'Leaderless, rudderless' - the VMTV panel give their verdict on Australia

"The writing has been on the wall. They are outrageously poorly coached."
"I think Eddie let his ego get in the way."
"Leaderless, rudderless, without faith."
Our panel pull no punches on their analysis of Eddie Jones' Australia.
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#RWC2023 #Wallabies #RugbyWorldCup #WelshRugby #WALvAUS #Wales #Australia #EddieJones #RWC #Rugby

[@garethrichmond4388]

Wales fan here its absolutely criminal how Eddie treated Hooper. Hooper is pure class an incredible player and outstanding leader

[@gregorybaillie2093]

Nonsense it's time for a change.

[@godisbollocks]

​@@gregorybaillie2093How you can stick to that story in the wake of this unprecedented Wallaby humiliation is fairly mind-blowing to me.

[@alistairmelhuish2168]

Agreed Gareth as an AB fan

[@gregorybaillie2093]

that's because you don't know anything about the ARU.@@godisbollocks as if one outstanding player who has reached his shelf life is goint to fix this dud team

[@dazeng4633]

Totally agree, one of the best the game has ever seen. There's only one fool in the game who'd dare treat him like that and that's Jones

[@catinthehat906]

Actually Rennie was doing well, a couple of close losses to big teams like France and Ireland made his stats look far worse then they actually were. The only reason they lost by a point to Italy was that Donaldson missed a conversion that an under 16 schoolboy regularly puts over. The sacking of Rennie by Hamish McLennan was devastating for the continuity and morale of the Wallabies rebuilding project. McLennan is the real architect of this disaster.

[@pixelpotato4874]

Well that guy needs to hang his head in shame, getting jobs for the boys rather than thinking about the Wallabies who are way better than the Car Accident against Wales,hope Phil Waugh sacks this guy,would be the best thing he's done since being ARU Boss.

[@jacobwinn2765]

Yep, corporate suits ruin everything. Look at NZR.

[@John.Valiant]

​@@jacobwinn2765eh nz Lose by close games to big teams generally. They still on

[@John.Valiant]

​@@jacobwinn2765 a few tweaks and they'll beat anyone .same for aus really. But they need hearty players. Playing up front ball In hand

[@eugenelavery9044]

Australia were poor under Rennie and not getting better. They have been getting worse under every coach for the last 20 years. I don’t think the coach matters at this point, the players just aren’t very good.

[@vuvuslayer]

Watched the match on STAN, Hooper was in studio. He refused to cut into Jones when they tried to lead him down that path, instead he stood up for him. Hooper is out and out class and too good to play for Jones.

[@karlosdeevs]

yh, he should come back immediately if Rennie gets reinstated

[@varuninnz]

Good comment mate. I've always had big respect for Hoops. He's a top bloke and a great leader

[@davejordan267]

As a kiwi he deserves alot man. I was truly rooting for him and Cooper under rennies reign.

[@sleati4911]

Of course he's not going to stick the knife in him. He wants a future with Australian Rugby so criticising the coach they appointed is career limiting. He's part of their dog and pony show. And who cares about the hours Eddie puts in, there's clearly no net return on those hours because he keeps getting his selections wrong. Sack the Chairman. The main issue is no one really wants to work with or for Eddie.

[@karlosdeevs]

@@sleati4911 agree on pretty much everything, but in the end it‘s mainly Eddie that needs sacking..

[@spumoni90]

Imagine how much more upset Matt Williams would have been if Australia went with a 7-1 split?

[@gwynevans6440]

This properly made me laugh. Have 1 like.

[@reubendobbs8011]

😂😂😂

[@Wolf-hh4rv]

would have lost it completely, the men in the white coats would have to have gently lead him away

[@Micah88]

@@Wolf-hh4rv 😂

[@M0RR1S10]

😂😂😂

[@hiramhackenbacker9096]

We've been living on past glories for way too long. Going backwards to Jones was never the answer. The coverage of the RWC in Australia has been dismal reflecting the lack of interest. At the moment everyone is absorbed in the AFL or NRL finals and that's coming off the back of being captivated by Australia's performances in the women's and men's soccer world cups. Rugby Union needed a response. We got one but completely the wrong one needed.

[@jpip1382]

And where does cricket squeeze in

[@hiramhackenbacker9096]

@@jpip1382 summer sport and not a code of football so not really relevant here

[@TC-sm8rc]

Coach is responsible period. EJ decided not to select the best players in australia for this tournament and surround himself with the staff he wanted so he got what he wanted and it wasnt good enough - Simple

[@regfries8279]

100%.

[@michaelodonnell824]

The Australian Defence coach, hand picked mere months previously by Jones, quit (unable to work with Jones) as the squad boarded the plane to Europe. The "current" (and very temporary) Defence coach is a Rugby League coach who has never played or coached Rugby Union... Jones's choice....

[@LimerickWarrior1]

A lot of people debate if jones has coached in rugby union....

