Libertarian Debate Goes Back To Coconut Island

Watch the Majority Report live Monday-Friday at 12 p.m. EST on KZbin OR listen via daily podcast at www.Majority.FM
www.house.gov/representatives...
www.senate.gov/senators/senat...
#SamSeder #EmmaVigeland #MajorityReport #politics #news #progressive #leftist #democrats #liberal
SUPPORT the show by becoming a member: www.jointhemajorityreport.com/
Download TMR's FREE app: www.majorityapp.com
TMR MERCH: www.shop.majorityreportradio.com
CHECK OUT MORE from the MR crew:
Matt Binder DOOMED / mattbinder
Brandon Sutton DISCOURSE / expandthediscourse
Emma Vigeland ESVN / esvnshow
Matt Lech LEFT RECKONING / leftreckoning
OTHER LINKS:
Twitch: / themajorityreport
Facebook: / majorityreport
Twitter: / majorityfm
Instagram: / majorityreport.fm

[@rexdink]

You can lead a Libertarian to water, but he'll just pollute it.

[@NJ-wb1cz]

Well, if we're alone on a remote pristine island and use coconut shells to trade fish, then all the crystal water is clear thanks to Objectivism and Ayn Rand personally

[@davidschrauwen1536]

😂

[@sethmann6397]

I agree with Sam on the issue. But is it illegal to burn your money? If you did that in your own house, why would that be illegal?

[@phaikia13]

And he expects you to pay for the clean up.

[@NJ-wb1cz]

@@sethmann6397 18 U.S. Code § 333 says harming bills in any way is punishable by fines and up to 6 months in prison

[@quietriot99]

I’m a simple man, I see libertarian on the majority report, I click watch

[@Ironraven001]

💯

[@joshuaadams1747]

Always lol

[@supremefenix974]

So does everyone, it's great content. But we don't post this same tired thing every time.

[@Rohbotoverlord]

For sure

[@gmsimoson]

Literally my favorite videos. And this guy has called in multiple times! This has to be a bit

[@wvu05]

Libertarians: People should not live off other people's labor. Also Libertarians: Support an economic system where the rich literally make their living off everyone else's labor.

[@robertgibb6990]

Realizing the latter part is what made me give up on Capitalism. lol If the system actually rewarded hard work, or skill, rather than rewarding people who get other people to do the hard work for them... Well we wouldn't have billionaires or millionaires under that system.

[@jaydimes3140]

"but intellectual labor! they're smarter! that's why they're rich!!!!!"

[@robertgibb6990]

@@jaydimes3140 *proceeds to hire hundreds of scientists and engineers to design everything their company will build* "See guys! No one, and I mean NO ONE, can hire smart people as good as I can!" - Elon probably

[@ronaldyang2295]

Yo wouldn't it be so cool if I didn't have to do any actual work and could passively generate wealth from the work of others? So cool right? And I wouldn't have to pay taxes and the law doesn't need to apply to me. Let me reap the benefits of a society without actually participating =D

[@freewilly1193]

​@ronaldyang2295 -everyone who has ever made money in a capitalist system where labor is valued less than the actual price of the labor Fixed your misstatement there

[@paulmeredith9404]

I love it when the writers bring back minor characters from previous seasons.

[@AndrewClement]

LONG TERM STORY TELLING

[@alexcaloca6566]

😂😂😂

[@gmsimoson]

I knew who it was the moment I heard that NorCal accent

[@rdnax5775562]

😂😂😂

[@NJ-wb1cz]

Please, call him by his KZbin name - Infertile Dan

[@raymonds.9021]

I really wish Libertarians would call in more

[@tokukeitaro]

Prey learn to avoid the places where predators hunt.

[@frankreyes6469]

So does Sam

[@blacxthornE]

​@@tokukeitaro that's a very generous assessment of the capacity of a libertarian brain.

[@sargonsblackgrandfather2072]

They used to but got to messed up they went into hiding

[@sargonsblackgrandfather2072]

@@elconquistador5469 why pay for it when they’re stupid enough to call in for free? Econ 101 buddy… don’t tell me, you’re a liberatarian right?

[@thumbhead3370]

At this point I refuse to believe libertarians are anything more than an elaborate satire of conservatives.

