Lucifer Morningstar Defies the Presence

[@josha6214]

The Presence "It is was never my goal to enforce my will unto you." Also the Presence: I made you and I can unmake you just as easily.

[@Amen-Magi]

They are two deferent think

[@efaristi9737]

@Aaron Holcombe when Samael ask why they should do what the presence demand, that's what he respond so it's clearly a way to impose his will on others.

[@jpf7942]

This is exactly what I find hilarious. He sounds like an absolute tyrant here. Yet when he shows up in physical form to talk to Lucifer he seems benevolent 😂😂

[@jillbill7752]

The fact that marvel (or DC I honestly don’t know) writers are intelligent enough to include the idea that creation and those within in it are in fact modes of god (when god calls Lucifer an extension/ aspect of himself) is insanely surprising and philosophically mature.

[@jillbill7752]

In fact it’s extremely reminiscent of Tolkien mythos, when Tolkien’s god tells malagoth that his disobedience is part of his design because it is part of him, the creation cannot separate itself from the creator. Philosophically it’s derived from Hegelian dialectics. A thesis innately implies/requires an antithesis, though both end up being two sides of the same coin, or what’s called synthesis (God).

[@MrPancake777]

Lucifer is meant to be God’s Will. Micheal is God’s Power, Spectre, Vengeance

[@efaristi9737]

@@jillbill7752 I don't see what in a thesis innately implies or require a antithesis. To me, that sound like a excuse to justify the existence of evil and punishing peoples for the wrong choices they made that could have been avoided by not letting evil exist.

[@jillbill7752]

@@efaristi9737 and here we evidence of an immature grasp on theology, where silly little KZbin boy thinks Hegelian synthetic cosmology is inherently tied to a Christian teleological framework, very sad! Many such cases!

[@happinesscompilation5252]

Shallow idiots love Marvel. And that's a fact

[@morpheusdruidic2813]

"Yes, I will defy you by accepting your offer" "Defy"

[@dukeofnylon]

don't know how you do it but you always manage to find the right music to complement the comic, keep it coming.

[@nahortesfaldet2313]

To quote Supernatural's Lucifer: "Dad made everything. Which means he made me who I am. God wanted the Devil." Think this really applies here too. The first thing outta Samael's mouth was backtalk, I can't imagine the Presence intended anything else for him.

[@cheeseburgerfreddy6350]

Presence is such an interesting character

[@barbatos6407]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/rKHap6Off7t-q9U

[@cheeseburgerfreddy6350]

@@barbatos6407 No thanks don't watch people that think Mordru can beat presence

[@JestersmilesStream]

@@75_86 parrot also thinks Superboy prime is multiversal .....so there that..

[@nahumaraya2660]

If ur a christian I know all about him cause he is god

[@manngay5046]

I'm confused you guys think The Presence is not Omnipotent or is he Omnipotent.

[@kyashix9561]

Lucifer is such an interesting and fascinating character to me. Truly amazing.

[@nahumaraya2660]

He's the calm version of the devil

[@leonalushi3429]

@@nahumaraya2660 He also thinks lying is useless and wrong.

[@esewhachudoinn]

@@nahumaraya2660 devil is pretty calm 😂

[@TIMVAL173]

you should join him for all eternity when judgement day comes

[@Trulyhit-w6l]

that gold man was an aspect of the presence so no one killed him

[@davidgrim5990]

The angels being 'men' missing their junk and just flying around nude makes them more horrifying then even biblical angels.

[@Nyrufa]

Uhh, biblical angels look like they belong on a fucking metal album cover.

[@SoRunThatYeMayObtain]

Maybe you are referring to the seraphims, cherubim, and the like. I don’t particularly think they’re angels, but in my opinion they’re spiritual beings. Angels are different from them. I think it was man that came up with this hierarchy of angels, and it isn’t biblical.

