Lesson 6: What If Titanic Never Sank?

[@OctoLink-qs3kg]

Then in that universe, there will be a video called "Lesson 6: What If Titanic DID Sink?" By a KZbinr called Lusitania University

[@solsticefox6062]

right? we would all be here because we were obsessed with the Lusitania disaster :P

[@OctoLink-qs3kg]

@@solsticefox6062 Still a better timeline than this one, for all we know, the grandchild of a dead passenger could have been the inventor of flying cars if Titanic didn't sink. It's a 1,517 to 1 chance.

[@MacAdvisor]

@@OctoLink-qs3kg Why not the grandchild of a dead crew member?

[@OctoLink-qs3kg]

@@MacAdvisor 🤷‍♂️

[@adamdonnelly3912]

then it could be "Lesson 6: What if Lusitania Never Sank?" By Andrea Doria University

[@danielbishop1863]

Without the sinking, Titanic would be little more than a row on Wikipedia's "Timeline of largest passenger ships" page (between Olympic and Imperator).

[@ssgus3682]

Bingo

[@AndyHappyGuy]

That page probably wouldn’t have been made at all :/

[@aj6954]

Exactly, would be on a par with Aquitania and Mauretania. It was well known because it sank but little more until 1985 which was the start of the present day obsession, made greater by the mystery surrounding the sinking and the suspicion of foul play.

[@Christopher-vs6rp]

Can't wait. I'd really love to see a video about the Second Class, what life was like, what it looked like, etc. I feel like its the most overlooked part of Titanic.

[@AlextheHistorian]

I agree, everyone talks about first class, and sometimes third class. But I want to know more about 2nd and 3rd class.

[@jenniferbrewer5370]

Would've been nice if James Cameron had remembered there WAS a Second Class on Titanic.

[@MarkHobbes]

Even on Titanic movie from 1997, 2nd class is not shown as far as I know. I'd like to see more details about 2nd class.

[@galoon]

I think you're right--Titanic's Second Class areas were really quite attractive and compared well with First Class areas on other ships like the Baltic.

[@balazs7235]

Yeah it’s a shame. It was either the First Class because it was “oh-so-luxorious” or the Third Class because they “lived like pigs”. Of course not all is true but this is what the general public knows to be the reality. The Second Class in comparison to those ideas cannot hold a candle.

[@sirrliv]

Regarding other shipwrecks after Titanic: The SS Eastland disaster can be said to have been a direct result of the Titanic's loss. Following the disaster, the Eastland's owners, in an arguably overreaction, refitted the already unstable lake steamer with almost double her original complement of lifeboats, mounted high up as was the standard for the time. The weight of said lifeboats considerably increased her instability issues, thus contributing to her loss as well. So if Titanic hadn't sunk, would the Eastland have sunk? Probably, but under very different circumstances.

[@blembree1]

If Titanic never sank, James Cameron would have made a movie about the Andrea Doria.

[@andrewbrendan1579]

Something I've thought about how there has never been a movie about the Andrea Doria. In the 1960 movie "The Last Voyage" the story line of Cliff and Laurie Henderson (Robert Stack and Dorothy Malone) that has Laurie trapped in the wreckage and being assisted by Hank Lawson (Woody Strode) is clearly based on real people who were on the Andrea Doria a few years earlier but no movie that I know of has specifically been about the Italian liner. (P.S. "The Last Voyage" was filmed on the Ile de France which was the main rescue ship that came to the aid of the people on the Andrea Doria.

[@AndyHappyGuy]

I think he would have made Lusitania.

[@resetplayz53]

Or Lusitania... Or maybe even the queen mary!,

[@nicholasmaude6906]

Or the Empress of Ireland.

[@jamesricker3997]

Or the Empress of Ireland

[@endeavourist5287]

White Star seemingly never recovered from the losses of Titanic and Britannic. They were replaced with used German ships, but those never really fit into the brand very well. Had the Olympic-class trio sailed as they were envisioned, White Star may have won the transatlantic trade over Cunard. White Star may have even continued to this day, evolving into the cruise line that Cunard eventually became.

[@queenalaska6499]

Chris Cunard is a OCEAN LINNNNNNNEERRRRRRR

[@michaelbujaki2462]

The merger would still have happened, but instead of Cunard ships using White Star crew, it would have been White Star ships using Cunard crew.

[@yonker1219]

That means we could have a Titanic 2.

[@kaiserredgamer8943]

@@michaelbujaki2462 White Star-Cunard Line Very blursed

[@radamik]

I think White Star did quite well in the 20s, it was the Depression that did them in; plus the modern evolution of the Ile de France and the German liners made the older ships look dated. Ships after 1927 were almost always some version of “modern” design up to the space age style of the QE2 in 1969. Very few exceptions. One curious example: the ultramodern Normandie of 1935 had 2 luxury suites decorated in 18th century style. Why - maybe just for a relief from all the deco.

[@ShadowXII]

I'd love to see an alternate scenario where Captain Lord woke the wireless operator at first opportunity.

[@TitanicHorseRacingLover]

Stone and GIbson could have woken up the wireless operator.

[@en1909s9iah]

there would be still the same amount of death. it took 4 hours for Carpathia to rescue all the lifeboats... Titanic sank too fast.

[@puterboy2]

Captain Stanley Lord confessed in the inquiry that it would have taken them two hours to reach Titanic, so they would have saved the lifeboat occupants from spending another few hours in the cold.

[@TitanicHorseRacingLover]

@@puterboy2 exactly. I agree he should have come to assist, but I certainly don't think he is responsible for the 1496 deaths like a lot people do. Even Lord Mersey at the British Inquiry said that Captain Lord "could have saved every single life," had he (Lord) come. That's a totally ridiculous thing of Mersey to say.

