When Did Star vs. The Forces of Evil Go Downhill?

[@robby7499]

When they killed off Toffee. He was my favorite villain with a lot of potential. And they do it in such an unacceptable fashion. But then he turned out he was right to begin with so WTF?

[@KittyMonk]

Not helping is the spell book they released suggested Toffee had a master named Seth, and their race is functionally immortal. Even globgor was scared of Seth, and that’s why Eclipsa rewrote the spell with no name. And yet they choose Mina Loveberry as the villain?! That’s like if the Owl House dumped Emperor Belos and made Tibbles the main antagonist.

[@danman4326]

@@KittyMonk OVERLORD TIBBLES THE GREAT

[@sarafontanini7051]

@@KittyMonk seriously, though I personally feel the Magic Commission alone should've been the final big bad, being the ones most invested in maintaining the status quo

[@millerkarageanes1562]

@@KittyMonk according to Daron nefcy Seth died prior to the series

[@robby7499]

@@millerkarageanes1562 But then there was someone else who worked on the show who said he was still alive. kzbin.info/www/bejne/q5KQcoGkdrt_oKM

[@Serje1227]

With Star being exhausted from fighting racism and rehabilitating Eclipsa's image, Star being mad at Eclipsa for selfishly using magic feels like she's figuratively mad at her younger self for doing similar things, and I always viewed this scene as Star being more mad at herself than Eclipsa. It would almost be a step towards maturity and self-awareness if the series didn't go off the rails shortly after

[@smg4reblooperd182]

That's a pretty good detail that under the right hands could have really developed her

[@cctomcat321]

I thought that's what they were going for. Marco even comments on her acting more mature. To me, it just seems like they skipped some stuff and needlessly made the obvious Starco thing take forever. Undoing the Blood Moon Ball should've ended differently and Season 4 could've started with them working together on the whole royal stuff, as well as what it means to actually be together. It just seems like all the story threads just fell apart, fizzled out, were forced out, or were flat out cut. That ending was just a whole pile of wth.

[@nevaehhamilton3493]

Star and Moon are truly like mother, like daughter in the fact that they both suck at taking accountability.

[@dalila2442]

I hate how Star herself would justify anything wrong she did by just saying "bruh, what did you expect? I'm a teen, teenagers are duuumb, I should be doing TEEN stuff like dating or somethin, not caring about real problems or real people."

[@zemox2534]

Still no excuse

[@McCraeTheMediaLover]

She needs to learn to about her problems and open up to others about her terrible actions. I want a Disney+ movie to bring the show back and deconstruct Star’s character by having her reckless actions addressed by showing how terrible Star is to others with her flaws and mistakes by causing problems to everyone,including Marco, and finally break out of her reckless,bratty streak by openingly admitting her own problems and confessing to everyone about how much of a selfish,dumb person she usually is who really couldn’t know how to make things better and keeps messing up a lot.

[@kateorgera5907]

To be fair, I wonder how much of that was inspired by Sailor Moon, who often said similar things about just wanting a normal life.

[@zemox2534]

S3 is where the series went down hill. At least for me. The shipping slowly became more important than the plot, Marco became annoying, Meteora was just mediocre and the high commission were just unlikeable. S4 is where things got worse

[@user-gp5yz5yz4x]

s4 was when it became unsalvageable, not when it went downhill

[@usermcskull4713]

Imo it went downhill in S2, most of that season is good but Bon Bon the Birthday is where it shifts from fun magical girl adventures to boring Disney Channel romance stuff. I think Battle of Mewni was still good despite the romance stuff, but I didn't like what I've seen of anything else

[@100lovenana]

@@usermcskull4713 I agree, Bon Bon the Birthday Clown was when I knew the series was going into a dangerous path of pandering to the shipping wars and romance clichés. I liked Jackie and Marco together, but when that episode happened I knew the show was going to brake them up just for Starco to happen. It was worse that they used the Blood Moon as a plot device when even the show acknowledged that the blood moon only forces fake feelings onto its victims, but then they justify its use with the "oh MayBe it WaS trUE loVE aLL AlOng" argument.

[@redmaxxs]

The reason Disney doesn't let their shows go over 70 or certain amount with animation is there's a law, once they hit a certain amount of episodes they have to pay them extra because they are obligated to give them a certain amount of for money for being there for certain years. The way they got past it in the past was if they change the title of the show it count as a new show so legally they don't have to pay them the extra because it's technically a brand new show. That's why the live-action shows have so many different title variance.

[@prometheuslens7825]

Wow that’s scummy

[@user-jb7tq7ko7e]

Well I learned something horrible today...

[@Rosemont104]

You've articulated your point so nicely. She really became, like the show did, a melodramatic, meandering, grumpy, gritty and wet blanket shell of her former self. I suppose it'd be interesting to see what you think about the crew's Reddit AMA and their supplementary books one of these days. For example, they knew they only had four seasons but wasted time anyway.

[@smg4reblooperd182]

To be fair she was kinda horrible character to begin, I stuck around because season 2 was slowly developing her personality before post battle of Mewni had her fall flat on her face

[@Nerdface.]

@@smg4reblooperd182 blooper

[@troperhghar9898]

My first recommendation to fix season 4 would be replace the *multiple* princess pony head episodes with episodes of star learning about her family history and how history changed genocidal phsycos into heros

[@sarafontanini7051]

and remove the starco bullshit and romantic false leads, those were seriously pointless

[@troperhghar9898]

@@sarafontanini7051 actually I believe the opposite; I liked that star and Marco got multiple relationships through out the series like how his relationship with jackie forced Marco to stop trying to act cool and just talk to her something a lot of young people can understand Same with star 2nd try with Tom where tom did show his growth at the same time showing show star had really just outgrown her "bad boy" phase I also like how all star's and marco's relationships ended so badly (friends family and lovers) as deconstruction of the destined lovers trope I.e. the blood moon, the place where it went wrong is in the finale where star and Marco get together never questioning if what they are really feeling is real

[@cartoonfanatic]

@@troperhghar9898 Aside from Jackie, the execution of the romances between Marco and Kelly and Star and Tom were done really badly. >Tom and Star get together in one episode despite her hating Tom in his previous appearances and wanted nothing to do with him. And Tom being over Star in Mr Candle Cares. There isn't a reason explain on why they got together again, it comes off as forced and lazy. >Marco quickly dumps Jackie to go to, with very little foreshadowing on this earlier. >The show forces Marco and Kelly together despite having very little chemistry >They dragged out Starco

[@smg4reblooperd182]

@@cartoonfanatic counter point it's addressed early on she isn't fully over him either, remember she willing went to the blood moon ball

[@SageofStars]

I can argue that, having rewatched it, the problem is that final season. Either cut some of the subplots and shorten it, or give it the three more seasons it needed to fully develop them. Basically the plot pacing in the first 3 seasons is great, and we got a load of development for everyone. Then Season 4 rolled around and things just sort of went down hill because there was simply not enough time to touch on everything. Some subplots from seasons 2 and 3 are just wrapped up in a single scene, others are started and stopped at random, and then the finale rolls around, and they've got no time to really expand on anything. Heck, the final scene remains one of the most frustrating of a show that claims to be 'finished' when you basically just introduced a major change, but then just abandon it. To be fair, it is the price paid for having arcs in shows now, some shows are never gonna be able to do the wrap ups well, but still, this was not good.

