This $.07 Upgrade Will Save You Hours

[@Lincolnstww]

Purchase these products today for 20% off. Using these links helps support the channel 3M 775L - lddy.no/1dszo 3M 710W - lddy.no/1dszp 3M 310W - lddy.no/1dszq Pad Saver - lddy.no/1dszr

[@johnjingleheimersmith9259]

so what about carbide sanding discs like those from Duragrit? Seems like they should be superior in most areas. Stumpynubs made a recommendation for them a few years back. I've never had a chance to use them but imagine it could be a game changer as far as material removal is concerned. Not sure why we're still using crap glued to paper or even mesh when we have literal discs of rough metal now.

[@WoodcraftBySuman]

Rough topic. Smooth delivery.

[@bruceregittko7068]

Yes, a gritty performance

[@CeeJayThe13th]

Eyyy

[@ykkfamily]

Hahahaha

[@Saskajohn]

Quick comment. Amazing work

[@pentagram313]

You win

[@AlAmantea]

As a professional woodworker and carpenter, I've used just about every type and style of sandpaper out there. As soon as 3m released the 710W I spent close to $800 in sandpaper acquiring every grit I needed. This was after using my very first sample disc. The 710W is hands down the finest disc out there, and most definitely the most cost effective sanding solution. For those of you on a tight budget, I highly recommend you save the pennies and get the 710W. Over time, you will put more cash in your pocket. Cheap sandpaper is just that. Cheap. Remember... The sander is the MACHINE. The PAPER is the TOOL. Quality tools ALWAYS have a better experience, work faster, and cost LESS over time.

[@Lincolnstww]

Couldn't have said it any better myself. The 710 really is an incredible product

[@post-leftluddite]

Try Norton's Blaze line....what do you have to lose?

[@HyperionBadger]

I generally sand pine with a cordless sander without dust collection. Would you recommend the 710W for my application?

[@woodworking4459]

Thank you 😊

[@vicquickenden4379]

At the end of the day I’m more concerned with finish than cost of material removed. What motivated me to use the 710w was the lack of noticeable scratches left behind. Like you have noted on previous videos is that a persons time is important. For me it is far more important than a bit of money, to have to go back & re-sand by hand after finding swirl marks or scratches negates any price difference. Thanks for the video, as usual great job!!

[@Bapuji42]

It was the 310W that had no visible scratches.

[@vicquickenden4379]

Yep, but after trying several types & brands of sanding mediums I settled on the 710w for the reasons I wrote above. Most consistent results.

[@thenext9537]

YES. The 710 is love. Once you try it, it's so much better by light years compared to something like Gator or festool or even mirka. I think tool brands should not mess with sandpaper. 3m has it on lock!

[@Mike-bh7sh]

So what grit are you people sanding to on your sanders to avoid swirls? I'm guessing at LEAST 220? Might suggest that you actually might save time by sanding to a lower grit and then hand sanding, rather than going to a high grit to avoid hand sanding.

[@michaelconroy8060]

I think tool people trying to get in the sandpaper business is partially what probably helped drive such innovations....@@thenext9537

[@znewc14]

I am limited to big box stores and have bought their sandpaper because I have thought is was decent and "cheap". After this video, I did a bit of investigatingand realized that these "Premium" discs are actually a fraction of the cost compared to HF, HD, L, etc. $20 for 50 discs for 3M or $6 for 5 discs at HF or HD. I will only buy "premium" discs now and feel good about it because they are cheaper per unit than the "cheap" ones AND perform a lot better! Thanks for opening my eyes!

[@skyhawaii5446]

Thanks for making this video. You are the first person to ever explain sand paper in lay terms without a biased opinion. As a professional painter, I use thousands of dollars of sandpaper a year for finish work and abatement. I have to be honest, I did not even know 3M was a major competitor in quality and price. Until now, every time I change paper, it feels like I am throwing a dollar away. Many thanks.

[@yabbieo8466]

Without a biased opinion? It's basically a 3M ad.

[@RonHelton]

@@yabbieo8466 Yep, and with the links to buy.

[@CeeJayThe13th]

I just want to say that I appreciate you including Gator brand. I'm on a pretty tight budget (almost all of my big tools were gifts, sometimes I have trouble being able to just get some wood to work with) so Gator is what I always go with since it's cheap and readily available. I knew it sucked but didn't know how much!

[@idhatemet00]

@@Macron87 he's not sponsored by 3m dingus, and the gator brand ends up costing more in the long run...

[@jeremybirmingham2316]

@@idhatemet00 I'm not sure why you are calling CeeJay a dingus. In the comment you are replying to they don't claim that the video is sponsored, and they say that Gator is crap, and were glad to discover it more expensive in the long run. Or the original comment has been edited, or I am missing something, or you owe someone an apology.

[@idhatemet00]

@@jeremybirmingham2316 that's because i wasn't replying to ceejay, the person i responded to deleted their comment apparently lol

[@tharemyhopkins5873]

Thanks! Over the last few months I've made over 100 cutting boards and seems like I get the best results with the 710 for all the faces, then switch to a 775 disc for doing all of the edges, for all the exact reasons you mentioned. I had not heard of the 310, yet, I will go check it out!

