Lesson 10: "Japanese conjugation" myth busted! Also, potential verb form secret unlocked

[@ローラ-q2y]

LESSON 10- HELPER VERBS & POTENTIAL FORM 00:01- introduction 00:09- why it should not be called "conjugation" --------------------------------- 01:25- review of former helper-verbs --------------------------------- ●The potential helper-verb ☆01:51- え stem ☆02:09- helper verb る/られる 02:45- examples . ☆03:31- the two exceptions 03:47- the logic behind できる || just a side note ------------------------------ ●The subject of the sentence- review 04:51- the が always marks the be-ar/doer . 06:47- don't confuse the particles & they won't confuse you . ☆07:11- the subject of the sentence ---------------------------------- ●☆08:12- Ichidan verbs + exceptions -------------------------------- 09:15- finishing

[@hailhydreigon2700]

The best Japanese lessons on KZbin. RIP Cure Dolly ❤️

[@supershogun]

Why rip? Did she die?

[@AwesomeFelix94]

@@supershogun Unfortunately, yes.

[@Tamère353]

Where did you learn that from? Fuck I'm sad rn

[@willing_to_learn]

@@Tamère353 She passed away last year. Announced on her patreon by her helpers.

[@GregMcRegor]

Requiescat in Pace

[@steamline432]

Her teaching style and unique perspectives makes me feel as though she is not only a KZbin-based Japanese language content creator and not only a Japanese teacher, but a Japanese-language philosopher, and it makes me feel as one of her followers - a Curedollyist, if you will.

[@ZakkFromSource_JPN]

She most definitely was a philosopher, you can tell by some of the topics she brings up and how she radiates wisdom. She had such a great mind. It's criminal that she was taken from us so early... 😢

[@MariomasterNSMBHD]

The moment I realized that る can be treated like an ichran verb my mind was totally blown! Everything almost makes too much sense now. Thank you so much!

[@onomatopeira]

This is by far the best Japanese language teaching channel I know of on the internet (and I've searched quite a bit). Cure Dolly has an admirable intelligence that is clear in the way she explains things. But above all, what is explained is a "correct" way of apprehending the Japanese language, of grasping the logic of linguistic construction and the very philosophy of the Japanese language. It's a shame the channel didn't continue after Cure Dolly disappeared. Although many subjects and topics are addressed here, there would still be many more to complete the bouquet. For those just starting to learn Japanese, there are many subjects of study that will have to be learned elsewhere and from other sources. But, at least, the fundamental bases are very well explained in this channel.

[@shieldtrigger]

She didn't disappeared, she died. RIP

[@robzydread1090]

​@@shieldtriggershe is still alive she is an Android.

[@ut99horus]

your lessons are insane, thank you so much for clarifying everything

[@vinilzord1]

Bad word choice. You meant incredibly insightful

[@d0xter742]

@@vinilzord1 no not bad word choice, just word choice you are unfamiliar with

[@bananacreeper290]

hahahahah blasted@@d0xter742

[@1984Joby]

Another great lesson! You did something great in this one that you hadn't done in the prior lesson but I almost suggested... Take the translation people often confuse the sentence for "I like to drink coffee" and write out that actual sentence so people can see how it is different. VERY helpful! Man your videos keep getting better and better over time. Great work!

[@aWildAk]

Rip we will continue to learn Japanese in your honor even 5 years later and a year after your death

[@pitekamonu]

do you speak japanese? what's your level?

[@aWildAk]

nope started not too long ago still learning i can read in it and stuff but i still have a LOT to learn to speak it and understand it @@pitekamonu

[@eireprincess]

this is my first cure dolly video, excellent explanation

[@japanese2811]

I have spent two years learning Japanese now. I remember at the very beginning I found this channel and I was just put off by the manner of speaking and found everything soooo confusing and strange.... Hahaha lo and behold, now I come back two years later and I find this approach to be the most logical explanation of Japanese I have ever heard. It's downright ridiculous! 😂

[@Mario1234mario3s]

Dear Cure Dolly, you are an angel and a genius.

[@Leviathan1132]

Unforunately she wont be able to see this since she now is an angel for real

[@youngsterjack619]

I *love* your videos because they never fail to add to my understanding of Japanese, but I'm having trouble following your explanation of how 本が読める。means that the book is readable, yet ∅が読める。means that I can read. I got through the last lesson thinking, "oh ok, so because が always marks the actor, these verbs themselves must have two slightly different meanings (one for when ∅ is the actor, and one for when the inanimate object is the actor), but 読む isn't like that as far as I know. Isn't it just a regular verb with one single meaning (to read)? So I'm wondering at what point is my perception of this dynamic warped, and if I am correct about it being about the verb that changes things, can all verbs be like that? Any help would be very much appreciated. Whichever way, keep up the great work Cure Dolly! Wouldn't be where I am without you and your channel.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

This is the one issue that causes most problems for people who really start grasping the actual structure of Japanese. I always think that when someone sees this as a problem it is because they are really starting to think clearly about Japanese structure. I've made a whole video on this one point (and its relatives) which I call The Final Problem. Please watch it and if you still have any difficulties come back to me in the comment section there: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jpCrnaGdhKapjpo

[@youngsterjack619]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Awesome, I'll give it a shot!

[@ahkamn]

@@youngsterjack619 Did you understand it in the end?

