Rumination Analysis on Final Fantasy VIII

[@kdakda426]

2022，and i still enjoy your old videos ,thank you lore

[@billsutherby]

I happened to enjoy FF8 for what it was. It was, quite simply, a min/maxer's wet dream. The story and plot was one of my favorites because of the interwoven stories and backgrounds of Squall/Rinoa and Laguna/Julia. Also, whenever I replay FF8, I impose a challenge on myself to assign specific GFs to specific party members and (for the most part) avoid swapping magic between characters. I effectively never use the Junction Exchange function. Therefore, I can build each character to be a specific "class" if you will. I suppose some people might take it as a negative that you have to go out of your way to make the game harder on yourself. But I feel like it's a positive for me because I can take this game and make it as crazy hard or crazy easy as I want it to be.

[@PTwolf]

Can stay listening to this dude for hours and won't get bored. It's actually pretty relaxing and helps me don't think about shit. Unique character.

[@GreenH0cker]

41:40 as for the GF induced amnesia, I both agree and disagree with you. Where we agree, is that it wasn’t executed properly (in fact, much of this game suffers from that issue). There’s absolutely a narrative reason within the game for the use of this “device”... and it’s called trauma. Take the “save Cloud’s identity from the lifestream” and turn that into a whole game from the perspective of multiple damaged individuals. All of the main characters have suffered a form of trauma in some way throughout their lives. Each character has their own unique spin of how it manifests, due to their individual experiences... but especially the unifying theme of being an orphan (And we can include Rinoa since she seems to have lost her mother and hates her father intensely). The GFs themselves are metaphors for psychological defense mechanisms. It’s explained that the junctioning occurs IN the brain, heavily implying the psychological element they were looking to depict. So, combine the concept for “junction-able” defense mechanisms (that have various applications and styles) to the concept of already existing complex trauma imprints and/or suppressed memories. Squall has intense trauma from abandonment to the point where he did everything to keep others away to mitigate adding any further suffering into his life. Keeping it all about what’s going on in his own head and doing what’s best for him. He’s an intensely emotional person who is more afraid of letting down others than he is letting down himself. Quistis always has to fix things... and be seen as the superior. Her introduction is a short moment of being slightly flirty while really just being straight up condescending... oh shit, she’s a covert NPD! Which is also why losing her instructor certification is a major blow to her ego and sense of self-value (her limit break then being thematically around “still more to learn”)... and why she tries to seek solace in the emotionally unavailable Squall (that she wants to “save”). Zell was an orphan too... but out of all of them, he was the only one adopted. The experiences of early childhood left him emotionally maladjusted with reactive anger... but the stable environment and positive role model (adoptive grandfather) helped him focus his energy into something mostly positive. Brains and brawn... desperate for validation... with reactive anger that details situations and gets the whole SeeD organization in hot water. Selphie is a manic-optimist that tries to keep herself busy... but also goes straight up kill-hungry when feeling threatened or vengeful. We also learn she started using GFs very young, which also explains her infantile-esc nature. Going as far as to say bi-polar/MPD is not a stretch in the least bit. Rinoa is a military brat who lost her mother (never explained... but also not around) and she hates the hell out of her father (for reasons also left unexplained... but we have to just accept it as part of Rinoa. We see her Father try to do the “I’m just trying to do what’s best for you” desperate-to-connect act. She comes from a broken home run by a militaristic authoritarian... with a (dead) mother who was a former celebrity sex-bomb (performers are normally narcissistic in some capacity). Rinoa is a mess who has immature outbursts, thinks in utopian ideals... and gets angry when flaws are pointed out. She also has a therapy dog who comes in handy when things get hard (or as a rng-counterattack if Rinoa gets attacked). She IS, however, the female with the highest level of emotional intelligence (sad to say it... but it’s true) due to coming from a more traditional background. She’s able to see past the flaws in ways that Quistis could never even grasp at the conceptual level... let alone turning it into actions. She’s also a bit of a serial-seductress... and shallow. She’s really just a classic BPD Irvine’s abandonment issues turned him into Mr. Charisma, because he saw it as the answer to keeping people around. If he’s charming, he’ll get what he wants. Our intro to him has him trying to alpha-challenge Squall and go off on his own with two highly bang-able women... he wants that bit of emotional satisfaction of only getting the best and being seen as desirable... because on the inside, he’s just an insecure person (for reasons not fully understood... he’s frankly the weakest of the characters). Seifer is your classic bully. Using intimidation and other emotionally abusive tactics to get his emotional needs met. He likes to inflict punishment as he sees fit... and does not hesitate to try anything physical, emotional, or magical needed to gain the upper hand of a situation. But really... all he’s looking for is someone to actually reach out and understand him. He has SOME success connecting with Rinoa... giving us a more sympathetic and human perspective to his character. But it’s stronger with his slightly Oedipal story of fulfilling his romantic dream. Edea and Cid is the embodiment of just how toxic codependency really is... and how much damage it can cause to the people around them. Cid is straight up whipped and consumed with his job while his cougar hotwife goes out and seduces one of his students to help her cause chaos to then come in and restructure things how she wants them to be. Classic borderline behavior (and Cid is the “good intentioned narcissist”... BPD and NPD go together like PB&J... but not in a delicious and satisfying way) Laguna... is the whole reason ANYTHING in this game happens. HE is the plot continuity... but even deeper, his is the story of how one’s search for meaning and happiness can leave us with both success and regrets... and a lot of lost time for when you realize what it was exactly that made you the happiest... and what could have been. Good friendships made it worth it along the way... but there’s always that “what if” with Julia... and that major gut punch of losing Raine. And he can live in the past all he wants with the help of Ellone’s power to inflict flashbacks. (Hold up... FF8 vs GoT time compression idea just came to mind) Full appreciation of this game requires some understanding of psychological development... it’s actually very intricate. Each of the main characters have behavioral strengths and weaknesses, and it shows how a group of people can overcome their traumatic personal shit together to overcome a larger obstacle. The interesting thing is that as I played FF8 for the first time, as a 12 /13-year-old, I picked up on a minimal amount of this at a gut level... partially because I was experiencing emotional neglect myself (didn’t know it) and could highly relate to what I was playing. Years and years later (it’s 20 years now), a deeper understanding of life and human behavior, through experiences and education, then reveals another layer of intricacy.

