Leaving Eastern Orthodoxy?

All good things....
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[@JUJUisKARMA]

Leaving ? Never…..👎 ❤❤❤

[@simonslater9024]

Leave your man made orthodox CULT

[@tonylewis9167]

Church Shoppers always eventually keep shopping wherever they land at the moment. It's a problem with Protestantism having so many denominations and so many doctrines. I used to be Protestant for 40 years. I need the Theosis that Orthodoxy teaches. Other Churches are lacking on that point.

[@simonslater9024]

You have the holy Catholic Church. You have 48,000 protestant CULTS NOT denoms. You have the orthodox CULTS. There’s NO salvation outside the holy Catholic Church because it’s the ONLY CHURCH.

[@locksmith9498]

Thanks for the video. I am a Swedish-born Eastern Orthodox since 7 years. My perspective as a non-American convert to the EO is a lot different than what you stated. I converted in 2017 in a Swedish-speaking parish under the Serbian Patriarchate. This parish has long since closed its doors. An attempt was made to transfer Swedish-speaking parishes to the Antiochian Patriarchate a few years ago. There were subsequent problems since the bishop electus, an archimandrite, got himself involved in shady business activity. He was later expelled from the country and ended up in an old calendars group. COVID delayed the whole process which eventually fell apart and the various parishes ended up under different jurisdictions. Right now we have to travel 350 km return trip to go to Stockholm. Unfortunately, Swedish is used only once a month and Russian/Church Slavonic for the rest. The Paris Exarchate closing down meant that our priest had to go look for a jurisdiction that could take us in. Strangely enough, our Bulgarian bishop is now in New York, USAS on the other side of the Atlantic. I thought we were in Europe. Were there no Bulgarian bishops in Europe to take us in? Apparently not. 150 meters down the street sits the Greek Cathedral under the Patriarch of Constantinople where the Metropolitan resides. He is a Metrolpolitan som he should be our bishop but he is not. Sweden is full of Orthodox bishops all claiming equal jurisdiction of the same land area, something thing I think is a clear violation of canon law. The Greeks use the Greek language whereas we use mostly Church Slavonic. These two parishes use different calendars which means that they are not celebrating the same feasts, fasts, persons or events OR readings for any given day. When the Greeks eat Christmas dinner we still fast. That's unity for you. We cannot celebrate the Nativity of Our Savior on the same day but celebrate it twice. My parish has existed for 400 years but is still not using the language of the land. There are other parishes in Sweden of course, most if not all cater to the specific ethnic group. Each use their own language. Very few use the language of the land that the people of the land can actually readily understand. Still, these parishes have been here for at least a generation if not more. My daughter was baptized in the church in 2021. She can hardly understand anything what is prayed and/or sung. In Sweden we have Greek Orthodox, Georgian Orthodox, Bulgarian Orthodox, Serbian Orthodox, Romanian Orthodox, Russian Orthodox, Finnish Orthodox, Antiochian Orthodox, Ukrainian Orthodox. Most of these care not predominantly for the people of the land since many do not even care to have the church service schedule in the local language. I have been to Athos twice, visited Valaam, the Kiev Pechersk Lavra and several other monasteries in Finland, Cyprus and Greece, had many a conversation with monks and nuns. We have seen many wonderful things few see and had great blessings from these wonderful encounters. I was even a lay reader in church in the beginning of my journey the first years. As beautiful and rich as Eastern Orthodoxy is, I still feel is is schismatic. It is a union of separated ethnic national churches. This is the result of the schism with Rome. Eastern Orthodoxy is not an entity that can claim to be the universal church. It is therefore with good conscience that I need to convert to the Catholic Church. Eastern Orthodoxy is falling apart since there no jurisdiction to deal with schism or control doctrine. We see schism deepening by every year. We see the divisive issue of female deaconesses creeping in. We see a Great Council of Crete in 2016 which took decades to arrange but essentially did not fix any of the issues that need to be adressed. We see disrespect for Constantinople with the old man almost being in house arrest. And we see zealots still, after 2000 years debating how converts should be received or focus on that St Porfyrios recommended married couples to cense the room and pray together before making love. Strangely, same guys mean we shouldn't readily pray with the heterodox which apparently means only lighting up the incense in my case. I am not living in America, hopefully things are a little bit better there. As a Swedish convert, a dummy who is not a polyglot nor a linguistic genius, things are not still not cut out for us after 2000 years. I thus cannot say that Eastern Orthodox is the true church as an entity. This country was never Orthodox in the present sense of that word. There are a few supposedly Orthodox Viking graves from the 900s that me and my 11 year old daughter of course could visit and tearfully weep over. We could ponder the days when men were truly men with big beards and the Orthodox were truly Orthodox in my native land. Ah! Such times we had. Such times! Oh sweet sweet mystery! Or I could convert, which I am doing soon. Still many will get angry, saying it's all my fault. Like Greta Thunberg some may possible fret: - How dare you?! (How any Orthodox could revert back to the heresy of Protestantism is beyond me.)