[@DebtDiaries5k]

@@jojos3685 the way I understood and this could be wrong but it was how I made sense of it is - Because Japanese is a context based language, saying 読める does 1 of 2 things, that is that the が will always be marked by the context of the the subject in this case the book or always default to how (I) feel about something

[@Alae-eddineN]

@@jojos3685 Interesting to see new comments on Cure Dolly's channel, I am also currently going over these series

[@GeekNeverDie]

For the potential form of "to hear" and "to see", i was already familiar with 聞こえる and 見える. Turns out from your lesson that the potential form is actually 聞ける and 見られる which was really weird to me because I never encountered those. So I've looked it up and what I have found is this: The first "form" is when you are able to see/hear without intent, while the latter is when you try hard and succeed to ear/see. Would you say that it is correct ? I have trust issues about anything that does not come out of your channel (笑)

[@Reydriel]

From what I know, the verbs 聞こえる and 見える are completely separate verbs in and of themselves (in relation to 聞く and 見る), they just happen to share the same kanji. Similar to 入る (hairu) and 入れる (ireru) lol

[@steve5123456789]

6.04. 本は私が読める。 "I can read the book." Is this good enough as well? As opposed to 私が本を読める。 What's the difference/nuance in these two sentences anyway if it's not good enough?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

As I said, it is more usual to say 本が読める so I don't recommend either for actual use, but yes, both are possible and are essentially the same. It doesn't matter what the order of the words is provided the particles are in the correct places and it doesn't matter whether you use は or が to mark 私 (as far as the actual logic of the sentence goes) because by marking the book with を you have already shifted logical が to 私 so it is there either implicitly or explicitly. In either case you are saying literally "I can read the book" which is what you would say in English as opposed to literally saying "(in relation to me) the book does read-possible" which is the way Japanese usually puts it.

[@slacky901]

Hi! Thank you very much for this lesson. I've been understanding japanese structure thanks to your series of videos. However, I have a question regarding this potential form. Is it possible to say, for example. はなせたい, when I want to say "I want to be able to speak" ? or たべられたい to say "I want to be able to eat"?. I understand that 話したい and 食べたい would both mean the same thing respectively, but how would it sound to a Japanese person? Thank you very much in advance!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

I'm so glad the videos are helping you. Yes 食べられたい and 話せたい mean "want to be able to eat/speak" and are the most usual way of expressing those ideas. In fact in Japanese this is used more often than in English as we often say things like "I would like to be able to see the big statue of Kannon in Sendai". Or "I was happy to be able to meet you" rather than just "I would like to..." or "I was happy to...".

[@slacky901]

KawaJapa CureDolly 面白い! ありがとうございます！

[@グレンズ]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 sorry if this is old, but I was taught that it should be 話せるようになりたい as opposed to 話せたい so can you explain the difference? Thanks!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

It is really never a good idea to think in half-sentences because the structure is unclear. The 話せる in this case may be being used as a self-move or an other-move verb. I am guessing this would be other move and in the context of being able to speak perhaps a language - but it could have a variety of other meanings too. In fact Japanese doesn't generally talk of "being able to speak a language" in the sense of being able to use it - this is an English-ism. They may occasionally use it if (somewhat unusually) they really are only talking about the ability to speak. And the expression 話せるようになりたい would be usual, meaing "I want to become (such that I am) able to speak X". This is because becoming able to do something is usually treated as a process of becoming rather than simply a wish for the language to do speakable (to oneself)

[@1984Joby]

Quick question. Is the potential form linked only to being able to do something absolutely or able to literally do it? For example, say I could read a book (able to read and understand it) but I can't actually read it because it is locked in a drawer. Would you use the negative of the potential given the circumstances even if I could actually read the book if I had it?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

As in English the same potential form is used for both senses of ability (possessing the necessary skill and being allowed by circumstances to exercise that skill). As in English, which is intended on a given occasion is usually clear from context. So yes you could say 本が読めない to express that while you are inherently able to read it you can't because it is locked in a drawer. Or more strictly, in Japanese, the book may do unreadable because of your inherent inability or its inaccessibility.

[@elmhurstenglish5938]

Evidently, I'm in the early stages, but how does 見られる differ from 見える? I think because 買える has a similar ending to 見える it throws me off, and 見える seems to also feel like its not too dissimilar to 見られる... Probably a novice question. Edit: nvm, I see you've answered this question multiple times in the comments.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

These two are a bit unusual - but useful because they express different and necessary things. 見られる usually means that something is see-able in the sense of one's opportunity/permission/will etc. to see while 見える implies that it is physically visible. So if you can't see an R-rated movie because you are under-age, the movie (not you) is 見られない. If you can't see it because someone's big hat is in the way it is 見えない. If you can't look at a horrible accident it is 見られない if it is too far away to see it is 見えない etc. This is not a strict grammatical rule but it is the way they are generally used.

[@elmhurstenglish5938]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Ah, that's a nicely explained subtle difference. Thanks. :)

[@leodip97]

Is kikoeru an exception? From your table I get that the potential form of kiku is kikeru, but I often hear and read kikoeru. Is it because of some old word like for ii/yoi?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

That is right. 聞く is one of a small number of words that have an irregular helper as well as the regular one. 聞ける is the regular one but 聞こえる is also used. The same with 見られる (regular) and 見える (irregular). A similar thing happens with the helper version (only) of the adjective ない which has the regular て-form なくて and the irregular ないで. All of them are irregular in only that one particular usage, and also have the regular form - so they are not really irregular verbs.

[@jeomaxx7499]

Sensei I am in need of you guidance once again 買え - Buy! expression of telling someone to buy? 買えるな - Dont Buy it! telling someone to not buy it? ( was it needed to be in a dictionary form to add imperative or prohibited) 買えて - Buy it. telling someone to buy it from me but plain form. 買えている - Im buying it - Telling myself to buy it. 買えていく - Im going to buy it - Buying it but with action. I just want to know if im saying it right in a japanease perspective as to why i made this example. Also if i made mistakes please do correct me.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

買え is the え-stem of 買う (buy) which makes the imperative. You don't use the え-stem in any of the other constructions you have here. The て-form takes the っ (small っ) stem like all う-ending verbs. So: 買うな - Dont Buy it! telling someone to not buy it? ( was it needed to be in a dictionary form to add imperative or prohibited) 買って - Buy it. telling someone to buy it from me but plain form. 買っている - Im buying it - Telling myself to buy it. 買っていく - Im going to buy it - Buying it but with action. I just want to know if im saying it right in a japanease perspective as to why i made this example. Also if i made mistakes please do correct me. Go here for the stem-system: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fJnco6ahfKd-fqc

[@jeomaxx7499]

​@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Thank you sensei! I was a bit shy to ask about it first but this helps me alot also if you dont mind i made these japanease sentence last lesson. 食べものだ - i want to eat something 食べたい俺わ - i want to eat. Both of these are like expressions sentences i want to know if im saying it right. the way i want something. or i want to eat.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@jeomaxx7499 The first one means "(it) is food". I think you should go back to the first lesson rather than try to make たい sentences.

