Louis Vierne - Messe Solennelle - (Score Video)

[@georgemurphy2579]

This is Op. 16, composed following the First Symphonie (Op. 14). It was done shortly after his appointment to Notre-Dame (probably the immediate response in the form of a major work to such an honored position). Thank you for posting this important work!

[@cahmn]

I've sung this twice in Notre Dame...singing the Kyrie in particular was the highlight of my musical life.

[@xoknight8166]

One of the most underrated composers, thanks for this

[@julianmatthews5785]

yes, outside of the organ world he is unknown unfortunately, he has some absolutely amazing pieces.

[@markjohnstone5678]

And I think I'm right jn saying he was blind

[@elainasaunt]

@@markjohnstone5678Very nearly blind, from congenital cataracts. He could make out shapes, but read music in braille.

[@keplergso8369]

L'impression de puissance de l'orgue est ici phénoménal. J'ai entendu cet orgue dans les années 70, Cochereau était encore là, la grande époque...

[@GuillaumeDeslandres]

Je ne comprends cette histoire de "grande époque"... Le grand-orgue est aujourd'hui le même (avec des ajouts intéressants en 1992 et en 2014), et la Maîtrise a atteint un niveau qui n'était pas toujours le sien au temps de la "grande époque", il faut bien le dire. Pierre Cochereau était un génie, mais il faut arrêter de laisser entendre que tout s'est effondré après lui. Ecoutez les enregistrement de la 5ème et de la 6ème de Widor par Olivier Latry, c'est (aussi) une "grande époque".

[@keplergso8369]

@@GuillaumeDeslandres Si vous voulez, mais autant Cochereau n'était pas un grand interprète, autant en tant qu'improvisateur il a marqué son époque. Cochereau était un nom familier comme Guillou, Langlais, Messiaen, et autres Duruflé et M.C. Alain qui étaient à peu près de la même génération, qui ont aussi marqué comme compositeurs. Là où je vous rejoins, c'est la qualité de l'interprétation des Latry et autres Vincent Dubois, plus fidèles au texte qu'à l'époque ! Par rexemple, j'adore Duruflé comme compositeur, mais quand on ré-écoute son coffret de disque de Bach à Soissons, on sent le poids des années (tempi lents sans dynamique, phrasé tout lié à la Dupré...).

[@GuillaumeDeslandres]

@@keplergso8369 Je ne connais personne qui nie le génie de Cochereau dans le domaine de l'improvisation. Il était d'autant plus célèbre qu'il était "l'organiste" de Notre-Dame. Autant je trouve pertinent le retour en 1985 des "quartiers", autant s'il n'y avait qu'un organiste du GO, il serait probablement plus connu du "grand public".

[@keplergso8369]

@@GuillaumeDeslandres C'est bien ce qu'a cherché l'Église en multipliant les titulaires des grandes paroisses parisiennes : éviter la starisation des organistes titulaires uniques afin d'éviter leur trop grande influence dans les décisions diverses. À titre d'exemple, les titulaires à ND de Paris sont 4 ou 5, cela devient ridicule...

[@GuillaumeDeslandres]

@@keplergso8369 Je ne partage pas cette vision des choses. D'abord à Notre-Dame ils ne sont "que" trois (et non "4 ou 5" comme vous dites), et ensuite la moindre starisation est davantage une conséquence qu'un "projet". Le système des "quartiers" (comme à St Séverin ou à St Gervais, même à deux, comme à St Eustache) permet de faire entendre des personnalités différentes. Et puis il y a un problème : on a en France une magnifique école d'orgue, avec des musiciens de très haut niveau... et pas le nombre de "grandes" tribunes ad hoc.

[@Gabry2138]

It's a masterpiece... and Cochereau is...powerfull

[@dife_ru]

My choirmaster described the Sanctus’ accompaniment as cowboy music and now I can never forget this mass 😂 gorgeous music, the Kyrie is especially spectacular

[@rogernichols1124]

This is awesome music, at times spectacularly dramatic, at others lyrical and ecstatic. This is one of the few liturgical masses that I know where the integration of voices and organ is a seamless whole and where the one cannot exist without the other. It expresses intimately the majesty of the divine and the dependency of man on something greater than himself.