[@brianbommarito3376]

If the Californian had gone to the Titanic’s assistance, she would’ve arrived just in time to witness the sinking, and maybe with quick work from her crew rescue an extra hundred people from the water. But ultimately, after the Titanic was damaged by the iceberg, it was inevitable somebody was going to die that night.

[@ccchhhrrriiisss100]

Conversely, a 2020 visitor from a parallel universe where Titanic did NOT sink would be shocked after learning about the disaster. He or she might not have ever heard about the ship.

[@youtubecreators384]

There's an episode from Supernatural where Balthazar traveled back in time and prevented the sinking because he hated the movie...

[@FinalLugiaGuardian]

If Titanic never sank in 1912... she would have been scrapped in 1937.

[@FrankIsAlwaysRight]

FinalLugiaGuardian yep

[@231gnx]

I think so too.She was (Olympic)old,worn and obsolete by 1930.They were twins.The life span was 20 years for those liners back then.Today 30-35 years or more.

[@tobiaszczarnota7879]

Or if I were alive at the time I could've bought the titanic.

[@kneeman66]

Kate Winslett would be a fat, unknown housewife.

[@kneeman66]

Henry Ford thx

[@Daniel_Huffman]

6:19 Ah, yes, the unfortunate fact that, even with a _clearly_ visible name, people still call a ship the _Titanic._ It gets annoying to me after awhile. So much so that whenever someone refers to one of the ships I've made as the _Titanic,_ they'd have to deposit ten cents to me. And if they do it on purpose to troll me? Twenty cents. And because they say it to me _over and over_ to me, it stacks up quickly.

[@AndyHappyGuy]

If Titanic didn’t sink and Lusitania took her place: Me: **shows photo of Titanic** what is this ship? Random guy: tHatTS LusITaNia!

[@michaelbujaki2462]

@@AndyHappyGuy I kid you not, someone built a model of a ship, called it Titanic, and got it in a museum. I went to that "museum" and found that this model ship was a cross between an Olympic class and a Mauritania class. This "Titanic" had red funnels with black stripes and four propellers. They did get the bridge and the well deck right though. I don't know if the Dorian Bay Ship museum still has their "model" of "Titanic", but it has been eight years since I was there, so I would not be surprised if it is gone now.

[@DerpyPossum]

@Railfan 765 #relatable

[@Bananoker]

What if you wanted to go to heaven but God said- Premieres in 16 hours

[@LoneWolf051]

purgatory

[@johnboy4025]

If Titanic never sank, yes some other shipping disaster would have happened that lead to safety measures and all 3 Olympic class liners would have been forgotten

[@johnv7317]

I would love to see you guys do more "what if" videos on other oceanliners like for example What if the Lusitania didn't got torpedoed, what if Britannic manage to beach herself, or what if the horrible fire Normandie never happen during her conversion into a troop ship.

[@puterboy2]

If the Lusitania never sank, Europe would have to continue fighting without America’s help, but there would still be a few volunteers.

[@andrewbrendan1579]

The late John Maxtone-Graham wrote a number of books about ocean liners and one of them, "Crossing to Cruising", has a chapter called "The Once and Future Normandie". That chapter has a fictional section in which the author tells about what (might have) happened to the Normandie as the American troopship Lafayette and then about her peacetime career, again under the French flag, lasting into the 1960's. Fictional but great reading for an ocean liner enthusiast.

[@AndyHappyGuy]

there are a few minecraft animations made by a youtuber called yumione skybedz ( kzbin.info/door/p7lqbb6YrRvhIF_8EJ3l0g ) that have some of these scenarios visualized. He has videos like, "what if Britannic never sank" or "what if carpathia never sank" or "what if lusitania never sank". check out his animations, they are really cool.

[@EvilRandomguy666]

I say that Imperator would become the infamous sunken ship. Her top heavy status and legitimately poor steerage areas (from what I have read), were a recipe for disaster.

[@IntrepidMilo]

Then you would be out of a job.

[@WeaselKing1000]

Coming soon - 'Empress of Ireland: Lights in the Fog'. The long-awaited Pointe-à-Père VR demo.

[@MarkHobbes]

His life depends on a tragedy

[@jesperhammarlund300]

big oof

[@danielito750]

how rude...

[@IntrepidMilo]

@@WeaselKing1000 I have been to Pointe-au-Père and to the Empress of Ireland's museum and gravesite in Quebec City

[@areoborg]

I wonder how long until an appropriate disaster happens. Just having a ship sink isn't going to be enough of a motivation. You'll need a disaster where the ship sinks, the lifeboats all get away safely, AND the majority of the deaths are because they ran out of lifeboats. If the Titanic sank too quickly, or listed to much to one side rendering half the lifeboats useless, there wouldn't have been as powerful a demand to have more lifeboats on board. So it wasn't just a perfect storm of events that caused the nearly unsinkable ship to sink, there was also the perfect storm of events that happened during the sinking itself that forced the changes.

[@Hector_H23]

Can’t wait for this!

[@ViImGamer]

Hector Hernandez neither can I.

[@thecunarder7297]

I always find these "What If" scenarios quite fun and interesting, keep up the good work!

[@harmsway2914]

So many "What if" scenarios. What if Titanic hit the iceberg head-on instead of turning? What if Olympic and Hawke never collided? What if Titanic and SS New York did collide in Southampton?

