. Heck, you're forgetting that even Irons is just as hawkish as Shepherd, both men wanted a war for their own goals. The difference between the two is that Shepherd got his war the way he wanted but Irons lost.

[@sebastiankrueger6209]

@@imgvillasrc1608 A war with no reason outside of saving his own face cause of the Marines that died under his command, and saving his own ass cause the double cross he did to PVT Allen. At least irons says people don’t want democracy, they want rules. He was clear from the git go of his ideas after his son died. Shepard’s Idea of giving democracy is extremely jingoistic, and his actions show nothing but saving his own reputation by igniting a war.

[@Veni_Vidi_Vici101]

Palpatine disagrees: He loves democracy, especially when he can turn it into an empire.

[@Deathmare235]

He loves adhering to his democracy and let the wheels turn

[@4everanarsenalfan]

@@Deathmare235 he loves the republic

[@wyqtor]

One man, one vote, one time!

[@haiqal5333]

He loved Democracy so much he shut down the Galactic Senate after being criticized from several senators! 😂

[@rickelgrim7974]

Didn't his empire fall apart in 30 years though.

[@HyperVegitoDBZ]

The irony is, that the "chaos" doesn't even have to be real. People just need to believe it's real.

[@SuperCatacata]

Just look at mainstream media. Create chaos wherever possible to distract from actual issues.

[@HyperVegitoDBZ]

@@SuperCatacata Precisely.

[@GLASSMOSCOWANDBEIJING]

@@AndrewTheMandrew531 McCarthy did nothing wrong

[@DaveSmith-cp5kj]

@@AndrewTheMandrew531 Based and history pilled.

[@krasnamerah1926]

​@@AndrewTheMandrew531, so was the army full of communists since the 1960s?

[@PhantomFelix211164]

Love him or hate him, he's speaking facts right there.

[@albertoquinones1173]

This is why I actually align myself with the antagonists and villains in most video games and movies. In this very scene he's proving what went wrong with the invasion of Iraq in 2003 and what happened in Afghanistan in last august

[@Chopstorm.]

@@albertoquinones1173 Iraq is a republic now. Japan, Germany, and South Korea all work under democratic systems as well. Honestly, the US has a pretty good record in setting up democratic governments. It's really only Afghanistan and Vietnam where they failed. Vietnam was only a failure because public support turned against the conflict. Afghanistan was an absolute shitshow with no coherent plan to maintain a government in a place that had been relatively lawless for most of it's existence. Kevin's rant only really works if your memory only goes back 10 years.

[@maddinenprimetime]

Facts about the state of the US itself

[@MuslimGentleman1776]

@@Chopstorm. lol, even most Americans no longer support democracy and liberalism😂😂

[@AB-et6nj]

No, he's like all dictators. Freedom rings in the hearts of all people, and eventually they'll manage to mature and overcome these kinds of leaders, and govern themselves. It's the story of England and Scotland, and countless other examples. He's fundamentally wrong, don't be so quick to give into him.

[@wilhelmvonberghoff175]

The writers for his monologue, without knowing of course, actually said something that’s very true about democracy and America.

[@Fulcrox]

They totally knew, thats why is a reflect of Irak

[@zamuraiicobalt896]

They knew. You don't write such words "accidentally" while just trying to make the antagonist sound evil, and talk evil antagonist stuff.

[@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent]

No not of America. About Democracy in general. The US is not the only country with a Democracy however it was until the last 4 years been its greatest flag waving champion. The issue is that what the character said was true. Democracy doesn't work in nation states that don't have the neccessary establishments to support a democracy. In the case of the Middle East. They run by strong leadership and action. If you can protect the people, feed, them shelter them and insure the well-being of them. They will follow you. Can you set up a democracy then? Sure can but only if the people follows you into it and you prove its capable of being done and they create the neccessary steps needed to create and run a democracy.

[@mwroleplay7950]

That is a very meaningful speech. I agree with his speech. I am from China

[@Fulcrox]

@@mwroleplay7950 China is a example of what Irons said, Mao massacred millions from hunger but then provided the Chinese security in a war torn land, and the Chinese followed him

[@HouseOfAlastrian]

Even I as someone who has never once contemplated playing a Call of Duty game cannot help but find this game's villain to be one of Kevin Spacey's most brilliant performances. One day I might even give this game a try... if this character is anything to go by, it certainly would have one of the more compelling stories of the franchise.

[@cool06alt]

If you can stomach mere 5 hours of campaign for 40-60 bucks, yeah.

[@HouseOfAlastrian]

@@cool06alt guess it's only worth picking up on sale then.

[@tuuufast5821]

@@HouseOfAlastrian it's not 40-60 bucks anymore lol

[@goobot1]

@@cool06alt bruh this game is old, prob can get it for 5-10 bucks

[@andrewmaddox2889]

@@cool06alt i got it for $3

[@shishirshohan1690]

I've been reading political science for a while. Believe me or not this is one of the best short speech on political science. They way he described the reason why democracy doesn't work in those country is impeccable.

[@SuperCatacata]

I mean it's simplified into a 1 minute monologue. To keep CoD brainlettes from getting bored. So it gets straight to the point. But nothing deep or complex is being stated here.

[@shishirshohan1690]

@@SuperCatacata simplyfying a concept into 1 minutes is the hardest part. Everyone can talk about a complex idea indefinitely. But explaining it in short speech is more helpful.