[@LampreyFilms]

My god I wish it was. The alternative is terrifying.

[@dezmodium]

They want all the freedoms with none of the responsibility. Literally the ideology of babies.

[@NJ-wb1cz]

@@dezmodium Ayn Rand was traumatized in Russia by the poor peasants stealing her family's wealth during the revolution, and her books were her attempts to somehow solve that trauma and "win" against them in an imaginary idealized world. And in a way it's understandable - she saw her parents working hard for their wealth, but she never saw how people working even harder could never rise out of poverty. She only saw how those people took what her parents worked for

[@Dontexxr]

That's exactly what they are, except they're serious....

[@Average_Brad]

Dude showed up to a gun fight with a straightened paper clip... again. I get the impression this guy spends all his spare time debating hypotheticals with himself.

[@sproductionsinc]

I heard he killed three men in a bar with a paper clip.

[@SmilingIbis]

Oddly enough, he loses those hypothetical debates with himself too.

[@TheDesertRat31]

​​@SmilingIbis lol!!!! Holy hell, i spit my drink out. Thank you!

[@Sup3rB4dVideos]

Are you from the Midwest?

[@NJ-wb1cz]

I'm pretty sure he just shows up to promote his tiny channel. He's doesn't even sound like his heart is fully into this so maybe he doesn't even believe in all this himself at this point

[@gmsimoson]

The problem with libertarianism is eventually you run out of coconuts to spend.

[@elduderino007]

Are you forcing a currency on me?

[@MrBendylaw]

African or European?

[@absoluteterror9098]

I can't believe The Coconut Island call videos are a Trilogy.

[@theguilloriousmind5832]

It's too good to be true

[@ShparkleDurginz]

Libertarian claims he was coerced into paying taxes......yet libertarian ideology says he accepted the contract by working, knowing he'd be paying taxes.

[@NJ-wb1cz]

No no no... It's cool if you're paying rent while living on someone else's property who provides services like protection and electricity and overall organization to tenants living on the property. It's not cool if you're paying taxes while living inside the borders of a country that provides sevices like protection and electricity and overall organization to the citizens living inside the country. These are totally different nouns with different letters in them

[@davidbright6790]

​@@NJ-wb1cz🤣🤣🤣 Excellent!

[@Alex-0597]

It's also cool if you're forced to take an exploitative job because nobody around you is offering non-exploitative jobs. But it's not cool if you're forced to live in a country with taxes because every country around you has taxes.

[@uncertaintytoworldpeace3650]

Yeah maybe if you’re an AI that was born at the age of fucking sixteen but if you exist in reality this comment is as insane as it sounds.

[@uncertaintytoworldpeace3650]

If you’re so convinced it’s this easy to not be stolen from then where are the local tax free communities all around America?

[@kcolonelx6181]

Libertarians: "I have this great idea that nobody has ever thought of before." Everyone else: "Heard it!"

[@williampounds5191]

"It's just a proto-Fuedalism that will very rapidly become plain old Feudalism again?!"

[@spamfilter32]

Not only have people heard it, they also experienced how it failed!

[@TheUglyAnswers]

Simpsons already did it

[@saybyebyetocomedy]

His libertarian ideology prevents him from accepting the fundamental mechanics of economics.

[@LuigiMordelAlaume]

Hahaha what do you mean, he knows what inflation is and the evolution of exchanging value in a trade. What's missing from that deep well of knowledge?? This dude is experiencing textbook Dunning-Kruger effect

[@saybyebyetocomedy]

@LuigiMordelAlaume You have an interesting definition for "deep well of knowledge".

[@Newton-Reuther]

​@saybyebyetocomedy I think Mr Meatball was being sarcastic (I'll stop with the Italian jokes when they prove that they can handle being on the Supreme Court)

[@daniel-panek]

And human nature

[@NJ-wb1cz]

It's a belief. So he knows the answer in advance and starts from "philosophy" of that answer to try find bits of reality on which it can seemingly stand on. It's how some Christians know the world is 4000 years old, and try to find rationalizations for it in the real world. They don't go out to find the best answer considering the entirety of the evidence, they are only interested in things that lead to their answer in particular. Which is also Dan can have such a patchy knowledge of things he himself mentions

[@OctoSavage]

Libertarian: lets talk about philosophy Sam: no, i'm going to assign you history homework

[@anthonyrowland9072]

Is Alden Island the only island safe to go to now? Can't go to Epstein's Sure can't go to Coconut...