[@greek1237]

That and they were all 5 or 6 at the time. Who remembers when they were 5?

[@kazenna]

@@greek1237 most people do LOL

[@TheBlayner]

Ff8 gets better every time you play it.

[@LordMalice6d9]

I personally like it. Only major sticking point of FF8 for me is its draw and junction system. Drawing is very grindy if you take the slow route, and junctioning is far too game breaking if you know how to abuse it. It can make the game either breathlessly easy or very hard.

[@fallenwing25]

For me, yessssss

[@Frorackous]

The FF Ruminations are Archengeia's masterworks. I always come back to them.

[@purgatoriprytania5382]

VIII and XIII (+ XIII-2 & LR) are my favourite FF's by a wide margin, followed by XII and XV. That makes me a bit of a pariah in the FF community, but eh, what can ya do. :P

[@minilabyrinth]

I just replayed it on steam, it is true that it is 500% better when you fully play thru it as an adult. I first tried it at around 12 years old, was my first FF game, and I got frustrated from not understanding the plot coherently, and if you don't have that, then you won't understand the characters. It is the first FF I tried though that relies on the player to fill in the details for all of the main cast except Squall and Rinoa. There is so much the player has to formulate and discover in his mind by analyzing body movements and little phrases from the party instead of being shown a full scene about them. For example: 1.Quistis has a hidden love interest for Squall but she never really directly says this. She kind of says she had a 'thing' for him before, but she realized she mistook sisterly love for romantic love, she tells him this but I think inside she was just saying that to resolve the situation, and still has feelings for him, but she decides to move herself out of the way because Rinoa is kinda obviously the girl for him at that point. Even the scene at the beginning where she opens up to him at the outdoor porch in the training area, and tells him she is quitting being a teacher, because she wants to be with him on his missions. That's really the only scenes she has as a character, so you have to fill in the blanks as you play. It's both a great thing and a bad thing to me. 2.Irvine is an interesting one. He is portrayed as a Ladies' man early on, and always hitting on the girls of the party. My favorite humor scene is any where Zell sees him hitting on the girls and proceeds to get angry and punches the ground. But again, it's up to the player to put 2 and 2 together and see this outwardly suave flirtyness is masking how he is a coward when things get serious. If left up to him alone, he wouldn't have been able to take the sniper shot at Edea at the end of disc 1 and ultimately would have caused the mission to fail (although it did anyway) but my point is he didn't have the nerve to take the shot until Squall talked him into it. It's a shame though they never revisited this flaw anywhere else in the game, I felt he got the bottom of the barrel in terms of character arc out of anyone. 3.Selfie is someone I initially hated as a 12 yr old when I played the game. I didn't understand her and thought she was dumb and hyper. Now I replayed it and see so much more to her. She is hopelessly optimistic, that's her character, but at the same time, the pillar of cheer and hope that everyone needs when they feel like giving up. Selfie never lets this happiness and joy leave her persona even once in the entire game. What really sold Selfie for me was when her garden, which for all purposes was her hometown, got completely destroyed and bombed to hell by a missile barrage, you visit it with her and she is there still keeping it together, happy and chatting up her surviving friends, she is still outwardly hopeful and has a smile. She knows she has to be that strong foundation for everyone, else they might all just give up. 4. Zell is of course a comic relief character, but if you look deeper there's more to him. I think he is the classic jealous younger friend who wants to reach the level of someone he looks up to, in this case Squall. He is always trying to prove himself by wanting to head the 2nd team whenever there is a mission, and if the player actually lets him have some form of responsibility, then he is ecstatic. There really isn't much else to say about him though, besides the whole side thing with him and the Librarian girl that the average player probably totally misses in a normal playthru. I won't discuss Squall or Rinoa because that's kinda been done already here. I will mention something I realized though in my last playthru of the game. I was starting to get frustrated towards Squall everytime he turned Rinoa's affections away, and got that classic feeling of 'Squall wth are you thinking, this girl is falling into your lap (quite literally at one point) and you still are being a stoic emotionless and rude towards her, just kiss/hug her dammit!" What I realized is that the devs HAD to make him like this for most of the game, or else his conversion and growth at the end wouldn't be meaningful at all. He had to be cold towards ppl in the first 2 1/2 discs or else his arc would be really plain. When he rescued Rinoa from space near the end and she was standing there asking for at least a hug, he turned away and gave an excuse of 'you still want to live right? We need to hurry'. When I saw that I initially screamed 'hug the girl dammit!' but I realized if he had let down his walls finally at that point and hugged her/showed feelings, the next scenes wouldn't have been possible. BECAUSE he was cold, the next part when the Esthar soldiers came to take Rinoa away and seal her away for being a sorceress, Squall was cold again and kinda just let her be taken. BECAUSE she was captured, that gave him the actual final push (along with the party's prodding him) to finally say yes I love this girl and I'm going to do whatever it takes to be with her. If he had opened up to Rinoa way earlier in the game, most of the endgame plot would be much different. So cut Squall some slack next time you are complaining about his angsty teen mood is all I'm saying! I am curious though, what is everyone's favorite scene in the game? My favorite scene is when Squall is Piggyback carrying a comatose Rinoa across the entire FH bridge from one continent to another, and he is so tired and puts her down at one point so he can rest, and sits on the ledge looking out at a sunset ocean, and finally tells Rinoa his feelings, although she is unconscious and can't hear him

[@dickydmcd]

Don't forget Seifer, one of the most complex and under-appreciated characters to feature in FF8 and wider FF games.

