Lauren Matthias with Hidden True Crime and Mormon Stories - Vision of Glory PART 1

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Other pertinent Hidden True Crime Episodes:
Daybell crash course: • LORI VALLOW & CHAD DAY...
Chad Daybell speech • CHAD DAYBELL'S speech ...
Braxton Southwick Interview: • LORI VALLOW DAYBELL'S ...
Jodi Hildebrandt beliefs: • RUBY FRANKE & JODI HIL...
Tim Ballard: www.youtube.co...
What do Chad Daybell, Tim Ballard, Jodi Hildebrandt all have in common?
Is it Thom Harrison, author of Visions of Glory?
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PART 2: kzbin.infoa-6kT1w63QA?si=fbLn2V3nVglvTLFA

[@jameslogan2735]

There's a book written by Stanton Peel in 1989, called "Diseasing of America". It was primary about his 25 year research into addiction recovery methods in America and their affected essay. What shocked me at the time when reading this book was that in the state of Utah the level of children on Ritalin, which is an cocaine like based medicine to treat ADHD. Well in Utah State he found out that the number of children on this medicine was 4 times the national average! Wow I thought at the time! I was wondering what trouble that would cause in the future? A church that doesn't tolerate coffee? I am now wondering how many of those who nowadays leave the church has been on this medication? And how many of those corrupt extreme behaving members, like Tim Ballard etc, were exposed to this medication? Sounds like a side effect to me!

[@erinjames3302]

Thanks. I keep losing you guys.

[@astrialindah2773]

I have a question for you lauren, is touched by an Angel a Mormon show? Because that show really pushed a lot of the ideas that Mormons have regarding dead loved ones and angels that guide us into our earthly death, etcetera

[@lilfiery0ne]

I don't think most people realize this, but this connection you discovered Lauren.. ITS A REALLY BIG DEAL and we don't even know how much of a big deal it is yet.... this connection is so obscure and so hidden and so nuanced, most other news journalist i think would have missed it, would have overlooked it and discounted it ... but you didn't and that's A BIG DEAL TOO!!! This was an awesome awesome show!

[@BecciBuck]

Yep, Lauren’s been saying for a while she thinks this is bigger than Chad and Lori. I’m familiar with prepper groups and thought for sure they just went off the deep end on their own. Lauren’s journalistic instinct was SPOT ON! This is scary and tragic. 😢

[@MKConnecticut]

I’m not Mormon and just started really learning about Mormonism when I heard the same AP press releases about the 2 kids missing and wanted to know what was happening . And I’ve followed things happening - ONE RIGHT AFTER ANOTHER! Then I’m hearing the same NAMES involved, then more strange events, the trial, the church of LDS hiding money, the Mormon connection to the BSA, O.U.R, covering up child abuse.. THANK you and all that’s good that I found Lauren and John Mathias, John Dehlin Mormon stories, Mormonish, RFM and all the brave individuals speaking up and connecting the dots. Being raised strict Catholic and leaving that religion let’s me understand a “faith crisis” especially in a high demand religion. You’re ALL helping so many, much more than you know, and far outside the Mormon church. Thank you. I feel like I’m hearing the authentic voices of truth. I feel so sad for the many victims- the ripple effect is huge I’m sure ♥️

[@millied4089]

​@mkv118 I agree. I started listening because my significant other died- many hurtful things happened to him, long story, he was raised Mormon and left. When he passed I just wanted to understand why his family thought what they did, and why he was so unwelcome when he was a great person. I got sucked down the rabbit hole and hooked on these podcasts. Then I realized why it all resonates with me. Raised Pentecostal (holy rollers..lol), left as an adult, but stuck with the underlying guilt that a high demand religion etches in your being. It's all the same. Women are less than, mens bad thoughts are womens fault, when bad things happen it's because you didn't have enough faith, that horrible tribulations are coming so let's all be afraid, that normal sexuality is a terrible sin, that the church you attend is the only "right" church, etc. It's like take all this, insert religion name here, and give us your money. As you said, these podcasts are helping a lot of people, not just exmo's. When I look at all the troubles in world history, the most blood shed has been in the name of religion. That's especially true right now.

[@domsmom725]

100000%!! ❤

[@Terrie-QD-PRN]

❤

[@christinadiaz4349]

I am Catholic. I am catholic to my core. My son is not. Guess what? I still love him and his family. I would never disown my child and his family.

[@justkiddin84]

I would hope so. I would hope that you wouldn’t label them as “dark” and plot their murders as a way to gain Earthly money and power. It is very very bad, this mess.

[@reglabrum6928]

I’m a Mormon there are some that take their beliefs to the extreme I saw it with missionaries when I was on my mission

[@GoAlamo]

Mormons don’t disown their kids either. Unless there is something wrong with those parents.