[@simplystreeptacular]

If Titanic had hit the iceberg head-on, she would have folded like an accordion at every seam in her plates and gone down in minutes instead of hours. Sincerely, Physics

[@jenniferbrewer5370]

@@simplystreeptacular Except for the fact that her bow had been reinforced to prevent just that kind of damage. No one knows if it would've been enough though, since it was never tested.

[@tntornadox89]

@@jenniferbrewer5370 Quite. I'd love to see a true computer simulation to test this once and for all.

[@KevsterWilson]

@@simplystreeptacular If she never had the coal bunker fire she wouldnt have been going so fast in the first place.

[@anormalcommentor9452]

@@KevsterWilson That makes no sense

[@timothyreed8417]

I would have about 4’ of book shelf space to fill with?…..

[@excelon13]

I envision two scenarios: one Titanic still encounters the iceberg, but turns just in time to barely miss colliding with it. In this scenario, all the crewmen involved have a very nervous laughter. Log the near collision and inform captain Smith, I think he might have changed speed at that point and be more careful. Titanic arrives in New York on schedule and the near iceberg collision makes a fun little story in the morning papers. In this case I think Murdoch, or Hichens, or maybe even Smith might press for more safety around iceberg heavy waters since they were directly involved. In this case I don't think Lifeboats would have changed, but maybe an additional lookout with required binoculars and lighting being required for future voyages. Titanic's life ends up the same as the video describes. The second scenario is of course she never encounters the iceberg at all, in that case it plays out as the video describes in my opinion, nothing changes, another disaster forces change.

[@rich_edwards79]

The mention of lighting is interesting. I've always thought the same as to why Titanic and other fast liners of the era weren't fitted with powerful lights up front to aid visibility. They certainly had the technology (gas and electric lighting had been around for a few years by that point, and even long before that, oil-burning lighthouses used reflectors and Fresnel lenses to throw beams some considerable distance). I can only surmise that it's because hitting an unlit foreign object (I.e. not another vessel) big enough to mortally wound a large ship in open ocean at night wasn't considered a significant threat, and maybe it wasn't, and Titanic was just incredibly unlucky to encounter such a big berg in the shipping lanes.

[@4vesta255]

Richard Edwards Here’s a very good video explaining why the Titanic didn’t have searchlights. kzbin.info/www/bejne/iKCvaKaVprtjatk

[@dogperson3014]

Something you failed to mention was the lifeboats. Had Titanic not sink, the rule of lifeboats wouldn't have changed meaning more ships like the Olympic and the Britannic would've been more at risk if the Titanic didn't sink, as they would prolly have 20 or a little bit more, instead or ridiculous numbers of lifeboats to ensure safety. And as a wider result, more people could've been in danger if their ship was sinking with not enough lifeboats. However, it is worth mentioning that the crew were completely unprepared for Titanic's Demise and so lifeboats weren't filled all the way, so that's a separate problem regarding lifeboats

[@mr.juniii5523]

And on 1914 lusitania will sink and more risk cause she will have only few boats so more deaths

[@theoddstrokesswimmingvideo1314]

I think White Star and Cunard both would have ended up with a German Liner, but if Lusitania became the catalyst for design changes. The Olympic Class, Mauritania and Aquitania would have been pulled from service for refits and extra boats leaving White Star’s Big Four, Caronia, and Carmania to do most of the fleet work in the Dardanelles. Most likely the Four Stackers would see action in late 1916-the Summer of 1918. But perhaps it would be Baltic or Adriatic that would strike a mine. White Star would end up with Columbus/Homeric to replace Oceanic and Bismarck/Majestic to replace the 1-2 ships of the Big Four lost. Cunard would get Vaterland/Berengaria to replace Lusitania and the rivalry would continue into the Thirties. Olympic and Titanic would be relegated to the Liverpool and Halifax runs once RMV Oceanic was launched making it the flag ship with Majestic and Britannic on the South Hampton Run. Cunard and White Star would merge in 1935 with White Star the controlling Partner. The Queen Mary would be built and put in service with Oceanic. Olympic and Mauritania would be scrapped to build two smaller motor ships Adriatic (III) and Baltic (III) Berengaria would be scrapped as Cunard botched her wiring. Titanic would also end up on the chopping block to build Olympic (II) to replace the Majestic on the Southampton run. Britannic and Aquitania would end up on the Liverpool Run, maybe Boston, maybe Halifax until WWII and then go to the scrap heap after war service. In 1950 White Star would buy out Cunard and the company would keep the White Star Name as to avoid the negativity associated with Cunard for the Lusitania Disaster.

[@fourlittlebirds6166]

I think most of what makes titanic so interesting is the stories about all the unique people that sailed. From first class passengers all the way down to third and crew. How would the lives of those people changed the world had they not perished? would they have continued in their relationships unchanged? We may never know. But thinking about all the good for generations to come that did come out of such a horrible disaster makes those lives lost not so futile.

[@91_C4_FL]

I wonder what the White Star Line would have accomplished had Titanic not sunk. Would they have had more new-build ships in the 20s and 30s before the Cunard merger? Would Oceanic III have been built?

[@johnbockelie3899]

She would have served on out til WW1 and carried troops . then either sunk or swam. After wards resume duty as an ocean liner. Eventually to retire.

[@AndyHappyGuy]

But maybe White Star would have a bit more money that they could use to build oceanic III. If the IMMC still existed because Titanic didn't happen, they could have been able to compete with cunard.

[@Daniel_Huffman]

The RMMV _Oceanic_ was scrapped because of the world's economy, not that of the WSL.

[@davinp]

It's unfortunate that Olympic wasn't made into a museum. White Star Line couldn't afford to do so due to financial problems. They had merged with Cunar.