[@jeomaxx7499]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 oh yeah i forgot there's no wanting of eating in that sentence and i guess だ really will translate this word to "is". Sorry about that i just wanted to make sentences you know if i make one and it was correct it feels nice being wrong means to learn more about it.

[@robostghost4223]

Not sure if it's mentioned in a later video, but similar to the previous lesson, how would I go about stating that someone else can do something: ex: "Sakura can read the book" or "Sakura can eat cake" would: さくらが本を読める　be ok or is it a similar issue to the previous video where we can't explicitly state we know what someone wants (or can do in this case) Or how about: さくらは本が読める　"As for Sakura, book is-readable"

[@christophermball]

To me, these two examples translate differently: さくらが本を読める --> Sakura is able to read the book. さくらは本が読める --> To Sakura, the book is readable. (possibly stated as a contrasting response to someone previously saying the book wasn't readable to them)

[@leobozkir5425]

Some websites use dekiru just as "possible" and not 'possible does'. Thank you, now I understand it better. That 'in relation to me' and 'hon-GA' just changed my vision on the sentence. But just one more question... Can 'yomeru' mean 'readable' AS WELL AS 'can read' depending on the context? Thank you

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Well possible-does isn't (heh-heh) possible in English. So this kind of translation is close to the literal Japanese but not natural English.

[@andrettax6052]

Guyssss, so, which helper verbs aren't ichidan verbs? Is there any that is godan? O_o"

[@sardinhunt]

kuru can be both korareru and koreru

[@taniaislam5545]

Hi, I find this lesson confusing and I need little help here. If I wanna say, "The book can read " or "I am readable ". How am I gonna say them. These might sound unusual but there should be a way to say it, right?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Yes. The first thing to understand here is the Ambiguity Rules. These are used in all languages (including English) and I would recommend this video gcbbSW-KuTQ Essentially the point in this case is that if you want to say something absurd or unexpected you can't just use a throwaway expression that can be confused with something else because people will always assume the "normal" meaning. So you might want to say something like あの本は読む能力がある (that book has the ability to read). Why can't Japanese say it as concisely as English? Because different languages have different areas of "agility" - different things that can be said very simply and lightly and things that need more cumbersome structures to exist. There are many things Japanese expresses in an agile manner that English can only do in more cumbersome ways too. See this video on linguistic agility - an important concept that is rarely discussed: kzbin.info/www/bejne/fJWwlounrMp1gJI

[@TedLedbetter]

Is よめる with the invisible zero-ga (to me reading is possible) a complete enough sentence? Or would it ever be used alone? Since it's not a copula type (da-desu) or "i-adjective" (with built in copula) A=B. Then if the zero-ga is implied it should be enough for a complete sentence?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Yes, a verb alone (with zero が-marked subject) can always make a sentence. As always the ∅ depends on context, so depending on the situational context よめる can mean "I can read" or "this is does readable (to me)".

[@jeisson42]

Great videos. The only thing always missing are the examples. A few sentences to see them being used.

[@man100111]

Should I dedicate time to sites like steven-kraft.com/projects/japanese/ regular to practice "conjugations" (sorry) or do you think it is enough to to use the organic method?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

A little drilling on verb-helpers etc. can be useful. I made a video on one such site explaining where necessary how to view it from an organic/structural perspective: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e52ni3iVd9J5jMU

[@man100111]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Thank you for the reply and the link.

[@HyperLuigi37]

What’s the difference between 聞ける and 聞こえる? They seem to mean the same thing but I see 聞こえる a lot.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

聞こえる is slightly unusual in that it is the specifically-self-move form of 聞ける that is to say, while the regularly-formed (but slightly less common) potential form of 聞く - 聞ける - can, like most potentials be used as either self-move or other-move (in the way that we have seen in this video), 聞こえる is always other-move. Why is this? I suspect it is because it makes the expression ○○に聞こえる (=sounds like ○○) clearly distinguishable. That isn't the only use of 聞こえる but it is a very common one (the other is the obvious "is hearable" which, as usual, is very often used where ego-centered English prefers "can hear"). 聞ける is used for "can hear" as well as "is hearable" (in other words, it can "flip" like most potentials and we always know which because of the infallible compass-points called particles). However it isn't used with に to mean "sounds like".

[@HyperLuigi37]

Organic Japanese with Cure Dolly Ohhhh, so self-move is for when the actor is the speaker, and other-move is for when the actor is somebody else than the speaker, right? Hadn’t heard those specific phrases before. Thanks for the clear explanation! Your explanations are some of the best out there.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Ohh sorry! I meant to link my video on self-move/other-move. This is usually called intransitive/transitive in English but I think those terms are overly technical and not always accurate (another instance of imposing foreign concepts on Japanese - not the worst but not perfect). So I use the Japanese terms translated into English 自動詞 "self-move word" and 他動詞 "other-move word" which are easily understandable without researching grammatical terms in order to get one that doesn't even fit exactly. The whole subject is messy in standard explanations. My video is here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e33OYpenlqqgr80

[@HyperLuigi37]

Organic Japanese with Cure Dolly Oh, great! Thanks!

[@nikolohernandez4234]

Sensei! If 本がわかる。means: "The book is understandable." Would 本がわかれる。roughly mean: "The book can make you understand.", coming from becomes clear-able / does understandable-able?

[@mrchorro1]

I'd imagine it means "The book can be understandable."