[@bhough410]

Have made dozens of cutting boards the last few months lately too. You should def try diablo sandnet!

[@LamboGallardo560]

Thanks for mentioning we should use the backing with a net disk. Wittworks just did a video on those this past weekend and that was the first time I had ever heard they exist and why I need one. You're the only other KZbinr I watch that's even mentioned their existence or purpose. I just got into woodworking this Spring and bought the "Xtract" net disks after seeing Jonathan Katz Moses's video but never knew I needed a backing. Thankfully I haven't done a whole lot of sanding since I've just been building garage furniture and shelving but I'm definitely buying a backing for next year.

[@WoodcraftBySuman]

I go bareback on my sander and live dangerously. But yes- interface pads are importanter

[@gregoryreffner2939]

Well, another great video. I'm now returning the $50 in gator sandpaper I bought from Lowes yesterday (5 grits, 15 discs per pack at $10 each) and purchasing sets of the 310w and 710w to try both with my projects. $56 dollars shipped for 10 discs of each kind in 5 grits. better sandpaper at a better price? no brainer!

[@Hath.0]

I've been a fan of the Diablo sand net due to thier price and being widely available at box stores. They also come with a pad saver.

[@christopherhonnen2250]

Great video! Most woodworkers are miserable finishers… hopefully they see the most important segment of the video… don’t skip grits and clean in between!!

[@brianhawes3115]

I used to hate sanding, the dust, noise, frustration, then I got a Festool sander and dust extractor, and I love sanding now. Turns out that removing the dust at the source makes a better finish, I’ve gone from sanding to the finish room without vacuuming or wiping

[@robohippy]

Hmm, interesting. I am mostly a bowl turner. In experimenting some time ago, I found that with the Mirka/woven type of abrasives, in grits up to about 180 or 220, they were much slower than the full cover abrasives. Over 220, there was no difference that I could tell. I don't have the fancy things to be able to exactly measure grams for differences.... One abrasive not here is a blue abrasive, maybe 'Deer' logo, that I get from VinceswondNwonders. I believe there is some ceramic abrasive particles in it. I had Vince make me some discs to fit my 5 inch Festool sander. It is the longest lasting abrasive I have found for sanding bowls, frequently getting several bowls out of one set of discs, rather than maybe one bowl per disc. or some that were just the inside of a bowl with one disc. My favorite saying about 'when to change' discs was some thing like 'use sanding discs like my 2 year old uses toilet paper', or 'like some one else is buying it'. You lose time using dull abrasives. I do keep the rubber eraser sticks handy, and they help extend the life once in a while. The cubitron is only available in 2 and 3 inch discs. The ones I get from Vince are 2 3/8 and 3 3/8, so they lap over the edge of the 'interface' pad, which is what we call the cheap pad that we can waste rather than the main mandrill. Oh, the hooks can leave serious scratches on a finished piece. You can not remove 80 grit scratches with 220, unless you want to sand for hours. If I start at 80, next is 100, 120, 150, 180, 220, and with my bowls I go to 400. Grits above about 600 to 700 or so are invisible to the human eye. The finer grits are more 'polishing out scratches' rather than sanding and removing stock. Paint grade stuff, 150 max grit. Surface finish, 220. Wipe on finishes, however high you want to go. Not sure where a hand planed surface is in this list... One turner said, "Never take a finished piece from the shop into the house on a sunny day. Sun light causes scratches." I prefer the natural light type of lamps for seeing scratches. A raking angle does help. Oh, cheap reading glasses from the big box stores are okay, but not good after a while, you need glasses from an optometrist.

[@Dgc2003]

In the future when talking about multiple products with names like 775L and 710W it would be a big help to have an image of the product when mentioning it. During the ranking of surface quality portion I had a hell of a time keeping track of which name matched which disc.

[@rangerrick2246]

you mean its too difficult to record the video????? or you're unable to make notes? He showed each one as he talked about it..... maybe you need to follow the script too

[@lavalleguitars]

Yep, I am one of those who uses sandpaper until it's just paper. I go through so much of it, that I keep some for later use ... albeit it might not cut as much, but in the times that I use it the scraps are worth getting every cent out of the paper. Great video, thanks!

[@grizzlygrizzle]

Me too. I do mostly hand sanding, and spent years restoring century-old wooden entryways on brownstones in Boston, and there was no way to use power sanders on them, except on some small areas that were flat. For hand sanding, I found Norton Pro-Sand sheets to work the best for me. And I save the small scraps, too.

[@lavalleguitars]

@@grizzlygrizzle I should have lead with that, that I do mostly hand sanding. I'll rough down some wood with a palm sander, but after that it is all by hand ....