[@jamesnutt4627]

My whole family in all religions have never considered hating family members or disowning!

[@deliberateindifferencewi]

Enternal core?

[@emmyrose1802]

This episode was intense and a bit scary. I really do hope the church will listen to you all.

[@kathryn653]

I'm 2 hours into this podcast and I'm blown away with the idea that a THERAPIST is claiming some kind of clairvoyance and people in the church and in the clinical setting didn't immediately shut this down.

[@TEAM__POSEID0N]

When it comes to any therapist like Jodi or others of a similar bent, given the amount of mind forkery involved, you have to take the word "therapist" and insert a space between the "e" and the "r". Because that's exactly what they do to people's minds.

[@mtaylor7307]

The high demand mega church I attended in my teen years had a "Minster of Deliverance" who offered counseling and therapy without a license. She stated God prevented her from completing her education so she would be open to the Holy Spirit's guidance instead of relying on the limitations of man's understanding. For decades, she covered the Bishop's sexual abuse of women and children. Seems when God forgives and casts sin as far as the east is from the west...victims who speak are talking against God's elect when God has no recollection of the sin of SA. Victim after victim was silenced. Her advice to a child being abused and exploited was the adults are just seeking love and the child was to say during the abuse that she loved the adult(s) but that God had a better of expressing the love and that they should stop. Shockingly the advice got worse because she said Obedience to authority was required and that God's Umbrella of Protection meant the IF the adults were doing anything wrong, that the child shouldn't be worried because God would not hold them responsible as they were being obedient which is Godly. Some female victims were groomed from childhood and then abused for decades into adulthood. The "Deliverance Minister's" adult daughters marriage was broken up due to her affair with the Bishop and her granddaughter, abuse since being toddler, won a civil lawsuit as a college student for the Bishop's abuse. This caused the entire loyal church and family of the granddaughter to ostracize and demonize her. Eventually the Bishop was convicted of perjury for lying about his adult affairs when it turned out he had fathered his brother's son. justice for the dozens and dozens of victims was never received. The majority of the church adult membership were college educated professionals.

[@Untamedshrew83]

It is crazy, but then again, how do any of these highly educated people hold onto their religiosity? That is what truly blows me away. I was very religious (LDS) as a child and teen, but the more I read the scriptures and doctrine, the harder it was for me to square my rational thoughts with the nonsensical aspects of the faith.

[@mtaylor7307]

@@Untamedshrew83 Human beings love their stories, their mythology, but we see repeated issues when literalism becomes part of the belief system. Isn't it odd how human beings continue to set up religions that include discrimination revolving around otherism, dehumanization, and greed--all in the name of a god they claim they claim gives them the rights to do so? Is any religion really the problem? Or could it be a human-kind issue? Edit: faith belongs to all people...but how many people get this ruined or become traumatized with life long consequences behind the literalist's religious dogma?

[@annieonpaper]

the whole mormon religion is based on clairvoyance

[@ozzietad666]

This is how a 5 hour podcast is done! Great collaboration- structured- conversational - full of info presented in a clear way with not too much waffle. Mormon stories do a great job, but add in Lauren Mindy and Megan was the icing on the cake. The very heavy fruit cake. And by that I mean the dude who wrote that crazy book!

[@chelsiesaunders2761]

Thom Harrison was my therapist when I was a teen. My parents sent me to Anasazi (the same wilderness survival program that Chad Franke was sent too). I nearly lost my life due to the negligence of the employees at Anasazi. I am curious if Anasazi is connected to EternalCore or any of these nutty people.

[@peacefulpath222]

Sorry that happened to you 💜

[@amburwood4022]

Sorry that you went through that. I am so glad you're still here, and I hope you're healing ❤

[@justkiddin84]

“In the mid-1970s Olsen left BYU to establish what is now the Anasazi Foundation, a nonprofit wilderness-therapy program currently based in Mesa, Ariz.” From-Behind Wilderness Therapy L.A. TIMES ARCHIVES JAN. 15, 1995 12 AM PT Right now, bizarrely, their website claims it is headed by “Ezekiel GoodBuffaloEagle Founder, ANASAZI Foundation ANASAZI FoundationBrigham Young University Mesa, Arizona, United States” from Linked In So yeah, it sure is. And you have to go a long way down to start finding stories like yours-it’s all rainbows and sunshine in the first google results. And yes, that CAN be purchased.

[@Loukirb]

That place and other places like it in southern Utah need looking into as well. The boys only and girls only institutions. I lived in Ivins Utah and Hurricane. Something never set right with me. Probably ran by Jodi.

[@mariafrmdaBX]

I’m so sorry that happened to you!! Hope you heal!!