[@yamatonoryuujin4871]

@@SoRunThatYeMayObtain what do you mean even the angels in the bible describe their mortal form as mere veils, sheeps clothing to make them less threatening as their true form would horrify any mortal who sees them this is why most Angels say “Do not be afraid” as much as possible they don’t want to create a fearful atmosphere since any form they take they exude Power especially when they are only sent to deliver a message, but when they need to expand their authority they are allowed to on certain conditions. Plus the Human formed angels aren’t even accurate not all of them are like that in the book of Ezekiel, Isaiah, Psalm, Revelation they are clearly almost Alien looking and weird even when they deliver visions or Messages. Angels are spiritual beings thats literally what they are at their core as flesh and bone weren’t given to them that was reserved for Man, they don’t even bleed unless they’re Demons & Mankind after their betrayal, since blood became the currency of the soul, a price they pay for separating from God. Plus its not a Hierarchy I don’t know why people keep saying this as Seraphim and Cherubim are not a class in heaven, Micheal is a seraphim but he was also regarded as an Archangel and a Messenger Angel which goes for the other Seraphims who also sent messages and had roles as Archangels, so no it’s not a Hierarchy its more of a description of what they may look like and what they are tasked to do by God. They are all regarded as Heavenly Beasts some just have specific roles assigned to them by their father.

[@mariobadia4553]

@@yamatonoryuujin4871 you are saying that like these things are real

[@yamatonoryuujin4871]

@@mariobadia4553 okay...what am I supposed to do with this sentence? We're discussing their nature because we care about it, fictional or not that's not even relevant to the discussion we made, that's like saying "Wow you're discussing a story or creatures that you're interested in, why would you do that, what do you think they're real or something?"; if that's your stance I Respect it but in that case it'd be more logical and rational for you to not have said anything because what you've just said isn't a good argument or a good discussion to start off from, it's stupid and makes no real impact on the discussion we've had.

[@thedood9503]

The song is Sarajevo by Max Richter if anyone was looking.

[@OWO-xm1tm]

Thanks

[@xaviertsun5004]

Basically Lucifer aka the Devil defies God... Was there any surprise?

[@bluewulv]

What about Trigon? Isn't he WORSE than Luci?

[@SteveWilsonComic-Man]

@@bluewulv not even close. Morningstar could wave his hand and Trigon would die. Trigon is a Demon LORD... Lucifer Morningstar? he has no limitations.. he can grab reality and fly away with it pealing reality back, revealing the Void... Trigon is basically Spectre Tier.. Spectre's real name is Aztar he was one of the angels that followed Lucifer and was punished for it by losing his actual name and being forgotten by all, he then became The Wrath of God to atone for his sins, then Spectre was deemed too powerful to leave uncontrolled, so Michael Demiurgos cursed Spectre by linking him to a Mortal Soul which in my view limits Spectres limitless power by simply being unable to perceive limitless natures that one born before Time would have full memory and control of. not to mention the fact that Lucifer Morningstar in this multiverse CHOSE to rule over hell, he wasn't forsaken there, He can walk back into Heaven at any time, while Trigon is not capable of even getting past Heavens gates. same as Spectre. Raven being the daughter of Trigon, Also cannot even be near Heavens Gates for long, though she CAN teleport people right to it and even go there herself.. but she becomes damaged greatly by Heavens presence so she has to flee immediately. point being that Trigon doesn't even register compared to Lucifer Morningstar. same with Spectre. both are Aspects of God.. but only Lucifer has free will... Michael Demiurgos also acts on behalf of God at all times... though one could Argue that is his Choice to do so. Lucifer is equally as powerful as Michael Demiurgos.

[@drinksomestew8159]

@@bluewulv In terms of evilness yes because Trigon is born from pure evil. In terms of power it's not even a contest Lucifer stomps on trigon.

[@fictionfan4100]

@@drinksomestew8159 lucifer did save the world in his comics so he is not all bad trigon is an complete asshole

[@Amen-Magi]

But gabriel kick his ass

[@VoxGav-bd9rc]

Great Evil Beast, do that thing next.

[@MinscFromBaldursGate92]

Lucifer would destroy Rainbow Darkseid.

[@sup2078]

We all know

[@LordBeerusGodofDestruction]

In an instance too because he explored his darker powers while ruling over Hell.