[@ronhochhalter3491]

The sandpaper revolution in woodworking lately is quite interesting. My father was an auto body repairman and painter by trade and never used anything but 3M sandpaper. I literally have old stock of 3M sandpaper passed down to me that probably outdates most of you watching this video. As a woodworker I've tried serval different types and brands of sandpaper. Honestly all of them get the job done on wood, but recently have decided to go back to the trusty 3M paper. I appreciate the time and effort you have put into your presentations. My first question/concern would be considering the material you're trying to sand. Every species of wood is different unlike sanding other materials such as a painted piece of sheet metal found on an automobile. Why do I bring up this point? I'm not an industry insider but I'm willing to assume that 3M develops its products for the people that use their products the most. The amount of sandpaper used by DIY woodworkers versus the automotive industry is negotiable. The weekend warrior makers can definitely benefit from the premium products that 3M has to offer, if it fits into your budget. But splitting hairs over little fine scratches seems excessive, especially when you can overcome these obstacles with patience. The vast majority of people working in a home garage could probably care less one way or the other as long as it looks acceptable. But I digress. For us woodworkers there are so many possibilities when it comes to fit and finish unlike an automobile that has to be absolutely perfect once the paint is applied. I could be wrong but companies like 3M develop their products to suit the needs of the most demanding sector of the industry. That is where the real laboratory tests exist. There's definitely a place for premium tools and materials in the woodworking shop. I appreciate all the information regarding these topics. It's definitely entertaining to hear about other people's experiences.

[@Lincolnstww]

Yep, 3Ms cubitron was developed for industrial applications like you said. Automotive and aerospace like you said. Most people assumed it was too aggressive for wood because it wasn't developed for that. If you're doing commission work, I wouldn't sell a tabletop with those scratches for instances. They are def noticeable. At the end of the day we all want to sand less

[@drstefankrank]

@@Lincolnstww Then just use the cubitron until the last grid. Saves you time and gives you the finish. TBH, not sure if that will work well, but it could be worth a try.

[@thenext9537]

The 710w is great. On lower grits, I will use something else like 310, but higher grits I'll use the 710. Dust collection obviously needed on the finer grits no doubt.

[@andywhtwo000]

I used Mirka for years in auto body. A pad saver is a must though a net backed discs still is useful for non vacuum systems as they keep the media cooler thus longer life.

[@Lincolnstww]

Yep - dont sand without one! The mirka sander is so comfortable

[@platypus4267]

Another thing to consider: Sandpaper doesn't just stop working when it gets dull. It starts cutting as if it's a higher grit than what's printed on the label. So a low quality disk will leave a "smoother" finish for the same amount of sanding-time than a good disk, just because the good disk is still sharp and cutting true to its grit level.

[@fancraft1266]

I don't think so. When your sandpaper becomes dull, it will sand slower, but the grits that are still on the sandpaper are the same sise as when the sandpaper was new.

[@bertfransman9864]

I bought all kind of grits( 80-300) of the 710W for a staircase renovation. Here in Europe they can be had for under €0.50 per disc (around €23 per packet of 50 discs) and it holds up better than anything I tested, including abranet, Bosch nets & festool, who are all magnitudes more expensive. If 3M is keeping this up they will own the sandpaper disc market in a matter of years.

[@mlrodenburg1990]

Which variety of Abranet did you use? I got the Abranet ACE (ceramic abrasive) and I'm in doubt switching to the 710W. Mostly end grain sanding, some general purpose work. Please advise :)

[@bertfransman9864]

@@mlrodenburg1990 Ik denk dat het de gewone Abranets waren, maar ben niet zeker want de doos is intussen al weer een jaartje op. Was ook meer dan prima schuurpapier, niet slechter als 3M imo, gewoon veel duurder. Zeker geen reden om abranets buiten te gooien, de 710W gaat geen merkbaar beter resultaat geven. Ik heb 3m gewoon bij slijpexpert gekocht, maar zie dat het intussen ook al weer wat euro's duurder is. Wel nog steeds rond 55cent per schijf,

[@5280Woodworking]

I tried a pack of the 710 and it was ok for quality of results, I just found the dust build up on the pad to be inferior to the Festool paper. Use what you like, so far I’m sticking with Festool.

[@Stan_in_Shelton_WA]

Aluminum Oxide is a hardness of 9. for sanding wood the hardness is not the issue it's the shape, size, and distribution of the grit. Another is the adhesive, closed or open face.

[@JimHester]

Honestly, the biggest problem I've had with the 710W while connected to dust collection is that the sander literally wants to stick to the work piece because of the suction thru the sanding disc. This happens on either my Bosch GET75-6N or the cordless Bosch GEX18V-5N with the cordless sander being by far "stickier" than the 6" sander. On the 5", I get the same effect with the Diablo mesh discs, too (It's the only other mesh disc I've tried). I suspect the 5" cordless wants to stick more because it's much lighter-weight than the 6". In fact, I tend to skip the dust collector altogether when using the cordless Bosch because it extracts pretty well already, and with the 710W, it's even better.

