LACS 5 - Cody Schwab, Zain, aMSa, Salt Vs Skyjay (Incineroar) Smash Ultimate - SSBU

The Ludwig Ahgren Championship Series 5 is a Smash Melee Tournament. This is a Super Smash Bros. Melee Tournament
It was streamed on: / @ludwig
You can check out the bracket here: www.start.gg/t...
#smashultimate #SuperSmashBros #Ultimate

[@verbage432]

Incineroar is the perfect melee player killer, his whole kit is filled with mechanics that weren't present in melee.

[@marcogonzalez9296]

It also a MU check in Ultimate.

[@6eyedbird]

Very much a scrub killer character, really good whiff punishes and Alolan whip obliterates if you don't know the spacing/timing

[@BBB-pe3ip]

Characters like Incineroar, Sonic, and Steve are the epitome of Smash Ultimate's metagame. Don't approach. Wait for your opponent to make the first move. Play passive and punish aggression. Good habits in Melee are punished in Ultimate, and vice-versa.

[@marcogonzalez9296]

@@BBB-pe3ip that’s literally every FGC . This could also be applied to some FPS.

[@BBB-pe3ip]

​@@marcogonzalez9296 Not really. Every game has different risk/reward systems for camping/aggression. Every fighting game leans towards offense or defense. At a superficial level, yes, everyone should punish mistakes, but you're missing the point. Playing passive or not approaching isn't "literally every FGC". A strong offense is the best defense in several fighting games.

[@DougDimmadome420]

Fun Fact: Prior to Smash Ultimate and Incineroar’s debut, Skyjay was a Zelda main!

[@RandomPotato106]

True, it was mentioned in a video that Larrylurr did talking to skyjay and such, i would recommend it to anyone to look it up

[@mudkipwithsunglasses7436]

That is so bizzare

[@MyChannel-pq6wf]

I’m a Zelda main but feel a lot of similarity with incineroar

[@Tlanesi]

I am form Skyjays region. He was a Zelda main at ultimates Start, he changed months into the game. He was a cloud main in Smash 4, but started right as ultimates got announced.

[@whosVariations]

🤓🤓

[@Fish_-]

"We are the nfl kickers of the fighting game community bro" 8:57. Never heard a more accurate description of the very specified set of skills needed for melee also the "No one can do what we do but we can't do anyone else's job either" lmao

[@EmissaryOfSmeagol]

I love how Zain immediately tries to wavedash off the platform but it just doesn't work

[@Oh-Ben]

It's interesting to see his neutral movement outside of Melee.

[@jasonelpelotudo]

when did Zain try it? I don't know how an attempt of wavedashing would even look like🤧

[@EmissaryOfSmeagol]

@@jasonelpelotudo it's immediately after he becomes actionable off the 3-2-1-GO! 6:01 Visually it looks like a little hop up, but he comes back down really fast. That's essentially what wavedashing in Ultimate looks like, you go much further from the ground than in Melee.

[@cowblast_]

LMAOO THE MELEE CHANT AFTER SALT TOOK ONE

[@Abbaschand]

6:00 A perfect showing of a man trying to play Melee in Ultimate.

[@tamcawam22]

skyjay was perfect for this. I wish they’d had this go longer, like a couple more people!

[@darthrambo1454]

6 melee players vs 6 skyjay stocks 😅

[@tobikurashiki5800]

Skyjay with the JV6. Good shit.

[@kciref6016]

I love the name they gave it, “Skyjay Ultimate Gauntlet”

[@shinyguiltforest3281]

Love seeing Ultimate players and Melee players intermingle and try to understand each other’s wack-ass games

[@mr.crumblycookie5203]

"Zain would lose to a guy holding a red cup" 💀

[@LS-td4yf]

Imagine them vs riddles, that would be an absolute slaughter

[@Weevys]

thats illigal a

[@oscar5012]

they would legit not even get to play the game

[@psyduck8025]

I need to see this now

[@juanguillen9946]

Against riddles would be 0% funny, that's why they chose skijay

[@aJazzcat]

it would've been a 4 minute cut scene combo

[@rmcooktails]

I love stuff like this shows you just how different the games are from each other.

