LGR - Evolution of PC Audio - As Told by Secret of Monkey Island

Computer audio has come quite a way since 1981. Here is a short video I made comparing the major steps from the PC speaker to Adlib on up to today's chips! At least, from the perspective of the Lucasarts classic, The Secret of Monkey Island.
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Monkey Island was chosen due to its having a wide breadth of versions of the same song, as compared to many other games which didn't support this many cards. The final version of the song is from the recent "Secret of Monkey Island Special Edition" on PC/360/PS3 - recorded using live instruments, NOT the CD-ROM version from the early nineties. See the menu it was taken from here: • Monkey Island: Special...
Some clips recorded by me, others from Crossfire Designs
www.crossfire-designs.de/index...

[@aarorasilainen]

That PC speaker really has some charm to it. Maybe I just like square waves.

[@robotsnake9374]

Yeah, to me, it sounded a bit like there was a guitar playing some notes of the background.

[@TankdozerCavalry]

You're such a square, gosh~~

[@MrDeeg05]

I see why

[@kidwolf0015]

Honestly, most things that come out of those speakers are downright painful... There was a ton of effort, resources, and talent put into Monkey Island's PC Speaker Theme. Keep in mind that only 1 voice was available for it (the PCjr had 3 voices for comparison). This is one of the best pieces composed with it in mind. Honestly, I wouldn't call it a fair example of the average IBM PC speaker experience. I personally love the Speaker version of Monkey Island, but almost everything else that uses them I would stay clear from.

[@larsjj2794]

Real audio has curves

[@Real_Retrophilia]

Who else thinks the Roland still sounds better than the CD audio version? 2019 and I'm still watching this on a regular basis. Love the story of music and soundcards in computer. And the MT32 will always be king... :D

[@siliconecheese697]

I agree, the M32 has some of the best sound, but I also like adlib, something about it I like.

[@Alianger]

There's another CD version from 1992 which I think sounds better than this one. But it uses similar instruments to the MT-32 one anyway

[@reanimationxp]

@@siliconecheese697 same, probably just nostalgia bc we had a sound blaster original, but same i like both equally

[@alliedmastercomputer5407]

eh....why would this even be a debate? MT32 is the original and isnt bad quality in terms of what it does.

[@EarFarce4]

Roland LAPC-1/MT-32 is my favorite. :)

[@diamondburned5229]

still it's luxury

[@DJCureTunezMusic123]

Mine too :O This quality is magnificent!

[@McGuinty2]

That's because the MT-32 is the hardware that the game was intended to use in the first place. In fact, there are some sound effects in the game that use particular features and quirks of the MT-32's engine that don't exist on later hardware which means that it only truly sounds right if you either own that hardware or emulate it with Munt.

[@clayh254]

McGuinty2 FM Synthesis is my favorite. You know, the Adlib and the Sound Blaster.

[@CaptainStrannik]

McGuinty2 I like pc speaker and SB16 AWE 32

[@Irisfantasies]

AdLib 1987 sounds amazing...

[@Schwarzorn]

It’s the harmonies. It makes it possibly the best rendition of the song. Tho the arrangement of the CD version is pretty much just as good, but for different reasons.

[@saladedemais]

my fav too

[@alliedmastercomputer5407]

Adlib for some things actually sounded better than the Mt32 but overall the mt32 is the better one to own. Sometimes Adlib in some games just sounded better, whereas the Mt32 sounded a bit fake or hollow

[@LGR]

@pozzo1979 The first CD audio version was indeed MIDI equipment captured in a studio. The final clip in the video is from the 2009 game's menu, recorded with real instruments (admittedly I could have chosen the better "Introduction" music....)

[@sirstrongbad]

I love how much they were actually able to get out of a PC Speaker, when so many games the first thing I would do is turn off the sound as it usually just sounded like grinding noise

[@stevemaherart]

Hey LGR I just wanted to let you know I feel this is one of the most culturally significant things you have done, I hope your proud of it, keep up the great work.

[@LGR]

Thanks!

[@stevemaherart]

No, actually, thank you. I mean it man, I found your channel about a fortnight ago, the more I explore through things the more great computer historical stuff I find, fair play.

[@whearp]

I have to agree. I've been watching LGR for a while now, and only just found this one. What an excellent piece indeed!

