Liberalism vs Islam - Does Liberalism Require Domination of Islam?

[@destiny]

Despite a long opening, the debate quickly picks up pace... stay for the Q&A for more arguing and controversial subjects. Check out modern day debates for more ►KZbin - kzbin.info

[@maalikserebryakov]

@M S yeah he needs to have a coping party with the rest of the copers 😂😂

[@maalikserebryakov]

@M S you sound hurt

[@maalikserebryakov]

@M S lol im just trolling

[@maalikserebryakov]

@UCrdpvPGMjOj3TVcbTeSNLkw wow that society sounds like absolute degeneracy

[@btecndcomp]

@euthyphro dilemma lol irony

[@Vinciini83]

Daniel's argument can be summed up as "Western-Liberalism is more harmful than Islamic Fundamentalism because it limits the amount of harm that Islamic Fundamentalists are allowed to do to others." Brilliant!

[@avavavavaz]

yeah maybe the liberals will recognize these people for what they are.

[@khaledkamal89]

Not really his argument is that western liberalism is more harmful than Islam because it destroys family community and the belief in God which are some of the basic indicators for happiness.

[@ttaa2599]

Well put

[@carnivalwholesale9809]

Very right

[@lloydgush]

Yes, that's what makes liberalism good.

[@jimmybeaton4438]

Wouldn't be a modern day debate if it wasn't shot on a 2004 sony camcorder

[@hazzardalsohazzard2624]

The audio could be a little better, but this is still fairly good production quality.

[@NinjaUploader95]

Eh, it looks more like the debatora are out of focus and the lighting is shit. Camera is probably fine. Films 1080 60p

[@twanner_]

So true

[@DLtheGreat]

I like the shitty quality

[@tehbloch]

it's going to be transferred to a vhs tape and sent to red letter media as a black spine

[@HauntedHarmonics]

“You’re forcing liberty on us authoritarians! That’s authoritarian!” This dude’s argument in a nutshell.

[@pepsi9225]

No, he is testing their consistency to show that both have the same standard in this respect.

[@ezo2161]

These fundamentalists, or at least their parents, have chosen to settle in the west and now they’re crying cos we don’t let them practise all their regressive bullshit. There are plenty of other countries where they’d feel more at home yet they aren’t so keen on living there 🤔

[@Akkatlah]

​@@pepsi9225 mm nope

[@kaisunra9676]

He is indeed saying that liberty is being forced on authoritarians. That’s why he won the debate. A liberal society does not allow for the oppressive and violent doctrines that are clearly inherent to the Islamic texts. Islam can thus not be practiced in a liberal society as the Behaviors commanded by the texts would be illegal. Liberalism therefore dominates Islam. And thank the lord Jesus it does

[@chintuz1002]

he is right lol the un dont let any country follow their ideology in the name of human rights

[@_nske]

I think Daniel did an amazing job. At reminding people that weren't born in a muslim country how lucky we are, and how important it is to try and preserve the freedoms that we have. So, thanks Daniel!

[@El_Deus.]

He ran in circles talking nonsense. Best quote from Daniel "You can't get divorced according Islamic requirements" TIME STAMP 1:00:30 - 1:00:35. If ur wife wants to leave u, SHE IS NOT HAPPY. People within Islam ARE NOT HAPPY if u enforce these things if over others. ALL of Daniels points are disingenuous and or circular falsehoods... “anecdotal experience teaches us that many times women want to get divorced for no reason” Dude wat is this guy going on about??? Yeah no reason at all I'm sure & 'Destiny: "Would you say that slavery should exist as it flourished under Muslim majority societies? Should we bring that back as well?" Daniel: "Slavery as a practice has a rational and moral basis."' If u don't see a problem with Daniels responses, u are part of the problem. U can practice these things, but at least don't lie about it

[@_nske]

@@El_Deus. dude, sarcasm

[@El_Deus.]

@@_nske Yikes that went over my head lol... Rereading ur comment, I really misinterpreted it, soz about that. Just something about Daniel and what he talked about in this vid really set me off

[@_nske]

@@El_Deus. no worries yeah it's scary how naturally he supports so absurd, extreme ideas and twists things to make it seem that it's the other way around. I just hope I never live to see an Islamic state, if people like that ever get to be in power

[@adrianofmars]

Freedoms is questionable in the US now but go off

[@Shinjiku]

Destiny looking early on dead inside just because there was nothing he could multitask during this debate.

[@gregnitz4396]

Destiny's just mad that the Rift will have to wait until the debate's over.

[@Kappi__]

His best debate tactics like eating pizza could not be used. Sadge

[@theanonymoustalk]

LMFAOAOO underrated comment

[@muzzy_55]

It's so natural for him lol

[@lordfifth3106]

Gift him a fidget spinner or 2

[@lilstevechan8427]

Daniel is one of the worst faith debaters I've ever listened to. He acts performatively affronted, he obfuscates his points to try and cover up how extreme they are, he arbitrarily redefines words, he can't accept rephrasing of his arguments EVEN WHEN IT'S REPEATED TO HIM VERBATIM, he rambles off talking points for minutes at a time, he refuses to answer questions directly and he projects all of these "tactics" onto his opponent to call THEM bad faith. He is not a serious person.

[@yahyehyusuf1969]

What are you on about did we watch the same debate ?

[@lilstevechan8427]

@@yahyehyusuf1969 If you can't see the obvious crap he was pulling then maybe we didn't watch the same debate.

[@sandersGG]

A Lot has to be done to avoid talking about the child brides , stoning of innocent people and women being slaves to men 😂

[@johns1625]

I just got done listening to several of his "debates" and there is one where they are arguing about Muhammad marrying a 6 year old and he actually supported that. Islam literally has the worst ideals in the world. He also tried to fight Matt Dillahunty on stage and then got scared into submission when Matt actually stood up and walked over to him.

[@iwsajet8506]

@@yahyehyusuf1969 yep we all watched the same debate. You just suffer from the delusion that your religion is the ultimate truth and thereby any defense of it, by any apologist, no matter how objectively fallacious, is revered. You are incapable of objectivity the moment you accepted Islam.

[@mizel101]

"...marriage also includes a degree of sexual exclusivity..." Camera cuts to Steven looking blankly into the air.

[@Plainbear]

Even as a open couple, you still ask permissions to some degree. You communicate. Steven wont go fuck one of her sisters just because they are open

[@battlecast9202]

@@Plainbear I think it's cuz Destiny's definition of exclusivity DEFINITELY doesn't match this guy's XD

[@templecreations2351]

@@Plainbear yea most people just assume open couples are just screwing left and right with no communication or boundaries, ridiculous

[@btecndcomp]

Bahahaha

[@rylace]

@@tandem863 What's it like to have low iq?

[@Iwillreply]

I can't believe "there are people who don't want rights" was used as an argument for less or no liberalism.

[@Afff924]

the western liberal ''human rights'' are not really human rights. that was his whole point lol just a bunch of white supremacist ideas that are forced on people and countries that dont agree on it. there are cristian and muslim countries in europe that dont agree by your definition of liberty and rights.

[@irnbrewhaha]

Pretty sure this guy is actually a tankie in disguise

[@Afff924]

@@irnbrewhaha wtf is a tankie?

[@lilben4184]

Can confirm, I am someone that doesn't want rights. No, I am not being ironic.

[@Rallylabs]

@@irnbrewhahadisguised as what? A moron?

[@CameronBFunny]

This is one of Destiny's best debates. It's amazing how Dan rambles for 10 minutes, then Destiny responds so succinctly.

[@anas-il3co]

Destiny doesn't stand a chance against Mohamed Hijab, Dr Umar Suleiman or Hamza Tzortzis. Daniel doesn't know how to engage in a debate effectively.

[@mikemorenilla7444]

Well Dan is not very smart.

[@vishg5148]

@@anas-il3coyou wish don’t you

[@noahfletcher3019]

@@anas-il3co Hijab is a fool, just like the rest of your silly echo chamber debaters.

[@MrMerve-tl9my]

@@anas-il3coafter seeing his lousy debate with cosmic skeptic, I doubt

[@blablabla7796]

Neat. Everything about him is Islam themed. He has the hat, the clothes, he even has a laptop that says Predator.

[@HyperTubeGames]

That last statement was FOUL 💀

[@HyperTubeGames]

@joemaxwell6826 😂😂😂

[@iSkulk]

My brother in Christ on that Muslim LARP

[@asmbeats5369]

Just like their prophet, minus the laptop.

[@madobrax]

that wasnt funny ngl

[@Loycole69]

It is mind numbingly ironic that this guy is able to sit on a stage in a liberal society and claim that liberal societies discriminate against Muslims more than Islamic countries discriminate against non Muslims and minorities.

[@abdullahmuzaffar2483]

He was here for the same reason that liberals don't let islamic society to exist. They will literally crack down on activist even remotely mentioning islamic government in our so called "islamic" countries.

[@akhnatenpage4854]

He says liberal societies are worse for Muslims, then goes and defends sex slavery, actual slavery, and clearly states he would never let this conversation happen in Muslim circles. But liberals are the ones oppressing him for not allowing him to rape his wife and own his slaves. Funny.

[@TheNoodleGod9001]

@@abdullahmuzaffar2483 If "Islamic government" for you means murdering gay people and forcing girls into marriages against their will then it's probably for the best that that not be allowed.

[@jamescook4402]

@@TheNoodleGod9001 if a Islamic society was the hegemony, it could say the same about liberal societies allowing abortions, eating pork, homosexuality and drinking alcohol for those societies to best not exist.