[@charlesparr1611]

I mean, Epsteins is probably way safer nowadays....

[@TescoValueMemes369]

Veesh reference??? 🐴🐴🐴

[@weightlifting_socialist]

Too many pdf and loli lovers there. They cant be leftist if they are into that. Hopefully they get better and can come back better. Until then, stay away!

[@taylorsackett2556]

What is this, a crossover episode

[@DeathByEric]

🐎🥖😲🥥🏝️

[@joc.1353]

Favorite food, ….pizza. Favorite debate… libertarianism

[@calebharris292]

Ian Vaushinski strikes again

[@utubepunk]

You mean the Karkhiv Kid Finder?

[@Madgod52]

Surely you mean Vorshe?

[@JamesMorgan-ne8qu]

Professor Alden's stable boy.

[@RoffeDH]

Voosh

[@thepolarphantasm2319]

You mean America's favorite centaur enthusiast

[@JoYoon-yo4qu]

This guy's argument is so stupid. I do not drive, so do I get to stop paying my taxes that go towards road building? Or I cannot afford to fly when I travel, so do I get to stop paying my takes that go towards airport building and air travel infrastructure? Too stupid for words. Would this guy like to work for peanuts instead of hard cash?

[@eljoel89]

Sure you do. Go buy a fake Sovereign Citizen plate online, pay a guru $1,000 to tell you you're "traveling", tell the cop you're not a person, and tell the judge you're the person instead of the patron (or whatever the terminology is). It's definitely not a scam.

[@CincyFlight]

​@eljoel89 the term you are looking for is strawman. The strawman is the account the government set up using your birth certificate, because all names on government documents are in capital letters. I'm not a sovereign citizen, just like watching them try to use it on traffic stops.

[@NJ-wb1cz]

It's all based on hypotheticals because it takes the current social order for granted and proclaims that it will arise spontaneously with the void in the place of a power authority, and will magically keep working Of course, in reality power vacuum is organically filled by some form of feudal/warlord scenario with warring factions controlling the territories and setting their own arbitrary laws. And we have countless examples both historically and in modern time when anarchy was created like in Lybia.

[@michaelk.jensen1611]

Well some times people , ie friends drive to me, even though i rarely leave the house, we also order pizza and can get it fairly quickly as, there is this road that goes to my house i can use. or i can get delivery. So if he ever got visitors from other places, he has got use out of it, lots of other stuff we get use of also that is not so direct. When trains and public transport is bad i didnt have time at some time of my life to visit friends in hte evenings, because i couldnt get there and back again. With good public transport , yeah and a car also i could, but why should i need a car just because i want to visit a few friends a long the week to relax.

[@TheZombiemofo]

​@@NJ-wb1czdo you want Mad Max? Because that's how we get Mad Max 😂

[@eljoel89]

It's hypocritical for me to participate in capitalism because I'm not a capitalist, but it's a ok for Libertarians to draw Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security even though they hate Socialism and the government.

[@CincyFlight]

Yep, thats the same logic they use against Hasan Piker for owning a house.

[@OneEyeShadow]

Ayn Rand moment. Ah okay, he actually made that argument literally.

[@Ironcorgi2]

Bust out the pina coladas cause a libertarian brought us back to coconut island

[@gmsimoson]

_jimmy buffett plays_

[@AmyDroify]

​@@gmsimoson 😂😂😂

[@DirkDjently]

Incredible that Dan took two-and-a-half years to come up with the "well Rand paid into social security so ackshully..." argument - pretty speedy for a libertarian tbh

[@DJAngelcakes]

lol I saw “coconut island” and thought of a very different argument. Thanks, vaush.

[@LaShoju]

If libertarians all want to live on an island, we should fulfil that wish.

[@MoCsomeone]

Let them live in a company town and get paid in company dollars that only work at the company store and for paying rent to their landlord that is also the company. Let their children work in the mine and get the black lung, pa.