[@TerryLondon]

True! For the last 12 years, I have come back here from time to time just to listen to those fine bleeps and bloops of Monkey Island soundtrack turning into awesome spacious CD-quality digital audio instrument sounds.

[@LGR]

It does have its charms, to be sure! I'm partial to the Adlib version myself. Always have been.

[@hanro50]

You should remaster this video. Include things missed in the original.

[@delatroy]

Evolution in hardware in the 80s and 90s was amazing to witness. Leaps and bounds that blew your mind over and over. Never again will it be experienced :)

[@WR3ND]

Didn't Apple just recently invent the headphone jack? lol

[@yashasvalmikam9498]

@@WR3ND You mean uninvent?

[@WR3ND]

It's secret technology, I'm sure. They're probably saving it up for a big reveal.

[@dnebdal]

@@litjellyfish Maybe it helps to group it as "allows new things" vs "incrementally improvements"? In that spirit, I guess "allows 4k gaming" is a newish change, and raytracing may end up being interesting, while going from a 980 to a 1080 only let you add a bit more of the same.

[@outofrhythm9670]

Nvidia rtx

[@The8BitGuy]

Pitty the Amiga wasn't included, Monkey Island was also made for that one.

[@natashaestes154]

Welp, I can stop watching now. That's the one we had.

[@ethanmachac]

I have found The 8-Bit Guy

[@GreyfoxNL]

The amiga version was great. .but this video is called Evolution of PC Audio ;)

[@WhoLover]

Well hello David!

[@danielm2142]

i like the sound of the Roland LAPC-1/MT-32 the most.

[@andy23r]

+Daniel M agreed

[@DJ_POOP_IT_OUT_FEAT_LIL_WiiWii]

The timbres coming out of the Roland synths were more interesting.

[@AudieHolland]

Big deal. Nobody could afford that card back then. Only professional musicians and companies could buy them. Poor students had to make do with the early Ad Lib and Soundblaster cards. For comparison: an Ad Lib was quite cheap in the early 1990s. A Sounblaster Pro 2 was not cheap but not that expensive either. But a Roland... It cost more than your entire computer.

[@DJ_POOP_IT_OUT_FEAT_LIL_WiiWii]

AudieHolland I don't see a problem with that. That Roland card was rightfully marketed as a professional product and delivered good value. The SoundBlaster Pro cards weren't pro in any sense of the term. They offered marginally better performance than competing cards costing less.

[@AudieHolland]

Jean Kuhl-Cuomo Of course you wouldn't have had a problem if you were rich. But back in the days, most gamers were rather poor (students) who, if they could afford a Roland, would buy a car instead I guess. I loved my 8-bit Soundblaster Pro 2 so much, I kept using it untill high quality sound was standard in PCs. The deciding fact for choosing it was that it was supported by all games that I wanted to play.

[@bolttracks]

Wow the Roland LAPC-1 sounds like an actual 80s music production including reverb & everything! Pretty impressive for a PC card!!

[@AudieHolland]

I've heard it was the same hardware that went into the Roland musician's keyboards.

[@Roxor128]

It's actually called the LAPC-I. That's an 'I' as in "IBM PC". There was also an LAPC-N for NEC PC-98 computers.

[@Kipperlab]

@@AudieHolland and was true! I had one and WOW...

[@MikeMayer]

Ten years later and I still come back to this video every so often. The Monkey Island theme is infectious in every form. Thanks Clint!

[@TheTurnipKing]

"We were stricken with a melody. A diabolical song I shall never forget. lalalalalalala lalalalalalalala"

[@LGR]

Correct! Quite a few wavetable sound cards did, to allow for higher amounts of and more complex sound samples to be loaded into it at once.

[@Kergari]

It's amazing that this music keeps its identity through the ages and sound systems

[@LGR]

@pdoja Most came from a site called Crossfire Designs in an article about the history of sound cards. Just google it, should be the top result

[@ibm5155]

Still one of the best LGR video!!!

[@Arda-qd7cy]

@ladawg81 Agreed.That's why I'm replying years later!

[@LGR]

I couldn't agree more, that's one of my favorite puzzlers from the time... it's actually on the shelf behind me at the moment, along with the sequel/update to that, Mad Monk's Revenge.