[@hustonovich]

This could play off into two scenarios. One: Titanic hits the iceberg, but doesn't sink. Two: Titanic never hits the iceberg, and continues on without incident. The former could still have an impact on maritime safety laws, but to a different extent. If the latter occurred, there could've been far less pressure towards shipping companies to upgrade their safety features.

[@elrjames7799]

"To a point" is the key expression here: the super position principle in quantum mechanics, which suggests a 'multiverse' theory, is between two deterministic alternatives (the equations are linear), not an infinite number of imaginary variables.

[@robertaviles8451]

If TITANIC doesn't sink by iceberg, you would not have the forming of the International Ice Patrol.

[@mr.juniii5523]

Yep and iceberg’s will be happy for that no guards

[@Truecrimeresearcher224]

I think one of the other ships would have had Titanics fate

[@MacAdvisor]

If I may, a more interesting question might be what if wireless operator, Cyril Furmstone Evans, of the SS California had not shutdown for the night after being chastised by Titanic's wireless operator Jack Phillips, but heard the fateful distress call and the California arrived shortly after the Titanic sent for help. The California was nearly empty and would have likely arrived time to retrieve the passengers from the sinking Titanic. Not only could Titanic's boats be re-used, but California's boats could pitch in. Before the Titanic sank beneath the waves, virtually everyone on board could have been removed. There would still be loss of life as several of the crew, particularly the boiler room staff, were killed early on, but the vast majority of the 3,300 people could have survived. The idea the sea lanes were busy and ships could come to the rescue of a sinking one would have been validated. There weren't nearly enough supplies, so a very hungry group would have reached New York. Many famous and rich people would have survived. The Titanic would still be gone, but many would live.

[@rich_edwards79]

I'm actually in the camp of people who don't think it would had as much of an impact as is believed. Californian had shut down her boilers some hours before. It would have taken up to an hour for her to fire them back up to operating temperature, build steam pressure and then more time for her to steam the 5-10 miles over to Titanic's location. And then the transfer of passengers would have taken even more time, which they just didn't have on the night. Unless the Californian were to have drawn up alongside Titanic and carried out a direct transfer of pax using gangways (possible given that it was a calm sea, but still risky with Titanic rapidly sinking and liable to break up) I still think that many would have ended up in the water, and survival time in those temperatures is a few minutes at best. More may have survived, yes, but certainly not all.

[@triplescrewsteamers]

If the Titanic never sank, her and Olympic would have been so successful that the Hamburg Amerika line ships would have become unpopular and the H.A. line would not have had enough money for high quality steel in their new fleet of imperator-class ships. This meant that at her launch, the Imperator would have split in half, capsizing onto the peer and killing about 10,000 of the people watching. After this catastrophic event, all countries banned all new ships longer than 800 feet, so all ships longer than that in construction would have to be dismantled, including Britannic. During the war, both Titanic and Olympic became troopships and always traveled in the same convoy from Halifax to the front lines. They both survived the war. Having the largest ships in the world now, Britain poured money into maintaining these huge ships, allowing Harland and Wolf to completely remake the interiors and raise the bulkheads to B-deck. Both ships were refitted in Art deco style and all their old fittings were stored in the basements of 2 of the Harland and Wolff warehouses. Both ships never sailed with less than 2,000 passengers until 1925 when they were refitted with a tourist class accommodation and their capacity went down to 2,000 passengers. During the Great depression, White Star Line sold cheap cruises onboard both ships. The government had plans to make White Star Line merge with Cunard but decided that it would be better if Cunard merged with the newly formed Britain Express lines. Right before the second world war, in 1939, Olympic and Titanic were refitted again and everything was replaced with fireproof fittings after the burning of the S.S. Paris earlier that year. During the war, Hitler had a bounty of 250,000 Deutschmark to any Captain who sunk any of the two vessels. Both vessels were painted in navy green and sailed in a convoy together. Thanks to technical improvements and being converted to take oil instead of coal in the 1920s, they both had a top speed of around 25 knots. On one occasion, they encountered a fleet of 3, 500 ft nazi troopships with a top speed of 28 knots which in an attempt to sink one of the vessels, rammed themselves into the side of Titanic. All 3 of them hit Titanic's hull, flooding 5 watertight compartments, 3 on the port side and 2 on the starboard side. In total 16 of Titanic's crew drowned installing the pumps that would prevent Titanic from Capsizing. Olympic and Titanic's guns that they had been fitted with and the damage that the nazi ships recieved trying to sink titanic sank 2 of the ships and the 1 that stayed afloat had a flooded engine room. 1,496 people perished in that encounter with 712 of the nazi vessels' crew being recovered by Olympic who towed the last nazi ship back to New York. Luckily, Titanic's engine room had not been flooded but the Captain decided to evacuate the ship 's occupants onto Olympic and waited onboard Titanic for tugs. The next day, 8 tugs arrived to pull Titanic back to New York. She was laid up in a drydock in New York until the end of the war. From 1947 to 1950, she was repaired and returned to the the White Star line and remained in service until 1966 when both sisters were pulled from service. Olympic was sold to the city of Southampton and Titanic was sold to the City of New York to become floating hotels and museums. Both cities have an agreement that every 5 years, the ships exchange ports being towed across the Atlantic. In 1997, James Cameron made a movie about the Titanic sinking on her maiden voyage, which was filmed onboard the real ship. In 1970, Harland and Wolff were demolishing a few of their old buildings when they found Olympic's and Titanic's old fitting and both ships were refitted with them. Olympic and Titanic can be visited today with half of the original first class cabins and half of the second class cabins available for booking as hotel rooms.15 of the tourist class and 15 of the original third class rooms are available to visit. The rest of the space is reserved for the International Maritime museums onboard both ships. During the coronavirus pandemic, the extra space on Titanic (what once was boiler rooms 2, 3 and 4) was converted into a hospital for patients while the museum was closed. In 2011, on the centennial of their building, both ships still remained the largest commercial ships to ever enter service.