[@jayvdequito8828]

youre just trying too hard to replicate english logic into japanese.

[@カペラマヌエル]

Should we think always of potential form verbs as intransitive verbs?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

There is really no such thing as a "potential form of verbs" there are verbs that have a second verb - せる・させる attached to them. Each verb of the pair has its own subject (doer) and they are not the same. The first verb may be either self-move or other-move (you can cause someone to eat or you can cause someone to eat bread). The second verb, せる・させる, which will be the head-verb in a simple sentence is always causing someone to do the first verb. That someone is marked with に but I think we should still look at it as an other-move verb because it can't work without having someone to cause to do the first verb. I think it is best to think in terms of self-move/other move. Transitivity does exist in Japanese in a sense, but it is a European concept that is less useful than self-move/other move

[@simcard2732]

I just read in one book that potential form of Yomu is Yomaremasu. This is wrong, right?

[@smudge8882]

That's the formal version of the potential form. Informal is the default though.

[@namename4980]

I was thinking is it possible to say the same without using くれる? おねちゃんはつまらない本をよんでいてアリスと.. and then I realize I need negative past of a て form, which seems like doesn't exists. and it's not possible to finish sentence with アリスとあそばなかった?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

You can't ever need the negative or past of the て-form because it is always connecting the verb to something else. If negativity or past is to be expressed it will be expressed by the final element in the clause, and a て-form by definition cannot be the final element. Can you say アリスとあそばなかった? Grammatically there is nothing to stop you from doing so. However it is important to remember that _Japanese is not English_ and does not say things in the same way. An action done for someone else (or seen in the light of its benefit to someone else) in this kind of sentence is regularly expressed by 〜てくれる or 〜てあげる to the point that if you avoid it it looks as if you are deliberately avoiding it because you mean something different. To take a very crude example in English, suppose someone is crying and I say "water is coming from her eyes". Grammatically that is correct and it is also an accurate description of what is happening. But it is so usual in English to say "she is crying" that if I choose to say instead "water is coming out of her eyes", most people will assume that water is coming for some reason other than that she is crying - because if she had been crying I would have said so.

[@namename4980]

Organic Japanese with Cure Dolly I see, thanks! Ooops, I confused the video, sorry for that

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@namename4980 It's ok! You keep trying and every time you get better. So keep trying every day and you will become excellent!

[@attilagoijra54]

Hey I was wondering if you had a video about the volitional form (行こうetc)

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

I haven't done one about the volitional but I talked about it in lessons 17 (toward the end) and 18 (at the beginning).

[@attilagoijra54]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 ah okay will look into those, Thank you

[@marinypower2481]

At first thank you very much! All your videos are helping me a lot. I've not watched all of them, so please forgive me if my question is answered in another video. You talked about thos helper (auxiliar) verbs, that can be added to a verb flexion form. But as far as I know there is no limitation like you can only add one helper verb, most common combination is passive-causative i think, but how do I know which helper verb needs to be added first to the verbflexion, shall I first add the causative helper verb or the passive helper verb. Is there any particular rule, so that I know first this, then that, and in the end this kind of helper verb?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

It is mostly logic. Whatever comes last is the head-element of the sentence so that is what you are actually saying the subject did. So with the causative receptive (there is actually no passive voice in Japanese despite what the textbooks say - and this misconception is what makes it obscure) you are saying that you _received being caused_ to do something. Since your receiving れる・られる is what you (the subject) actually did, it has to come last. Please see this lesson to learn how the Japanese receptive helper verb really works (you can then proceed to lesson 19 for the causative receptive: kzbin.info/www/bejne/mae5Z5djh6qHqZo

[@orangegab06]

Amazing! I was wondering if the polite form of the potential form (if there is one) would turn よめる to よめます/よめります and たべられる to たべられます ?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Yes. Because the helpers are ichidan you attach the ます decorator to their standard ichidan stem.

[@orangegab06]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 I forgot they were helper verbs thank you

[@joaodelvaux3152]

It's funny that just yesterday i was trying to analyse this sentence: お前は光だ ときどきまぶしすぎてまっすぐ見られないけど それでもお前のそばにいていいかな and i found out the meaning with a lot of effort and interpretation... Watching just one more lesson would be so much helpefull! ps: i was trying to understand the actual meaning, but in translation i used portuguese words and logic.

[@joaodelvaux3152]

I thought on something... The idea is the same, but the first is more correctly, according to the statement in the video: 日本語は勉強ができる 私は日本語が勉強をできる I prefer the first at least, it's simpler and more direct

[@akira7ink]

What if one wants to say "The book is readable" (meaning that the book is, Idk, destroyed, barely readable and someone gives his opinion: It IS readable)? Would one use the same sentence? -> 本が読める。

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Yes. Most of the time 読める implies does readable (to someone) but it can also mean does readable (in general) in cases like this.

[@japanheart3607]

Just a question, would よむ then "conjugated" to 読める be able to be put as 読めります to mean I can read in polite form?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Yes, The ます decorative helper goes last and attaches to the い-stem of the final element.

[@RustieMcHogg]

I get a bit confused when you say that if we only say 'tabetai' that implies the subject is 'I'. If I see a cake and shout 'tabetai!' isn't the subject the cake?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

If you see a cake and shout 食べたい, in that case your implicit sentence is ∅が食べたい where ∅ = the cake. So yes, you are right. Remember that Japanese is a context-driven language. However if there is no cake as the implied subject and you are simply saying 食べたい (= I want to eat) then ∅ = "I". As we learned right back in lesson 2 ( kzbin.info/www/bejne/hmTRaaFmqph_fqM ), the value of ∅ is always determined by context.