[@pocketlint82]

Great info! My time sanding is the most important factor to me behind a good finish. I originally bought a planer just so I could start with a more uniform, smoother surface on rough boards and cut down on sanding time. I was willing to spend $600 to not sand for hours. Added benefit of making them all the same thickness

[@scottc3626]

I noticed the 775L would not stick to the hook and loop pad on my Milwaukee sander (brand new pad). Would constantly fly off across the room whenever it had the chance. Never had tyhat problem with any other sandpaper. The 710W doesn't seem to have that problem is shockingly fast at material removal compared to the Klingspor discs I had been using. Very happy with the 710

[@SICresinwrks]

I usually purchase more expensive sandpaper because of past experience where it outlasts cheaper stuff, but recently i bought some off Amazon pretty cheap for a small project i was doing with my kid. this sandpaper is surprisingly good and ill be ordering more just to have on hand

[@tomdenny8507]

I had never heard the word "mattering" before. I looked it up and it is a real word. That's what I learned from this. Oh, about sandpaper, I sand until it is smooth enough and don't get too hung up on cost. But that's just me.

[@TheNewJankyWorkshop]

I hate sanding… but the new Diablo SandNet is my new fave. Seems to last 3 to 5 times longer than traditional old-school sandpaper.

[@MFJ-ru7kk]

Enjoyed the video and learned useful information. I’m not a woodworker, but I do various DIY projects in and outside my house. Watched 15-20 of your videos and they are engaging, have nice “story composition” (for lack of a better term), and I learn from them. I’ll never be a woodworker, but thanks to woodworking videos such as yours, I am working more efficiently and effectively on the silly projects I do. Really appreciate your videos. Thanks

[@bartoryzah8047]

Thanks for the great info once again. Always my man to watch when I actually want a genuine review or someone to break down what I need when I am not sure what I need.

[@jonr6540]

I do a lot of hand sanding while wood turning and have tried the 3M disks for that. They seem to remove material extremely well but also dull quickly in that application.

[@Shiva108]

Would be interesting to see the difference between a "cheap" Makita sander and (for example) Festool's high end ones, combined with the 310W or the 710W...

[@thecloneguyz]

MIRKA blows both of those OUT OF THE WATER

[@_pnky]

In my recent experience the 775 sandpaper was cheaper than the 710w. I bought several multipacks of both on Amazon recently and the 775 was cheaper! Also you must have recently watched My cousin Vinny and I approve!

[@playablecharacter3871]

I love this video. I work in a cabinet shop sanding a lot of poplar lumber and birch plywood and I have questions about the intricacies of it, even though we use vibrate sanders, but no one else really thinks about it enough to teach me cause they just want it to be over haha

[@audetnicolas]

One interesting test would be about dust extraction. You weigh the board before sanding and after. You weigh the dust collected (in the bin + change of weight of the filter). Dust collected / board weight loss is extraction efficiency. On its own it probably isn't a useful measure, because it depends on the kit that you are using for dust extraction, but you can certainly compare the different sanding papers that way. The intuition would be that some backing materials are more porous than others, maybe the size of the dust particles depend on the grit material. Whatever could help to reduce the airborne dust in the shop would be helpful.

[@rexassian]

I would love to see a comparison between the 310w and the box store diablo sand net disks.

[@danieltolman7249]

Please do a comparison, as I use 80 120 and 400 grit for my Myrtle wood Charcuterie, and cutting boards. I fact anything I need to smooth. Thank you for considering this test.

[@demolitionbmxd]

Just a quick note with net discs from someone who has used them for years in automotive bodywork where they can often clog... You can very easily wash them out.

[@gbear056]

You have just jumped into rarefied air, my friend. I place you in the same category as James Hamilton (Stumpy Nubs) and Jonathon Katz-Moses when it comes to the explanation of woodworking science. Well done.

[@CP-mb7ly]

Yay Stumpy, Boo JKM. He's a pompous douche nozzle

[@gbear056]

@@CP-mb7ly I hear you loud and clear C P. Consequently, I’ve learned to focus on content, not the presenter.

[@CP-mb7ly]

@@gbear056 That's unfortunate. I prefer not to support content creators that degrade their viewers, just my preference.

[@gbear056]

@@CP-mb7ly thanks C P. It’s food for thought. I may have to rethink my views. There are certainly a multitude of other creators out there!

[@CP-mb7ly]

@@gbear056 there's definitely a fair amount that don't take out their frustrations on their viewers in the comments :-) cheers!

[@wayneyadams]

1:23 Grits are a corn product that is buttered and eaten with all kinds of foods. The very best way is to butter them, then cut and mix fried eggs in them. It's a southern thing. I was visiting s friend in Connecticut years ago and saw grits on the menu. They served it in a bowl like cereal and I grossed out my friend when I dumped them out on the plate, buttered them and proceeded to mix them with the fried eggs. 🤣😂😅😆 That stuff on sandpaper may be called grit, but it tastes terrible and really "ain't" edible.

[@Mr.GucciClass1A]

Thanks for the Sandpaper PSA. I’m just left with one questions: “which one would you use/buy if you only had one choice and $ was not a factor?” You’re so freaking awesome!!!!! Fun, funny, informative.

[@Lincolnstww]

Hey bud hope you're doing well. 710w is the best all-around in my opinion

[@Mr.GucciClass1A]

@@Lincolnstww I’m doing well brother man, hope you are too. Thanks for the feedback. That is what I needed to know. 👍🏽 Happy Holidays!