[@uryanflores4378]

Escucharlos celebrar esa ultima Stock me hizo reir muchísimo xd me encanta cuando la comunidad sabe no tomarse enserio

[@drewf8619]

I never thought I could beat Melee pros at ultimate... Until now.

[@Saltyoven]

Don't do this. Don't rush incineroar without a plan, it's what he wants. Outside of Kazuya probably, incineroar punishes mistakes harder than anyone.

[@UltLuigi1]

also don't double jump from ledge, Incineroar is the one character who punishes that melee habit harder than any other character

[@greedo194]

Luigi

[@Krowhanig]

Bro these guys don’t play ultimate give them a break

[@atari_hmb]

@@Krowhanig Funny cuz in melee they'd probably JV 5 stock even high level players in melee, imagine if they fought an ultimate player lol

[@justiceony]

@@atari_hmb kola (ultimate player) literally took a game off AMSA in bracket 💀

[@kenra3600]

Melee players have nice taste in ultimate cast

[@dewdesi]

Cast was perfect

[@J01789]

Unoriginal, you mean.

[@illford]

​@@dewdesiRoy was fine but Cody would play Aegis he's just that kind of guy

[@toastgod1276]

Skyjay and Salt’s reactions when she finally took his first stock were priceless

[@Bixnoodle]

Pretty sure that was a dude

[@toastgod1276]

@@Bixnoodle Pretty sure they use she/her pronouns in the video so that is what I am using

[@stuffedlegoguy461]

​@toastgod1276 still a dude

[@joziexd113]

Got so confused why you said she when it’s a guy

[@toastgod1276]

@@joziexd113 What’s the problem with trans players? Fellow players don’t have a problem with it, the commentators don’t have a problem with it, most fans don’t have a problem with it. It’s only people who go out of their way to disrespect trans players who are making it weird.

[@da_tall_one9460]

I like how the transitions between games are longer then the games themselves lol

[@jwizzle448]

Yo aMsa was actually doing some Ult tech, the roy wasnt bad!!

[@TheLronGiant]

Editors Note: The Roy was BAD

[@zixelix]

I was predicting amsa was gonna be the one to take the first stock! I believe I remember him being a tester for ultimate before it came out, so I assumed he had the most familiarity.

[@Chario_]

Probably helped by the fact that Amsa aMSa actually worked on Ultimate as a playtester

[@christophers5327]

Lmaooo that pop off at the end 100% is me and the boys playing local on a Friday night

[@elijah2118]

This subplot in Smash was very interesting..

[@OseiTheWarriors]

8:49 he's right tho, all that Melee skill stays in Melee. Really surprising how free this was

[@qwinn111]

Same for ultimate, but with a much low skill ceiling. Melee at least guarantees tech skill in any game lol

[@OseiTheWarriors]

@@qwinn111 I mean I've seen more 4 and Ultimate pros able to pivot to other traditional fighting games. Not sure what games benefit from Melee tech skill.

[@amazinghedgehog1247]

If this were Project M, it'd probably be a different story.

[@cxgx9054]

Are you stupid? Ultimate is a very different game than Melee, if it had been in Melee or Project M your dad Skyjay wouldn't last a minute

[@qwinn111]

@@OseiTheWarriors Melee players just love melee too much but if you need an example, Leffen is all we have who did good in ultimate early on and DBFZ but all you guys have is Riddles [who plays technical 2d characters in ultimate, which helps my point a little with tech skill]. And the general difficulty of tech skill is enough, kinda like "if I do double laser, triple shine and perfect wave 24/7 then playing more difficult games that have just as difficult a tech wouldn't be so foreign to adapt too" kinda thing.

[@cowblast_]

Them saying Chrom and Byleth are the best fire emblem characters hurt me

[@tobikurashiki5800]

Roy crying in a corner.

[@fupalover]

Roy isnt the best.

[@uryanflores4378]

MkByleth makes a Lot of damage in the top player perspective

[@SexyFace]

there's a mod called pm remix that has lyn on the roster & she is so good as a sword character

[@2000Doriyas]

@@fupalover Roy is probably the best in Ult, you could make an argument for lucina mayyyybe

[@DarkAura19]

Didnt Amsa actually do testing for Ultimate before it came out?