[@0Magicallywild0]

They had more than enough time to figure out what they were supposed to keep, continue or finish in the show since they knew they had four seasons to work with.

[@awakarikatase]

Kinda off topic but where, other than Disney+ can i watch it?

[@Rosemont104]

I wonder if you've read the crew's Ask Me Anything, which goes into more detail about what they did and didn't prioritize. This whole show was the result of the following: *a last-minute pitch change *no long term roadmap story-wise *writing in response to what works for "fans" (codeword for 'shippers) *drastic change in tone and animation style/house after Season 1 *padding *chasing shounen anime-esque trends (production-mandated filler) from other wannabe anime western shows like Steven Universe *the first major villain's voice actor having cancer/being too expensive *a prominent Avatar director leaving after season 2 *getting the worst Spongebob + Regular Show writers onboard for Season 2 *most of the crew leaving for Amphibia and the Owl House in Star's latter half *putting off unused plotlines into supplementary books so there'd be more room for their petty love triangles and WTWT episodes in Seasons 3-4

[@KittyMonk]

I honestly didn’t know about that. Ty!

[@Rosemont104]

@@KittyMonk Thanks. It's pretty interesting stuff.

[@lovelycupid642]

@@KittyMonk just to be clear, with "the first major villain" you mean tofee?

[@Rosemont104]

@@lovelycupid642 Yes.

[@sarafontanini7051]

this...does explain a lot. doesn't excuse their decisions, such as trying to please the fans rather than go with their own ideas.

[@ValenArtsAnimation]

Season 1, 2 and Battle of Mewni were great imo Season 3 and 4 need a rewrite

[@sarafontanini7051]

first thing I'm doing in my AU fanfic, have Star and Jackie hook up, and have Jackie be a main cast member rather than some recurring character the writers eventually forgot about. second thing I'm doing: have Seth and Hekapoo as major villains with their own seperate agendas and motives.

[@smg4reblooperd182]

@@sarafontanini7051 thank you...for making me appreciate season 3 & 4 more because God that sounds horrible, even Satan wouldn't wish that

[@sarafontanini7051]

@@smg4reblooperd182 oh okies :c I sorry

[@garrettjackson1451]

Keep jarco and make Jackie part of the main cast like what they did with Janna and Marco can just go to mewni to visit Star whenever she needs help and he continues his life on Earth and moves on from Mewni and bring more lore into mewni

[@simeonwashington9995]

I really wish we could have explored more of Mewni's history (I really dig the queens and wished we could see some aspects of time before Skywynne and her Mother) as well as learn more about Seth. I wish we could have seen more forms of magic spells and training and just more adventures learning about the Mewman and monster ways of life. It sucks that it came down to Starco and a bunch of haphazard conflicts that capped off with destroying the magic and cleaving the worlds together (and while that does change the status quo and adds conflict, it feels very inclined towards Starco).

[@meganmarchionda1165]

Yes my thoughts exactly! That's why I cool with the switch to Mewni since it was the Queens that got into the show. Too bad it was wasted like most things.

[@bluebird1914]

@jf k Me too, like what happened to that idea? More so, what's the point of having a book with all the past queens when the most attention they got is a couple of seconds in one episode that just showed their portraits.

[@smg4reblooperd182]

I took this more as lesson what not to do with my own show

[@for.you.and.iheart4983]

No offense, but for being honnest this is the first cartoon I see you americans ever give a lot of relevance to a character of mexican origin, being next to the hero character, who is Star, and being in the USA instead of other shows like Mucha Lucha and El Tigre, when you people are usually so racist against mexicans in your country, which is your posture to mexicans in general? what percent of people of your country thinks of mexican influence as positive or negative, depending of the states you live in?

[@hadridurrani188]

Never realised Star's hypocrisy in Season 3. But I agree I never realised how Star called out Eclipsa for doing 'selfish' and 'unconventional' things when Star did selfish and unconventional things herself in Seasons 1 and 2. I felt like they masked it well with Star's more serious nature which was why I probably overlooked it.

[@_NIKOS9_NIKOS]

To me (aside from the ending) it was due to how much S4 was focused on Starco. While I was not a big fan of it since the beggining (the prophecy killed any chance of me liking it) the fact that the writers chose to pretty much dedicate so much time to it when there were a billion more interesting plot points that they could explore instead just doesnt sit right with me. It doesnt help that their entire relationship is just the "will they wont they" trope, if they got together in S3 and S4 was about seeing how they work together as a couple maybe things would be different

[@for.you.and.iheart4983]

No offense, but for being honnest this is the first cartoon I see you americans ever give a lot of relevance to a character of mexican origin, being next to the hero character, who is Star, and being in the USA instead of other shows like Mucha Lucha and El Tigre, when you people are usually so racist against mexicans in your country, which is your posture to mexicans in general? what percent of people of your country thinks of mexican influence as positive or negative, depending of the states you live in?

[@Office_chair]

Really though also can't we just have a boy and girl main characters that just stay friends ?

[@nippy3674]

And I liked how Tomstar and Kellco were growing up and later broke up for Starco, because problems.

[@monkeydui7241]

I think it was the point from the beginning

[@b_rogue]

You know, I totally agree that Eclipsa shouldn’t have gone inside Star’s mind to find the remaining piece of the spellbook. But why does nobody bring up the fact that when Eclipsa ASKED Star if she had any remnants of the spellbook, Star straight up LIED and said no? I understand that Star didn’t fully trust Eclipsa, but I was disappointed that Eclipsa didn’t even MENTION that Star lied to her, and everybody basically forgot that this isn’t all on Eclipsa either!

[@Stxrbolts]

thank you! Someone pointed this out. The book is Eclipsa’s any damn way.

[@marcelineabadeer8380]

Star Vs was such a great show it’s really unfortunate to see what happened to it later

[@smg4reblooperd182]

Season 1 was meh, Season 2 was pretty good and an a great lead up to battle of Mewni, Season 3 sucked and Season 4 killed whatever good was left after Season 3

[@Office_chair]

This is why most shows should not have a season free or four most of the time it ends up downgrading it.

[@tayloredwards4968]

Season 3 was by far the best season. But season 4 totally ruined everything.

[@KittyMonk]

I think season 3 had more issues than seasons 1/2 but I still enjoyed it. Season 4 should’ve ended with Cornonation.

[@tayloredwards4968]

@@KittyMonk I'm going to be honest it should have ended when eclipsa and globgor became king and queen. Cuz I think the show would have ended much better there. Then the horrible ending we got

[@SaKura-il8op]

I think season 2 is the best season. With season 3 a lot of problems started.

[@heatherheinz2455]

Maybe Divide and Conquer should have been the series finale and season 4 should have been the first season of an Eclipsa spin-off.