[@aestheticspace8862]

Triple Screw Steamers I find it difficult to believe that ships larger than 800 would’ve been banned, surely the governments of the countries would’ve come to the conclusion, that inferior steel was used in the imperator and therefore the flaw was not in her length but in her materials, making it unlikely for them to ban ships based purely on length

[@JWRogersPS]

Construction on the Imperator was already well on its way when Titanic sank. In fact, she was launched a month later. Her not sinking would not, in any way, made the Imperatror split in half. Nor would it have forced HAPAG to go under.

[@triplescrewsteamers]

Yes, I agree, it seems highly unlikely for something like that to happen, I needed a reason for Olympic and Titanic to stay popular...

[@AllenSymonds]

Wasn't Britannic originally called Gigantic?

[@DerpyPossum]

nope. just a myth!

[@AllenSymonds]

@@DerpyPossum It would seem so. However, it is still a somewhat live myth.

[@DerpyPossum]

@@AllenSymonds britannic was ALWAYS going to be called Britannic. no one i’ve met has had valid proof.

[@nicholasmaude6906]

If the Titanic never sunk we'd be likely talking about the Empress of Ireland tragedy.

[@charlietheanteater3918]

I’d be interested in a episode seeing what a rescue scenario would have looked like while the titanic was sinking. If there was a ship that was close to it.

[@Quasihamster]

Californian quietly sneaks out of the chat

[@Ekircher5]

Seeing how they barely got the boats off in time it's tough to figure out how they would have loaded more people into another ships lifeboats or offloaded and reused the Titanics boats without running out of time. They could've gotten more people out of the water, but considering they only had minutes to get them out I don't think many would've made it

[@charlietheanteater3918]

I know it really wouldn’t have made much of a difference, but was there a standard rescue procedure during 1912? Or was it non existent

[@en1909s9iah]

@@charlietheanteater3918 I think there were drills and training, Titanic had a lifeboat training drill on the Sunday morning it sunk, but it was cancelled for Captain Smith wanted to give service one last time before his retirement. They also had spreadsheets with the names of officers and their positions during a lifeboat situation. But it was thought that ships could not sink, and they could take quite some damage and still remain afloat. Titanic proved them wrong.

[@Rilhon]

We might have seen fewer deaths, but it would most likely still have resulted in a lot of people dying due to the lack of time which was needed for launching the lifeboats.

[@ijnfleetadmiral]

Olympic - serves in WWI alongside Titanic and Britannic; scrapped in 1935 Titanic - serves in WWI alongside Olympic and Britannic; scrapped in 1936 Britannic - serves in WWI alongside Olympic and Titanic; serves in WWII; scrapped in 1951

[@anormalcommentor9452]

Likely. Britannic had private baths and Olympic didn't. That was a major death blow for Olympic

[@TheHeater90]

Titanic is just a perfect storm for legendary status... the fact that it was her maiden voyage, the fact that there were so many prominent people on her, the fact that the disaster all took place at night in the freezing cold, the fact that she was the largest ship in the world at the time, the fact that she represents a microcosm of society, that fact that the Olympic class liners were touted as practically unsinkable, the fact that she is probably the most esthetically pleasing ship to look at ever built(opinion, I know, but a very popular one), hell, even the name, "TITANIC"... there's just something about it that captures the imagination. She represents both triumph and tragedy, both beauty and horror, both optimism and despair, both arrogance and humility.

[@shireknight01]

What a very good point that I've never heard made before -that the main reason a lot of people are even interested in ocean liners nowdays is because of what happened to Titanic.

[@imperator29]

There's a short story entitled "The Ship's Run" by M. McDonnell Bodkin that's set on board the Titanic. It's kind of a surreal read--Bodkin wrote it in 1908, and the Titanic's role in the story is quite minimal (though it's mentioned in passing that she's the "largest and fastest (!) passenger boat afloat"). But it does feel like a peek into the parallel universe you talk about here!

[@indy-fs6de]

The whole vibe of the opening reminds me of how episodes of The Adventures of Pete and Pete would start with the inquisitive, existential voice-over from the older Pete.

[@TheSonic1685]

Assuming the Titanic survived the great depression and made it to world war 2 which is unlikely she would've been scrapped after world war 2 due to her age. Either way you look at it Titanic's fate would've either been the same as the Olympic's or the Aquitania's with Olympic being more likely.

[@aodhganmerrimac]

Well thought out video! I agree that had she not sunk so dramatically on her maiden voyage she would be as lost to the mists of time as most other liner to the general public. White Star would have been in a much stronger financial position as well. The more interesting question now springs to mind-What if the Lucy hadn't been sunk?

[@TheJoeSwanon]

Ocean liners that did not have private bathrooms would be doomed beyond the 1930s people would’ve absolutely demanded it

[@troodon1096]

By the 1950's even the lowest passenger class on the ship had private bathrooms.

[@Scrubworks]

On the subject of alternate history and the Titanic, there is a game you should all play called Titanic: Adventure Out Of Time. It's a point and click adventure game from the mid 90s, and the plot is based on the premise that a series of minor events that occurred on the Titanic before it sank went on to shape the rest of the 20th century in drastically different ways. Fascinating game.