[@otissandford8539]

I mean it's a pretty tired and rehashed point

[@SuperCatacata]

​@@shishirshohan1690 Oversimplifying something so complex into one minute to the point that it isn't even correct in some scenario's isn't difficult. At that point you have ruined the whole argument in order to communicate it to people who don't actually care in the first place. Anyone taking this 1 minute talk a PS 101 professor in highschool would give as absolute fact is being ignorant.. The issue is MUCH more complex and nuanced than that. Nothing deep or complex is being stated here. The fact that you think it is says a lot about your own PS education level. This is literally like trying to argue how Justin Bieber lyrics are super deep and a work of art. They aren't, it's low effort and nothing of substance is actually being said.

[@shishirshohan1690]

@@SuperCatacata when something is so obvious, "oversimplifying" isn't that hard. If you see most of the country without democracy, you will see something common. Most of the people of those countries don't understand how to handle disagreement. Western countries knows how to do this , that's why democracy work in the west. Most intolerant region in the world is middle east. That's why there are no democracy in middle east. So called Arab spring trowed off dictator but they couldn't create democratic countries. You don't know much about geopolitics. You're taking this in the perspective of pop culture, I'm talking this in the perspective of political science. And I think he sums up very obvious things here. Yes there are a lot of explanation and details about that, but what he said is true and fundamental.

[@Schregger]

There is far to much truth in his sentiments. Not just in what people want, but in why you cant just turn a country into a democracy. Its a shame that they decided to send the story in the most clichéd direction possible half way through. Would have loved the choice of actually joining Irons in his plans. Would have been a far more interesting story.

[@Deathmare235]

Can’t really because it’s cod you need to be with America though the sentinel is definitely the bad guys from my pov

[@dakinoytc986]

Yeah me too, but you now call of duty is scripted from the bones

[@diligentone-six2688]

Unfortunately, Kevin Spacey is Cancelled. But at least the Remake Modern Warfare Trilogy delivers a strong narrative.

[@Paul-xu6gt]

@@diligentone-six2688 truth, it's immersive but mw2019 plot seems super realistic but when you look closer it makes zero sense, urzikstan is a desert country placed next to georgia, one of the greenest countries in the world, it's filled with arabs in a region where they should be speaking a turkic language, the whole general barkov thing is kinda weird, it's also unclear where verdansk and kastovia are...

[@smiley4669]

Hardly. Look at South Korea, Japan or Germany. We still have nearly 100,000 troops stationed across them after intervening. The problem is it takes about 50-70 years to be functional, at least two generations need to be born under the new system/government. However, people want it to start working after a few 4-year presidential terms and if it doesn't then leftists demand we pull all the troops, and after it collapses, then those very same leftists claim the collapse (they caused) is evidence of it being a failure the whole time. It's like going to the gym to lose weight and then after 1 day, you scream how you didn't lose 100 pounds thus going to the gym won't ever do anything.

[@kuanged]

All the other CEOs in the room be like "Shut up dude. Dysfunctional democracies is how we make our bread. Did you miss orientation or something?"

[@stephenjenkins7971]

Well they actually make far more bread from dictators feeding off of the misery of their people, but we like to ignore that.

[@kuanged]

@@stephenjenkins7971 No, the dictators are a cost center for American foreign policy makers. Those crackpot leaders are expensive and have to be paid off and given protection in order for us to gain their obedience. From our perspective it is an investment because those dictators make sure American companies are given favorable terms and unrestricted access to their domestic markets. Preferably our pet dictators will kick out all foreign competitors from their countries and give US companies a monopoly. Even better would be if there is nepotism and those dictators breed and make a bunch of spoiled entitled future dictators with expensive tastes. In those cases, we can even manipulate them into letting Americans run their banking system for them. Pull the same old trick that Mayer Amschel Bauer (aka Rothschild) used. Get the national leaders hooked on spending, loan them money that they can't repay on their own so that they have to pawn off national taxes to make their interest payments. All that money then rolls into the US banking system which we use to buy off American voters with cheap mortgages, car loans, student loans, and credit cards to subsidize their lives. That is basically the whole game. It is to take foreigners' money to keep them poor and destabilized so that they will never be able to challenge our supremacy. It also stabilize our position of political power and influence back home, by letting just enough trickle down to peasants so they feel content and don't question anything. Easy peasy.

[@MemeMarine]

Irons is tired of making money. He has all the money he could ever need. He wants to make *change.*

[@WhyTho525]

@@MemeMarine "That's why my priorities changed from profits to policy."

[@notrius7754]

"dysfunctional democracies"? Oh you mean the EU right.

[@KevinSmile]

It's scary how exactly true every word he said was.

[@yoshiduke7832]

I'm more scared by the fact it's Kevin Spacey

[@andrewmontgomery5621]

As Palpatine said in Attack of the Clones:"I love democracy. I love the Republic."

[@Deathmare235]

Way better than the Obi Wan comment

[@balashibuyeeter2704]

As he silently builds an authoritarian regime behind everybody's backs.

[@Carbon_Based_Life_Form]

@@balashibuyeeter2704 that's the point

[@Chief4Army117]

I mean, he's not entirely wrong. Democracy itself is fragile and, as he said, needs a country with the right building blocks in order to support it. Shortly after the United States was formed, a woman asked Ben Franklin, "What do we have, Mr. Franklin?" "A republic ma'am, if you can keep it," he responds.

[@thearnorianruby4681]

Pre-Constitution or Post-Constitution?

[@f3dea.329]

"not entirely wrong" what was the part where he was wrong again?

