Criticisms of Bitcoin | Nic Carter and Lex Fridman

[@vitobrusnik6953]

I think that the "Satoshi Nakamoto criticism" goes the other way around. Not that all the coins from those early wallets would be sold and BTC price would crash. But rather that if BTC became main global currency, Satoshi Nakamoto would become the richest, most powerful entity in the world. And no one knows who that is.

[@okthennone]

It’s mind blowing when you think of it that way. HODL

[@zaaxi7424]

Satoshi is Hal Finney, who passed away

[@crotchy7667]

That makes sense too. Satoshi just sounds like a placeholder for wealthy individuals or corporations who could amass Bitcoins just like they accumulate dollars. And the world would still be beholden to the oligarchy.

[@user-DongJ]

So then one should wait until 2109 before investing in BTC? Just to make sure that Satoshi has died of old age & nobody else is moving those bitcoins?

[@MisterCovek]

Bitcoin will never become the main currency in the world. And it doesn't have to. As a currency, it's got plenty flaws. But as a digital gold and a store of value, it's pretty much perfect. And that's all that it needs to be.

[@Dmoney12346]

The fed: PeOPlE UsE BiTcOIn FoR dRuGs Any rational person: and they never used cash ?

[@christaylor8337]

So how many people in the U.S. pay cash for fentynyl from China, directly? How many use Bitcoin? I'll take my answer off the air, thanks.

[@TherealJesseLivermore]

@@christaylor8337We will never know

[@DarinPirkey]

For the "silk road" argument, I always say that you do know you can use the US Dollar for drugs too right?

[@ClaudioMartella]

you cannot use US dollar to buy drugs online though, as you d be tracked. That was the point, the same way you cannot use bitcoin to buy drugs on the street.

[@rubensantos578]

@@ClaudioMartella you can. You just pay With PayPal friends and family lmao.

[@MrEmbrance]

Good luck

[@TheHellogs4444]

@@rubensantos578 wtf. How is fucking paypal untraceable lmao. You think that one unique transaction of a few hundred dollars to a completely random stranger will not be easily flagged?

[@cameronmagdaleno2288]

Ever heard of Venmo?

[@idh65]

So the Silk Road criticism is that is was adopted by the black market? That’s pretty shallow. Should we not also use HD video players since porn adopted it first? Just because something you don’t like was an early adopter, doesn’t mean the tech isn’t valuable

[@MysticalPolymath]

its a poor argument. people will buy illegal shit no matter what.

[@idh65]

@@MysticalPolymath exactly, I wonder what people used to buy drugs before Bitcoin. Should probably do away with that form of currency as well /s

[@MysticalPolymath]

@@idh65 I agree, no need for sarcasm lol

[@Young516_]

@@MysticalPolymath lmao fool kept goin 😹😹

[@rasputozen]

You ever thought the energy consumed by cryptocurrencies is just a byproduct of our mistrust of one another.

[@Psionyc]

Distrust*

[@socrates_the_great6209]

Nothing new about that. For the same reason, we will maybe never have world peace man.

[@dogstar5572]

I concur, here in Iceland we have hydro/geothermal electricity sources. A lot of Bitcoin mining happens here.

[@IWaxBux]

All he did was repeating the criticism without actual useful counter point

[@makiroll9960]

exactly, kid is awful

[@blottolotto7648]

I hear u but the guy has literally rebuked or tried to rebuke these claims mannnnny times already. Not saying he is right or wrong but that basically his life's work is writing & studying BTC. Check out some of his work.

[@quaidcarlobulloch9300]

Can you mention competing coins that are more efficient?

[@gercius]

Dogecoin

[@plasticman2011]

More efficient, but less secure, sure.

[@aarinteich]

Fabulous interview!

[@VagabundoOMC]

0.0074% of addresses hold 50% of Bitcoin. How is this not a Ponzi scheme?

[@plasticman2011]

Addresses is not the same thing as entities. For example, an exchange address holds funds on behalf of hundreds of thousands of customers.

[@VagabundoOMC]

​@@plasticman2011 I see what you are saying. Seven entities are exchanges, 7 out of the 0.0074%.

[@nickmatthews7600]

Oil and gas companies are now using excess gas wells they used to flare (burn) off to power bitcoin mining facilities out in the field as well

[@turretstudios9907]

Anyone: "...Crashing the price of bitcoin" Me: "that would be formidable"

[@thistle_boy]

It is definitely weird that no one knows who made Bitcoin

[@drfighter4467]

Its the beauty of it!

[@lukenewton2721]

what happens with the 4 Million coins lost.. so is the supply 21m or 17m?

[@ahmos9090]

17m in circulation

[@TheBanterCity]

Btc is not geographically independent. 65% mining happens in China

[@konradb2010]

Majority of the world's production happens in China.

