Legendary Technics SL-1200GR Turntable VS Denafrips Venus 2 & Cayin Cd players

#hifi #audiophile #amplifier #stereo #Amplifier #speakers #turntable
Sound demo for Technics SL-1200 GR vs Denafrips and Cayin. • Sound Demo for Technic...
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Gear used in this review :
Technics SL-1200 GR turntable
Denafrips Venus 2 DAC
Cayin CS55CD cd player
Cayin CS100CD cd player
Mcintosh MAC6700 Integrated amplifier
Silverline Sonata speakers

[@ThomasAndStereo]

If you want to check out the Cayin cdplayer but cannot find any info, email Richard at [e-mail], Sound demo for Technics SL-1200 GR vs Denafrips and Cayin. kzbin.info/www/bejne/nonVaaGQeM1jrNU Check out my other channel video on the Wilson Sabrina and the Galion TS120 kzbin.info/www/bejne/lZ65iISYoK6Hlc0 and also please be careful of scammers pretending to be me.

[@clementng7718]

Stereo Thomas? 😂👌🥂

[@jasonmehlhoff8877]

Thank you!!

[@renesklangwelt4393]

if viewers can't find any info about the Cayin 100, they can watch this new video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/kGnaYnapiZyEapI

[@renessoundlife235]

sorry, the Cayin CS 100 video in English has the following link kzbin.info/www/bejne/o6TClXikf9dootE (the first link is for the German version)

[@myronhelton4441]

Equalizers are great, but if your room allows you to put your speakers in exactly the position where the speakers need to be then that if effect makes the equalizer totally worthless, because equalizers make distortion, just like tone controls on amps. Cars have to have equalizers, because the cars small invironment doesnt allow your speakers to be placed in the perfect positions. In stereo, the lesser the connections, wires, or wiring are in the chain, the better the sound. IC'S or integrated circuits has too much wiring in their circuits stereos, Class A amps is an example, amps that allow you to bypass their tone controls is an example.

[@chelillingworth9466]

I really feel like you missed the most important part. I really find that my love for vinyl is not about it being warm or about it's frequency response. It is about authenticity, that feeling that the instruments are solid, corporeal, and have air around them, and this all happens in a deep soundstage.

[@WhatTruthIs]

I recently pulled my 1981 Technics SL-1200 Mk II out of long term storage, adjusted the Grace Ruby cartridge installed on the head and cleaned up the turntable. Then I put on The Tubes "The Completion Backward Principle" and enjoyed the sound put out on my Boston Acoustic A100 speakers connected to an Akai 2020 receiver. It was great! "Talk to ya later!".

[@phonatic]

Bought my SL-1200GR back in 2018 and really like it, especially because it has native 78rpm, highly versatile and excellent built-quality.

[@TNPFan]

Comparing an analog Legend to modern digital technology is pure genius, Thomas! Please give us more!! 🙏🏻👍🏻

[@jwinstonh1926]

I enjoyed this episode, good job as always. I very seldom make comments on KZbin video. It’s fun listening to folks talk about their audio experiences. The listening experience is very much based on personal taste and one’s ability to hear. I’ve always had great ears and I absolutely love most music, especially Jazz. I started listening to great equipment in the early 70’s, actually 71, thanks to my father. Great story but long, maybe another time. At that time it was all records and cassettes. All analog, what a pleasure. I moved to New York in 1980 and discovered CDs not too long after. I could not wait to switch from records to CDs. I always been somewhat of a collector - sold records in my early days, partly so I can collect the music I loved. I have a huge collection of music on vinyl, CDs and hard drives - hundreds of records (I’ve given away collections of various artists over the years), over 6,000 CDs, and approx. 20 terabytes on hand drives. I am trying to figure out how I can come back in another life to listen to all the music I own 😇. All of this to tell you that on good equipment I find it difficult to to choose a favourite source - turntables, CD players or streamers - for me it’s always been about the music. I have my favourite systems to listen on and that truly depends on my mood. However, I currently own 3 CD players, 2 turntables with 6 different cartridges and 2 streamers. I enjoy music on all of them. As music lovers, we all experiment. I do not discriminate as to where equipment is made. I currently own many amplifiers - integrated an power, a few preamps, a few DACs. I have heard them all. My friends and I was responsible for most of Brack Electronics sales when they were around - I brought many of my friends there to by equipment. I worked on Bay St. and spent a lot of my lunch hours there. The equipment I enjoy listening the most is a ESound Platinum series CD player. It is as warm (I know, that word) but you know what I mean - it is as warm as my Thorens TD 318 turntable, with that clarity that CDs bring to the table, played through a Harmon Kardon HK 990 (brilliant when set properly), using Polk Audio . I also love listening to my Teac CD player through my Denafrips Pontus ii and my Pyramid 9 Speakers. I also own a Denon AVR - 5803, If you know that receiver, you know it’s a monster - still my surround sound baby. Like children, they all tell a different story about the same event - the music. And I love them all for that…I know, this is longer than I expected. But that’s what we do, we share.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

wow you write really well and you should comment more. Thanks for sharing and I enjoyed reading it.

[@jwinstonh1926]

@@ThomasAndStereo Thanks, Thomas.

[@joeythedime1838]

My friends and myself agree that "very good" vinyl recordings are tough to beat for creating a special musical experience. Paul McGowan's Octave Record's vinyl pressings from DSD masters are an amazing experience. We have done A/B comparisons of some of Octave Records recordings on vinyl, downloaded DSD albums and CD media... The vinyl just sounds more "magical". For CD's I run a transport into my digital source/DAC a Cary Audio DMS-700. For vinyl I have a Clearaudio Concept Turntable/Concept MC Cartridge & Satisfy Carbon Fiber Tonearm that feed my T&A PA3000HV integrated amp with the T&A PA HVMC phono module.