[@philmar44]

final fantasy 8 is awesome. it was awesome when released and it's still awesome. my fave final fantasy and one of my fave all time games. Go Team Squall.

[@Cybernetic800]

FF 8 is one of my favourite games of all time so underrated.

[@markmaloney4949]

Final fantasy 8 is my favourite to this day it was first ff I played so I know I have rose tinted glasses syndrome on it but I really related to squall as a lead character after seeing your review for ff6 I've noticed some bizarre similarities between squall and kefka my favourite villain so maybe certain ppl are drawn to certain types of characters in games. I think ff 9 was easiest of all ffs I remember finding it very easy compared to 8 where on my 1st time playing through it I had no idea how to junction or even know what junctioning did until near end of disc 2. 8 is my fav by a nosehair ahead of 6 then probably a toss up between 7 & 4 after that

[@cornchip3439]

review starts 16:00

[@Fintastrophe21]

Thank you. GODAMN he rambled

[@Vic2point0]

I'm going to respond to your points here, but first I gotta say that FF8 was awesome. Easily in my top 5 Final Fantasy games. Top 5 games *in general* actually. Great story, best soundtrack, balanced gameplay, best limit breaks, best use of GFs/espers, best airship, and definitely best mini-game (Triple Triad). Can't really think of a flaw, actually. But let's see if you can! Though the spiel about game preferences being subjective was somewhat long-winded, *good message* about branching out and trying new games, because none of us really *know* if there's another game out there that we'd enjoy more than our current fave, until we actually play them all (which will never happen, of course, but it would behoove us to get as close as practical). And yes, I am Liking your video now for the humility you're showing, despite what you may go on to say later. Well said. Now I will paraphrase your points and respond to them: "FF8 is too easy" In most of the storyline locations, I will agree on this (Omega Weapon, Ultima Weapon [along with the enemies you have to go through to get to him], the enemies on the Island Closest to Hell and Island Closest to Heaven, and Tonberries provide quite a challenge!). But even then it depends on how you play it. If you don't acquire strong enough spells to junction onto your characters' stats, it won't be all that easy for you. And of course people complain all the time about the enemies leveling up with you, so there's at least some balance but it's not appreciated. Ultimately, however, I would say that the "easy" parts are *good* that way, because this particular one is very much about keeping the pace in the story. "They took away equipment" And in its place, they added a deeper system for customization (in junctions). It's still fundamentally the same concept. You can just do more with it now. "Drawing was terrible." Well again this comes down to how you choose to play the game. Observant players noticed that they could refine items and weaker magic *into* these spells *rather* than Draw them. So it's the same sort of "You can do it the longer but easier way (drawing/leveling up) or the shorter but more mentally engaging way (refining/strategizing)" thing we've seen all along in the FF series. "I always draw 1-5 spells at a time" This is where your Magic stat comes in. If you have a strong Magic stat, you'll get a lot more spells with every draw. Plus, again, you don't actually have to draw to acquire the vast majority of spells (particularly the useful ones). And finally, grinding in general was always part of the franchise. This is really just another form of it. As we discussed already, your spells determine your strength. So instead of grinding for levels, you would grind for spells, which at least provides more *variety* if nothing else. "You had to have 100 of a spell to make junctioning it worthwhile." That's just not true at all. Animations? Yeah, they could've been better, but I wouldn't call it a flaw because it was still the best they had ever done, IMO. "You get money too easily, and it's practically useless." While you do definitely end up with "too much money" if you do the SeeD tests as you did, otherwise I'm not so sure. If you were to try to get all the best items (so you could junction all the best abilities, for example), you would find yourself needing a lot more money than you could acquire by accident! And while it's true you don't *need* money to beat the game, I think that could be said about the other FFs. If you find weapons and equipment in FFs 6 and 7, you don't have to buy them unless you just want the "best of the best!" Again, very similar in concept with FF8. One sort of effort can be replaced by another. IMO, that's what makes FF great in general (well not so much anymore, but anyway). "The scene at the basketball court was bad." Well apart from saying it was poorly written and managed, you're not giving any elaboration here (which is shocking considering how much elaboration you put into everything else!) But assuming your major gripe with it is that it seemed "just thrown in there", I don't think that's the case. It works to explain everyone's inclination to keep "bugging" Squall and making sure he's OK, as well as the ease with which they did in fact understand him though he tried to distance himself by saying they didn't. They were subconsciously aware that he was more than just a fellow mercenary. Otherwise, the story *would've* been a little worse, because then everyone would just be annoyingly protective of him for no given reason. "I didn't really care about all of the characters." Well TBH, I don't think we were *supposed* to care about most of them. I think they were supporting characters of Squall, who was of course the main focus cast-wise. "Squall was annoying and childish." I think this is where you arrive when you completely ignore his backstory (which is not something I would advise anyone to do). I think he's the most badass, most *realistic* protagonist the series has ever seen. Because I do believe that most people would be very similar to him, if they had to deal with everything he has to deal with, past and present. Music! How could you possibly think FF8's music wasn't spectacular? The soundtrack in this game is easily the best of every FF game to date, IMO. From songs with lyrics to chants to the instrumental. Practically every town's theme is memorable, and of course the usual suspects (e.g., chocobo theme, airship music) make an appearance too.

[@Lorerunner]

Vic 2.0 Just thought I'd post here to A: Show that I read your responses and B: To add that I did a re-evaluation of... well all the FF's during my Marathon last year (you can find it in its own custom playlist) and while I was a bit negative towards certain elements of 8, I still enjoy the game and really liked a lot of the presentation of the story better this time through. I also was easier on Squall given a greater understanding of the translation issues.

[@Vic2point0]

Lorerunner Awesome! Yeah, I wouldn't have blamed you if you didn't read it. I just wanted to put my perspective out there and all. You did a great job in this video, BTW.

[@thelonesomewanderer8359]

Vic 2.0 really liked this response, really loved the video too.