[@charlesdavis7087]

Brillant! Profound. Never heard it before. Wonderful production. Captivating. Thanks all concerned for the production of this grand work.

[@peteransom1125]

Just wonderful. Julian, the effort you put in to showing the full score perfectly timed is very much appreciated. What a treat!

[@brettowen7174]

Wow....what a Kyrie! Marvellous.

[@MarcelMangnus]

What a majestic recording of this phenomenal piece (one of my all-time favourites)! Also compliments for showing the score.

[@julianmatthews5785]

Thank you. It’s one of my favourites for sure! I think its the best mass ever. ( some might say bach b minor mass which is another one of my favourites but it is too long to actually enjoy I find and isn’t hugely different from any of the other bach cantatas which are all magnificent)

[@sciagurrato1831]

@@julianmatthews5785 I hope know that the Mass in b minor is primarily made up of material that had previously been used in earlier Bach compositions (ie a pastiche of sorts). That may account for your reaction. Same is true of the so-called Christmas Oratorio - previously composed cantata movements “recycled”. Vierne was an absolutely inspired composer - this Messe Sollenelle is a great work, on a level with Vierne’s magnificent organ symphonies.

[@tbolofsson1522]

This music is absolutely magical! It constitutes one of the finest memories from the church music education several years ago.

[@jean-marcpipet6801]

Magnifique version Comme il etait beau l’ancien orgue de notre-dame !.

[@piperthedoge2531]

I really wish I could hear this Mass at my parish.

[@jetenza2434]

I never heard of this before by Vierne except the Kyrie Eleison. This is a masterpiece.

[@tropicjam7343]

Absolute perfection from beginning to end, every bar is à meaningfull masterwork.

[@rohancrafford8050]

Simply splendid, thank you. The only other recording I know of is that by St John's, Cambridge, which I hold in equally high regard.

[@sciagurrato1831]

There is also a fairly recent, excellent recording (coupled with Widor’s Symphonie Romane) recorded in Toulouse led by Joël Suhubiette and with Michel Bouchard at the C-C organ at St Sernin.

[@ThePurplePianist1]

There's another one from Exeter Cathedral Choir in 1987.

[@Sathrandur]

I recommend the recording with James O'Donnell with the Westminster Cathedral Choir (not Westminster Abbey) on the Hyperion label. It also has the Widor Mass and some Dupré motets.

[@davidvanrooyen4332]

Thank you Julian ... 1000 thanks.

[@aarnouddegroen]

Thanks for sharing. Pure magic!

[@carolalilienthal8085]

I will have the luck to sing this piece end of June 2023 with a huge choir of 150 people in Bordeaux! It is so much fun to practice I can’t wait for the concert. Will will do the Gloria of Rutter as well 🙏🏻

[@georgemurphy2579]

I hope it went well - I'm sure it did!

[@RalphLooij]

Fantastic music!

[@julianmatthews5785]

Indeed! It's one of my favourites especially the first two movements. Louis Vierne himself played it at my church, too bad I wasn't alive in 1914 to be there!

[@james.flores]

Ralph I have a live recording of this on my channel 😉

[@julianmatthews5785]

@Alexander Luhrs it's a little town in Normandy called Vimoutiers

[@jmdujardin]

quel plaisir d'écouter cet enregistrement ! J'ai eu eu le grand bonheur de chanter cette Messe Solennelle, à Notre-Dame de Paris, vers 1979 , sous la direction du chanoine Jehan Revert, Maître de Chapelle de NDdeP, avec le grand Pierre au GO, faisant sonner ces chamades si marquantes, et Jacques Marichal à l'orgue de choeur sauf erreur. Souvenir inoubliable...Merci...Louis Vierne !

