Lessons from Gaming: Gothic II Review

[@amoawesomeart6074]

There are so many great things about Gothic 2, however one that for some reason really stuck to my memory is the little cave near/behind the Old Camp, in the first game you will meet there a guy who is hiding due to owning debs but in the sequel you can go to exact same spot and read a message he left that was something like this "a week has already passed and it's weirdly quiet, I think I will just get out and see whats going on", and that's such perfect thing to happen in the setting since this guy just living as a hermit and had no idea about the fall of magic ore mine or the upcoming orc army attack.

[@ArhonOkvals]

Indeed! It really makes you feel like this gothic world stops for no one!

[@Alexandru1996_]

Good review. I have played both Gothic and Gothic 2 multiple times, more times than i can remember, with all the factions and i have to say that G2 was my favorite. I still play it some times :) And a real pleasure to watch this video.

[@ArhonOkvals]

Thank you for the kind words! I really tried to nail down what makes Gothic 2 so special to all of us and I'm glad we agree! See you in the Temple next time!

[@khatack]

G1 all the way. G2 is a lot better technically, but what it gains in better writing, pacing and such, it loses in atmosphere and personality. I love G2, but G1 is the truly good shit.

[@Hynotama]

“I bet I can handle your sword” That sounded better in his head. A magician would never say something so embarrassing.

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@Hynotama The Nameless Hero knows how to handle rods.

[@Hynotama]

@@ArhonOkvals well my mage only does pikes and wands. He’s a sensible fella. 🤣

[@Veellinn]

Magician would distribute all the sausage he can. And what is little sausage between friends.

[@lderintp9380]

Gothic 1 and 2 are one off the best games ever made. They might feel a little clunky and unfinished but they are what an rpg should be like. The rough start at the beginning and your hard earned strenght and gold is what makes me come back to them all the time since my childhood. Also the dialogs are just brilliant for me as a german they just hit perfectly.

[@ArhonOkvals]

Yeah I always wondered how does it feel to hear all the voices in native german. For me the meme level english dub of Nyras and Bromor gove Gothic 1 and 2 its charm.

[@thevikingsock8527]

The seeker and item looting part was hilarious

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@thevikingsock8527 and true for any real gothic fan!

[@DrSnack-fr2uy]

Glad to see two of my favourite games of all time getting more appreciation with a nice educative spin. Keep up the great work!

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@DrSnack-fr2uy Thank you my friend! Welcome to the Temple! /punch

[@SBBBurney]

This only has 400 views? Man, what the hell! Great video!

[@ArhonOkvals]

All in due time my friend! Welcome to the Temple! 😁

[@SBBBurney]

@@ArhonOkvals Thanks! Please make more! The playable Sequel demo is really good and chalk full of immersion features like you mentioned in your G1 review, do recommend! :)

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@SBBBurney Will add it to the list definitely. I'll have more specific lessons in the future for sure!

[@AlexAegisOfficial]

did you know that when you ask for companions for the final battle, if you ask diego to come, then reject, he will go back to change clothes again, if you ask him again to come he won't have the shadow armor anymore and just goes to the ship naked. (at least that's how I remember I triggered this bug, it was a while ago, here's a video pnsHAjYFDp0)

[@ArhonOkvals]

No idea! In my 15+ years of playing Gothic II, I never could reject Diego 😂

[@Dvirankis]

Great video. I am using gothic games 1 and 2 for DnD campaign, and while the game does leave a few loose ends, it's amazing how different groups of players are able to come up with the ideas of those gaps. This game was my first step in RPG, and still sticks to this day.

[@ArhonOkvals]

Thank you! Fully agreed! Whether by accident or intentionally, Gothic's lore is empty in just the right places. Still my critique stands and I wish there was more of it 😣.

[@Stuka1NCOMING]

Great video! Interesting to analyse Gothic for developers :D A big point is of course the 3 different factions give unique quests, bringing insane immersion eg. monastery novice quests.

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@Stuka1NCOMING Sausage quest immersion in the monastery! 🙌

[@m4djoker890]

This is a very good format, keep it up improve and don't give up you're getting places!

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@m4djoker890 The Temple needs all the encouragement it can get! Thank you! I hope to see you around!

[@maxmuller6730]

Just found your channel, thanks for the great content 👍

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@maxmuller6730 The Temple provides! Thank you and be welcome!

[@janneruda3350]

Is the guy on the photo at 2:46 Petr Pavel, the president of The Czech Republic? If so, it`s hillarious that he is an ilustration of "Xardas, the major ally from the first game, who has your back".

