Marth Roundtable with Ken, Mew2King, Rishi, Zain, and PPMD!

[@_Majunior]

This lineup is so sick and has so much for every generation of melee player. Would've loved to see ppu though

[@Killopotamus]

PPU was more inspired than watching M2K and the rarely attending PP from 2013-15. I still play blue for da PPU

[@Space_Lion]

@@perryperry989 damn this is a sick idea

[@FrightNFight]

I miss PPU man he's so sick

[@harpot678]

Yeah, but it's already a little bit congested, and PPU would add to that

[@berekexer8158]

@@harpot678 He's talking about for people who make content, not just marths. You already know

[@factor_hm]

The joy on ppmd's face when ken mentioned how much he enjoyed pp's marth was the best part of this ep

[@ark8021]

PP's reaction is so wholesome, it almost got a tear from my eyes :') Ken's right tho, I wanna see PPMD play again so bad

[@robertwhite9621]

Do you have a timestamp friend?

[@ark8021]

@@robertwhite9621 from 45:06 for like 30s

[@factor_hm]

@@robertwhite9621 45:10 ish

[@Eval999]

Ken is the dude for still caring about melee

[@rat4992]

Respect to Ken as always. I feel like whether or not someone actually watches the video, you gotta give love to Ken 🤣. He’s one of the reasons why we’re all here today and that’s not a joke.

[@MrGameonthis]

He's like master Roshi talking with all the Z fighters who have now surpassed him. Legend.

[@gwen6622]

eh

[@maelstrom218]

Interesting that the Marth roundtable upped the number of players by quite a bit compared to the Falcon roundtable. I can't wait for the inevitable Fox roundtable when they bring on 50 guests.

[@EzequielMPinedo]

there is only one more person than the falcon roundtable :P

[@johnshutler2135]

Only 2 of the players on here though are active... I WANT MORE MARTH PLAY

[@mire_cs]

TIL one more person is "quite a bit"

[@yobobby9]

Just needs PPU

[@nl6526]

Fox roundtable is gonna be insufferable

[@SoLinkSmash]

23:59 “There’s one ruleset where stalling is pretty much solved, and that’s Rishi’s Jungle Jam” LOLLL

[@DrewOPowell]

PPMD’s face after that too lol

[@rat4992]

lmao

[@ThePharphis]

comedic genius

[@PJBxx]

I don't see what's so funny about this.

[@Sumii_re]

Nightmare blunt rotation

[@Windraesa]

this made me laugh so much. Please, please elaborate so i can laugh some more

[@CatFighterForce9]

hahaga

[@ln8496]

@@Windraesa whats there to elaborate on? Ken and M2k are next to eachother. Awkkk

[@sogga_fan]

hahahhahahhahahhahahahahhaha

[@Cashmoneez]

I honestly love ken bro he’s got like an old school traditional fgc swagger to him

[@fritothedemon6647]

Man says fuck your percents I do that on instinct

[@sageosaka]

The Melee community definitely felt a lot more like the traditional fgc scene back in that day. Not that I don't love what it's turned into today but it was definitely cool back then

[@Silent_Tentacle]

as in like obviously casual but looking too hard to relive the glory days

[@rohannambiar6564]

@@Silent_Tentacle cringe

[@mypsizllez]

He's Melee's Justin Wong. And that's a great thing

[@aiden9472]

Zain needs to give himself more credit.. Sure, the pivot tipper punishes are old school, but all the soft bair, fair and uair links are all him. The UpB edgeguard bullshit, and all the edge cancel shenanigans? Like c'mon dude.. No one ever did any of that. You've brought the character firmly to #1 in several people's minds.

[@youtubeobserver]

I’m one of them tbh. Idk when top players will come around to echoing the sentiment but marth is the best character in the game. When Zain is playing clean no one can even touch him. No matter who beats him it always feels like an upset, marth always feels like he should have won. Only exception is Axe but that matchup has a lot of development left to find and Zain is already looking for it.

[@mav9987]

in fairness i would never act anywhere near appreciative of my own skill around this line up, even if i was #1. just the nature of it all makes you humble

[@incarnate1]

I agree, he's such a humble dude. It felt like Marth was falling off as a character until he came around and incorporated a lot of the tech the former Marths had not.