[@Vic2point0]

jim smith and Dodo spiegel: Thank you! I watched Lorerunner's Marathon playthrough of this game as well. It was pretty good, though he got a little frustrated with it toward the end (with all due respect to him, I think that video served to discredit the claim that it's "too easy", as will my own playthrough which I'll be publishing before long).

[@MrIronJustice]

+Vic 2.0 I generally agree with you here. FF8 is very underrated and doesn't deserve the shit it gets. I loved it as a kid and still do. It does have some flaws though. But I'd rather they be bold and experiment, even if a few don't turn out for the best, than keep doing the same old thing.

[@akatsukimercenary]

People who disliked Final Fantasy VIII did not pass The SeeD exam.

[@JAK3mus1c]

I watch these videos when I'm having trouble falling asleep. Something about this dudes voice just relaxes me

[@ranmore30]

I'll admit, for the first 15 minutes I was thinking 'what the hell is this guy rambling on about?', but I am very glad I stuck it out. This was a very interesting and intelligent analysis, you articulated a lot of my own thoughts very well.

[@timmyman1997]

When I was younger I began playing JRPG games because I loved the idea of having more than one disc. When I got a little older I started being able to see the storyline and I was able to learn about the characters properly. The first Final Fantasy I played was Final Fantasy VIII so that may be why I hold that close in my heart. I have been trying to get as many of the Final Fantasy games I can, and I so far have 7, 8, 10, 10-2 and 13. I actually only got 7 recently so I am starting to see why so many people love it, but I think when it comes to Final Fantasy I love all of the ones I have played equally to a certain extent.

[@tomasgarcia7499]

I 100% agree with you on Ultimecia. I think she’s my favorite FF villain thus far. The mystique behind her really makes you think about what drove her to insanity and motivated her to do time compression and become the infamous “evil sorceress” that everyone was waiting for. I know in the FF8 Ultimania, Selphie says something like Ultimecia was just trying to protect herself in the best way she knew possible and inferred that Ultimecia had a tragic background. I look at her like that too. For me personally, I like tragic villains more than any other types of villains, and I definitely see Ultimecia as one of those given that society was the very thing that unfortunately pushed her over the edge. There’s all these little subtleties that gave way to that conclusion in my opinion. On a general note, FF8 was my first Final Fantasy that I played (this year actually), and it blew me away. The ending made me bawl like a baby, and video games NEVER make me cry. Eyes On Me is such a beautiful song, and really hits hard after you finish the game. This game will definitely hold a special place in my heart. It’s one of the best I’ve ever played with an amazing story to boot.

[@WilliamGarland]

I could of swore you already reviewed it, then again I may just have seen so many of your videos where you bring it it that I've pieced together a full review in my mind.

[@SuperGuitarDude]

One of the things I disliked most about the junction system was the fact that certain spells were amazing for a specific stat BUT there weren't a lot of places to "draw" them from. Which led to the disappointment of junctioning magic to a stat only to never use it in battle (as a cast spell), because doing so would lower your junctioned stat points. Then there's the fact that you had to travel far and wide looking for that one spell you accidentally used in battle. This led to drawing 100 of each rare magic and hardly ever using them, except in the case of desperation. At least that's how I used to play. What I did love and like most about the junction system is the fact that you could refine cards and other items into things you need. The devour and the lvl up/level down abilities helped a lot in maxing out stats, which was also a relief because I figured out and managed to max out several of Squall's stats while still in the Training Center at the beginning of the game by refining cards into specific items that could then be used with other abilities to refine the proper magic needed to be able to junction with certain stats. It takes around ~10 hours to get to level 100 at the beginning of the game. It was fun to one shot Elvoret with Squall's initial gunblade simply by using the attack command.

[@HighLight43]

I really enjoyed that little talk at the beginning about taste and finding the game that fits you.

[@dinosteve]

tbh I don't really have a favorite FF but I think VIII is up there with the better ones, they are VI, VII, VIII, IX it was really the golden age of final fantasy.

[@Vic2point0]

Hey... Your playhrough is still the only one I've managed to watch 100% of (aside from my own, of course). You did a really good job here, and during the playthrough. Just wanted to say that once more.

[@DeathwingDuck]

You know the more I watch your videos and the more you explain yourself the more I really seem to like you not just as an entertainer (even if this is just basically a vlog video, it's entertainment), but also as a person, because despite addressing your opinions, you almost always address that you don't mean to put down others with your opinion. Most people who make these kinds of videos don't take the time to address that. Bravo, good sir!

[@padawanmage71]

*whew!* just finished your series up to this point. The drive to and from work, the gym, even walking around the house, I listened to it all on my phone. Can't wait for the rest...

[@adthomp]

God you are great, so intelligent I love how in depth you talk about all the final fantasy games

[@studiocigsplain8588]

I think alot of what it comes down to is nostalgia. Most ppl I talk to about "their favorite game" it pretty much always comes back to their favorite childhood game, that they hold dear to their hearts.

[@Airjet2582]

On your opinion of Ultimercia. There are theory that Ultimercia is Riona in the future. Look at this way Ultimercia travels to the past passes her sorceress powers to Cid's Wife; who then becomes Edea. During the events of Final Fantasy 8 Edea accidently passes powers to Riona during the battle of Galbadia Garden. Years after the events of Final Fantasy 8 Riona slowly evolves into Ultimercia due to the sorceress powers contained within her. There is another theory that GF she summons and fuse with during the final battle is related to Squall. Squall wears a lion necklace that some have said resembles Ultimerica's GF beast.

[@1lamafarmer]

"Ultimercia" "Ultimerica" "Riona" Must... refrain... can't... aaargh...