[@ArhonOkvals]

One temple rohlik for you man of culture! 😁

[@janneruda3350]

@@ArhonOkvals What made you use his picture for the video? This guy would never destroy the rune magic... :D

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@janneruda3350 Knowledge of Czech memes.

[@andron417]

IMHO the main problem of Gothic3+ is the characters. I mean, you completed the quests in Ardea, Cape Dun, Montera whatever and... see you never. You cannot even remember their names. While in Gothic1, Gothic2 those characters are with you till the end of you journey. P.S. Awesome video

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@andron417 Thank you my friend! Be welcome at the temple. Also I'm not in a decades long denial or anything, but Gothic 3 was never released!

[@khatack]

Is that screen from Soul Reaver a hint that you might do a video about the LOK games perhaps? ^^

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@khatack I see you are a man of culture. I plan to cover parts of it in the future ;)

[@khatack]

@@ArhonOkvals Sounds awesome; they're brilliant teaching material considering that about every single game in the series has almost unforgivable flaws (block-athon enemies in SR2, the camera of doom in Defiance), but they also manage to be absolutely brilliant on other fronts, mainly storytelling. Those games should offer a massive WEALTH of talking points of both brilliant successes and pronounced failures. Suffice it to say that when I get a chance to revisit Nosgoth without having to actually play the games, I take that chance every time! Absolutely looking forward to any insightful Legacy of Kain content ^^

[@fantasywind3923]

It's great that those games receive the proper prais and attention all those years later!!! Damn I always loved Gothic 1 and 2 :)..it's a shame that from what I heard the follow ups weren't as strong....and certainly the most recent entries like Arcania Gothic tale urr and it's expansion.....are well....let's just say it's no longer the same! But indeed the story of Gothic 2 showing itself as giant rippling effect of consequences of the actions of the first game story...was brilliant narrative move and how well it played into the depiction of the setting.....Gothic 2 visiting the colony again...Valley of Mines like a sort of twisted 'return home' if we can call it that and seeing just how things changed for the worse :) was great. In general there is a lot that Gothic games can teach the modern game developers!!! (by the way let's hope they won't completely butcher that Gothic 1 Remake!). By the way it is said that the CD Projekt makers of the Witcher games are somewhat inspired by the Gothic....the type of world and the consequences in the narrative etc....

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@fantasywind3923 So far the remake looks good from the demo. Fingers crossed the Archolos devs have a lot of say there!

[@sheezy2526]

Yeah I think I am one of the few people who think Gothic 1 was better in almost everyway. Even the AI is better, in Gothic 2 the unarmed and unarmoured farmers will perform jumping kicks on those stone monsters while in Gothic 1 NPC's run away with a silly animation from any enemy they can't handle. When I lured some Snappers to one of the NPC's living just outside the Old camp on the path to the new camp, I saw this happening. Any NPC u already gave a beating to will look away or say something that implies he didn't see anything if they see the player attacking someone else. In a way it makes sense since there is some law and order in Gothic 2 since it is not a prison colony.

[@ArhonOkvals]

I see. Hmmm for me Gothic 1 is better thematically but Gothic 2 wins in gameplay and story (with notr).

[@hushix3]

Gothic 2 is such a good game but the fact that you need to level up so much makes it a chore to replay nevertheless I still find myself coming back to it

[@ArhonOkvals]

I honestly found myself enjoying the min max process over time even though i'm not a minx maxer myself in games. I guess it's because it complements the power curve.

[@kleonhs]

26:19, is that a metaphor for what the orcs did to the paladins?

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@kleonhs Good eye! A man of culture is always welcome at the Temple!

[@mrgodBG]

svaka čast za ovaj serial 👌

[@ArhonOkvals]

Nije mi velicanstven hram kao Savin, ali svakako si dobrodosao! Hvala, uzivaj! 😁

[@mrgodBG]

@@ArhonOkvals veruj mi da sam baš uživao, 80-to sam god, sećam se kao juče kad sam pročitao Macedonićevu recenziju u SK-u, znao sam da moram da nabavim igru i našao sam je kod SKC pirata neki dan kasnije. to veče kad sam prvi put igrao pamtim kao sinoć da je bilo... da ne davim više, ne samo da ti je video/produkcija/naracija vrh nego me si me pogodio u nostalgiju 👌😁 aj u zdravlje

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@mrgodBG Ma uzivaj samo. Tek ce biti nostalgije hahaha 😁.

[@Edvardius]

15:10 splendid, I lol'd xD

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@Edvardius It's funny cuz it's true.