[@slayer_general4243]

@@TheNoodleGod9001 stop misrepresenting shar'ia, shar'ia is more than just capital punishment, also forced marriages are haram, why dont you guys listen? Stop being emotionally driven

[@limitbreak2966]

1:04:39 “liberal aggression on Muslims” LMAO, if allowing woman to divorce is aggression on Muslims, then I’m all for it

[@VigilantGuardian6750]

well enjoy your 60% divorce rates and creation of all type toxic exclusivist male movements like redpill, incels, mgtow, pickup artistry, manospheres, alpha internet pimps you name it, we muslims don't have that toxic cancers

[@notusingmyname4791]

"this is an inequality in islam that..." keeps women in abusive relationships keeps women in unloving relationships keeps women in unhappy circumstances keeps children in abusive families all that favors the possibly abusive man (although allows the man to divorce an abusive woman quite easily.. so... half a point for islam??)

[@edres7563]

@@notusingmyname4791 Most ordinary muslims think his views are extreme because theyre not following islam to its fullest and most faithful extent. Daniel is fully faithful to the quran and example of muhammad. This is why islam is so dangerous. Thankfully most muslims dont practice and follow full islam and instead let their natural humanity and sense of goodness dictate their day to day life, instead of following all the dictats of a barbaric 7th century desert cult, that at its heart, is a fascist and imperialistic, expansionist and authoritarian dictatorship (both personally and collectively) and has the potential to create a disengenuous and disloyal 5th column in every society it is present, until it achieves demographic advantage, at which point muslims will demand the full implementation of its barbaric shariah system of law, and eventually force a breakaway muslim state at the point of a gun, terrorism and war. Muslims have already done this in modern times. So dont think it cant happen.

[@AntiFurryJihad]

​@@notusingmyname4791 what the hell do you mean by "keep" it's the women that has agreed to marry and sign the contacts.

[@WarningMoose]

​@Islamic_Nationalist So if the husband turns put to be an awful person, it's just game over? Because in Islam, it's pretty hard to know who you're marrying compared to Western society.

[@JesterAzazel]

"Our wives are happy, but you're ruining everything by letting them divorce us" (paraphrased) If they were truly happy, them having the right to divorce you wouldn't be an issue. I can't believe Destiny is glossing over such an absurd statement, I really hope he goes back to that.

[@hasanhakan4019]

Are you married?

[@1993muth]

In Islam the husband and wife each have a role. Every time a man proposes to a woman he gives his wife a dowry (Maher/a valuable gift) to demonstrate his commitment to her. A man is obligated to provide for and protect his wife. A wife is obligated to support and be loyal to her husband, but is not obligated to give him any of her wealth (she can if she desires). If he divorces her, he is still obligated to provide for her for an extended period or until she remarries. When a woman divorces she has no post divorce obligations to her husband. So if a woman could just divorce any time she wants, she keeps his dowry and owes the husband nothing, and he would still need to provide for her after divorce until she receives a new dowry from the next husband. That is why if she wants a divorce she needs to seek permission from her husband or go to court and make the case he is depriving her of rights or harming her to get a court mandated divorce. There is wisdom in this.

[@1993muth]

Divorce is discouraged for all, although permissible. We can all agree divorces are not good. There many men and some rich women in America who hate marrige becuse of family law. A spouse you deaply invested in can just out of nowhere asks for a no fault divorce for no compelling reason (just they don't love you) and take half of what you own. I mean this is a disaster. At least if a man under Islamic law wants to divorce his wife he still is obligated to support her, until she remarries. Once she has a new man, his obligations to her cease. How many divorcees in the USA grow resentment when the money they are forced to pay to the ex by the court gets spent by her on another man.

[@JesterAzazel]

@@1993muth There is no wisdom in solving a broken system with an even more broken system. The wiser thing to do would be to solve the original problem without creating another.

[@1993muth]

@@JesterAzazel if you claim both systems are broken, why don't liberal democratic governments Iike the USA let people decide which family law system they wish to follow. Why govern every marrige the same if marrige is a religious function. Why do islamaphobes in the USA deliberately throw propaganda campaignes against having islamic family courts if there own system is significany flawed.

[@thedrewshowtv]

This whole debate boils down to Daniel doesn’t want people to choose because they might not choose Islam.

[@neroj_]

So true

[@notusingmyname4791]

that's everyone who's opposed to rights to choose.

[@zuhosido]

Perfect 👌 😂

[@AntiFurryJihad]

Liberalism too wasn't chosen by the mases, it was enforced onto people, The French Genocided 5 million Algerians to spread their ideals of Liberalism and method to destroy spread of Islam. It better to be a honest Authoritarian than a hypocrite libertarian

[@hsdjsdshdhsdnsmsd6247]

Just Like liberalism doesnt want people to Chose because they might not chose liberalism

[@CasualHuman]

Accusing liberalism for the downfall of fundamentalists while arguing that people shouldn't have some basic human rights is so insane lol

[@queensharkeisha4479]

It's not even "Basic human rights". Like, I may not agree but if you argue people shouldn't X at least there is ground to stand on. It gets like... Literally impossible to discuss when you're like "Well white men shouldn't be allowed to vote but everyone else should" type arguments like with the divorce bit he did.

[@thewingedserpent5823]

To be fair, human rights are definitely bad. After all, they are a social construct

[@Blazee2897]

As a bisexual person, I sincerely hope that islam does not become a global religion.

[@creed610]

Don't worry a lot of people neither religion yearly.

[@AmicableAgnostic]

Then start talking against it. Otherwise it will become global decease just by playing victim card everywhere.

[@Nemo.24]

Global religion ? Bruh , a quarter of the world's population is Muslim

[@DrDeathbat]

Islam IS already practiced throughout the world. Really?!

[@sebbosebbo9794]

thats happens demographic numberS tell this now who is noch a minority

[@Blank_01_01]

"LGBTQ would be happier in a Muslim society" Bro, I haven't seen this sort of delusion in a loooooong time. It makes me nostalgic for oldskool religious debates from 10 years ago.

[@turkihazem]

What if LGBTQ are not happier in muslim societies? What makes homosexuality ok not incest? You been socialized to accept this today you condemn your forefathers for not allowing homosexuality and your grandchildren will condemn you for not allowing incest Daniel focus on foundational issues every culture and civilization agreed on where destiny keep pushing his feelings about LGBTQ on Muslims who don’t hold the same value on this regard

[@Reticulated_Spline]

Please go on and continue pushing a slippery slope argument, makes your position look so strong.

[@monkeybudge]

To steel man his argument: He’s basically saying they’d be happier because they wouldn’t be gay. He’s using research that shows there are certain genes that can predict likelihood of certain sexual orientation, but that in its self is not predictive of whether the person will become attracted to same sex partners. That societal pressure will determine if the “gay genes” are expressed, leading to same sex attraction. He’s saying in his society those genes would not be expressed through any societal pressures. So the individual wouldn’t be gay and hence would be happier. Obviously it’s total bullshit as there is no society, hardcore Muslim or otherwise that doesn’t have gay people.

[@mrpotatospudthe1sy160]

@@turkihazem do you understand the diffrence between homosexuality and incest?

[@Blank_01_01]

@@turkihazem incest harms individuals, homosexuality does not. It’s not hard to understand.

[@danielvan12]

The phrase “anecdotal experience teaches us that many times women want to get divorced for no reason” is the funniest self-report I’ve ever heard

[@iam.damian]

I am not surprised with this guy

[@drawnsequence]

Destiny - You're free to do everything within your religion that isn't theft, kidnapping, enslavement, child abuse, or violence. Liberal businesses tend to accommodate religious ceremony as well. Daniel - Those are liberal rules! We want the freedom to control and restrict women as though they're chattel because if the women leave, *they* break up the family and take *our* money. We're oppressed!

[@geeljire9247]

You didn't understand Daniel's perspective. Firstly, Liberal countries don't limit their restrictions to those arbitrary lines as Liberal countries have been know to force religious students to do things like mixed gender swimming lessons, banned the Hijab and have even confiscated children from their parents because the parents taught their children, socially conservative values or didn't allow their children to attend alcoholic parties. Secondly, it's funny you mention that these communities can't ''steal, kidnapm enslave or violence'' when Liberal countries have also been known to steal ressources, kidnap union leaders and political dissidents, enslave third world workers including children to work in mines, and enacted violence on the civilian populations as seen by the mass-bombings, man-made famines, economic sanctions and torture centers like Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo, not to mention the untold numbers of black sites distributed throughout the world. You as a citizen of the first world is shielded from the brutalities that makes your life comfortable, but they still exist nonetheless.

[@GopherpilledTunneler]

@@geeljire9247 Almost all of that has happened in societies without separation of church and state. Also, specify when parents have lost custody of their children for teaching conservative values or not letting their kids drink. In America you aren't allowed to drink until 21 and its fairly normalized to not let kids go to parties in general so I don't buy it.

[@jaywallace5582]

@@GopherpilledTunneler it's a european example

[@almostafa4725]

@nickers7409 in Sweden

[@ecnalms851]

​@@geeljire9247 Islam also does them things which you said liberalism does. Saudi Arabia for example shot upon Ethiopian migrants crossing the Saudi-Yemeni border - hundreds estimated dead. Gulf states also use the kafala system and treat foreign workers like slaves. These countries are also autocratic and suppress freedom of speech. Also doesn't allow freedom of religion - can't publicly practice any other religion in Saudi Arabia unless Islam.

[@timmarsh973]

Destiny: "Would you say that slavery should exist as it flourished under muslim majority societies? Should we bring that back aswell?" Daniel Haqiqatjou: "Slavery as a practice has a rational and moral basis." *Destiny realizing this has been a monumental waste of time* : "...okay..."

[@zundubi]

And Destiny didn’t answer DH asked

[@multifayzer8130]

Second it is encouraged to freed slaves, slaves should be treated good better than the homeless and poor in the west are treated, they are to be given the same food you eat and the same clothes you wear. The Prophet also said that they should not be hit or treated roughly. The only people you can make slaves are captives of war, after all you wouldnt just let your enemy free, the first attempt is to integrate them. If they convert to islam even more reason to free him.