[@davefear11]

Libertarian phone networks are improving. 😂😂

[@its_zach_jk]

I wish I had someone that looked at me the way Sam looks when he realizes he’s about to debate a libertarian caller

[@AsifKhan-hf9zy]

you could.......... just save up some money, buy a ONE WAY ticket to south africa and visit a safari park.......... all your wildest fantasies will come true!

[@cronizle]

You know libertarians are in a bad place when,up til this day, they think is a good idea hit up Sam Cedar and open with a social security take.

[@fnord3125]

is that Sam Seder's treesona?

[@cronizle]

@@fnord3125 Thanks obama... 😠

[@kyle9401]

Best Halloween outfit ever for Sam. Dress as a tree and call himself Sam Cedar.

[@davidbright6790]

​@@kyle9401🤣🤣🤣 Spectacular!

[@xibalbalon8668]

Nah, I think they're getting too cocky again

[@OscarLangleySoryu]

Libertarian: _”Ayn Rand”_ The Enlightened: _Hyuck! Hyuck!_

[@Iban-Underground]

The Libertarian caller *STILL* doesn't understand Vaush's point/use of coconut island. The whole use of the metaphor was to show how someone who got an unfair head start, through no fault of your own, can use coercion with the vast amount of resources they collected, against your relatively few to none. It's a great metaphor for generational wealth, corporations, and arguably the state. But this caller constantly misses the point, and has no idea why Vaush uses the metaphor.

[@sjsart7181]

The Gadsden flag should be updated to say "Imagine if there was an island"

[@thomasprislacjr.4063]

Also should have a quote "Appeal to ignorance."

[@thepolarphantasm2319]

"ooh tread on me papa Sam"

[@sjsart7181]

@@thepolarphantasm2319 Many such cases

[@tylerhackner9731]

Alden’s island

[@euronimo34]

This dude has an entire year to prepare and he still can't even do the plug right lmao

[@gerrye114]

He kept wanting to go into philosophy exactly because reality doesnt play out in his favor. Libertarians should be made to read history books A Clockwork Orange style

[@Amalgamotion]

A Libertarian recently bought Twitter, dismantled it, and is currently quietly restoring the things that he tore apart because he put his philosophy in the real world and found out.

[@mrgotitfordalow]

And yet, these libertarians will learn nothing.

[@w0t_m818]

Exactly what I've always said to libertarians, their ideas work in the mind palace, because they control all the conditions there, but as soon as you try to bring it into the real world, where you don't control the conditions, it completely falls apart.

[@nilkonom]

well, this "libertarian" is one of the most successful people in the world, it would seem weird if he only just started applying his philosophy after buying twitter

[@w0t_m818]

@@nilkonom damn, there are really still Elon meat-riders? Musk was just born wealthy enough to continuously fail upwards.

[@w0t_m818]

@@nilkonom Musk was just born wealthy enough to continuously fail upwards.

[@MaestroTrin]

I don’t understand these Libertarians. They want to use US currency, but don’t want to pay their dues for participation in it’s use. I agree with Sam that they can choose to trade in puka shells, and they won’t have to pay a thing.

[@TheHuxleyAgnostic]

Yeah, they don't seem to grasp how anything works. Banks all doing their own bank notes didn't work well outside of local trade. They only had full redeemable value at the issuing bank. So, a bank in Montreal wouldn't take a note from a bank in Halifax, at least not at full value. Because, they'd have to take it to Halifax, to redeem it for actual currency (British pound). There's also the case of mining companies building their own little towns, and issuing their own currency to workers, as pay. Those workers then couldn't use the currency anywhere else, except the mining company shops. It allowed them to fully monopolize their workers.

[@spamfilter32]

I mean, he did say he wanted banks to issue their own currency. But then, the banks are going to charge you a fee for using their currency. And what is that fee if not a tax?

[@anthraxfan93]

@@TheHuxleyAgnostic Thank you for this quick history lesson, was looking to see/read more on this topic now I know where to start.

[@nilkonom]

that's great, so i can use cryptocurrency from now on and don't have to pay a single cent in taxes (including capital gains)?