[@smokingcrab2290]

@F3DE A., he's wrong about a few things. America hasn't been "trying to establish democracies around the world". It's always been about economic and territorial interests. He also said we do it based on "fundamentalist religious principles". This was laughable. Again, we do it for economic and territorial interests.

[@whidoinedname2891]

@@smokingcrab2290 He didn't said the US did it out of fundamentalist religious principles, he's saying that the US is trying to start democracies on countries based on fundamentalist religious principles. Just a minor pet peeve

[@jonoc3729]

@Gamer_Gangster7 But hes correct, when it is more convenient the US has established dictatorships, not democracies. Like in many places in south and central america.

[@LeLaidbackLauncher]

If you've seen Charlie Wilson's War or Generation Kill you know he's actually speaking straight facts. Democracy requires infrastructure, both physical and social

[@ninjadragon5661]

That assumes democracy works

[@InitialPC]

@@ninjadragon5661 and it doesnt, democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on who to eat

[@LeLaidbackLauncher]

@@ninjadragon5661 works for a few countries in Europe

[@ProjectEkerTest33]

@@ninjadragon5661 Winston Churchill once said that: “democracy is the worst form of government - except for all the others that have been tried

[@astillia6073]

@@ProjectEkerTest33 best quote

[@Shorthairification]

To be fair, the whole rogue PMCs versus real militaries is a super interesting concept it's just a shame it was done with the gameplay of advanced warfare. But the same setting with a modern shooter? GOLD.

[@miguelluisgorospe8417]

PMCs of today simply aren't in the position to challenge entire nations and the main thing that they're more interested in is profit.

[@Fulcrox]

Today PMCs, unlike in the 60s-90s are shadows of themselves. They are no longer free to take contracts everywere they want, now they are dependant of governments and can only fight those the governments want to, it's shame to see, and why the Mercenary culture has been lost on the face of government controled corpos

[@Shorthairification]

@@miguelluisgorospe8417 True, but Russian Wagner and Chinese PMCs are able to challenge developing countries. Looks at the Central African Republic, Syria, Ukraine, and Libya. But yes you're right, the U.S.A. or France will never collapse at the moment to PMCs. Would personally still find it interesting in such settings.

[@AnonYmous-dh2zt]

@@Shorthairification It's not exactly fair to use Wagner in this situation, it's less of a PMC and more of a front organisation.

[@NYG5]

PMCs could never go head to head against a major power during the cold war. Easy to pick on bananna republics, but they were never juggernauts in their own right. A western PMC could never outlast the USSR, they would eventually get ground down. Just like a western PMC couldnt topple the US or a US ally because the US would shutoff its supply or send in Solid Snake

[@logger22]

For those who paid attention in the campaign, one of the Atlas primary bases is in New Baghdad, Iraq. Irons explains that Atlas occupied the city for only 10 years and handled it better than the 40 years prior under U.S. control. Showing how Atlas unlimited policy outweighs U.S. foreign policies because they are a private company, and can focus 100% on their priority without worrying about public opinion and politics.

[@epicbill7446]

The point: Democracy is gay ----------- < ---- -- ----------- Your head o

[@thezerastora]

I didn’t see him as a villain, I idolised the character and still do. It’s a man like that who could fix the worlds problems only too many people in charge don’t want peace they want profit.

[@majorevangelism]

Casually ignoring he wanted to mass murder over a 100 million people and hold the world under an authoritarian regime with the threat of chemical warfare.

[@andrewiannelli7635]

@@majorevangelism lmao true

[@sb17899]

@@majorevangelism so what? it's literally all make believe.

[@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent]

He's a villian I respect. I wouldn't idolize the character and I wouldn't agree with his actions. Far from it. What he wanted to do with 100 million people and his form of regime he wanted by threat of chemical warfare was hidious. He needed to be taken out. However. That doesn't mean he was wrong on his personal opinions. I would aknowledge that he is correct on them.

[@lnonno9321]

Bruh idolised him? He's right on some notes such as his comments here but the way he acts is literally through pretty authoritarian means, literally comparing to dictators who've committed mass murderer

[@Dominion69420]

The writing here has aged like fucking fine wine 8 years later and we’ve recently seen this speech proven

[@Srindal4657]

Liberal democracy is an idea, and it has truth and validity to it. If you take the position of government to its most logical conclusion, you always find authoritarianism. But if you take the position of people, then the issue becomes how to protect them. Ideas like democracy, rights and rule of law all protect people from others and themselves. But i suppose it depends what you want to support. The rights of government or the rights of people.

[@marcusrelicus728]

Although taken to the utter extreme, Iron's views here are not unfounded. It's the three key principles of life that he talks about that so many dictators exploit to gain power. The average citizen, the standard joe who works a 9-5 with a wife and kids, cares about only three things. If you promise, and provide, these three things then they will turn the other way so long as those three things are meet. They are; a means to provide for their family, shelter and food, and stability. It's how Hitler, Mussolini, Gaddafi, Hussein, and so many others gained power. Hitler actually hit all three when he took power. Germany, in economic ruin, was desperate for any chance at survival and Hitler provided it through his brutal seizures of Jewish monetary capital which he then redistributed among the German people, ending the near 20 year economic collapse.

[@andrewiannelli7635]

Search up the “stabbed in the back” myth. It explains basically what your saying and how Hitler was able to do it.