[@namename4980]

It's not really related, but during watching this video question arose, if I want to say "It's difficult to speak in Japanese", with emphasize that difficult part is speaking, not all language, is this correct: 日本語で話すはむずしい ?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Japanese people do not use the idiom "speak a language" figuratively to cover all aspects of using a language in the way that English does (it uses Lができる rather than Lを話す for that, where L = a language), so the confusion won't arise. Your sentence is fine except that you should put a の after 話す in order to "nominalize" what comes before it. Then that whole first part up to and including の becomes the A-car and the B-engine is 難しい. Remember that the A-car _always_ has to be a noun or pronoun. Strictly what is happening is that the A-car is の 日本語で話す becomes a white-car group telling us what の stands for. This usage is explained here kzbin.info/www/bejne/fpDNloOwmLV5d7M

[@namename4980]

Organic Japanese with Cure Dolly oh,I forget that は can be used only with nouns! Thanks a lot for your answer!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Not entirely true to say that は can only be used with nouns. Logical particles can only be used by nouns and in this case the は is implying a logical particle (just as in the video explanation I linked to) so in full it would be 日本語で話すのは ∅が むずしい (we know that because this is a logical clause and must have a が-marked A car). Thus a の is necessitated. While the non-logical は mostly marks topics that are nouns, there are some constructions where it can be used with other parts of speech - notably て-formed verbs and て-formed copula (I just mention this for completness).

[@namename4980]

Organic Japanese with Cure Dolly deeper you go more complicated it become. Hope with your help slowly I will master all nuances of Japanese! :)

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@namename4980 Please don't worry. Maybe I shouldn't have mentioned that last part because it is confusing to get too much information at once, but I didn't want you to think that you can't use は except with a noun or you might get confused when you see that sometimes it is used without a noun. In the usual way we are talking about here it will need to be used with a noun. Like any language there is a lot in Japanese, but if you take it step by step it will be all right. Did you see my video on logical particles? kzbin.info/www/bejne/mqjGhXxvptuCY7c This makes clear the difference between logical particles (which really can't be used without a noun) and non-logical particles は and も which under some circumstances can. Please take it slowly, step by step, and ask me whenever you need some help.

[@amarug]

So to make it simple and avoid the potential form, is for example "私はラーメンをたべます。" always wrong/bad, do I have to say "私がラーメンをたべます。"? I thought は can also be a subjec/"do-er" in a verb?

[@amarug]

sorry i only saw that this was part of a whole series later. i watched the first videos and i understand now. the difference between logical and non logical particles. my mind is blown, you are certainly one of the smartest AI's I've ever seen ;)

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Thank you! I am very happy that I was able to help.

[@damlurker]

I feel like I have picked up the bad habit of nominalizing verbs and then using できる。As in for example I would say 本を読むのができる instead of 本が読める。 Would you say 本が読める is the more natural way of saying it? Thanks!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

I think you mean "nominalizing" rather than "normalizing". Actually it is pretty common to do this, only with こと rather than の (either is grammatical, こと sounds a little more natural). I have actually had a Japanese person (not a teacher) say that words like 飲める are a "shortening" of phrases like 飲むことができる. This isn't technically true but I think it is often perceived by ordinary Japanese people that way. The longer form feels "fuller" and game instructions often seem to use it (perhaps because it is considered easier for children). Using the potential helper is more usual in regular speech. It is probably comparable to the difference between "doesn't" and "does not" - except that "doesn't" really is a shortening.

[@damlurker]

Are there any conjugations in English? I've only heard of this term in Japanese textbooks. edit: ok I've heard of the term before Japanese, but only in math: the complex conjugate.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

It really depends how broadly you define the term "conjugation" but in the sense that European languages have conjugation, English doesn't. For example most European languages have a different version of a verb depending on whether I, you,he/she, they, we etc are doing it. Verbs may also conjugate for number and gender. English does not do this except to a very small extent (I/we/you/they come: she/he/it comes) - just two variants (and only very small variants) - nothing like French or German with their complex conjugation systems. Japanese doesn't even have as much as English along these lines, but it does have the verb-stem/helper system which is quite different structurally and serves quite different purposes. Modeling it as if it were European-style "conjugation" gives a completely false impression of what it does. The only reason the term "congugation" is used for Japanese is Eurocentric thinking and mental laziness. Unfortunately the laziness of educators is hard work for learners.

[@reptilesarecool6739]

English conjugation is extremely simple, which sets it apart from other European languages. I run, you run, he/she/it runs, we run, you all run, they run. Only deviation is the he/she/it case and irregulars. An irregular example in English is I am, you are, he/she/it is, we are, you all are, they are. (For the verb to be).

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@reptilesarecool6739 Well it is simple in that respect, but it is full of irregulars like run/ran, go/went, eat/ate, sell/sold, buy/bought - etc. etc. - all of which are unguessable and have to be learned on a word-by-word basis. Luckily Japanese has none of this sort of thing and is almost perfectly regular.

[@reptilesarecool6739]

Organic Japanese with Cure Dolly truuu

[@Someone-pj2qe]

For godan verbs, can the る sometimes be replaced with ず? I came across the potential form of 言う as 言えず？

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

The godan verb here is 言う, so there is no る to replace. 言える is 言う with the potential helper る attached (as always) to its え-stem. This る is ichidan. What has replaced that (in the regular manner - helpers always simply replace the る of ichidan verbs) is the ず helper which I discuss toward the end of this video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e2i0oKNumdyDatk

[@Someone-pj2qe]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Thank you. I will watch that video. What I meant was, for godan verbs in the potential form, can the る sometimes be replaced with ず.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

​@@Someone-pj2qe You are looking at it the wrong way around. Forget the whole conjugation idea. The "potential form" of godan verbs _is ichidan_ because the る helper is ichidan. So we are talking about how the ず helper is used with the potential of anything (which is always ichidan). Godan is a red herring here. As soon as we attach any ichidan helper to a godan verb we are dealing with an ichidan entity and anything we do after that follows the ichidan pattern. Don't be thrown by the fact that the potential helper is only one kana. It works just the same as any ichidan helper.