[@conwaynoel3715]

They let Mack Hansen go , what more do you need to know about the state of Aussie rugby.

[@Blueeey]

Tuipulotu, Bealham, Meafou

[@alistairmelhuish2168]

I'm a kiwi, raised in Oz. Love it and their country and people. I was shocked today. Hurt. I believe Eddie completely misread the room that's the WC and his ego got the better of him. Hoops is an icon, a leader amd up there with Savea. What possessed him to leave Hoops at home. Bye Eddie. Not good.

[@Adam-im3uz]

Ardie Savea is a brilliant player, but not really a "leader". Agree with everything else you said though.

[@charminjarmin1234]

Hooper is the only wallabie that would A make an ABs team and B make a world 15 team. He’s that good why would you leave him out - Nz supporter-

[@dominicjohnson5352]

Best game I have seen from Wales for years. Accurate, strong defence - seemed to have a game plan and stick to it - no aimless kicking and that set piece try was outstanding - so much as everyone is pointing out that Wallabies were shite credit needs to be given where it is due....

[@archo0518]

I agree i think Wales are would give the All blacks big problems playing like that. Sothern hemisphere rugby is falling behind in set piece and the breakdown.

[@KaiserMacCleg]

​​@@archo0518I'm not sure about that. Wales' game plan was spot on and executed perfectly, but it relied on backing their defensive capability and waiting for (or forcing) Aussie mistakes. Teams like the ABs, Ireland and France are a lot more accurate. Those mistakes just don't come anywhere near as often. Wales are better than a lot of rugby fans think, but there is still a big gulf between them and the top four.

[@spud7823]

@@KaiserMacCleg not so hasty, Ireland have never been past quarters, Wales have a lot of players from 2019 WC. Don't underestimate them..

[@gerainthopkins7576]

@@spud7823 er not so much Wales missing sever high profile player through retirement or injury, no AWJ ,Jake Ball, Ryce Care, Cory Hill, Wyn Jones, Ken Owens, Aaron Shingler, Justin Tuperic, Jonathan Davies ,Hadleigh Parks, Ross Moriorty, Josh Navadi to name a few thats 13 players most of them were first team starters.

[@Skybar23]

Wales shouldnt get caught up....they lost to a worse Wallaby side EVER

[@ph5849]

Matt was saying how good EJ was when England were dreadful! Last 3 years of EJ for England was beyond awful, 20% win rate last 3 six nations( take out Italy) lost at home to Scotland for 1st time in 30 years, destroyed by the Baa Baa’s, what the hell We’re AFU thinking?? Rennie was doing decent job, still EJ got a huge payout for England and will From AFU, millions for complete failure!

[@LB_die_Kaapie]

He's probably the worst pundit on any media platform in rugby

[@Wolf-hh4rv]

The white powder was steadily doing its work

[@Nat-oj2uc]

The clown is a con man

[@varuninnz]

Let's not forget Wales were insanely good to begin with

[@gregorybaillie2093]

Nonsense they're second rate and needed the ref to save their buts against Fiji.

[@not.likely]

And how was that possible?

[@patsyparisi2620]

​@@gregorybaillie2093talking through you arse mate .

[@weekesy5122]

The Welsh implemented a game plan well but are a team of average players except for a handful. A group playing as a team will usually outperform a team of star players! Having Cooper, Hooper etc... Wouldn't have changed anything.

[@not.likely]

@@weekesy5122 sorry, I don't think this holds water. Only up to a point. Average players can't play skilled rugby throughout the match. But because Australia couldn't put a world class team together, does overshadow the Welsch victory. The Welsch are obviously not as strong as they appear.

[@MyPaddy2011]

Blaming Eddie or any coach that has come before, is just a gutless attempt to avoid the truth. This result was not of Eddie's doing. A cursory glance at the Wallabies performances will show that such a capitulation had been building for thirty years. It is a cancer embedded throughout the entire rugby organization in Australia. My own assessment is that rugby in Australia will become obsolete before it had a chance to be salvaged. The growing support for three different codes of football in Australia, should guarantee the death of rugby that seems to have been designed for it. It should be noted as well that rugby is struggling globally, because the powers that be, have systematically taken the the game they play in heaven, to the game they now play in hell.

[@footyfin]

Agree on all fronts but especially re Rugby Australia.

[@MyPaddy2011]

@@footyfin 👍

[@footyfin]

Aussie here, agree with everything this panel says. Fair play to Wales who played well against a poor team. All of this is symptomatic of the dysdunctional and inept organisation that Rugby Au has been for well over a decade. Meanwhile NRL and AFL are getting record crowds - even over the past weekend.

[@doggyplayzdoggy3197]

do you realise there were people putting Australia 1st and wales 3rd and even 4th! But we didn't beat Australia it was them ,we didn't beat Fiji it was the ref that's what everyone is saying

[@garrymajor7528]

Plus 10 seconds from beating the All Blacks.Dave Rennie very hard done by.