[@ClaireRousseau]

Super interesting video, thank you! I'm still very new to woodworking, so I was using cheap amazon sandpaper, until I saw Katz-Moses' video and switched to the 710W and I really love it, the difference is so much more than I thought it would be! It's probably the thing that's made me rethink my instinctive cheap-stakes-ness the most! It looks like the 310W is a little harder to get my hands on in the UK but I'll give it a try if I can find some.

[@AgentWest]

Might be beneficial to replace only some grits. For example, if you care more about just removing material (lots of rounded edges or gradual shapes in projects, for example), get fancy coarse disks. If you are more into fine finishes, invest into finer grits and use cheaper coarse ones. If you are working with sap-y woods, working it with a scraper first can help to keep disks from clogging. Certainly helps with autobody fillers since they tend to get a gummy layer on top as they cure.

[@larryatha3221]

I wonder why you didn’t consider 3M 216U “Fre-Cut Gold”? It’s favored by luthiers for surface prep.

[@martinoamello3017]

What'll save you more headaches than anything is a well balanced RO sander.. If you have a decent air compressor with sufficient CFM's there are some high end pneumatic sanders on the market that are very balanced.. My "sanding background" began in the autobody industry working in a variety of shops so I learned the hard way to NOT allow the edges of your sander to dig in..Keep things flat as possible because you will create swirl marks and the more balanced the sander the less likely you'll screw things up... I had to completely resand entire trucks down to bare metal because of my mistakes and listen to bosses make me out to be the worst body man since the dawn of time..Yeah..It's THAT much fun to be the schmuck in the shop and end up working for free.

[@SithLandlord]

I thought I knew the answer to this watching the original JKM video, but you proved me wrong. Great analysis!

[@petevonschondorf4609]

oh thanks, I didn't know what I didn't know, now I have no excuse except continue to be stupid or be enlightened. Will work on being enlightened, but hopefully not from the light at the end of a tunnel. After all there may be a train or a bus. Really enjoy your videos.

[@TokyoLlama]

Thanks for this. Found that they sell the 310w here in Japan so will give it a try (will use on Hinoki cypress, quite resinous).

[@needstacos4892]

Objectivity, fact based and situational recommendations? Rad. Thanks for this ❤

[@austinfry4138]

I like the little tip about drawing all over the board with a pencil before sanding it. I have a bad habbit of forgetting what does and doesn't need sanded. So thats a good way to know whats been done already and to help me so I dont over sand an area. Just move on once the pencil marks are gone.

[@OGSauceDaddy]

use a pencil. The ink from certain ball point pens soaks in too deep

[@noneofyourbusiness2726]

I know every youtuber love the orbital sander but a forgotten fact is sand with the grain. You will use much less sandpaper and be able to skip more grits if you avoid the swirls of orbital sanding. Square sander for the win.

[@Mike-bh7sh]

Like the video - for the discussion of efficiency of material removal.... not the swirl testing (which I will explain why). I didn't know people were of the idea that you can jump directly from random orbital sander to finishing routines. This might work alright depending on the wood and a clear finish.... BUT, very unlikely to work well if you are staining or if the wood is fine textured... and yes - professionals DO use stains - a lot. It does make me wonder if possibly some simply have had no reference point to realize that what they are seeing is the results of not removing the swirls. ALL swirl marks are made by your machine NOT the sandpaper. The sandpaper's ONLY job is to cut material. The machine sets the pattern - and can also have a great determination on efficiency. A swirl is nothing more than the evidence of the machines pattern. That pattern remains the same no matter the quality of the paper or the size of the grit. The swirls will "disappear" after you reach a certain high grit size due to the swirls being too fine to see with the naked eye... but I would suggest it would save time to stop at a lower grit and quickly hand sand to remove the swirls then it is to sand up to a high enough grit to HIDE the swirls. I might suggest that what your swirl test is ACTUALLY revealing is that the lower quality sandpaper is - well, lower quality, meaning a greater range in the actual grit size on the pad - otherwise the swirls would be consistent across the surface. This is turn would leave visible swirls wherever that larger grit made contact. If you did the same test on the higher quality over a dozen sheets or so you would probably find swirls from some inconsistent grit. The raking light is the best way to find swirls and blemishes - but you can make it even easier by also wiping the surface with paint thinner. This will soak more into end grains (which is what a cross grain scratch is) making the scratches and blemishes a little darker. My personal preference for sanding (if one can use the word "preference" when referring to sanding) is to orbital sand to 1 grit higher than I want and then drop 1 grit to finish with a quick hand sand. This way I am not fighting to remove swirls.

[@Kosh42EFG]

Yay! A KZbin video that means I stay with my current product instead of buying new!

[@wvp07]

Oh crap. 🤦‍♀️ I paused at 2:31 and am flabbergasted at how poorly the brand I bought performs. Apparently buying in bulk was a terrible decision. 🤷‍♀️ Thanks for the info, you’re doing god’s work with this vid. 🙏

[@MrHf4l]

Been watching your content since the start. Excellent. Superior. High value. I appreciate your effort, man.