[@Devilot91]

Glad to hear this still from my SoundBlaster Live! 5.1 :)

[@T3KNUG3T5]

im using a SB Audigy 2 5.1

[@Devilot91]

***** I can't remember the whole series of soundcards, but I think your soundcard is even newer than my Live! 5.1 (that is already "modern" by itself too for W98) Anyway, you should search for DOS drivers (I have them on my original cd, but they should be aviable also on the net) then set up the IRQ.. that's the real pain part, It tooks days of hard work for me to manage to work even under real dos, all you have to do is to set an IRQ for your soundcard from the bios, then add them in your autoexec file... if you need more help just contact me and we'll see what I can do for you

[@biboKralle]

Searching for one of the things I have the most nostalgic memories for - Monkey Island - brought me to your channel for the first time about 10 years ago… ever since the, both have been amongst my favorite things. Thanks for everything, Clint!

[@LGR]

As far as I can tell, it was never available at retail, and was certainly not supported by Monkey Island so it wasn't even considered (along with the Covox Speech Thing and several others). But it's one awesome sound device, and incredibly rare.

[@Catishcat]

Roland is THE BEST.

[@Phenom98]

Кэтишкэт yeah but expensive AF

[@abandonedaccount6878]

i feel like the pixelated graphics don’t go together with smooth audio, so #adlib

[@GuybrushThriftweed]

I totally agree

[@Redacted-mi4rm]

thankee sai

[@adenarrington7607]

And THE MOST EXPENSIVE

[@Mellence]

This was the first LGR video I saw, and I've been a loyal follower ever since. Sometimes I like to just randomly come back and listen to it. It's fantastic.

[@trisymphony]

darn, uploaded 7 years ago, almost to the day! and i'm still loving this one. this video actually made me subscribe to LGR, all those years ago. keep up the great work, Clint!

[@bolttracks]

I really want the full Roland LAPC-1 version, sounds so impressive for the time!!! Almost like an actual 80s music production.

[@LGR]

@1xWertzui Yes, it's amazing how much different the real hardware can be! One of the reasons I collect hardware as I do. The GUS music is one of the Monkey Island CD-ROM editions, as far as I know, one of those which came in the early nineties. I could be wrong, the sample came from Crossfire Designs.

[@ayime12]

Is nice to hear all the evolution. Thanks for this video!!

[@papilloneffect4015]

I love this video so much. I've watched it just to hear the variation throughout the years.

[@TerryLondon]

I was happy to discover that video when it was released. And I was lucky to find it again. More than 10 years later. It's good to see the video is by LGR. I had no idea back then. Probably he neither :D

[@nvlis]

Roland всегда к музыке подходил серьезно, за что ему огромное спасибо. автору спасибо за отличную нарезку разных каноничных эпох звука на PC

[@ThePikmania]

I love the AdLib

[@Roxor128]

Hell, yeah. FM guitars are awesome.

[@yellowblanka6058]

You should do more of these man, great work.

[@Pr0Blackmagic]

Wow, well done! Love the progression over time!

[@Slay1337pl]

Game blaster. Now that's what i call retro!

[@ConnorR.mp3]

Mmmmm, that's a lot of square waves.

[@meanmole3212]

Gameblaster had the most epic sound imo

[@RetroPCUser]

Quick. Someone make a modern version of the GameBlaster ISA card.

[@39zack]

Chicken Tendie don't worry, it is hip to be square 😀

[@b-cone]

Slay I know

[@patrick-aka-patski]

I used to play this with PC Speaker sound. Daymnn!

[@HolyKhaaaaan]

Wow, that was really an option?! I always thought it was only included in SCUMM-VM for shits and giggles! I like it!

[@tossabaddle]

Still stands as one of the best videos on youtube... I`ll never get over this

[@tossabaddle]

I keep coming back to this! One of the best videos on youtube ^^

[@tivikemajom]

Hey Clint, as this is my all time favourite video, any chance of you doing some nostalgia best game tunes of all times clip by your choices? If it catches your interest, I'd be delighted and I think many of us, humble followers :) Keep up the good work :)

[@Vitalka325]

Это просто погружение в беззаботное детство... Кто вырос в 80-90 поймет меня, как после безусловно великого zx spectruma отвисала челюсть от принца персии, х винга да и конечно же Индианы джонс с адлипом коваксом или соундбластером...