[@Someone-pj2qe]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Thank you for the clarification. I read this idea before in one of Tae Kim's lessons. But I did not understand how a verb can change from godan to ichidan so I just dismissed it. Because godan verbs that end in る are not ichidan, I assumed verbs could not change. I'll try to read/watch more about this and understand this better.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

​@@Someone-pj2qe This is the whole point. We need to drop the "conjugation" idea. Japanese verbs do NOT conjugate. So there is no question of a godan verb becoming ichidan. What is happening is that a godan verb is attaching an ichidan helper. Let's take a case where the helper isn't just one kana because it may be clearer. 飲む is godan. 飲まれる is 飲む plus the helper れる (receive). れる is ichidan, so anything you do with that will follow the ichidan pattern. This is not a "conjugation" of 飲む in fact if we say 犬に見ずが飲まれた (the water drinkage-received from the dog) the two verbs have different subjects. The drinking 飲む is done by the dog. The receiving れる is done by the water. Two verbs. Not one "conjugated" verb.

[@seisveintiocho-x9e]

So this is where the saying "as very very easy as 日本語 not-conjugation" comes from!

[@wirito]

せんせい, I know how が and を work thanks to your phenomenal explanations. I do have one question: Would it also be alright to say: kono hon wo yomeru (this book readable) I hope I constructed the sentence correctly I know saying watashi wa hon wo puts emphasis in “I” which is not common in Japanese but if I just DON’T say the watashi part, would it be acceptable?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

本が読める is standard Japanese. You'll hear it most of the time except from a few young people. 本読をめる is a disputed usage considered to be heavily influenced by the teaching of English (considered by many to be a "cool" language). Stick to standard Japanese and you won't go wrong.

[@wirito]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 perfect! Thank you for the reply :)

[@devinajoe7584]

Hi, sensei! Thank you for the lessons, I've been going through it for a few days (although not exactly in order). I have a question regarding this one line I found in a manga I'm reading and I need your guidance. The line is [お前に国は救えない.] Based on your video, I can understand that 国は救えない means the country is not-save-able but I'm quite confused with the usage of に in the sentence, what does it shows?And, how is it different than お前は国が救えない?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

に is used in various cases like this - for example 私にも分からない to me (also) not understandable. に is the only logical particle that can be used here, though of course non-logical は is possible and common.

[@ryanlohjy]

先生, すみません！！　I have encountered a weird 'conjugation' and need your guidance. The sentence is [あの攻撃効(き)いてるんじゃね？」(that attack is effective no?), and while most of the sentence is fairly simple, [効いてる] seems a bit strange to me, as the base form seems to be [効く] , hence the connecting stem would be 「効き」 How i would interpret it is it is the [てる] is a short form of [ている] and [効き] is just shortened to [効い], i have watched the video regarding particle omission so this is what i think would be the answer.　Please correct me if i'm wrong! 間違えたら教えてください

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Xてる for Xている is a very common colloquial abbreviation. The が has been dropped from 攻撃 and and 効いて is the regular て-form of 効く so nothing is shortened there.

[@ryanlohjy]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Right, I forgot that the て form for ｘく/ぐ is ｘいて/いで。So てる is basically ている. Understood! 説明してくれてありがとう!

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@ryanlohjy どういたしまして。

[@SPAGHEEEETTI]

Why do people think 6:25 is bad japanese? Who's place is it to decide whether or not it is? Is it just not natural to speak that way? I would think that as someone who's learning it is absolutely our place to try and work out whether or not that's bad japanese and to try and find some "good" japanese if it exists I guess

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

The question of what is good or bad in language is one that gets all kinds of opinions, but from the point of view of a learner I think there are two issues: 1) it's important to understand the structure of the language. So if you are learning English you need to know that "Nice day!" is short for "It's a nice day!" or you're going to end up very confused about how English sentences work. 2) (and this is less important in the early stage) - we need to be able to recognize "bad" Japanese because whether it is legitimate or not we are going to encounter it sometimes. This, of course depends what one's aims are. If all one wants is to pass exams in Japanese one can do that without knowing any common incorrect usages. If one wants to watch anime, read novels or talk with Japanese people one will need eventually to know the rules and know the way they sometimes get broken. It is important to realize that rules are not broken at random. They are only broken in a few specific and quite limited ways. For example lots of English speakers say "It don't matter" which is incorrect. No native English speaker over six ever says "It not matter", or "matter doesn't" or any other variation. So even rule-breaking follows a certain kind of rule!

[@naumbtothepaine0]

suddenly I can clearly understand why "eigo ga hanasemasuka" means can you speak English (not literally), thanks a lot Cure Dolly sensei

[@user-hf6jm4tv2v]

カタカナとひらがなが読める would make perfect sense then. In general I am fairly okay with the ambiguity but these help with creating a concrete bases which is a great advantage.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Tolerating ambiguity is helpful in learning language, but fuzziness over the basic structure leads to problems.

[@gregorsamsa9762]

There's a question I'd like to ask you. I found these videos yesterday and watched the majority now, and you haven't talked much about the whole kanji thematic. What I've been doing is the Heisig method with the RTK book, you've probably already heard of it. I've been doing it for a couple months now, and I have almost 1500 keyword to kanji down. Do you think this is an efficient way to learn? I basically create mnemonics and connect a kanji with its primitive elements to it's primary meaning - primary, as in one of them, which is one of the things kinda bugging me with the method. It does help with the majority of Jukugo, but when you get to stuff like 泥棒, it is kind of disheartening. I also wouldn't want to abandon the method after having invested about 150 hours in it. How'd you go about the feat of internalising multiple thousand kanji and what do you think about the mnemonic-keyword method? Videos are great, by the way. Subscribed after the first one.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

