Longrange blog 271: 6XC reloads for hunting

[@deadeye6666]

My personal experience is that the magneto speed has a big adverse effect on group size. I'm not sure if it is the altered harmonics or the fact that the bullet passes so close to the bayonet, but it definitely messes with group size.

[@MrMalicious5]

Depends on the gun. It changes my POI up and to the left but accuracy remains the same.

[@jaycupples4362]

I usually collect data with the magneto then take it off for groups.

[@THLR]

I had the same result as MrMalicious5 on my other barrels, it dropped my POI down about a few cm but otherwise no effect. It does seem to affect this barrel. I have no explanation why/why not.

[@hjerttindrein]

On my gun the gruops open realy up when using magnetospeed

[@svaigis]

Thomas try Lapua Scenar's bullets.You will be surprised how good they are for targeting. I have got 6XC Gruning Elmiger and Norma factory ammo is far behind my reloaded Lapua scenar ammmo. Plus Norma bullets are molly coated,so you have cold bore first shot effect.You collect data,you clean barrell,molly goes off,you get different numbers again.So you need to keep treds all time molly coated and cannot clean to mutch barrel to save your results. Molly saves barrel live,but has somme disadvantages.You shoot same time hunting bullets to,molly coated barrel gives more slippery and less speed and more accurasy.Once in a while you clean barrel well,and you gain speed and lose POI.Then you need to do somme schots to get back to a accurasy. I presume your molly coated barel dont like those non coated bullets. So idea is stick with only coated bullets or take off all molly from barrel treds (with Acetone for example) and try all from begining. And by away: that Norma factory ammo you use are old stile boxes or new ones? As I know Norma used different bullets for they 6xc ammo. They perform slightly different.Try both. Keep going Thomas.Good luck.

[@THLR]

I haven't gotten that far into reloading/ experimenting with the 6 XC. I am still a little unsure of how much/ how little I need to clean the barrel as I have moly/ non-moly bullets. But the problem will go away, as soon as I run out of factory ammunition it will be clean bullets all the way. And I will definitively be cleaning out the barrel properly and shooting non-moly only well in time for hunting season.

[@pasjooter1039]

Indeed I would not mix coated and uncoated bullets.

[@mehmetkaya7154]

Kısa ve öz bu kanalın en muazzam yanı 🇹🇷

[@THLR]

Thank you ??? Google translate did not help much there.

[@mehmetkaya7154]

THLR.NO google translate error 😆

[@mehmetkaya7154]

THLR.NO my friend sharing the channel's knowledge and experience in a concise and concise manner.

[@mikemcmillan5482]

I have not watched one of you videos in a bit. Good video as always. Now i feel like reloading. Yeee

[@THLR]

Sorry for putting you in that position, it is a terrible chore! I absolutely hate it and if I ever win the lottery I'll spend it on factory ammo :D

[@cratxn1]

A simple dent in the muzzle crown changes the escaping gas pressure waves as the bullet exits and thus the POI i.e. accuracy & precision...same, same with the harmonics of the barrel as noted below for the weight/moment arm of the MS unit. So would the change in exiting gases caused by the MS asymmetrical proximity to the bullet's exit path have an effect ? probably

[@THLR]

What is the MS unit? I am a little unsure of what you are saying/asking here.

[@cratxn1]

MS = Magneto Speed Airfoils are moved off course by changes in the airflow around them...flying formation the closer you get to your wingman/men the more it changes both of your headings, drag thus airspeed ...when a plane gets close to the ground, "ground effect", drag/lift is effected ..(actually this ground effect is much like a boat pushing its bow wave up onto the shore) so what I am saying is that the magneto speed (MS) changes the drag/lift asymmetrically on the bullet as it exits the bore...this will tilt the bullet and change its heading thus flight path=terminal POI and not always uniformly. That 6mm sure seems to shoot easy

[@beres70]

I am very curious how much the rate MagnetoSpeed modify the POI. It is obvious the barrel resonance will change, but the degree is not obvious. Especially at different length barrels. It is important questions because when you zero your rifle it won’t be enough to shoot some for speed data, you should shoot without the equipment. More shoot more money. I do not know a correct table which would show some data about the mentioned (with MS, without MS, different temperature, diff. barrel lengths, POIs, etc.) It would be great to try and show the results. It would have been a great new study for shooters. Maybe MagnetoSpeed would sponsor that one. I gladly help in it.

[@THLR]

I am not sure about what effect the Magnetospeed will have. Definitively a change of impact, possibly also a change of precision.

[@wolverinekut]

Hi Thomas! What do you think about 6xc or 6,5/47 will be better for barrel life? I need it for training,

[@THLR]

This is one of those questions I really cannot answer accurately. But I would SPECULATE you'd get more barrel life out of a larger diameter bore (more surface for the pressure) and I would GUESS the 6,5x47 has an advantage there.