[@DonnaLena1]

This episode has been needed for so long! I’m grateful to all the people on this panel for shining light on this book - Visions of Glory. It symbolizes the evil that has come from Mormon extremists.

[@kimbrown419]

I am only at the first part but do you think I should get the book at the Library? I almost missed the part of blood atonement. I had read a fiction book about this subject. The Righteous Mormon man was killing people because the woman had an abortion. I tried to find out more from an exmo but she said she didn't know about it. Now I wonder if she was lying because this is so bizarre! Love you John and all these super smart Ladies! Thank you!!

[@papadopp3870]

Lauren and John, Megan and John D should pin this video to the top of their video lists. This drivel- written in apostle-speak- is every bit as self-righteous and self-serving as any GA bio on the shelf at DB. I kept wanting to hear the results of Thom’s handshaking devil-test with his satanic/angelic visitor.(Edited for gender and tense)

[@lindamartinez7006]

There is no part of blood atonement . That is not in the book . Give the chapter and page number . Though I don’t believe it .

[@hideem1]

I know this is old, but I have to say that I adore Lauren. I like all of you. What I noticed about Lauren though is that she actually practices radical acceptance, ferociously defends children & publicly makes mistakes, then corrects herself, leading by example. It’s very very cool to watch. I really appreciate that she’s still a member of the church too. It’s not for me, but I respect the support she shows others while still practicing. That she’s not a bystander. Her behavior proves you can advocate for the right thing with anyone who also wants the best for others & hold on to your own beliefs without judging other people. If everyone in the Mormon church was like her it would probably get better real quick.

[@carolwardropper5521]

It’s frightening how easily humans can be persuaded and go along with this..

[@emaeco6602]

It reminds me the heavens gate cult, or any cult in general. But heavens gate because they were intelligent people struggling with difficult issues coming together to build a utopia of sorts… in the after life.

[@BossyBoots2you]

Like cattle 😂

[@kathleenphillips6445]

Built on fear.

[@mountaingrannie4020]

I'm a LDS and I denounce this book. I have read it in the past. I agree with your analysis of this book & people around it.. Thank You. I don't agree with everything you all have spoken but I see what you're laying out for everyone.

[@lilys7431]

So glad you made this comment. I do hope listeners realize this is not representative of all LDS.

[@LIMITLESSFEMALE]

Yes this is so important to understand, but also hard to hear people talk lightly about a few of LDS members core beliefs.

[@jenniferjenson5182]

This pannel is brave and courageous for calling out those astray in their faith who are doing great spirtual harm. Your pannel is a reallife example of what REAL meaning of spiritual discernment is and looks like. Great job

[@paulamarie43]

AMEN!!!!!!!!

[@motherbear327]

Three of them have been excommunicated. However, I really appreciate that they stayed within respectful boundaries and didn't attack the whole of the LDS church. Not all members believe this kind of crap like Chad, Lori, Thom, and now Tim Ballard.

[@Emcald74]

@@motherbear327 Thanks for the comment. Just to clarify, I was not excommunicated (I resigned).

[@motherbear327]

@@Emcald74 Thank you for clarifying. I really appreciate how you all stick to the issue without clumping all LDS members together. Different people are in different spaces of understanding and commitment to their faith LDS or otherwise. :)

[@TEAM__POSEID0N]

Well, I tracked down that ottoman and conducted an interview, pursuant to ingesting a specially formulated mixture of mushrooms and ayahuasca tea. Turns out, it was not made of leather at all. It was made of pleather, a form of faux leather. But the pleather was under the influence of an evil spirit, having become angry at the noxious foot odors of the last person who used it...and then deceived Thomas with visions of cows and leather. The pleather ottoman has since repented and is now in good standing with the Church. It has a name: "Plottoman" and it has been in contact with the same rocks that Thomas communed with. They have always been righteous rocks and are very musically talented, a gift that is best manifested when they roll down hills.

[@sommer8337]

You win the internet!

[@MKUltra42]

🤣 👏 👏

[@bookchick]

😂

[@Lizzie4Freedom]

👀🤣😂🤣😂 standing ovation

[@wendywoobles]

😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@LoLoMcGee]

Great job Lauren! I hope this reaches everyone it needs to so that the damage can stop!

[@renaebodine1029]

Nope they are told to stay away from u-tube internet and that all of this is evil against the church and not to listen

[@dilafng]

I’m a geologist, and What’s-His-Face is right about the rocks. They tell me where they’ve been and how they came to be. ❤😊

[@WolfRoss]

I was a geology major in the Motherlode area of California. There is silica in most rock. I think in time we will learn how to access this information. I think it will become part of science in time.