[@rb3706]

@@multifayzer8130 found the child rape apologist. God has no place in heaven for people who harm children and defend child rape

[@theamazingj7007]

@@multifayzer8130 it doesn't matter how nice you are to slaves you enslaving them is immoral in its action It's like saying rape isn't as bad when you wear a condom

[@wanderingstar5270]

@@multifayzer8130 men had full permission apparently from god to have s3x with female slav3s. Slav3s could not, and did not consent - that’s rap3. Muslims don’t call it such but it is. Owning a person as property and having a few rules about treating them ok doesn’t make up for being property.

[@blitz8425]

This guy's entire position can be boiled down to "liberalism is imposed on us we should impose Islam instead!"

[@EdertheJust]

Pretty much

[@valipunctro]

And liberalism is not even imposed,economic sanctions does not imposition make,you can live however you want we just don't want to have anything to do with you.the take away is "if you don't inbrace us for our morally abhorrent ways you are a colonizer and a intolerant bigot".

[@tomwright9904]

@@valipunctro liberalism is imposed in western countries in the sense that women can divorce their husbands

[@How_to_Pronounce]

@@tomwright9904 Dude just wants to exercise his religious freedom to have child brides.

[@valipunctro]

@@tomwright9904 side bar...I may have a problem with the equity croud but nothing disgusts me more than ppl who promote inequality.

[@BrendanishLeo]

Oh this is literally just the "you're oppressing me by not letting me oppress people" argument

[@Featherman]

Don't be tolerant to the intolerant.

[@overoscar1788]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/goeVaGmwbbuJaNE

[@pulsegamin4790]

@@overoscar1788 Not this guy 🤣 Also, why do you people use English names?

[@AntiAtheismIsUnstoppable]

There is absolutely no difference between islam and atheist religion / communism. It is two sides of the same coin.

[@pulsegamin4790]

@@AntiAtheismIsUnstoppable yeah totally no difference between an ideaology that supports slavery, child marriage, stoning adulterers, etc. and liberalism. Atheism has nothing to do with communism. It is an answer to one question, that is it. I am sometimes baffled how you people even function in the real world.

[@davidlegare5021]

Sure a woman can try to initiate a divorce in Islam, but it's convenient that he didn't bring up the fact that the Qur'an states that a woman's testimony is worth half of that of a man.

[@ghosthunter0950]

She can only ask for one, the husband has to agree, if he doesn't she will never get a divorce. meanwhile on the other side the husband can just divorce her whenever.

[@yarubaziyan]

yes.

[@respectfulgamer7232]

"My wife is happy" although she want to divorce you but is not allowed to? This is delusion.

[@geeljire9247]

She can initiate a divorce, but has to do it through the Jurist, just like you guys do the divorce through a court. There's no practical difference.

[@xxsatisfyu484]

@@geeljire9247 so in what circumstances will the judge approve the divorce in islam??

[@yahyehyusuf1969]

​@Bunny Bun99 if he is beating her or not letting her follow her religion or if she is depressed

[@yahyehyusuf1969]

​@Bunny Bun99 if he is beating her or not letting her follow her religion or if she is depressed

[@WhatisReal11]

@@geeljire9247 the level of gaslighting muslims engage in is unreal

[@kunyoruyo]

This Guy: You are oppressing Islamic values Destiny: Like what? This Guy: *"lists a number of human rights violations"* Destiny: Well that sounds awful This Guy: So you agree with islams being oppressed

[@bleb87]

Great debate recap

[@leafguy95]

right but his (daniel) point is liberalism and islam are at odds. In that sense, he would be right islam is being oppressed because he feels that liberalism will not allow for islam to be practiced in the way it (he believes) should be practiced.

[@kunyoruyo]

@@leafguy95 that's right, from his point of view he is totally correct. I just feel like, if I were part of islam, I wouldn't want this guy to talk on my behalf

[@leafguy95]

@@kunyoruyo perhaps. hard to know. In the video posted by moder day debate youll see a lot of arab origin names in the comments agreeing with daniel.

[@JM-mh1pp]

@@leafguy95 In a video chat of Kent Hovind you will find great many christians who agree with him on very similar issues, that does not mean that average christians wants destruction of democracy.

[@Reticulated_Spline]

"How dare you limit my Religions ability to oppress others" this Is the perfect example of the paradox of tolerance.

[@Reticulated_Spline]

​@Michael "Abdullah" Smith Liberals do not pretend to tolerate shariah law, just as they do not pretend to tolerate white supremacists and they never have. I think you'd find that Liberals are not all that interested in invading other countries if you talk to some.

[@UltraStarWarsFanatic]

@Michael "Abdullah" Smith All laws require enforcement, obviously. That does not mean that all laws are themselves of an equally oppressive nature. The virtue of tolerance is to allow each person to live as they will. But if one person's will is to impose on someone else's will, then that virtue is undermined. A society cannot be free from oppression whilst its constituents are free to oppress. Thus the limit of the society's tolerance must be the individual's intolerance. This behavior is consistent with the principles liberals espouse. What is difficult to understand about that?

[@Reticulated_Spline]

@Michael "Abdullah" Smith Just keep blaming all of life's problems on Liberalism, especially as your type of Islam fails to spread.

[@TawheedPromoter]

Liberals: UN laws are to be enforced on the whole world. Also Liberals: Enforcing your law is opression

[@samueldjekki6399]

@Michael "Abdullah" Smith you can have this debate in a liberal society. Can you have it in a Islamic society?

[@jakewilkraw]

Did he just say religion is biological

[@kannix386]

@nickers7409rape is also natural. what you're doing is the "fallacy of nature"

[@notyourbusiness4254]

Expecting intellectual honesty from a Muslim apologist is like expecting that random homeless dude you decided to give 2 dollars to actually being Jeff bezos and giving you a million dollars back as a social experiment

[@Shiroyashasama]

How are all Muslims intellectually dishonest ?

[@notyourbusiness4254]

@@Shiroyashasama exactly the way you just demonstrated, I said Muslim apologists and you said all Muslims :)

[@paulomsantossilva]

Ok aren’t all Muslims Muslim apologists by definition? Otherwise they wouldn’t be Muslim, right?

[@pinujay959]

​@@notyourbusiness4254Tell HIM!!!

[@rocksparadox]

@@Shiroyashasama Aloha snackbar, ''not all brainwashed Muslims/ Muslim apologists'' lie, just the ugly and dumb ones do!

[@Berxy]

How can you say “my wife shouldn’t be able to divorce me” and the justification being “I want to preserve my marriage because my wife is happy”

[@drmodestoesq]

Easy...you just say my wife doesn't know what's in her best interests. Because my wife is morally, intellectually and spiritually inferior to me.

[@FerociousPaul]

@@drmodestoesq God I fucking hate religion. But Islam has a special place in that hatred for personal reasons. Turned my best friend into a sexist, raging, racist, homophobic douchebag. He used to be such a chill, funny, loving guy. Tolerant, accepting, didn't judge others for their identity. But he started getting more into his religion, Islam, as a result of some messed up personal problems going on in his life. It didn't help him, it just made him paranoid and ruined his relationships with not only his non-Muslim friends, but even his Muslim friends that aren't as extreme as him. Ironically, religion isolated him from the community that loved him. The guy's unbearable, you can't talk to him without him bashing either jews, women, or the lgbt community.

[@jansmitowiczauthor78]

He also somehow got from Liberalism to genocide and authoritarianism without, I dunno, pointing out that you are ipso facto no longer talking about liberalism if you're authoritarian. DERP!

[@tekki5744]

@@FerociousPaul your personal problems doesn't represent Islam or any religion.

[@thenotoriousm0e852]

@@FerociousPaul you shouldn't use the negative experiences you have with your buddy that took on a more extreme route, as a fuel for your anger towards a whole religious group that has suffered from these generalizations. Most Muslim scholars (especially in the West) disagree with Daniel and have a more sound understanding of Islamic law and theology. Being a hatefull and unpleasant person around the people you surround yourself with (whether Muslim or not) is unislamic anyway

[@Elitematt74]

I think it would be an interesting idea to let there be a "discovery" phase before a debate, which would just be both parties getting all the sources that will be mentioned in their debate or used to back up their statements. Would deffo eliminate the bombardment of sources and citations that can't be checked on the go

[@sinatra222]

That would work for the prepared opening statements, but not for the back-and-forth portion of the debate.

[@bigian4649]

Giga based. Though there's a necessary caveat: if one party introduces a claim not supported by their submitted sources, sources not mentioned in discovery become fair game.

[@overoscar1788]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/goeVaGmwbbuJaNE

[@TawheedPromoter]

Only Daniels was using ref Destiny was qouting himself all the time

[@scotty212]

@@TawheedPromoter This guys username definitely implies impartiality that's for sure.

[@ordohereticus3427]

Destiny: “So, about that killing gays part.” Islam Apologist: “Don’t misrepresent Islamic law.” Destiny: “So, the bit about finding two gay men engaging in sex with witnesses and then killing them.” Islam Apologist: “That’s totally not the same thing. That’s getting caught. It’s different.” I hope that the left leaning and accommodationalist types in the audience realise that there is no negotiating with this particular branch of Islamic zealotry. Sure, most Muslims in the West are moderate, but this guy sure as hell isn’t one of them.

[@rh4993]

Moderate Muslims are just bad at being Muslims. The same is true for Christians (especially Protestants) and Jews. I'd go as far as saying moderate Muslims aren't really Muslims based on Islamic scripture. That's a good thing though.

[@culturedvulture2015]

The lgbtq litmus test is an excellent way to figure out who is the moderate muslim.

[@ordohereticus3427]

@@rh4993 Yeah, I guess any Muslim who stands by modern civic values and progress, is, to many of these people and their script, a heretic. Fortunately many are in that category.

[@ordohereticus3427]

@M S Right on.