[@paulmorris1225]

Same with the Newvelle records. All digital and sound great. I doubt they're as good as the Octave ones, but I've yet to hear an Octave.

[@feloniusdrunk]

Your stories always provide insight, so I like to listen to them. I think your strategy of reviewing products that surprise you in some way is also good. It's like turning up hidden gems, which is always worth a listen.

[@riccitone]

This was great, and right in stride with many (I would say) that are curious about great possible results with CD players/dacs. Yes, PLEASE review the smaller player. Would be great to know how it sounds on its own, and then maybe into the Venus as a transport to see if it comes close in any way.

[@BasicYTUser]

Definitely want to see the cheap cd player review

[@mr.george7687]

I bought a Technics 1200GR a few months ago when I saw Steve Guttenberg sold his $10K turntable for a technics.Couldn't be happier w/ it. Was using a Thorens TD 125 w/ SME tonearm. The Technics blows it away, no contest. I love both vinyl & Cd's. To me, it depends on the recording whether vinyl or CD sounds better.

[@jonuiuc]

I think Steve sold his for a $4k 1200G, not a $1700 1200GR. But both are less than $10k!

[@GodfreyMann]

When you switched from Thorens/SME to Technics what changed and did you lose anything that the Thorens/SME gave you but isn’t the same on the Technics? The reason I’m asking is I’m trying to decide between Thorens or buying a modern deck. FYI, I’m interested in trying to recreate a more natural sound.

[@aceofspades6667]

I have the same thorens tt wity upgraded arm and cart. I found the cart the biggest change in sound on that setup. Which did you have ?

[@mr.george7687]

@@jonuiuc You are correct. Would of bought the 1200G but, it was a lot more$$$.

[@mr.george7687]

@@GodfreyMann Biggest change was in the bass. It was tighter & faster. The Thorens sounded muddy by comparison. Also on the Technics was the dead background noise. Another big plus was the ease of changing of cartridges. I have 6 different ones & set up on the Technics takes 1 minute! I at first was going to use both (One MM the other MC) but after comparing them I could not go back to the thorens. I would recommend the Technics. Built like a tank, easy to use & set up.Will last the a lifetime.If I had the $$$ I would of went for the 1200G just like Steves!

[@mrddcass6540]

For me, the vinyl magic is in early pressings of 60s and 70s records, but there is a lot of inevitable noise. For modern recordings there is probably a more narrow difference between the digital formats and vinyl pressings. Thanks for the great videos!

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Thanks for sharing!

[@carmy1878]

Thomas, i did the same exercise before buying my Technics turntable. I used an APL Dac as comparison and a Nagaoka MP 150 cartridge, I can say that i strongly prefer the sound of the turntable in all ranges. Instruments look also more real and with more air. APL is way better than Denafrips and differences were clear even to walls. PS: I have done a blind test so no bias.

[@shanestephenson8423]

Hi Thomas I love your stories don't ever change doing that it's part of why I subscribe to your channel. I am 51 years old and am a child of the 80s. I'm a vinyl guy, I always was and now I am more digital than vinyl. I have a Gryphon audio Mikado signature CD player and love it. I definitely don't think CDs are irrelevant in fact if you listen to what's being said there coming back into fashion, and I'm not surprised. It's all well and good to have a streaming service but there's something lovely about owning your own media. I guess I like all kinds of media both analogue and digital, but the convenience of digital certainly is attractive and the quality is improving all the time with digital components.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Thanks, it made me feel good reading this comment. I guess I should continue telling stories.

[@markn1090]

CD's are still great, streaming is convenient, but you don't own the music it can disappear at any time. A great value CD player is the Rotel CD11 Tribute, the DAC is very nice. I compared it to my built in DAC in my Parasound 200 pre and found the built in DAC of the Rotel CD11 to be superior.

[@farbschlachterei]

There is nothing stopping you from buying music on file. And in jazz, there's a growing number of artists who don't offer CD or vinyl pressings. I have records and I play them too. But I won't buy anything just because it's a record unless it's one of my "must haves". For example, I have the Ring der Nibelungen/ Karajan, published in 1970. 19 records in a box. And I also bought the files that I play a lot more often.

[@spvlinn9009]

Apple to apple, both Naim and Linn own top the line digital players surpass their own top CD players for sure. Naim 555 CD and Linn sondek CD12 players are not bad players at all.

[@piglingbland8666]

@@farbschlachterei There is nothing stopping you from buying a CD.. Why pay for air (a digital file) when you can buy a CD for nearly the same price? And your CD won't disappear when your hard drive crashes or your cloud storage mysteriously vanishes. And by the way Karajan was a National Socialist aka a...

[@farbschlachterei]

@@piglingbland8666 OK Brainiac, I've responded to the claim about not owning streamed music. One can. The redundant backup of data is neither a question of time nor a question of costs. I'm not going to debate the question of whether CD is better or worse than vinyl or streaming. I do not care at all. I have records, CDs and music files. Everything in good time. Now to Karajan. This is a very nice topic, because you're breaking open doors. Especially because I'm a big fan of Hellmut Stern, who had to flee Berlin with his parents in 1938 after the Reichsprogromnacht (Kristallnacht), had to spend his life in China in poverty for a long time until he was able to go to Israel and from there in 1961 he returned to Berlin to take up employment with the Berlin Philharmonic, conducted by Karajan. Stern knew that Karajan would not become a member of the NSDAP under pressure, but voluntarily. And even twice. First time in Austria. And then, when the NSDAP was banned in Austria, he migrated to Germany and there again voluntarily became a member of the NSDAP. Karajan's letters to his family also showed that Karajan was obviously an anti-Semite. It is undisputed that Karajan benefited greatly from the Nazis and watched with open eyes as Jewish members of the philharmonic orchestra were removed. Stern became 1961 an orchestra board and the first violinist and dreamed throughout his life of performing with the Berlin Philharmonic in Israel, because Israel rightly did not allow Karajan to conduct in Israel. It was not until 1990, after Karajan's death in 1989, that Stern's dream came true. What I want to tell you Personally, I think Karajan's appointment as conductor was a wrong decision. That should not have happened. Only it is not changeable. But from 1956 to 1989 the Philharmonic consisted not only of Karajan, but of up to 128 musicians permanently. If you count the many retirements and newcomers, there were many hundreds. Plus the guest musicians. Musicians such as Jehudi Menuhin played for the Berlin Philharmonic under the direction of Karajan. One cannot and must not dismiss and banish the performance of all these musicians, including many Jewish ones, by pointing out that Karajan was a Nazi.