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@locksmith9498 What are you converting to?

[@normadaly7506]

The saints endured awful storms and fires and conflicts. It's essentially Christ we follow and confession Communion so central which are mysteries, beyond apologetics and intellect. Alot of KZbin orthodoxy dismays me as the pride is awful.... Boastful apologetics etc. The cross is awful.... Always awful, that's what we're in the middle of. Our instability and Christs rock like order and mercy. God help you and us all.

[@KillerofGods]

In my city we have multiple Orthodox parishes nearby. Originally there was only one inside the actual city, but they only spoke in Greek. (At the time.) Many people didn't like having it in Greek so they set up a mission type thing and arranged to have it set up where they could eventually open a new parish in the antiochan church if they grew enough. They eventually met the requirements and formed a new parish.

[@locksmith9498]

I notice a lack of understanding and disinterest for those outside the ethnic group who do not happen to understand the foreign language. Do the Orthodox bishops care for the native heterodox in the land that accepted them? I see far too little interest and gratitude from the foreign leadership whose churches we have de facto allowed in our land. Many times I feel like a foreigner in my own country. Some may even question the efforts to use the Swedish language since some may even judge it 'unholier' and 'common' than the church's lingo. How do they think Eastern Orthodoxy will spread then? They must realise Eastern Orthodoxy is not universal and not even capable of being so. (Recently, I was in Spain and learned that they had built a Russian Orthodox church. Really? Why do we need 'Russian' Orthodox churches in Spain? It's an immigrant church. They even had language classes in Russian!) Oh the nerve of these people! Russian Orthodox church in Spain. Am I the only one sensing the cognitive dissonance in that concept? It's clearly not THE universal church entity but only a part of a conglomerate of local schismatic eastern church bodies. Do they assume that all locals (the Spanish people) will learn 'their' language first? Even my hardcore Southern Baptist wife realizes clearly that the Orthodox are the schismatics from the mother church in Rome. It's perfectly obvious seeing how it is spread nationally/regionally in the world today after 2000 years. And then many Orthodox are at the same time fiercely anti-ecumenical and calling others heterodox left and right yet not willing in practice to spread the good news outside their own little club of mutual admiration. And what little there is of formation seems to come from a handful of new Athos saints to whom they cling to zealously. Most severely, many grossly misrepresent and deeply mistrust the Western/Catholic church and treating it like it's the origin of all evils in the world. Even Orthodox saints like St Maximovitch spread misunderstandings about Catholic dogma, like so many others even the clergy does not even bother to read the Cathechism of the Catholic Church to find out what the Church really teaches.

