Longtail Bicycle Frame Build 05 - Tubes Dropouts Binders

[@Alex-sz7wj]

everytime I watch a video I learn something new

[@PithyBikes]

+the king and every time I make a video I learn something new.

[@bradbucc]

For filming weld shots, you need a neutral density (ND) filter. They are adjustable and are available to add on (or tap onto!) any lense. You're good enough with the camera to figure it out in two minutes. We use these to film trade school welding videos for students and they're amazing. The Weld Monger uses them too ;) Loving the videos and gearing up for my first frame. Collecting junk bikes to cut up and practice on first.

[@PithyBikes]

I have tried ND filters. Would you mind sharing what filters you guys are using? Cheers!

[@ronalmeida2536]

First I want to say that I love 4X video. Secondly that bandsaw and your fingers have me at the edge of my seat every time. Another great vid.

[@PithyBikes]

Hahah videos always make stuff look much more dangerous. ;)

[@MachineRight]

Great channel! Just a heads up you can use CA glue to temporarily attach your two pieces together instead of drilling and tapping and simply remove them at the end with a little heat. I've used that trick while working at machine shops multiple times.

[@PithyBikes]

+Machine Right cool, I didn't know that could work for steel too. Nice

[@Steelcrafted]

For the dropouts you cound have put them in the vice and gone through top to bottom with the end of the end mill....basic slot cutting....go .025" at a time each pass with the DRO telling you when to stop at the radiused end of the slot...it takes a while, but a mini mill won't cut like you we're trying to with the side of an end mill...and then cut the rest on the bandsaw....

[@PithyBikes]

+Nathan Hamler ah another great idea. This one didn't occur to me.

[@michaelgilchrist851]

Awesome results!!! Love those dropouts

[@cycleprep8829]

Nice set up. This is going to be sweet bike. Cant wait to see more.

[@PithyBikes]

+KC McArthur I'm really looking forward to the finished design bike. I think more than my son

[@timwatterson8060]

As for the close up shots you should get 2 board cameras(fpv) and intergrate them into your helmet. Might not work all the time but might be good b roll footage, I'm thinking one above and below the visor window.

[@PithyBikes]

I had tried at one time putting my action cam under my hood. The biggest problem with point and shoot type cameras is being able to control the aperture and shutter speed. Without that control, the auto exposure tries to expose the area around the arc and then the arc is too bright. It's a very tricky subject to shoot. The other issue i ran into is I don't always look straight at the subject such that my hood is aimed straight too. Its all very tricky lol :)

[@rahmatdjatihutomo3111]

happy new year steve...! keep building ur bike ...its awesome!

[@PithyBikes]

+rahmat djatihutomo thanks happy new year!

[@a.gallagher9423]

Love this channel, great stuff. I'm just starting out also but just a thought for the dropouts. perhaps you could have fusion welded the plates together on the excess and grind apart after?

[@PithyBikes]

+A. Gallagher indeed! Another commenter also suggested this. It's a great idea!

[@johnmk6148]

dude this kid is gonna be out of school by the time you finish this series

[@owengeary3948]

out of skool riding a sik custom longtail

[@PithyBikes]

+John MK a hahaha I know right?

[@PithyBikes]

+Owen Geary yus

[@qingxiangyee5675]

Hey there.. ever thought of just tack welding the dropout pieces together while welding? You can tack the areas that will be discarded after cutting.

[@PithyBikes]

+Qing Xiang Yee that's a great idea!

[@qingxiangyee5675]

Hope it works out for you! -QX

[@sweenep86]

Each of those practice bosses would weld differently due to the thickness of the material. I generally don't like welding threaded parts, heat and scales screws up the thread, so if I were doing it, I'd bore it, weld it, drill to tap size and hand tap it in situ

[@PithyBikes]

+sweenep86 nice I like that.

[@Alistair_Spence]

I would recommend brass brazing the binder on, not silver brazing it. That binder sees a pretty decent load in service, brass will give a stronger joint. Henry James carries the Gasflux C-04 rod, it's a Nickle Bronze rod that flows well. Good for bike making.

[@PithyBikes]

+Alistair Spence hi Alistair, can I use MAPP gas or will I need a real setup?