[@invernessfan3017]

Wales did well to win. This is a great result for Welsh rugby. Wales have really done well. Also, I am looking for a good Ireland v Scotland game. I support Scotland. So I want Scotland to win.

[@cruisersism]

Nope, not a chance against the up coming world champions.

[@barra6709]

​​@@cruisersismlad, let's not turn into Saffa fans just yet. Every team in front of us deserves due respect.

[@cableguy6275]

It's not a given for Ireland,not by a long way. Scotland are capable of winning. Self belief and it can be done.

[@Donalob]

I'm Irish and love the Welsh and Scots equally. Just sucks that the Scots were handed a rotten group draw. Still will be a tense match in two weeks 🤞

[@cruisersism]

@@barra6709 It's belief my friend that this time is ours. Due respect to all nations. Apart from Ireland, my other favourite team is Fiji.

[@gregj7916]

Internal politics in Australian rugby union must be horrendous. At least The Brumbies are giving it a crack.

[@petergrifin1958]

Rugby barley gets a mention anymore. NRL - National Rugby League is genuinely 100x more popular has 10x more money so all our best talent goes there or if they don't go to NRL they play Union in Japan or France. NRL has 17 teams - plenty of room to net developing union players. Union has 5 teams. And to be honest the NRL is a far better product than union, way more exiting - it's because of this that you see Australia and NZ innovating in Rugby. All these new laws are because of ANZ - since we watch the NRL!

[@petergrifin1958]

I wish union was more popular here!

[@jamescaldwell7396]

This is spot on and heartbreaking at the same time😣😢

[@wolfgangvonuce9803]

Eddie,come and coach Manu Samoa,we will welcome you with open arms👍

[@Wolf-hh4rv]

I honestly think Eddie is sniffing some of the white stuff. His behaviour is getting more erratic. Bizarre at the moment.

[@long-shotlouie]

I realise this is just a clip and I'm not watching the whole post-match discussion, but did these guys ever get round to talking about the things that Wales did well?

[@ronaldobrien6870]

Yes! The post-match analysis and discussion was excellent and went on for over an hour

[@etienneholmes5556]

Mate, you are the last Australian to give Eddie advice....

[@stevebell395]

Y?

[@etienneholmes5556]

@stevebell395 After his role as Scotland coach, Williams was sacked as Scotland head coach in April 2005 having the worst win percentage of any Scottish head coach he lost more games with Scootland against tier 2 nations than any other coach. So dont lecture Eddie mate.

[@aidanbrophy86]

Scots were brutal tbf

[@etienneholmes5556]

@aidanbrophy86 he knew this when he took the job. Much like Eddie knew that the stroke in Australia rugby is extremely poor at the moment. Look what Eddie did with Australia back in the day when he had the players.

[@aidanbrophy86]

Look how toxic he made the England environment.

[@johndanter7834]

I just love the way people aren't talking about Wales lol. Keep it up and we'll see whoever in the final ;) On a serious note, I feel sorry for Australia

[@conorcahill5422]

I'm sure the pundits did talk about Wales but they haven't shown a video of it. But let's be real. Not many would talk about Wales being good, but the bigger talking point is Australia being bad lol.

[@timphillips9954]

@@conorcahill5422 Wales are a rugby nation something Australia or Ireland will never be!

[@zombievikinggaming4258]

Wales are ranked well outside the top 5 for a reason. Australia have been nosediving for 15 years as Union is dying there. Fiji is still a Tier 2 classified nation. Wales has a piss easy gift route to a semi final.

[@timphillips9954]

@@zombievikinggaming4258 Yeah Wales have a piss easy rout to a semi final every four years, lol. Not bad for a nation of three million

[@timphillips9954]

@@aidanholland126 Yes England and Australia

[@peterthomas4533]

I love how everyone is not talking about 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿. Carry on please. I think its will only when wales gets to the final will people then start to take notice.

[@steelcity4581]

Congrats to wales on the win but they beat the worst Wallaby side to ever exist. Hardly means they will get to the final

[@Skybar23]

Dave Rennie should of never been sacked...his approach to coaching was to fix the foundation of Australian players such as skill and technique that never existed in the local system

[@Marktb363]

Good honest discussion 🙂

[@arserobinson7118]

Getting rid of Rennie was their biggest mistake, he would have done something for Australia in this World Cup

[@johnsuncle888]

It’s incredible how Matt Williams has reinvented himself as a pundit after a laughable excuse for a coaching career.

[@ciaranoconnor4027]

How many international games have you played for your country at senior level? How many senior clubs and international sides have you coached? Tell us all about it?