[@aruce9]

Season 3 had some good episodes like butterfly trap but it does not compare to season 2

[@jaycrews3707]

Season 1:that was okay Season 2: that was actually very good Season 3:that was kinda bad Season wtf did I just watch

[@melissam6931]

For me personally it was Curse of the Bloodmoon's aftermath that sealed for me that the show was going down the drain. Curse of the Bloodmoon could've been great, it was an out for the show! And one that I really would've respected. All the stupid shipping drama between Marco and Star, forcing them into the heteronormative main character in love with the main guy trope was just that, forced by a curse! Super cool concept, tasty, it would've justified all the dumb back and forth nonsense we've been dragged through over the last season and a half! But for some reason they decided- Nah, this just shows they TRULY love each other because they're still in love DESPITE the curse being broken like no Star vs?? You didn't earn that?? You spent the first like two seasons with Marco liking somebody else and Star telling Mr candle she doesn't like Marco, why after all this bullshit would you reject the cool out just to headlong into the same cliched nonsense? It was just really bad, Star and Marco have friend chemistry but absolutely no romantic chemistry, the finale where they just start making out in the pig barn was just uncomfortable.

[@AnimatedIdiotGuide]

The way I see it there were two options: either the curse was real, and the show just shit the bed in developing the "real romance" from that episode onward, OR the curse was never real and the entire Blood Moon concept was 100% pointless. So either option they still fucked up.

[@melissam6931]

@@AnimatedIdiotGuide This 110%

[@cole6843]

I loved the show at first but it became about petty love triangles. The writing for marco and star changed pretty drastically in the second half the show. They became jerks. I still love Tom! He was always my favorite character. He didn't deserve to be cheated on by Star.

[@MillyKKitty]

I do aswell feel the show started to get weird on season 3, especially because of how creepy things got between Star and Marco while they were *dating other people*. And if I think about it, the show started to treat Marco like background character that everyone would make fun of. Then there is the antagonist of the season, Meteora that you can feel kind of sad for until she turns into kind of a boring giant monster and basically dies. Season 3 still had its moments but it felt like the characters were being either really stupid (like theCrystal guy from Magic High Commission) and really self-righteous and mean. But season 4 really takes the cake as a really unfocused season. There were tons of moments where characters do stuff just because. For example, the show basically speeds through the Globgor and Eclipsa plot, and they just sit there all happy while our antagonist of the season makes an army from the insufferable to watch Mewmans (Mina was honestly really unthreathening from the start and annoying and everyone in Mewni acts so stupid that it's hard to get invested at all.🙄). Then suddenly everyone has broken up with each other right after the Blood Moon curse and the finale happens and suddenly Moon is the big bad who is fine watching even the Frog dad she spent time with, get his family murdered, but then realizes she is wrong just because Mina is in charge. 🤦‍♀️. Then we meet Mrs. Fire girl who apparently dies when magic gets destroyed and is fine with it. And I mean, destorying magic means those spells inside Star's and any other universe Star's wand would die along with any species that depends on magic to survive in their environment, and one way or another they even state that Mina will still try to destroy monsters one way or another with or without magic 🤷‍♀️ So what was the point?! The monsters are probably going to get shot or prisoned after the merge of dimensions, since the people of Earth aren't much different when it comes to intelligence from the Mewmans...

[@smg4reblooperd182]

It's even worse seeing it in text how is that possible

[@for.you.and.iheart4983]

No offense, but for being honnest this is the first cartoon I see you americans ever give a lot of relevance to a character of mexican origin, being next to the hero character, who is Star, and being in the USA instead of other shows like Mucha Lucha and El Tigre, when you people are usually so racist against mexicans in your country, which is your posture to mexicans in general? what percent of people of your country thinks of mexican influence as positive or negative, depending of the states you live in?

[@MillyKKitty]

@@for.you.and.iheart4983 I don't think I am qualified to answer this question due to the fact I am not American.

[@Office_chair]

It really was creepy how things happened between star and Marco when they were dating other people like I felt horrible for Tom and Kelly. TOM TRIED TO CHANGE AND YOU STILL DIDN'T CARE.

[@trentintoof1465]

​@for.you.and.I Heart as a American i can give a bit of a foresight on those times that the dbows you named were running they were not on that often and did not pick up hype like others like danny phantom the fairy oddparents and the still old school acting spongebob was on air

[@lovelycupid642]

While imo svtfoe was just fine in the first 2 seasons (I stuck around because I recognized the show had potential) I'd say it slowly went downhill after battle for mewni, which is where I think the show peaked. After that, it slowly became more and more ship crazy, which I think is overall the biggest problem with the show. I think they should have either made starco canon wayyyy earlier in the show to get it over with, or not bother with any ship at all

[@buzzytrombone4353]

I always felt that they should've made a movie to properly end the series with some story about Star and Marco feeling like they didn't do enough, with a Laser puppy, given the ability to speak from the merge, being a character who would hold their hands in going through the aftershock of the merge, but at the same time would lead them into oncoming traffic because he wouldn't know what to do himself. It would've been a more fresh experience to see these two struggle after accepting the fact that they've got feelings for one another, with the puppy being someone in the background for the whole show watching it unfold.

[@jessoliveiro8975]

I remembered the season finale (and the entirety of Season 4) being a COMPLETE LETDOWN for me, everything just fell apart after Eclipsa was officially recognised as queen. The crew already knew they had four seasons (whether Disney cut off an extra season is a whole other debate) and they had SO MANY FILTERS with the LITTLE TIME they had left. Not even good entertaining "filters" like 'Knock, Knock, Knockin' on Hooty's Door', where it could had been light hearted and dive into the lore at the same time, just useless ones for the sake of the shipping wars (Marco and Kelly, Janna and Tom getting that warrior boot). I could go into a whole tirade, but the only good characters by the end of this train wreck were Eclipsa and her family, Tom and River. Everyone else, even on earth (my god, the 'OMG did you and Star get busy/is Mariposa your kid?' "jokes" in that one episode back in Echo Creek were so disgusting, how was it even funny), just deteriorated. It was quite possibly (and this coming from someone who only entered the show by mid/end of Season 2) the biggest letdown in show lore history.

[@TheKaitykatz]

You put it really succinctly like i remember after the finale aired i was like "star was kind of a bad person" and people kept arguing like "oh but she got better and learned her lesson" but like...she really didn't. the writers just chose to write her as more morally superior without justifying it at all and it made her come across as a major hypocrite instead lol.

[@charlesammi-el7337]

I fully agree with you. I've noticed that the series has started to go downhill, Star and Marco's personality has been tossed out and the supporting characters are simply ignored. Star When I started watching the series I didn't like her very much because she was very stubborn, inconsequential, and for thinking only about herself and in the last few seasons she got much worse. Marco The guy who was careful and responsible started acting arrogant because of that cover and wasn't even paying attention to his family and Jackie anymore, who he'd had a crush on for years and wasn't rejected. Toffee A villain with great potential, but the writers killed him before his time, which caused the series to lose interest, and in the end of the show, Star and Marco destroy the magic and fuse Mewni with the earth, causing a mass genocide and causing a war. Remember when Toffee said he knew how it would all end? Because it happened exactly the way he planned it. Final conclusion: Toffee died, but still won.

[@marioluigi3122]

Toffee took a temporary L but ultimately left with a W.

[@ottagol1985]

I've said it once, and I've said it many times: Was the destruction of magic really that necessary?

[@Pops34100]

Yes because the monsters would of been genocided

[@Office_chair]

No not necessarily I think Moon had the other option of all of them teaming up to try to defeat them with eclipses powerful spell.