[@Kydos37]

Airjet2582 To elaborate on a good point you made, the theory stems from the fact that Rinoa ends up absorbing the power of every sorceress in the game. First from Edea then Adel. We then learn that Edea got her powers from Ultimecia so there are no outstanding sorceresses left, all the power is concentrated in one person, Rinoa, which could explain why Ultimecia is so powerful if Rinoa went on to become her. Then there is the castle, built above the field where Rinoa pledged to wait for Squall should they become separated. Then there are the guardians of Ultimecia's castle. Your party gathers 16 GF during the game, where do they end up? 8 of them are bound to the guardians of the castle. So Rinoa ends up with all of the GF and they end up in the castle with her. Bahamut is also there, though he has been transformed into Tiamat. As for Griever, there's a theory out there that Griever IS Squall. At one moment in the game Squall promises to defend Rinoa, to be her knight even if she becomes the enemy of the whole world, which is what Ultimecia is. Squall stands by his promise and ends up becoming Griever, a image of strength he always acknowledged. It's even in his name and the name of his weapon, Leonhart/Lionheart. The track that plays in the final fight is also called "Maybe I'm a Lion." I think there's a lot of evidence to suggest that Rinoa is Ultimecia, apparently Sqaure denied this but no one has ever been able to provide a source for this. The other argument is that there is no mention of sorceresses having extended life which would explain how Rinoa is still alive so far in the future. However, I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that the ultimate sorceress would find a way around that. There is time magic in the game after all. I think the theory adds a lot to the game and to Ultimecia's character in particular.

[@Ponaru]

Uh...Ultimecia doesnt just summon Griever, she draws it from Squall.

[@DarkStar1406]

Hey Archengeia, first off just wanted to say that I love these videos that you do. They are so in depth and engaging that i have literally lost a couple of days time watching them all. Keep up the good work we need more reviewers who are like you. Also at some point later in the future I would be very interested to hear your opinion on the Fable franchise and how an initially good premise and idea has become progressively worse with each subsequent installment. Thumbs up people if you agree.

[@capocapy2870]

Silence and Motion is easily one of my favorite songs from the soundtrack. :(

[@countvladdracule]

This is my one game, i love it and enjoy it to the fullest every time i play this game

[@ggrulez64]

Someone should count how many times Archengeia says sorry in this series of Final Fantasy reviews, for reasons he does not need to... goes to show the level of humility and politeness he has. Such rare qualities.

[@Lorerunner]

Actually it is on the list to review so yes. Not yet though, need a break from reviewing series' after this one.

[@MoonlapseOpethian]

New to your channel. I'm subbed. Can't imagine that alot of people enjoy hearing some dude ramble unedited for an hour and a half about a game. But this guy does.

[@lostwoodsdweller5313]

+Melodeath Ted dont worry, this guy does too :)

[@shinsenkitsune8823]

FF8 is my overall favorite Final Fantasy. I have to say that Seifer really got to me. I still really relate to the guy. The man was so loyal. His speech calling the party monsters was great too.

[@possessedslig]

This is the first one I played which would probably explain why it holds a special place for me. I have to admit I never found it that easy to complete, it took me a while! I'm kind of interested in playing some of the others now.

[@GetDaved]

Extremely late to the party, but I think there are a few keys to enjoying the game: 1.) Accept that it is going to get the big things right, but a lot of small things wrong. 2.) The pacing is uneven, so there are a few parts where just powering forward in the plot is needed to really keep the momentum going. 3.) The game is about love, and for a long time I assumed that meant it was about romantic love between Squall and Rinoa. Try playing the game and thinking about it as a story of paternal love between Laguna and Ellone, because that's where the real love is found. It's tough though - the game focuses so hard on Squall's perspective it's almost hard to tell why it's even showing you the story of Laguna and Ellone.

[@DargorV]

FF8 was different from previous FFs. It was mostly a drama/love story. Squall was also different from previous leads, he was jaded, he didn't really care and he was fighting with his inner demons before the story even started. At the time of release I was around 16, I liked the game but it wasn't an instant favourite. With time and looking back, FF8 is is in my top5 favourite FFs and Squall is easilly my favourite Lead of the whole series. As I got older I realised I identified a lot with squall (as a lot of teenagers would), growing up without parents, not fitting in, being raised to be something you're not interested in but still doing it because you've got nothing else, pushing away people that only want to help, losing his innocence, falling in love but being unable/unsure how to communicate and then gaining enough confidence to grow out of his shell. All in all FF8 was a more mature story that obviously didn't appeal to young boys. These boys would eventually grow up tho, then play it again, understand more and thus appreciate it more. Almost all people I saw that hated ff8 on release, after replaying it in their 30s gain a new appreciation/understanding of the story and end up ranking it higher. Squall starts out in a very bad place and evolves throughout the game just like we did during teenage years until at the end he has learned to love, to let people in and to accept himself for who he is. Makes the ending where he makes the ultimate sacrifice and "dies" bittersweet. Ultimecia's themes also resonates much more with an adult than it does a teenage boy. Even nowadays people are still debating on that ending wether Squall died wandering aimlessly in the "other place" and that the final scene is just his happy place/afterlife or if Rinoa's love brought him back and its actually real or if its real and he's a spirit that only Riona sees or w/e (even saw one where people say he dies from the ice spike at the end of disc 1). My opinion is that square intended to kill him but they backed out of the idea at the last minute because PG13. Either way it was a fitting/memorable end to a good coming of age/romance story

[@cryofpaine]

43minutes - I was waiting for it. As soon as you started talking about the basketball scene, I just kept waiting for the ME3 reference.

[@yushinzzo]

"Isn't this ro-mantic!" Seifer when fighting Roxas.

[@cadaver6665]

It's interesting as VIII felt like the most artistic FF to me, though it's possible I'm imagining something that was never really even meant to be. It has a very unusual atmosphere to it. And certainly getting to know the Squall is Dead theory makes it a different experience altogether.

[@SilentFantasy5]

I feel as if another theme that runs throughout the game is that there is no such thing as evil, but only circumstance/ differing veiws. Squall himself brings this up twice I believe, and nearly every situation and villain in the game runs on this logic. Even Ultimecia fits this.