[@ordohereticus3427]

@@culturedvulture2015 Yeah, it’s a great one, and the liberal and left quadrants of Western politics should take this argument on, otherwise, it’s advanced by disingenuous reactionaries on the fringe right who use it all to dismiss Islam or add obscurantism to subvert progressives while advancing their own retrograde social values.

[@ezo2161]

I love how he spends the whole debate crying that western countries don’t pander to his dark age religion and then says that Muslim societies can’t accommodate atheists.

[@Cyborous]

Yeah right God, I miss Hitchens.. he would’ve tore this guy a new one. 😂

[@tom-lg3oi]

@Table Salt yes liberal societies don’t tolerate the intolerant elements of religion, it won’t be liberal if we accept Islam’s views on lgbtq.

[@bruhstasa6784]

He also mentions the oath in france when even christian preasts have to do that lol

[@ismar989]

@tablesalt2628 I agree that I failed to provide a reason why it's illegal, I thought a bit more about it and I have no other answer than that western democracies are still rooted in Christianity, and are slowly decoupling in time, but that process is still far from finished. As to the other point, polyamory won't end up in killing, but Sharia law for example would. There are multiple cultures which would kill you for the stuff you and I do on a daily basis.

[@GoDLiKeKakashi]

@tablesalt2628 Polygamy is not illegal. Marrying more than one person is illegal. There is a very clear distinction. If you want to have 100 boyfriends, go for it. If you want to have those 100 boyfriends recognised by the state and receive benefits such as tax breaks that's a whole different matter as it very much can affect the rest of society.

[@PongoDaMan]

This dude might as well have been debating for liberalism

[@StFido]

I laughed when he said it's good that women can't divorce their husbands in muslim society.

[@thebeardsolution]

TRUE

[@PlaystationPeeps]

We got this guy and mrgirl biting bullets all day

[@hugo3627]

At least he is not an apologist. It is frustrating how many muslims are just as fundamentalist. While acting like they are not. I had one argue to me that there is only 1 Islam and that it is diverse at all.

[@SIRAJPRODUCTIONS]

@@StFido well that guys actually wrong on that

[@TheFindol]

"I don't think all these technological advancements are a good thing" - Says the religious man with a Predator gaming laptop in front of him.

[@battlecast9202]

*HM* The man in the well meme again XD

[@the_inquisitive_inquisitor]

You trying to tell me that the Furby made the world a better place? Technology has gone too far

[@Klamev]

@@the_inquisitive_inquisitor Nah it hasnt gone nearly enough. Space ship go BRRRRRR

[@andrewhenry9516]

@@the_inquisitive_inquisitor Furbies? Out of all the technology in the modern world that’s the example you use?

[@polosaquarium691]

🧠

[@unclebobboomergames]

Religious morality debate? Am I in college 13 years ago? This is wonderful Edit in post: Destiny needs to lean into saying "yes we restrict your rights in the way you describe as we would against any other religion seeking to do so. Good. Im glad." He needs to say in and be shocking about it against someone like this. Lean in harder. This dude needed to hear it.

[@Gogofam123]

Math debate? Are we still in a middle school? 🤦‍♀️

[@unclebobboomergames]

@@Gogofam123 I'm confused by your inability to read

[@WanBelltrum]

@@Gogofam123 what?

[@obi-wanshinobi2353]

Hitchens era. Welcome back.

[@dopplereffect4278]

video resolution checks out

[@izzywox8246]

I could be entirely wrong but whenever I hear people explain Islam they all sound like master manipulators

[@Champz2323]

"You're oppressive because you don't want us to be oppressive" sums up Daniel

[@TawheedPromoter]

Who gets to decide what is opressive

[@empireofhearts6471]

what is oppressive? answer the question please and annihilate me

[@motorhead48067]

@@TawheedPromoter If killing people for leaving the faith, forcing women to live In burkas, murdering homosexuals, or restricting women’s rights to divorce aren’t all oppressive, then what could the word oppressive possibly mean. Liberalism is all about tolerating everything that isn’t oppressive. Are you actually arguing that the things I just listed aren’t oppressive?

[@wisdomofislamm]

@@motorhead48067 next joke buddy. That’s why debate is happening. You guys are so dumb or ignorant to just acknowledge your own mistakes. Liberalism is not tolerant at all. It is just in your dreams. 🤦‍♂️ Didn’t you hear Destiny saying he is okay with starving whole nation including children and women and putting sanctions over gay rights? Is this tolerant? Is killing children over gay rights okay? Do you support child killing? Huh?

[@wisdomofislamm]

@@Kaewin5510 I didn’t ask questions from you. I don’t need your answers.

[@chasepotter341]

Can we stop entertaining Daniel as a rational interlocutor? He’s a troll at best

[@leoskyi]

And the worst thing is this guy has an audience of more then 300k subs on youtube who eat all his bs

[@benefitsbrian9199]

He's not rational but he does genuinely believe the things he says. I feel we should at least give these people some sort of engagement different to that of a troll.

[@brandonblevins7870]

@@benefitsbrian9199what's the difference between genuine delusion vs grifter delusion???

[@benefitsbrian9199]

@@brandonblevins7870 From what I know about Daniel, he cut ties with a Muslim organisation that was paying him because they asked him to be more moderate. He seems to have a pattern of behaviour that shows that he cares more about his ideology than about personal gain.

[@benny399]

Dishonesty really kicked in the moment Destiny questioned him on the survival of liberalism in a Muslim society! The dude was so slimy... 😩

[@84632]

@@UH1YVenom123 in Saudi Arabia, they’re called shame parades 😂😢😂

[@samson136]

He quoted alexis tocqueville as a liberal lmao, one google search and ull se that hes the literal opposite

[@Momo-vl7ly]

To be fair destiny dodged his question first

[@hugo3627]

@@84632 Yea they do have them. They just end in stonings there.

[@dvanyukov]

@@cynicalmemester1694 In his mind, this thought experiment is the literal future of every liberal society. The dude sees himself as nothing short of a doomsday prophet.

[@invadervim9037]

I think he's just mad that he can't marry a 12 year old

[@invadervim9037]

I meant this as a joke, but no it came up

[@goofyahhh254]

​@@invadervim9037damn

[@audreyandremington5265]

Yeah Mr. Daniel Pikachu actually did a whole debate on why he should be allowed to marry a 12 year old with Michael Jones from Inspiring Philosophy recently. I'm literally not even bloody joking look it up.

[@MrYelly]

Daniel even argued in favour of marrying 4 year olds as long as they had their first menstruation.

[@courtney9180]

1:17:17 “we have the right to determine our own destiny” … that felt like when they say the title of the movie in the movie

[@muatasimahmed2343]

We have a will

[@randomguy75]

Family guy

[@enhancingrice1825]

I thought of the ScreenRant Pitch Meeting videos, "That's the name of the movie!"

[@memesofproduction3]

"LOOK CHAT! HE DID THE MEME!"

[@bvishal2kn]

So that's it huh? we some kinda....Destiny ??

[@spiral9088]

“We don’t want atheists in muslim societies constantly undermining our religion, why? Because it will destroy the religion.” You’re god damn right it will. If your ideas are so fragile that you’re begging people not to criticize them…. Perhaps some reflection upon those ideas is in order… 🧐

[@GamerCracked]

Nothing scares political and religious extremists more than critical examination by a non-believer.

[@CA-qw7qk]

He doesn’t wanna beg ppl he wants to kill them

[@nanashi2146]

@@GamerCracked Keep telling yourself that, Muslims have been exposed to non-believers criticising their beliefs literally since Islam's inception, and it's done nothing but make it grow

[@shungite785]

@@nanashi2146 yeah cause they just killed non-believers

[@nanashi2146]

@@shungite785 The first 40 Muslims consisted of the Prophet Muhammad, his wife, and a bunch of other slaves, women, children and poor men. They were tortured and killed by the pagan Arabs around them who, day in, day out, lambasted Islam, criticising every inch of it they could. These Muslims, you claim, just killed the people who were criticising their religion? You are showing that you're uneducated

[@abemi869]

"Liberalism doesn’t tolerant inequality"- I really don’t see that as a bad thing.....

[@JohnDoe-xv9du]

Liberalism isn't destruction of hierarchies either. That's when we go into philosophies of anarchism in its roots which talk about destruction of unjust hierarchies. If you look at every liberal institutions throughout every nation, hierarchies are cultivated all the time.

[@turkihazem]

What do you mean by equality? Does liberal society have equality? If a woman accused you of a sexual harassment, are you and the woman will have equal testimony for the police? No Should we invade liberal countries for not having equality??? Or is it only limited to what feminists decide of what they think equality is

[@TawheedPromoter]

Then communism is Liberalism on steroids

[@WhatisReal11]

Actually true liberalism does tolerate and acknowledge inequalities. Lebron James will always be taller than the asian math student.

[@6foot8jesuspilledpureblood82]

It's also not true, it's communism that doesn't tolerate inequality.

[@EatHoneyBeeHappy]

Daniel: "We've dug up bones of a family with a mom, dad, and two kids, therefore everybody who lived thousands of years ago wanted a nuclear family."

[@6foot8jesuspilledpureblood82]

And what do you want? A fleshlight?

[@lowkey276]

My sister is an archeologist and Daniel is not far from the truth, but we would generally not say "it's a family" but "it's a religious site" to gain funds.

[@MrEvrit]

Weren't families in the past structured more like clans?

[@Jake-bt3fc]

@@lowkey276 Archeology is barely science. Those people make up so many crazy elaborate assumptions and theories off of tiny clues that could mean anything.

[@redwire6315]

I want this guy to be featured on every media outlet in the world. I've never seen anyone make clearer arguments against fundamentalist Islam...and I'm not talking about Destiny lol

[@beastemeauxde7029]

Except he doesn't recognize that Saudi Arabia exists.

[@Sprite_525]

@@beastemeauxde7029 both people in the video and the commenter know Saudi Arabia exists. Countries aren’t debaters so it doesn’t apply to the commenter’s point about individual public speakers

[@COEBY]

Thats was clever lol,

[@aaronataman892]

ugh. this was a disappointing conversation. not a real POV, just a boring caricature.