[@Donalob]

Some shitetalk

[@jordancurley995]

That's totally uncalled for its completely disrespectful 😡

[@theofilusbouwer3430]

​@@jordancurley995Yeah as respectful as Matt Williams was after south africa lost to ierland saying "Ding dong the witch is dead"😂😂😂 Think he was taking about australian rugby ranked 9 th in world 😂

[@robsbones5813]

We’ve gone thro a lot in the last years with accusations about the WRU and the player going on strike but since Gatland have come in he’s structured the welsh set up and started from Scratch and more the team got together the more the teams getting grips with Gatland way and now it paying off ,the Australia are like wales you’ve got to get the right coach in and get a structure in place and work from there I’m welsh but it was sad seeing Australia with no game plan , they be back but it take time ,

[@noneofyourbusiness7396]

This is the evitable conclusion when sporting organisations (ARU), teams (wallabies) and players believe that they should "lecture" the public about political agendas, rather than training how to win in the sport they play. GO WOKE GO BROKE. It all started when they hounded Folau out of the games for his religious views, paid him 6 figures compensation, and made the woke political agenda more important than playing and winning the sport you play.

[@Colin-wx7kz]

Everyone needs to remember Wales are rebuilding also.

[@richardl772]

I can’t believe how long ago it was that I last saw the Wallabies play good consistent entertaining rugby……it’s been aeons.

[@gregorybaillie2093]

sack the board only way out

[@damianbylightning6823]

No respect for loveless Wales. All wins are down to luck or poor opposition, apparently. Irish pundits are especially condescending to recovering teams. In the last 4 Six Nations, it's 50/50 in terms of wins between the two. People need to show a bit of respect to both England and Wales. On the day, both these teams could down one of the top 4.

[@Rocky19837]

Wallabies are finished - they're now a tier two nation and I don't see a way back - The sad reality is Australia favour trash sports like aussie rules and league

[@John-pl8fe]

True the two crappiest games of all!! At least the Wallabies were flag bearers for Australia as League is not a world game!!

[@Rocky19837]

@@John-pl8fe Im baffled how Australia who were so dominant in the nintees didn't promote union (2 world cups) they allow all there young talent to go and play two codes no one in the world cares about

[@etienneholmes5556]

Cannot agree more. League and aussie rules suck.

[@sljones9103]

Rugby league is rubbish Union is the global sport

[@patfarget-nm3mt]

too much competition... 13-a-side game, Australian football, even the footballers with their round ball are starting to overshadow them in Australia

[@godisbollocks]

"The beautiful attacking rugby that we know in this game was built in Australia." NZ: "Lol"

[@Adam-im3uz]

Haha, yeah - don't know where he got that from.

[@matyoukee799]

Quite interested to know just how good those pre-WW2 aussie backrowers were now.

[@Adam-im3uz]

I don't know why he used WW2 as a reference point. Australia didn't really "make it big" on the world rugby stage until the early 1980s

[@daveholmes7130]

Sad day for this Aussie rugby fan. Congrats to Wales and Fiji

[@ManaBrown-vw4sp]

The players have been mucked around ever since they let Rennie go now they've just givin up on this disaster

[@letstalk3265]

Coaching in Australia has gone backwards for decades. I'm a baby boomer who played rugby (both codes) and learnt the basics real good. Played multiple sports including handball (at school and home), tennis, table tennis, snooker, billiards and more importantly cricket. Coordination and spacial awareness that crosses over into most ball sports. As young blokes our favourite games re rugby were touch and force'n'backs. Meant that everyone showed their talents and exposed their weaknesses. Force'n'backs in particular showed the talent of who wanted to get to the ball on the full to get the reward of 'three steps' from the mark, who would chase hard to minimize the hazard of the bouncing ball and who had vision for the great kicking game to win it. In my year it was the forwards who were the best kickers and had all the skills of any back and the only part they lacked was pure pace. Our two second rowers were our two best kickers and players. Both could kick field goals and penalty goals from over halfway. We had a 'star team' from the Firsts to the Fourths. One skill that's been lost in Australia is the perfect pass. We only ever threw a spin pass if a halfback or a cut out move. Every other pass in the forwards and especially the backs was a non-spin pass. A league pass; the easist pass to deliver and catch in all conditions. Moved across the backline with hands out in front and the roll of the wrists to move it on WHILST LOOKING AT THE TARGET PERSON FOR THAT PASS TO GO TO. My job as five-eight on was to throw my team mate the perfect pass. His hands were out as a target for my pass so that he would catch the ball at pace without having to deviate or hesitate because of a bad pass. I never threw a bad pass left or right. That was my job and then after throwing the pass it was to stay in support which a lot of the time meant I was back in position very quickly to go again ... and again...and again. LAW: never throw a pass to a team mate in a worse position than you (selling them the dump was sometimes a droppable event). If that was a possibility I'd head back into my forwards and feed it safely to them, the great recyclers. Now it's nearly all spin including forwards. Spin passes often thrown bullet like at the stupidest times. Most cannot throw spin passes to their left anyways and taking too much time to get the hands in the proper position to throw one. Just crap. Then all these no-look passes. Mate get the fundamentals right first then when you're really good, then maybe. Better throwing a GREAT pass and staying in support. Basic skills that are missing in Australian teams. Tragedy

[@andrewsoroka3628]

Why can't Rob Kernney pass wales a compliment

[@davidpearn2484]

Not one of these lot said well played Wales disgusting 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿.