[@Office_chair]

Also it was just randomly thrown in there too like out of nowhere she decided she hates magic. I sort of hated the ending because magic is what made it interesting.

[@Nerdface.]

ñø

[@CharaViolet]

@@Pops34100 There is literally a spell to stop time, a spell to erase people's minds, and Eclipsa's kill-all spell. And we know they exist because Star, Moon, and Eclipsa know about all of them.

[@jbcatz5]

It definitely feels like Mabel in Gravity Falls, who even after having her faults point out by the Big Bad continues to act selfishly (and that episode earlier showed she was more than self-aware of her less than selfless nature).

[@100lovenana]

Glad to know that people still remember what Mabel did. Her attitude in the final episodes is what infuriates me the most about Gravity Falls, and the fact that the show ended right after what she did makes it look like the writers did it so she wouldn't receive consequences for her actions.

[@Warriorcats64]

Season 1: Decent plot, amazing filler Season 2: Amazing filler, amazing plot Season 3: Decent plot, terrible filler. Season 4: Decent filler, terrible plot. But it would've been fine if the show hadn't completely undermined its entire premise in the final episode. It's truly the last episode [maybe two], that cements the show as bad.

[@miquelescribanoivars5049]

Everything was great... ... Until Star started smelling a sweaty hoodie.

[@strawbert879]

Great video! I personally having watched all the seasons left with a poor opinion of Star, granted I had negative feelings about her from the beginning. I don't believe she really grew or even learned from her mistakes or realised how manipulative she really is. What might have been a good strategy would have Eclipsa (having been in her mind) called Star out on her actions and hypocrisies. Stating that despite her apparent acceptance of monsters, she completely took over the life of an entire family, put them in danger, sabotaged and manipulated her so called best friend's budding relationship, and just lacked empathy and care for anyone else other than herself. Her and Eclipsa could have come to a stalemate, in that they both have made decisions that benefitted them without any care or concern who it may hurt, and that could have been the benchmark for Star making some self improvement. This is just my feeling, I watched the show years after it finished so I didn't witness a lot of the discourse around how it ended.

[@strawbert879]

@jf k that's fair, I guess you can't expect a character to be perfect, or be resolved perfectly. From what I've seen and what everyone says the lack of good writing and mistakes in the last few seasons really just messed up what could have been a more satisfying wrap up to the series

[@caiocesarmarques4765]

Star become annoying in season 3 and 4 make me want to see more of Star of season 1 and 2 in this last 2 seasons.

[@pockystyx4087]

this is like trying to figure out why grandpa died of a heart attack. Was it the years of unhealthy eating, substance abuse, toxic relationships causing stress, poor life choices in general? It’s a mix of all or more. Also he did a genocide once; that was pretty messed up.

[@jefferyandbob3137]

For me it was Battle of Mewni, they hyped it up like a movie only for about half of it to be effectively filler episodes that could've happened afterwards and a lot of the big story beats were hella underwhelming. Then when Toffee finally shows up for more than just small bits, he quite literally got one-shotted minutes after he wins and dies

[@renatoe9648]

would have rather seen Eclypsa refuse the crown like i just want to live in peace with my family dont care much for the kingdom, felt like Star was just trying to elude responsibility and Eclypsa had no reason to want to help Mewny

[@gabrielmeireles8851]

It's a shame the way this show fell from grace. I truly think that the Season 2 finale of "Star" is one of the best cliffhangers I've ever saw in a children's animated show. So I was VERY excited for season 3... but I already thought "The Battle of Mewni" was underwhelming when I first saw it, mainly for the - as you mentioned it - really anti-climatic way they get rid of Toffee. But I still did think "hey, maybe that's not the end for him. I'm sure they'll reveal that's part of his plan, and he'll make a great comeback"... how wrong I was... That was the point things started to go, at least a little bit, downhill for me. It did still have some story arcs that were intriguing and making me keep going (AKA Eclipsa), but the last season and it's finale were tremendously disappointing.

[@gzharsh]

I don’t think season four was as bad as people say it was but I absolutely hate Starco I wish it stayed as startom but I do love eclipsa and globgor

[@bluebird1914]

Same. Like it would've been really nice if they had Star become more mature with Tom at her side, and instead of her getting with Marco they both decided to remain friends.

[@cartoonfanatic]

Oh it isn't good, there's a multitude of reasons why it and S3 aren't good both from a viewing standpoint and from a writing standpoint. Also have agreed with you on Tomstar if the show actually did a good job of developing their relationship instead of rushing them back together in a really contrived way and not doing much of anything interesting with their relationship

[@smg4reblooperd182]

@@cartoonfanatic on Tom's side but Stat was acting like a total bitch with him. Ironic the one that deserved better was a Literal demon

[@Office_chair]

Same Tom tried to change a lot and she just didn't care. I felt bad for him also starco felt forced as heck and can't we just have a show where a girl and boy protagonist just stay friends ?

[@Office_chair]

IT WAS ALSO A LAST-MINUTE DECISION AND THE WORLD LITERALLY CHANGED FOR THEM TO BE TOGETHER 🤦

[@sibylhera]

the show still holds a special place in my heart, but i can't keep defending the final season. had they not wasted so many episodes on pointless fillers, the ending could've been SO much better. and personally, as a starco shipper myself i am really unsatisfied with how they were handled in the end. i wish they had broken up tom and star a lot earlier and shown that the blood moon curse wasn't the actual reasoning behind starco developing feelings for each other, and then have starco get together maybe in the middle of the season, everything would've been so much better. also, i wish they had shown us more of eclipsa's history with her mother and globgor. i hate them for wasting so many episodes, like seriously did we really need that episode of mariposa and meteroa? *sigh*. great points in ur video ! articulated many of my problems w the season perfectly :) also: tom deserved so much better >:(

[@フランクランドン]

If people asked me, “Who do you hate more, star or pony head?” I would say Star hands down. I could go on forever for how much I hate this character. But that would require an entire video to make.

[@McCraeTheMediaLover]

Yeah,Star should've been a better character if they took out the ego/inferiority complex,gave her flaws,had her grow and get better as the series went on,show things in front of Star why she always messes up and keeps making mistakes,don't make everyone useless and apathetic towards Star's actions,and make Marco more assertive and teach Star how to be a better person by attempting to control her negative emotions and impulsive actions properly(something that was never done in Season 2).

[@HiAgainTheNameIsStillAyle]

Probably when they thoght that starco was an actual good idea

[@smg4reblooperd182]

In concept it wasn't bad, hell they acted like a better a better couple in season then literally any other relationship in the show

[@lilllyeevee6536]

@@smg4reblooperd182 yeah, in your fanfic

[@smg4reblooperd182]

@@lilllyeevee6536 *season 1 I'm not talking about half ass revision in season 4 I mean season 1-2 where they go to private events nobody else was allowed to. Star's "Capture the Flag" is a good example what I mean, it's more then just 'meeting their parents' Marco is the only guest at entire gathering that wasn’t a servant or relative

[@lilllyeevee6536]

@@smg4reblooperd182 pretty sure it the same with other season of Svfoe. It quite waste of writing in every season involving with each other. Since Star love to play dumb as fuck

[@xmant8842]

I loved starco until I realized exactly what the blood moon was doing. I honestly would have preferred if marco ended up with with hekapoo or Tom and star end up single.