[@fluffyfingerz9777]

It wasn't a debate destiny clearly didn't do his research and actually admitting there should be a military intervention to force people to following his ideology. So basically he conceded the argument probably in the first 20 minutes. They have many debate Islam vs Liberalism with people far intelligent than this destiny guy just look mohammed hajib vs liberalism ect . This wasn't a debate. The Muslim shouldn't have falling for the rattling gun tactic that most Liberals use when they clearly haven't done their research this destiny guy is out of his depth.

[@roberteriksen6434]

Destiny and religious content, Islamic debates at that?!? Am i back to the golden age of 2016 or whats going on ?!?

[@unclebobboomergames]

2016? You make me feel old because this feels like 2009 youtube as I was starting college

[@domenicgalata1470]

I didn’t really think this would have to be debated again. One view is outdated, irrelevant and a barrier to progress( all of the Abrahamic Religions for this description) , the other is necessary for the 21st century and onward for society to evolve into something better.

[@bennywolfe4357]

Why so salty?

[@birdly9983]

Man’s brought a predator gaming laptop to the debate

[@adamlee1014]

Smashing out some league

[@pargonyan]

He supports predators so it makes sense

[@overoscar1788]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/goeVaGmwbbuJaNE

[@CuriousCyclist]

Teaching evolution in science class is not imposing liberalism. It is teaching science!

[@jordanaragon4609]

Lol ur clueless

[@CuriousCyclist]

@@jasfordprod like theory of gravity

[@octs609]

@@jasfordprod you know all science is theory right? what do you think scientific theory means? are you dim?

[@cmp6]

@@jasfordprod You should learn the basic things about what you are commenting on before embarrassing yourself on the internet. The definition of "theory" in science is different than how it is used by the general population. I feel like this should be a well known thing by now, but you decided to be ignorant to it.

[@mgband]

@@jasfordprodI know this is 7 months ago, but do you really not know what a theory is in the scientific sense? If you still don’t know, maybe read a book?

[@Z_GT]

“Are you not fetishsizing reality?” Lol

[@ExtropianKnight]

When your debate opponent says that, there's no better move than just letting it hang.

[@HuntersHunter]

Daniel's unconscious argument is that Islam is the perfect bliss machine and we should mandate everyone into it. He loves the bliss machine as long as it's his bliss machine.

[@saulkid7232]

I noticed this too. His bliss machine 'argument' was an almost perfect parallel to his own ideology. He said people who believe in a God are happier than atheists which is actually true.. but if God turned out to be not real, the belief in God is in essence just his bliss machine. A delusion that makes you feel good.

[@ogulcandursun1665]

@@saulkid7232 well that part is complicated i mean the is god real part.Better question is what is it that people call god yet can never precisely define.As destiny stated which i agree is smt a lot of people do which is if something is bad just compeletely toss it aside but doesnt necessarily has to be like that.The way i view most ancient beliefs is basically people at that time with their perception understood somethings and tried to share it as best as they could there might be some more details to this but for the sake of this little section lets just take it as that.Think of it like this , someone in a village claims there is a ghost in a house and they feel it in a spesific place of the house most of the time.There doesnt have to be an actual ghost can just be electromagnetic waves leaking out of bla bla bla but the thing im trying to tell you is that he/she felt something,anything.They percieve that there is something yet what they call it doesnt have to be true for there to be something happening.I really hope i could express what i meant.Not really easy to tell it here.

[@agathafry4233]

Yes exactly this. The “utopia” he claims liberals desire in the nebulous slippery slope future is in fact the ‘once upon a time’ utopia when everyone was happy because religion was pure and liberals hadn’t watered it down or whatever. It’s the same fantasyland game that Conservatives play in the US about the good ol days (that never actually existed).

[@gd8838]

It was so clear to me during his opening statement. Unironically "liberalism is opressive and bad and wants to force itself onto others" from a Muslim of all people. Talk about lack of self awareness.

[@HuntersHunter]

@@saulkid7232 Even if God was real his reasoning is faulty. He appeals to Islam on the basis that it's the most suitable to our biology and makes us happiest and most fulfilled, without even mentioning God. If you accept that logic and metric for Islam being good, then a bliss machine perfectly designed to match our biology and produce maximum feelings of happiness and fulfillment is not only a good thing, it would even be an improvement on Islam.

[@JesusHChrist2000]

When asked a direct question about Islam it's; "Well, if you look at this other religion/system..." Every. single. time.

[@JesusHChrist2000]

@My Bro There's a big difference between honestly explaining an answer, and deflecting with "whataboutisms".

[@sh-tz2xs]

@@JesusHChrist2000 because you trynna make it only Islam's problem and he have the right to respond

[@arisrayden]

​@@sh-tz2xs yes he has the right to respond and he uses his right to show all non cognitively impaired people that he has no answers and needs to deflect, circumvent or equivocate. he is completely aware that direct and honest answers would reveal the grotesque and disregarding nature of his side

[@sh-tz2xs]

@@arisrayden then i guess you actually didn't watch the debate and being emotional if you think he was being dishonest

[@arisrayden]

@@sh-tz2xs oh i have watched the whole thing. i just can't really believe that anyone could be this dumb so my first instinct is that he's just dishonest but you're right he probably is just really that dumb and delusional

[@Are_you_eyeballing_me]

His example with divorce was so revealing. The problem in that example is not that someone is being prevented from practising islamic law, because even in that example the woman, if she is a devout practitioner of sharia law, can just choose not to take the divorce avenue afforded to her by a liberal society. The problem he is crying about is that when presented with an alternative, people choose not to follow islamic law. So in essence he is not upset that he is being prevented from practicing his religion, because he isn’t, he is upset that in a liberal society he can’t force someone else to follow his religious doctrine under threat of severe punishment. Well, tough shit.

[@Alexander-qd7nj]

Destiny: can liberal societies thrive in Muslim countries? Other guy: what do you mean by the word "can"?

[@spiritx13]

Well first, we need to figure out what the weird "can" doesn't mean...

[@Localpref416]

What do you think society means? Do we live in one?

[@gd8838]

@@spiritx13 are we sure this is not related to feudalism?

[@markymark7531]

What do you mean by LGBT?

[@abdullahmuzaffar2483]

Yes exactly they are thriving, not only that liberals are the ruling class and they did this with bombing and making the islamic activist disappear .

[@vCryptoYT]

It’s been the same story with these guys trying to debate Islam, all liberal flavored who repeat the same tired talking points and none of them can begin to even think critically about liberalism itself and acknowledge that it has problems & is contradictory & leads to opression.

[@riderbuu1]

💯

[@OdinWannaBe]

you really need to rewatch the video my dude

[@riderbuu1]

You for real my man?

[@OdinWannaBe]

@@riderbuu1 im asking you to re watch the video with a critical mind please

[@IGiveTheBestTakes]

This is bait

[@GO-GO_SO-SO]

It would be way better for a Conservative in a Liberal society than a Liberal in a Conservative society. I agree with Destiny completely.

[@adamcramm]

It’s worse for everyone in a liberal society.

[@drmodestoesq]

The Liberal gets to virtue signal. And really, shouldn't that be the focus of one's life?

[@waldo8040]

@@drmodestoesq go try living under conservatives in the Taliban and come back and tell us how it's better than liberalism you ingrate.

[@justingower1597]

I’m pretty sure this is objectively true

[@lifeyoushouldtryit]

@@waldo8040 many of the people currently living under the Taliban do think that, as did many of the people in the Soviet union and currently in china. You think your way of life is objectively better but many peoples around the world think you are degenerates trying to recreate sodom and gomorrah

[@pvtj0cker]

Can't have a mature conversation with someone who believes a person was flying on a horse.

[@SAKA701]

Imperialism is liberalism, utilitarianism is liberalism, Colonialism is liberalism, Pragmatic Anarchism(?) is liberalism, Transhumanism is liberalism and lastly every other thing that I don't like but forgot to mention is also liberalism.

[@brettleighglass]

Also everything you just said is liberalism, and because I said this, I am now liberalism

[@TawheedPromoter]

Destiny should have defined liberalism and refuted him but he too stupid to do that

[@brettleighglass]

@@TawheedPromoter Dude, you were so close to the point, but somehow still ended up lightyears away from it. The debate isn't on the Destiny's definition of liberalism, it's on what the video is titled Have you read the Qur'an? "As for the thief, the male and the female, amputate their hands in recompense for what they committed as a deterrent [punishment] from Allah . And Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise." That's some pretty wild stuff to get behind.

[@jkdragonjk6895]

@@at_1804 that modern societies shouldn’t be saying that an ok punishment for theft is cutting off the thief’s hands

[@jkdragonjk6895]

@@at_1804 as a general rule yes, in every case no. But if I have no idea about the underlying context of the situation then yea I think it’s fair to say that the modern thing is probably better than the non-modern thing

[@brandonk.4864]

“Slavery is bad but sometimes it’s necessary” BRUH

[@NeoLegendX]

We literally can't see that we are slowly being enslaved

[@1993muth]

How are you so confident he is wrong. Slavery with specific guidance and restrictions can be justified In the context of war captives, which is the only way one can become a slave Islamicly. The USA still practices slavery under a different name. People who commit crimes against the state (some of which are less significant than being a supportor of enemy combatants) are placed into prison and are forced to work there with little to no pay. Many prisons are overcrowded and miserable. How is that any better than slavery. The war captive/slave of a Muslim amay actually have more rights than a prisoner of many liberal countries. How do liberbral democratic countries treat their prisoners of war? Is it any better, I doubt it. Have you heard of Guantanamo Bay.

[@curiousman3655]

@@1993muth wow, lotta shit to say nothing

[@yorgenibnstrangle3072]

@@curiousman3655You just lack comprehension skills

[@curiousman3655]

@@yorgenibnstrangle3072 so there are no alternatives to slavery?