[@gillianc6514]

I really feel the pain with which you write, but I am not convinced running to Catholicism is the answer. Firstly, the ecclesiology in Holy Scripture points to the Orthodox model. Consider the 7 Churches in the Book of Revelation. Where is the unity under one Bishop? Each church is regional and has its own bishop/angel and its own peculiar problems and heroisms. Each Orthodox jurisdiction is likewise a wobbly mess with real issues about staying on the narrow path. That is the nature of the Church. Our unity is in Christ following in the tradition handed down by the Apostles (all of them, written and unwritten tradition) . It is when we try to do our own thing that everything goes wrong. Peter has a special place amongst the Apostles but nowhere does John the Theologian, the Apostle who knew Jesus best, think that Peter somehow had authority over the other Apostles. Also the role of papacy has evolved over the centuries, and popes contradict each other all the time. Consider the contradiction over ecumenicism between Francis and Pius IX. There is no unity of doctrine in Catholicism and people just drift till they find a priest or congregation which matches their views of the church. Trust me, I come from a Catholic background. When my husband died, I wanted a full Old Rite Latin requiem, but I knew that many of my Catholic friends would struggle to attend as they hated Latin and only received the Eucharist in the hand. And actually these modern Catholics were far more supportive in my hour of need than my Trad friends, so I compromised with the Requiem, a Latin novus ordo, versus populum. There are massive divisions in Catholicism. People are at each other's throats and only mix with like minded souls: the pro and anti Medjugorjie clans, the Fatimaniacs and those who don't care about Fatima, the Trads and the Charismatic Catholics, Irish Catholics and Poles or Ukrainians . Actually the Poles and the Ukrainians really don't like each other (from my experience). Also, what about those who think Francis is the Pope and the growing numbers believing that he is not? These people can not reconcile and will only listen to media which endorses their point of view. Regarding the state of Orthodoxy in non-Orthodox countries, it is a real mess but that does not mean that Orthodoxy is not True. Should Orthodoxy have an answer to the ills of migration which are always caused by politics? Should it have a perfect system to cope? The Catholics are more organised because of their centralisation, but that doesn't make them right. They have found an answer to a political problem, not a pastoral problem. Your choice is to either emigrate to a country where there is only one jurisdiction (I am in Romania but am Irish by birth), or stick it out at the church that is nearest to you come hell or high water. The national churches in the traditionally Orthodox lands are not paradise either. They are utterly infiltrated with US 3 letter agency guys, just like they were with Soviets 50 years ago, there are forces that wish to break Orthodoxy because if it were united it would break them ...... and here is my final point. Surely the mess in Orthodoxy is proof of its validity? The devil will ignore anything which naturally leads to perdition..... but he will work his socks off to destroy the faith of those in Christ. What you have to decide is which mess is the one Christ truly wishes us all to belong to: Catholic or Orthodox? There is only one mess which truly hangs together through the energies of the Blessed Trinity, one mess which has never made forced conversions, one mess which has such rich and endless supply of martyrs, one mess where monasticism and hermits are still thriving, one mess where the faithful are as much a part of the Liturgical life as the priests........ Pray for your Bishops, and grace will break through.

[@abigailwillis1656]

Congrats on your new little one! 😊 And thank you for taking the time to make these videos!! I have been inquiring into Orthodoxy for about a year and a half and I discern this precise phenomenon, especially at the parish I recently started attending after moving. Went from a small ROCOR, half cradle/half convert parish to Antiochian parish with 80% converts, and a large one at that! I am young, grew up going to non-denom/Protestant evangelical churches, just graduated with a college degree in Philosophy and Theology. I know I have a lot more to experience and learn, but I feel that God has led me to the Church at this time. Whether to become Orthodox, I am still discerning, as I want to take my time with the decision and still have many facts and opinions to consider. Lord, have mercy, it is really challenging. 🙏 I don't want newly baptized Protestants into the Church to merely "play" Orthodox or simply think they have joined the "winning team" among many equally viable teams. And as much as I am drawn to the fact that Orthodoxy seems to be conserving truth that are being squandered in our modern society, I am concerned with whether or not I believe I am truly becoming a part of Christ's Body, not joining a community with similar politics. I think acquiring the mind of the Church entails much more than that. I am an extremely analytical and, I would say, logic-oriented person. But, I don't want a watered down sales pitch of why Orthodoxy makes more sense than the other options; I want to be shown a Church that truly and radically changes people from the inside out, relentlessly challenges us to put on Christ, and preaches the same gospel unto the ages. Please pray for me, Roman, as I pursue the Way, the Truth, and the Life. 🙏🙏🙏

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@abigailwillis1656 You have my prayers! My suggestion is to set aside the theology (sort of..."theology" actually has a slightly different meaning in Orthodoxy) and read the lives and counsels of some modern Orthodox saints. You might find them helpful, or you might not, but they will definitely give you a good taste of Orthodoxy as it is. I suggest "Wounded by Love" by St. Porphyrios.