[@farbschlachterei]

@@piglingbland8666 And if we want to talk about Nazis and the inglorious role of the post-war governments, then we shouldn't forget the USA. Arthur Rudolph, the German rocket researcher and ex-SS officer, worked for NASA from 1961. Arthur Rudolph was instrumental in the construction of the "Saturn 5" launch vehicle. He emigrated to the United States in December 1945 and became an American citizen in 1954. Rudolph managed the V2 rocket factory in Thuringia. A third of his 60,000 forced laborers from the concentration camps died by the end of the war. And the CIA knew about his past. The German Nazi rocket engineer Wernher von Braun made a career at NASA. With "Operation Paperclip" the USA had brought the prominent Nazi scientist into the country. The former SS man Tscherim Soobzokow found refuge in the USA - although he had informed the CIA about his past with the SS when he arrived in the States in 1955. During the Cold War, Soobzokov served the CIA as an anti-Soviet operative.Only in 1985 was a Jewish group able to put an end to this injustice. Otto von Bolschwing, who, as an employee of Adolf Eichmann, played a key role in organizing the deportation and murder of European Jews during the Nazi era, became a CIA agent and received American citizenship in 1959.

[@albertosilva1076]

Thanks Thomas for another objective review! I'm truly convinced that cd players are much better sounding for the dollar than they were 15 or 20 years ago. Obvously this should be linked with the dac evolution so far in my opinion. I had the chance to grab the 2021 release of Creek CD Voyage and I'm very astonished for the GREAT sonic results I'm getting ... on par with my fabulous Gamut CD3 and better still due to the great flexiblity of the digital inputs and excellent filters! The worst now in analogue reproduction are the not the great machines around, it's the new vinyl that is so POOR quality! Shame on the companies who mistreat the consumers that bought vinyl for a life!

[@billwillard9410]

Good video and topic. BTW, no one calls the Technics the one thousand two hundred - it’s always referred to as a twelve hundred. I bought my first SL1200 mark 2 in 1987 and just bought a GR. I rotate from records to CDs to streaming, depending on my mood.

[@timbre7999]

Very nice video and very interesting! As a longtime analogue (vinyl) player, I can say that I have been more than just a bit impressed by good CD players. And yes, I would say that CD players most definitely still have a rightful place in High-End audio today. NAD still make some very musical and affordable CD players, as does Rega.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Well said!

[@erwindewit4073]

I agree! I still have my NAD 5000 budget CD player. It’s still really pretty good!

[@timbre7999]

@@ThomasAndStereo Thank you 🙂

[@EnemyofCredulity]

For me, CDs are still relevant. I use a Moon 360d from Simaudio. The DAC is a Burr/Brown 24 bit 192kz

[@fearwolfbrewery5014]

Never been a vinyl guy. Recently I ripped all my cds to flac files. Got a raspberry pi4, allo digione and smsl vmw d2. Have not looked back. This combination are levels better than my cd setup.

[@RedSinter]

Yes, please on reviewing the CD Player... I still like CD's and have a small personal collection.And have yet to move into streaming. Though it is likely not far off.

[@soumyajitdeb3943]

I do most of my listening on a clear audio performance dc tt with a maestro mm cartridge. After going through dozens of dacs, the closest to this analog setup has been an AMR DP777 using the philips chip. The cd spinner is a hand built one based on the philips cd pro2m transport connected over BNC. A close second was the reimyo dac.

[@jakobgooijer]

Due to artrosis in my hands i was forced to sell my dear Clearaudio . I had to search for a new cd player as well because my historical Sony 30ES died too! Finally I chose for a Audiolab 6000CDT transport ( easy to use with my hands) + a Denafrips Pontus II. On the streaming side I bought myself a new Bluesound Node N130 with USB output to feed the DAC. Although the classic fun and beautiful cover art of Vinyl disappeared, the lively sound of being there is changed, I can say that this totally new setup opens new ways of listening and discover music. The Audiolab,in all it's modest appearance, is a golden shot! Waiting for a Denafrips Hermes to get rid of the last digital glitches....🙂

[@greenbeginner3353]

Yes! I enjoy and “like” your stories. Please keep them up.

[@carolineleonard8214]

Yes CD is still very relevant because the media is so ubiquitous and currently great value compared to achieving an equivalent vinyl set up, as noted by other suggestions in the comments. As my wife attests, it is also sooooooo easy to use and care for compared to vinyl. We use a top end Cyrus CD transport into a Cyrus QXR DAC. Whilst some consider it slightly lean, Boy can it extract the detail, create soundstages, separation and all the other things desired in audio playback. It compares very well with transports in much higher price categories. I have heard the Esoteric gear and it is very much WOW in every sense. For us, to achieve a perceivable improvement we feel that we would need to consider something like Luxman or Esoteric (and yes we have auditioned them). Great post once again, please keep them coming.

[@ptg01]

Great track !!! Curious, were you able to ensure that the VINYL and the CD are exactly the same release (i.e. same mastering, same label etc ) ? That's the only most fair way to compare I think...

[@ThomasAndStereo]

I have to check but both were given to me by Mr. Vintage from his collection.

[@mrpositronia]

Thanks Thomas. Nice quick-fire review.