[@toanz4869]

Cursed for kicking Isreal Folau out for sharing his faith quoting the Bible. Bow down Australia apologize to Izzy asap

[@karltaylor2857]

100% but that would never happen as they bow down to the "CORPORATE WOKE" agenda.

[@toanz4869]

@@karltaylor2857 then I hope they fall right down to tier 2 rugby level. Disgraceful

[@patrickporter6536]

I would have loved to hear Eddie's interview. "Don't be a wisearse mate!

[@timphillips9954]

I think the world needs Wales to be strong rather than a strong Australia. The Welsh are one of the few true rugby nations on the planet.

[@SMacCuUladh]

two world cups says you're wrong

[@Donalob]

Irish fan. Went to Cardiff in 2015 and have chatted to many random Welsh rugby fans both there and in Dublin. Salt of the earth. Great people. Happy to see the Welsh do well

[@timphillips9954]

@@SMacCuUladh What has that got to do with it? England have won a World Cup and rugby is at best the third most popular sport there.

[@timphillips9954]

@@Donalob Thanks, there have been some great days in Cardiff and Dublin when they play each other. They are normally close games.

[@AdamB-lg9gc]

See you Irish in the Semi Finals @@Donalob

[@cloudydaez]

He nailed it but it’s not complicated. They just got the wrong coach

[@Chess323]

Australian Rugby don't have to make it complicated, cut the BS and the Rugby politics in it.

[@erfwise]

Williams is a real joke as a panel member on this panel Very critical as usual - and his record as a "failed International coach is abysmal after this comment """"As a coach I was really helped by that system of coaching""""" (as a player too mind you) says Williams - the chap with the worst Coaching Record ( up until now with eddy assuming that position that is?) - the chap (coach) Here is his Scotland record! ::: After success with Ireland A, Williams was reportedly[citation needed] "head hunted" by the SRU and, in 2003, he was appointed as the head coach of Scotland. Williams was only the second Australian in over a century to be appointed as a head coach in the Six Nations Championship - and the Scottish national men's team's first foreign coach.[citation needed] Scotland won three games out of 17 under William’s tenure - against the Tier 2 nations Japan and Samoa in 2004, and against Italy in the 2005 Six Nations. Williams controversially discarded Townsend - a celebrated figure in Scottish rugby, then aged only 30 - a week prior to the unveiling of his first national squad, despite an admission that his team lacked experienced centers.[citation needed] After his role as Scotland coach, Williams was sacked as Scotland head coach in April 2005 having the worst win percentage of any Scottish permanent head coach,[2] with Scotland's results immediately picking up with the arrival of new coach Frank Hadden, a former schoolteacher.

[@Cmjd0923]

The coach, by bringing a team of young guys and leaving behind the older ones who could have provided a solid core for the team at home, has resulted in a disaster for the game in Australia. Rugby is already losing to the competition from AFL, Rubgy League and soccer. This debacle will just make things worse. It's sad for the game in Australia.

[@nichobee]

Australians have become disillusioned by the way rugby has devolved into battles of who kicks the most penalties. It's no coincidence that, as that panellist said, Australia pioneered enterprising and attacking rugby. We don't have time for boring scrums and penalties, which has meant fewer people watching rugby > less exposure on tv over time > less junior participation. The ARU governance is a symptom of the problem, not a cause of the problem. The gradually increasing structural issues in Australian rugby all stem from the growing lack of interest in the game down under. Your grassroots are the foundation, and when the grasroots incrementally vanish out of sheer disinterest in the game itself, the ARU can only do so much to keep it propped up. The warning signs were there 20 years ago when they had to poach Sailor, Tuquiri and Rogers from rugby league. It looked great in the short term, but was masking over a fundamental grassroots issue. This might be controversial, but the northern hemisphere, ever reliant on boring tactics and penalties, has ruined rugby union. There are too many rules and laws in rugby. You wanna have your cake and eat it too. You want it to be a battle of all these men piling ontop of eachother in rucks, but then also want to regulate for every single thing that happens inside the ruck. It's just all a bit silly to us. And if it's impossible to deregulate the laws of the game, then fine, stop over-rewarding penalty goals and field goals. That should not be what rugby is about. It's ridiculous. We want to see tries, not penalties and drop kicks. If AFL and NRL didn't exist, and we all played rugby or soccer instead, the world would not stand a chance against us. And I genuinely mean that.