[@garysouza95]

Dan...may I call you No. One? Out there on Coconut Island, it's entirely possible to build a geodesic shelter so you don't sunburn to death. All you need is 1.) a knife, which contains a considerable amount of the cultural heritage of mankind, which you did not pay for and the cost of discovery of which has been amortized since man discovered fire and alloying elements, and 2.) the necessary geodesic math to construct the struts, which also represents a significant percentage of that cultural knowledge developed over 6,000 years, including trigonometry, invention of the zero, and Bucky Fuller slaving for years over an adding machine and trig tables to invent geodesic math, none of which you paid for yet is available to all without royalty. Self made is a lie.

[@tonoornottono]

im a simple man i see Coconut Island i click

[@aaron-n]

oh boy haven't seen one of these in a bit. time to pop some corn.

[@AndrewClement]

A libertarian, holy crap thought they were dead

[@CincyFlight]

​@@AndrewClementnah, they were just in a meeting debating age of consent again.

[@rdnax5775562]

😂😂😂

[@danielmikula1375]

The caller should look into the history of company towns and company scrip. Whenever there was competing currencies, private companies enacted petty empires. There is never a free market. There is always regulatory power, public or private.

[@williampounds5191]

It's so crazy how just calling something private makes these people think there still isn't, in effect, a government that exists that will absolutely make you do things "with a gun pointed at you."

[@TheZombiemofo]

​@@williampounds5191yep, government is just another version of authority. Whenever there is a power vacuum some form of authority will emerge, and history has taught us that authority that arises from a power vacuum is very rarely benevolent.

[@NJ-wb1cz]

​@@williampounds5191 The presume the actual government somehow still exists to maintain fairness of the markets. Smarter ones presume this explicitly and define this government, dimmer ones presume it implicitly or add functions to it ad hoc when faced with hypotheticals like "I'm hiring my private army and taking all your property because I can" But in all cases they never answer why would that government exist as an impartial overseer. Why wouldn't it become massively corrupt and sell off to the highest bidder. How can a small powerless government have an omniscient and omnipotent power over the most important processes between the most powerful entities in the country

[@HMDHEGD]

My man brought up the inflation in Argentina lmao

[@briannelson27]

RIGHT?!? it is exactly libertarian policies that got them there!

[@norikofu509]

@@briannelson27 No, it was actually Socio Democracy policies and Third World Conservatism, nice try tho, imperialist ;)

[@Silverfang447]

Libertarians continue to make complete fools of themselves whenever possible. 😂

[@Dhamma_Nomad]

The laugh at the mention of Ayn Rand… 😂… I forget how much I miss these calls.

[@DeerBoy736]

I gave up hope that libertarians ever gonna call into The Majority Report again.

[@nancyjay790]

And then they came. And Sam and the rest of Majority Report were waiting.

[@dadsplains]

Every one of these Libertarian callers must be plants because they all sound like vegetables to me.

[@killerdonut1194]

How do you, as a baby-brained libertarian Ayn Rand stan, listen to the Majority Report and even pay five bucks a month for a membership for years, and manage to learn absolutely nothing in all that time?

[@swissarmyknight4306]

IQ=shoe size, that's how.

[@floepiejane]

​@@swissarmyknight4306act your age, not your shoe size 💜

[@satevo462]

I was a Libertarian for about 2 weeks in the mid 2000's. That's how long it took me to realize Libertarianism is basically a 9th grade teenagers grasp of economics after receiving their first paycheck and looking at the taxes taken out and going "that's not fair!!!" But then they get their tax return back and buy an Xbox.

[@matiasyannuzzi9655]

I thought the official currency of Coconut Island was BJ vouchers.

[@whysocurious7366]

Ah, coconut island.. great bait for the Vaushites.

[@user-rh1iv7yp2c]

Also known as pdf fans

[@whysocurious7366]

@@user-rh1iv7yp2c um.. what?

[@NewSocialistEraVideos]

Anti-taxers are "against" force when it comes to tax collection, but will LOVE to use force to make others respect their theory of entitlement ala their version of private property rights. Dan, no one asked you to partake of the public system that is funded by taxes to keep it going so you can get what you want out of it, those dollar notes...give me a break-

[@williampounds5191]

They're completely oblivious to the fact that a rich guy hiring goons privately to enforce all these things is still effectively a government. Soon they'd start calling themselves Kings and then.... hm I think I read all this in MANY history books somewhere.