[@nespodzany]

I still love playing CDs. I use a Cary Audio CD 306 SACD player. I chose the 306 due to its ability to upsample when sending the Redbook CDs to a DAC. It has a few tiny quirks, but if anything were to happen to it, I would try to replace it with another 306. I did just upgrade my DAC from a Chord Qutest to a Denafrips Venus II. The Denafrips are still being burned in, halfway there, but I am excited to hear the differences and the more analog-like sound you referenced.

[@basstylelex]

I'm a vinyl collector and a DJ more than an audiofile. I collect "rare grooves" that aren't usaully released on CD... (Rare and lost records, unusal but groovy stuff) So for me there's no comparing. But when you want sounds a SL1200 is always a great choice. I play my records on a radio show on a Swiss national radio. Tell me if you want a FLAC of on of my shows. Shurely you'll discover some music. Cheers

[@montycaps8235]

Great video!! I have the SL1210GR and that Denon cartridge. I ended up putting the Denon on my Thorens TD1500 but I agree your thoughts on the sound. Interesting headshell choice. Retry the test with a AT18 Headshell and a heavier counter weight. You be surprised what that does for that Denon on that table. I have a node 2i. Been wanting to take a deeper jump into digital and find a nice Dac for it and also add a CD player. Can’t beat the price of cds. Haha!! Keep up the great content!! Cheers from the Prairies !!

[@montycaps8235]

@@DG-ie5ip the Td1500 doesn’t lift up. It fully manual like the technics. Not sure I read that about the 1200gr. It’s always been manual. I had to use the 30 gram counter weight. Purchased from eBay I think. That will allow you to balance the arm properly. I ran both table for a while but kept the Thorens and sold the 1210gr. The tech is a fun player, very well built and easy to use. I enjoyed it. I picked the thorens in the end based on sound. It’s more open sounding and clearer among others things it does better.

[@scottbaylor6215]

I prefer CDs over any other medium. It just sounds better to me. I do listen to vinyl and stream on occasion. I use a Schitt Modi 3 DAC and a Sony CD player as the transport. I use either my Realistic STA-730 or the Cambridge CXA-81. Speakers are either the Definitive DA7's or he Polk R200 bookshelf speakers. Just depends on the day. Keep up the good work.

[@goahead3995]

As an audio nut for 30+ years who's into CD transports and DACs, I never got into turntables. I never understood the science behind it. How can turntables cost up to tens of thousands of dollars? It simply spins the record. I can believe a fancy needle can make a sonic difference, but an expensive turntable? Ironically, I just got the Venus II DAC last week! It is connected to Cambridge CXC Transport. It's a good combo.

[@erwindewit4073]

It's funny, I also wondered about that. Same for a CD player.. A DAC perhaps, but what's a CD player supposed to do? Just spin the disc, read the data... Why would some Esoteric CD player be SO fantastic? So I tried. And I don't know why (both for turntables and CD players), it does seem to work that way. Man, the dCS Verdi (when it worked properly) SACD transport was FANTASTIC... Okay, and it's transport needs to be replaced every 7 years, and there are none left. Oops.. Still, the CXC is good right? But those vintage Philips / Marantz players, hmmm...

[@latheofheaven]

And, in reply to your comment about CDs. I've ALWAYS preferred vinyl, BUT... I also have a fairly extensive CD collection over the years, especially of releases that are not available on vinyl and for my car. And, as I stated above (below) with the SMSL DO200 set up properly, oh my, the 7000+ FLAC albums on my HDDs are sounding very nice 😊

[@carolineleonard8214]

Great review, honest. I've heard the Luxman, and own Cyrus Amps and a CD transport, the previousgeneration. The Luxman is easily at the highest level, world class, especially with their latest amplification. IMHO they can stand toe to toe with anything in the world, although a mortgage is required to buy it all. I know i sound bonkers, but if the Cyrus and power supply can get you close then they are relatively...... a bargain. You must hear the new i9 with power supply, now THAT is really good and can compete with serious ultra hifi amplifiers. Once again a great post please keep them coming.

[@pala23mj]

I use both…. TT is a Technics SP10 MKII with custom plinth. 12” Jelco with the Denon DL-103R. EAR Phonobox. CD players is a Sony CDP-X7ESD ES and the DAC is a MSB Platinum Link. I love them both!!

[@thirdkey9]

Thanks for doing some freewheeling comparisons. I sometimes enjoy doing listening comparisons with vinyl & streaming as my present fav platforms though will surely get back to over 2K CDs in my storage someday (and once I get a needed transport). The Streaming leads to Vinyl dynamic has certainly resulted in some reduction of my disposable income 😆

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Yes, it was all for fun and I wish many people who have understood the intend.

[@thedirtydutchman9749]

Vinyl is KING

[@chrispdx5755]

Please review the Cayin Mini-CD MK2 !

[@Gez492]

I'm a mainly analogue guy and used to have 3 SL1200MK2's as a DJ they were game changing. Have heard the GR with a ortofon 2M Black, it makes sense as a good mid range turntable with huge practicality as you can change out cartridges very easily. The GR could not get anywhere near my much modded Linn LP12 with an Audio Technica Art9 moving coil cartridge though. It's not even close but I still have a great deal of love for the Technics.

[@mpw621]

I have a Vintage LP12 as well and sounds great. I can't even listen to Cd's after a few minutes. Even old Lp's with surface noise sound great on the Lp12 along with my Tube amp/pre-amp components.

[@yardleylfc]

I'm still using my Linn akurate Streamer Dac. Better than the new £5000 naim streamer Dac - For, which i recently auditioned it against. I have lovely sound . It feels so nice. Dac is nearly 9 years old . I am using mission 770s on Roksan blak amp. Thank for you review. I love vinyl too.

[@mariopenzo]

Good timing on the digital vs analog video Thomas. After the MoFi debacle the topic is in everybody's mouth.