[@astroknot8627]

Ffviii is my fav game of all time. Since the day it released I was madly, madly in love.

[@Kyroyal]

Incredibly well analysed! Very interesting!

[@shurue8628]

Because of the subjectivity of opinions I don't usually put value in them. (This includes my own.) Instead I try to analyze things based on the facts of what is there, how well it is constructed, how well the themes are represented, the pacing, etc. Now, obviously there are instances where this can't be done and instead I have to rely on my feelings, but I don't let that have a significant impact on how I see that work. That way, when I'm talking about something that I enjoy and someone tries to dock my credibility because it is "just my opinion" I can respond in a quantifiable and objective manner that can't be looked down upon because I am potentially the only person who feels that way. I don't feel comfortable using a currency that only I value. I would often find myself in the position of needing to choose between my opinion and someone else's, and since both are equally viable yet potentially radically different I would get very confused and end up regretting the decisions I made simply because of the potential of the other choice. Since taking the objective stance I have regretted much less of my decisions, since I know that regardless of the potential of the other option, what I did was provably right. I have seen many content creators on KZbin present their opinions without following them up with facts, and these opinions are completely hollow because nothing is learned by their existence. This is why I enjoy what you do: take facts and use them to uncover information that would otherwise be missed and therefore adds to the lives of the viewers. Now it occurs to me that a balance between the two mindsets is probably the healthier way to go. I just don't like the thought that game quality is determined by the individual as opposed to the time and effort put into the game by the developer. While there are ways of organizing games that will stick with a certain audience, (genres) when someone enjoys because of the circumstances of a time that they played it, they don't actually enjoy the game. They enjoy a memory that that game is a part of. This does not automatically mean that the respective game is bad, but it also doesn't make it good. In fact when you get down to it, in a situation like that the game itself actually prevents maximum enjoyment because instead of viewing the game like it is, we force ourselves to look at them the same way we did in that moment. Now, that might work for a time, but eventually we lose sight of why we even play games in the first place because we have defined our gaming experience with a single memory that is only going to get further and further from reality as time goes by. It also doesn't help that this subjectivity is what allows companies like EA to do what they do, butchering developers and pumping out half assed content and while we may dislike it it is never the less supported because someone out there will play the game and because of their circumstances it will nudge them just enough that, even though the game is provably terrible, people will still defend it because of a memory they have in regards to it. *cough cough* mass effect 3 *cough cough*

[@Easelgames]

You've come a long way in these 5 years man.

[@Lorerunner]

Gotta be honest, it feels weird looking back at these old videos.

[@Easelgames]

Just wait for 5 years from now. lol. As a side note, would you happen to be doing another FF marathon of some sorts? (not soon but whenever) I know time is hard to fit in, and note that I said marathon not sprint... But I really enjoyed them. Maybe take them at a slower pace, not necessarily needing to beat them all in one year for example. Really dive in so to speak. Like FF month. Take FF1 for June, 2 for July ETC. This way it'd start off small and allow you to get adjusted or plan ahead. I'm kinda just floatin ideas so to speak.

[@jannegrey]

@@Lorerunner Looking at it from 6 years from the future - not only you came a long way, but you kept changing. Yes, those old videos are odd in some ways, but they are still great source of information

[@DaSpoonyBard]

Outside of Groundhog Day and Chrono Trigger, FF8 has one of my favorite time travel plots ever. The idea of time compression is way cooler than death rays and typical doomsday scenarios. Paradoxes be damned, merging the future with the present to reach the big baddie makes for a distinctly epic climax, in spite of its lack of difficulty. The other bizarre scenarios that take place and characters involved only help establish a suitably unique world that is definitely worth visiting, even in light of the flaws inherent to other aspects of the game

[@zakuguriin4521]

If they ever Remake this game, I think they should turn money into something more than what it was in the original. I mean in the beginning you are just a merc, but by later you are Commander and Chief. To me it makes sense that Squall would be able to distribute funds to different aspects of Garden. I feel a system like that would make this game super interesting and depending on what changes depending on what you pour money into it could maybe even make big changes to the story and gameplay.

[@allmight302]

I love FF8

[@Synathidy]

Hmm... I'm a biochemist and find neurons and electrical signals interesting... but you probably could've summed up the first 13 minutes with "different people like different stuff." LOL. But I still enjoy the eloquent commentary. Also, you nailed the Squall mannerism mechanics at 36:20.

[@Colli120]

Fantastic review. This is by far my favorite of the FF games, closely followed by 6, 5 and 7 (in that order), and so I like how you were able to point out the points that seemed slightly more annoying at times, and yet still be able to find the good. I agree completely with the orphanage scene part, sure it was needed to an extent, but it should have been either more spread out, or just more subtle in its entirety. Laguna was my favorite char as well, but I loved seeing Squal grow as a char too

[@michaelhowell2809]

I'm replaying this game right now. I was ten when it came out and I never knew the plot was this good. I was thinking how self contain it is so when you said Tim is linear , man you are do correct with pace and scenes and the foreshadow it really when over my head till going over the story

[@nemesis9022]

I love your old videos man. I'm currently trying to get into ff8 on an emulator. The learning curve is odd, but I keep getting stuck in 13 lol, so the difficulty being lower is sort of appealing tbh.

[@SirChristopherMcFarlane]

I can imagine a better way to make the drawing system work. Eliminate the idea that magic spells are items. In FF8 you use para-magic, which is a replication of real magic which only monsters and sorceresses possess. You could: 1- Make it so that junctioning a GF teaches you, one AP at a time, the magic spells that are innate to that GF. You can use magic with MP. This could also be called FF6. Or... 2- Have the characters have some kind of object that allows them to use para-magic as long as they learn it by drawing on an enemy that possesses the genuine spell. If you don't want everyone learning everything, you can have some spells take up the same "slot" (Fira and Bizzara for instance) and you'd need to discard one to learn another. You could also have characters have a limited number of slots for magic. 3- When it comes to junctioning to attributes, every spell needs to have a fixed bonus. For instance, Fire is always Attack + 5. In the elemental department, make each spell have a different percentage boost on an enemy with a weakness. Fire: 30% more damage against fire-weak opponents; Fira: 60%; Firaga: 100% damage.