[@saskiarachel7271]

This is such an important collaboration. Thank you everyone for coming together with all of your hard word and investigation into this and sharing with everyone. You are all so incredible and I can't wait for you to all come together again and share more thoughts ❣️

[@gingerlady785]

I didn’t have Tim Ballard, Tom what’s-his-name, and the Daybell’s on my 2023 cult bingo card. WOW. I’m blown away. So many great points made. This podcast is 🔥

[@KatKrueger]

Congratulations Lauren. Your hard work over several years is so important. 💜

[@melanie9369]

This book really is scary. The dots are connected🤯. Thank you Lauren. 💛💗

[@ginaross6382]

Megan’s wrap up was amazing! She is so smart, eloquent and caring.

[@justkiddin84]

Yes, she is!

[@lilys7431]

They are all beautiful souls aren’t they? They all clearly want to keep others from being caught in the deception.

[@Third_Verse]

Thank you!!!

[@katelynr7836]

I became more and more disturbed as the podcast went on. The teachings in this book are insane and so harmful! Thank you for the in depth analysis of the info in this podcast.

[@ioanekirarahu951]

I was an LDS missionary in Tahiti (1972-1974), though I left the Church many years ago. That is NOT what ancient Tahitian culture was like. They were in many ways more "enlightened" if you will than anybody else. At any rate, they certainly weren't ever raised in any "shame culture."

[@domsmom725]

Wow wow wow… this answers sooo many questions for me about these cases lately… explains so much!! Thank you all for the great discussion.. and Meghan, fantastic job pulling it all together into a digestible format.. and for sparing us from having to read/listen to it ourselves;) Brilliant episode!! 👏♥️

[@JackieKiadii]

I haven't watched this yet, but I am glad you're looking into this. I remember hearing on someone's podcast that as things came to light about Lori and Chad, families were withdrawing their kids from school and fleeing Rexburg. Leads me to believe there are many more involved and they left town before they were found out.

[@justkiddin84]

Hope you watched! It is worth the time.

[@patriciaseybold7396]

Simply put, there is a cult involved. Period.

[@kristine4949]

I sat and listened to the entire show absolutely transfixed. Thank you!!!

[@paulamarie43]

Just don’t be translated! Please lol

[@snowwhite2524]

Poor Lauren read Chad Daybell's books, that had to be terrible. It's a good thing that she has Dr. Babe to help her recover after reading that poorly written trash. This was a great episode, thank you.

[@NancyRN]

Did you take notice Lori Vallow used almost the exact language from the beginning of this book regarding those who had passed ie. Not to grieve, they are troubled by your sorrow, they were happy, they were finally at peace and free of pain and they were "busy", going forward with their work. They love you and ask that you cease to mourn for them! Lori said she was i direct contact with the heavenly messenger and also those who passed! WOW!!!

[@NancyRN]

Lori also mimicked this writing with saying that Tammy is "helping her family"

[@justkiddin84]

All this ‘work’ confuses me: what are folks supposed to be working at so much after death?

[@82566]

​@@justkiddin84sharing the LDS faith with those in the afterlife who may not of had a chance to hear or accept it in this life .If iam wrong my apologies it could of changed since I was told .

[@SuzanneBarthelemy]

⁠@@justkiddin84have you heard of the baptisms that Mormons perform for the dead? They also try to find out through genealogy who was married to whom, and then they perform LDS ordinances of marriage for those deceased spouses by proxy. That’s what “temple work” is. They do it so that these people have the chance in the afterlife to accept the “true” church and to be sealed for eternity to their spouses. The idea is that this stuff is necessary for these people who never heard the Mormon gospel while they were alive to ever attain the highest levels of heaven in the afterlife. After Mormons die, they think they go on to minister and do missionary work to those souls, to get them to accept Joseph Smith etc. This is why Mormons are always talking about being “busy” in the afterlife.

[@jazamaraz8029]

First time listening to a podcast that was so good that at the end I jumped up and gave the host and guests a standing ovation. Way to go all of you.

[@christinabeck9316]

Great job connecting all of these dots! Please be careful…..the direction the dots are going is headed toward even more powerful people. Sending you positive vibes and protection for your continued courageous path 💕

[@carrieeslinger9193]

I agree and hope for the safety of everyone that is raising the alarm. However grateful they are!

[@InternationalMysteries360]

Watching this for the second time. It deserves an Emmy. John and company are being the light.

[@MoparMomma]

Great job parsing out and bringing light to this tangled web. Wow, Lori, Chad, Tim Ballard and Jody Hildebrand all influenced by this crazy teaching, I hope they are not just the tip of the iceburg but shudder to think that we will hear of more victims.

[@SummerSunshine02]

WOW!! What a ride this podcast was! You guys were so professional, insightful and empathetic! I really hope this video reaches as many people as possible!