[@llmntd242-offline5]

Такая же хрень ;(

[@RuffyT1]

Merely hearing this brings back such awesome feelings. Thx Clint

[@CeruleanDragon1]

Oh man this brings back so many memories... I still remember bringing my new AdLib card over to my friend's house and plugging it into his dad's "high end" 486 PC and playing Civilization 1. The sounds as it loaded were awesome! (despite being MIDI, until then we'd only had PC speaker beeping)

[@alexnasla]

Geez those Roland's sounded WAY better than anything else I remember at the time 0_0

[@AndersEngerJensen]

If you send me all the original recordings, I'll mix them into a seamless morphing track. I'd do the recording myself, but I haven't got a Tandy and some of the old cards. ;)

[@herrabanani]

you can just convert this video into an mp3...

[@AndersEngerJensen]

Not what I had in mind. I need the files in full lenghts so I could sync them and as the song plays along, I'd seamlessly fade between versions. ;)

[@Filming_Scene]

guess you never got the files?

[@cryptoAlgo]

You could use DOSBox with sound card emulation, I've tried soundblaster and Roland mt32 emulation, its very close to actual hardware.

[@timblake5844]

Go PC speaker! Bring back those memories! Very nice video Clint! Keep up the great work!

[@KurtisBarnes]

ive watched this video so many times, it gets better every time.

[@q306005]

That GameBlaster had some bitchin' stereo! I'd say it was my favorite by far.

[@speedyblupi]

Stereo is only good if the music coming out is good, and with gameblasters it generally isn't.

[@lazavideoz]

speedyblupi It depends on what your style is, the gameblaster may be good to others but not you.

[@HunterVS]

Roland is best

[@EvilMaxWar]

MT-32 FTW, but I really like the GameBlaster 8 bit-ish synth sound :)

[@dnebdal]

Max War Goddamn the MT-32 must have been fantastic in its time.

[@smokermegadrive]

That roland scc 1 sound like pure glory is damn great DX

[@rgilles42]

9 years later it's still a great video thanks :)

[@MrOreo76]

Adlib is my favorite! Great video

[@50MGG]

Do this with Doom please! The electric guitar rock with a Gravis ultrasound! In my opinion the best cards for Doom!

[@mark12358]

Indeed!

[@gormless-idiot]

Are you crazy it sounds like the 32x version on a GUS

[@maximal10]

The Roland cards sound impressive! Also forgot some of the creative cards had expansion slots. From chirps and farts from a small speaker to impressive audio (nostalgic either way)

[@coolie4u]

Great video, very good work. I've been growing up through this whole era and I love to see stuff like this. I went from pc speaker to a 'Sound Blaster 1.5', when I got that card Adlib was the well known card in the sound card business. Nobody knew what sound blaster was, when I started using the card I knew that Creative would be a major player in the industry....

[@thescream7777]

Thankyou for doing this. Having been playing games on pc since the 80's, this was very nostalgic and I almost cried a little with joy at seeing some of my old sound cards.

[@jaekoff5050]

Adlib then, now, and forever

[@DragonEvgeniy]

Это божественная музыка с душой аудио-чипов.

[@FastStyx]

Да нет. Это не пиздец. Пиздец - это та же музыка, сыгранная на восьми флопповодах. Вот это точно пиздец.

[@carl_the_]

FastStyx Sorry to rain on your Russian parade, but English pls

[@gormless-idiot]

Vodka

[@soralapio]

Awesome video. As someone who lived through all that (well, from the advent of the sound card onwards, but I still remember the good old PC beeper!) it's amazing to think how far we've come in such a short time.

[@metabog]

I love it when I discover a new awesome KZbin channel with tons of awesome geeky PC videos.

[@Hotiechic101]

Please do a review of one if not all the monkey island games love your videos

[@nartin9]

how does someone hate this video

[@Nikku4211]

+nartin9 People have different tastes...

[@yashasvalmikam9498]

At the moment, 69 people hate this video.

[@KaitenKenbu]

Watching your vid on the gravis ultrasound at the end 2022 and was reminded of this video. Great work.

[@BrakODatWak]

Well, I know I'm spreading the word too...Pretty much all the stuff that you cover is the kind of stuff I grew up with, if not the exact things, so I'm always looking forward to more from you. Keep up the awesome work, man!

[@AndrevusWhitetail]

The CD Quality is pretty damn good but it's just not the same without the recorder/flute that the SoundBlaster and MT-32 used.