[@lordbogdanoff5002]

Wtfs a *rainbow* darkseid

[@FatherFoxtrot]

@@lordbogdanoff5002 thanos

[@starbustergaming5651]

@@FatherFoxtrot no

[@brianedwards6733]

For those who don’t know, Gabriel was about to kill Lucifer. Yahweh saved him

[@Beerbottles123]

And also those who didn't know, Gabriel got his wings clipped by John Constantine with a chainsaw and his heart literally ripped out by a succubus who seduced him.

[@brianedwards6733]

@@Beerbottles123 What issue of Lucifer did this happen? Out of 75 issues Mike Carey wrote which one did that happen? Take your time

[@IvanMrsicStudio]

Hellblazer and Lucifer are part of the same DC/Vertigo universe.

[@brianedwards6733]

@@IvanMrsicStudio Dude that shit didn’t happen in the original series and isn’t canon. In fact, Gabriel makes a grand total of two appearances in the original series and both were flashbacks

[@langer8656]

Dude, nigga or whatever do you understand Lucifer wasn't trying to kill Gabriel he was just trying to handle him from going on the wrong path, nothing in the sense that refers to Gabriel being stronger than Lucifer, so that thing is irrelevant.

[@Manovgreatworth]

Despite the fact that the morning star was a perfect and beautiful creation one of Gods most precious Angels, he defied his master despite the fact that he had an immaculate habitat and had everything at his disposal under the power of his creator.. he decided to let his ego / vanity drive him into oblivion.. and when he realised that he had fallen so far from his creator's Grace (by his own free will) and there was no chance of redemption, he thought that he could drag humanity down to his own debt / depths in order to despite his creator

[@hollow-point8690]

CorronZenith revelation 12:7-9. Interesting to see Marvel’s interpretation of that

[@Manovgreatworth]

@@hollow-point8690 absolutely mate

[@InnerCityRocker]

That Pretty Much Somes It Up!☝🏽

[@JestersmilesStream]

@@hollow-point8690 Marvel's Lucifer is garbage...

[@alessioballoi5876]

Who says Lucifer seeks redemption ? All of his suffering don't derive directly from his rebellion, bur rather from his defeat. He wouldn't accept blind obedience but God doesn't allow any other kind of obedience, so he banishes him away along with all the other souls who agree with him. Gos has created both heaven and hell, and God has decided who goes to both, so Lucifer doesn't actually have the power to force any of us to do anything. If he is powerless, then all of our struggles come from God, not from Lucifer.

[@Jack-rj4kd]

I hoped for this for such a long time

[@guitarshred32]

Absolutely fascinating comic this is. want to read the full issue

[@liepasataite6102]

So in the tv series ,,lucifer" this is what the fall was like? Hell was a gift? Not a punishment? Because thats what amenadiel said to linda, and linda said that to lucifer in s1 ep6

[@juanmrealii2638]

Good call so true

[@imsplitz3401]

yeah the show is based on dc comics and this is exactly what happened

[@oneman7638]

Well God gives each what they desire in the end. To Lucifer and his angels, eternal torment in the lake of fire was given, away from God's presence, and away from life.

[@BOb-lu3pc]

This is a much more interesting story, and one that I wish the show kept, instead of trying to stay true to the Bible

[@kkhudezashikkha5907]

love your videos.

[@williamsierra5386]

The precens > lucifer

[@ian-gj8mc]

@Abhikrishna Ps the presence is the overvoid

[@ian-gj8mc]

@Abhikrishna Ps my bad, it's not even a living being, it's below the presence. also calm down ahaha, you getting a tad too mad at fictional characters. go outside. my comment wasn't even butthurt either, I was just stating something LOL

[@ian-gj8mc]

@Abhikrishna Ps overvoid isn’t even a real being

[@ian-gj8mc]

@Abhikrishna Ps they don’t come near the presence, hes literally the supreme god of the dc universe

[@ian-gj8mc]

@Abhikrishna Ps presence is above 💀

[@johnetheridge5833]

Where were the presence Lucifer Michael and all the warrior angels during all the crisis events

[@moisuomi]

Not giving af

[@jpf7942]

They usually don't involve themselves in events like that. They are still the top dogs of the DC multiverse. It doesn't affect them at all. Every crisis is Destiny. It was destined to happen. It's all written in Destiny of the Endless book

[@scottjordan9942]

Anyone know the name of the comic when he and demigorgus fought the presence together

[@thetruthshallsetyoufree.7999]

This is how many people like Lucifer Morningstar. 👇🏻

[@morning5tarr]

Interesting.