[@justsomeguy7042]

Zain literally took everything that made Ken, m2k and PP so good, put all those things together and did them all way better than any of them ever did

[@aiden9472]

@@justsomeguy7042 My point is exactly that he didn't to just take their ideas. Show me one marth before Zain who's comboing Captain Falcon to 150 plus with soft up airs on final destination. And that's just one thing he invented.

[@mav9987]

THIS is a stacked cast. very excited to watch this after work

[@Kylerulez666]

Same... Probably gonna watch after class

[@iMacxXuserXx485]

Same here!

[@jpoggi9081]

Seeing Ken sets the bar high I need OG players at every round table now! Fox will have 25 people

[@PK_Smokey]

I think the Roundtable is the best thing to come out of GG Melee so far. With the current format, it's a valuable perspective into Melee's history throughout the years, while also having a perspective of where Melee is right now.

[@jimsface]

Ken and M2K’s dynamic is hilarious to me

[@laskeese7930]

It's actually insane how much of m2k's melee discourse revolves around controllers

[@arJunebugSmash]

Really excited to see Rishi, but who are those other guys?

[@vvlaze]

Not too sure, think they’ve had some decent results before so I don’t mind them being here.

[@xertifiedthicc]

bro fr like who THE FUCK is zain??!?!?!?

[@ammmmm6556]

@@xertifiedthicc some guy I think he won a few tournament’s or something

[@jonathansaraco]

Lol they did M2K dirty with the tournament performances they listed, where's Summit 6? Other that than, GG Melee are legends for assembling this awesome Marth roundtable. Almost an hour of these players talking is a gift to the community.

[@arbustoardiente]

Mango won Wtfox 2016

[@favourites4]

@@arbustoardiente noticed that too

[@carsondubs]

I like how it implies that he hasn't won 3 majors

[@Gabriel-sd1oh]

also did zain dirty for not putting his wins

[@christomanci]

Yeah also i was annoyed they didnt let pp tell his marth origin story.

[@SkiteRight]

I've always thought Ken's Marth would look a lot like Zain's contemporary Marth if he had never stopped playing. Charming to see the 2 red swordsmen pay respect to each other. Old and New school kings

[@algar6616]

Agreed all around

[@itsbmeGaming]

I once saw someone comment on Ken playing on unranked and how even with not playing much he seemed much more innovative in his play. If Ken's hands stopped bothering him and he could practice again and develop his Marth more he'd probably resemble Zain. Ken came back towards the end of 2013 and by 2015 he was already shield dropping and power shielding lasers easily. He definitely has the capacity to learn new tech and apply it intelligently. A random thing was in one of Ken's last tournaments before he retired the first time, Super Champ Combo, someone commented he started resembling M2K's Marth because he was wavedashing a lot more and seemed more juggle heavy. I think if Ken was able to train with Zain he'd probably be more like that. I would love a world where Zain and Ken are pushing Marth together. To be honest it makes me feel sad they aren't.

[@shanepage8041]

That was sick when ken complimented PP's marth ❤

[@Tonedawg181]

Ken and M2k are litteraly my two favorite players and the reason i picked up marth around 2007. Was very happy to come home from work and see this video on my feed.

[@willlauzon3744]

Honestly Armada and Hungrybix are my two favourites. Hungry box for his insanity and Armada for his peach. Just switched to peach (Daisy outfit melee) from Link (white tunic). My main obstacles are ganondorf and Roy played by my brother. Ganondorf with the up grab and Roy with just canceling my float game. Any suggestions specifically for Roy/Marth?

[@jayadehart1680]

Love to see Ken encouraging PP to play agai

[@Bedrick]

Love how ken is still involved with melee one way or another. What a legend

[@PalPlays]

45:00 Whoa! Ken saying what we're all thinking! We're rooting for you Kevin!

[@davidvkimball]

A gathering of greats.

[@colinmurphy2214]

M2k & Zain’s tourney results were odd choices. No summit for M2k, no genesis or shine for Zain. Loved the video, just a tidbit. Great that you got Ken in

[@SeriousYi]

wish this was longer this is the kind of content melee needs

[@rocket117]

I agree !!!!

[@ThisIsWEB]

It's amazing watching all these generations of Marths on a call together! It's too bad they didn't make room for the one true Marth superhero: Blur.

[@itsbmeGaming]

Yayuhz

[@conanbdetective]

🤣

[@PurplingYellow]

Love how it looks like m2k is talking to Ken the whole time

[@aspiknf]

Oldschool legend talking to another oldschool legend XD

[@CursedOutRS]

Any one of these people could have been a full on great guest for radio melee. This is sick.