[@Lincolnstww]

I appreciate that!

[@mrrberger]

On Sanding anything not just built, especially painted pieces, cheapest unit disc the better. Disc clog, hitting nails, soft putties, rusted steel, pad life is not grit life it's backing life. All these tests in flat, sap hardened dry long grain hardwood is so narrow a test. Sanding down an outside door and adding a hardwood toe strip covers most of the situations. You'll hit nails and maybe the latch plate, clog with water and oil based paints, then flatten the endgrain in several positions, edge dig the pad for long moulding sanding and finally when it's had its first recoat of paint you'll knock down some missed sharp edges. the pile of discs will be 90% clogged and torn and 10% lost tooth. when you look at cost (time and dollars) of doing it at home, sticking with cheap discs is the path, beats strippers, heatguns, and super performance cutting discs.

[@anontimothy8]

Super informative. I feel like I went from novice level on sandpaper to craftsman level on sandpaper in under 14 enjoyable minutes, saving myself $ and ages of agony debating with myself on which to use when. Liked and subscribed!

[@I_Dont_Answer_Questions]

You're oblivious that you just watched a commercial...

[@scottboettcher1344]

I'm still using a 30-yr-old linear (no RO) sander with no dust collection and square pieces of "flint" sandpaper. Mebbe time for an upgrade.

[@lupenielsen]

I just finished binge watching all of the videos in your channel, and yours is one of my favorite channels on KZbin. You are informative, entertaining and I love your sense of humor. Your research and information on sandpapers will save me a lot in an upcoming project. Thank you for you wonderful content. May the Force be with you. Stay well! ❤️🤗👍🏼

[@christopherberry8519]

1. Sanders that supply cool air to the center of the sandpaper such as Mirka, festool and some metabo - ALL push sawdust to the outer holes batter and make sandpaper with any center hole last longer. 2. The true calculation of sandpaper value to me is cost, uniformity of sanding over 1 hours, finish and dust - not in any order all sandpaper must achieve a great balance of all the above. Did I miss one? I believe that Autonet nails my preferences BUT SO DO A LOT OF OTHERS

[@kellyb7321]

Thank you for this video and the testing. The sandpaper options can be kind of overwhelming and it seems to be a subject a lot of people gloss over. I've been using some Amazon variety pack cheap sandpaper without dust extraction. Now I've ordered some 3M products and am excited to see what kind of difference they make.

[@Lincolnstww]

You wont ever look back

[@JediHagrid]

This video keeps showing in my YT recommendations. I like this channel well enough but I'm not in the market for sandpaper at the moment so I've just ignored it. However, each time I see it, it has a different thumbnail. I guess this one finally worked because here I am. Keep up the good work.

[@Lincolnstww]

Glad I finally got ya!

[@jarett484]

Im only 3 minutes into the video and holy F you dont overthink anything. Awesome man! So cool.

[@aaronwarner2762]

I am such a woodworking nerd. I watched your entire video and didn't fast forward once (through the usual sanding at least). SOOOO worth it. I have so much crap sandpaper. Gonna check out Taylor now. Hope they have combo packs.

[@dangkolache]

The pad saver is basically required in some cases, like my old dewalt sander. I bought some 710w a while back when WittWorks talked about it but I didn't know about the pad and it barely sticks to my dewalt's hook and loop at all, basically unusable. Taytools is sold out of it currently, so now I'm using my old shitty amazon discs for now until I can get my hands on a pad saver. Since I bought it, WW made another video talking about this very issue.

[@tremolobar]

Your video made me switch from a bulk Menards pack to the 3M sanding pads. I love the performance! Thanks!

[@Rusty_ok]

Wow this is a complete detailed report. This should be the science channel.

[@alexpatton9077]

I've been wondering about these higher end disc's for a while. Great video and really informative!

[@frenchie_maple]

Jesus that's a comprehensive video! Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks brother!

[@Lincolnstww]

You got it!

[@tac1058]

Mirka sander and Abranet discs have been a life changer after 30 years of building furniture

[@hardnox6655]

Thanks for sharing. Great info! I've been using 3M 710 for the last year or so and am extremely pleased.

[@paulhopkins1905]

I'll stick to Klingspor, great paper, great price, and very convienient. I really hate the net discs, they will fray and wrinkle if you hit even the smallest splinter.

[@mrt1626]

Hahaha! @ 1:23 - "What is a Grit anyways?" Good one! That was great!

[@Garuda1415]

Mirka Abranet (aluminum oxide) and Abranet Ace (ceramic) are two different products. I would like to see Abranet Ace compared to the 710W.

[@gunningopher]

Great and informative video. One thing you might take a look at are the graphs you had at the beginning. You were talking about cost per gram but the chart showed wood per 25 minutes. This higher number in the graph (amount of wood removed) is basically a good thing, while the higher number in you description (cost per gram) is a bad thing. The magnitude of each sample is sort of backwards to what you were saying. You were describing it correctly, but I think it would have helped to have a graph that displayed your data. Not a big deal, but the graphs went so quickly it isn't easy to discern that they are different and potentially misleading. Is they reason you said 'sorry' to the battery powered guys (me most of the time) is because we would have to tether to a vacuum hose or is there some other inherent drawback that I'm not aware of?