[@wolverinekut]

@@THLR thank you Sir 🙏

[@jaycupples4362]

Was hoping the eldx’s would do good, sd’s where good . Good video Thomas

[@THLR]

Jay Cupples Me too! It's kinda the only high bc hunting bullet in 6mm, but I've spent 200 bullets now and gotten nowhere near the precision potential of 6XC. By all means, they can do less than 1 inch, but it's a bit frustrating to see how good the 6 XC shoots with match ammo and not being able to replicate. I have given up on the ELD X

[@Filmpilot]

Great vapor trail!

[@THLR]

Yeah, camera caught that really well!

[@jwhunting4379]

Bra film! Söker data på Hornady kulor till 6xc

[@THLR]

Bruk ladedata som for Berger sin 105gr, med varsomhet.

[@madsnielsen8912]

What’s the lenght of your 6xc barrel? Can it be cut down to fx 50 cm?

[@THLR]

I cut (almost) all my barrels to 50 cm for compact size and have had no drawbacks in practical use. IIRC I had V0 850'ish with 105gr in my barrel.

[@madsnielsen8912]

@@THLR thx for rapid and competently respons :-)

[@THLR]

@@madsnielsen8912 double checked. With 90gr bullets I had V0 933 msec, with 105gr V0 858 msec. Vit N550//150 and Norma 203B was the best powders for that "magical" 6XC precision. On roe and reds this cartridge worked as well as anything I've used, complete shoot-through every time and normal, short flight before falling.

[@madsnielsen8912]

@@THLR once again adequate and competently respons. Thx very much :-)

[@DaMadMardigan]

I would think that a lower SD on speed would result in a tighter group. How much does the bullet weight vs twist rate is at play with only a 10grain difference in weight?

[@THLR]

It is more a question of lenght. For example Berger Bullets makes shorter versions (Classic Hunters) of their VLD bullets in order to work better with normal twistrates. All of the bullets shot here should work fine with my 1:8" barrel.

[@DaMadMardigan]

THLR.NO That’s interesting, Do longer bullets need slower twist vs shorter bullets? I guess the question becomes of tuning your loads to the barrel. I shoot 6.5 Grendel mainly, and the 110s from Hornady seem to give me the best accuracy, I experience about 1mil drop with my suppressor, but the groups stay the same.

[@THLR]

It's the other way around, long bullets require a faster twist (like the cal.22 90gr bullets that need a 1:7" instead of the normal 1:8" or 1:10"). I know that my suppressor on/off will shift the POI, but I'm a silencer addict and hardly shoot a shot without one so don't really know what the shift is.

[@mrr0cksor669]

you mix different bullets without cleaning the barrel? I learned that this can have a great deal on the accuracy of the gun?!?

[@THLR]

Oh it can! Moly to ordinary or ordinary-copper. I give the 6 XC a thourough scrub when I'm done with moly.

[@DZPX2]

how are you? Sorry to bother you. I'm trying to find a reload for my blaser r93 7mm, I'm really getting frustrated because I can't improve 1 inch to 50m. I already tried different tips. Any advice? I don't usually have problems with finding a good load, it's just happening to me with the blaser. thanks

[@THLR]

Sorry no, that is a little outside my competence. Just checking: There might be a chance that your barrel is shot out? You are not using to heavy bullets for your barrel twist (180 grains)? To find my own reloads, I use this procedure sierrabulletsblog.com/2017/01/03/how-to-find-your-absolute-best-load/

[@zsoltczibula5722]

Hello, I have the experience that calibers and loads over 880 m/s mv are easily printing groups opened up at 50 meters. If you could check at 100 meters or so, I have a bullet weight range advice to hold between 150-175 grains..Additionally, I am a 20 + years reloader and what I fount is that a Blaser new barrel shoots from beginning, or won’t shoot accurately never. My decision to sell my R93 was because of a 243 I couldn’t find a load in that particular barrel better than a 1” group, while all my Tikkas shoot the third of it! My hunting teams PH has an R8: same 243 cal: all my loads tested in his barrel :shoot like a 10-16 mm one hole group. Sorry to take your time, didn’t want to mix you even a little.

[@wolverinekut]

New boots 🤪👏👏👏

[@THLR]

Yes, Asolo. I have "difficult" feet and very few boots will fit me very well. I previously owned Asolo and I got a longer life out of them than any boots I've owned, so very happy to find that they had an online shop.