[@Hateful_Rex]

so im satanic??????

[@thetruthshallsetyoufree.7999]

kasra in the comics

[@Hateful_Rex]

@@thetruthshallsetyoufree.7999 i know just joking

[@satx.didi1]

They love me

[@lordbogdanoff5002]

Did any of y'all C the marvels new warriors. Rip marvel

[@peanutlover409]

*DeTeCtIvE*

[@LordBeerusGodofDestruction]

G-Squad49 I think he merged himself knowing his full power would destroy the very galaxy that Earth resides on just by existing.

[@user-xs8tx6gm3w]

Who’s more powerful Cosmic King Thor or Ghost Rider Zarathos?

[@cheeseburgerfreddy6350]

That would be a good battle

[@InnerCityRocker]

I would say Cosmic King Thor. If he can take the power cosmic From Galactus.. Then, I Don't See Ghost Rider Zarathos, As BAAAAD ASS Of A Power House As He Is, Over powering Thor especially while Thor would have the power cosmic from -GALACT- added to his Already Cosmic Knowledge that he inherited from Odin once he became King, The Odin Force, Thus Becoming The Thor Force, His God Blast, Muljnir and or Stormbreaker And His Regular Powers As Thor

[@nahumaraya2660]

Thor

[@GTOnizukaa]

CKT can’t kill Ghost Rider, GRZ penance stare say goodbye to Thor.

[@InnerCityRocker]

@@GTOnizukaa The penance stare will startle Thor for a LIL Bit but it won't keep Thor down. It wouldn't work on Thor like it has on others because Thor already snapped Out of that Penance Stare when God Doom put it on him right before receiving the Phoenix Force Into Muljnir When Thor Became.. ''KING PHOENIX: GOD OF FIRE-- at the end of the War Of The Realms Story Line I believe that was.

[@rodrigofilho1996]

in what edition did this happened? I have the books and i dont remember, i remember in number #50 he starts his rebellion.

[@johnetheridge5833]

Is the light guy supposed to be the presence?

[@satanico-saberdestroyer-pa8641]

El mensaje es claro, DIOS aqui no es mas que una marioneta de fuerzas superiores, los escritores xd

[@ernestobecerragomez2699]

Los escritores son los seres más poderosos de los cómics y la ficción en general .

[@erikcamacho575]

What book is this ?

[@onizgr77]

pre retcon beyonder vs luci ?

[@cheeseburgerfreddy6350]

Personally I'd say Beyonder in terms of raw power, Only way I see lucifer winning is if he smooth talks Beyonder into giving up or something

[@cheeseburgerfreddy6350]

@G-Squad49 That's what I was saying, If it was a raw power battle I think Lucifer would lose

[@TheBefox]

One is only second to TOAA, the other is only second to the Presence / Ellaine Belloc... I guess they are quite the same to me. Because Lucifer took the creation like a page in a book btw. That's just a lot more what LT or Beyonder has everdone to me. Bitch slapping LT and all the others abstracts is something, to me taking the creation as a book is an other

[@trevornaught5698]

Lucifer df

[@shadowman9836]

luci but pretty low diff...beyonder can be scaled above luci in power(even though i scale him below luci) but even if this really is true luci still is omniscient and and has irrelevant speed

[@Bruhntosaur]

Which series is this from?

[@OWO-xm1tm]

Lucifer from dc comics

[@ALEXXAlexisx]

Lucifer mornigstar vs beyonder pre retcon

[@godking1257]

@@preretconbeyonder7700 Lucifer created platonic concept and beyonder dosent possess those abilities.

[@brothersofwrath4785]

pre retcon beyonder>living tribunal=michael and lucifer

[@rehaan6428]

@@brothersofwrath4785 LOL. The living tribunal is equal to spectre. Lucifer and Michael both treat Spectre like a fly. Michael and Lucifer together would be just as strong, if not stronger than the Presence who is equal to TOAA since the presence directly gave each if’s them half of his power. Hell Lucifer created his own creation where he is omnipresent. Lucifer 2016 killed the Great evil beast who is the evil incarnation of Presence himself using the sword of eden.