[@eyecontrol4900]

I still remember growing up hearing about the Wallabies and still have fond memories of the 1999 and 2003 world cups. Hard to believe that golden era is long gone now. Like you said, AFL and NRL are far more popular in Qld and Nsw and take away alot of the talent pool that Union needs. Of course Rugby Aus have shot themselves in the foot multiple times with bullshit admin decisions over the years. RU is a niche sport now, behind a paywall with far less viewers and popularity than NRL.

[@peterkehoe481]

While I agree in part with what you say about the northern hemisphere ruining the game (I've long believed the 2003 final loss to England was what killed the game in Oz) the simple fact is Australia simply don't have the bottle to have a red hot go at sports that actually matter. I used to adore rugby league but lets face it the only reason it and AFL are so big here is because we're virtually the only countries playing it. We have this American style mentality where we don't want anything to do with sports we don't think we can dominate year after year. Rugby can rise again in Australia but the mentality of the public needs a big change.

[@nichobee]

@@peterkehoe481 Aussies don't want a red hot go at real sports? That's a red hot take. Aussies used to give a red hot go at rugby and were the best nation in the world for it. They dominate the second most popular sport in the world too. We even somehow reached the 2015 rugby final. The 2003 final did not kill rugby in Australia. Rugby going professional in the 90s is what killed it. We had the best amateurs in the world but all our best pro athletes are tied up in the other codes. I do agree that it's sad we don't take rugby or soccer more seriously, but it's not out of insecurity either, we just have mediocre taste in sports

[@peterkehoe481]

@@nichobee Mate, it is insecurity. The simple fact is we don't want anything to do with sports where we can't see the "best in the world" outside our own front door ie AFL & NRL. Former Socceroos captain and SBS doyen the late Johnny Warren touched on as much in his 2003 book Sheilas, Wogs & Poofters. Rugby & Football struggle here because the best players play in overseas competitions.

[@nichobee]

@@peterkehoe481 so we suddenly became insecure about rugby

[@TomRiddler-m3j]

Game has moved past Australia. Last time Australia did anything of significance in Rugby, there was no social media for them to boast about it

[@MrRadialdrift]

Last time we did anything was when we had a world class Fly-Half, what over ten years ago now.

[@jackobrien1026]

The bigger issue is that Australia has moved past rugby. No one plays rugby in Australia bar private schools in two states. Rugby as a product is far too static and slow and can't adapt to what the Aussie public wants.

[@steelcity4581]

There wasn’t social media in 2015 when Wallabies were in the World Cup final?

[@MrRadialdrift]

Are you asking in the negative or the positive? No, so there was social media in 2015. @@steelcity4581

[@plutoniumnitrate1201]

Man....what happened to Australia over the last couple of years......i may be wrong but they now might exit the group stages for the first time.

[@gregorybaillie2093]

hope they do, something constuctive might get done like sacking the board.

[@rosselliot8971]

You better believe the same structural problems albeit for different reasons are about to swamp NZ rugby. We've been faltering and it's about to get worse. I doubt the NZRFU have the wherewithal to diagnose and correct before too much damage is done. Virtue signalling about women's rugby and running a closed shop seems to be their priorities.

[@scramblesish]

Eddie Jones just never cared - he was only ever in it for a short term paycheque and rugby Australia were foolish enough to take the bait

[@phillyflyersfanuk]

Welsh club rugby has also been in decline for many years but its always been kept under the radar due to the success of the national team in the 6 nations. Its really only come to light because of wales poor 6 nations performances over the past few years without Gatland at the helm. Noone cares when the national team is winning, but easy to blame structural issues in the game when theyre not winning. Sure theres serious issues with australian rugby but that was still a good australian team but they just lacked the grit to try and get back into the game

[@jonesyjones7626]

Good comment. There are a lot of problems in rugby union right now across the globe and the unions and World Rugby only seem to concern themselves over tv money and big tournaments. If you don’t help the grass roots, the game will disappear up its own backside.

[@ryanway9346]

Hmm thinking about history, the sport, the game - i think this might just be the worst world cup performance by any team in any world cup in history.... and its not just cos they lost to Wales and Fiji but in the manner of it. Considering its the easiest draw in a rugby world cup on that side of the draw in history this is a massive failure. And this is coming from a Kiwi, Aussies greateat rival, but i dont wanna see them that bad, this is embarrassing even as an arch-nemesis

[@jimlowe8511]

Yes, I understand the panel's discussions mainly focusing on the state of Australian rugby but one aspect of the game to mention, Wales played very well and scored 3 excellent tries against an Australian side which still had some great and seasoned players. Alright they (Australia) are not being coached well but what more motivation would you need as a player than playing in a World Cup for your country. Does the coach have to spur you to play well that much? As a Welshman I became worried in the first half when Biggar went off injured the the Australian scrum pushed us off the ball twice, yet somehow the Welsh started to play better and eventually dominate Australia in all aspects of game. However, the question has to asked why didn't Australia capitalise on the advantages created by their early strong scrums and newness of Anscome once he replaced Biggar. Do they as players have to be told to play such strategies but somehow Australia became more dysfunctional if anything. I didn't see that result coming

[@pleasurering1]

Rugby league clubs pick off all the cream of the crop. No other nation has this dilemma!! What’s the point in having all the structures in rugby…when you have no cattle!