[@CheeTheOG]

Dude idk if anybody else wants this but I seriously want a ken as a commentator

[@algar6616]

Ditto

[@ammmmm6556]

Very cool idea

[@KaptajnKlutch]

These roundtables are SO SICK! And this one of course is just crazy stacked. Top tier content

[@muqmanor]

Seeing PPMD be so flattered and appreciative by Ken saying he loves watching him play was adorable. I love that for him

[@kennythekid130]

love seeing Inngenn get some props, getting that good in only a year is crazy

[@john34557]

Thanks GG melee for putting this together, M2k and Kens insight are so interesting to hear

[@shady8045]

I love how Leffen just blatantly caught a stray lmao.

[@JoeSmith-manlyhall]

Phenomenal video, shout out to Ken. Absolute legend that we need more of, his survivor season is worth a watch if you haven't checked it out

[@ssbmgameri5iti]

Would love a puff one with Hbox, 2saint, Solobattle, etc.

[@ssbmgameri5iti]

Maybe even try and get like KillaOR?

[@Moon-uq6ob]

It would just be The King, Mang0, and Hbox

[@Themonkeymartin]

Def gotta get mang0

[@AbatedToast77]

Lmfao

[@dbzsongoku1]

Mang0 too he's like the OG Puff

[@ThePortjumper]

This was such an awesome roundtable, one for the history books. Please do more characters!

[@matrixyst]

i thought there was no way this series could get more sick than the falcon roundtable, glad to be proven wrong! this is so absurdly cool edit: i asked m2k if he played one or two games with ken and he insists it was just one, seems like we'll never know for sure...

[@MitchBison]

Great video and I love to hear from Ken and Mew2King about oldschool Melee. But I have to make a correction. M2K got 3rd at WTFox 2016 (aka WTFox 2). Also bizarre to list FPS 2015 and Endgame 2016 as his highlighted tournaments when Summit 6, Shine 2016, and Super Champ combo are probably his most impressive tournaments (if we are just talking Melee). Maybe even UGC Smash Open, despite getting 2nd to Armada.

[@sl0pe363]

God what I wouldn’t give for a peach round-table with Adam, llod, polish, trif and kzhu

[@sageosaka]

I would fangirl out so much to have ken get back involved in the scene more again.

[@ConradSly]

cool to hear about m2k's ume f-smash (like daigo's ume-shoryuken). Not random, but to a spectator looks totally random.

[@nkbjpn222]

I really like this video. Insane line up, good production. I also like the structure, everyone seems to have time to say something and its fair. It feels natural.

[@M00P35]

Anyone else geek tf out over this? Gonna need a roundtable for the entire cast tbh

[@itsbmeGaming]

This is hype. Love seeing OGs like Ken on this content. Brings back the old days. B)

[@chalino1010]

This is incredible! I can’t wait to watch

[@hadesthegod9181]

Ken is the most legendary dude ever. There’s such a stark divide between his era and what followed, it’s like he’s from a different history altogether.

[@okamidun]

Legendary line up

[@alexwright7501]

This is one of the best pieces of melee content ever! Thank you for making this happen

[@HieronymousLex]

I love Ken man, I just rewatched Survivor Gabon and he was an absolute savage on there, just like he is in melee.

[@user-uo9yb2qx8z]

There's a Ken interview way back maybe 10 yrs ago he said red marth will make a comeback he just needs the right person behind him.

[@Bachilles38]

"I still don't know he percents" - ken, 21:58 goated mentality

[@user-uo9yb2qx8z]

47:15 falcon marth is so devastating and we really have Ken and Isai to thank for giving it to us so fast and early on.

[@zumie3285]

Holy fuck I didn’t expect Ken. Also great video, loved it.

[@LiLBird727]

I love how Ken just talks over m2k bc he wants to tell his story

[@Killopotamus]

He’s got the tenure 🤣

[@rasha1a]

I love how Ken didn't stop talking because m2k interrupted

[@rubix0110]

Just a quick note: When you play the gameplay clips, the audio from the clip is a bit distracting from what the guests are saying. Maybe just mute the gameplay clips going forward.

[@zzFuzzy]

These are great. And shoutouts to Toph for being an awesome host!