[@brothersofwrath4785]

@@rehaan6428 equal! wtf living tribunal is 16 dimensional

[@rehaan6428]

qphs.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-49d740572df321fca59a0fd9dada848d Their jobs are pretty much the same anyways. The reason spectre doesn’t have that much good feats is because Michael the archangel cursed him to have a human host. When he doesn’t have a host, he is called as unbound spectre. The previous vengeance of God, Eclipso I think, caused a lot of destruction. Either way Lucifer scales way above living tribunal and has feats to put him ahead of the beyonder.

[@kebriaalitaimurjafri4990]

Where is amenadiel. The older brother of Lucifer , Michael and gabrial

[@isaaccortes6082]

It's diferent in the comics.

[@daipayandutta615]

amanediel is not the older brother of lucifer or michael or gabriel!....the tv series changed everything around,just like there is no mother goddess for the angels in the comics, presence/god created the first three archangels micahel,lucifer and gabriel and they were tasked to create everything in the entire DC verse!...god later created more angels for heaven/silver city and one of them was amanediel(he was a seraphim and was much much weaker than every archangel), btw in the comics lucifer did actually kill and eat his heart out just like he promised in season 1 episode 1 of lucifer tv series.

[@kebriaalitaimurjafri4990]

@@daipayandutta615 oookay

[@Beerbottles123]

Lucifer killed him in a duel.

[@suomalainenvoima]

@@daipayandutta615Amenadiel was an archangel too…. Just one that was formed later.

[@johnetheridge5833]

The presence said to lucifer someone made him.

[@gonzalez7935]

why hw calls him (samuel) when they are in hell?

[@gonzalez7935]

the presence call him (samuel).*

[@Talren-PU]

@@gonzalez7935 it was lucifers original name before he rebelled but after he rebelled he renamed himself lucifer morningstar to further distance himself from god

[@madlozano7575]

Lmao god tricked him into being a prisoner

[@FernandoComicsOfficial]

Yup, story of his life lol

[@yamatonoryuujin4871]

Not really he freakin allowed him to create his own version of Earth literally telling Adam and Eve to not listen and just decide themselves...in the end Lucifer even destroyed the World he himself created...so yeah it’s not really God’s fault Luci is just fucked up in his own right. He has other reasons why I think it involves Maz but yeah he obliterated that world and just came back to the World his father created and ran a freakin bar...so gg. Plus this Luci is different from the Show like a whole different dimension away. Edit: plus he acts like an entitled douche more so especially in the sandman comics you can see his arrogance show when he talks to one of the endless, but either way he is an interesting character alongside the endless and the Presence.

[@BladeOfLight16]

There was no trick. Lucifer simply wanted more than he could have.

[@MildManNerd]

Better to reign in Hell than to serve in Heaven.

[@poncearnel2950]

better to serve my God than to reign in hell...

[@hollow-point8690]

Revelation 12:7-9. Very interesting seeing marvel’s interpretation of this!

[@thedood9503]

@@hollow-point8690 *DC

[@thedood9503]

@@poncearnel2950 Your God is a wrathful, intolerant, incompetent, egotistical, misogynistic, homophobic, racist, malevolent bully and if he exists then he is not worthy of any worship or praise.

[@leonalushi3429]

@@thedood9503 Some guy quoted that, I remember.

[@thereaper6061]

Regulator Thanos can beat all of them So still marvel character is more powerful than DC character

[@75_86]

Not even close

[@cheeseburgerfreddy6350]

Both are equal in my opinion

[@preretconbeyonder7700]

Cosmic regulator Thanos can defeat everyone in fiction through all time. But still,at least dc's power hierarchy didn't get messed up like marvel. Marvel writers often depower many characters to create hype over their new characters.

[@preretconbeyonder7700]

If you wanna be a true fan, you'll have to respect both.

[@barbatos6407]

Regulator thanos doesn't even get past the godsphere