Like a Phoenix From The Ashes of ALCO: The MLW m420

KZbin Video Credtis:
Painted Horse Rail Productions-
Steamtown holiday train to Moscow Nov, 2015
Alex Brockway FLGK railway-
Cab Ride in an MLW M420 #3568 on the Oil Creek and Titusville Railroad.
:The Nomadic Railfan -
DelawareLackawanna ALCOs and an MLW M420 on the Pocono Main
Trainutjob Videos-
NYSWTHS First Test Runs of M420W 3573 on the PRR BelDel
DHDISPR SMITH (Gordon Smith)-
CN 344 on Mont Joli Sub May 26, 1992
Railtime Media-
Alco's of MLW and Bombardier - The Last Years
mrjv61-
LIRRs Alco C420s with Freight 1986 and More with my New VHS Video Camera

[@MrCateagle]

Beautiful! They kept what worked and fixed what needed fixing; producing an excellent product.

[@cliffwilkie4035]

The 3573 used to be one of ours (SLQ 3573) & is ex-CN. I see they repainted the cab, but the CN zebra stripes still remain on the long hood. We owned 3573 1998-2003, before selling it to Maine Eastern Railroad (MERR). We purchased it from CN in September, 1998.

[@jimkelton4052]

As a retired throttle jockey (Engineer), I am impressed by your knowledge especially of an older locomotive that ConRail was phasing out just after I hired out in 1976.

[@cmdrflake]

The “AAR” trucks were mostly designed and built by General Steel Castings, Adirondack and others. General Steel Castings was the designer of the “AAR” truck. Their trucks were used on selected EMC/EMD, ALCO and Baldwin units. Although EM went to their own unique truck design, the GSC trucks were standard on ALCO and 4 motor Baldwins, and earlier Fairbanks-Morse units.

[@brianburns7211]

Apparently the double equalized design truck was cast by several foundries. Similarly so was the EMD. Most common were LFM/Rockwell in the US, and Dofasco on Canadian produced units. I have seen one with a GSC casting. It was on a Delaware and Hudson 7300 class GP38-2.

[@scottb8175]

I saw a good number of M420's working on short lines in Manitoba in the 2000's. There were a few on Omni Trax's Hudson Bay Railway before the shut down of freight service to Churchill. One was the sole locomotive for the short lived short line Southern Manitoba Railway. The HBR crews said they'd rather have one or two more old EMD's and a lot less M420's.

[@0fficialdregs]

i love all the MLW popular diesel locomotives because I can find them in N Scale.

[@0fficialdregs]

one of my recent new favorites

[@Dennis-vh8tz]

The Sartigan Railway in Quebec Canada have several m420's, I believe 4, at least one of which is running, a second either running or expected to be restored to running order, and two presumed to be parts donors. These are former BC Rail units which were sold to the Ontario Southland Railway, then to Sartigan in 2020.

[@wendywalsh5220]

We indeed have 4 ex BCOL engines. 644 and 647 are running and have been renumbered to 2044 and 2047. 641 and 646 are parts donors.

[@genghisglenn]

You gotta love the Lehigh Valley livery. I miss that fallen flag.

[@JaredBallou]

I grew up a short bike ride from the P&W main, and watched those MLWs hauling through town through the late 80s and early 90s. It was a sad day when they were retired for whatever EMD units ended up replacing them, but I'm glad to have seen them running for those years.

[@brianburns7211]

I saw them around the P&W. I ended up on BN and saw a few of them in their second career on Iowa Interstate.

[@JohnGeorgeBauerBuis]

Bombardier recently got out of the railroad business entirely, selling their rail division to former rival Alstom.

[@juliangerardcascio1111]

I like 👍 👌 it very well done 👏!!!!

[@bluegrassman3040]

West Tennessee Railroad had 3 of those MLW wide cab locomotives. One of them got wrecked during a derailment in Sharon, TN when they tried to couple up to a runaway train. It sat in Jackson, TN at their yard and I believe was used for parts or scrapped. As far as the other two units, idk if they still have them or not. Everything else the use are older GE units. I got to ride in one of the MLWs on a grain train from Dyer, TN to Humboldt, TN back around 2007.

[@SouRwy4501Productions]

I don’t know why but I’ve always thought that ALCo diesels would sound good with RVB 5 chime horns, and the M420 is no exception.