[@abrahammartinez3524]

Thanks Thomas, the comparison should be with a SACD Player, compare a CD vs turntable could be misleading. regards

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Yeah, SACD sound more analog.

[@andrerichison4426]

CD is still relevant to me. I use them. Much quicker to play than a record and now that I have a better gear set up is good. I use cambridge CXC transport into a very nice Bitfrost 2 DAC

[@pagornchait1471]

Phono preamp plays major part for turntable sound, similar to DAC influences on sound

[@Nephilim-81]

The Cyrus CD i is my go to player. Absolutely love it. Highly recommended.

[@garykarczewski6678]

I still think CD will be around for quiet a while I use an Oppo 203 for all hard digital media via HDMI to my Arcam AVR850. I am wondering if an external DAC would sound better with the Oppo to the AVR80? The new Technics SL-G700 would provide an improvement in CD playback from what I have been hearing per reviews. I have a GR-1200 as well love that as well.

[@sylvio1980]

Hi Thomas, great content as usual ! That little Cayin Mini CD player really caught my eye and it’s something I’ve been interested for a while. I’d love to see your review of it, but in case it doesn’t happen, what are quick thoughts on it ? Thanks

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Well it is on the smoother side so if you have a bright system, then it would be a good match. However, best I spend some real time with it before giving my 2 cents. It does have i2s output so you can use it with current DACs if you don't like the sound. You can email Richard to ask him for more info. See first comment for his email.

[@sylvio1980]

@@ThomasAndStereo great, thank you for responding !

[@davecroft2991]

Definitely, enjoy your "stories" because they provide context for a better understanding of enjoying music thru different mediums. I would value a review of the $400 cd player. I've considered buying a cxc Cambridge transport and a audiolab 6000. I recently purchased the buchardt amp and s400 mkii. Right now I play music thru an old google audio dongle with optical output into the amps optical input. Your video made me realize that I have options to consider other than those transports I mentioned, because I could enjoy digital music via the amps internal dac or invest in a cd player with it's Owen that could match the music and speakers a bit differently. I might like the ones you mentioned, maybe not so much the price but the tube rolling possiblity is neat Also, I really like this video because I have hundreds of records and have considered upgrading my turntable. Thanks Thomas!

[@AusGanesh]

Hi Thomas, I do accept CD outperformed both internet and records. I do own the famous Ayon CD-5s, check out the reviews for your self. But time has past and I was on the hunt for new CD player. Ended up with Denafrips Terminator 2 with Denafrips Avatar, and I also tried PS audio SACD transport (current version) with Denafrips Terminator 2, using I2S. But to my ears the T2 with Avatar sounds best. So sold the PS audio and purchased Audio Research Ref6. Another thing like the CD’s you have to look for albums produced from analog master to make a difference, most of the lp’s today are cut from digital master like the CD. So why go to expense and time consuming media like lp’s? I have owned many Cayin CD players and amplifiers in past. Cayin is good quality and reliable and use top quality parts. Thank you for the video. Oh bye the way use streaming most of the time, but if I come across interesting artists I purchase their CD, they still sound the best.

[@wm2357]

I still enjoy both cd player and turntable. I like fiddling with them and owning my music.

[@peronnikbeijer213]

You should compare the turntable with the CD player and the DAC with a phono Pre-amp

[@TheNaka9]

Great video Thomas! I have been waiting to see something like that for ages. I am a CD lover, and although I have a good turntable and tube phono stage, my preference goes all the way to the silver discs, for: sound, availability of titles, practicality and pure fun. Like so, I have 5 excellent cd players, 2 cd transports and 2 dacs. The stars of the group are the Denafrips Pontus II dac, the Musical Fidelity AMS cd player, amd a vintage Parasound BCD2000 + DAC1100HD transport and dac combo. I have several thousands of CDs and Jazz is the majority of them. In a well balanced system the CD sound quality is amazing and pure joy. Perhaps sometimes vinyl can improve one or other aspect of sound reproduction, but for me it is not worth all the hassle. If you can Thomas, I urge you to listen to a good vintage and once-expensive dac from Wadia, Theta or Parasound... they are now affordable and you will be surprised by the performance.

[@eugeniodinardo3881]

Thanks again Thomas I appreciate your reviews. Did you use a phono amp, or power supply for the SL 1200GR? If so which one, thanks

[@vukkragulj1010]

Studer A730 - considering myself very lucky that I had a chance to listen to it and compare with other high end cd players, and afterwards managing to get one. Amazing, magical, most analog natural cd player I ever heard. Wish someone would compare it with a nice turntable, since I'm not experienced with turntables.

[@DigitalJCT]

Interesting, thanks for sharing your impressions. I got myself an Sl-1500 about a year ago. My first turntable. I figured it was plenty enough to get into the vinyl game. Very happy with it so far. I hear you mention the Simaudio Supernova. In other of your videos I believe I saw a 340i integrated and I think you have owned one of their power amps as well. I would really like hear your thoughts on Moon/Simaudio sometime. Cheers!

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Moon for me has the old and new sound. The W5 poweramp and super nova I had before are the old sound, smoother. The 340 is the new more analytical sound.

[@cberg07]

I would love a review of the cayin mini cd mk2 with the new denafrips ares 12th-1 specifically since they both have the i2s connection. It would be great to see someone test that combo

[@Eugene737]

I would probably own a cd player in my system but as someone who already ripped cds to my unraid and/or synology server before diving into this hobby, I already had a process to locally stream my music. I haven't experienced vinyl in my system and only briefly from a dealer. So when you mention the venus 2 for those that love the vinyl sound, I am still lost as to whether I should get it or the holo spring 3 for my DAC upgrade.. Review of the venus 2?

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Venus 2, soon.

[@blastfromtheeast]

Great video. CDs are, for me will always be, the best format to listen to. I listen on Marantz CD6006 for the moment.