[@Blitzo8390]

I think the show went off the rails for two reasons 1: The death of Toffee. Toffee was an interesting and amazing villain performed brilliantly by Dexter Morgan himself, Michael C Hall and I felt his backstory was gonna be explored at some point. But no, he was dead. I mean, you know your show goes downhill when they kill off the best villain 2: Too many love triangles. The way Daron handled them made them annoying and like they were taking over from the stuff we want to see, the plot and lore of the series. Every time I saw a dumb romance story I was like ‘Move to the story!’

[@exileforever2508]

Sadly, they weren’t really cancelled? I heard by someone that Dana knew the amount she was getting and I believe that’s the ending she wanted

[@Nephalem2002]

I’d say Season 4. I really enjoyed what they did with Eclipsa and Grobgor but the rest was kind of bad. Result of the horrendously toxic shipping wars no doubt.

[@liloreocookie4610]

I was the biggest of Svtfoe for years, being my top favorite show for so long. I’ve never before seen a show where I can pinpoint the exact moment the entire show began a downhill slide. When Star dipped her hands into the boiling pot in Battle For Mewni, transforming, and killing Toffee. Maybe my Toffee bias is getting in the way but now that I look back it really was when the show just became terrible. Not because he died (though I’m very salty over that), but his death was the exact moment it collapsed. The shipping drama and abundance of terrible episodes hurts to watch. Season 3 was bad but not awful, while Season 4 was just a complete dumpster fire I agree with your analysis on the scene. I LOVED the episode since Eclipsa was my only saving Grace those last two seasons, but Star completely killed the mood. C’mon all we wanted was a cute episode between an adorable married couple and then Star decided to be Star. Honestly it’s heartbreaking seeing a show I poured so much of my heart and time into become so… bad. I spent almost two years working on a giant AU trying to develop Toffee’s character. Toffee, a character who I was in love with, was such an important part of my life that helped me through the worst times of my life. I honestly wish the show could’ve been better than it turned out to be. My favorite characters deserved better and heck, Star and Marco deserved better even if I ended up HATING Star by the end. Hopefully the series rewrite I’m planning will turn out better than what canon Star vs did.

[@Julayla]

Agreed. They really did Toffee dirty. Had at least Mr. Vorpe stayed on board or if the show actually ended after Battle of Mewni (even though I love Toffee and Rasticore to death), the show wouldn't have gone downhill as it did

[@liloreocookie4610]

@@Julayla I DEFINITELY agree. They turned such a menacing threat into a plot device to free Eclipsa. While I love her, I would’ve rather they freed her another way instead of just turning him into a plot device. Personally, I’d rather him stay because the entire concept of him “dying” was flawed from the start due to his immortality, and the way it was handled instantly made Star OP for killing an immortal, indestructible being. And him being right in the end left a bad taste in my mouth because sure, that could be interesting revealing he was right all along, but he was also the only villain to not get away scot free and died for being “right”, yet Ms Princess can do it and it’s fine. If Battle for Mewni was the finale I feel like S1 and S2 wouldve needed to get more serious more quickly and actually built up to Battle For Mewni, and maybe resolve Toffee in another way that doesn’t make Star OP. I personally would go the him sticking around route for those reasons. He could’ve kept the show going on an uphill train but nope Daron had other plans and rushed his death to make room for Eclipsa (though, again, I do love her) and shipping drama.

[@tierwidy]

I recall years back when I was avoiding this show for some reason, but when I finally gave it a try; it kept me entertained till the very end. Although, I have to admit that the last two seasons weren't as good as they could've been. Also, it's saddening that no one talked about the fact that the show flopped after disney announced that they have only one more season left. So many things were either abandoned or rushed, which made things worse. Plus, I do remember that the show went on a pause between seasons for a long period of time. I could be wrong, but I believe that was the moment when the team behind the show had to rewrite the last two seasons; cut most of the interesting things, and focus on the main goal. That alone would explain why there was so many plot holes, abandoned story arcs, etc. TL;DR If it wasn't for Disney or if the crew behind the show knew exactly how many seasons had left, I think they'd handle it much better. Still, I did have fun watching the show, so I can thrust aside some of the mistakes that appeared later on. Not saying that it was the best show I've ever watched, but it's definitely one of my favourites.

[@MKVarana]

I'm surprised with how many comments seem to agree pretty much with my sentiments of the series here: That season 1 was okay, season 2 was better, then it all went downhill in season 3, with a general negative view of the show as a whole product in the end. Part of my personal issue with the show is that I never liked Starco. At first, I applauded the show since it seemed to not be going in that direction, so when it finally did, it was a major let down (though let's face it, by season 3, most relationship stuff in the show was more annoying to me than anything). To be fair, I liked Eclipsa, but she's really the exception to the rule for the back half of the series.

[@rewriter3981]

Well in my opinion it waw after battle for mewni Star and marco became jerks Eclipsa didn't live up to the hype And i thought mewni would be an interesting setting for two whole seasons but nope it's so dull and 4 is literally Trash not even a good designed villain I would just end the show at battle for mewni With a few small rewrites to the first two seasons and bfm to make it fit i think my svtfoe could've been better 🤷‍♂️ but that's just me not having to deal with budgets Work Times And other coworkers

[@smg4reblooperd182]

I guess that's what happens when you literally fire the person who handles the Continuity with zero replacement

[@rewriter3981]

@@smg4reblooperd182 fr

[@emma_nutella58]

Season 4 finale was rushed and Moon’s betrayal made no sense

[@robfobjanstar]

Video on how Star is Mentally Broken

[@Juli_is_Online]

Goddamn did I use to love this show. The characters, the world, the art style, the music, the energy, the story...everything just fit for me. If you had told me before Season 4 how much they would butcher it I wouldve never believed you (even though I also thought there were some questionable things in Season 3, but they didnt bother me as much cause I thought "hey there's still time to fix/do sth with this!") And yet so much potential was just completely wasted on inane shipping and plotpoints that led absolutely nowhere. The creators were public about the fact that the way they wrote show was kinda by just thinking of stuff as they went along and boy is this show in it's last season a shining example of why you absolutely should never do that in a show with strong continuity. So many character inconsistencies, plotholes, weird character and writing decisions...man does it hurt to look back on what the show turned into.

[@meganmarchionda1165]

Wow I never realized how bad this was. Granted I haven't gone back to Star vs since the finale. This show just gets worse and worse the more I think about it. Especially Star man I hate what they did to her.

[@smg4reblooperd182]

To be fair she wasn't that good a protagonist in the first place

[@RuntyTiger]

Overall, we need more shows like this. We have a powerful white female characters recognizing her privileges and helping bring equity to those who were robbed of their life and dignity. We need more stories like this and role models like this especially during these tense times.

[@coolvideoskhatamovs4264]

I think the scene itself was supposed to show character growth. This is why she says "I know how loving someone can drive you making crazy things" or something like that. Your examples would be good if she did that AFTER the scene, not before.