[@yasirdaniel9165]

17:09 - 17:18 That was really strange from Destiny as Daniel spent very little time talking about US foreign policy, maybe one sentence in the entire 15 minutes. So he just dodged everything Daniel said about colonialism. It seems like Destiny doesn’t know what colonialism is, and he definitely definitely doesn’t know the history about it. In this entire debate he tried to avoid the topic of history

[@OdinWannaBe]

cus it had nothing to do with the debate you know....

[@lacktoes5838]

@@OdinWannaBe how?

[@yasirdaniel9165]

@@diobrando6910 Colonialism is rooted from liberalism 🤦‍♂️

[@thetruth2301]

@@yasirdaniel9165 No it's not

[@yasirdaniel9165]

@@thetruth2301 Let me not provide anything with academic weight and just say “No it’s not”

[@k45207]

I just watch Matt dillahuntys debate with Daniel. Probably one of the more frustrating debates I’d ever seen. One of the worst Islamic apologists I’ve seen, it turned into name calling and misgendering. It was insanely dishonest and he wouldn’t even begin to start a debate. Matt got very frustrated so its really nice to see destiny just body bagging this guy 😂

[@negaro9113]

As an exmuslim yeah, bro got bodied hard

[@k45207]

@@negaro9113 hey me too! 🤣

[@negaro9113]

@@k45207 I'm from Pakistan 💀💀

[@k45207]

@@negaro9113 ok this is getting weird so am I 🇵🇰

[@mgband]

Same. Just got done watching the Dillahunty debate. Matt was not prepared for that shit show, but really who would be prepared for such an asinine and dishonest opponent.

[@moiseslopez981]

My fav part is when he says slavery and murder are okay in certain circumstances. Also love how his whole argument is that forced strict islam is better than the supposed "forced" liberalism that exists in western society.

[@davidkarter.3632]

@My Bro coming from a person who believe good virgins bul| is quite ironic 😂

[@alexalford7874]

@@TawheedPromoter So what are some examples of justified slavery ?

[@muhammadbello8756]

@@alexalford7874 When you fight war and there are captives, you don't kill them like savages and you can't let them go either as they'll come back for revenge and thus you enslave them.

[@hashimkhan7]

@@alexalford7874 Islamic Slavery is totally different from the Socially constructed picture of Slavery caused by west.. Islam teaches to enslaves War prisoners.. And doesnt teach to kill the war prisoners like the pre modern day wars did.. Also What west is doing..

[@TheBlaze4000]

@@muhammadbello8756 Prisons exist smooth brain.

[@TheNoodleGod9001]

It really is just "you are oppressing me by not letting me oppress other people".

[@aaliyah3037]

Ahh and the white race gets to define what oppression is.

[@jakobhancock106]

@@aaliyah3037 not killing people for being gay, allowing women to have rights, not sexually abusing children are not inherently white views of morality. Are you okay with any of those things?

[@aaliyah3037]

@@jakobhancock106 It's your kind pushing LGBT, feminism and liberalism on people. These are not universally accepted morals and values. You have to argue for them from first principles.

[@jakobhancock106]

@@aaliyah3037 pretty sure not sexually abusing children is universally accepted but if that's something you're for just come out and say it. I'm not pushing anything. Literally not one thing. If you think the Muslim ideology has any chance in the u.s. then get into politics and get enough people behind you to enact that change. But we both know that will never happen because the majority of this country wouldn't entertain that barbarism. That's the best part of America. In most cases the majority set the standard. So it's no surprise that you can't get away with whatever bullshit your scripture tells you is okay.

[@keanureeves3273]

What is wrong with killing two people who were caught having gay intercourse (four witnesses). If you were caught by that many people, you were likely doing it where you were not supposed to. Woman have rights, it sure where it says they don’t. Where does it say that children may be sexually abused? Are you stupid?

[@warrenob1000]

I love Daniel's appeals to biology, even as he admits that he does not believe in evolution.

[@MrIslamdeen]

Yes if you believe it then it's a authority over you

[@TawheedPromoter]

But you believe in evolution and this way he shows contradiction in your world view

[@justifano7046]

@@TawheedPromoter $10 says you don't understand evolution

[@Jay-wb7hw]

You don’t need to agree with everything in biology. If ur in the science field or know someone who is you’d know they’re a lot of disagreements on certain topics but that doesn’t necessarily mean you can’t use X science because u disagree with certain theories that are present.

[@Ketszercsip]

@@Jay-wb7hw You can't cherry-pick science that fits your world view. I'm sure there are disagreement about certain details and more modern findings but if you reject something as well established and fundamental as evolution you forfeit your right to appeal to biology

[@ChronicDreamer1st]

When the Muslim guy says “people” what he really means is “Muslim Men” When he says this is best for “people” and best for the happiness of “people” what he means is it’s best for “Muslim Men” and everyone else’s happiness supposedly trickles down from theirs.

[@silmarilion2667]

the predator named laptop is so fucking fitting.

[@Wahooney]

"We want to protect your fulfilment and happiness, even if we have to kill you to do it." - This guy.

[@unknownuser41190]

The best summary of Daniel's position I've seen thus far. 👏

[@nextmessi4249]

That' sums up some secular states Aswell. Both Islam and liberalism condone punishment of insurrectionist's.

[@maumau467]

Its bad to oppress, unless if you are a liberal, then its ok.

[@nextmessi4249]

@@maumau467 good point the bias and complete double standards are unbelievable these days

[@unknownuser41190]

@@maumau467 liberals, historically are against oppression of freedoms & rights of everyone.

[@robertgrey1377]

By “liberal” Daniel means enforcing basic agreed upon human rights. Ie. outlawing child marriage, killing apostates, having womens rights, daniel believes it’s oppressive to Muslims to not let them do those things!

[@DStrong.]

and yet you still have people in these comments defending this guy. how you can agree with these things in this day and age and still amass a following is beyond me

[@thatindiandude4602]

@@DStrong. I mean, there are 2 billion Muslims in this world. There's enough demographics there.

[@robertgrey1377]

@UCyGNfP1TqH5wWHyHBbTw_qQ no group in this world should have the right to take away basic human rights. That’s why your at odds with liberals. That’s a restriction I’m okay with. If your religion doesn’t infringe on others rights, your good. Secularism(or liberalism) is the reason we are even in the comments talking freely right now

[@FfejTball]

It's an important but still subtle distinction between a practitioner of Islam, and an Islamist. Religious extremism never really does anyone any good.

[@DStrong.]

@@thatindiandude4602 solid point. i mostly mean anyone whos had experience with a more free society still believing in this nonsense is crazy but nonetheless, good point

[@Reds-Card-Case]

Dudes complaining about being oppressed because international law and US law stops him from oppressing others😂

[@TheMarkSasuke64]

"We can't oppress people and force our own religious values on people, so we're oppressed." Good.

[@TawheedPromoter]

We impose our religion liberalism but you cannot impose your's. -Liberals

[@TheMarkSasuke64]

@@TawheedPromoter At least you admit you just want to impose yours too, but failing.

[@TawheedPromoter]

@@TheMarkSasuke64 yes but you don't admit you are imposing your values

[@TheMarkSasuke64]

@@TawheedPromoter no, I admit it. If you're for oppression and subjugation of others with immutable characteristics or different ideologies that's harmful to others outside of it, then I fully try impose my beliefs over yours.

[@TawheedPromoter]

@@TheMarkSasuke64 that's colonial mentality you don't obey me then you are for opressing others

[@yasirdaniel9165]

19:26 - 19:45 Wow, Destiny really said psychologists and evolutionary biologists don’t make any claims about people’s psychology and biology 10,000 years ago?? Really? That’s the whole point of evolutionary biology & psychology. That’s actually so bizarre. Does he know what evolution is?

[@rb3706]

Found the coping Muslim

[@WaxPaper]

Psychology is what he said, and I think he's probably right. We're anatomically-identical to humans 10,000 years ago, so it's reasonable to imagine the psychology was no different as well. Hence, not worth making a distinction between the psychology of modern and ancient people.

[@yasirdaniel9165]

@@WaxPaper Be honest with yourself. Psychology between societies today is different, let alone generations...

[@WaxPaper]

@@yasirdaniel9165 I really don't think that's true. I doubt the DSM differentiates between people of different cultures. Human psychology is probably the same in us as it was in the first people, 200,000 years ago. I mean if you can find examples of psychologists studying the psychology of prehistoric people, then I stand corrected. But I don't even know how you'd study that, since it relies so much on observation. That's why I think he's right; I think you'll be hard-pressed to find any psychologists making claims about prehistory.

[@yasirdaniel9165]

​@@WaxPaper The idea that human psychology has remained unchanged for 200,000 years and is the same across all cultures is dumb-founded and not supported by scientific evidence at all. I think you're confusing physiology with psychology. Just look at any research in cross-cultural psychology. You'll see that cultural differences can have a significant impact on individuals' behavior, thoughts, and emotions. For example, studies show that the expression and experience of emotions can vary between cultures, with some cultures emphasizing the suppression of negative emotions while others may encourage the expression of emotions. Cultural values, social norms, and beliefs can all shape individuals' experiences and behavior, simply leading to psychological differences between societies. Man, even within each society, there is a range of psychological diversity among individuals. This is even more clear in prehistoric psychology. What are the methods to study prehistoric psychology? Researchers use archaeological, anthropological, and historical evidence to infer psychological differences between ancient and modern humans. Also, sure the DSM might not differentiate between people of different cultures, but did you know it does acknowledge the importance of considering cultural context in the diagnostic process? The DSM-5 includes a section on Cultural Formulation, which encourages clinicians to gather information about the patient's cultural background and how it may affect their symptoms and presentation. That's why many psychiatrists and mental health professionals advocate for culturally sensitive and culturally competent practice, which means being aware of one's own biases and taking cultural differences into account. Thank you for the great discussion btw.