[@rw3915]

Keep up the good work Thomas. 👍

[@Staybrown11]

Great video Thomas! What phono pre did you use? Think of the turntable as your CD transport and the phono pre as the DAC. I don’t know what to compare the Cart too, but the better the cart, turntable and phono pre 🤩🥳🤯 I use an Audio Research PH 8 with my technics GR and I cannot get enough…but I do love my Denafrips DAC too.

[@mpw621]

Interesting that around 1985(?) Cd's were supposed to be the new medium of the future with a long life. Today those same CD's can be bought at thrift stores for a 1.00 USD. The current digital medium is now streaming. Lp's have lasted through the Cd era and into the future. The only problem is that new Lp's are expensive but even used one's at lower prices sound great. Thomas get a vintage Linn TT, maybe Mr. Vintage can lend you one!

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Oh he does have a few nice turntables.

[@mpw621]

@@ThomasAndStereo Well see if he has an LP12 already setup to try in your system...Play Pink Floyd's "Dark side of the Moon". Anyway I love your Vids!

[@jamesminotto8036]

Thomas, I use a Yamaha CD S1000 as my CD player which plays SACDs. No DAC as I wish to keep the SACD capabilities. MY turntable is the 'legendary' Technics SL1210 MK 2 with a iFi Zen phono stage. In comparative listening the Technics is usually better in mid-range and bass. My amp is a vintage Yamaha CA 2010 playing through somewhat vintage, 1994, Acoustic Energy AE 2's. My cartridge is currently a Sumiko Moonstone and I will be mounting a Grado Platinum 3 later this month. I really enjoy your insights, humor and how you do not take yourself seriously. Well done! JM

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Thanks James for the comment and appreciate it.

[@CanberraProtest-dm6hu]

At the beginning of digital in the late 80s I found cassette recordings of vinyl sounded better than the CD. But now i find my Teac 2 x DSD recorder does a great job to record my vinyl. It only loses a touch of air and reverberation, but it sounds like the original record rather than a digital recording of a record. Older HD recorders from the 90's sounded like bad scratchy digital recordings with dry harsh trebles and with poor air and sound staging. I never thought digital would catch up

[@scottielambert9312]

I cannot believe that people still doubt the superiority of digital sources, in particular, cds. Vinyl is wonderful but there is no real contest here. It’s like a dual clutch transmission versus a manual transmission. The manual is likely more engaging to drive but it will always be slower. Always.

[@billfarrell4387]

Hi Thomas I am definitely in the vinyl camp and there is a definitely place for it as well as enjoying full albums at a time However there is definitely a place for streaming and CDs of which I have both at the end of the day it’s all about enjoying the music Take Care

[@gregoire8376]

Now ... Just think if you spent as much on a really good phono stage AND you paired it with this (or another legendary) turntable ... well ... you might buy the company. As I get older and widen my views on life, I no longer use the word "better"; I now use "different". There is something really heavenly about all the gear that is available today to enhance our collective listening pleasure. I am a vinyl fan first, have a good CD player and a cheap streamer that I use to screen the music / format of my purchases. All are different and enjoyable, once I settle in to the format and hardware. It is, as they say, about the music. Thanks for your great reviews!

[@gregorypatton360]

Id be interested in a review of that cayan cd player

[@playbackvintagehifihunter9669]

Hi Thomas. I hope you'll try some of the legendary vintage CD Players from Marantz and Philips. You may be surprised how good they sound 🙂

[@deadandburied7626]

I use a Pioneer PD-S701 CD player, a Fluance RT85N & Technics SL1210GR

[@christianjohansson8518]

Thanks for another great video! All analog listener here and if you like that record you should consider buying the Impex pressing of it, just amazing sounding. Keep up the good work and keep eating them noodles.

[@jonuiuc]

I may have missed it, what phono stage where you using? If its the phono stage in the MAC... I'm not sure how that stacks up to a venus. The Phono stage is like the DAC, and the turntable is like the CD player. (though admittedly the turntable/cartridge will have a bigger impact absolute resolution) The phono stage will impact the character and presentation though, kinda like a dac.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

I was using the build in phono stage of the Mcintosh. I don't have a better one.

[@markcarrington8565]

Hi Thomas, I have all three formats and love them all. I intended to use my streamer only to research music for purchase on record or CD, however, after my last upgrade I’m loving the streamer for its own sake. CD player is a modified Musical Fidelity A3.2.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Thanks for sharing!

[@contemporaryhomeaudio]

I mostly listen to my vinyl records. CD's are played through my Pioneer Elite BP player to a Nuprime DAC10.

[@danedes9297]

Call me crazy, but I now play my CDs through a CD transport into my laptop. I use JRiver media center with a bit perfect output. This is connected to a Denafrips Iris DDC and feeds the Denafrips Ares II DAC. This combination comes very close to matching that vinyl sound for those of us who crave that analog experience. For reference, my turntable is an Avid HiFi Diva MK I with an Avid HiFi Pulsus phono preamp.

[@gsherlock]

I've had an SL1200GR for about 3 years now but I've modded mine with an SME armboard from Ammonite Audio. I have an SME V fitted now and it sounds much less softer at the frequency extremes compared to the high end belt drive I owned fitted with exactly the same arm.

[@ganck1147]

For turntables, belt drive is still the way to go. I have tried several heavyweight direct drive turntables & they always sound flat & lacklustre compared to even the cheapest belt drive. There’s plenty of misinformation in the audio world. Listen & trust your own ears.

[@gsherlock]

@@ganck1147 I do trust my own ears. The belt drive turntable I had was an Avid Acutus Reference, a $25, 000 turntable. The SL1200 with SME arm just sounds better at frequency extremes and leading edges of notes. Pitch stability is better and with the SME fitted theirs little difference in soundstaging. Your experience is your experience, don't try to tell me what you think mine should be.