[@20thCenturyFav]

Oh lord did the caller really plug his KZbin channel, that was so classless. And yes she definitely has a right to the money that she invested into as a tax payer but that should have also prompted her and others to reconsider the value and importance of these social programs. Especially its importance for people that don't have the luxury of sitting on a large amount of wealth from a best selling book. This is the part where empathy and compassion should kick in.

[@lisadioguardi5742]

He got that wrong, she wasn't wealthy at the end. As the social worker at her lawyer's office put it, doctors cost more than books pay.

[@justr6982]

Yeah, as far as I can find her financial records were destroyed at end of life. So it's a pretty unproductive debate aside from noting that the value exists for people in end of life dire straits, as even Rand acknowledged

[@uhu7813]

Historical examples: "Philosophy," speculation, dumb. Coconut Island: Objective reality, factual, enlightened.

[@orphaotheseeker2770]

How are people still libertarians in 2024?

[@northuniverse]

American education system.

[@michaelk.jensen1611]

Eh arent we moving closer to libertarian like policies all over the world for the time being, ie last 20 years, so everybody is a little bid libertarian these days because some of it has been normalized as being the default / correct way / commons sense, not talking about all of it but some ideas of it, like private companies almost magically makes things better, government are always very incompetent,

[@patchwurk6652]

@@michaelk.jensen1611 American Libertarians are not Libertarians. They're politically illiterate morons.

[@mr3745]

There are still Scientologists in 2024 so nothing is shocking.

[@davefear11]

FINALLY! A new libertarian debate! Ive neen getting tired of watching the old playlist for the 4th time.😂😂

[@kylevanzandbergen3285]

I absolutely love Bradley’s laughter when it peeks in 😂

[@rickperrine1059]

Can we get this guy on the payroll? It was a good laugh during these dark news cycles. Especially after the last few fake Libertarian callers.

[@joc.1353]

Feels like we have been here forever

[@boomzy9532]

Aldens island smh

[@Robert_Bob_Bobrob]

Not coconut island! The coconut crabs still haunt my dreams!

[@user-sx3ov5nv8b]

The statement that "if you think the rich should pay higher taxes, why don't you just give the government more money" is impractical for a different reason. About 5 years ago, just to see what would happen, I sent a $10 check made out to the National Park Service, to the Treasury Department in Washington DC. They still have that check; they never deposited it. To be fair, when I sent an identical check to the Department of the Interior's HQ, they did deposit it. But I never got a receipt saying that my contribution was tax-deductible, which it was. I assume that rich people would get the same treatment a middle-class person would get. The government won't take their additional contributions in most cases. This is not to contradict Sam at all. Just a sidebar, really.

[@serversurfer6169]

"We all used to do this all the time! 🤷‍♂" "Why did we all stop doing it? 🤔" "What? Why would I care about that? 😕"

[@jawshchevyvan]

The book Sam suggested (Debt) handles all of this libertarian guys’ hypotheticals. There is even a whole section on the myth of barter.

[@standoughope]

When a person asks permission to plug themselves however plugs themselves in the request itself they're insincere about respecting your platform, they just want to appear like they're respectful. In other words, it's grade A douchebaggery.

[@crawdad]

“You just did” - Sam

[@vxicepickxv]

They also said, "I'm a libertarian," so douchebaggery was implied.

[@gregorsamsa1364]

A new libertarian video with ayn rand AND coconut island? Oh hell yes

[@SuperStrik9]

0:20 Emma trying real hard not to crack up lol! I know I'd fail miserably and be lmao.

[@thomasgriffiths6758]

I hate when they make the argument "why should I pay for things that I don't use?" If anyone has ever joined a gym or the YMCA, you would realize that your membership fees go towards every piece of equipment and every part of that facility. Just because you only use the treadmill doesn't mean you don't have to pay dues.

[@douglasdea637]

Dan, here's a hint for you: company towns and company scrip. The workers living in a company town and being paid in scrip. The company opens stores and services and charges whatever they want for those goods and services. Oh wow, things cost more in the company store than in the real world. A recipe for indentured servants. Who could have imagined such a thing? (Well, the CEO did...) There are very good reasons why company towns and scrip are highly frowned upon. Just a hint, Dan. Just a hint.

[@ryandavid4288]

Looks like Christmas came early

[@Ironraven001]

Libertarian = INSTANT CLICK!!!!