[@Pierce1996h]

The Nazis looted an entire continent and still couldn't win because at the end of the day they were just glorified pirates who didn't know how to manage a country

[@marcusrelicus728]

@@Pierce1996h The Nazi's lost the war for a variety of reasons. Note: I do not support them I merely try to provide all points of view and information I have. But anyways; probably the biggest reason(s) they lost was Hitler himself as apposed to the Nazi's at large. Remember, they held off the combined might of the entire world for over 6-7 years before finally collapsing. Hitler just didn't know when to stop while he was ahead (Poland) and was to impatient.

[@Deathmare235]

@@marcusrelicus728 so Hitler’s problem was starting the war in the first place

[@Deathmare235]

@@Pierce1996h wait what continent I mean the allies ransacked Africa and parts of Asia

[@solinvictus4367]

As a historian the first part he said about Democracy is very true. Western democracy is a product of thousands of years of experimentation. While the ancient democracies of ancient Greece and Rome established the building blocks with debate and the sharing of ideas it took the complete collapse of Western civilization with the fall of Rome to begin individualism which evolved first during the Renaissance, then the Protestant Reformation, then the Enlightenment, and even then it would take the American and French Revolutions to bring about Democracy as we know it today. That is over 2000 years of development and you are asking these backward 3rd world countries whose only forms of government they have ever experienced such as absolute monarchy, iron-fisted dictatorship, or tribalism to skip all those stages I previously mentioned and become a modern democracy. It just doesn't work

[@SuperCatacata]

Im not disagreeing with your point. But it worked for Korea and Japan. Just requires the countries involved to get the proper support required to develop. The Western countries haven't tried nearly as hard to develop the middle east compared to Japan and Korea.

[@MrSiddharthaSaha]

@@SuperCatacata Japan is essentially a one party state with an illusion of democracy. Korea is a dictatorship disguised as a democracy.

[@otissandford8539]

Definitely not a historian

[@kurzackd]

"As a historian..." -- *proceeds to spew a bunch of bullshit that demonstrates an understanding of the world that is below 10th grade history and is clearly biased from a Western perspective, completely ignoring other historical regional perspectives*

[@jamesyoo4779]

@@MrSiddharthaSaha Hey, South Korean here, I think you have the northern half bunched up as Korea as a whole.

[@jamezzz0035]

Kevin, my allegiance is to the Republic to Democracy!

[@andrewiannelli7635]

Based Obi Wan

[@asheer9114]

@Jamezzz 003. *LONG LIVE THE EMPIRE* 😈

[@dogbert14]

If you're not with him, you are his enemy!

[@TheWarmachine375]

@@dogbert14 Only a Sith deals with absolutes. I will do what I must.

[@dogbert14]

@@TheWarmachine375 You will try!

[@broblob]

You know you grown up when the villain you once hated as a child starts to make sense and actually makes very valid points to justify his actions. Questionable methods but valid objective.

[@AlwaysSomeone]

He's got a point Democracy is a lovely thing, but it requires a lot of foundations to be put in place and a lot of things to go right in order to avoid descending into chaos after the end of the first president's term. Most 3rd world countries simply aren't ready for a republic.

[@mysteryjunkie9808]

Even in a first world country Democracy fails talk to the average voter for about 5 minutes and you can see why. Having a popularity contest to decide leaders should never happen. Read some Socrates

[@cebonvieuxjack]

@@mysteryjunkie9808 I agree with you but if you want to understand modern democracy you must read much more than Socrate. Socrate and Plato lived in ancient time were the most liberal system they knew, Athens, was an exclusive system designed to only favour the few (true, during Themistocles and Cimon that few grew in size but it was still barred from the huge majority of the population), whose roles and duties where much more than just voting but also fight and die for their city (a duty that is far less present in today's world for instance). It wasn't based so much on tolerance or respect but on freedom and bringing advantages to crucial portions of the population. If you want to understand modern (not contemporary) democracy you can read Locke, Montesquieu or even Tocqueville for later works.

[@sol___invictus]

Every democracy leads to chaos. Making a democracy more *stable* means making it less of a democracy.

[@sol___invictus]

It applies to every country in the world, but yes, much more to the third world countries.

[@Mishimachine]

Democracy is a lie that deludes the common man that he has authority. In actuality, it allows those with money to control media and newspapers without limit and manufacture public opinion. I suggest looking into Edward Bernays if it isn't blatantly obvious at this point. Liberal democracy also continually erodes morals and stability, and is uncompromising in this path it in the name of freedom.

[@ARgmffn]

don't know what i could say about the second half but the first half is a very solid theory in political science as far as i know: what he describes is basically the political norms of mutual tolerance (acknowledging the legitimacy of political opponents despite disagreements) and institutional forbearance (refraining from using technically legal tactics to work around or antagonize/eliminate those political opponents), without which democracies do in fact fail source: a semester of a us political science course and the 2018 book "How Democracies Die"

[@Admiral45-10]

So, you're studying Pollitical Science?

[@ARgmffn]

@@Admiral45-10 yup that's the plan, it felt like something very relevant and interesting to study given the political climate in the us as well as even in some other nations

[@Admiral45-10]

@@ARgmffn Ok, that's nice... what you're planning to do in the future after you graduate?

[@epicbill7446]

@@ARgmffn Bro read Carl Schmitt please

[@KingRigo2000]

This comment section is missing one of the most glaringly obvious errors Irons makes: the US in the past century has never intervened in other countries to “establish a democracy”. It’s done so to ensure global American hegemony. Nothing more, nothing less.