[@MattAShine]

The multi-verse is an interesting concept. The universe I would like to see is the one where Olympic is never scrapped, but they successfully convert her into a restaurant and hotel ship in the 1930s. Imagine a world where Titanic’s sister ship still exists and could still be visited and photographed today.

[@twilight-chanloafssanspie1493]

Not entirely about the Titanic but not only is it an interesting topic but it is the only surviving ship from the White Star Line. SS Nomadic. She is a very interesting ship and has some connections to the Titanic. She is the last surviving ship from the White Star Line and is currently placed right by the Titanic museum in Newfoundland. She is pretty unique as she has only one funnel and an interesting at her front bow (from the photos I could find). I'm impressed she made it this far! She was first launched April 25, 1911 (almost a year before Titanic's sinking). Maybe do some research about SS Nomadic. Maybe not make a video about her (which is understandable and she only barely had ties with Titanic) but it's an interesting topic to research about!

[@brentholt1458]

White Star had to pay the British Shipping Comptroller for Majestic/Bismarck. She cost £1,000,000. It is also likely stories of Britannic's construction being substantially slowed due to the loss of Titanic are exaggerated. White Star was done in by poor management by owners such as IMM and Royal Mail who drained the companies cash reserves.

[@geowynleda4641]

Captain Smith would have had an honourable retirement.

[@Daniel_Huffman]

I heard somewhere that Captain Smith would _not_ have retired after the _Titanic's_ maiden voyage, saying that he would continue to command her until the WSL completed an even greater vessel.

[@lawrencelewis8105]

I heard that the Titanic didn't sink. When it tied up at the pier in New York, a reported asked the first guy down the gangplank, "So how was your trip on the new luxury liner Titanic?" The guy said, "Boring."

[@hmskinggeorgev7089]

My take on: If Titanic does not sink ( AU ) So Titanic doesn't hit an iceberg and arrives in New York perfectly fine, she has a similar early life to Olympic. Then the great war brakes out and Titanic is brought into navy service. In this new part of her career she some how ends up fighting in the BATTLE OF JUTLAND... along side the Royal Navy's 5th Battle Squadron. Here she by some divine means she managed to sink a german battlecruiser, and if your wondering how she did this? well its in another universe so with the endless possibility's of timelines it bound to happen in one of them. :)

[@justinosborne1001]

If Titanic never sank, I'm not quite sure what my main hobby would have been all of my life. Titanic has consumed my interest for 28 years. Looks like it has consumed yours, too. I really appreciate all of the work you've done and how you've brought the ship back to life in a unique and accurate way. Even with all the research I've done on the ship in all of my years, you've challenged me to see her story and life a bit differently. Now, one little question to consider if Titanic never sank: Would Britannic have been named Gigantic? Where do you sit on that "idea"? Do you ever think she was going to be named Gigantic, and that WSL changed the name after Titanic's sinking?

[@paulheenan9098]

1. Shipping companies were anticipating an update to lifeboat regulations as their ships grew ever larger, hence why the Olympic class were built with capacity for lifeboats they never carried. (The shipping companies didn't know exactly when the regulations would be updated, and since they legally didn't have to carry the extra boats at the time, they didn't) The loss of Titanic simply accelerated these changes that would have happened eventually. 2. Britannic is an interesting "what if" scenario that would be better suited to having its own video. 3. White Star would have been a better financial situation if they hadn't have lost Titanic, but they would still have been the underdog in the Cunard-White Star merger. They had been passed around between different owners over the years and never had a chance to properly flourish while Cunard fiercely maintained their independence. As such, Cunard had a much larger and more modern fleet than White Star.

[@falcon664]

The mandatory increase in lifeboats is interesting. Many of the most famous ships that sank either sunk too quickly or listing prevented launch of the boats they had. Was there a later sinking that occurred under conditions that were as good for launching, i.e. calm, flat sea and very small list?

[@markportwood4045]

Very clever indeed Matthew; the analogies brilliant and fun. Thank you. Please can you chaps make a video about The Great Eastern. Cheers from England.

[@martod]

Has there been a maritime disaster since Titanic where having enough lifeboats saved lives? All the other ones I can think of the ship sank too fast, or it capsized, or rescue ships were close at hand, or the crew mishandled the crisis so much that the lifeboats were unused.

[@johnbockelie3899]

Queen Mary and Queen Elizabeth served in WW2 as troop.ships. Queen Mary is now at long Beach California. Queen Elizabeth was destroyed in a.fire in 1968. Both launched in 1939.

[@KevsterWilson]

What about the Costa Concordia in 2012. She hit rocks & started sinking straight away. The evacuation took over 6 hours in place of 30 minutes & cost 32 lives.

[@anormalcommentor9452]

@@johnbockelie3899 Queen Mary entered service in 1936 so no

[@tntornadox89]

I have often thought of what would have become of White Star had things been different. Certainly had both Titanic and Britannic survived they would have had the upper-hand on the Transatlantic trade over Cunard in the teens, in my opinion. While Cunard led with speed, White Star had the better product in the Olympic-class. With a three ship service of new, modern liners versus Cunard's rag-tag collection, I feel this would've propelled White Star to the forefront. If that's the case, I believe White Star would've capitalized on this and built the super-liner Oceanic before the Queen Mary ever came into being which would've cemented their dominance. Ultimately the two lines would've likely been forced to merge during the depression anyway, but in this scenario I see White Star being the dominant of the two with the Cunard name disappearing over time. Indeed, I think this scenario could've played out had just either Titanic or Britannic been saved. Which of course, looking further down the line, I do believe cruising would've became dominant just as it has. So it begs the question, would White Star be a Carnival brand today? Would there be a massive new "-ic" ocean liner built by Carnival, ala QM2 in service today? A huge, new liner with a buff funnel instead? It's fascinating to theorize, isn't it?