[@oppre55]

My favourite bit is the Muslim talking about colonisation and oppression

[@haruhirogrimgar6047]

Any abrahamic religion has absolutely 0 room to talk. The only places they didn't completely destroy the culture they invaded was when they were systemically oppressed.

[@chintuz1002]

liberalim didnt do colonisation? lol

[@nws6146]

1:18:18 Ironic how he grills Destiny for rejecting his “experience machine” thought experiment, but then goes on to explain how one can achieve blissful ignorance through a belief in God.

[@josephscott1236]

This is especially true given the fact that religious mysticism tends to emphasize that God desires us to fall in love and enjoy the bliss of experiencing God's presence. So it seems this guy's ideas would even be controversial for well articulated religion. Thomas Aquinas for instance believed pleasure was indeed instrumental in happiness

[@gd8838]

The whole thing is so surreal, it's almost 2 hours of someone endorsing ideas he wants to reject

[@boliusabol822]

there's no way he'd say such a thing he's very educated. Try quoting people and not misrepresenting them. Daniel has studied physics and philosophy for example, not exactly ignorant, his knowledge of the world blows yours out of the water

[@nws6146]

@@boliusabol822 Is that why he doesn’t believe in evolution?

[@boliusabol822]

@@nws6146 Dude you are not talking honestly and are playing games. A person can be good on philosophy and physics and not believe in evolution. I think it's wrong for him to not believe in evolution and I know why he doesn't believe in it and it's not for the sarcastic thing you mention. If you aren' capable of having a rational discussion, which you clearly are not, then there's no discussion for us to have.

[@polosaquarium691]

Destiny: Islam wants to kill the gehs Muslim guy: No, but yes. Destiny face:🗿

[@rafay3760]

Don't forget that gay people would be happier living in that type of society

[@alewis17]

@@rafay3760 no

[@gkrpgfan]

@@alewis17 @Rafay was being sarcastic by repeating Daniel's Answer, which was that gays would be happier living under that kind of Islam

[@KindBatman]

What's wrong with having laws?

[@Qjaivlfystcox]

@@KindBatman doesn’t solve the issue and zero Muslim country’s follow traditional sharia, they r just dumb

[@kidmidas2029]

I live in a Muslim household, and so my mom actually watched this debate before I am. She was complaining in my family group chat about how this Destiny guy was an idiot and got destroyed, not knowing I'm a destiny -cultist- fan. Really weird like worlds colliding moment lmao

[@superhamz7]

Yeah true, in my family and mosque group chat they were throwing around clips of this debate on Facebook talking about destiny getting wrecked

[@thatindiandude4602]

Marshallah. Your mother is a wise woman. This is why in Islam they say the whole world lies at your mother's feet 🙇

[@maxpenders3417]

This is actually incredible

[@sdog1234]

Is that why there are so many Muslim plebs piling on the modern day debate comment section?

[@thatindiandude4602]

@@MauveGun bro, these memes are cracking me up :D

[@Mignon15]

(Long post, sorry) I have an online friend from Saudi Arabia who's gay. He plays FFXIV to do erotic roleplay because he can't live out his desires in real life. If he wants to hook up with a guy, he risks getting executed, because while yes, BEING gay is indeed legal, being caught in a gay act risks getting sentenced to prison, flogging or death. This includes you having sex in your own home and someone happens to see you through a window, or a burglar breaking in, and then serving as a witness. His family doesn't know he's gay because he would never be able to speak to them again. He also claims that sociopathy is very common in Saudi, by his own estimates up to 40%. No empathy towards animals, the homeless, or women for that matter. In Ramadan, people will not eat during the day then feast like kings every night. A lot of my muslim friends change their sleeping schedule to be awake at night. The whole purpose of fasting is to feel how it is to be poor, being closer to Allah by understanding the essence of humans, seeking forgiveness for sins. You don't understand how poverty feels by LARPing as a poor person for a few hours a day, when you don't follow the spirit of its teachings. I disagree with the whole concept of Ramadan, but that's another thing entirely. It's really rather sad seeing the state of modern western muslim youths. They took a liking to the worst aspects of modern western culture; trying to game the system by lying about disabilities, gambling, drinking and doing drugs, yet the positive parts of western culture is seen as haram, like homosexuality, equal human rights, peaceful and democratic responses to critique and so on. In general they tend do the same thing as the Chinese government, which is abusing the hospitality of western empathy: plead for generousity, yet demanding hosts to conform to their views, then act like the victim once there's the slightest pushback towards their aggressive actions. The term islamophobia is probably one of the most misused words I've heard in recent years.

[@carolinaandy5059]

God, imagine how scary it must be to be on the opposite side of a debate as destiny and seeing him just writing on his sticky notes the entire time your talking.

[@diaz2634]

imagine if he starts eating his pizza which he ordered to arrive 10 minutes before the debate

[@mainsidequest5203]

I think he is just playing stick figure LoL with himself.

[@cosettapessa6417]

@@diaz2634 where does this pizza meme come from? Does he use the moments he chews as a tactic?

[@Ryfinius]

If you know your shit, not that scary.

[@khaledibrahim4889]

Not scary if you’re actually educated well on the topic your discussing.

[@justice1911]

Also he was angry that “Muslims in France have to follow French law before Muslim law”. Why wouldn’t they? If I went to a Muslim country and demanded to follow liberal American law instead of sharia I might get my head split open. Why wouldn’t you have to follow the law of the land you reside in?

[@drmodestoesq]

Easy question to answer. Because French secular values are wrong. And his version of Islam is right. What's next? Are you going to say that he should accept 2 + 2 = 5 because the French government mandates it?

[@mattattack75]

That's why this whole premise of the debt is moronic and poisons the well. Of course there will be some level of oppression unless you live in a anarchist utopia. This slimy moron just can't admit that islamist countries would be FAR more oppressive than the reverse

[@justice1911]

@@drmodestoesq do you not think that just claiming “im right because im right” is the dumbest shit in the world?

[@drmodestoesq]

@@justice1911 Ohhhh....my friend..."I" have nothing to do with it. It's what God wants. I am but his humble vessel. It rests on these sagging shoulders to deliver this burden of knowledge to you. I'm praying that you see the light and won't have to suffer for all eternity.

[@drmodestoesq]

@@mattattack75 He actually likes the oppression. For two reasons....One...he won't be on the receiving end of most of it. And two...he'll be getting most of the benefits. Also, he lives in the fantasy land that he, alone, gets to decide on how Sharia will be applied. Oh...a third...when he dies he'll be getting 72 virgins and a permanently tumescent erection. You can look that up. Is permanently tumescent erection a tautology? I leave that question to you.... If it is...I apologize.

[@thehaight68]

“you know what a thought experiment is right?” had to of been one of the most frustrating questions destiny has ever received.

[@OdinWannaBe]

i laughed

[@claymoreisdope1361]

@@Cymricus he was more frustrated than anything else. Destiny literally had no idea what he was debating. Destiny did not have an opening statement. He would literally ask 10s of questions to DH just so destiny himself could understand the argument. Zero citations of studies/ academic/Philosophical work. Conceded the debate midway through. DH had to spoon feed Destiny, destiny’s own position

[@rosscleary9110]

@@claymoreisdope1361 "Saying 2 men who get caught having sex should be put to death isn't the same as putting gay men to death" Yeah okay then you slimeball.

[@xaviernunez7777]

@@claymoreisdope1361 Daniel got steamrolled lmao

[@claymoreisdope1361]

@@phun54321 hilarious how u couldn't defend any of the charges leveled against Destiny

[@wileyreid5420]

Honestly part of the reason I love watching Destiny is the fact that he does these irl debates and still does incredibly well at maintaining his composure unlike a strong majority of people in the political sphere. Could you imagine someone like demon mama or vivian doing shit like this?

[@Yoshimitsu4prez]

I’m pretty sure Demon mama could easily do what she always does in this setting. Whether you think she does well or not is another wuestion

[@jamrollz]

@@Yoshimitsu4prez She always intellectually checks out and then goes on an angry monologue of what she thinks the conversation should be. So perhaps youre right, she'll do the same thing here.

[@sm0key0u31]

@@Yoshimitsu4prez Destiny was not maintaining composure. You must not know how to read body language at all. 1. He kept clicking and flipping his pen nonstop (shows he’s nervous) 2. Only asked questions and avoided answers (nervous with replying) 3. Had his head looking down while still clicking his pen throughout the debate when Daniel would respond (bad posture for a public debate). 4. Gets upset and emotional for each response because he doesn’t know how to apply logic and reason.

[@Yoshimitsu4prez]

@@sm0key0u31 what the actual fuck does that have to do with my thought that demonmama could handle an in-person debate? What are all these words? Why did you list aspects of Destiny’s body language? I didn’t even mention Destiny

[@Yoshimitsu4prez]

@@sm0key0u31 to respond to your wildly out of nowhere comment: yeah, he’s used to constantly playing LoL or Stellaris or whatever the fuck while he talks to people. Of course he’s fidgety

[@ThePigeStrangler]

“You’re just using one little example!” The little example is being EXECUTED for wanting to have a different religion vs women wanting to get divorced.

[@TheMarkSasuke64]

Destiny really should've pushed back on that absurd line. Executing people is not just a "little example"--I don't know why Destiny lets stuff like that go.

[@regalraccoon]

@@TheMarkSasuke64 I get the feeling Destiny was holding back for some reason

[@SecularReasons]

@@TheMarkSasuke64 probably has something to do with the idea of possible negative consequences for his criticisms of the best religion on earth. Lol.

[@j.r.r.tolkien8724]

Mr. The Pigeon Strangler, The punishments in their entirety are only a fraction of Islamic law. You can straw-man all you want but in the end you'll lose the debate if you were to chose this side of emotional reductionist argument.