I have to say that the Heisig method is not my personal preferred method, but that doesn't mean that it isn't the right method for some people. I know some people thrive on it and I certainly don't want to discourage them from doing so. My own reservation is with the whole principle of keywords. I prefer learning kanji within words as part of the language as a whole. But if people prefer to front-load a lot of kanji with English keywords (some of which fit and some of which really have to be rather oblique just because of the exigencies of giving each kanji a unique keyword) - that's fine. If it works for you, it works. That's the only part of the Heisig method I differ with. Breaking them down into "radicals" and "primitives" and using mnemonics is to my mind by far the most sensible way of going about it (Heisig-sensei did not invent this, but he is responsible for popularizing it in the West and has done a great service in doing so). You certainly shouldn't throw away your work, nor is there any reason to do so. I would suggest that you _may_ find that the deeper you go the trickier keywords become (the more abstract a concept is the less useful an English - or any other - keyword gets). But this does depend on how your own learning works - and "if it ain't broke don't fix it!" Words like 泥棒 - well yes! It is just the case that Japanese people call a robber a muddy stick! There is probably some historical reason behind it. I find it pretty memorable in itself just because it's so odd. I don't know to what extent you are following the "pure" Heisig method of front-loading all or most kanji before knowing a word of the actual language (Heisig-sensei's stated aim is to put the student in the position of a new Chinese student of Japanese who has a very good grounding in Kanji but knows no Japanese). And I don't know whether you intend to go on in this way (since you have been watching my lessons I would guess not). So if you are intending to mix Heisig (learning Chinese-origin characters with English keywords) with learning Japanese, you have two options. One is to continue with Heisig until you know all the kanji while also learning Japanese. The other is to stop with your current 1500 kanji (continuing to review them if necessary because you definitely don't want to lose them). In neither case will you have wasted anything. Knowing those kanji is invaluable and whatever you do from now on they are a really important thing to know. What would I do in your position? Well, remember that I'm not you and what suits me might not suit you. But here's what I would do. I would discontinue Heisig because I think 1500 kanji is more than enough at this stage. I would start learning Japanese _vocabulary_ and _grammar structure_ The second part is what I teach. But (unless you really have only a handful of real Japanese words as opposed to kanji keywords) I would not be learning vocabulary in the abstract. Here's the tricky part - and here's why a lot of people don't use my approach - I would be looking around to say "what Japanese can I tackle at this stage". Because that is how I learned beyond basic vocabulary and grammar-structure - I dived into Japanese. But that is really tough. Incidentally this is what Heisig-sensei himself did. Having got all the kanji he started playing baseball with Japanese children to learn by immersion. Personally I wouldn't see any need to front-load more than 1500 kanji before starting immersion. The rest you can pick up as you go (still using Anki - if you do) - but then Heisig-sense is Heisig-sensei and this android is this android. So that's a very, very brief overview (even though a too-long comment) of my take on the matter. Remember that whatever you think of my approach, your current question is "how do I learn Japanese?" Learning kanji is not learning Japanese - though having a good base of kanji will help you enormously. 頑張ってください

[@seventhsheaven]

I would say Cure-sensei makes a great point. I’m currently at around 900 kanji following the heisig method (well done to you for getting so far!) and what I’ve been doing is adding kanji compounds to the srs app Anki. These compounds are made up of kanji I have learnt through Heisig. I go through the lists of JLPT vocabulary and add new words to Anki as soon as I find words comprised of kanji I have learned. I also add words that I find ‘in the wild’ so to speak, IF I can recognise the kanji they are comprised of. I do not bother adding words where I haven’t learned all of the kanji, as this is just making life harder for myself. So, for example, let’s say I am looking at a Japanese news site, and find these three words: 田舎 - I know both these kanji. One means rice field, the other cottage. Together they mean ‘rural area’. A useful word, I will add it to my deck. 韓国 - I know the second kanji, which means country, but not the first. I will return to this another time once I have learned the first one. 練歯磨 - I have only learned the third kanji. It might be a useful word to know but again I will leave it for now. This way, I am learning the meaning and stroke order of the kanji while also building my vocabulary (and of course learning grammar on the side). Hope this helps! P.S I add these kanji to full sentences as well so that I learn them through both recognition and context. I’ve found this to be the best way.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

This is also a good approach. Reading over my answer I am not sure I made it clear when I said that 1500 kanji is a very adequate base and I personally would stop doing Heisig (not of course that I ever started doing Heisig) I did not mean by that "stop learning kanji because1500 is a good base". I meant continue learning kanji on an ad hoc basis as part of words, as you encounter them, while of course exploiting the ones you already know to learn words more easily. My personal approach has always been "learn words, not kanji" - that is, learn kanji in the context of words, not as abstractions. However klj788986sbb-san's advice is a very good way of continuing with Heisig while branching out into learning Japanese if that's the route you want to take. Thank you very much for your contribution.

[@gregorsamsa9762]

I see! I might follow that. Thanks to you both. I've stopped the Heisig method already, and I'm working on learning kanji through vocab as well as properly learning the kanji I know.

[@retronickmusic]

あぁ! ちょっと分かったと思う。また見てる。

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

問題がありますか。質問があったら、ぜひ聞いてください(日本語でも英語でもʕ•ᴥ•ʔ)

[@napa1015]

why does "zero ga yomeru" mean "i can read" instead of "i can be read" like how "hon ga yomeru" means "the books can be read" and not "the book can read"

[@qqwppppp]

I don't know if is this is correct, but i rationalized it as "enables [[the verb it is attached to]] to be done". So the book can enable reading to done by having words in it. But you can also enable reading to be done by your ability to perform the action of reading. It's like "tai" being a adjective that means "is [[verb it is attached to]] inducing". A cake can induce the act of eating on you through looking tasty (ケーキが食べたい), just as you yourself can induce the act of eating on your own self, be it through your hunger or desire. (Øが食べたい

[@epix4300]

Done

[@arazemijo9674]

It seems like watashi wa functions like an indirect object pronoun in a sentence such as watashi wa hon ga yomeru; the book is readable to me.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

English translation makes it look that way but actually it would need to be watashi ni to mean that. Strictly what it means is "Me=topic: book does readable" (because yomeru is a verb, not an adjective). It doesn't matter too much at this stage but Japanese does something that English doesn't do often and is only rather awkwardly capable of - which is using non-logical topics in a variety of ways. Once we see them as anything like indirect objects we are including them in the logical sentence which is not the way the structure actually works. It could of course be わたしは(∅に) but in these cases this is not required or implied. If you are curious, you might like to look at this video on Japanese non-logical topic/comment structure as contrasted to its logical が-centered structure: kzbin.info/www/bejne/lZ-7eaOhibmZfdU (but if it confuses you, please don't worry - it is much further on in the course - Lesson 60 - just an optional sneak peek).