[@AFGuidesHD]

manifest destiny was the genocidal expansion of America (funnily enough when Germany adopted its own genocidal expansion, this was deemed bad) the Monroe doctrine was an imperialist sphere of influence, which again is funny because apparently according to America spheres of influence are bad you can start to see how essentially, whenever America does something its "good" but when another country does it, its "bad".

[@AFGuidesHD]

@Johan Liebert I don't disagree with you that much, it's just funny when we apply your logic to other things in history for example "90% of the decrease in Native American population was because of diseases" is an argument used in another genocide but if anyone were to say this they would be an evil villainous outcast lol

[@AFGuidesHD]

@Johan Liebert So what disproves that most deaths weren't caused by diseases ?

[@emperorzhangzhongchang5672]

Jokes aside, If this dude was real i would fight for him

[@1992zorro]

he's real. His name is Kevin Spacey

[@olsenfernandes3634]

@@1992zorro My guy thinks this is Twitter, he's already out trying to (unsuccessfully) cancel people.

[@1992zorro]

@@olsenfernandes3634 Sadly you cannot cancel him. He cancels you after each christmas message after he kills you with 'kindness'

[@timur162007]

Join the ATLAS Corporation

[@argon7479]

You'd fight for someone who ideals are that he's going to seize authoritarian power and go to war? Kinda weird man. Also this dude does exist in real life and he's a sex offender whose accusers keep mysteriously dying before his trials

[@docproc144]

He’s right you know. While Irons’ actions weren’t justified by any means, his thoughts on democracy and government were spot on. For some reason our government has this idea that we can just fly over to some third world country that’s been at war with itself for thousands of years, drop a couple bombs, topple a few tyrants and regimes, and just magically set up a democratic government in a place that likely doesn’t even want one, much less have the means to support one if they did. Places like that have been unstable for longer than our relatively young nation has even existed, and somehow we think that we can play World Police and install stable democracies in these places when we can’t even get our own country under control. The US has been trying to do this for decades and all it leads to is more death and destruction. Take Afghanistan for example, we spent 20 something years over there and billions of dollars that could’ve went towards something else, all for what? We just recently pulled our troops out and left billions of dollars in military equipment over there, just for those very same people we used that equipment against to now use to oppress even more people. After the US relinquished control, The Taliban swept across that entire country, taking it back in less than 2 weeks. 20 years, thousands dead, billions wasted, just to be right back where we started.

[@TAKE_BACK_BRITAIN]

When the villain is actually the hero of the game

[@kateofone]

That’s why I value authoritarianism and see democracy as the enemy. Order, stability and a firm hand is what’s needed. Have that and freedom will follow after.

[@brightblackgrouse6236]

@@kateofone vased

[@yeah30]

vased and potterpilled

[@sol___invictus]

@@kateofone But authoritarianism under whom? Saying you just want authoritarianism is stupid, unless backed atleast by a particular ideology. Ideally a specific man.

[@CaesarsLegion1]

@@kateofone Based

[@GlamorousTitanic21]

He may be a fictional villain in a video game but he described the US’s foreign policy nearly perfectly.

[@SgtKaiden]

He's literally the good guy.

[@folderboy]

No he’s not

[@thajemm4371]

Except for the capitalism and private corporation for hire part, yeah he is tbh.

[@RufoGman]

@@thajemm4371 I think its the genocidal weapon route that seals the deal. There isn't much of a capitalisitic motive to that one. Killing lots of people based on ethnicity doesn't improve you're productivity.

[@DaveSmith-cp5kj]

@@thajemm4371 That's literally the part that makes him the good guy. Which is why he turns into a bad guy when he starts ignoring profit and starts trying to control the world with globalism.

[@ShadowMark3_]

I can't wait for a Helldiver to stumble across this video

[@Dongnae_book]

for democracy!

[@simonnachreiner8380]

Democracy is a luxury the average person doesn’t have time for when the question on their mind is “where is drinkable water”

[@Nauta_]

He is spitting the truth. People think democracy is inarguable answer but they don't consider societies also applies in natural selection. If there was democracy in 14th century the nation is going to fall in a month and become a chaos. Same with poor nations today.

[@ShatteredArchive5447]

It’s sad it takes a video game to tell you the truth. It truly is.

[@fatinabrar4081]

and the sad part is what he told was all true

[@bruh-yq2qx]

He's right though

[@riesenfliegefly7139]

Ive seen hours upon hours of political content, but ive seen such a short and accurate description of US geo politics.

[@SuperBuildsInMC]

1:19 when Kevin Spacey sees an unattended child.

[@chaseginise8968]

This caught me off guard 💀

[@Dickinthesenutzs27]

Finally someone talks abt the sh1t he does irl

[@Voidrings116]

Irons was spitting some facts

[@crosselsmith776]

When you grow up you understand villians.

[@watthedeuce6456]

Wished they gave an option to side with him.

[@milestrombley1466]

The president of Super Earth.

[@RabeaerisFracto]

Democracy isn't what this people need... Unless it's managed democracy......

[@FalangeRevolutionary986]

Fascist dictatorship is what we need

[@Darren_117]

Love him or hate him he's spitting facts (We need a Johnathan Irons more than ever)

[@darthkillhoon]

When the villain is the most down to earth guy in the room

[@piercepayumo4212]

You know a cruel and terrible as it sounds, I isn't wrong. Sometimes even the villain could always tell the truth. Now this is just my opinion of course.

[@07johngnzls]

THE WORLD NOW NEEDS PEOPLE LIKE JONATHAN IRONS AND HIS PMC

[@whodatboi2567]

I am actually shocked. This isn't even the usual "villain makes an iota of a point" type of speech. His commentary on Democracy requiring the foundations of tolerance and freedoms is actually insightful.