[@Ksok]

Yes he was part of the making of this game

[@gracefuldrowning138]

That's why he picked Roy cuz he told them devs to make him cracked

[@gracefuldrowning138]

@@Jack-fw7wd Roy is in fact cracked. As for my sources proving that amsa influenced the devs to make him broken: I made it up

[@DarkAura19]

@gracefuldrowning138 I belive it. Roy's fire is red, Amsa plays red Yoshi, it all comes together.

[@gracefuldrowning138]

@@DarkAura19 are you a Lucario main?

[@pablovonpablo2590]

"This is the ringer.... And the ringer's getting rung" 😂

[@treesaregreen]

I guess Leffen, Hbox, Plup, Wizzrobe, Mango would be the best line-up of top melee players good at Ultimate?

[@peterparker9042]

Hbox and Mang0 arent actually good so just Leffen, Plup, and Wizzy

[@Balloushop13]

Skyjay out here making Incineroar look like a Demon

[@shaseim4st3r]

I love that the pros and commentators experience the same thing with friends lol. I always preface that it's ultimate not melee, so I won't be as good. I still wipe the floor with them though but it's a struggle to mentally not L cancel or wavedash

[@bibbyboxx2219]

I don’t play a whole lot of Ultimate but it feels extra weird after playing lots of PM and trying to L cancel everything

[@CLERICssb]

Zain playing melee Lucina in Ultimate looked so weird

[@Oh-Ben]

He was the only one that didn't blindly run in. It's what he does in Melee but it looked janky because he's not used to Ultimate.

[@zosky256]

Skyjay: todos ustedes contra mi solo🗿

[@KevinCockerline]

This was great. I think we need riddles, kola, sparg0 and void vs a melee player next (maybe drop void, might be too good at melee idk)

[@Bamoftheppl]

Kola and Riddles are arguably better than VoiD at melee, Im almost certain they do better.

[@redwarrior118]

@@Bamoftheppl No way Riddles' falcon is better than Void's marth

[@treycuret]

The comparison doesn't make sense because those people actually have touched Melee before. Zain and Cody are confused and doing things anyone who's played a day of Ultimate understands.

[@jordanriley1436]

⁠​⁠@@treycuretI mean Cody and Zain have played quite a bit on release, I’m pretty sure the confusion came from fighting incineroar more than the game itself.

[@itzmasterz]

@@treycuretea! Let’s have a bunch of ultimate players that have never played melee fight zain or cody! (Probably cody, because fox is nuts) Watching ult players try to get used to no buffer would be funny. New People often describe melee movement as blocky and stiff when they first start out.

[@mackenzieb6397]

It was cool to hear Howard Stern on the mic

[@ChinaChamp]

Holy shit Skyjay’s Incineroar is actually Zangief. I’ve honestly never seen an Ultimate matchup that looked so much like a traditional fighting game, where you have to REALLY respect their options otherwise you’re just fucked. His Revenge reads are crazy too and make it so scary to try to hit him. Dude is a beast.

[@KeShaunB3]

I think it’s mostly because the other mainly players didn’t know what buttons they could burst option against Incineroar with..

[@ckkrzuwwhotchi1465]

And get 4 stock'd by cody's fox in melee.

[@psyduck8025]

"ultimate traaaaash. Skyjay traaaaash" 😂

[@pbz7572]

Would’ve loved to see the Melee players react to fighting a FP2 character like Sephiroth Steve or Kazuya

[@seansolo3583]

@@PurposeDriven7_he deserved to be way more broken

[@KrazyKyle-ij9vb]

​@@seansolo3583I'd prefer it if everyone else was a bit less broken but I guess I can agree with that too

[@Warrenoh]

@@seansolo3583he is it’s just people haven’t figured him out yet

[@Oh-Ben]

They fight Fox on a weekly basis.

[@jaredkino9258]

Tuned in for Skeyjay vs melee. got a 20min melee player roast and not complaining.

[@N810garcia]

This was very entertaining. Loved the ending commentary

[@Paper_planeguy]

Also good job skyjay for beating mkleo and coming 2 your best player

[@LoadedKlip]

They played again? Where?

[@Paper_planeguy]

@@LoadedKlip I think between semi or loser

[@uryanflores4378]

​@@LoadedKlipthey played in a online tournament 2 weeks ago, Skyjay make a epic shieldbreak!