[@McCraeTheMediaLover]

Yeah,but after becoming mature a bit in Season 3,Star is back to her old reckless,irresponsible ways,with her reckless,irresponsible actions and worst moments being amped up to 11 this time and much worse than before in the first two seasons. Even worse in the finale,she frecking showed no remorse for erasing magical beings from existence when she destroyed the magic and she lost her faith in magic all because of her mother starting a war with Mina Loveberry.(Also,Queen Moon could've been better if she should've dropped her pride,regretting giving Star too much power and freedom,took back Star's wand, and trained Star into a better mature and responsible person, if Father Time came to the kingdom and showed her mother the horrible things she's done and the damages and near-deaths she's caused to Echo Creek in the first two seasons).

[@coolvideoskhatamovs4264]

@@McCraeTheMediaLover Not really. She behaves pretty mature throughout whole Season 3. Which is why this scene fits: she was like that too (for Marco, like when she was running for Hoodie), but ultimately decided to become the best princess.

[@McCraeTheMediaLover]

@@coolvideoskhatamovs4264 Yes,I wished they would've done that more if they showed her maturity more if they did a couple of episodes involving Star's behavior and give her a therapist that would've made her admit her own mistakes.

[@coolvideoskhatamovs4264]

@@McCraeTheMediaLover Star’s behavior is quite mature at Season 3. Take almost any episode from Season 1 and compare it to any of Season 3. In Season 2 she also has much less “Season 1 behavior”. And what makes you think she doesn’t admit her own mistakes? And, y’know, sending Princess of Mewni to therapist is kinda weird.

[@cartoonfanatic]

Season 3 is where the show really went downhill, after The Battle of Mewni the show went into a different direction that was not for the better. The show moved to Mewni which is nowhere near as interesting as the show makes it out to be A lot of the humor became really slow and drawn and at times, DOWNRIGHT irritating The absolute poor romance triangle A lot of the episodes having interesting ideas but boring execution Some really noticeable writing errors The Eclipsa episodes and a few others are the only redeeming thing about S3

[@KaminoKatie]

Reminder that Nefcy always knew that she's just going to have four seasons ahead of time

[@Kara87569]

Does anyone else agree they should make a season about Marcos adventures trying to get the scissors from Hekapoo? I think it would be amazing 🤩

[@sonictennyson2201]

The series finale should’ve been The Battle For Mewni,you can’t change my mind.

[@Julayla]

Yeah I get what you mean. It's like when I saw in Yadda Yadda Berries Star bullying tiny Rasticore (despite knowing that he was a bad guy hired by Heinous) when she interrogated him. At the end of that scene, that one scene, Star feels like a complete bully who can get away with stuff. And with this hypocrisy, it's no wonder Star can get away with stuff like this: She's a nastier version of Brittney Wong if she was the star of the show.

[@CreativeNia]

I feel like after season 3, the show went downhill. I like Star vs the Forces of Evil, but the show has a lot of issues. Season 1-2 were good. Season 3 has some interesting stuff. Season 4, I felt like it could’ve been better.

[@mitzyeditz8999]

So I’m not the only one who thought Toffee’s death was stupid. I wanted Star to actually fight him like moon in season 2.

[@kittykittybangbang9367]

2:30 That actually not true. The creature said that she knew she would be getting 4 Seasons from the start.

[@asumi_channn961]

star always use the fact that she's a teen to excuse the things she do. every time she does something she says "well I'm a teen and teens do dumb stuff" like ok?? that don't excuse her mass genocide the way she treats people, and she whines when she don't get her way or she'll blame other people or a mix of both

[@SH1N0Z]

*commits mass genocide* Star: I’m a teenager, thats what teens do! Teens are dumb!

[@alysia8214]

To Be Honest I Find S4 To Be The Weakest And I Hated The Fact That Star Was Mad At Tom Over Him Not Telling Her That He Knew That She Kissed Marco.

[@hey_itzsugrz726]

So for context I already commented this on my mom's acc, but i decided to comment it on this acc instead, + some things added which is just me changing a few things Abt the SVTFOE script- If I'm being honest, I feel as if they should've ended the show in season 3 and did what the owl house did, which is have 4-5 episodes instead of a fully forged out season showing the aftermath of what happened after season 3. For example, one or two of those episodes could've been dedicated to Star finding her mom and Moon regaining her memories, while the others could've been dedicated to Eclipsa signing the peace treaty and making mewni a better place, while still giving an episode or scene for when Globgor is finally set free. Heck, they could've done what Helluva boss did in the end of the pilot and add that one love song Eclipsa and Globgor sang together in 'the monster and the queen', at the very end while the credits are playing under the song! I also feel as if they underplayed Eclipsa, like maybe she could be shown in a 'Good to Evil to Neutral' type light, as she does do bad things in the show, so just maybe, they could've shown us glimpses of her past, showing how Solaria's manipulative nature may have affected Eclipsa. They could've done something like a twist where past Eclipsa did some crazy stuff out of anger about how her life was and the pressure of having to be queen at such a young age, not to mention having to be separated from the one she truly loved all because her mom said so in her will. She could've started out as a mostly toxic and manipulative character, only for Star, Moon, and the rest of the high commission to help her change over time, while not extending her recovery for too long. And instead of changing the high commission to be completely hipocritical and overall jerks, they could've been shown to still have a little bit of sympathy for Eclipsa, while still hating her for the bad things she did, so that way, both sides are technically in the wrong. Eclipsa is in the wrong for doing bad things out of anger, and the high commission is in the wrong for sending away Eclipsa's daughter, Meteora, because she was half monster. Heck, to give an excuse to the sudden flashbacks, they could've had her lose her memory, with Star and everyone else helping her regain her memory. Glossaryk was also an underplayed character through the last two seasons, and I feel as if he didn't really live up to the role the story kept suggesting he played. They could've shown how the effects of battle for mewni affected Star and Marco's mental state, as well as how they cope with the trauma, with Star becoming slightly more hostile along with vunerable like Eclipsa in the past(for this rewrite), and with Marco having a sudden obsession with mewni and star, which gets in the way of his conflicting feeling with Star and Jackie. As for the shipping situation, I feel as if that could've been resolved by having Star single at the end of the series, so then it's up to the fans to decide who Star gets to be with. They should've also gotten rid of the blood moon around the middle of seasons 2-3, or better yet, just not have it happen at ALL, since that is what caused the most problem, which was another thing I felt was really underplayed. Heck, they could've even did what gravity falls did with it's unanswered questions and made it into a on going mystery that fans need to solve themselves! Y'know, mysteries like, "Aren't the butterflies technically monster mutants?", "Is rasticore Seth?", "Did mewman's really originate fr humans?", "Can star actually be related to Eclipsa through Justhin the unqueen?", stuff like that. All in all, My point here is that this show had so much potential, and it all went to waste. I'll use this idea soon to create an even better version of the show on another channel either on yt or Wattpad(or both), but until then, thanks for reading. -sincerely, and 11-year-old fan of both the show and ur channel :>

[@smg4reblooperd182]

I skipped the rest the comment since even owl won't succeed on that front, it's clearly already rushed and Disney shoved an early expiration date, it'll fall flat on its ass I predict

[@hey_itzsugrz726]

@@smg4reblooperd182 yea that's a pretty good point-

[@sofig1237]

I think this show peaked in Moon the Undaunted and, after that, we got a couple episodes that were on the same level of quality but none of them ever got better. I'm not sure when it actually got gross bad but... Yeah. It eventually got so bad it was gross. The ending? It introduced things and never followed up on them; when Marco gets stabbed by the unicorn, they zoom into the wound and then... It gets healed and nothing happened. It's just weird. It's not satisfying in the slightest and it has nothing to do with the rest of the show!!!