[@kangurukaiser9395]

He's not wrong though. I got a 93 on a Political science paper outlining the necessity for democratic culture over the structure. When people are in a disposition where democratic values are not at the forefront, they'll turn to anyone and any system with enough security, force of will, and in most cases high charisma. The 20th century is synonymous with this, and I am genuinely impressed about how well this scene is written

[@_Devil]

Jesus shit, this dude speaking straight fax, no printer.

[@KageNoTenshi]

It’s never about installing democracy, it’s about installing ruling power that agrees with America

[@user-ob4sq6fi3s]

Yes. And democratic regimes are just the way of government more familiar to the USA. If they were monarchists, you'd see monarchies being established around the globe. Same with communists etc...

[@KageNoTenshi]

@@user-ob4sq6fi3s dude American government had legit toppled democratically elected regimes to installed dictators that obey the American government, it has nothing to do with democracy period

[@Harry-tm3ck]

Source ​@@KageNoTenshi

[@KageNoTenshi]

@@Harry-tm3ck the fact they’ve openly said it’s for America’s interest Or the fact that they’ve toppled government that were democratically elected and installed military dictators

[@KageNoTenshi]

@@Harry-tm3ck the fact that they’ve openly said it’s for America’s interest instead of

[@yordy2740]

Very touching monologue. I bet Kevin went on to do great things after this performance.

[@silencia08]

Kevin Spacey really tapped on his personal experiences for his role as Jonathan Irons, such a perfectionist.

[@scoopidywhoop7484]

Uhh

[@rahulsar2030]

Actually Ion's words are quite true. People especially non-military background won't care about democracy if their country can ensure better economy, prosperity, safety and better lifestyle. Take Hitler and Mosolline for example, lot of people followed them as they promised better life for their lower suffering class. They rose to the power of dictator becoz lots of people believed in them that they can bring back their country from struggling times.

[@KrugerderGrosse]

And they did. The communists teamed up with the Western powers to destroy fascism in Europe but in reality, fascism in Europe sole purpose was to destroy communism, it had no ambition to destroy western civilization, it was a lie. The reason why fascism has been temporarily destroyed is because of the propaganda the western world has made of it and that people currently are happy and love living in their tiny bubble. The moment all hell breaks close and their bubble pops and their leaders are incompetent, democracy will fail and never rise again. Fascism will rise when there is sorrow in a state that has patriotic people. Democracies only succeed domestically if the country is rich, safe and everyone believes almost the same. Once people believe differently in a democracy, everyone will tear each other apart. Iron says this with great wisdom, a leader is meant to keep the people in check so they don't go tearing themselves up.

[@ReviveHF]

After watching this video Social credits went up over 9000. Jokes aside, Jonothan Irons was actually right about the democracy. (This game was the only thing that Sledgehammer done it right in the 1st place.)

[@ME262MKI]

Jhonatan Irons**

[@AlyssMa7rin]

@@ME262MKI Jahnotan Irons***

[@DaveSmith-cp5kj]

China supports democracies though (China became communist through democratic movement backed by FDR), which is why all the politicians they control try to get America to create democracies because it creates mob rule which allows central control to be established. America is a republic and that's the form of government we really should be establishing as it puts checks on majority rule to prevent dictators.

[@mnc365]

Comments talking so proudly of democracy in the comments section seems to ignore the last and most important part of the monologue about democracy not being what people truly want.

[@iblastyou4819]

Ok despite Kevin Spaceys reputation. He makes a badass villain still.

[@welkingunther5417]

Quite true

[@aleccross3535]

Here's to a wasted potential of an alternate ending where we can side with him instead.

[@andrewcharles6489]

It’s sad when you realize he’s talking facts and for a moment, I support him in the idea that you can’t topple a dictator ship overnight or even in a couple of months. They needs strong leader and strong sense of what it means to be a citizen

[@wsleez8749]

This aged uncomfortably well....

[@jesusrivera2970]

I’m gonna say it, Spacey needs to do more roles in games….

[@TwoDollarGararge]

No he got caught with some kiddies his career is over

[@guadalupe8589]

@@TwoDollarGararge no kiddies involved ffs, person was 18 (with evidence that it was consensual) so, let's all admit it was mistake to jump to conclusions and give this extraordinary actor more roles!!

[@foreverred105]

@@guadalupe8589 Bring him back to House of Cards. That last season was absolutely embarrassing.

[@justinbergeron5997]

@@guadalupe8589 At least they were young men (over 18) but it was alleged sexual assault so its still discusting.

[@imcontroversial8774]

don’t care, he’s the best, bring him back

[@Frostyknight627]

There are far more people in this world like the ones Irons is talking about than most people care to admit.

[@kietvo2633]

Iron is damn right about democracy , look how america prove for other country , it's full corpution or collapse like south Vietnam , afghanistan , ... . This is how i like Iron . He is speaking the truth .

[@bowwak5366]

@Roniixx instead they became a cheap factory of the Southeastern Asia for West. After all prices need to be as low as possible and more ambitious vietnamese can still migrate westward.

[@ricardograca1161]

@Roniixx Thats not true. Look at China for instance. Things are not always that simple.