[@Wordsnwood]

Lots of good info here, thanks. I sand way too often w/out a vacuum. I have a crappy shop vac because I'm too cheap to buy a better on... Need to get shopping.

[@kfederico]

this is the one video that convinced me to subscribe to the channel... and I don't even do wood working

[@StArFuRyZz]

I make cutting boards and use the 710W for the flat surfaces, it sands fast and gives me a nice finish. I use one of the Amazon brands - something Gold - for the corners. I found the 710W grit falls off when doing edges. The overall finish is great and I haven't noticed any scratch patterns.

[@Lincolnstww]

Yep - the 775L might be worth looking into for the corners. Its crazy durable

[@mikedurkee7296]

Very much enjoy your delivery, sense of humor, and more importantly your teaching.... and just for the record "A New Hope" (original of course) was the best (my humble opinion).

[@Lincolnstww]

Oh no - not a new hope

[@VitalityMassage]

9:46 Piece of ash. hu hu hu. (Beavis laugh)

[@StuffTested]

You should check out Diablo's sandpaper as well. Project farm rated his best value for the lower end one and the more expensive one was rated near the 3M Cubitron.

[@SpencleyDesignCo]

thanks for the excellent video jon! great info in here!

[@larryflenner4878]

question could you start with the 310 on lower grits and finish with the last grit the 775 or 710w to get the best of both worlds?

[@mriguy3202]

Excellent information, a true service to the community. In the grams per dollar testing, the defect in comparison was the effective grit size of various brands. A lower grit number will always remove more material than a higher grit number; how do we know that the grit scale is consistent from one brand to another, or even from one lot to the next within a single manufacturer? Your testing went several steps in the right direction.

[@Lincolnstww]

Thank you! There are standards that each company must meet to label grits. This helps create consistency from one brand to the next. I can't remember the exact names of the organization that monitors this - I read about it a while back. But there are industry standards.

[@JWimpy]

The biggest waste of money I ever spent on sandpaper was from Harbor Freight. That stuff lasted about 1 minute and there was no sand left on the paper. I only buy 3M paper now.

[@SleepyStud]

Criminally underrated content.

[@scandl01]

The charts/ graphs at the beginning were SO helpful. Can we get another chart for the conclusions?

[@braincraven]

Smooth commercial delivery for Jackery. I was not compelled to skip.

[@lauchlanstill6677]

I’d love to see the comparison of 3m with festool discs

[@watermain48]

I really enjoy your no BS approach to You Tube. Thanks.

[@Gandalf0056]

How about a video comparing orbital sanders to vibrating sanders? Which should I buy?

[@CoreyShockey]

Thanks for the in depth analysis of what really goes on with the cheaper sandpaper vs the more expensive options. Like most folks I'm not adverse to a bargain, but it is only a bargain if it works. I was curious about the old time sandpaper clogging remedy of cleaning the wood residue off with a rubber block. My grandfather used to swear it doubled the life of the paper. I'd be interested to know your thoughts.

[@Lincolnstww]

I use the eraser all the time. I've never tested the actual impact of it though. I'm sure it can't hurt given its removing pitch and allowing the abrasives to make better contact with the wood.

[@randyvannatta6523]

This is the first video I’ve watched of yours. Outstanding! Great job explaining the straight facts. Thank you!

[@tlynch918]

Another hot Saturday night: I’m in the kitchen watching a video about *sand paper*! We’ll done. Thanks for the info.

[@mainstay.]

I honestly didn't think any qualitative tests could be done on sanding discs to get any data to prove which is better. I have always gone with experience of use and thus settled on 'Abranet' I was so 'consumer loyal' to this brand ( always buying only that and never looking around ) I never knew that 3M also brought out net discs till now.

[@bingefox4056]

Yes, statistics are useful but easily manipulated. Even unconsciously when testing for a favorite. I believe he was testing for truth, however I wood of liked to see some other brands included.

[@lwgrantsmom1603]

The timing of this video as it relates to me is uncanny. Yesterday I purchased a 5 foot long solid wood fireplace mantle on FB Marketplace for only $20. It was a hideous shade of orange stain, with both a glossy topcoat and faux “distressing”. Today I had fun sanding it down to bare wood (pine). I used my cheapo 5” Ryobi orbital sander, and a pack of Diablo SandNet discs. (Picked up from HD a few months ago, $20 for a pack of 60!) Because the piece was solid pine, I went ahead and used these 80 grit discs. According to the package, they are made of “Premium Ceramic Blend”. Then for comparison I got out my ancient box purchased 10 years ago of 40 grit Bosch discs. OMG. Even with the coarser grit, they hardly removed anything. The SandNet discs work so fast and I got to bare wood within seconds. The whole 5’ mantle took under an hour to bare wood. I didn’t realize I should use a vacuum, I skipped doing so because my 12g RIDGID is bulky, cumbersome, and noisy. (My next purchase is definitely going to be a Festool dust extractor!) Also, I didn’t know these need a extra padding layer. There was one at the bottom of the box! Next time, I’ll use it! Thanks for all the great info! Very happy with the Diablo SandNet discs. I did go through 12 of them but at 3/$1, it was only $4. I’ll be donating the Bosch discs to my local Habitat Restore.