[@gallowglass2630]

Well ya even in england the stronger code is union.Ireland doesn't have to deal with that either it has to compete with gaelic football ,hurling and soccer ,but the skills are very different to rugby

[@homonaledi640]

Is this the same Matt Williams who got sacked as Scotland coach after winning 3 out of 17 tests?

[@gregorybaillie2093]

It's NOT the coach. It's the board. It will still be the board in yet another 10 years. Time and time and time again we've blamed the coach and zip has changed. Wake up. Anything else said is about self interest including the commentators here. SACK THE BOARD and sink some money into the kids like all other great rugby nations have done.

[@ABStudioProductions69]

I personally think the Wallabies lost on purpose just to see Eddie kicked out - oh sorry "resigned" - his agenda was "I've been fired by England, I have a gap year, Japan is looking for a coach after the world cup - Dave Rennies been fired, let me take a $$$$ gig with Australia for a year, screw it up, get fired or resign and blame the ARU and get more $$ with Japan who only want to maybe make the 1/4 finals in the next world cup - such a loser

[@jamielocke3783]

Not one comment on how well Wales played, typical bias commentary!!get a grip guys - shocking

[@naughtynightlifeasia857]

How can you leave Foley, Quade Cooper and Hooper back in Oz? Crazy.

[@worldallycat]

Didnt mention Wales one time. Too arrogant to give the opposition any credit. This oanel is terrible

[@FijianFala88]

Eddie's chose an inexperienced wallbies side. It's an embarrassing wallabies side. Shame on Eddie.

[@Bugart18]

Like how there's not one mention of how good Wales were. LMFAO classic always under mining Wales. We're used to it and we're winning it all

[@dennism5731]

This is the same Matt Williams who nearly did an “Eddie” on Scotland a couple of decades ago. Glad we got rid.

[@theofilusbouwer3430]

Matt Williams "Ding dong the witch is dead" 😂😂😂 yeah mate you ranked 9 th in the world mate

[@LarryFogarty]

superb analysis

[@daysofmkty3029]

Hooper should have been there

[@moes786121]

Oh yes Matt Williams and Australian rugby 😂😂😂

[@Ballas56]

Good to see MW eating humble pie - he's done that lots in the past.

[@hankgoldenshaft]

As a kiwi I feel Australia’s pain. Kiwis have also seen their national side take a beating due to mismanagement, poor coaching, maintaining status quo, and vastly improved opposition. Hopefully we both can get back our mojo, and I’m predicting the ABs will get it back when we demolish Ireland in the quarterfinals. But all jokes aside, if the ABs beat Ireland in the quarterfinals it will be a huge upset, and I wouldn’t be putting any money on it either.

[@ablewilling2778]

🤔 the ABs have literally won the Rugby Championship for the last four years in a row. The Springboks still haven’t wrestled the Freedom Cup off NZ… who have held it since 2004… and the Bledisloe… even longer. So 🤷‍♂️ 🧐 🤔

[@hankgoldenshaft]

@@ablewilling2778our standards as NZ fans are delusional especially with teams like France, Ireland and SA playing such dominant rugby

[@ablewilling2778]

@@hankgoldenshaft ummm… you realise that South Africa is in the Rugby Championship right? (The tournament they haven’t won for the past four years… where NZ have been too good for them… including this year)?

[@hankgoldenshaft]

@@ablewilling2778 what are you say is true. But South Africa only care about world cups at the end of the day and their results prove this

[@JamesWilson-ts5xk]

This World Cup has been very difficult as an aussie fan. But I don’t agree with blaming a coach for everything that goes wrong with the team, he is definitely a keystone of the team, but let’s be real. These players didn’t just start playing rugby. When teams do well coaches, get accolades when teams do bad coaches get vilified I think it’s easy commentary blaming the coach for the outcome although in this situation, there is definitely a large part of responsibility on the new team, which was Eddie’s decision, but if Australian rugby has been crap for 20 years, which I definitely agree with then someone has to have the courage to make major changes and Eddy made changes. Albeit at at a very difficult time for a World Cup performance. Onward and upward wallabies!

[@GRIFF22]

They failed to mention the most obvious point...that was a team who wasn't playing for their coach. Aussie players clearly don't want him!

[@rickster5120]

Matt WE William's...1 week he's irish next he's Scottish finally he's an Aussie

[@jasdhillon9200]

Great Analysis. There was no "dog" in Australia. They did not lay their bodies on the line. They did not win one ruck!

[@jasonstechman5841]

Should have kept Dave rennie

[@somenobody8599]

Throw your hat in Matty you're well able mate

[@walkaboutdavo]

EJ has to go after that performance.