[@mrgameandmusic]

I love that Ken is so old school his mic sounds like it's from more than 10 years ago lmaooooo Love that dude tho, glad to see him talking on a larger channel like this

[@gyro4433]

This was the best video ive seen all week, thank you

[@Fikakillarna]

I love seeing Ken back again!

[@PalPlays]

9:42 I actually agree with Ken here. Zain feels like a 2022 Ken. All of M2K's kills are either optimized gimps or throw flowcharts. PPMD is its own thing, with more movement than any other. I feel like PewPewU should be up here. Wasn't he the first Marth to implement pivot f-smash on Puff?

[@stayontrack]

m2k also out of nowhere will go for a lolm2k side B meteor kill offstage down in the magnifying glass on his last stock in tournament so def not all optimized flowcharts

[@PalPlays]

@@stayontrack All Marths reserve the right to style.

[@stayontrack]

@@PalPlays What I'm saying is that not all of his kills are what you described. M2k also has insane neutral reads with fsmash to kill and he does plenty of other stuff.

[@PalPlays]

@@stayontrack You're right.

[@chrisdrums1910]

@@stayontrack this made me burst out laughing

[@eddiestilll]

YOOOOOOOOOO i can't believe you guys got ken too!!! :D he pioneered so much to not only the early marth meta but the early competitive melee meta!!

[@aspiknf]

YEAHHHHH He is awesome!!!

[@ChrisVickeryinajar]

"final destination or japan" i actually laughed out loud at that one hahahaha 35:02

[@emmbeesea]

This was one of the closest opportunities to a Ken/Azen reunion, but I'm sure Azen is difficult to book. Regardless, this line up is stellar. Wish you could've also gotten Azen, PewPewU, and KodoriN to round out every era of #1 and #2 Marth, but I digress.

[@codetaku]

Was PPU ever the #1 marth? It feels like this was a roundtable of "every #1 Marth... plus Rishi", and #2s aren't really factored in. I feel like PPU never actually surpassed M2K except when M2K unofficially retired by which point Zain was already ahead.

[@plonzz]

@@codetaku i think he's calling ppu #2 marth during a certain era

[@DatGuyWithNoName]

Ken feels like the father of Melee.

[@mcfam8657]

Toph sorta playing role of host to a swarm of Marths is funny but this is a super cool idea. Having a panel to discuss character's progression and optimization

[@souppdog1916]

Back when they dropped the falcon roundtable i was a falcon main. Now I'm a marth main and this one drops. GG REALLY knows their audience

[@FearTheImpaler]

so cool to see all the legends in a single call. zain asking ken questions is so cool.

[@changyanwang1625]

Holy crap the members of the panel are GOATed

[@Materialist39]

This was an amazing discussion, everyone was able to get their viewpoints out there well and it definitely changed some of my misconceptions.

[@catandfishfc]

Yoshi Roundtable: Amsa just talks by himself lmao

[@garfthebased1882]

thanks for getting this together great video

[@TheSpaceOpera]

So cool. Would LOVE to hear these guys talk more.

[@tm_14_44]

A Luigi roundtable would be sick

[@john34557]

Insane you got Ken!!

[@TDot_SSB]

The M2K metafy plug at the end was my favorite part.

[@m00rons]

Ken and m2k in the same video is a dream come true

[@michaelmurray9730]

I love the metafy plug at the end by m2k, it's almost a meme at this point lol

[@BornNguyener]

The Mount Rushmore of Marth players + Rishi and Toph 🤣

[@ryan_rapido410]

I wonder if they tried to get Azen too. it wouldn’t surprise me if they tried, but he didn’t want to

[@SmiteKhepri]

No PPU though sadge

[@Killopotamus]

Marth Rushmore

[@Buzzerman2120]

Put some respect on Rishi without him Zain doesn't exist.

[@rocket117]

@@Buzzerman2120 word this is the real take away

[@shadowbean590]

M2K never loses the opportunity to advertise his stuff

[@hiddenimg]

This is awesome to see all the different generations of the top marths.

[@paulfong90]

Toph when discussing pp neutral - 'I played pp back in XXXX and he 4 stocked me every time. Boy we played a lot of neutral!'