[@gurufabbes1]

Everyone hates it, this remains my favourite final fantasy simply because it was my first. I would love it if we ever got a remake like FF7.

[@forestcampbell8962]

30:50 . So pretty much the draw system is an equivalent exchange yes?

[@DMDracoMoondragon]

FF8 is actually my number 2 game in the series (FF6 is number 1). I actually really liked the characters, considering I was close to their ages when I first finally picked up this game. I really liked Rinoa's bubbly personality and Squall's development from the stoic jackass to the genuinely caring leader. And I have to agree with you about Laguna. Laguna = BOSS!!! Also love the soundtrack, especially "Eyes on Me" and its various leitmotifs throughout the game.

[@River_StGrey]

I actually really love the effect the bipolarity has on the game. The really excellent music works to augment the themes of romanticism, while the broken parts of the music also indicated that break from romanticism, or seemed to suggest dreariness and delusion.

[@Imjustaguy123]

Listened to your ME3 review and now found Final Fantasy. Subscribing!

[@Ikomanderz]

Quick point: Edea actually was a sorceress prior to Ultimecia's timewarp and passing on of her powers before dying. "In order to die in peace, a sorceress must be free of all her powers. I know...for I am one, too.” Anyway, I find it so interesting that you happen to like Laguna (seems most people who aren't fans of FF8 don't like him) - s'all good because I think he's great too! I actually disliked Rinoa quite a bit when I first played through - she seemed too naive. I guess she's grown on me though. I like how you point out the different themes. I'm not quite sure which music themes you feel were out of place, I found the soundtrack to be fantastic.

[@btothekfromg5973]

I am some years late to the party but due to my current playthrough I came back to that video once mir. XD I thought about the issue of drawing being poorly implemented although the basic idea is a good one and I really would like to see it given another try. What might have fixed it is limited draws to a given enemy. And limited or even nun access to higher spells through enemies. Let's say monster A only has... i don't know... 5 or 7 spells that can be drawn in 2 turns... The avoiding of leveling would be mich less abusable by the simple fact you have to face 15 to 20 monsters to rallye fill up for one character. Leaving the battle after drawing could be a Thing, but with a higher punishment to the SEED Level and giving like you said money a higher value would mean you avoid to chicken out too often. So avoiding higher level monsters means missing statmaxing through the spells. Higher level spells should be only a thing thanks to gf abilities so the items get more meaningful as well. So drawing would be directly connected to grinding levels or risking money, In all three ways you have a natural progressing difficulty line thanks to the monsters leveling as well. Keeping the monster level down in not fighting gatekeeps the access to basic and mid tier spells causing problems at a point. Skipping battles cripples the money later used for getting the stuff to create the high spells, giving the game a great guideline how to play it best without really controlling how to play but making the curve much harder when you try to chat the system instead of promiting and encouraging it.

[@EmperorOfLols]

The principle you are looking for this kind of time travel is "Novikov Self-Consistency Principle". The Legacy of Kain and his characters also deal with this kind of problem and eventually managed to find a way to change history in his own particular way.

[@HaselsteinerMartin]

Great video:) You're not expected to get 100 units of one spell through drawing, that's why you are limited to only 9 units per Draw. BUT you can get NEW spells easily and see how they effect your stats when junctioned. If the effect is good, then you can go and use the G.F's Refining-Abilities to get a full stock.

[@557deadpool]

Martin Haselsteiner yes you do have to get 100 if you actually cast spells. Especially Aura and cure spells

[@Threesixtyci]

24:00 I used to lock the GF's to the characters.... to where I'd never transfer them to other characters once I put them to one. I mean, self-imposed rules is where this game really shines. As for drawing, my rule was that drawing is only allowed via items or via the world map. Drawing from enemies could not be stored to characters, only used immediately and of course to draw GF's.

[@WhiskeyTango76s]

This is actually one of my top favorites in the series and it always has been. I've replayed it recently and still enjoyed it though the Orphanage scene where everyone realizes that they just happened to have all been in the same Orphanage as a kid is the only real problem I have with it

[@mrcrowley57]

Hey Archengeia, i love your reviews!! any chance you'll review the breath of fire series, or the metal gear games?

[@alanlee67]

Ff8 doesn't need a remake. Its perfectly enjoyable in its original form. The remaster was beyond a butchering. Just get a ps3 and play the original.

[@fallenwing25]

Have you played it recently? If so, did you enjoy it more?

[@TheNail777]

It was my first FF game, and i loved it. I'm PC guy. and when I found a PC version of the game on four disks, I thought '"Hm, it's something different" To this day I found FF VIII the most StimPunkish game in the series.

[@rjdiii1224]

This helps me sleep, ty

[@InTheMindOfDavid]

Actually just beat FFVIII and I really enjoyed it. The plot was fantastic. Though the ending had me scratching my head. I feel like FFVIII was to Final Fantasy as Dark Souls II was to Dark Souls. Good game, not everyone loved it. Those that did lived it passionately, those that didn’t, disliked it with passion.

[@RazorAndHyper]

FF8 is a good game, I agree with everything you said. It was very capturing in some scenes as well as somewhat confusing in other scenes especially when the story really came in like Edea's whole background like being born in the future. I would love for them to make a remake of this game but not like a big remake but one where it looks better (graphics), voice acting, better combat functions (with drawing magic, like pick what you want form a monster), and more revealing with Edea and especially Ultimecia damn it lolz.

[@gurufabbes1]

As for the last boss fight, it was the opposite for me. It was an epic final showdown with no one-shots whatsoever. I guess I didn't prepare as much as you did to get all of the important upgrades and limit breaks.