[@wolverinekut]

THLR.NO 👍

[@dekinser]

Tell us more about the 6XC

[@THLR]

The 6 XC is basically the match version of the good old deer/varmint cartridge 243. If I understand correctly, it was pioneered by american master rifle shooter David Tubb and later picked up by Norma. The cartridge has gained a very strong position amongst international level 300m position shooters. For me who are pressured for time and wants to avoid reloading, it is the only locally available 6mm where I can buy quantities of match ammunition at a managable price. For american shooters, there is also the 6mm Creedmoor which really isn't available here. I really liked my 243 when I used that (I think I shot 21 deer in one day with it, all fell on the spot) and I am hoping the 6 XC will be pretty much the same. The only frustration I've had so far is my inability to reload my own ammunition to the same precision standard as the factory ammunition.

[@allantinnion2663]

Find the Facebook group 6xc shooters and reloading

[@THLR]

Thanks! But I think that is a secret group as a FB searh turned up nothing.

[@allantinnion2663]

THLR.NO your now a member 😉

[@12kire34]

@@allantinnion2663 How can I join that group?

[@zeroone3835]

Do you think the chronograph will affect the accuracy of you trying to do load development? Thanks Great work and clear videoing. Keep it 👆

[@THLR]

Definitively a shift in point of impact, posssibly a change in precision. To be sure one should shoot without the chronograph... but I shoot with a silencer attached anyway, and I don't see much difference other than the POI change.

[@blaserlongrange7616]

Såg inge vidare ut med laddningarna ,skjut utan magnetospeed monterad är mitt tips, kolla hastigheten när du är nöjd med laddningen

[@THLR]

Har strevet stort med å få koll på 6XC ladningene. Fikk noen resultater like før jeg dro på ferie, skal sjekke igjen i august. Skytebanen har ikke pri 1 akkurat nå...

[@liangxiao2909]

Would the suppressor change the velocity from your experience, and by how much?

[@THLR]

Sorry, I have never compared V0 with suppressor on/off.

[@winniewinskill2106]

What was your velocity with the 90-95gr bullets? Great videos as always!

[@THLR]

Thanks! Right around 930 msec (3050 fps)

[@RichBorrett]

Will you also try the ELD-M (new AMAX)?

[@THLR]

Rich Borrett Yes when I can get my hands on them, they are currently unavailable here. I finally got the 105 Amax to shoot very well, the ELD X not at all.

[@TheD3lux3]

Hi, If you get some 108 ELD M.. my load in my R8 is 45gr N560 and OAL 2.77". This creates every time one hole groups.

[@THLR]

I'll give that a try, but it is unlikely I will get my hands on the ELD M anytime soon. My 105gr Amax shot very well with Norma 203B and ok with URP. Nosler shot super with N550, I did not get any velocity with N560 but did not explore that powder much due the N550 results.

[@csiguntrainer108]

Is it possible to get a copy of the target you were using?

[@THLR]

The circle dots or the Shooter Error target?

[@csiguntrainer108]

The circle dots

[@KSM22LR]

👍👍👍

[@THLR]

Thanks for taking the time.

[@greatsportb5376]

A+

[@THLR]

Thanks. Sorry for the late reply, today has seen a rush of comments that KZbin hasn't displayed to me earlier.

[@baer4547]

I’m sure you know this but if you did not totally clean your barrel out between changing manufacturers of bullets or powder....your results are pretty useless...

[@THLR]

How so/ what part?

[@JimFleming1953]

Not "real" bad on the SD's, Thomas.

[@THLR]

No I was really hoping it would do better than it did. But now it's summer, no shooting for some time now.

[@Selec1201]

Hello great as always! Your blog is the reason, why i have bought an R8 in 6,5-284 Norma. Which magnification do you use, for the 300m+ shots? Thank you.

[@THLR]

It really depends on what type of target I'm shooting. If it is a paper target, I tend to use the highest magnification where I see a clear picture. For competitions and similar, the magnification seems to stop somewhere between 10-16x depending on how fast the shooting needs to be/ how difficult the targets are to find etc etc. I find that as I've had scopes with more magnification, I also use that magnification. I was perfectly happy with my 4-16x50 and I was ok with my 3-20x50 and I am equally happy with my 5-25x56.

[@contimusic8357]

Outstanding, i think you would like my music for your videos as well, perhaps you would be intersted to use my music for your next video? Love to see more!

[@cratxn1]

MS = magneto speed

[@THLR]

Yep Sorry for the late reply, today has seen a rush of comments that KZbin hasn't displayed to me earlier.

[@wolverinekut]

👏👏👏👏👏👍

[@THLR]

Thanks!

[@samsungtv4u]

Too small for hunting I think...

[@THLR]

It is not as flexible, but it worked surprisingly well for deer. I would not use it for something more massive.

[@ЭльдарМагомедов-п9ю]

👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

[@THLR]

Thank you!