[@zaaxi7424]

"Bitcoin isn't backed by anything"

[@BritonRites]

If you think that then neither is the dollar, gold, diamonds or any other fiat currency. Bitcoin is backed by Math and is the scarcest asset in the world.

[@zaaxi7424]

@@BritonRites Of course Gold is back by something, the physical ownership of the asset, there's a reason governments fill their vaults with it, the dollar is not backed by gold correct but backed by the largest military in the World

[@zaaxi7424]

@@BritonRites The only thing that backs Bitcoin is the energy required to mine blocks, btw I'm a big believer in crypto I just find this argument the most difficult to dispel

[@crotchy7667]

Scarcity and proof of work. It's like saying the basket I crafted in Everquest is worth billions because I worked on it for months and it's scarce because I made it uniquely ornate. 🤣🤣🤣 Bitcoin is backed by trust. There's nothing wrong with that. The algorithms prove it's not easily counterfeited so that helps with the trust part. Fiat currency is backed by government and the country's economy that uses that currency. It can be printed by the government to stimulate the economy during times of crisis. Bitcoin is as useful to monetary sovereignty as gold turned out to be. That is, not at all. Look at what happened to Greece during the 2008 financial crisis. It owed money to IMF. Greece was forced to obey austerity measures until the citizens had finally had enough. Bitcoin can still be an officially recognized currency but it would be disastrous for a country to replace their fiat currency with Bitcoin or back their currency with Bitcoin.

[@crotchy7667]

@@zaaxi7424 Some governments have been selling off their gold assets.

[@Vurtcone]

Way to not acknowledge any real criticisms of Bitcoin.

[@quaidcarlobulloch9300]

It can be useful and have an alternative

[@Hobby428]

Is it that China has the most mining equipment mining Bitcoin or just the largest Bitcoin mining pool?

[@TheNewMediaoftheDawn]

As a layman (and deadbeat) who doesn’t know much about code, my simple criticism of Bitcoin is how can we trust there isn’t a master code behind it to create more coins, or manipulate the system... We have to trust in the democratic process of it, if we can’t check for ourselves, which probably less than 5% of the population can... It’s just like trusting in regular currency that the feds or federal reserve are being honest and not printing too much. It’s a good concept, but not easy for average people to get or trust...

[@TheNewMediaoftheDawn]

Yes I watched it... It would require a tremendous amount of time and energy and skill that most don’t have to understand it, and theoretically there could still be a master coder or hacker behind the scenes fooling the chain? Or the creators created a back door? I don’t have the skill to figure it out... But I hope it is as it is supposed to be, thx for the vid.

[@zaaxi7424]

Lots of crypto coding is open source, anyone can view the code, projects like Cardano rely on academic peer review to test the resilience of the technology, there is no hidden coding that will rob you of your money, I doubt institutions like Banks would be buying in if this kind of thing was a legitimate risk to their clients

[@crotchy7667]

@@zaaxi7424 Open source code can still have vulnerabilities. Remember the OpenSSL "heartbleed" vulnerability?

[@JustinMasayda]

Value concerns but some thoughts: Bitcoin's source code is publicly visible, too many independent developers are watching Bitcoin for something devious to be planted in it without anyone noticing. Plus, as long as the code doesn't auto-update, nodes have to independently update to the latest version for any changes to code to apply, making it impossible for a bad release to impact the entire network simultaneously.

[@jpphoton]

bitcoin's main problem is bandwitch. too much energy and time required to settle the books. theoretically, what is the optimal time and energy requirements in a peer-to-peer context?

[@malteb4108]

Considering that Nic Carter was prepared for the questions, specifically on energy consumption, he didn't do his homework. Energy that wouldn't otherwise have gotten to anyone's socket. That is just really far off reality. His comments on Chinese bit coin mining are ever further off.

[@konradb2010]

I'd love the Bitcoin price to be crushed to sub 10k USD prices so that I could buy way more.

[@jonbloom1870]

Why would you spend a ccy that's inherent supply algo means itll inflate in price?

[@StrayCatInTheStreets]

Imma need about three-fiddy bitcoins. It was at that point, I realized this was no nerdy keyboard warrior, it was that damn lochness monstur!

[@climaxhubbard]

let it go man. that hasn't been funny for like 6 years..

[@StrayCatInTheStreets]

@@climaxhubbard ok lochness monstur

[@choiceblade]

This conversation is the single most coherent, relevant, and concise explanation for how and why bitcoin consumes energy which I have ever heard...and I've been looking...like, a LOT.

[@crotchy7667]

All I heard him say was that it's cheap to buy electricity in China, so that's why people like to do their Bitcoin mining in China.

[@makiroll9960]

@@crotchy7667 yep, thats all he said. the "excess" of electricity he talks about actually means that: its cheap in china

[@Youtube_ban_me]

ETH is a better digital asset and dont let these btc shills tell you other wise.