[@davemeise2192]

I've wondered what kind of sandpaper one should focus on. No one seemed to have any idea on what to buy, how to look for it and how long sandpaper would/should last. Thank you for clarifying it for me. I'm going to see if I can find some of the good stuff for my orbital sander.

[@hansangb]

Hmm, @11:49 I wonder if dust buildup on your finger tip/pad made a difference? If you did it in the other direction, would it have affected the results? Not that we need to turn this into a rocket launch or anything. LOL. And while I do try to blow/dust between sanding, I'll now be more diligent. I wasn't aware of the PTCE: purple tortilla chip effect. As I get into more and more "fine" woodworking, I'll be sure to be on the lookout. Thanks!

[@silenthill5794]

It's awesome how 3M and other companies will use the same employees, the same equipment and almost the same ingredients..and then tack on the 50% increase because it's "premium". I love capitalism but consumers get screwed constantly by manufacturers. It's like something as simple as paper towels. High quality paper towels are produced by the same companies that also make the really crappy ones. They use less layers, don't punch the holes all the way through as well, and barely lower the price and call it affordable....I know, what's my point ? I don't really have one. I recently bought a great big box of that cheap amazon sandpaper and it will be a while before I need to buy anymore, but I'll consider better quality over better price because of this video 🙂 Also, while I appreciate the effort of this and other videos, they always seem to judge the sand paper on it's wood removal and smoothness, but , and I'm not professional, aren't "most" high end wood furniture pieces coated with several layers of poly/stain/whatever, and that has to be sanded, and doesn't that decide the actual "Ooooh that feels smooth to the touch" finish ? My point is, can't I use crappy sandpaper on my wood, then stain and finish ...and THEN get a nice smooth touchy feely with crappy paper ?

[@Snausages32]

Great content. I'd like to see a chart or some sort of breakdown at the end - for those of us that don't take notes mid-video.

[@Lincolnstww]

Good call!

[@mikahundin]

Here is an elaboration on the key benefits explained in the summary: • Cost-effectiveness - The testing showed that while more expensive upfront, the 3M Cubitron and net abrasive discs actually had the lowest cost per gram of wood removed. This means they are more cost-effective in the long run by removing material faster and lasting longer before needing replacement. • Understanding grit and materials - The explanation of how grit levels work and the impact of abrasive materials (e.g. aluminum oxide vs ceramic) and backings (e.g. paper vs film vs net) helps users understand what factors drive sandpaper performance and cost. This knowledge can inform better purchasing decisions. • Smoothest finish - Despite removing less overall material, the testing found the 3M 310W net disc left behind the smoothest, most scratch-free finish on the wood surface. For many woodworkers, having an ultra-smooth finish is extremely important. • Tailored recommendations - Rather than blanket recommendations, specific sandpaper products are suggested for different user needs - budget/softwoods, working without dust collection, mix of hardwoods/softwoods, etc. This tailoring helps ensure each user gets the right product for their requirements. • Frequent disc changes - The data showed that even premium discs see a 50% drop in material removal rate after 25 minutes. The recommendation to change discs frequently, while potentially using more discs, ensures faster removal rates and better finish quality throughout the sanding process. The overarching benefit is maximizing both cost-effectiveness and quality of results by understanding the factors impacting sandpaper performance and following evidence-based best practices. This saves time while producing superior finished products.

[@mikahundin]

The video outlines some potential downsides to the different sandpaper products recommended: 3M 775L Cubitron Downsides: - Most expensive option - Not ideal for resinous/soft woods like pine as they cause premature clogging - Left deeper, more visible scratches in testing that required sanding to a higher grit 3M 710W Net Disc Downsides: - Edges more prone to fraying and tearing compared to film-backed - Purple abrasive fragments can get left behind if not vacuumed well - May need to go to a higher grit to remove all scratches 3M 310W Net Disc Downsides: - Removed material at a slower rate than 775L and 710W in testing As for which product is ultimately recommended: For Budget or Resinous/Soft Woods: The 3M 310W net disc is recommended as the best bang for your buck, especially if working with inexpensive woods like construction lumber where the slightly rougher finish won't matter as much under a film finish. For Edges/No Dust Collection: The 3M 775L Cubitron is recommended if you'll be sanding a lot of edges or won't have a vacuum hooked up, as its film backing holds up better to edge sanding and doesn't require dust extraction. For Mix of Hard/Soft Woods: The 3M 710W net disc is recommended if you work with a mix of wood types, as it provides excellent dust extraction while still removing material very efficiently across different densities. So in summary, the recommendations balance factors like budget, wood type, sanding application, and whether using a dust collector based on the performance testing results.