[@FireGod1101]

@@j.r.r.tolkien8724 What is a law but the enforcement of values with the breaking of said values resulting in punishment. You're missing the forest for the trees buddy.

[@Julien-pd2vs]

LMFAO. The question about whether debates like these can happen in a Muslim country was so good. I was born and raised in a Muslim country and to this day I'm very careful on debating religion(and its politics) even with my closest Muslim friends. If it's taboo enough to debate in a private setting, imagine debating topics like this in a public one.

[@woodsofchaos]

do you mind saying which country it is? Just so people have a more accurate impression than "all muslim countries are like this". Btw reading your comment made me realize how grateful i should be for my freedom of speech.

[@Julien-pd2vs]

@@woodsofchaos The UAE. Keep in mind that I'd consider this country to be the most moderate Muslim country right now.

[@umaryusuf537]

@@Julien-pd2vs bruh there have been massive religious discussion in Pakistan where Christians argued why Christianity is the truth in front of tens of thousands of people maybe over 100k so why don’t you stop generalizing 😱🙄🙄

[@wisdomofislamm]

Debates like this has happened in Islamic countries. Just search Debate of imam Abu Khanifa with Atheist. He lived in 8th century

[@btecndcomp]

Julien acting like he'd be stoned to death in Dubai for discussing anything controversial

[@aaron4820]

The man can levitate objects with his mind with the amount of mental gymnastics he practices to be able to say that an LGBT will have a fine time in a Muslim community.

[@chrisdistant9040]

Most descriptive and fitting laptop brand ever XD

[@alphazutn1274]

No way 😂

[@hachelyd_i3232]

Yoooo🤣🤣🤣

[@Ajaws]

1:52:00 “liberalism oppresses my ability to oppress people” basically sums up his entire argument. There I just saved you 2 hours Edit: literally getting the exact argument in the responses, it’s fucking hilarious

[@botbeamer]

what do you define as oppression? liberalism is an oppressive genocidal ideology of colonization / racism

[@botbeamer]

because liberals prefer between their legs and their other senses to the well being of society, truth, justice, etc ... these are alien concepts to science because science can only measure dirt and wood and mud, it cannot measure love, dedication, worship, submission, truth, justice, enlightenment

[@Ajaws]

@@botbeamer colonization and racism aren’t unique to liberalism and aren’t the direct cause or result of liberalism That’s like saying “monarchs invade other countries therefore monarchy is bad” like no that just means invading other countries is bad That argument just isn’t sound Hell Genocide has literally been committed by anti-liberal regimes throughout the 20th century, the USSR, China, Nazi Germany, Bosnia, Cambodia, Rwanda, Ultranationalist Japan, mass killings in the Middle East, almost every act of genocidal violence in the 20th century were committed by non liberal regimes, in fact, Liberalism defeated both fascism and communism in that same century. That isn’t a sound take

[@Ajaws]

@@botbeamer well enlightenment, reason, justice, equality, etc. are all existing liberal values and came to mainstream ideological discourse specifically because of the enlightenment period which was the foundation of liberalism in the west Ultimately the greatest advances in human history and the fastest growth period in all of human existence has come from western liberal civilizations. Hell China’s standard of living and GDP skyrocketed when the liberalized. The Islamic golden age embraced Aristotle and western philosophy and Al Ghazali basically rejected reason and kept Islam in a dark age. Islamic fundamentalist nations kill each other and have been stuck in the dark ages because of the decline of Islamic philosophy brought on by people like Al-Ghazali and hasn’t been able to “dominate the world” specifically because it hasn’t liberalized. The entire thing is authoritarian cope. He is upset because Liberalism doesn’t allow him to oppress other people. (Meanwhile you can openly practice Islam in liberal nations but if you practice anything but Islam in Islamic nations you are subjugated or executed) Like no wonder so many people leave Islam, nobody wants to be subjugated because the nature of man isn’t submission. The right of man is to be free, because that’s his nature. Submission is rejection of humanity

[@Ajaws]

@Syed Aman what authority have you to enforce your will on other people? it is your religion, your subjective interpretation of the world and universe, it gives you no authority over anyone but your own individual self. Within liberalism you can be muslim, that is your choice, while everyone else can make a choice to be non muslim if they wish. You simply do not have the right to impose that will. Liberalism is simply intolerant of intolerance. You have the freedom to choose for yourself, that is it. Humans are free agents who can determine thier own path, and those who do not accept that fact are not only unholy and rejecting the gift of free will God gave us, but are oppressive and do not have the right to oppress others. Nobody is interfering with your ability to be Muslim, its when you force it on others that you are overstepping your boundary, you have no authority from God or otherwise, as no man can understand what god wants. The Quran, the Bible, the Torah, these are the words of men speaking for god, and are subject to change and challenge by men of faith. They should be challenged. Otherwise we do God a disservice, we reject our human nature given to us by Allah himself. Free will and self determination are holier than domination

[@Ben-oc3fg]

In Germany, we have a subject called Ethics. In which I learned about other religions, such as Islam, and in a completely neutral way. We lean about Philosophers of the Western world a lot to be fair. Although, at the schools I went to, 50% or more were part of another religion. Mostly Muslims. I don't know why you would consider it Atheistic. I think that I actually never heard the word atheism in these classes. The teachers have a background in philosophy and encourage discussions. I just wanted to add this since I think it is misrepresented.

[@blackwomangamer2637]

Without Lies Islam dies

[@nathandotson6350]

Thank god Destiny asked the Moderators to enforce a 20 second response time, this dude just redefines the words anytime a question is asked and appeals to biology and liberal philosophers without answering anything.

[@randalthor2859]

He put the entire political spectrum from actual liberalism, all the way to fascism and despotism under the umbrella of liberalism in his opening statement. Regardless of your placement on the political spectrum, that statement should come across as absurd.

[@fritzschnitzmueller3768]

This is the definition of religious talk

[@kashifkhan-yr8wi]

seriously? Destiny asked for 20 sec response ONLY after Daniel was frustrated by answering to like 50 questions He finally refused to take any more question and asked one from Destiny Destiny avoided it by asking the moderator for 20 second response time And the funny part is, Destiny still escaped the question

[@RanEncounter]

@@kashifkhan-yr8wi Wait you actually think Daniel answered anything honestly?

[@russelld2925]

That about sums up the debate. When people don’t have anything meaningful to say they overcompensate by spewing word salads.

[@zedpilled]

As a member of the Daliban I am confused on who to side with.

[@Dogan_TM]

"Can I have 15 minutes?" this is gonna be a good one

[@harpagornis]

15.000 years of recorded history. This guy is telling so much bs, I'm not going to watch any further. Destiny, he is not worth your time.

[@professorrubickmagusgrandi7909]

Small Brain: Liberalism oppresses Islam. Big Brain: Liberalism doesn't oppresses Islam. Galaxy Brain: Liberalism oppresses Islam. And that's good.

[@sargeteg5927]

Small clarification: Liberalism oppresses Islam when it comes to matters like honor killings, child rape/marriages and murder for abandoning Islam. And that's good.

[@SIRAJPRODUCTIONS]

@@sargeteg5927 what?

[@Fredekokie]

@@sargeteg5927 Exactly. Pray to any god you want idgaf but when you start killing people and justifying it in your religion, nah man that's fucked up

[@abdullahmuzaffar2483]

@@Fredekokie but liberals kill and genocide without praying to God, what about that then ?

[@Fredekokie]

@@abdullahmuzaffar2483 Never said thar genocide is good. But it's a little easier to justify killing someone for your self-preservation than holy war is, no?

[@timothyfogwill2627]

Destiny's editor needs a fucking knighthood for allowing us all to skip the 15 min opening statement

[@saharaahmed7885]

​@lostin cave 💀💀💀💀🦍💀

[@9cobil299]

Is this guy just the most honest religious extremist ever? He should be on a watchlist.

[@michaelvanderwal7390]

He said he has a few friends on the no fly list. That was a red flag for me.

[@z123_qqq]

a watchlist because he makes perfect sense

[@urielpolak9949]

“Liberal oppression of muslims”??!! What trype. Daniel would be fine being forced into mariage?? Noooo just women not daniel

[@ammanite]

Daniel is a pariah in most of the Muslim community, even among the religious ones. He takes the most extreme opinions and then tries to push them as normative and that anyone who differs with him just does so because "they're apologists." For the record, many/most of his views aren't even accepted by most Muslims in the Muslim world, much less ones in the US.

[@revalation92]

How in the world did Daniel claim that Saudi Arabia is under a “liberal government”, even with his absurd definition?

[@MrEvrit]

At this point I have no idea what's a Liberal government according to Daniel.

[@ayoub.3939]

Maybe semi sharia

[@Farhadmoh]

😂

[@Farhadmoh]

Saudie Arabia are very close to becoming one in the future, women no longer required to wear hijab by law

[@jcorey333]

I would have two questions for David: 1. I agree that a lot of things you listed are good: strong families, strong religious beliefs, etc. Why do you believe those values should be enforced by a state and not freely chosen by a community (e.g. if you want to have a strong family with a tough prenup, you should absolutely be free to make that choice, but why should that be forced upon you?) 2. If you believe that Muslim/traditional values are better and should be enforced by the state, how is that different from countries historically enforcing liberalism? (Besides "but these values are actually right")

[@MrGhostbeard]

He really does not seem bothered by the ok to kill gays part of the Quran….

[@andrewtallman1867]

Also, it’s funny he brings out colonialism as if Islam was not the vessel of Arab imperialism

[@notusingmyname4791]

"it's ok when we do it" the double standard that.. every culture has.

[@ayoub.3939]

Diffrent things islam mostly spread through trade and mixed with locals around world while europeans replaced native ​@@notusingmyname4791

[@ayoub.3939]

​@@notusingmyname4791 danny is persian not arab and in north africa the native berber fought arabs in spain, invaded mongols converted to islam so on