[@angieharasimik713]

AWESOME WORK @Lauren !!!!! TRULY “Lifting the Veil”🙏🏼🙌🏼💞

[@oliveheatley1919]

Visions of glory sounds like a manual on how to commit heinous acts under the guise of religion and God

[@justkiddin84]

Bingo in one comment!

[@cynthiagimbel6590]

Yup. The psychopathology meets the "god-given" justification. Kaboom.

[@Maisiewuppp]

Happens in the name of religion with or without this book.

[@saskiarachel7271]

Thanking you again for bringing a little laughter to such a dark topic. I know it might feel wrong to some people, but when you're digging into these ideologies, you need some relief ❤

[@valentinat3250]

I am blown away by the content here!

[@ABCDEFGIHAVETOGO.]

This panel will be back live in about an hour to continue discussing! ❤

[@patriciaseybold7396]

Mindy. ❤❤❤❤ each time I see you and the TREMENDOUS strength you used to leave this centuries old cult, my heart just wants to hold you until you heal. Sweet one, this is NOT Christianity. As a 70 yr old Christian, w no weirdo cult crap (aka Mormon ***) I so hope you’ll join the rest of us goofy Christians who adore Christ.

[@katelynr7836]

Such a great and thoughtful podcast, this panel all had such important insights. This topic and discussion is SO important to understanding and learning how to stop the horrible behavior from these mormons. I love Lauren and Hidden True Crime!

[@JoSews-t6m]

Awesome to see you all collaborating.

[@IndySpirit]

The teachings of the Mormon church that if you are spiritual enough, you acquire "discernment", which means you are capable of seeing and judging someone's soul. Isn't that elevating themselves to the level of God, who says "Don't judge lest ye be judged"?

[@amycrawford8562]

I have listened to part 1 and 2 three times now 😅 there's so much great information, points and conversations in this shared podcast with Mormon Stories

[@kerryallen4665]

I love you all for the good work you’re doing! Thank you!😊

[@AudraNeurauter]

BRAVO to the four of you! 💪🏼

[@lalaellen]

Insightful, thought-provoking conversation! Thank you for such meaningful content, Lauren, Dr. J, John, and the whole team!

[@loubylou1899]

I have been watching Kresha over on diffiCULT research and she has instinctively spotted the connection between all these people even though she has no real knowledge of mormonism and feels she doesn't have the language to describe it properly. I think she is doing a great job.

[@justkiddin84]

She is!

[@Hippie_Chick_11]

A "Rule" is just a suggestion. A "Law" is enforced by men with guns.

[@82566]

There's alot to digest with this religion. Kresha's doing great ,it's a deep rabbit hole to venture into 😊

[@starmiesteele1034]

Yes she may not be as polished and well spoken which these folks are no doubt, but her Bull Shit O Meter is in excellent working order❤

[@Susan_1]

This is huge!!!! Really enjoyed this one🙏❣️🙏

[@toad1959]

The narrative about the spirits in the barroom was lifted almost in its entirety from an NDE book called "Return From Tomorrow" by George G. Ritchie. Harrison then expands on Ritchie's account with his description of the horrors of pornography, but he is certainly not being original here. The crazed barroom, the frustrated spirits grabbing at the drinks, the split in the back of the head into which a spirit could leap -- it's all a direct rip-off from Ritchie. I can't remember the original publication date of "Return From Tomorrow," but I read it back in the 1980's. It's still in print.

[@TEAM__POSEID0N]

This reminds me of another "Harrison" who wrote a very influential book for Mormons. I'm talking about "Drawing upon the Powers of Heaven" by Grant Von Harrison. (I can't help but wonder if Thomas G. and Grant Von are related). Grant Von Harrison's book was very popular in the late 1970s and in the 1980s and was apparently really pushed in the Mission Training Center as something that missionaries needed to follow. The basic premise was that God is judging you constantly and finding you either worthy or unworthy of blessings from moment to moment in the tiniest of details. And if your behavior was not good enough in even the smallest detail, you essentially disqualified yourself from receiving anything from God, including protection, health, success in achieving goals...basically anything that could be regarded as a "blessing". The book, if taken to heart, was pushing a formula for scrupulosity on stilts and steroids. Pharisees would have loved it. Examples of unworthy behavior even included things like chewing gum. IIRC, even things like not polishing shoes or wearing appropriate clothing were mentioned in one way or another. It seems to me that the white shirt fetish that got pushed in the Church during the Hinckley years likely came out of the mindset encouraged by Grant Von Harrison's book. And of course, obedience to priesthood authority/leaders in everything was absolutely mandatory to qualify for any kind of help from God. Combine Grant Von Harrison's book with Thomas G. Harrison's book and you would have the perfect library for any nutjob aspiring to start a cult within the cult of Mormonism. GVH's book would also have religious extremists judging everyone around them based on extremely trivial and superficial criteria...and then possibly believing that a person may be under the influence of an evil spirit if, for example, they wore a light pink shirt to church instead of a white shirt.