[@daveharries]

Heard this in Westminster RC Cathedral (🇬🇧) on 18th October '24 done by the cathedral's boys choir combined with the boys choir of Cologne Cathedral (🇩🇪) and it was fabulous.

[@elainasaunt]

Thanks for posting. It's hard to find a good recording of this. I took part in one effort in the 1980s at Sacré Cœur in Paris. The church has to be big enough to accommodate 2 organs but the acoustic of many such places makes it really hard to keep everyone together. We had Naji Hakim on the grandes orgues and a British organist, Connie Glessner, on the choir organ. Philippe Mazé directed in the choir loft, while Fred Gramann was also directing in the organ loft trying to preserve the ensemble, which kept wandering all over the place. The recording was not a great success and is long out of print. For the choristers, though, it was quite an experience.

[@aarnouddegroen]

To me this recording is the reference. It's fantastic, glorious and wonderful!

[@aseptisch]

Don't be so shy with your judgement! When I was young I bought the Sacré Cœur recording on CD and was deeply impressed by the dark atmosphere, the power of the organ, the impression of a very big, but far choir which however had no chance against the big organ. It was an opener to french symphonic organ music for me at that time. I still keep it as a treasure in my big CD collection. I was always attracted by acoustics with a very long reverb, and I have a special faible for the combination of sound in a certain acoustical space (concert hall, church, ...). I am always delighted when there is at least ony photo which shows the recording venue in a way that allows me to imagine where and how the musicians and instruments were positioned. I would always have loved to have a photo of the Sacré Cœur recording session. Sometimes simple photos of only the choir during the recording session allow to make a picture search of the church on the internet and recognize elements such as a statue etc. to know where the musicians must have been standing/sitting. And today I would love if someone had made the recording with the technical possibilities of today regarding microphones and mixing, and the best of all would have been a binaural recording, or a surround recording or even better a 3D recording. (That is surround recordings with height channels added, so when listening you don't only get an idea of left, right, front, and back, but also an impression of the space which is above you, i.e. up and down.) Of course at the time of the recording we were still far from surround recordings. Of course I would have loved to attend the recordings. A few years after your recording I was in Paris for a pupils' exchange to learn French, but didn't know about the recording yet, and haven't even been inside Sacré Cœur, despite my deep fascination for cathedrals, acoustics, and organs. Regarding the Chochereau recordings I also wonder where the choir was standing. Probably downstairs, but where? No picture available.

[@elainasaunt]

@@aseptisch Thanks for this long, interesting comment. I believe for the Cochereau recording the choir would have been in the transept or nave near the small chorus organ. Notre Dame lacks any kind of choir loft, if I recall correctly. I have sung there a couple of times for international celebrations of events such as Armistice Day. It is very, very echoey - although the champion in Paris for reverb, in my experience, is the Madeleine church. I used to joke that the first time I heard the Mozart Requiem was there, and that it was also the second time I heard the Mozart Requiem.

[@Sathrandur]

I recommend the recording with James O'Donnell with the Westminster Cathedral Choir (not Westminster Abbey) on the Hyperion label. It also has the Widor Mass and some Dupré motets.

[@BenzemonstreENTs]

Quelle grandeur, quelle beauté.

[@georgemurphy2579]

Alexander Schreiner, organist at the Tabernacle, arranged the first movement Kyrie for organ solo - probably out of print - it was titled: Maestoso in C-sharp Minor

[@schrysafis]

I'm new to listening to composers like Dupré, Widor Vierne, Reger etc. It's supernatural. My dream is to play the organ some day! Actually I've been listening to Widor, Reger and Dupre in more than 2 years but I have so much to listen....

[@PierreMartius]

Sublime. 💙

[@ChrisJustinian]

Spectacularly magnificent, to be sure! Pity it's no longer deemed Liturgically appropriate music for the text being sung. Nevertheless, great concert music.

[@judithwhitehouse2149]

Cochereau! - says it all!!