[@Alistair_Spence]

Hmmm, good question. It's a small part, but brass melts at a higher temp than silver (around 450 degrees F higher iirc). I don't know the answer to that, as I've never used MAPP myself. Not sure if it'll get the job done or not. An O/A rig is another investment I know, but really if you can figure out how to acquire one in the coming months it would be a very useful thing for you to have on hand. Braze on's can be welded of course, Ti builders do it all the time. One thing they do that might help is to PURGE big time. Make foil dams to trap Argon and reduce scaling on the threads of the binder, use a bigger cup, turn up the flow rate to suit etc. etc. I see that someone suggested TIG brazing but I would recommend against that. Anything that sees dynamic loading like a seatpost binder does is best joined another way. TIG brazing doesn't join with the same penetrative power as brazing, or TIG welding.

[@JoelRavier]

In my experience MAPP gas will just barely get brass to melt but not quite hot enough to flow nicely, especially with the mass of the binder. I used silver extensively in my frames without issue. Actually, PB if you want some to play with, I have some extra Henry James silver rod and flux you can have. I'm in Oakland if you want to DM me.

[@Alistair_Spence]

Agreed, silver is usually fine, I'm just saying that the few times I've seen braze on's fail it was when they were silver brazed. Here's a link to a thread on VSalon that just popped up that provides an example of this, www.velocipedesalon.com/forum/f2/my-custom-frame-nightmare-rant-46445.html

[@PithyBikes]

Thanks for the offer Joel! I would take you up on it but I have some that should be arriving soon. :) And I'm busy all week at my day job :( haha.

[@radek5690]

Beautiful!! Happy new year! Take it easy.

[@PithyBikes]

You too! Happy NY!

[@Mr_RichardH]

Those are some chunky dropouts!

[@PithyBikes]

+Richard Hayter indeed! I'm considering cutting out a relief in the blank area. Elks out a tiny bit of weight savings. Weight is becoming a concern for me. It's a kinda bike atlfterall. The rear end is all 035 wall 3/4".

[@BenTheBikerBoy]

zee for a longtail build! gonna be shredding some downhill trails?! haha, looks sick tho :)

[@PithyBikes]

+BenTheBikerBoy I don't see why not😁👍

[@anthonyambler9688]

Have you ever tried silicone bronze tig brazing I've had a few goes with it and it works nicely for parts like your seat boss

[@PithyBikes]

+Anthony Ambler do you Flux with it?

[@anthonyambler9688]

Pithy Bikes no just argon I think you used it to attach your name plate to your last frame

[@kristoferjonsson3362]

Pithy Bikes No, you just use a silicon bronze rod. Check out welding tips and tricks on KZbin. He's got many videos on the process. Great build, by the way!

[@justaregularbiker]

I'm looking forward so much to see the silver brazing!! trying to learn the method too :) soon I'll start practicing with oxy-butane set up, but I'm very curious how the mapp torch will work out. Good luck! :)

[@PithyBikes]

I'm really looking forward to it too!

[@cerberus1981]

Nice work, and happy new year! Before reading the earlier comments, I came up with a Bad Idea(TM) to help w/ the doubled-up dropout milling: bore a third hole - placed for fender stay mounting - through the dropouts themselves. Two birds with one stone! 😅

[@PithyBikes]

+cerberus1981 not bad. I wasn't planning on fenders though. Famous last words..

[@paulanderson5492]

Time for a new band saw blade!

[@marianorg8426]

Sory men, you haven't shown us how did you weld those rings to the headtube. How did you do it? Thanks about your videos, they are really good

[@PithyBikes]

Sorry I don't understand the question. Could you send a time stamp to the part of the video you are asking about? thanks!

[@michaelanderson8464]

I am tired just watching you this is a lot of work

[@benjaminsherrill5513]

GO PITHY STEVE!

[@PithyBikes]

(*•̀ᴗ•́*)و ̑̑

[@Altimis]

Happy New Year! :D

[@PithyBikes]

+Altimis Nuel happy new year to you too!

[@jalankumar2766]

how well does the leather binding hold up to the temperature of the welding torch? Would it work with a brazing torch or not? Love the videos, especially as you have a completely different method of building frames!