[@rsdudetsom]

i am actually blown away by the amount of inspiring melee players in one call together, i mean seeing ken in the melee scene is always crazy

[@nateinman1]

Would love an ICs round table with Chu, Wobbles, Nicki, Bananas, and Slug

[@conanbdetective]

Fly and Army would be sick

[@shady8045]

that's actually a good idea

[@jungshin87]

this is godlike. melee has teh best personalities and these are some of the best of the best

[@ffbear8078]

I reckon a Fox roundtable will never get made cause they can't settle on who to invite lol

[@harpot678]

Take 1 fox from every year of Melee, the roundtable will have 20 people

[@valakemedia]

if they invite hax money the simulation will crack

[@dexenationgracey1979]

The only absolutes are probably Mang0, Leffen, PC Chris, and Chillindude (he's the OG Fox.)

[@shady8045]

@@dexenationgracey1979 Why not Cody?

[@clap5108]

We should definitely give more respect to Ken. He was one of the building blocks of the entire community and the first God of the game. Melee players love to shit on past pros. They would probably shit on you in half the inputs.

[@tropik5724]

True

[@itsbmeGaming]

It’s crazy how in a short amount of time he figured out how to dominate and stay on top inventing Marth pretty much on his own. Definitely deserves respect. Ken hardly plays, but when he does play unranked he actually does really well, especially after the first game. I think it’s his experience but also he seems to have a game sense, like he can feel what is going on. What he does is pretty ambiguous and I think more modern players have trouble with it. Also Ken seems pretty much immune to being tilted on unranked so I feel like even someone better than Ken on paper are more prone to be frustrated with how he plays and start falling apart.

[@doggiegroundhog9223]

Damn that ken to ppmd respect at the end.

[@Aydreyan]

Just found out about this. I know how hard it is to get this many people on the same time but love to see more

[@isambo400]

I love how M2K never stops talking

[@MitchBison]

Funny that Hbox started camping again right after they recorded this roundtable lol. And Rishi is right about the longstanding rule against "stalling" not being well defined. The definition of stalling has not been well defined, with obvious exceptions like freeze glitch and wobbling. But even Puff’s pound stalling is not well defined. And I have never once seen a TO step in to punish a player for “stalling” in a tournament (once again with the exception of freeze glitch and wobbling past 300% because those are clear cut, although I have actually seen ICs wobble past 300 and not get punished by TOs, but this is moot with wobbling banned). So the no stalling general rule has been pointless for years because TOs never act on it, even in egregious cases of Hbox and Michael4100000 ledge camping and air camping/pound stalling (mainly Puff vs Peach and ICs, but we've also seen Hbox ledge camp a gratuitous amount against Fox). The rule against stalling def has to be more well defined, whether it's a rule against pound stalling a certain amount, a harsher ledge grab limit vs Puff, and/or an air time limit to make Puff less incentivized to air stall (mainly a problem for Peach vs. Puff, but a Puff can choose to air stall to great effect vs many characters).

[@john34557]

This discussion is so good, we need a part 2!

[@4sfield527]

I'm watching all of these guys talk and their body language as they react to each other, and I just know in my heart that Kevin is the kindest soul out of all of them.

[@haydent4946]

You guys should definitely do a peach roundtable with how well llod and polish have been doing recently!

[@stayontrack]

armada, polish, macD, llod and DoH or like wife or something?

[@troydevries547]

@@stayontrack trif would be cool for the eu representation

[@dabadaba5847]

@@stayontrack i wonder if they could somehow get ahold of cort

[@GeneralEatsMotors]

Video idea: Show top players playing characters with greyed out color and no player cam, and have the golden guardians guess their corresponding characters with who the player is. Like None guesses captain falcon, zain marth, etc..

[@TyBarros_]

The 1# Player in the world, 2 Gods of the game, the king of smash AND the FATHER of Rishi's jungle jam

[@jayadehart1680]

I don't see Moky anywhere in this vid?

[@kestrel7493]

@@jayadehart1680 moky: the FATHER of Rishi's jungle jam

[@stayontrack]

or some would also call him the one and only Smashg0d

[@AnanaNegra]

How epic would it be to have generation and character crew battles. All key players from each generation of Marth vs all key players from each generation of fox.

[@mbabaneamputee7725]

As a slippi falco I feel personally attacked by this round table 😂 just rewatched Survivor Gabon, ggs Ken

[@veiss5819]

It’d be awesome to watch a Gods roundtable in the future. The interview they could’ve had at BOTFG

[@MaraudingManiac]

I really like watching top Marths. I don't know what it is, but each of them has such an interesting perspective on the game. They're all pretty different, but there's definitely some common thoughtfulness about the game. If I catch a tournament with any of these players, I'm likely to root for them, and it isn't even because they main Marth.