[@abigailwillis1656]

Thank you so much for the suggestion and for your prayers! God bless🙏

[@KillerofGods]

Have you been to a monastery yet? I enjoyed my first brief visit. You can go to distance yourself from the politics and see if you enjoy it or not.

[@abigailwillis1656]

I haven't been, but will certainly try to! It's been on my bucket list for a while...

[@annalynn9325]

I’m not exactly sure what you mean by the politics. But. I came into the Orthodox church in an EXTREMELY liberal city, and the congregation was also very liberal. I was never open about being conservative either in that town or that church. St Paisios had a very humble life and minimal education, never even became a priest, not well-read. But he wrote many letters in response to people’s questions and problems. Definitely not an academic or intellectual Blessings to you in your search

[@EricCastleman]

There is a lot of coping in the comments, so I'll add a bit of perspective to help. I was Orthodox for 16 years. Perry Robinson was my godfather. I spent three years as a catechumen, and read a lot. I was made a catechumen under Fr Josiah in 2008, and was officially received in the Greek Orthodox church. Prior to becoming Orthodox I was headed towards Catholicism, and it was Catholic apologetics that broke my protestant framework. I won't do a exposition on why I left, because I don't feel it is a good place to platform my issues with Orthodoxy. What I will say is that this video is at least intellectually honest and fair, so I appreciate the aim here.

[@tedvalis6071]

The worst "jurisdiction" is the GOA! Just look at its head....Elpidophoros and by extension Bartholomeow. Check my name, you see that I am of Greek descent, but by the grace of God, my family was never part of the GOA. As a consequence, I am obligated to steer converts to Orthodoxy who have come through the Antiochian, the OCA or ROCOR in such a way they don't go off the deep end. I make it clear to converts that the perfection they are looking for in the Orthodox church is NOT the definition of perfection that they have held in their previous life.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@tedvalis6071 I have had great experiences in every jurisdiction...and bad ones.

[@tedvalis6071]

@@TheRomanOrthodox That goes without saying but I'm sure you understand what I mean. An Orthodox phronema is what is to be cultivated. Heart knowledge over head knowledge. The GOA is the worst for cultivating and sustaining this phronema as long "hierarchs" such as Elpidophoros are in charge and allowed to continue to be in charge by the wealthy (spiritually pathetic) powers that are to be found there.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@tedvalis6071 I actually think the Greeks are really good at the "phronema," even if some of their bishops are not so great at following it. And yet, we find the lack of an Orthodox mindset in every jurisdiction, including the Antiochians, which is one thing, thanks be to God, that Met. Saba has been trying to correct.

[@DoIoannToKnow]

Good news for you: The homeland Greeks have been noticing the decay of hierarchy for the West that has been brought to the attention of even the Greek head of state, Mitsotakis. They are in action trying to remove these hierarchs. I am in an opposite situation - Slavic American but Greek Jurisdictions are the only ones in my nearby area, so its all I have. So I hope the glaring issues can be resolved here soon

[@thatsabignomydude]

@@TheRomanOrthodox Even though I and my wife have both left the EOC, I would have to agree with you regarding the Greeks. I do hope and pray that Met. Saba has many long years to steer the American jurisdiction. Also, very good and fair video - I hope that more internet Orthodox take on your tone and presentation. God Bless!

[@i_assume]

Usually people leave because of some hard saying, that gave them the ick, or personal incredulity. People choose something that fits their taste disregarding for where the fullness of Truth is. So in conclusion, people leave because they take personal taste over personal salvation.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

I think there is a lot more complexity and similarity to these individuals' stories than just that.