[@ganck1147]

@@gsherlock sorry i misread your earlier post. You said much less softer & i read it as much softer. Anyway, i always use same cartridge & play same LP when comparing turntables.

[@gsherlock]

@@ganck1147 That's the comparison I'm making, same tonearm, same cartridge same phono pre-amp = Technics better.

[@latheofheaven]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Mr. Thomas... You have *REALLY* been missing out on turntables my friend 😊 You see! There IS indeed a certain magic to analog, AND you don't necessarily have to spend a fortune for it. IF you have the right synergy, like everything else Audio, yes, then you can experience the magic. BTW, on my system of which I have sent you links and pictures, I must admit after basically despising anything digital for over 40 years, when I got my very first DAC recently, the SMSL DO200, I must humbly admit that especially with the AQ Victoria interconnects, it does indeed sound very good! The depth of the bass (with the Victoria's) and the layering front to back of the image is quite impressive. Now... You *DO* have to put more work into analog, but TRUST ME Mr. Thomas, especially when pairing it with tubes, Ah... Heaven... 😁

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Yeah, I should spend more time on it.

[@cnhhnc]

I use a Jolida Music Van MKIV CD player with four tubes (input and output and dual power transformers). It's a nice sounding unit, not too edgy, warmer and with a good bottom end (bass). Though I have a couple of vintage TTs, I don't use them much. CDs are my primary medium.

[@erwindewit4073]

Well, I use vintage stuff.. A Phillips CD960 and a Marantz CD11LE. Really goodCD players. I’ve only heard better from a dCS Verdi transport and a Pro-Ject CD-Box RS2T. Beautiful to see, feel, yea and it sounds fantastic! So normally I play a CD on the Marantz into the dCS Delius / Verona (click) combo. Streaming sounds a bit better using a Naim ND5XS as a transport into the dCS. But I also use a 1965 Thorens TD-124 restored and slightly upgraded. It sounds wonderful! Not as detailed, but so nice and perfectly timed and endlessly smooth. I love both really! I would like to try a Technics SL-1200GR once.. My weird experience it that the biggest structural difference seems to be the turntable itself, next in line the arm and least the cartridge. Sure, the type of sound can be tweaked with cartridges, and more high end is better, but in the end, the turntable sounded like it always make the biggest structural difference.. So I don’t have a preference. I love both!

[@jungtarcph]

Thomas, I love your content because your passion is awesome! But also because you normally don't spend time on turntables 😂

[@edverbeek6292]

Great comparison. Did you have the song played with the Denafrips in DSD format? Or streaming from a music provider? Qobuz or Tidel? All makes a difference, and if you streamed, the modem/router and use of a audio optimized switch also make a huge difference in my experience!

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Thanks, it was ripped from the CD onto my harddrive.

[@edverbeek6292]

@@ThomasAndStereo OK, Thanks for the answer. Can’t be worse than streaming 😊 (that’s what I do, though I know authentic DSD is the best)

[@eugenefudge1883]

I love my CD and vinyl set up. My CD set up is an audio 6000 cdt transport with a gustard x18 which cost me $1600.00 and the turntable is a rega P6 with a naganoka mp500 cartridge and an trigon vanguard III preamp cost $5000.00. I wouldn't say One is better than the other just different.

[@AN-ce1nd]

Well, on this subject I agree with you. Not because I own an original 1200 MK2 and a well broken in DL103R. I also do have a Denon DL 103R modified bySoundSmith but I haven’t tested it yet.

[@anythings215]

My CD system are Dcs Rossini SACD transport , Rossini clock and Rossini Dac. And my turntable system are Jr Jupiter and PassLab xp17 phono amp . These two systems are very different sounds , personally I prefer turntable as they sound so much warmer and realistic and natural .

[@MrJanfensten]

I was a CD guy. I still have 500 cd in my collection and still play them. When I got into vinyl I swore that I would’nt buy vinyl dublicates. But that is the way it went. Vinyl with a correctly loaded mc cartridge is more dynamic, more punchy, more fun. 45 rpm records even more dynamic, more punchy more fun. That Denon needs to be loaded with 100ohm to be dynamic. Is your McIntosh mc preamp setup to 100ohm ? Best regards :)

[@paulpavlou9294]

Hi Thomas, I still use both CD and Vinyl. My preference for convenience has been my JLTi modded Oppo 105 SACD/Blur-ray player which sounds fantastic still. I had been using my Denon DP55K turntable with Grace 707 arm. Which I have updated with a pimped out Goldring Lenco GL75 turntable with double platter, Syrix pu3 arm fitted with a highly modified Nakamichi MC1000 reference pick-up modified by the legendary Garrott brothers before they died. I prefer to listen to vinyl for critical listening only when I have a pristine record without the snap crackle and pop of artefacts/dust and scratches. I think that the vinyl is more organic and natural, but my Oppo is very hard to beat with a good recording on red book or SACD. I haven’t bought any component of the shelf in a bricks and mortar store for many years as there are many small specialty audio houses doing fantastic work to products like my Oppo that where 80% there. Great KZbin show and I like Mr vintage. Thanks.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Thanks for this comment. I actually had the Oppo 105 at one point, they make very good players.

[@darencooper409]

Curious what brand is the small slot loaded CD player sitting on top of the 2 Cayin CD players at the beginning of the video. I don't recognize it. Oops never mind just needed to watch the video further! 🙃

[@meganoid_9001]

The GR Is everything but legendary. It's been the shortest ever lived SL 1200 due to several bugs and technical inconsistencies recently tackled by using digital adjustments in the GR2. Before making a title, think.

[@budgetaudiophilelife-long5461]

🤗THOMAS … as you can probably guess I am only here for the stories because… All of these are out of my experience and budget 😁 it’s cool 😎it’s not a problem 🤗😍😍😍

[@Trump1776]

Hi Thomas, would you be able to comment on the difference between Esoteric CD player vs the Denafrips DAC , I understand it’s not a apple to apple comparison, CD vs DAC , but what the hack just give it a try , thanks in advance 🙏🙏

[@ThomasAndStereo]

I can't because the difference in performance of that system and mine is just too big. I have no idea what is the sound characteristic of each of the components in that super high end system.