[@christiansanchez5769]

I hope we talk about the butterfly family and butterfly castle because the show really Messed up because in season 1 in monster arm star said the the book of spells was use by every queen but we later find out that not true and you don’t have to agree on this but the meteora arc kinda hurt me because star and eclipsa not being related but the arc was really good. The next is the butterfly family itself is weird because butterfly castle was rebuilt by skywynne because the original castle got burn down by queen skywynne’s mother lyric butterfly and also the first book got destroy in the fire too and only know about three ancient queens, the first unnamed queen, soupina the strange, and lyric butterfly so hope you talk about or whatever it’s your decision

[@AndrewColomy]

Star vs the Forces of Evil went downhill when they started focusing too much on the teen drama and shipping.

[@taakofromtv150]

I literally just started watching this show and only just got to season 2 after 3 days

[@bloatedcow1361]

I miss the old Star

[@McCraeTheMediaLover]

If Disney rehires Daron Nefcy and Star Vs. The Forces of Evil ever comes back with a revival continuation, I want to see Star go on a coming-of-age redemption arc and finally gain serious consquences for her horrible actions after acting like a reckless and selfish jerk throughout the entire original series run, since almost everyone would become completely hostile and turn against Star for what she did in the finale by destroying magic and is now considered a pariah for trapping them in the cleaved world and calling her out for all the past wrongdoings she's done in the past,then Star would finally reflect on her actions and decides to work on better herself and atone her past actions by going back and finding a way to bring back and respark magic(with her friends and family's help),along with finally accepting to take responsibility for her own actions,learning more about Mewni,magic,it's queens and citizens,and the monster-mewman relationship, and learning to handle and use her magic properly.

[@ViewerOnline101]

I don't think it went "downhill" per say, as I enjoyed the series all the way through, but I felt like there was a little drop after Star gave up her princess title and the direction the series took as a result of it. Still highly enjoyable though.

[@naciabell7903]

eah ok just gonna weigh in here. On something that nobody talks about/has mentioned yet in everywhere i have read. As i re watched the finale i think i got it. I think i got why the finale upset me so much. It was a subtle writing flaw that ticked me off as a writer that i didn't get until now. But now that i do ii understand why i still have issues. Simply put i let myself be confused by her wanting to stop mina. This is not important in the long run. What upset me so much was that Star never considered all the problems for others not on mewni without magic(or the spells) . what star did was the antithesis of the whole show, she became what she hated, a queen making a big decision for everyone else without actually considering the wants and needs of others. That is why i was so upset. When you break it down that is so against what Star's character is that it's downright upsetting. It sort of just...Makes her what she hated so much. Someone who makes decisions for others, saying it's for the best without asking anyone else. Literally her entire problem with the commission was this very thing and them lying about it saying ti was for the greater good of mewni. She basically does the same thing that feels so wrong Its just... So selfish. And there are no real consequences or fallout of this that affects her in a negative personal way It makes Star almost into a Mary Sue Everyone loves her and accepts her decisions no matter what and faces no consequences for her actions She kills magic and gets the guy in the end Simply put it makes star a hypocrite. Think about it. Star is litteraly a giant hypocrite by the end of the series and nobody points this out or addresses it. Heck even most people pointing out the problems of the show DON'T point THIS out either.

[@thomaswest2583]

Season four was rushed which ruined it. Disney would not let Star vs The Forces of Evil have a season 5. So they tried to tie everything up in season four and it was not pretty. If they would have had time to plan a proper ending and season it would have gone significantly better.

[@sarafontanini7051]

ehhh not really, if they didn't see how badly they were wasting time with what they had and focusing onthe wrong things, and didn't even have a good idea for a big bad, I have a feeling a season 5 wouldn't be that good, saadly. the show WAS good. Operative word being 'was'.

[@sarafontanini7051]

@jf k hell even the genocidal racist is given only a moment of sympathetic screentime with her daughter in the finale, which was WEIRD given she was, well, a genocidal racist. The book gave us SO MUCH and NONE of it mattered to the show at all

[@pink05432]

Yo I can't wait to see this

[@raheemaslam7363]

2:30 no that’s the worst thing they *KNEW* that they only had 4 season and hell could’ve got a 5th season but no they fuck it up

[@MarcoStrange]

As annoying as Season 4 is, I still think Season 3 was when the show started to go downhill. It's when we started to see more annoying things being a part of the series such as the shipping going overboard. Yes, Season 2 had that, but I felt it wasn't overdone at that point. Also, Toffee's death still annoys me because it felt like it would go somewhere and didn't. Season 3 may not be the car crash that Season 4 was, but it's what led up to it happening.

[@Nazo-kage]

I can tell you exactly when the show started going downhill. The same thing that’s been happening to a lot of animated shows. The Episode clusters. Both Steven universe and star vs. started suffering when they had those moments of no new episodes and then five in a marathon and then nothing again. Interest in the show waned because of that because audiences know there aren’t any new episodes after those and if there are there going to be advertise like crazy so you know when they’re coming. So ratings drop, because audiences know that they’ll be a big marathon showing all the previous episodes so they can catch up for when the new episodes come out in the cluster. And it’s not even bad for the ratings it’s bad for the writing. Because those clusters are usually story arcs that are quickly brought in and concluded or left ambiguous. And because of that the writing suffers because they’re trying to quickly hurry out something because The people making the shows have no idea whether they’re going to be canceled or not. A lot of shows being made anymore always seem to be kept over a knife edge no one not even the writers and actors are aware if there’s going to be another season after the one they just finished. And sadly that’s not even a new problem that was a problem all the time and TV.

[@lovelycupid642]

Would you consider making a video about Moon? Only if you are interested of course. But yeah, I personally feel like the show turned star into kind of a bad person, especially when you consider how she treated Tom when they got back together

[@KittyMonk]

I'm considering it, they derailed her character come Season 4.

[@sarafontanini7051]

@@KittyMonk seriously, they didn'thave to shoehorn some nonsense twist to make her a temporary villain,especially since they drop it immediately in really bullshit ways.

[@asami826]

yeah it would be great, they just throw her development to the garbage

[@Pokefan3332]

I think the show went down hill when they decided to go down the starco pandering route. Especially with how Marco brings it up to Tom and theres no real dialogue between it other than comedic relief. I feel like if they were going to go down the route of ships they should've fleshed the characters out more. Marco and Kelly should've had more screentime together and should've at least had more of a couple vibe to them all things consider as "break up buddies" which could've also linked to Marco and Tom talking. Marco could've felt like he betrayed Kelly as well as Tom and admits to Tom that it wasn't the photobooth guy that got them to kiss but rather he kissed Star out of his own volition because he was confused about his own feelings toward her after the season 2 finale where she admits to having a crush on him while Tom feels conflicted but puts his hand on his shoulder, takes a deep breath in(due to him working on his anger management problems) and says something like "Thanks for being honest with me man". Followed by Marco breaking Kelly's heart because of the Starco kiss leading to them inevitably either taking a break or fully breaking up. It would've been a whole lot better without the bloodmoon curse aspect as well. I feel like that was just put in to yet again pander to the popular ship(Granted I shipped it since the beginning but was still disappointed with how it turned out)

[@AH-is5yg]

season 4 was really bad. Star was a big idiot throughout the story. It had bad story telling. If Eclispa release globgor in episode 2 of season 4, things would be good and we get to know him better.