[@서수미-p1t]

On the positive side of book "Drawing on the Powers of Heaven," discovering its false narratives and teachings taught me in the 80's to recognize - and reject - soul-sucking, agency-robbing, tripe marketing to the Saints. That skill has blessed me all my life!

[@IllustriousPoof]

Thanks!

[@carlaperkins655]

I need to thank Lauren, this podcast/you tube answers a lot of questions for me. I didn't know that Mormon stories was hosted and somewhat about excommunicated members and I was always wondering and suspicious. Now I understand your mission to understand this mess. Even the stamping up princess seems to be tangled into this mess. I hope you (Lauren) don't get exed if you don't want to be. The mormons leadership needs to respond to this mess.

[@carolinahurtado6634]

Hello everyone on panel tonight and to John Thank you very much for your podcast! It's educational and interesting for me and very insightful concerning "Mormonism" and what and what not to believe in? And to Lauren you are sincerely correct in not speaking about evil and dark spirits/possession because you are right in pointing out how many people can read into those thoughts literally and can cause damage to many weak minded people.? I love the way the panel thoroughly takes the time to explain the negatives of this book and should abstain from reading it? Thank you! John,Lauren,Mindy and Meagan.Also my prayers to Heather and the innocent Daybel family members.

[@whiskers8431]

This is a GREAT show. All of you are a true fit and the subject knowledge is amazing

[@carrieeslinger9193]

I learned today that i participated in a cruise hosted by LDS Travel early this year. Bruce Porter spoke and this year Tim Ballard was scheduled but has been removed.

[@ginaross6382]

The comment about translated beings not having kids caught my attention. It reminded me that The 2 Melanie’s & David also abandoned their children.

[@snowwhite2524]

I don't understand how people can abandon their children for anything let alone a nonsense fantasy. It blows my mind that a parent could leave their babies behind. I don't even know what to say about Jodi except for she's a monster and I hope that she never gets out of prison.. She's a danger to all children.

[@sherielowe4256]

Melanie P needs to be held accountable or her children will be in danger.

[@jenc7173]

Well done and thank you for this podcast. A quote that comes to mind after listening to it: "In the ordinary moral universe, the good will do the best they can, the worst will do the worst they can, but if you want to make good people do wicked things, you’ll need religion." Christopher Hitchens

[@juliegiles334]

Where to begin...I've had 3 near death experiences, and I have no illusions of being a messiah, or having any special powers because of my near death experiences. These are personal intimate experiences with the divine. Yes, you have a heightened sensory awareness, and can only look into the future as to how it will pertain to you, your choices, and how others choices may have an affect on you. You don't go back in time. The heightened sensory experience fades as soon as you reenter your body, it doesn't stay with you. Your experiece, what you experienced and any wisdom you recieved does stay with you. You can't enter, or merge through other people's bodies, as you're still an individual entity( soul). This experiece is with you and the divine, or with divine messengers about you, and there is noneof this voyeurisim of into other people's lives, souls, or intentions! It's about you and you alone. You don't have discernment of anyone else's spirit or soul that may be around you while this is happening. The descriptions in the book aren't the way near death experiences are and offensive to the intimate connections with the divine. Normally, I'd never share this on social media, but this is the biggest bunch of garbage I've ever heard of on this topic. I've wondered what has gone wrong for all these murders that have associations with mormonism, I now have no doubt as to why it's happening. It's horrifying and blasphemous. Furthermore, on the topic of portals...if God created the earth and all on it in 7 days, and was able to you into a physical form ( body )...don't you think per chance God could beam you anywhere he/she wanted without a portal. There are no portals.

[@heatherhammersmith8997]

So not only does everybody have their own portal, IF you're good enough, then everybody gets their own seer stone too! Uhm....I'm not a psychologist but I'm saying with full confidence that this guy has some VERY serious mental problems. I'm absolutely horrified and furrious that he has domain over the future of youth and adults, it's so far beyond troublesome that I can't even find the right words! GREAT JOB exposing the connection between this guy and all these predators, as well as the essential endorsement (through empowerment) of the church. I don't know how anybody can possibly deny what's going on here and I haven't even listened to the second part yet. Thanks for connecting the dots!

[@patriciaseybold7396]

Mindy! God bless you for the courage to leave! 🥰🙏🙏🙏

[@AshelieWiser]

Thank you so much for bringing light to all of these teachings! Please don’t stop!

[@Maisiewuppp]

Teachings! That’s a joke. Just ramblings of a grifter.