[@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent]

Fun fact. The US was railroaded into the Vietnam Conflict. The South was not a US creation it was a French creation. Vietnam also known as Indo-China was one of the last French Colonies after WW2 and growing resentment of the French government resulted in political and social unrest which resulted in Vietnam having elections, choosing communism and the eventual split of both countries. The US wanted nothing to do with the matter initially but the French whined and pointed out that another Communist government in Asia was another step to the world becoming communist essentially railroading the US into the conflict it didn't want to go into. The US knew indeed most of the nations knew the Southern Vietnam government was corupt tot he core. Everyone knew it. The US knew it, the North knew, the French damn well knew it. Everyone all universally agreed that the North was the better government even the US although in the US case it pointed out that had the south and the french not pissed off a number of the northern leaders its likely they would have ended up more socialist than communist. Afghanistain is known as the graveyard of empires. Not in the way people think. That poor country is the site of thousands of battles going back most of human history empires grew and fell and Afghanistain usually was in someones hands for a few years a few centuries then in someone elses. When the US invaded in 2001 it was to remove the Taliban and its leaders, and the US would have succeeded had the GOP not gone after Iraq. The problem is the US like many nations before it wished to install a democratic or democratic friendly government into Afghanistain but didn't truly understand the situation of its people. Later in the ending years it correctly made the right choice trying to influence the younger generation however what the US should have done was establish a federation for the tribes or a kingdom (puppet state) that would have stabilized the region and gave its people a sense of control over the nation. Have the younger generation learn of democracy and similar so they could take over at a later date. I think in the end the US could have pulled a victory but the last 4 years especially after what the former US leader did allowing the taliban to have representation destroyed the thin morale of the afghanistan government literally bringing its demise a year later during the pullout.

[@MK_ULTRA420]

@@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent Even simpler than that: America's major rivals are China, Russia, Europe, and India, and Afghanistan is between all of them.

[@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent]

@@MK_ULTRA420 Yeah. The sad fact to is the Afghanistan is home to large deposits of valuable minerals that can literally turn it into a powerhouse of technological progress if it ever got its act together. All those countries knows it to. In the end Afghanistain likely will end up in the crosshairs soon and all the major powers will end up back to the war torn country. I have a feeling the US will end up back in Afghanistain at some point. Likely the next time working with other allies and not running on the GOP fear mongering that lead it to fight a multi-front war on terror. It has too as well. With China now on more aggressive footing to India and other nearby nations. Its only a matter of time before something happens and that country is right smack as a crossroads.

[@ZAR556]

sound like Managed Democracy

[@fusionvideos6288]

One of the few villains that I actually thought of as a good guy.

[@LordCoeCoe]

Most heroic villain of COD.

[@Ericisnotachannel]

Technically speaking, Germany, France, Russia, Austria, Hungary, Italy, Israel, Egypt, Turkey, Greece, and Japan went from autocracy, dictatorship, or monarchy to democracy due to direct or indirect military intervention by the US in the past century ( give or take 10 years).

[@cgmason7568]

Grenada

[@quangcaodo8864]

>Egypt >Democracy Hahahahaha. >Turkey HAHAHAHAHAHA >RUSSIA HAHHAHAAAAA Goddanm it you are hilarious

[@TheKaMeLRo]

Not for Thailand. US brag about democracy and freedom but also sell weapons to dictator king's personal army to abuse Thai civilians.

[@lihaida5838]

Making a speech does not make a person villian, action does. The speech was spot on: yes there are problem we face in democratic societies but that just simply cannot justify tyranny.

[@zippyparakeet1074]

Exactly. Villains are villains because they cherry pick problems with democracy and use them to forward their own fascist agenda showing it as a better solution. Yes, democracies aren't perfect, but they're damn well better than any other alternative. He did hit the nail on the head about US Foreign policy though. It's idiotic to try and establish democracies in countries where the people don't even know what a democracy is nor do they care for one.

[@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl]

@@zippyparakeet1074 actually I live in the middle east you don't know what you are talking about EVERY ONE HERE WANTS A DEMOCRACY.

[@zippyparakeet1074]

@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl a) middle east isn't one country b) you and the people you know don't represent everyone there. The simple fact that terrorist organisations and religious fundamentalists keep finding support from the people means that democracy isn't the prime agenda on the table. That's why the US lost in Iraq, that's why it lost in Afghanistan. You can seat a puppet and call it democracy but it ain't shit if the people don't prefer it and the various cogs and gears that form a democratic government care more about lining their own pockets.

[@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl]

@@zippyparakeet1074 I see that you are not a native because I can use the example of how long the Muslim brother hood lasted here in Egypt. You see almost every country in the region is not ruled some religious fundamentals but by courpt political elite that is hated by there population

[@archyneverpicked]

@@MohamedRamadan-qi4hl Why are most middle eastern countries authoritarian then?

[@MikMoen]

It's pretty scary when a little voice in the back of your head pops up whispering "Jonathan Irons did nothing wrong."

[@TheCompleteMental]

This is how you write a templar, Assassin's Creed

[@DivineKnight_115]

Advanced warfare was 10 years ahead of its time

[@DevilishBeaver0]

Hes absolutely right, the way our society works now is a complete joke

[@rcslyman8929]

Like the game or not, like the CoD franchise or not, the animation in this game was at an entirely new level of awesome.

[@selohcin]

Because it wasn't animation. It was motion-capture.

[@rcslyman8929]

@@selohcin MoCap is still a form of animation, and there's quite a few instances where it is done badly.

[@youcanpunchmeintheface]

the villain I'd listen to all day

[@Smokedship]

Golden words. One of of the best CODs ever!

[@kondor9998]

This is pretty much 100% accurate.