[@samsee_ca]

kinda surprised that Hbox wasn’t here to try to carry everybody lmao

[@tatekaste7238]

The first match was a minute and 8 seconds, second match was 2 minute and 13 secs, third match was 2 minutes 2 secs, the last match was 1 minute 53 secs. They lasted in total 7 minutes 26 seconds and tbh thats probably longer than i would against skyjay but the commentaters wanted a percent total and it was Cody:46%, Zain:162%, AMSA: 141%, Salt:160% after the hit. Total: 509%.

[@Ridley96]

Commentary was hilarious

[@atari_hmb]

All they need is La Luna, Leffen, Mango, and Wizzy and they'd have all taken a stock or 2. But Skyjay is goated. Also notice Zain's patients and movement is sick lowkey

[@EmissaryOfSmeagol]

He's playing Lucina like a cautious Melee Marth I think. It's nice to see players go outside of their comfort zone.

[@atari_hmb]

@@EmissaryOfSmeagol Agreed. If it was Marth he'd have done better due to spacing and hit stun lol. just cuz Marth can get that oops tipper you die at 40 lol

[@neroultimate1]

3:02 I thought it was a button check lmao

[@Diamondsucks.]

16:02 lmaoo that was actually a stock

[@kirazhenstelar6199]

yea down air up smash wouldve taken it

[@hafwit3088]

Really funny that nobody mentioned Amsa *worked* on the game lol

[@cxgx9054]

It is curious that many praise Skyjay for beating Melee players in the Ultimate should now face them but in Melee

[@PoloOrozco]

Mi compa metiéndole los dedos a unos güeros jajaja muy bien ahí

[@stenettedavis68]

This was fun to watch and listen

[@Sponsie1000]

l know it would be a hassle to do, but one time you guys should really do something like this where the pro stays at the percentage they're at when a game ends. That way they're way more susceptible to losing stocks, and the whole match wouldve been closer and more hectic since the pro would be at kill percentage for way longer.

[@patoa3481]

They deadass had to throw in Skyjay man. You don't get to do shit against him unless you're experienced. Even top Ultimate get bodied by him at times

[@Paper_planeguy]

Incineroar go brrrrrrrrrr

[@3thhackz531]

this is sucha cool idea idk how i havent seen this.

[@canmx121]

Why are they playing under player 1 tag that would have tap jump on? Do they not have coustom controls like skyjay?

[@TehWhiteTiger]

Using Skyjay for this was just cruel .

[@l0af_o]

this was like atomic bomb vs toddler Incineroar lives for so long

[@Testify087]

I’m surprised he didn’t punish them for regrabbing the ledge so much lmao

[@feresoththedamned2688]

Hey, where is the interview??

[@aidenzorn8322]

We love Skyjay

[@3thhackz531]

god i want another event like this lmaooo so funny and sweet weirdly

[@Yokai_Yuri]

At least the Melee gods are playing ultimate vs a really good player. That's pretty nice. They should do it backwards as well.

[@Slug_ssbm]

I feel like if it was any other top player except maybe Riddles’s Kazuya they would have taken like 5-6 more stocks.

[@diddykong2143]

Crazy battle. This was pretty entertaining

[@asdfasdfadsfasdf]

Melee would've done much better with Leffen, Plup, Wizzrobe (if they still cared about Ultimate lol)

[@Tetrafirez]

Or Hbox, who took Skyjay to last stock multiple times at the last ultimate summit. Him and Leffen would have made this more competitive for sure

[@neverknowsbest.]

*STILL WONDERING WHY THEY DIDN'T SEND LEFFEN IN HE WAS THE ONLY ONE THAT STOOD A CHANCE WITH HIS PT 😢😢*

[@yui_yuiritu]

所々DXっぽさが出てて良いね

[@Molten-Throne]

Genuinely great. Lisa loved this meme

[@dee6561]

Ludwig calling out WillNeff lmao

[@MrDmoe33]

Now do this for the entire melee player base vs mkleo

[@ramonvasquez3503]

Her?

[@shanecarvin1035]

Who are the commentators here?

[@uryanflores4378]

Melee commentators xd

[@clonetrooper_1214]

I know one of them is Ludwig

[@gavinwarren9705]

Ludwig, Phil, Studenbacher, and Toph. Phil’s the guy that says melee players are the worst fighting game players, Studenbacher has the deep voice, and then there’s Toph. (Toph and Phil are two of the scenes most legendary commentators)

[@TinyTim_TV]

aMSa didnt play red yoshi???