[@CalvaryandChristendom]

As someone who left Orthodoxy just recently, I find this a little true but also a huge amount of gaslighting. Any time I find something genuinely wrong in rthodoxy, you just call it prelest or say I don't want the extreme asceticism. Like I said, there is some truth to that; but there are genuine problems in Orthodoxy like remarriage, denying the atonement, not submitting to the Papacy, etc.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@CalvaryandChristendom I actually agree with you. These are huge decisions that involve complicated theological and spiritual struggles. That is certainly true of my journey to Orthodoxy, and I think we can extend the same understanding to those who leave. I hope you find your way back, and most of all, that you are doing everything you know how to do to remain close to God.

[@Christophershame]

Imagine search in your whole life, finding orthodoxy and then going in submitting to the Pope. Oh, Lord, let it never be.

[@censoredanon8928]

That's literally me.

[@CalvaryandChristendom]

@@censoredanon8928 I just left too. Planning on doing RCIA. What made you want to leave?

[@censoredanon8928]

@@CalvaryandChristendom A lot of reasons. Briefly I'll say that the Catholics have a better put together theology, the Catechism is really accessible as a way to understand what they actually believe. The rosery and Marian devotion were a big draw to me, I began praying the rosery and that helped convert me. The Latin understanding of iconography as instructional, compared to the East's particular (and exclusive) way of viewing it.

[@CalvaryandChristendom]

@@censoredanon8928 I think the Latin use of iconography is certainly more historical (used for teaching and decoration as opposed to worshipping through)

[@EricCastleman]

Lets be fair, this isn't an easy game to sift through. We live in a day and age that most Christians throughout history were not faced with, which is having to sort through massive amounts of text and history. Heck, most Christians throughout history were not even literate.

[@gillianc6514]

I do wonder if having an Orthodox catechism or indeed catechism classes may be part of the problem. It gives a very Catholic/Protestant understanding of the Faith as being a series of tenets or dogmas which must be adhered to. As an outsider to American Orthodoxy, I am wondering if instead seekers should be encouraged to live the faith first rather than discuss or be instructed in doctrine. Would it not be more Orthodox to be given the following (1) a family in good standing who could take the prospective convert under their wing and provide a witness to the lived experience of Orthodoxy (2) an initial prayer rule to follow and guidance about the fasting etc (3) insistence in attending certain liturgies and learning the more common prayers. Then we have prayer, fasting and community and doctrine can follow. Also I think it is really important to stress to wannabe converts the apophatic nature of the faith: the Divine Darkness, if you prefer that phrase. We know that we can't know and through this comes humility and patience and without these any progress in the faith with be like those plants which spring up rapidly but die away again through lack of good soil. I was a Catholic know-it-all. Straight away my Orthodox spiritual father spotted that pride may be a fault of mine and rather than engage in debates and talks about spiritual matters, he insisted my journey into Orthodoxy would be done away from the intellect and done through standing in prayer, mostly outside .... Orthodox from the feet up! I felt like my feet had to take root in the rich soil and only then would I be slowly transformed into a healthy plant.

[@normadaly7506]

Thank you.

[@mrjustadude1]

I think you have a lot of good points, but I don't think the issue is catechism class. At my old Parish they would pair you up like you suggested, even after they had been brought into the church and I think that was very helpful. But I do think that some sort of class is very helpful.

[@censoredanon8928]

I think the most interesting thing about your story, is how Catholic it could be.

[@orthodoxphronesis]

I have to say, I do find that there’s this view that we as orthodox should be focusing solely on Protestants and Roman Catholics… yet, most of our population are agnostic and atheists, or nominally “Christian”. I was an atheist before converting and I felt I truly found true Christianity. It would be nice to see a focus on the fact that anyone who is not Orthodox is outside of the Church, period, and all of us need His healing, and this healing is found in the One Church, the Orthodox Church. I also want to add that we, as Americans, should pay great respect to the Russians, Greeks etc.. those cultures who gabe us true Christianity.

[@normadaly7506]

Thank you.