[@AB-et6nj]

What's accurate is how people, like you and the rest of this comment section, are so quick to give into people like this ...

[@davidward3848]

"The most precious possession in this world in one's own people. For this people and for the sake of this people, well will struggle and we will fight. We will never slacken. Never tire. Never lose courage and never lose faith." -Kevin Spacy

[@henrycrabs3497]

Nice square pfp

[@davidward3848]

@@henrycrabs3497 thanks

[@henrycrabs3497]

@@davidward3848 JUST KIDDING LOL YOU DORK! WHAT IS THAT!? ASTROLOGY FOR REDDITORS!?😂😂😂😂

[@davidward3848]

@@henrycrabs3497 I'm not a redditor and it's a 7 or 8 year old political alignment result

[@davidward3848]

@@henrycrabs3497 also I don't believe in astrology

[@tinykingcontractor1396]

Is it only me who daydreams with this speech every single day?

[@24YOA]

People slept on Advanced Warfare's story. It aged well.

[@KrossFL]

My man speaking the truth

[@R005t3r]

Gawd I miss Kevin Spacey. I love his acting style.

[@genghiskhan5701]

The irony about US installing democracies is that they had more success in countries where they acted as a old school colonial power like Japan and in lesser extent the Philippines.

[@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent]

It makes more sense when you realize that many of the countries where democracy has issues are those that had kingdoms or similar historically. Taking that suddenly away and installing a forigen power structure doesn't work most of the time. However if the people accepted the influence of it. Then you have the grounds of future democracy. As its the people that could establish it. Not a outside power.

[@MrAsaqe]

@@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent See the war on Terror and Arab Spring as the brilliant idea that lightning can strike twice. If the US went for Operation Condor Muab Dig Boogaloo, none of this would have happened. I mean look at South America when you don't even pretend you are bringing democracy, when was the last time some Banana Farmer blew himself up in a public market to protest the Junta? He got thrown out a helicopter instead. That is the true argument on Irons part, the most successful puppet governments The US installed were dictatorships. Not wars of so called liberation

[@stephenjenkins7971]

@@MrAsaqe Except those dictatorships collapsed within minutes the Soviet Union collapsed and the need for the war of influence collapsed with them. They were every bit as weak as the democracy the US formed in Afghanistan; collapsing without US support. In reality; US-backed regimes that don't have internal support are always prone to easy collapse, it's the ones that do have lots of internal support that stand the test of time.

[@MrAsaqe]

@@stephenjenkins7971 South American Dictatorships beg to differ. Whenever a US backed dictator happens in South America you don't see disgruntled banana farmers and coca cola workers blowing up American Embassies or driving a truck into American civilians. Meanwhile the failed democracies of Arab Spring and the WoT led to the rise of ISIS and Europe eating terrorist attacks

[@evenmorecheese2785]

@@MrAsaqe Nicaragua would beg to disagree.

[@marcoling2173]

Ngl, despite the villainous portrayal, what he's saying here actually makes sense. Aaaaaand I'm on a watchlist lmao

[@unknownz1238]

He be speaking facts

[@stefanaraharijaona324]

Finally someone decided to post this speech! Gold!!!

[@TimoRutanen]

That's great writing right there! Start with facts first and distort them later to become the villain. A totally believable person.

[@rmdhn1]

i mean, yeah, trying to make a democracy in a society that can't support a democracy is like telling a toddler to run

[@ShadowFalcon19]

This is why America needs to be isolationist to fix its own problems first. We forced ourselves into everything that does not even benefit us. If only we had listened to George Washington and remained neutral.

[@PRubin-rh4sr]

The United States will not survive now if it went isolationist. It is IMPOSSIBLE for a country to be totally isolationist in this time. Hell, even North Korea still maintains diplomatic relations to its non-enemies.

[@YoY664]

@@PRubin-rh4sr US is one of the few countries that can. Isolationism doesnt mean zero contact, it means zero international political activism. US still had commercial interactions with other countries during its last isolationism. Hell the westward expansion in the US was in part fueled by the need to find a route to china, to trade with them. US businesses still did business with countries, US government backed them but the govt didnt really have its own agenda it tried to enforce on other countries. You mentioned NKorea, Pacific and Atlantic rim states are instrumental to US's security, thats the extend of your security needs. Why is america involved Ukraine ? Russia doesnt even have meaningful populations on its Pacific end. Americans are manic depressive idiots.

[@theelightbearer4254]

This was one the best CoD campaigns. CRIMINALLY UNDERRATED

[@tom0900060]

I hate how the campaign make you go rebel against irons because I fully support his ideology

[@CentralCoco]

I've seen a few comments in here saying that democracy works just fine or it doesn't in South Korea or any other country that is mentioned in here. I believe you missing where he specifically he's referring to the nations of the middle east or if you want to go more specific, the nation of Iraq and its capital Baghdad and the people of the middle east/Iraq do not have the building bullocks to support a democracy as referred by Irons(i won't repeat them again), these countries cant support a democracy because their culture is not set to work within a democratic state, as least as of the current state of how they operate.

[@indonesianguy4026]

im a hardline democracy supporter but i always agree with this one

[@agniteyt]

He ain't a villain. He's a Eye Opener

[@compmanio36]

Are we sure he's a villain? He's absolutely right. I think I need to reinstall this game and play it again.

[@joseph891]

I loved the campaign man omfg it's so good...

[@josephanderson8655]

Oh no not reality! Somebody stop him!

[@daniel.r5295]

Yeah he is right but that doesn't justify his actions