[@bradjames6748]

British Columbia Railway was a loyal Alco/MLW customer for years including the M420 "safety cab" and only switched to EMD when it got more favorable terms from them after purchasing several used SD 40s from the Kennecot copper co it had absolutely nothing to do with trade policies as GM had their main assembly line in London Ontario and GE Canada supplied dash 8 locomotives to BC Rail in the early 90s

[@Bob-ed9tc]

Or as we say in trucking; keep the shiny side up! 10-4 good buddy. 👍

[@bunky060171]

Saw 800, 801, 802 regularly on the IAIS between Colfax and Mitchellville Iowa in the mid 1990's, they picked them up 1994? They were traded off to SRNJ in 2005 (802 still in Iowa Interstate livery, looking a bit rough). Now we see a majority of their refurbished 1972 GP38-2's in the DSM local traffic. I never knew the ALCO connection to the MLW units, I just knew they were relatively unusual at the time. Cool to see a few still in operation.

[@johngeorge1294]

Love those Alcos

[@trainsontuesday]

Great footage of locos that used to be common but are gone forever now. I miss them.

[@perkelix]

Most late MLW engines became unserviceable when Bombardier failed at getting a foothold into the market. That's why, contrary to earlier MLW RS18 (of which CP rebuilt quite a few as chopped-nose for switching purposes), none of them were rebuilt. This also happened at a time when EMD's failures with the SD50 left railroads in limbo as to what they would buy next. GE responded to that with its Dash-8 series and the rest is history. While EMD cleaned up its SD50 mess with the 60 and 70 series, this pretty much was the start of GE's monopoly, which EMD's Caterpillar-engined locomotives never really challenged.

[@brianburns7211]

Not really. Fairbanks Morse still makes 251, as does India under license. GE still makes all the electrical gear.

[@WHJeffB]

My local railroad (Providence and Worcester) purchased four M420R's years ago. Same loco, but with the AAR road switcher trucks off traded in RS3's. My favorite locomotive by far, it was unfortunate when the P&W got rid of them.

[@brianburns7211]

There was a story behind that purchase. When P&W went independent, they’d used leased D&H Alcos. Eventually they got some of their own. RS3s. I don’t know if it’s railfan lore, but apparently neither GE or GM would accept the order. The story is that being new as a rail operator, their credit was not good enough. MLW was more than pleased to fill it. The part that I wonder about is why GE or GM wouldn’t. They were making small orders for other short lines like VTR. As far as credit goes, the bank holding the equipment trust can easily repossess them. The R in the model is because of using parts from the traded in units. These were the only Canadian built Alcos purchased by a U.S. railroad after the Schenectady closure.

[@davidbrown4823]

I so recall the M-420. They were sleek and smooth especially when 4 on a train.

[@brucegordon4924]

Another Great Alco Video, Many Thanks! I grew up in Louisville, KY and a L&N railfan. In the 70's the L&N had one of the largest Alco fleets in the nation, the C-420 was was always my favorite. By the early 80's there where aroung 60 C-420s under the L&N, Family lines flag in service mainly in East KY Coal mine service. Many units were formaly Monon, Seaboard Airline, and Atlantic coast line heritage that ended up in coal service with the L&N due to good lugging power ,reliability, and diversity. The Corbin shops was home base for service and Maintenance .(Trains, November 1979"How L&N Got Out of the Woods")

[@MLWQC]

That was a great video.

[@TheCheffydave]

As a former Schenectady resident, I ❤️ Anything about ALCO! I loved this Video,and your factual reporting, you earned a SUBSCRIBE!

[@brianburns7211]

My wife is a Ballston Spa native. Many of her family members worked for Alco. I met her when she was rail fanning the D&H.

[@kenjones2312]

First off, none of these units had AC in them. If there is, it was added by a different owner after CN retired them. 3568 NEVER had AC, I ran it for many years, along with 3575, and eventually HR412 3580. The videos of the CN trains don't even show any M420's in them. There's a shot of some of the Bombardier HR616 (2100 series) but no m420's. These units were road units, not very good for shortline switching. The ZWT trucks were a pain in the ass and a switch called a "snow brake" was added for winter operations. When switched on, it was supposed to keep about small amount of pressure on the brakes to keep ice from building up behind them. Most trucks would have 2 shoes per wheel (8/truck) but the ZWT only had 1 shoe per wheel (4/truck). Hi friction shoes don't work with 3" of ice buildup. The snow brake was also a pain in the ass, as when on, sometimes when you applied and released the independant, the air would not release and actually increase. They were good for breathing fire under heavy load, I had fire 3ft out the stack more than a few times on 3568.