[@homelesbillionaire]

what is good price to pay for icon?

[@homelesbillionaire]

custom

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@homelesbillionaire It varies so widely. Just go with quality.

[@hanng1242]

1:50 So...everyone but GOArch? RE: Rigorism - I'm just too worldly, but I try to spiritualize my lack of ascesis with something like, "Thank God I cheated on the fast because if I had kept it, I would have become proud." See also: skipping Good Friday services in imitation of the Holy Apostle Peter.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@hanng1242 Well, among the more cradle Orthodox jurisdictions you have the Ukrainians, Romanians, Serbians, Carpatho-Russians, Macedonians, Greeks, and Bulgarians. We have a beautiful, diverse church.

[@hanng1242]

@TheRomanOrthodox Ah. I forgot about ACROD. Well, if you thought that the 3 (or 4) major American jurisdictions were already pretty hole-in-the-wall, you have seen nothing yet. Besides, aren't quite a few of these part of the OCA in their "ethnic" dioceses?

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@hanng1242 No, many of them are duplicated in the OCA's ethnic dioceses, but have their own structure.

[@Ignis.lex.ignis.gratia]

I liked and subscribed because this is mature Christian advice ☦️

[@chuckironsight3914]

luckily for me im a blank religious slate, i went to a few non denominational churches , knew from the start it wasnt for me, attended an orthodox church today and i think im going to keep going. i didnt even know orthodoxy was a thing until 2 weeks ago, i thought church was church. i need an adult place, not a childrens show , those non denoms felt like an episode of Barney the dinosaur, i dont need Kyle screaming into a mic " hi guys, do you love Jesus?!?!?! " " Yeaaaahhh!!!"..but i dont know much about anything, just how i feel

[@IosuamacaMhadaidh]

I understand you. I never felt right in a protestant church. Always felt awkward and cheesy. Not real worship but some weird show.

[@Orthoindian]

I know you didn't mean to mock but that's hilarious 😂

[@chuckironsight3914]

@@Orthoindian I hope it didn't come off as disrespect , probably more of a lack of understanding on my part

[@simonslater9024]

You have the holy Catholic Church. You have 48,000 protestant CULTS NOT churches NOT denoms. Then you have the orthodox CULTS.

[@simonslater9024]

It’s protestant CULTS NOT churches. Only Jesus can found a Church the holy Catholic Church which is also his mystical body of Christ on earth.

[@rigavitch]

From my experience the catechesis is woefully lacking in UK. I imagine it is the same in many places...

[@paulhagen1002]

when you describe the process of priests reconverting to protty, it sounds like they are not using a rigorous process of discernment, there are numerous theological/philosophical defeaters for the undergirding of both catholicism and prottyism. If the other systems are disqualified and Orthodoxy isn't, then it makes discernment far easier.

[@williamsmith5049]

So... You're saying they leave because they can't let go of their western mindset? Makes Sense.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

I don't know that I would call it a "western" mindset.

[@williamsmith5049]

@@TheRomanOrthodox to clarify, the definition I'm using for it being a western mindset is the intellectual experience of the church rather than a mystical experience.

[@silveriorebelo2920]

still making an anti-Latin argument? - confusing contemporary Western culture with mysterious catholic influence?' if it is the case we will have here a new argument to belong to Orthodoxism...

[@1KMPLX]

I looked into the Orthodox Church and can’t get past their view on the Eucharist, and the Mary stuff. I don’t mind veneration though. I can wrap my head around that. There was another thing I couldn’t square as well but it isn’t coming to mind right now. I wanted to be Orthodox. I’ve also heard that many of the things the Orthodox believe don’t date back to the beginning of the Orthodox Church. I do think the Orthodox Church was the original church, but they’ve added stuff onto it later (sometimes much later). If there was an Orthodox branch that was more like the first and second century church I’d probably be more attracted to it. I’m obviously not a scholar, but that’s how it seems to me.

[@orthodoxphronesis]

Read Blessed Theophylacts commentary on the Gospel to St. Matthew.