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

PS - just to clarify - English grammar needs to tie almost everything into the logical sentence structure; but Japanese has a parallel non-logical structure that works alongside the logical structure. In the end we need to understand this, but I deliberately keep it out of the early part of the course as you can go a long way without entering this area explicitly.

[@arazemijo9674]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Wow, thank you! I think I'll have to gain a deeper knowledge of Japanese as a whole before I really understand that concept fully, but it does make sense. I'm still in the habit of trying to relate things to concepts as they are in English (a habit I'll probably have to break as I go on!).

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@arazemijo9674 I try to introduce the concepts gently over the course of the lessons.

[@uttccltucluglutd7rotc]

If "本が読める" is "The book is able to be read" Then let's say in "飛べる", who is the doer? If it's "I", then it means "I'm able to be flown"?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

This video should help. If you have questions after you have seen it, let me know: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jpCrnaGdhKapjpo

[@michaelhoffmann2891]

かえるをかえる = I can buy the frog; かえるがかえる = the frog can buy (something). 😋

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

雨の日には、かえるはでかける、人間はかえる。On rainy days frogs go out and humans go home.

[@michaelhoffmann2891]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Is that an actual Japanese proverb? :)

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@michaelhoffmann2891 No, I made it up.

[@michaelhoffmann2891]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 I'm now mildly disappointed. Surely the Japanese know the art of bad puns and dad jokes?

[@undine8750]

I’m sorry for being a lobster...

[@arjunvardhan8134]

Sounds like there are birds chirping in the background.

[@wilmercuevas6491]

その写輪眼、お前はどこまで見えている

[@deedanner6431]

So, " verb-eru/rareru" acts more like an adjective but "conjugates" like a verb?

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

No, it is a verb. ない and たい are helper adjectives. They look and behave like adjectives (ending in い). The helpers ending in る are all ichidan verbs.

[@deedanner6431]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 I see. Looking at the ru/rareru verbs as if they are pretending to be adjectives (not like the actual adjectives ~たいand ~ない ) helps me to remember that they need a が marked subject instead of an (w)o marked object.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@deedanner6431 Japanese is very consistent. Verbs all end in an う-row kana (even if they are mainly kanji they have to have that kana at the end). Adjectives all end in い. No exceptions at all. The only thing that makes it _seem_ confusing is that the textbooks insist on calling adjectival nouns "na-adjectives" when they are actually nouns. I should point out that verbs and adjectives both need が to mark their subject (something must _do_ the action, something must _be_ the adjectival quality - both those somethings take が). Verbs can also have a を marked object, but adjectives can't. For obvious reasons. You can say "I ate" or "I ate the cake". You can say "I am green" but you can't say "I am green the cake", or I am green anything else

[@siyacer]

〆切り

[@siyacer]

kuru

[@かえる77]

今朝は私が眠い.。

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

私も夜の充電の後、ブートシーケンスが遅いこともある。

[@nihongo-MIA-danh]

i always imagine the man behind cure dolly is an old wise man. Who is British. That is weird i guess. ok dear the reader of this comment, wish you have a nice day.

[@mjloversful]

am i the only one who think the way she say “class dismissed” is so creepy

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Oh but I can do much, MUCH creepier than that.

[@jfr49djd39jcuuhg]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Cool! I wanna see that😂

[@mjloversful]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 hahaha oh noooo

[@NoriMori1992]

Your distinction between "conjugation" and "adding helper verbs to a verb stem" seems to me like a distinction without a difference.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

No. A conjugated verb has one subject. It is important to realize that in many cases (causative, receptive - so-called "passive" etc.) the compounded verb has two. It is not knowing this that makes them so difficult to grasp. The "causative receptive" actually has three kzbin.info/www/bejne/mae5Z5djh6qHqZo This aside from the fact that not using the ill-fitting conjugation model (bound to cause confusion with European conjugations) makes things so much less complicated-feeling.

[@OcadosLivros]

このビデオの内容がすごい。けど、何がこの声？なんか、悪い気がするよ。

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

私の声だよ。すごく自然で人間っぽい声と思っていたのに・・・

[@OcadosLivros]

ｗｗｗｗｗ　えーっ　なんかこわい声　ｗｗｗｗｗ

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

声が大好きな人間もいるよ。でもOcaさんの意見は少なくないかもね。真面目に、声のどこが悪いの？

[@vinilzord1]

Que frase artificial, é exatamente como um gaijin falaria

[@OcadosLivros]

@@vinilzord1 era pra ser um xingamento? Eu sou gaijin e nunca morei ou fui no Japão... Mesmo assim estou me esforçando pra aprender o idioma... Claro que meu japonês não será tão natural como o de um nativo. 🙄

[@mirciap6833]

This video is creeping me out...

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

Really? Did you have a bad experience with potential verbs in early childhood?

[@mirciap6833]

@@organicjapanesewithcuredol49 Your virtual character and voice are extremely unsettling. I couldn't bear to watch past the first 30 seconds.

[@organicjapanesewithcuredol49]

@@mirciap6833 I am sorry you find it so. The voice is mine, I'm afraid.

[@eithansamuelmorenomunoz8b636]

what a nice lesson! now everything makes sense. there is only one spot i haven't figure out yet, does this happen with -ない also? like クレーㇷ゚がたべない。y 私がたべない。