[@khatack]

Oh, but dragons definitely ARE occult. Not the generic fantasy dragons, but the Devil is described as the Dragon in the Bible. Other interesting fun fact is the meaning of the word Seraphim, one of the classes of celestial creatures in service to God in the Old Testament. The Hebrew word Seraphim means very literally "snake that burns". I think "occult", while absolutely descriptive of gothic, is not COMPLETELY spot on, and I think the missing element from Gothic 2 is the distinctly Lovecraftian flavor of Gothic Occult imagery.

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@khatack Interesting, I didn't know that about dragons. Maybe it's the occult/demon theme of Gothic that does not match well with dragons.

[@khatack]

@@ArhonOkvals I think it's more the dragons of G2 are way too generic fantasy dragons and don't have that demonic feel to them. I think there may have been a way to make the dragons feel less like beasts and more like demonic spiritual entities. Have them change shape to disguise as humans, have them be more manipulative and cunning, have a cult of dragon worshippers infiltrating Khorinis and have bases of operation throughout the Island and the valley of mines, etcetera etcetera. I think the whole orc invasion was a bit of a mistake, it's a bit too in your face compared to the much more subtle threat of the sleeper in G1. At the very least the orcish presence shouldn't have been so dominant, instead having a more subtle threat ambushing the Paladins when they try to move the ore or send word for help rather than immediately besieging the entire castle. Another mistake they made I think is having more than one dragon. Having only one dragon that has a Sauron-like presence in the world you feel through the intermediaries of his power rather than direct interference. In essence, they should've designed another evil arch-demon that happens to be a dragon, and I think it would've felt a LOT closer to the occult feel of original Gothic.

[@pander7652]

Can anybody tell me what games /which game are / is screenshoted in 30:17 and 30:20. I think I played them

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@pander7652 Those should both be from Guild Wars 1 I think. Ascalon is the name of the kingdom if i'm not mistaken.

[@bloodwynn]

Do you plan video on Chronicles of Myrtana?

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@bloodwynn Eventually, when the Temple People are many! The good word of Archolos must be spread far and wide!

[@Maesterful]

One of the best if most flawed games out there

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@Maesterful The flaws add to the character really.

[@Maesterful]

@@ArhonOkvals Fair point. The same can't be said for 3 onwards though 😂

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@Maesterful Yeah, real shame Gothic 3 was never released...

[@kognitiveresonanz]

Good lord you're hilarious

[@ArhonOkvals]

A lesson is only half-effective without humor. Welcome to the Temple!

[@khatack]

Gothic 2 is SO MUCH better WITHOUT the addon.

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@khatack Sadly I'd have to disagree, Gold Edition is the complete experience for me.

[@khatack]

@@ArhonOkvals Have you played through the game without the addon? The pacing is so much better. The problem with the addon is that it feels like its artificially attached to the game, and the first chapter is just way too much with all the content of the vanilla game AND the missing people quest slapped together. Jharkendar, as much as I love it, is just so completely divorced from everything else that is going on with the game that it just doesn't work. I wish they had found a way to more properly tie the Addon to the main questline instead of doing its own thing. Sometimes less is more, and that is the case with G2. NotR is definitely worth playing through, but I'd recommend everyone to play through the vanilla game first at least once before going for the Addon.

[@ArhonOkvals]

@@khatack I suppose that is the dividing line then, whether one considers Jharkendar worth it. For me, absolutely, just completes the experience.

[@khatack]

@@ArhonOkvals I think both positions can be true simultaneously. I absolutely love Jharkendar, and it is absolutely worth playing, but I still think that the overall experience is better without it. Like I said, I really wish they had figured out a way to introduce the addon in a way that didn't break the flow of the original game; if they ever do a remake of G2, I hope they tackle this issue some way. One thing that could be done with the Addon that would make it fit better into the rest of the game is to divide its content into the later chapters, I think it frontloads way too much. The vanilla chapter 3 is pretty scarce on content in comparison to the other chapters, so what if the people start going missing during chapter 2 and chapter 3 is when you actually tackle the issue? Obviously it wouldn't work that simply, there would have to be some build-up in chapter 1 and such, but I absolutely think that the addon should have been distributed more evenly throughout the game. Another thing that could've improved the experience would've been to have the nameless hero FAIL to get Raven in Jharkendar and have Raven escape to Irdorath and expand on that part of the game. Anyway, as is, the game with the addon simply has way too many things that stick out like a sore thumb and just feel wrong or otherwise out of place that I still prefer the overall experience of the vanilla game. If they managed to blend the addon in better with the main game, I'd probably have a different take, as like I've repeated several times already, I absolutely love Jharkendar.

[@seezy1]

I only agree about the pacing. But that's it. So mostly disagree.

[@goxy701]