[@yanaegg]

The Western Rite may feel familiar to our Catholic brothers and sisters. Orthodoxy does not necessitate Eastern-ness. ☦️

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@yanaegg To me, it was familiar, but ad hoc and fell into the "uncanny valley" problem.

[@iakov1906]

The western rite is spiritually dangerous. I would not advise anyone attend parishes that are "western rite"

[@iakov1906]

​@TheRomanOrthodox it's very ad-hoc. It's not a formulation of an organic development within an Orthodox nation/people group

[@iakov1906]

​@@TheRomanOrthodox ^

[@joshbanker8743]

Eastern rite is better because it all stems out of the hebraic tradition. Orthodoxy isnt greek or anything else. What is actually happening is a hebrew reality that has been shared with us.

[@prometheus5770]

Cradle Eastern Orthodox now catholic here

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@prometheus5770 What led you out? Was it anything I mentioned in the video?

[@prometheus5770]

@@TheRomanOrthodox Nicer liturgy, clear vernacular speech not monotonous archaic singing, pews, organ music. Reasonable ecclesiology as opposed to EO exclusivism. That Jesus clearly made Peter the head of the apostles. Logicality of monarchy in the earthly church (priests under bishops, bishops under patriarchs, patriarchs under who?). National churches make most of their medieval kings into saints. Like Serbians with Stefan Milutin who had 5 year old wife. Or Georgians with Bagrat III who invited his cousins and slaughtered them only for preventing threats to his power (they didn't even have a conflict). Sorry for bad English

[@supertigerroadtrip5193]

What tradition of Orthodoxy were you coming from?

[@prometheus5770]

@@supertigerroadtrip5193 Georgian EO

[@intreuefestundlachen1883]

The ethno-centrism is my biggest gripe as an Orthodox convert. Along with the Ecumenism (which is why I left the Rome/SSPX position!) And I agree you need to live Orthodoxy to understand the Fathers. I have been reading the Latin Fathers and have been pleasantly surprised how well they compliment Orthodoxy. Has really given me a better understanding, particularly how well the Dogma of Uncreated Grace/Operations answer the Pelagian heresy.

[@JohnAlbinus]

Could you expand on your point about Uncreated Grace/Operations answering Pelagianism? I'm coming to Orthodoxy from the SSPX/TLM background and would love to read about it!

[@prometheus5770]

Latin Fathers believe Filioque

[@drstewart]

@@prometheus5770 Also, Peter as leader, not just another.

[@SAHOVNICU]

National Autocephalous churches is heretical nonsense. Nowhere do we find in tradition nor Ecumenical council where the ecclesiological heresy of Autokefali was used nor defined. The concept of National Autocephalous sects is a condemned heresy of Phyletism. There was no such concept as National Autocephalous sects in the early Church. Autocephaly is just another heretical innovation from a laundry list of heresies from the schismatic Eastern Orthodox.

[@mikaelrosing]

When you joining the Protestants?

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@mikaelrosing Lol, watch the whole video!

[@snowps1]

I've been Orthodox for 17 years and I struggle to stay sometimes. I married a Greek guy and converted into his Greek church. I was pretty much the only odd-ball convert at the time. Orthodoxy healed my fractured Protestant heart. But a few years into it we got a convert priest and that was the end of my content Greek ethnic Orthodoxy. He took me right back to my Protestant years and has me messed up in my head to this day about Orthodoxy. He was so by the book that he messed up a lot of people.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@snowps1 I think it is possible to be strict without being "by the book" or, in other words, to break the rules by simply following one's own interpretation of the rules. But I also think we have to be careful about either putting too much of our faith in individuals, on the one hand, or, on the other, concluding that someone else is wrong just because he or she tells us that we are wrong. Either way, we are relying on a human interpretation (ours or someone else's).

[@snowps1]

​@@TheRomanOrthodoxThank you. I found this video very, very helpful. I do best when I don't listen to or read Orthodox media from a lot of different sources. If I just stick to my church and my priests, I do much better with my Orthodox life.