[@JWRogersPS]

WSL's passenger revenue did not suffer all that much in the long term due to the Titanic's sinking. The company was just as financially sound as Cunard in the 20s. The Olympic, Homeric, and Majestic were very popular ships. The depression did WSL in, just as it almost killed Cunard. Had all three Olympic Class liners survived the war, then the Bismark and Columbus would have gone somewhere else. WSL's fortunes would have been about the same, and the resulting merger would have still happened pretty much as it did.

[@lpclassic60]

Your implication near the end of this video that the sinking of the Titanic is distantly but directly to blame for Avatar frightens me

[@sebwilkins]

Olympic 1997: Jackielle and Rosard become bffs on olympic and fall off with everyone when she collides with hms hawke

[@SilverHedgehogX]

In the sequel to H.G. Wells' The War of the Worlds (The Massacre of Mankind by Stephen Baxter), The Titanic was able to survive her collision with the iceberg since she was constructed from an incredibly strong metal alloy that was developed by the Martians.

[@Mabidemonstrations]

I have thoughts like that all the time. Its hard not to let your mind wander.

[@jamesricker3997]

My great-great-grandfather had tickets on the Titanic's first eastbound voyage across the Atlantic He was not happy when it sunk

[@DerpyPossum]

i imagine nobody was happy when it sank...

[@TheSportscar86]

Matt, that is some REALLY DEEP "Quantum Leap" type thinking there.

[@davef.2811]

Have you any information on Titanic's refrigeration system(s)?

[@tobiaszczarnota7879]

In WW1, he would either be an amred merchant cruiser or a battlecruiser. My timeline also says that he participated at the Battle of Jutland in 1916.

[@MarEpor]

"who's leonardo decaprio?"

[@jeanoboyle2439]

What about Kate Winslet?

[@DerpyPossum]

@@jeanoboyle2439 who’s Kate Winslet?

[@Shipwright1918]

She'd be a footnote in maritime history instead of an entire chapter or a full book. At the time, Olympic was considered the more famous since she was the first of the class, but like any debutante, her time in the spotlight was short as newer liners came along, though she had her diehard fans to the end. Ships are like people, they are born, they live, and eventually they have to die. Preserved examples are outliers to this, and I suppose you might call this a living death, as relatively few preserved ships get to enjoy an active retirement and sail, even then most are only brought back to life briefly for special occasions.

[@docdaneeka3424]

4:25 why is Lurch from the Adams family standing in the middle?

[@TheFarmerfitz]

Britanic might not have been built.. So Titanic would have been the one made into the hospital ship for the war effort and it would now be where Britanic is... Maybe...lol

[@charliegood1967]

TheFarmerfitz Britain’s was being built when Titanic sank

[@anormalcommentor9452]

Britannic was already being built next to Titanic in 1911 and early 1912

[@titanicman9329]

Alternate history is a beautiful idea. Thank God we have such a genre as well as fanfictions.

[@jamesgroccia644]

Titanicman Aren’t fanfictions just people’s own interpretations of alternate history?

[@davidhoffman1278]

In the USA cruise ship fascination was significantly driven by the"Love Boat" television show. Surprisingly the State of Florida became more significant than the State of California in the USA cruise ship industry.

[@PassiveSmoking]

What would have been the knock-on effect for the International Ice Patrol and the SOLAS treaties? I'd imagine lifeboat capacity would go up regardless of whether or not Titanic sank (The Olympic class were designed with davits that could launch multiple boats in anticipation of such a change, after all), but what other safety measures would not be implemented or be delayed until some other disaster happened?

[@JuanGarcia-vb3du]

Maybe White Star would still be around as a cruise line. Maybe they be the largest in the world like Carnival. Its possible they would have started an airline in the 1950's to stay in business. American Overseas Airlines was started by a shipping company. Cunard operated a joint service with Eagle Airways in the 1960's. Probably world history would have been very different.

[@TitanicHorseRacingLover]

Great job, Matt. It is hard to say what would have happened.

[@ookieyeplays1355]

In The Alternate Universe: What if titanic sank by RMS Britannic University

[@anormalcommentor9452]

Just cranked out a video and perfect timing to see this now!

[@jordancorbineau3827]

First of all I love your videos ! I learn so much thanks to you :) Second: I don't want to be picky but Tuesday night will be the 16th of April and not the 17th right ? :O

[@truckingham3233]

I have always wondered what were the deciding factors for Olympic to be a troop ship and Britannic to be a hospital ship? And not the other way around? Or both one? Or both the other?

[@paulheenan9098]

Heavy war casualties resulted in Aquitania being diverted from troopship duties to hospital ship. Her now vacant role was filled by Olympic, but the number of casualties continuing to rise from the disastrous Gallipoli campaign resulted in the need for an additional hospital ship, which is where Britannic came in. (It was a rather vicious circle as one sister took you to the frontlines and the other brought you home either dead or wounded)

[@JJMHigner]

The era of the ocean liners would certainly have been epic, regardless, just without the added luster of Titanics drama. That addition, as Matt points out, might have contributed to the QM. The cruise industry would have happened more or less the same.

[@martinbeneteau309]

Many good points! Titanic not sinking would have probably had the third sister called Gigantic. Plus it would have looked closer in appearance to Titanic. No ugly lifeboat gantries.