[@dazeng4633]

Jones doing to Aus what he eventually did to Eng. A stubborn fool out of touch

[@sean.butterworth]

No cohesion = coach is responsible.

[@2011hwalker]

England RFU decision to fire Eddie Jones so close to a World Cup will never be questioned again. Jones is totally toxic when he encounters a losing streak. Happened to England in 2022, has happened to Australia in 2023.

[@sampedder98]

The decision to fire a head coach 9 months before a World Cup should always be questioned. That goes for both England Rugby and Australian Rugby. Jones had dropped the ball, but with less than 1 season to coach the team, what did anyone expect? Borthwick will face a similar dismantling in the quarters. Blaming coaches only gets you so far and ends up in a football-like culture of swapping out managers. We need stable decision making, and neither England or Australia have enjoyed that for a while now.

[@jeffbarbour2194]

Clearly the appointment (of Jones) has been a failure. The coaching of the Australian team has also been a failure. One must now consider the future of both the appointor and the appointee to be up for considerable discussion. Both the Australian rugby playing fraternity and the public deserve a better outcome.

[@patsyparisi2620]

Dave Rennie is laughing hard.

[@Perrie-j6z]

Eddie is just a great assistant coach no more

[@colinmeehan791]

Same with Fozzie.

[@admiralbenbow5083]

I and a lot of other Poms were convinced that we would be the laughing stock of RWC 2023, then you lot turned up, so thanks for that.

[@Natedawg38]

I know a lot of people hate matt for whatever reason, i actually quite like him and feel bad that as an aussie he had to witness that disaster of a game

[@jordancurley995]

Me too I don't understand why Matt gets the stick that he does I feel really bad for him

[@pixelpotato4874]

Hi Dave Rennie 😂😂😂

[@tonyalways7174]

As a neutral what I saw was just a worse version of Australia as it was under Michael Cheatah. Lovely expansive passing and movement but no punch and no bite. Cross the gain line get into a great position then either fumble it or just run out of ideas. Last night there was no on field leadership that I could see but it’s lovely to see flowing running and passing although sometimes an ugly boring win is better. The early decision to scorn 3 easy points and go for the corner with a garbage kick followed by a lost line out summed that up for me. Blame Jones if you want for last night but he was asked to do the job so I’d probably be aiming arrows elsewhere to fix this recurring mess.

[@Andrew-yb1uv]

Wales rack up another win 😊

[@marco69tits]

Not a lot of praise for Wales there

[@damionneranginui6546]

I'm glad I'm not the only one to think this.

[@diap727]

People need to put a little more respect on Eddie Jones name

[@michaelodonnell824]

Rugby doesn't NEED Australia. Rugby does need teams that can compete at the highest level. In the 1970s, despite their "history", Manchester United were demoted. English football didn't shout "the First Division (what the highest level of English domestic football was called for a long time) needs United". Teams rise and fall, and are replaced by other teams. Prevent that and you weaken the sport. One of the real, unspoken issues with Rugby is the absence of Promotion and Relegation. We have this concretized at international level with the very fake "Tier 1" and "Tier 2" designations. But it is also present in the current English Premiership and built in to the structure of both the URC and the Rugby Championship (interestingly, having dumped the South African clubs, NZ and Aus Rugby "allowed" both Fiji and Samoa/Tonga enter teams into "their" Championship - wonder if they are having regrets now?). The only "domestic" club championship that has always insisted on Promotion and Relegation is the French... and they are dominant in European Club Rugby...

[@AL3X2580]

Embarrassing from us. I’ve supported the Wallabies through a lot. But for the first time ever I’m turning my back on them, they should be ashamed

[@SpuddersSpud-ps6dd]

Australia cannot play the "beautiful attacking play" they once did as the game now wouldn't allow for it. They would get crushed trying to play that way. France is another team who used to play open running rugby, as did Wales. It's an attritional arm wrestle now played by enormous players, and then the mass interchanges allow for more brutes to be wheeled on.

[@rodeo4786]

Yeah as neighbors we know the wallabies of old. the aussie battler never quits outside the bokke once our toughest rival. congrats wales onward

[@Stowerslemalu]

Well the beautiful attacking was actually built in New Zealand

[@twpsy634]

Being an oldie. I remember the beautiful game being brought to New Zealand by the 71 Lions, managed by the incomparable Caerwyn James ...a true rugby genius .Every rugby mad kid wanted to be Barry John.

[@darrellw.matodes6898]

Australia is a shade of themselves...made Wales look good

[@grimmytg1]

lol 🤡

[@michaeldethierry5901]

Are you for real the game I just watched Wales had it all over the wannabes😅😮😢😂😊

[@bannaubrycheiniog1329]

Portugal should get a bonus point win against this australian team

[@Cumberland_swasige]

I thought Wales were good value for the win and played well but they didn't need to do anything really special. I don't think you can say Wales wanted it morebut they seemed much more together as a team and definitely more structured.