[@CatskillsGrrl]

The appeal of this book is the same as the appeal of conspiracy theories: I am special and I know something you don’t know.

[@Carnivore1959]

Have to wholly disagree..... I am old enough to have seen much of what was labeled "conspiracy" over the years come to fruition. The entire Epstein Island was a conspiracy theory years ago bc of the ugly pedophilia going on. It has been proven true and the elites still hiding the list to that island. No one thinks they are special....just realists not impacted by the utter coverups to make the evil appear untrue and thus labeled "conspiracy,". Not special ....just angry as justice is slow with the propaganda to quiet the reality.

[@mackattack701]

My interest in listening to this podcast is because my son-in-law is a Mormon. I have been learning everything I can about the LDS church so that I can interact with him intelligently about the things that are of importance to him. Though the LDS group discussed here is a more extreme group of the LDS, I have still learned an awful lot, and I thank you for that!

[@amburwood4022]

Make sure you listen to more of John's Dehlins interviews, because as an exmember of the mormon church, this sort of abuse and thinking is very prevalent in the church.

[@mackattack701]

@@amburwood4022 , thank you for your suggestion. I'll do that. I think my SIL is just a "casual" mormon, but still....

[@sharoncarson2414]

the mad hatter wasn't the only one that went down the rabbit hole !!

[@heatherhammersmith8997]

I found it interesting that in the VoG clip about light/dark spirits Thom says that he could not tell who the dark spirits were and that he couldn't knnow their histories either. It makes me think that Chad was trying to one-up Thom because Chad's lists included extensive past life histories of (both light and) dark spirits.

[@humboldtannie]

Another great collaboration between Mormon Stories and Hidden True Crime. I love it! TY!

[@paigebarker1468]

56:11 10000000% agree with John's metaphor, it's terrifying to know that this book is out there in the hands of so many people that don't understand that it isn't truth, it's a sincerely dangerous piece of work. And of course, go Lauren go!!! You're getting to the bottom of it all, hopefully your hard work can help to stop this from happening even one more time ❤️❤️❤️

[@daisyb2637]

Nice job it’s really great having you all together. Please keep spreading the good work. Sadly harmful ideologies, and specific peoples pathologies really hurt people- from any and all religious beliefs. Thanks for putting in the work and time.

[@estaire79]

God bless Megan - I'm at 54:00 or so and her voice is cracking - Satan is a deceiver and loves to confuse people. Praying for you to be strong. Great discussion, excellent guests.

[@paigekutz8539]

Every time yall post, I get so excited!!! This is awesome, fantastic group of folks! ❤

[@JessicaNebeker]

As Lauren and Dr. John have argued Lori and Chad truly believed these delusions. I think Thom Harrison similarly is a true believer. I find myself feeling sad for Thom and others as I think the LDS church primed the pathways for these delusions and even reinforced them. His beliefs do not remove his culpability from the damage his words have done. I hope Thom accepts responsibility, fully renounces his book, and heals.

[@bt8508]

He died in 2013...

[@justicejane2429]

Rest in Peace JJ 👟👟Tylee👡👡 Joseph👞👞 Charles👢👢 & Tammy👠👠

[@GoGreen-l7e]

Whats really bizarre is the average person who has a near death experience does not travel to a bar. They talk about going to heaven or feeling others pain they caused, or just feeling so good they don't want to come back. But they don't go to a bar, 😂

[@KellyKelz7]

Right! Then he goes on talking about communication with ottomans, trees and how he can speak to rocks and they speak back. 😂👀 Dude is🦇💩😵‍💫

[@motherbear327]

I read that book back in 2013 when it first came out. I didn't believe the "visions". The book gave me a creepy feeling. I, too, was concerned about friends who glommed onto it as if it were God's word. Scary. I got rid of the book and am stunned at how it plays a part in all these creepy rogue LDS crimes. Ick! Good work Lauren, Megan, Mindy and John!

[@kaymusictaylor7214]

Mormons try to convert me. My reply, 'Get thee behind me, satan."

[@patriciaseybold7396]

OMG!! AMEn…. I don’t do cults. Sounds like you don’t either. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

[@elizabethtippetts3091]

Lauren, thank you for really driving home the importance of members to not support this book. The story of JJ and Tylee and Charles and Tammy opened my eyes that people with radical beliefs can be sitting among you at church so it really does need to be talked about.

[@patriciaseybold7396]

Just joined your channel after studying Mormonism since the 1980’s white salamander letter.

[@Trimom05]

This has been so disturbing for many reasons. But mainly because my ex-husband was in alcohol ism treatment at the Weber County mental health department and I recognize many of these principles being taught. This was the early 90’s.