[@kazenna]

You don’t need to work for it, just have Zell in the party

[@tmpfsoares]

Here’s something that I found odd in the game, Squall is a child when ultimecia shows up, so it only passed like 10 years until the present day, so Cid couldn’t build the garden in that space of time, and there’s more gardens similar to ours, so he must have bought it somehow.

[@TypicallyUniqueOfficial]

I think what you are saying is true, some games just click with a certain individual. Especially since certain people think a certain way, and have reoccurring thoughts and preferences that translate onto their personality. I have a good friend, and his favorite game of all time is FFVIII. Xenogears is my all time favorite jrpg. It definitely had flaws in the combat and in certain areas, but the story blew my mind. I loved it. The end was a bit rushed though.

[@bobbyquinn2156]

Dude, you like all my favorites...Fallout, Oblivion, BG, now this.....considering the hate for ff8 though I am worried which direction this video will go, lol

[@tmpfsoares]

The only point u could complain is that irvine shows up later, but remember, he shows up by order of the garden to kill the sorcerer so he is kind of a seed as well, so Cid must have had track of him since he was a child in his orphanage, so even him makes sense to be part of it, he eventually is unable to kill her because her face is familiar to him.

[@TypicallyUniqueOfficial]

Also you know what would have made the draw system much better. Instead of drawing spells randomly...I think they should have assigned certain magic spells/abilities to certain character (giving each character a unique purpose instead of being blank slates). Example: Zell learns Meltdown at level 85/Rinoa learns Cure at level 15, cura level 45, curaga level 85/Squall learns Aura at level 100 etc etc... But give each character a unique blend of spells, and drawing stocks all learned magic.

[@NightShroud092]

Just a general question. Since you redid the Final Fantasy 6 review from your what to pay series. Is there a chance you'll redo your Chrono Trigger review? I'd like to hear your elaborate opinion on it, since it's your second favorite (right?) game of all time, it's my all time favorite.

[@tmpfsoares]

About the draw system I totally agree with u, it’s broken, we should be able to draw like 30 to 40 each time, this way it would be possible to spend magic as well as store it. Or they could just reduce the limit from 100 to 30 or wtv.

[@Jiromata]

Archengeia i know you have a order/list for the FF you are review and was just wondering was dissidia on that list? Well you have talked about all the characters in that game but still the story did try to connect all the FF's would be nice to hear your thoughts. And ff 10 doesnt need a remake but needs a real release 12 as well. Those international versions would of made them so much more challenging and fun in my opinion always regretted never getting to play them T__T.

[@xsamplexample]

patience is a virtue... the guy has a life

[@DAOlover1234]

Wondering if you will review darksiders 2?

[@DelphieNEhuntah]

Great summary :D thank you Dwight :P

[@Lillu700]

I really don't think the "heart" part is any less scientific or harder to explain since emotions are properly "just" chemicals being released in the frontal lobe of the brain so I believe the way to explain that in the context of your theory is "the electrical signals being processed in the brain have to also awake the mixure of chemicals that is right for you"

[@ETrench1]

Just curious...what is your opinion on the "squall is dead" theory or the "rinoa is ultemecia theory"? I understand why you didn't mention them as they aren't really relevant...but i was just curious. Excellent reviews by the way.

[@dlong3468]

Hey Arch, have you heard the Squall is dead theory? If so, what are your thoughts?

[@Gguy061]

I recommend reading Kant's Critique of Judgement

[@RatchildUK]

Any update on your FFIX review? It's my favourite game and I really want to know what you think of it, I have been more excited about your reviews than recent game releases :)

[@tommythetomcat]

Really enjoyed the video. As you say some people have different opinions and I've always felt like FF8 was the game for me, flaws notwithstanding. I always had to defend myself because I actually don't like FF7 at all and it's hailed by many to be the best. I'm really glad you gave it more than one chance, some people don't even manage that. Also I'm a huge fan of sci-fi and the world just spoke to me on a personal level, if Square Enix could do that again... Here's hoping FF versus 13 can.

[@Lorerunner]

The theme for Esthar.

[@adamwintz1072]

Silence and Motion.

[@TheMehukas]

Great video, hope you would do the newer ones too or are you done nowadays with this content?

[@CloaknDagger]

Because Cranberries!

[@alanlee67]

Ff8 soundtrack is extremely overrated. I see too many people saying it's best in series. It's front loaded with great tracks but most of it is just elevator music. However, you are wrong about ff9.

[@JoeNeutrino]

Can you give any examples of music from FFVIII which didn't fit its setting?

[@Korizmatic]

I agree with you to some extent, but I don't the games or music or anything like that has anything to do with any type of code or how we read it, I believe it is how it relates with your lifestyle, how either a song or a game relates to you, or somewhere you want to be, a form of escapism, some people prefer Final fantasy VIII to other final fantasy orgame in general because it involves a love story, love is something most people can relate too, yet at the same time some people cringe at it.

[@Harmon2]

Concerning the customizable weapons, I take it you like the Ancestral Weapon feat in D&D, then? :P (assuming you play 3.5)

[@Juzang100]

have you considered working at a game review/news company like xplay gamespot or ign etc...?

[@RevolverRez]

FFVIII's plot is basically a big bootstrap paradox. It was also my first in the series, so I like it a lot even if it's mostly nostalgia. Did Europe get a harder version? I remember Ultimicia taking forever to kill, even with lionheart.

[@SaberRexZealot]

Enemies level with you. If you were like Lvl 50 when taking on Ultimecia then that's why.

[@RevolverRez]

Ah, that explains it. I was level 99 if I remember correctly, so she probably had an insane amount of HP.

[@ThisiswhyWecanthavenicethings]

It was my first game I ever beat have a soft spot for it

[@kereed1000]

Hey Archengeia i was wondering what your opinion on the supposed Dragon Age 3 Leaks . Do you think it is just BS or actual content do you like what you have hear dont like what you have heard . i was just wondering what your thought were. me personly i what to play as my warden again.