[@paulhudson8321]

One thing about the the Olympic class trio is that the titanic and Britannic still exist where as the Olympic was scrapped.

[@kameronbrooks2016]

Ironically, the fact that it did sink is the best thing that could have happened for the ship in the long run

[@vammy_]

2:20 the third lifeboat in the picture pops

[@madmanmapper]

1:55 excuse me, wtf is that man WEARING?

[@anormalcommentor9452]

EW THATS HORRIBLE AND TACKY

[@GoodOlGranite]

Which one?

[@Gamex99999]

2:32 Is that me or I see Lusitania (of) Liverpool on the back of the stern?

[@jasperraine6104]

Is the world destruction thing referencing another video or something? I feel like it is.

[@KevsterWilson]

Another theory worth asking would be if Titanic had never had the coal bunker fire, Would she still have suffered the same damage that the Iceberg caused & sunk. As the Coal bunker fire had seemingly caused the metal to weaken & 1 of the bulkhead doors had jammed as the walls went out of shape. Also shifting the large amount of coal from the boiler to the other side gave the ship a lean as she was sinking.

[@anormalcommentor9452]

The "fire mark" in the photo is where the swimming pool was and the fire started post April 2nd.

[@anormalcommentor9452]

The real fire was around 40 metres away from the real fire which was completely below the waterline

[@K9TheFirst1]

My headcanon is that Titanic would have become a hospital ship, taking Britannic's place. And like Britannic, the doctors would have kept the portholes open while out at sea while sailing into a war zone. And given that this Titanic still has her as-build protection configuration, and the mines would have still been put in place, a Titanic that doesn't sink due to an Iceberg and becomes infamous, instead sinks due to a mine and becomes a footnote.

[@-Yurkey]

Most likely another liner would've taken Titanic's place because "less cluttered decks" would take precedence over lifeboats and that would be the norm until one of those giant liners sank with an unacceptable loss of life due to a lack of lifeboats...So I believe we'd just be saying that other ship's name instead od Titanic, but a lot of history would stay intact

[@KaiReactsWasTaken]

Maybe it got sunk in ww1 or scrapped next to the olympic or kept long enough to serve in the next war maybe then got sunk or survived. Then after the long history saved as a museum idk

[@KaiReactsWasTaken]

@Yumione SkyBedz yup

[@ookieyeplays1355]

0:13 v break theory lol

[@mr.juniii5523]

Hehe yes funny XD

[@MikinessAnalog]

This should also be a topic for AlternateHistoryHub to tackle. I would love to hear his take on this as well.

[@connern5791]

I can't get over the shot of Titanic flying

[@quillmaurer6563]

I sometimes see people lamenting that the Titanic sank as otherwise they'd love to see and sail aboard her. These people have no idea that Titanic had two sisters, one of which was scrapped, as Titanic would have been had she not sank. Her sinking was the only reason she was famous, the only reason anyone now knows that name. She wasn't even all that noteworthy in her time - a middle child in fact, Olympic (first) and Britannic (biggest) would have gotten more glory. The class was record breaking in size and accommodation, but these records were being broken frequently in the era, so the latest biggest ship wouldn't have really been all that big a deal. Likewise, bigger ships were built later on, far grander and more luxurious. Compared to a modern cruise ship, Titanic would actually be rather small.

[@DerpyPossum]

Matt needs to pin this.

[@pyriph]

I've seen this asked before on other sites but am curious what those more knowledgeable think....what if Titanic had, instead of what they actually did, aimed the bow directly at the iceberg and put the engines to full reverse? Would that have reduced how many compartments were breached and thus result in the ship remaining afloat? This is assuming they closed the water-tight doors before impact while they still operated.

[@anormalcommentor9452]

I mean it would destroy at least 4 compartments and be a bad fail

[@pyriph]

@@anormalcommentor9452 Right...the front of the ship would be totally wrecked but would it remain afloat for them to get (slowly) taken back to port or would that still be the end for the ship as a whole, I wonder? I remember hearing of another ship (SS Suevic) that had the original bow cut/blown off and a replacement installed in 1907...I wonder if they would have gone this route? (kzbin.info/www/bejne/iKHVoqmAeNp7Z8k)

[@TechnologicallyTechnical]

If Titanic hadn't sunk, we would've avoided WWII because of something to do with a painting, I don't remember the specifics.

[@AndyHappyGuy]

AOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT

[@xavierlauzac5922]

World War II would’ve still happened.

[@DerpyPossum]

@@xavierlauzac5922 it’s a joke

[@davids6898]

It would be nice if titanic survived to be a museum ship like the Queen Mary. I have been to the Queen Mary and it is a bit of a taste to what Titanic would have been like although the interior of the Queen Mary is much more Art Deco.

[@-C.S.R]

The piano drove me crazy! 😫

[@johnboy4025]

Titanic would have still had some game because the ship that becomes the “New Titanic” makes all the ocean liners famous like Titanic did in our universe. Also, Empress of Ireland... disaster. But I think that Titanic’s story got famous because they not only didn’t have enough lifeboats but with all hands on deck and enough lifeboats, Titanic could have had MUCH fewer casualties and most of not all lifeboats would have been launched

[@gloriahanes6490]

Parallel Universe - I've heard of this theory where another dimension with scenarios different than ours and we have a mirror image of us in another dimension.

[@titanicbigship]

What is the back of the titanic/the stone section never sunk

[@falcon664]

Not addressed is if Titanic didn't sink, the International Ice Patrol would not have been formed. The question then is would another liner have hit a berg at a later date? What if a cargo ship hit a berg? Would that have been a big enough loss of life and cargo to form the Ice Patrol?