[@tarmoveinaste5992]

Emma wanting to facepalm after hearing the island argument again at 9:22. 🤣

[@toussaintmalik8639]

"you wanna do the Robinson Crusoe stuff" has me deaaaaaaad xD

[@begging4music]

5:02 What is this brother doing here then if he feels that way? Is he not using the roads? The water? Sewage? Ever frequent a city park? What about gas? Should you not have to pay for that? You want to be the one person (s) who gets to skip over taxation; Nah. I'll sit this one out. You guys go ahead and pay for everything and they'll just use it to their benefit and then take off when their gut is full. No offer to wash a plate, sweep a floor, take out the trash...Nah bruh, that's on you. Anyways. ✌🏾 Peace Y'all.

[@petesmitt]

sounds like every welfare bludger I've ever met, except they don't have a political ideology.

[@danarchist74]

Infertile Dan called back in today, and I missed it live. I'm so angry with myself.

[@rwed13]

never met a libertarian who taught themselves to "read write arithmetic" as a baby in a school they themselves built... as a baby... by teachers they hired as a baby...

[@SurrealEdifice]

ive read atlas shrugged twice, the fountainhead once, and I know their arguments pretty well. They just do not make it fully around the track, intellectually. I was 16 the first time I read atlas shrugged and immediately connected the concept of rational self-interest with collectivism. How are these people this dense? Honestly, when I make the comparison between Rand's novel and our real country and its real crisises, I can clearly see the "heroes" of her story are the existential threat we actually face, and the people she vilified the most are her biggest goddamn fanbase. Paul Ryan and his indistinguishable army of sound-a-likes as an example.

[@vxicepickxv]

How do they compare to Max Stirner?

[@SurrealEdifice]

@@vxicepickxv I dont know much about stirner to be honest with you. I had to google the name to learn more. I stopped being a philosophy debate pervert, emptied my cup and started learning properly about 10 years ago and never looked back lol

[@segue2ant395]

I've never read Ayn Raynd, is she as toddlerish as all her supporters suggest, or is there actually anything susbtantive in there? Like is it all just 'waaaaah I don't wanna pay taxes waaaaah' or am I at least gonna have a story to read?

[@williampounds5191]

Look all I'll say is the fact this is what ALL of her supporters are like, without fail, should tell you everything you need to know. If there were good ideas you'd see more (even a single one) supporters that are able to articulate them.

[@inrainbows1829]

Ayn Rand fan boys 😂

[@Shadowman4710]

"They're so stupid..."-M. Lech

[@jaredblatterman6877]

What do I have to do to get the coconuts now...??😂

[@blacxthornE]

depending on your interests, i have either terrible or great news

[@blue51]

Oh, I've been missing these.

[@52flyingbicycles]

Why would people struggling to survive on a tiny island have currency or markets? They would just share what they produce. Anyone who hogs stuff would get the crap beat out of them, and anyone who doesn’t contribute would get the crap beat out of them. None of this BS “I’ll trade you 2 coconuts for 7 palm branches” it’s just “I need coconuts for dinner help me get some”

[@williampounds5191]

And even THAT still counts as a government. These libertarians are delusional.

[@52flyingbicycles]

@@williampounds5191 no that wouldn’t be a government. No one in this scenario has a monopoly on the legitimate use of force. Whether or not force is legitimate is a purely peer-to-peer interaction. Even if a “leader” is elected, they would just be the person people tend to agree has the best ideas or everyone has the most respect for, rather than someone they are forced to follow. Because if you refuse to follow the leader, whether or not everyone beats you up completely depends on whether they agree with you. Which is the same for any other person. Without some sort of clear power differential, a state cannot exist because no one can accrue enough power to have a monopoly on (legitimate) violence. Which is why right-wing anarchism is bull. Money, private property, and weapon hoarding are key ways to concentrate enough power to achieve at least pseudo-state status.

[@patchwurk6652]

@@52flyingbicycles The only explicit definition of a government just defines it as "The system by which a population is governed." This would also apply, the standard of government just doesn't fit your applied view of what a government is.