[@raven-a]

"Just double fair" Melee players 😂🎉

[@tonyhui4149]

Go Skyjay!

[@varioush]

They should try this again with another Ultimate pro but make them play random. Would be interesting

[@janswhatsupdoc]

A certain dude named after witch trials once said “melee players are only good at Melee”

[@Frank-bn9us]

lol

[@gj4312]

Skyjay was just cooking with salt

[@freejenny4061]

Ludwig?

[@drewtweedie7408]

Really cool Incineroar play but the schadenfreude of some of some of the Ultimate fans is palpable.

[@ryanrotert3453]

Zain tried using lucina as if she was melee marth 😂😂😂

[@_Domo_]

LET'S GO SALT!!!!!!!!!!!

[@kaleljoseph9729]

Where is it?, pro players? I can't nobody

[@p.m.7060]

ZainがSPやってるのすげえ

[@lostspider343]

melee 🤝 ultimate

[@azelnir135]

We wanna see SkyJay Vs Leffen

[@RicardoChoppah]

Ustedes contra mí solo

[@plastickkerorolm4889]

Get my man wizzy, m2k, mang0,hbox, and plup in there. They'd do better 😂

[@Gran_Ove]

If you give Skyjay 6 Stocks, even with those rivals he would win. Your chance is for Skijay to have only 3.

[@sharifbrown3567]

​@@Gran_OveHBOX literally plays Ultimate. He'd probably get 2 by himself

[@Gran_Ove]

@@sharifbrown3567 Yes, I am aware of that, in fact that was my very thought, that Hbox is the only one that could perhaps take 2 Stocks, the others perhaps 1 or none, hence my comment on the 3 lives.

[@danielsmith5032]

m2k used to play Ultimate as well. He could get 2 stocks

[@Gran_Ove]

@@danielsmith5032 I honestly don't think anyone else other than Hbox has a chance to take 2 Stocks from him. I know m2k plays ultimate regularly, but that doesn't put it on the same level as Hbox, let alone Skyjay.

[@oogamania4261]

11:15 yo, is Zain 37 for real? Daigo of melee tho?

[@peterparker9042]

No he's like 27

[@zapkido2830]

LMFAO sal tryna crouch cancel

[@2000Doriyas]

Amsa didn't pick YOSHI????

[@aoeu256]

Yoshi lacks combos ability that melee Yoshis are used to, though he gains ground and air speed. I don't think Yoshi could have traded with his armor vs Incineroar... but he could have at least gotten a stock or two.

[@2000Doriyas]

@@aoeu256 His yoshi fundies would've done better than that Roy I would think, but he definitely picked a smart pocket character

[@GuiltyDoc]

Incineroar fighting the pokemon battle 😭

[@sharsasuke01]

If Leffen, Hbox and Mango were in the lineup they would have probably won.

[@treycuret]

Like, literally anyone who has experience with the game? Cody is avoiding Skyjay grabbing ledge 😂

[@ojutay8375]

They picked the one character that stuffs a newbie

[@sentoworf]

Min Min, Kazuya, Steve and possibly Snake would have been just as bad if not worse.

[@ScylesTheDespaired]

Then they just happen to choose nothing but characters that Incineroar can thrive against. I've never seen a Joker not spam dash attack, counter or his projectile lol

[@SyncedIceClimbersSSBU]

Can we do this with an ice climbers like prince demo and see melee players just get clipped

[@SyncedIceClimbersSSBU]

After watching the video I think I could have beat them with three stocks

[@JSins_]

Next: Mang0 vs Ultimate Pros

[@atari_hmb]

They're not even landing a hit if he's try hard mango.

[@BagelEnjoyer]

Nah nah, ScorpionMaster vs Ultimate pros

[@JSins_]

@@BagelEnjoyer even better

[@rubberwoody]

wow a JV12

[@julianlastname5730]

It would’ve been funny if they just kept throwing melee players at him until he ran out of stocks, 13 v 1

[@kiptelgat]

I thought zain would play roy

[@danielcastano9124]

🔥🔥🔥