[@andreimoldovan7112]

@@TheRomanOrthodox kzbin.info/www/bejne/pIGTmX2YqbSVqtUsi=RA7BeJnVoNWFG6U8

[@censoredanon8928]

My story, I was raised a Protestant, Reformed Presbyterian, really small denomination, the CREC. I was practicing all up until 21 or so, you could say that I wasn't very faithful before that. I didn't open up and decide to begin searching again till 2020, I wanted to stop living badly and fix my relationship with God. I wasn't interested in other denominations at first, I just went to Bible study and one of my friends was Orthodox, one was Catholic. I met a girl, she was Orthodox and I moved to be with her and then began going to an OCA church with her. It opened my eyes to another form of Christianity that I wasn't familiar with. I never thought of God in this way. I began a prayer rule and a day hasn't passed where I have not prayed since. I was there from December 2021 to June 2023. I met lots of converts there. I was an enquirer and surrounded by many others interested in Orthodoxy. I talked and tried to understand the Orthodox way. I got familiar with Mary and comfortable with devotions to her. Though, I will say that I thought the way the Orthodox interacted with icons was really weird. Even after I understood the explanations behind it. I didn't really know Catholicism at the time, but I had asked around in the parish about it, eventually someone told me to read 'Two Paths', I bought it, I read it and thought it was stupid. Exaggerating stuff about Catholicism. I decided to give the Catholic view a chance. I bought some books and started reading the Catechism. This really started to convert me interiorly. I wanted to know what the faith meant, I wanted an explanation, everything about Orthodoxy had this opaque exterior and mystic interior, I felt like I was getting gatekept out essentially. But Catholicism, it was as simple as cracking open a book to understand it. Reasonable. Made sense. I remember I had this perception that Orthodoxy was the crown jewel and nothing Catholic could compare, then I went to Mass with a Catholic friend of mine and feeling at home, seeing a lot of similarities between this and Orthodoxy. While all the more just making sense to me. At some point, a friend sent me a rosery, I began praying it and really that was it for me. I was pretty leaning in on Catholicism in December of 2022 and finally decided to make the jump and go to RCIA in June of 2023. As for April 1st 2024, I am a fully accepted Roman Catholic. I am thankful to God for this. As for some final hurdles for me, the book Pope Peter by Joe Heschmeyer convinced me of the papal claims and that the first Pope was indeed Peter the Apostle.

[@MarkTurner-ff8cz]

Now attend a TLM to experience the traditional and purest expression of Catholic liturgy

[@homelesbillionaire]

most oca priests have m div bro

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

Okay....

[@joshbanker8743]

When people make videos saying they left orthodoxy I laugh.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

I don't.

[@ChaceRice]

Its not funny why the walk the trail of hell, its pretty fked up to laugh at that

[@kevinmacbearach8629]

All these "why Orthodoxy might not be for you" videos always seem so far off the mark.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@kevinmacbearach8629 If that is what this video seems like to you, it is far off the mark. There's no gatekeeping here.

[@kevinmacbearach8629]

​@@TheRomanOrthodox It sounded like you took the average convert Protestantism experience and called it the Orthodox experience. To say Orthodox apologetics is lacking and not providing is mind boggling. Half the internet these days is Orthodox apologetics... And to say that Orthodoxy is exclusive, and dismissive of the other groups is strange since first thing is we learn the trisagion prayer that the Holy Spirit is present in all things. So that's not even 10 mins in.

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

@@kevinmacbearach8629 (1) Nope. I talked about a particular subset of converts to reverts, and I also specified the limitations of my view. (2) The problem is that apologetics is lacking nuance and serious engagement on the issues, at least as it is being presented. (3) And I didn't say that Orthodoxy is dismissive of other groups either.

[@AS-np3yq]

Just be greek-catholic

[@TheRomanOrthodox]

Lol, nope.

[@theowilmot1841]

Do you guys think if you say “be Catholic” enough times he’ll revert to Catholicism? 😂

[@iakov1906]

@AS-np3yq catholics worship the Islamic and jooish false deities. Nobody wants to do that