[@1notstressed]

I just want to mention that, back in 2005, I came across a book titled “People who don’t know they’re dead” in a Borders bookstore. I thumbed thru it for a minute and I just gotta tell ya- the bar scene in Visions of Glory seems plagiarized, lifted right out of the pages of that book. I knew I heard it before!!! Almost word for word.

[@41Pucky]

This is one conspiracy theory I actually believe. Thank you for uncovering it. I hope more people pay attention.

[@peggybreidenbach8703]

❤ Thank you all for this episode!! So interesting & informative!! I'm going to share it, though I don't know if anyone I know will watch it, it's worth a try. ( I'm a True Crime Junkie, but no one I know share my interest. One online friend that has some interest. So, I spend a lot of time watching & interacting in podcasters.). I have definitely always noticed so many evil people are or have been involved in LDS. I don't have any religious ties, or beliefs. I'm kinda atheist, I guess. I have a hard time believing in God. It's people like all the ones you are talking about & mentioning that reenforces my feelings. Again, thank you all for doing this & All you do!! ❤❤ Take Care & Stay Safe Everyone ❤️

[@marjoriejohnston3038]

Wish I'd found this before because it explains so much about Chad and Lori, pertinent to their case. Till now I thought Chad was trying to impress Lori , making things up off the top of his head. Now I see there's a much bigger picture. Being in Ireland all I know of mormons is when they turn up at the door hoping to convert. Glad I found this post.

[@gardengirl6636]

History repeats itself in that atrocities are committed by those who believe they have God on their side. The comic relief was much needed. I loved seeing y’all crack up at the absurd ideas and phraseology in VoG.

[@shelikedimaginarymenbestof1293]

Having this on repeat, so well done!🎉

[@HBrosLeadr43540]

Amazing discussion. Thank you all

[@maryrowery80]

I have been interested for a long time with another set of characters - Doug Mendenhall, his daughter and friend "Kitten". It was interesting (but not very surprising) to find he apparently had connection with Harrison too. From a Reddit comment "Doug Mendenhall had a book on evil spirits, and was Snuffer's BFF, talked about Jedi conferences where supposedly "Spencer" was a keynote speaker."

[@GGma2020]

This is fascinating!! It is bringing forward the dangers of false profits. I believe in loving God & doing good should be the core belief of every true legitimate religion you wish to follow. Simple

[@lollygirl8768]

Watching your faces during the narration was priceless! 😂

[@rhondadearborn3265]

Lauren, as a reporter, have you considered writing a big expose/think piece regarding this book and all its tentacles? It needs national exposure - perhaps for Vanity Fair, Rolling Stone, Time?

[@41Pucky]

Thank you for taking one for the team. After all these stories I heard from you the last few years, was tempted to read the book… very thankful I didn’t had to!! This is wrong.

[@HeidiSue60]

This video came across my feed a few weeks ago and I didn’t have time but now that another doomsday Mormon family has absconded with one of their children thinking he is the “chosen one” and his father doesn’t know where he is…sweeping Mormonism is right. I’m going to find the time.

[@deborahrobertson2340]

The voice. Good grief! It's the fake & same sing-songy voice that Bill Gothard, Warren Jeff's, and even Michelle Dugger. When I hear what I call the "sing-songy " voice, I have red flags. It's just weird.

[@jodibauer4742]

Call it out! Thank God for all of you! 🙏🙏🙏 amazing research…

[@MaggieMaeMatt]

Y’all are so reverently irreverent! I love it!!

[@paulamarie43]

I love you allllll!❤

[@VirtuousHereticKristin]

I looked up Maurice Harker; he’s my neighbor. (Same HOA.) Davis County/Farmington is like a cooler, hipper, quasi elitist mormon vibe. (Like, we don’t have to wear garments because those guys making the rules are old fuddy-duddies.) It’s been weird and I’ve been trying to put my finger on it. I think I’m kind of getting it now when you talked about sending things underground.

[@awalkthroughtorah6897]

This is crazy. I was just hoping that trafficked women and children would be rescued. I didn’t realize all of this would end up in a Mormon cult situation.

[@ckayj4]

Thank u for doing this work

[@patriciaseybold7396]

Megan. Thank you for your bravery. 🙏🙏🙏🥰

[@2012Cheetah]

Always love you Lauren! Nice to have yur expertise on the panel! 😍

[@Yoga3756]

Thank you for the information shared here. As an active Latter-day Saint I only wish it was coming from my church organization. Several friends/family got caught up by Visions of Glory/Avow. I despised everything about it back during that time period in my life, and despise it even more now, learning these details.

[@LadyCrimson25]

Anyway, I want to thank you sharing this when not knowing any of this before you mentioned this. Love you guys🙏

[@Sundae-Doodles]

Very insightful. Thank you for the education. ❤