[@crumpetsack3909]

has this specific recording ever been released physically? i would love to own it. i haven't found another recording that sounds this good

[@franckranaivo666]

L'enregistrement ❤🎶🪢🪅🌺🌺absolu de référence existe en Collector vinyle aux éditions Fy avec le Grandissime Maître catholique organiste 🇻🇦🍋✝️🍋Pierre COCHEREAU (1924-1984) et le légendaire Maître de Chapelle de la GRANDE ÉPOQUE de Notre-Dame de Paris🌿🇨🇵💒🇻🇦🌿, Monsieur le Chanoine Jehan REVERT💮⛑💮 !!!le disque est couplé avec un délicieux verset "In Exitu🎶🌼🥰🪢" et le très émouvant trypique (Stèle à la Mémoire d'un enfant🎶🌻🧸 défunt ) KZbinur frank🙋‍♂️ de Paris (France 🇲🇫)

[@Sathrandur]

I recommend the recording with James O'Donnell with the Westminster Cathedral Choir (not Westminster Abbey) on the Hyperion label. It also has the Widor Mass and some Dupré motets.

[@BenEmberley]

Who was the other organist for Org no.2??

[@chronochromie772]

Jacques Marichal, choir organist; Jehan Revert, conductor

[@julianmatthews5785]

Thanks!

[@federicosavio]

Capolavoro. Con Pierre Cocheteau al Grand'organo. Versione di riferimento. In assoluto.

[@freddoliveira]

Épico!!!

[@Tamadehenzhan]

danke

[@franckranaivo666]

À la Mémoire VÉNÉRABLE de MESSIEURS les CHANOINES🍋🇻🇦✝️🇻🇦🍋 Émilie BERRAR🌸🌿🏵 (GRANDISSIME Archipretre de Notre-Dame au Cœur d'Or Massif ❤🌼💒🥰⛑) et Jehan REVERT🌿🎶💮😇💐 (Légendaire et probablement dernier Grand MAÎTRE de CHAPELLE de Notre-Dame🌺🌿❤🏵🎶🇻🇦🌻💒✝️🌸🍋🪅🌼🥰📃📚) pour toutes les libertés artistiques et "autres"🌼🌸💐🏵🌿 SANS AUCUNE RESTRICTIONS❤🌿🌺🏵 qu'ils laissèrent au CELEBRISSIME🎶🇻🇦🍋✝️🍋🇨🇵🎶 MAÎTRE CATHOLIQUE ORGANISTE PIERRE COCHEREAU dans Son titulariat❤🇻🇦🎶💮😇🌸🏵💐🥰✒📃🧸📚💒🌿🦊🌼🙋‍♂️ !!!

[@domila5316]

But the recording is with two organs or with only the great organ?

[@julianmatthews5785]

With both organs i think

[@ds1868]

@@julianmatthews5785 Yes it is composed with the two organs in mind - the Orgue de Choeur and the Grand Orgue.

[@elainasaunt]

Both organs, with Jacques Marichal on the choir organ, which was installed in 1969 (this recording was made in the 1970s). That organ, unfortunately, was probably a write-off after the fire - not because of fire damage, I have heard, but because of water damage. We are most fortunate that the great organ survived. There is a version of the mass with one organ, by the way, done so that the work could be performed more easily.

[@locvs_iste]

Wooooooooow

[@franckranaivo666]

DIEU🎶🇻🇦✝️🇻🇦🎶 Vous protège cher Javier Martinez Rubilar🧸📚 ,Vous et toute Votre famille 🍋🪅🎶🦊🪢!!!KZbinur frank🙋‍♂️ de Paris (France 🇲🇫)

[@GuillaumeDeslandres]

Quel dommage que, outre Pierre Cochreau, on ne nomme pas les autres protagonistes.... Jean Revert, on s'en doute. Jacques Marichal à l'orgue de chœur ? Peut-être...

[@julianmatthews5785]

Oui désolé je les mettrai!

[@lanonyme]

Dona nobis pacem . . . .

[@stephanecivel4712]

Quelle lourdeur ! C'était sans doute les normes de l'époque mais c'est assourdissant à souhait !