[@Trump1776]

@@ThomasAndStereo , thanks Thomas 🙏🏼🙏🏼

[@bin.x]

I have to say it depends on what vinyl/file you played. I tried the Technics SL-1210MK2 + Ortofon mc5000 + Clearaudio and Cary Audio DMS-600. If the file 44.1khz/16bit, you can find some advantage from vinyl. But when I choose the DSD or 24bit Hi-res file to stream, digital wins clearly. The soundstage, the sound density，the quiet backgroud, I can't say vinyl better than digital. My AMP are willsenton R300 with new PSVANE CV181T2 + new WE300A replica and LUXMAN C900u+M900u. Speaker is the Harbeth SHL5 40th anni. I even tried some 1960/70 Collector's Edition Vinyl from some hi-end friends, although they were better than new version vinyls and my TEAC VRDS CD Player, but it can't campare with Hi-res files. Therefore, I may decide to buy a Teminator Plus 12th R2R DAC instead of upgrading the turntable chain.

[@James_Ryan]

Fascinating! I don't like analog-sounding stuff so I guess I should steer clear of these players? ;)

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Yeah, probably cdplayers like from Cambridge would be more your cup of tea.

[@orthosympa6993]

I'm really curious. wouldn't a cheap CD player with digital outputs paired with a crazy high end dac be a better (and much more versatile) solution?

[@a3marketing991]

I like using my CD player as a transport with my DAC.

[@GodfreyMann]

PCs, streamers and CDs playback the same files, what makes them different is how well they protect the delicate signal from electrical noise which can disrupt the timing of clocks. The human ear is very sensitive to errors in the timing domain. By the same logic, a cheap CD player will not have the quality components and design needed to protect the signal coming off the disc compared to a more expensive transport and therefore will not sound as good. I was auditioning some speakers at a dealer last month and suddenly the soundstage and stereo image collapsed and the instruments on my demo CD sounded quite different. The dealer had swapped out his expensive CD player (£1200) for a £400 player and the sound difference was noticeable blind within 10 seconds.

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Ah good question, some people believe transport makes a difference, some say it is just 0 and 1 so it should not make a difference.

[@ccaz1001]

The answer to this question is related to jitter correction. If your DAC has very good in built jitter correction, it is a waste of money spending a lot on a transport and you are far better spending your budget on the former. I’ve gone one stage further and ripped my CDs to a music server.

[@GodfreyMann]

@@ccaz1001 jitter arises due to electrical noise that affects the performance of crystal oscillators used in the clocks of the DAC, and moving your files to a music server doesn’t solve this problem. In fact, because CD is a more mature technology than music servers, a CD transport may well out perform a music server…for now. Clearly music servers are the future, but they’re only just getting started.

[@milesdufourny4813]

Use the edit icon to pin, add or delete clips.

[@derekrobinson4347]

Nice challenge Thomas, CD vs Technics 1200. I ripped all my CDs and use Tidal and Qobuz. I ahve not played a CD in about 5 years. One day I will do a test to see if CD sounds better than streamer but doubt I will play CDs due to inconvenience. I stream through out my house and on the deck. I listen to so much more music when streaming than I every could with CD so I think it had died the inconvenience death. Rather than use CD I will use vinyl and streaming. I have had some amazing adventures recording my vinyl and streaming it. That is probably my next fun project.

[@bizyz]

try hooking up a solution 760 dac to a denafrips cd player.the solution 760 costs 72 grand but you will get some pretty good sound out of that transport/dac combo.

[@fastamx069box8]

I have a $5000.00 THX DTS CD Transport and a vintage Marantz 6200 Turntable with an Ortiphon Black Cartridge. Turntables WINS, Hands Down...!! Great reviews... Never stop the Stream 👍👍👍👍👍👍 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🤣

[@Iam-mad]

Your today´s very interesting story came to the perfect time, because I´m in the search for a DAC with tubes for my old Philips/Marantz SD-players! The "problem" of actual CD drives, is the lack of "High-End" engineering in the drive itself, the modern CD-readers are flimsy and weak compared to those old CDM-1 or CDM-4 drives made of pure steel or aluminium cast with the smooth reading unit and it´s Schneider-Kreutznach lens. The technical "problem" of the CD is the frequency-cut at 20 kHz, wich makes the hights sound a bit "cool" or "artificial". Pairing the D/A unit to a class A stage with tubes result in a more "harmonious" sound quality, because tubes generate harmonic distortions above 20kHz. So I am in the search for a Tube-DAC (without OpAmps) to pair it to one of my vintage heavy CD boys. Is there any chinese Tube DAC in the league with the Cayin CS-100 that would be affordable too? Thank You for Your as always interesting vlogs!

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Well at one point musical paradise I reviewed was good but they no longer make it.

[@davidwald2938]

I have a Doge 7 with 6 NOS Telefunkens and 2 GECs. The dac is under 2k but you can spend alot upgrading the tubes.

[@tee-jaythestereo-bargainph2120]

Nice looking cd players , Its about time for me to buy another one Cayin is impressive having tube stage output or buffer ? Thanks Thomas Vinyl came have a soft sound

[@ThomasAndStereo]

Oh, no idea!

[@neps4th]

I enjoy listening to most anything you want to ramble on about.... whoops had to pause the microwave; almost forgot to add the bacon bits to my chicken fettuccine/alfredo. Don't spatter any on the UB52's or knock over the Q350's while listening to Thomas.

[@rotaks1]

Thomas, how do you know you are listening to the TT or the cartridge? Also, the vinyl pressing might matter. There are too many variables?