[@ithinkimhipster502]

One thing worth considering is that the value of bitcoin is tied to the U.S dollar and its value is inversely proportional to the stability of the U.S dollar. If we take this to its logical extreme and the US dollar collapses, what happens to the value of bitcoin?

[@MrNeed2c]

It will skyrocket!!!

[@crotchy7667]

No, I don't think the value of Bitcoin is tied to the US dollar. Why do you think that?

[@littlevini]

Bitcoin is the coin of choice for those states that are going to try and leave the union in America. American banks get transaction fees when you spend USD and ultimately fund your treasury, But with Bitcoin it's the country that hosts the most Bitcoin mining equipment (Texas and china). Don't give your money to the enemy.

[@AlexM-yh8tf]

Lex, please fact check your guests. Nic's comments about energy are absolutely wrong. There is not such a thing as "stranded" energy. China's energy matrix is made mostly out of coal, gas and hydropower, all of these are energy types you can store. The Chinese are not burning gas or coal that they don't need, that is ridiculous. You can have INSTALLED CAPACITY greater than your needs but still you don't need to burn everything at 100% all the time. Energy production is setup with this in mind, consumption fluctuates all the time. Some energy is lost due to transmission/distribution and load balancing but no individual consumer gets to access this. If it was that easy to access this why would only BC miners do it? The reason people mine in China is because energy is cheap and plentiful. This type of silly half-baked explanations I see from bitcoin enthusiasts makes me see them not as visionaries that know more than the rest of the population but as self-deluded victims or scam artists.

[@S3maxime16]

Google China energy curtailment and maybe don't speak when you don't know the topic?

[@j.d.c.777]

Cardano/Ethereum 🚀

[@zaaxi7424]

Polkadot!

[@ABrandNewU]

Nice

[@ABrandNewU]

We could do a podcast together

[@captnuggets1611]

So bitcoin is illegitimate but designed for everybody to make more "bitcoin". If someone made gains and sell their bitcoin for fiat again, then spends that money into the regular market place, wouldn't it cause more inflation. I dont see the difference in making money in bitcoin and wallstreet printing money. What I do know is that as shaky as the dollar, it still means something. what does one bitcoin mean?

[@coltrider17]

Main issue with cryptocurrencies of any kind, they have no intrinsic value. The price is completely reliant on public opinion and sentiment. Look at dogecoin, was nothing until Musk started pushing it

[@turbodewd1]

crypto is ewaste, energy waste, not fast, not decentralised, its crime...its sht

[@William_Fields]

As for Satoshi’s satoshis, what if the owner chose to distribute them among the unbanked at some point in the future. Imagine a Bitcoin Grant managed by smart contracts with AI evaluating individuals of historical exclusion from modern banking. Wouldn’t this be a fulfilment of the humanitarian praxis of Bitcoin?

[@saidbendif2834]

Backing money by energy is pure genius😈

[@TheRastacabbage]

For me to get crypto, I have to spend actual money. Then I cant use the crypto for anything. So I have to sell it, to get my real money back

[@JustinMasayda]

But between uses, you can be sure that it will never be impacted by inflation, unlike the money you use for daily purchases. Plus, as more people adopt, you may find a seller that will trade with you directly in BTC.

[@TheRastacabbage]

It could drop from $100,000 a coin to $0.50 a coin. Because it's only use is tied to real money

[@JohnnyDunn]

#veve !

[@robbieparis07]

This is what I am having trouble comprehending, so someone tell me where I am going wrong. If Bitcoin is accepted as a world currency, and lets say it reaches $1m/ coin. People like The Winklevoss Twins who own about 1% of all bitcoin will, simply by buying bitcoin will control much of the worlds wealth. Looking at the rest of the top bitcoin holders, it's not the best list overall.

[@LuciferArc1]

No. Its more like gold. Just because they own a bunch doesn't mean they own the majority of the wealth. Bitcoin isn't the only form of payment. We have stable coins on other blockchains which are pegged to fiat. Although if say fiat goes digital, it simply gets pegged to the digital variant of that fiat. Plus holding other/multiple assets can attain a relative amount of wealth to btc. Say you bought eth, ADA, and other blockchain coins early, you'd be up there with them as well. With blockchain being decentralized, the wealth you hold doesn't mean as much anymore due to deflationary assets and cheaper services. Plus it's again, decentralized...they wouldn't control any crypto unless it's centralized. Decentralization solves a ton of wealth issues in the end

[@richardmatt631]

People will be kicking themselves in few weeks if they miss the opportunity to buy and invest in bitcoin

[@rasputozen]

iM hOlDiNg GuYs

[@christianjoachimgruber2773]

Proof of stake, baby.