[@PithyBikes]

The leather only held the binder on while tacking. For actual welding I took it off. If I have a completely different method, it's because I don't know the standard method ;)

[@boo9oob]

Love your Videos! But where can i learn your skills?

[@PithyBikes]

You must climb a great mountain and on the 10th day you will encounter the first frame builder. Ask him to teach you the ways of the frame builder. srsly, you mean what schools teach this stuff? The most well known in US I think is UBI. www.bikeschool.com/

[@boo9oob]

Pithy Bikes :D but how did you have learn it? Just try and error?

[@rockyBalboa6699]

Im building a bike but i only have a Jigsaw and a hand drill!! unable to have any hitech equipment like you!

[@gdmountain]

Hey Joe, what arbour are you using in the mill for your hole saws?

[@Pushyhog]

I want a 170mm rigid frt fork for fat bike push thru axle. Anyone make em?

[@procraft]

You tapped and drilled the dropouts but it would be easier to just quickly tack weld them in some places. :)

[@PithyBikes]

+Maximillian Brozinic I agree! Another person mentioned glue that releases when heat is applied. All good ideas!

[@literoadie3502]

Don't breath cutting oil smoke, it's extremely toxic and causes cancer (think bladder cancer). Try and set yourself up with an extraction tube that you can bring real close to the cutting to exhaust the fumes out before you breathe them in. It may seem cumbersome and slows you down a little bit, but it's worth it isn't it? Btw, at 13:29 when you're tapping that hole, a good trick is to use what's called a tap follower, which is basically a center (usually a spring loaded one, although a dead one would work) that you would chuck up in the spindle and the point would sit in the center hole in the shank of the tap, making for perfect alignment. Look up mrpete222's video on tapping holes.

[@PithyBikes]

Thanks for the tips. I always wondered how toxic the smoke is.. I very rarely generate smoke like that because I mostly machine aluminum. But this time around the thought had crossed my mind. I had the garage door partly open, but I've since starting using a fan. Especially this weekend because I was brazing for the first time too. I have a spring loaded follower, I just get lazy sometimes with smaller projects ;)

[@maxhemphill575]

you could tig braze them on with some silicon bronze.

[@PithyBikes]

+Max Hemphill nice. I wonder if I could get it to flow enough though..

[@maxhemphill575]

It's easy and fun to work with. 1/16th rod should be right.

[@stevevanslow3874]

+1 on tig brazing with SiBr.

[@PithyBikes]

Do you use flux when you tig braze?

[@maxhemphill575]

Pithy Bikes Nope just low amperage. Jody has a video or 2 on it!

[@bodford11]

Does your mini mill have a quill auto feed?

[@PithyBikes]

+bodford11 it does not.

[@aVonHolmium6520]

is your band saws table at a slant because all the cutting fluid ran one way

[@PithyBikes]

It probably is because the table I made is a bit janky

[@aVonHolmium6520]

Pithy Bikes Oo ok

[@tomt9543]

@@PithyBikes First off, I really like your channel! Your assembly jig blows me away! Very cool! As a 40+ year certified welder/fabricator, I don’t know why you want to use that nasty, messy oil on your bandsaw cuts! It’s not needed on the thin stock you use, and for instance on Ellis miter bandsaws (the best there is in my opinion) they don’t even offer any kind of oil/coolant dispenser on their saws! Keep up the great work!

[@PithyBikes]

@@tomt9543 Thanks for the comment! I wish it wasn't necessary because it makes such a mess. Unfortunately on this type of cheap portable saw, its kind of a necessary evil to maximize the life of the blade. Some day I'd like to get a really nice full size bandsaw. :)

[@motospeed1311]

nice bro

[@PithyBikes]

:D

[@warbichetire]

with angle grinder those DO takes about 10 minutes....

[@PithyBikes]

+warbichetire another great option!

[@dRxUgz]

First! :O

[@PithyBikes]

+dR.Ugz :)

[@razzorbladz]

build on of these frames for your next project bmxmuseum.com/bikes/southern_cross/90621

[@hassanhayat6254]

Please make MTB

[@metalanddust]

Here's my 2 cents; Hurry up! Sorry but this video series is too slow. Lots of unnecessary clips and voice over. I'm bored. I am watching because I thought I was near the end, I have another 8 episodes yet.... Good build and interesting techniques. Look forwards to future videos.