[@captainviggo4575]

Meanwhile, on Amiga...

[@EvilMaxWar]

4 audio channels and no evolution in over 5 years xD.

[@gnoink]

Max War There were module formats developed that, through software mixing, enabled more than 4 simultaneous voices. Take TFMX for example, used in the Turrican games. 7 voices. And wasn't there OctaMED with 8 voices? Also, I have always felt that General-MIDI sound banks offer little personality compared to sample-based music. Comparing game music between the Amiga and the PC during the pre-CD-audio-era - well there is no competition really.

[@EvilMaxWar]

gnoink True, there is not competition, The MT-32 and sound canvas owned everything.

[@gnoink]

I guess it boils down to what one thinks is most important. Character or sound quality.

[@EvilMaxWar]

TBH I think FM synthesis has the most character. Just listen to Dune sound track on Adlib or Cybersphere on OPL3. I also really like SID( although not FM ) and megadrive. I do like Amiga sound but so many games on it are lackluster.

[@explod2A03]

This is an amazing upload! I have a great nostalgia for this music, and this is a nice presentation of its evolution. :) I grew up with the Amiga version, which had a different set of sounds as arranged for the Paula sound chip.

[@ldf8u]

I admit, I kind of expected that as well, but I still loved your video and added it to my Favorites, so awesome job, and thank you for the upload! :) Also, absolutely best choice for music (am the biggest Monkey Island fan).

[@nerfiasjust4461]

why am I crying a little?

[@ShiNDaizer]

Because you remembering the old good days

[@RJSBrothers]

Because we are oldfags ;-((

[@98of99]

While the GUS and Roland cards add some extra effects I feel the AdLib has the fullest, most distinct and recognizable sound for vintage PC games. It had the largest impact on the PC sound scene, much that came after was incremental improvement at best with the exception of the GUS on games and demos that fully utilized it - which were few.

[@OneVerySadPanda]

Nice video Clint!

[@lennystudios3.14]

Honestly I loved the old ibm versions, despite how primitive they are, the beeps and bloops do have a charm.

[@zalmo7993]

so nostalgic, no, i won't shed a tear... ... ... aw, whom am i kidding, cried like a baby, i still fight like a cow

[@nintendogurkan9055]

Roland MT-32 FTW! :D

[@Sandata64RD]

love the Gravis Ultrasound part. Those high yet low sounding flute noises are just so awesome.

[@awesomefacepalm]

This was the first LGR video I ever watched :) Gotta love Moneky Island

[@dbradford259]

Roland sounded amazing compared to anything else!

[@fake12396]

and it was also amazingly expensive compared to anything else

[@Phenom98]

It was also expensive AF

[@Kem1kal13]

Dat Sound Blaster 16. UGHHHHHh such a good card for its time. I loved mine.

[@mRahman92]

Still one of the best videos about computer sound cards out there.

[@RETROCENGO]

I love this video, thank you for mixing this together :-) Retrocengo

[@estjaydee3000]

Ask me about LOOM

[@knocks42]

Well, what is LOOM™?

[@estjaydee3000]

Mae Cheque You mean the latest masterpiece of fantasy storytelling from Lucasfilm's™ Brian Moriarty™? Why it's an extraordinary adventure with an interface on magic... stunning, high-resolution, 3D landscapes... sophisticated score and musical effects. Not to mention the detailed animation and special effects, elegant point 'n' click control of characters, objects, and magic spells. Beat the rush! Go out and buy Loom™ today!

[@8bits59]

My favorite has to be the game blaster

[@LGR]

@Scrooj1 That is exactly why I chose to do it this way instead of crossfading. A direct comparison is what I was going for, and I find this method worked better when creating the video.

[@LGR]

Thanks for the compliment! I don't yet post videos to any other sites, though I've seen them ripped and posted one or twice but not by me. I pretty much rely of word-of-mouth at this point and hope they get directed here

[@AudieHolland]

You left out the Amiga. That machine had incredible sound quality.

[@LGR]

Nope! This is a comparison of PC sound devices. As in, IBM PC compatibles, which the Amiga is not at all.

[@AudieHolland]

Lazy Game Reviews Ah, you're correct. And I was quite content with my Soundblaster 8-bit because it was COMPATIBLE with everything.