[@wendywalsh5220]

That's relatable lol. I work with 2 M420s and they are pretty fun to switch with but damn those brakes suck. The ZWT trucks make for a pretty smooth ride above 20 mph, but at 15 mph they are terribly uncomfortable, feels like a ship in a storm. I always find it amusing to look in the mirror when I'm sitting in my RS18, a pretty comfy ride, to see the M420 constantly oscillating from one side to another. Thank god the center of gravity is low lmao.

[@kenjones2312]

@@wendywalsh5220 Another issue is the traction motors. If you cut one out, you lose at least 50% of your power. and yeah, that harmonic roll zone is brutal. We had some track at 15mph. seasick is an understatement. The HR 412's were just as bad. We had a curve that was engineered wrong. It was too sharp, I sheared off 6 of the 8 truck bolts. They also breathed fire.

[@SocialistDistancing]

I may have been on one of those m420. I think there numbers were all in the 9000s on the CNR. It was an MoW train laying ribbon steel. I have pictures somewhere.

[@haroldalexis4200]

Great video. I learned so much from watching this. Now I want scale models of these especially the wide cabs of the ALCO engines they closely resemble GE & a touch of EMD / GM units. Amazing scenery. 👍👍✅ ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐👋👋

[@bryanlarocque7627]

Watching train when i was young in Gaspésia . Morning train and evening train.

[@jerrycvek6098]

Very good Video. I enjoyed seeing the different control stand in the cab ride in this video. CN is very different now today then it was only 10 to 20 years ago. CN now mostly runs new GE Locomotives in todays times. Take care now. Jerry

[@93greenstrat]

Looks like they have GE-styled fuel tanks. Great video.

[@alcopower5710]

Excellent content. I thoroughly approve this video 👍👍

[@timothysteeves4167]

The first M420R's to be scrapped were by the Southern Railroad of New Jersey, 801 and 802. 3 still exist, 2 in Canada and 1 on the SRNJ. The video clips from 9:17 to 11:46 consist of HR616 (Bombardier built) #2119, and MLW C-630M's numbered 2010 and 2022.

[@jacobrail501]

It’s a shame there’s only a handful of these M420s

[@Arturobrito0502]

Dude, i remember these engines from a movie called atomic train, but, i also remember them for the movie final run both films made in 1999, albeit ive only seen the trailer for final run, but i have seen atomic train.

[@tzrr-nsnyswmodellingmore2821]

I caught those passenger cars in the beginning with a few more just the other week!

[@jamesstuart3346]

Another great video. Always the best video choices

[@transittown7891]

Nice catch bro 😎👍😊

[@Zebrails]

Love the footage even if there were no M420's seen in original road service. Those stripes in CN are/were dazzling... 16:43 is an awesome scene with CP stripes/multimarks joining the CN's collection. Thumbs Up and just subscribed. I wish the HR units were available in (affordable) HO. John

[@crsrdash-840b5]

At first glance, those trucks are mistaken for GE FB-2 type. The Zero Weight Transfer trucks look shorter and perhaps lighter.

[@joeystrains.9316]

Excellent video.

[@jims6323]

There are 2 of these in use around here, 1 on the AC&J in Jefferson, Oh & 1 on the OC&T in Titisville, Pa. Nice looking units with the large "crew cabs"!

[@Trains-With-Shane]

Nice documentary! The M420 sure seemed like a decent little locomotive. Alco was just too troubled for too long to survive anymore. I don't think the industry fully ever got over the loss of faith in Alco suffered during the early RS3 days due to the faulty prime movers. Which is too bad because, labor and company management issues aside, they seemed to have finally got their QC under control and were putting out nice reliable and efficient units again. It sucks that GE did them dirty in regards to price fixing.

[@fredzag2452]

Plus the communist in the unions helped trash the company by making it look like they were helping the workers get better wages and benefits only the poor worker got the heave-ho.

[@daffyduk77]

Engine noise of M420 slightly reminiscent of Sulzer engines in the UK at the time

[@flexvision2000]

BCRail has a lot of these locomotives.