[@52flyingbicycles]

@@patchwurk6652 a more philosophical definition of government is the entity in charge of the state, which is the entity with the monopoly on the legitimate use of violence. Which is the actual antagonist of libertarianism. If no one has a monopoly on the legitimate use of violence, then there isn’t a state and by extension no government. Not to be confused with, say, the “government” of a social club or a corporation. While they govern an entity and can be considered a government in standard usage, they are legally and philosophically beneath the real government. Which is where left-anarchism (correctly) diverges from right-“anarchism”. Left anarchism correctly identifies that unjust hierarchies can exist all over the place and they must be abolished in all their forms. But in a low-population coconut island example, barring a huge physical difference no one has enough power to consolidate into a state. The primary evidence for this would be that attempts to hoard wealth/power would immediately result in the hoarder getting their ass beat. Compare to a state which has consolidated enough power that direct physical force is rarely necessary to keep people in line AND it can effectively prevent other people from trying to set up their own nodes of power without its consent (thus the monopoly).

[@patchwurk6652]

@@52flyingbicycles "a more philosophical definition of government is the entity in charge of the state, which is the entity with the monopoly on the legitimate use of violence." Yeah, I know, I just said the OP was using a more general definition of government, not the one you're using. "Not to be confused with, say, the “government” of a social club or a corporation." *Sigh* No one was confused by what you meant, just remarking you're categorically using a separate definition than the post implied.

[@absoluteterror9098]

I recently had a girl tell me she got banned from a discord server and I started laughing thinking about Dan calling about the chat policy

[@leonardruggiero2457]

Our favorite Ayn Rand fan Dan Norton jumps into the ring again with the MR crew lmao

[@joshuaadams1747]

Sell pistachios and call it libertarian currency lol

[@TroubledTrooper]

Now ask him about what he thinks the age of consent should be.

[@alantus14]

The caller will learn about Social Security when he reaches the age to receive it. At this point, he doesn't know anything about it.

[@howigetmynews4728]

Rare Mythic Level Libertarian Boss Encounter.

[@csdn4483]

I'm laughing so hard at the caller who doesn't realize why a standardize currency came about in the US. There's a number of reasons, but he doesn't know a single one.

[@jjb.6152]

You put the lime in the coconut

[@Houtont]

Man I've wanted one of these for a while.

[@bryan-bl9dh]

when adam smith invented the telescope he discovered that the value of money comes from the little strip buried in the paper

[@cymtastique]

You know, we have people making their own currencies, and so far, it's been pretty bad. I'm certain we don't want that on a large scale,

[@aosidh]

So brave of him to go on air after sustaining so many falls on his head 🫡

[@IsThisAmerica1]

I cant believe he's back

[@JoeMahma24]

People will pay a “fee” on Robinhood and be ok with it, but a “tax” is way to much? Taxes go to our communities yes and to pay our corrupt government officials, but that Robinhood fee, where does that go?

[@NJ-wb1cz]

Babe wake up, new libertarian debate just dropped

[@Vancerova]

I miss these... Thanks for the effort Dan!!

[@brograb898]

Bart: this isn’t real money-it’s printed by the Montana militia. Caller: It’ll be real soon enough!

[@ItsDeffoScott]

Oh my God, is it Libertarian Caller-Mas already?! It's the most wonderful time of the year!

[@coreyc1685]

I’m pretty sure that’s the same libertarian who calls the Pakman show on a regular basis, usually asking the same question, and David has to remind him he has already answered it.

[@this_mind_of_mine]

At 13:36, he says "I've read some history, including the history of philosophy!" followed by a nervous chuckle. Hopefully he reflects on that mumble and self-reflects honestly and sincerely.

[@user-pc3we6gf6j]

Libertarian? More like "li-BETA-rian".

[@Cool_Calm_Cam]

That was the least-frustrating libertarian caller I think we've ever had. He actually remembered the the things previously talked about.

[@LinkRocks]

Ah yes, some weekend entertainment, Sam debating a libertarian.

[@_xeere]

A minor correction: tax isn't what gives money value. It has value because it's legal tender (can be used to pay of debts). Those could be debts to the government in the form of taxes or debt to private individuals. If you offer to pay your rent in collectable trading cards, a landlord can refuse that offer even if they have sufficient value to cover the bill. But if you offer to pay with money, the landlord cannot hold you legally accountable for not paying.