[@alecday3775]

Lazy Game Reviews Hell even today's on-board audio has improved quite a bit too. even to the point of where built in speakers aren't really a thing anymore. motherboards are coming with 7.1 surround sound hookups built in and the built in sound chips have such a good quality that you don't really need a sound card anymore. the sound setups the motherboards are coming with are as good as any modern sound card on the market. Even in O.E.M. machines come with the Realtek Audio chipset and it sounds as good as any modern sound card. only if you are a discerning audiophile you need one. But in all reality, you really don't. just a decent set of speakers like your Logitechs or my Klipsch ProMedias and you are set.

[@illegalquantity]

+AndrewNewZealand I agree, the Amiga music was way better than PC speaker or OPL3 music. The two type of music isn't comparable in my opinion. Amiga music is module, PC music is midi (at that time FM sythesis). Both are good formats for game tune, but completely different sounding. I like both formats, but the module format is closer to my heart, because I made a lot of music on Amiga and also on PC with trackers like Protracker and Fasttracker2 :) Of course the Monkey Island music is better on PC with a good wavetable soundcard ;)

[@MetallicBlade]

+Alec Day I agree on most of everything you say, however as far as when using headphones with built-in audio, most of the time you would be restricted in using the more power efficient headphones (lower impedance). Most boards with built-in audio simply lack the power to drive higher impedance rated headphones, as such, some dedicated sound cards come with built-in headphone amplifiers to alleviate the problem. Sure, you could just keep the built-in audio and grab a headphone amplifier on its own. But wheres the fun in that? Still... just my 2 cents.

[@Catishcat]

Дмитрий опять послал меня меня сюда... A MT-32 И ПРАВДА ЗВУЧИТ

[@lukariogod6881]

Я тоже от Дмитрия

[@lukariogod6881]

А мне Адлиб понравился

[@MrLeo6241]

+Lukario God Roland рулит

[@lukariogod6881]

+Арье А У роланда звук самый красивый.Но мне почему-то АдЛиб больше нравиться

[@MrLeo6241]

+Lukario God просто у меня в 90-ом появилась Roland LAPC-1 и все ходили в гости ее прослушать, звук был божественным. Плюс все выводилось на аудио систему Hitachi.

[@paulrahme]

Thanks for posting - excellent comparison!

[@alexriesenbeck]

so awesome! thanks for this great video!

[@StevenOBrien]

This comment section seems to just be Clint talking to himself, slowly going to insane.

[@NUBAS12345WoT]

Roland 88-го прекрасен

[@SLY3712]

Awesome! Thanks for doing this!

[@LGR]

@MrNeskio For the most part, yes. It's as close to the same musical composition as possible played through the differing sound standards. Several of them aren't exactly "MIDI" files, but they're similar in concept. And of course, the last one is a group of live musicians, not synthesized at all.

[@term-827]

my favorite is still the roland mt32.

[@VengefulNonsense]

I Kinda like the IBM PC speaker for some reason

[@John.B.Jenkins]

THIS May be one of the rarest LGR Finds YET! MUSIC to MY EARS!

[@OlviMasta77]

COOL! I never knew this. Those gravis and especially the Roland cards sound spectacular! I would never know, since my family always have had creative soundblaster cards.

[@user-is3ut1wd7g]

hi from Russia :D

[@strawberryjam3670]

Hi from Germany :D

[@klermon7]

кто от бачилы лукаса сюда

[@vladi_g]

Нивапрос )) 2016 рулит!

[@vladi_g]

Кстати, а игру то делал "лукасфилмс"

[@user-cg2fz7fc8e]

чувак!

[@AudieHolland]

I just love this particular piece of music. It sounds good no matter what soundcard is playing it.

[@Stormer324]

Awesome video Clint (hope its ok to use you first name) :) The curse of monkey island is my favorite game of all time :) I always have my original copy of that game on a shelf near in my office :D Awesome to hear how the monkey island theme has evolved with the hardware :)

[@NickoBlayde]

wow gameblaster sounds amazing

[@sgt.vernex6378]

The roland from 1988 an 1992 are almost the same quality but proccest diffirently and i think the one from 1988 is better than that cd quality crap

[@sektor2001]

very nice video man ! you should post more !

[@abhirao2001]

So classic! Awesome! Thanks for the history lesson. Loved it!