[@geac9100]

That is a good video

[@GMCGUY-]

What a great video! I am in the middle of your video very interesting 🤔 I love how you explain yourself, unlike most people on KZbin 😅 I wish you could do a video on older Locomotives that are Almost extinct on American Railroads. Maybe you could do the C-40 dash 8 4 axle and the twin to that locomotive the one with 6 axles I know PAM AM Railroad has alot of them last time I checked. When CSX finally bought The old Pam am Railroad They kept 80% of the locomotives and Pam Ann railways had a 102 locomotives on their rafter. Really doing resbitch. And it took me about a month to figure out all this information. CSX sold about 30 to 40 locomotives out of a 102 And they sold a lot of the older locomotives But don't get me wrong. Everything that Pam Am had for locomotives Was older I remember back in 2002 Pam Am purchased a ton of locomotives from CSX A lot of them And now CSX has them all back again That's why they sold 30 to 40 locomotives to genesine and Wyoming Railroad They have the orange and yellow paint scheme. It would just be nice for you to do a video about older locomotives The ones that moved everything in America when we were all kids Not all these Dash 9 locomotives. I'm so sick of seeing these things they're everywhere Dash 9 , SD70MAC , 44AC These Locomotives rule the rails in North America, unfortunately. I love the older locomotives. SD45 GP30 GP40 SD40 GP7 GP38 High Hood GP9 Alco RS3 SD60s

[@jamesleopard8518]

This M420 diesel locomotive is from the movie Atomic Train 1999

[@mysticrailroad]

Interesting loco :)

[@raymondwedley]

I Like The Video

[@aspenGF8]

The M in the M420 didn't mean Montreal but modular, MLW was proud of the redesign to make things more modular and quickly replaced. Also, you used Gordon's footage, why didn't you use any with M420 footage?

[@crsrdash-840b5]

They could do it all including put out more smoke than anybody!

[@johnkurtz8360]

Alco C420 high hood nice locomotive .

[@thelovertunisia]

As an Alco fan you cannot ignor the country where Alco was and is most used: India!

[@wishusknight3009]

Sadly being phased out. Though they did have a great last stand.

[@thelovertunisia]

@@wishusknight3009 Yep I loved their sound the chugging and the smoke was amazing too.

[@thelovertunisia]

@@wishusknight3009 We had lots of Alcos here in Tunisia from Canada, MLW they were real coal rollers they smoked like steam trains.

[@therailfanman2078]

I still want to get the rapido trains version of this in the Delaware and Lackawanna paint scheme because I saw those in Scranton

[@Dennis-vh8tz]

I'm getting one in Ontario Southland colours.

[@therailfanman2078]

@@Dennis-vh8tz nice. I can't find one for a good price so in still searching

[@Dennis-vh8tz]

@@therailfanman2078 I pre-ordered from Otter Valley Railway, who have a discounted price, if ordering from Canada works for you; however, Rapido are still expensive.

[@therailfanman2078]

@@Dennis-vh8tz yea.... Im putting off getting one from rapido itself since it's expensive but there limited on the market for good prices. Especially America

[@ZombieSlayer-dj3wb]

A wide cab geep38 was leading the train in hinton

[@oddjobz9858]

There miserable to work in . On Guilford, there cabs were drafty , had bad exiting clearance exiting the cab, and poor layout for crews. I hated them.

[@coquitlam_railfan5686]

Ah yes bom bar yay…it’s Bombarider

[@grandcrappy]

I love old four strokes. EMD's parts price are much cheaper,,is that correct? For example, a 1980's GE fuel pump $2400, pwr assy $20k. Cast block, $300k!.

[@JohnGeorgeBauerBuis]

Could be. Ironically, GE and Morrison-Knudsen did a lot of business supplying spare parts and rebuilding EMD locomotives!

[@mamarussellthepie3995]

Sounds like my crappy old Buick century xD

[@j.m.youngquist419]

If they were so much more efficient why aren't they still around?

[@ptdiamonds9414]

Are not all diesel engines fuel injected? 0:24

[@forrestwright5981]

It's is a fact they all are injected

[@TimOGhoul]

*Titusville. Not Tit-usville.

[@bobbysenterprises3220]

I understand the importance of unions and what benefits they can give workers. But so many times I hear of cases where the members all ended up with out places to work and a large group of trained people on one field in one area looking for jobs that need their skills.

[@kristoffermangila]

That is one mistake that unions in the US would repeat, more than twenty years later on...

[@IndustrialParrot2816]

first

[@wazza33racer]

"highly tuned turbocharger and fuel injection"...........so previously, did Alco use a diesel engine with carburettors????? LOLOLOLOLOLOL