[@breeze5926]

Everything after meteora was turned back into a baby. That was honestly the end of me liking it.

[@chiyosan3520]

Ok the lore when to crap the momment they when to "relationship drama" instead of the lore :/

[@smg4reblooperd182]

I beg to differ you could actually use to further expand on the lore too

[@chiyosan3520]

@@smg4reblooperd182 ya but o just think they got more into that then actually *doing* the lore but your right, when it first start it was a really easy was to further the lore using emotions as there guide not there brain again i just think they went to deep lmao 😂

[@smg4reblooperd182]

@@chiyosan3520 I had a stroke reading that, can you please explain better?

[@chiyosan3520]

@@smg4reblooperd182 when they follow there emotions often times it was much easier getting to new lore (I'm basically saying I agree with you for the most part lmao sorry 😂)

[@chiyosan3520]

@@smg4reblooperd182 also I just reread it and it does sound like I'm having a stroke 👀

[@Marjorine1]

I used to love season 3 and 4 but rewatching it I like 1 and 2 a lot better

[@LexiChannel]

I was one of those fans who thought the show was cancelled after season 3, then I one day saw an ad for season 4 and was hyped. The moment I watched the first episode of season 4 I thought, “oh, they can’t all be this bad, right?” I’m just repeating others sentiments here, but season 4 is definitely the weakest. The only episode I personally liked the was Cornball because in a way it felt like organic development for Mewni rather than the PR Star has been pushing (yeah this was pr too but it didn’t go the way Star expected but there was still growth).

[@Noobmasterdp]

What's PR?

[@Office_chair]

Also in my own opinion I liked it better when moon and star were royals. I felt like it was more interesting when you got to see their relatives and the past Queens of Muni. Since eclipsa doesn't really care that much.

[@tjmcfadden5137]

A multitude of reasons but for me they are: 1. The magic high commission being made into secondary antagonists felt stupid for beings that represented fundamental aspects of the universe. They shouldn’t have been bad or good like Glossaryck they should have just been guided. 2. The monster racism plot was interesting but it droned on we should have seen Buff Frog as king unite the monsters and start a great kingdom that worked with the other kingdoms. 3. Eclipsa many things she and Star should have been actual enemies for a time and they should have stayed related. Instead of Eclipsa becoming Queen and Star being in an in between position the series still should have been Star slowly coming into her own as Queen and ending with her taking the throne. 4. Marco going back to Earth and planning on it was stupid. The episode where everyone told him to go to Mewni perfectly explained that through his adventures with Star Marco would find a normal life on Earth boring and empty and his literal dream job is being an adventurer through the dimensions. 5. Last getting rid of magic and blaming it for all problems was bad too. Personally that message came across more as time to grow up and come back to reality and that drained a lot of wonder out of the series for me. Also the death of Hekapoo and Glossaryck.

[@dianaal-maqtari7683]

I loved it at first, however after Toffee died it brought legitimate ache to my heart and I stopped watching it 😭😭 he was literally my first cartoon/movie crush, could you blame me?

[@orion4622]

cartoon and movie crushes are stupid, I can blame you.

[@dianaal-maqtari7683]

@@orion4622 Maybe you can blame 13 year old me for being sensitive 🤝

[@orion4622]

@@dianaal-maqtari7683 Not for being sensitive, just having a crush on a cartoon character

[@dianaal-maqtari7683]

@@orion4622 Well when you're isolated filled with toxicity from family and need a getaway, they become useful 🤷

[@smg4reblooperd182]

@@dianaal-maqtari7683 thank God the shows over at least the toxic side of community is dieing, for now, until they take over the next show

[@lychee349]

Well, they got rid of the person in charge of continuity.

[@mollymcmurtrie8037]

Well to be fair did eat and torture people before Epsica changed for better but he still needs to pay for all his crimes when he was a villain, so I liked crystalized him because he though he had his redemption, Globar still ate and torture people before he met Esplica. Don't have him eat and torture people, if you going to give him redemption because of Esipca. Just have him be in a neutral grey area on the wrong side.

[@theos943]

Honestly Eclipsa is still probably one of my fav Disney characters

[@IsiahTomas]

When it was at the top of the hill?

[@JaheemHoushakuji]

I always felt that Season 2 was the strongest because it was very character driven and Star was constantly going through bad emotions as the season went on with her feelings for Marco and the most underrated plotline with her losing the book and having to grow up plus paired with her inspection you saw how she was growing and the season ended perfectly

[@FinnyThePorg]

Sadly this cannot be blamed on the network. The Star team knew exactly how many episodes they would get

[@bodaciouschad]

Imagine if they kept Toffee instead of crazy-Ludo. Toffee was fascinating, captivating and effortlessly dangerous. Ludo becoming the rat king? Fine: that was actually awesome and I liked Ludo Alone as well, but thats as far as that idiot should have gone. Scrap the pidgeon kingdom and force Star to get the newly crowned Ratking Ludo to sign the monster-mewman petition. Ludo'd be down for it, as it'd legitamize his kingdom in the eyes of the Mewman alliance, but Star would be conflicted. Could SHE make peace with her enemies? All the while, Toffee musters his forces in the shadows, armed with a fragment of the wand.

[@oliolioliver]

I enjoyed every episode somehow or someway except the finale

[@comicbookreviewer4856]

seeing how people reacted to star vs the forces of evil going downhill is like my thought on ok ko Lets be heroes as season 2 try to poorly redeemed Foxtail despite she was willing to cross a line and not come back from it and the fact season 3 made Venomous and Laserblast one in the same and should of had Laserblast as a clone to get into Point and Venomous learning the clone father a son and felt the last episode cooped out badly

[@BroncoBohmer]

Quick answer right after battle for mewni

[@mesousagaby740]

In my eyes, it never got downhill, beacuse I'm not a miserable asshole that constantly gets obsessed how the show went down. There were some flaws, but what show doesn't have it, and I actaully love the show way more than I did back then, so...yeah, opinions vary, but ya'll take this WAY out of line. This is still my second favourite cartoon ever behind OK K.O, which is fitting as both shows ended on the same year and and even had big season finales air next to each other. They can brain rot me forever.

[@toadtv4389]

You're denying people right to critize

[@leviboypopop]

Nice! A recent video about the show!

[@cripwalker665]

Star went from "YAY, a episode with Star! What 𝙬𝙝𝙖𝙘𝙠𝙮 shenanigans will she get into this time!" to "GET OFF THE SCREEN"

[@Nerdface.]

W h a c k y

[@Nerdface.]

Get O F F the S C R E E N

[@フランクランドン]

Pretty much

[@dankbudew4830]

I find it sad this show is kind of forgotten. Amphibia and Owl House are so much more better than SVTFOE. If it was given more time, take away all that shipping nonense, and balance the comedy with its seriousness, it could’ve been great!!!!