Lucrehulk vs Punic

[@ithinkimfunny9499]

Okay, what. You really give the UNSC the short end of the stick here. To me this fight is entirely based on if the Punic can drop the luckerhulks shields before it’s main batteries can get in range. The vulture droids don’t really pose a threat to the Punic because of its stupidly thick armor. I do agree that the longswords and frigates would be overrun but not before taking way more losses. More than in this video. So really the fight rests on the shields of the luckerhulk. Say it takes 3 shots for a Punic to take out a Cas. The luckerhulks shields would be say 5x more powerful. It would take the Punic 15 shots from its max to bring down the luckerhulks shields. That’s not even taking into account the frigates. The luckerhulk is more like a space station than in terms of movement than a battleship. Sure it would move but painfully slow. The Mac has incredible range and being in space doesn’t lose its power over distance. I think the luckerhulk is in for a real fight. This video caught my attention because it was a seemingly close fight to my knowledge of both ships. If your just going to give the luckerhulk these over powered shields that would rival those defending planets than what’s the point. All the tension is lost if the Punic can’t do anything. Look, I admit I am definitely biased here. I love the Punic, it had the prowess of being one of the few human ships that could stand up to the covenant. It’s ability to carry frigates and having secondary mini macs clearly inspired the design of the infinity. giving it this unfair fight just doesn’t sit well with me.

[@jklncolpetzer]

I think we all can agree the sins of the prophets Punic is the best version

[@zetoboogaloo8802]

In lore the turbo lasers of capital ships could cause nuclear scale explosions. That's a fuck tone of energy and the shields are ment to take a barrage for hours. I think we know who the winner is. And the blasters on those vultures while maybe not powerful can cause electrical issues in the enemy ship if targeting specific points.

[@ithinkimfunny9499]

@@zetoboogaloo8802 I’m not too savvy on Star Wars lore but if what you are saying is the case, then this whole comparison is pointless if the technology difference is so great. It’s like comparing a modern destroyer to an 18th century ship-of-the-line. I was assuming that the luckerhulk was similar to what we see on screen which would make this fight much more even

[@zetoboogaloo8802]

@@ithinkimfunny9499 well the star wars galaxy literally has fleets of giant ships that fire plasma. And can travel across the galaxy in literal days. I think it’s not that far if a jump.

[@stratoreyener461]

Did someone forgot star wars shields are quite useless at stopping physical progectiles at high speeds?

[@unknownsierra6297]

The punics super MACs were nearly that of a ODP and we see them rip through even a CAS class battlecrusier the frigates yes would ultimately be overwelmed but not without putting up a good fight especially due to the vultures lack luster of anti warship armaments. All while this happened longswords have 120mm miniguns these would surely shread most vultyre droids and they go mach 9 so theyre extremely hard to catch combind this with rear turrets and theyre a big issue but maybe if swarmed will get taken down. Punic meanwhile is keeping up the ,MAC barrage supported by missiles and the deadly anti Capital ship breakwater coil guns would be pounding the lurkrhulk as point defences fend of the most likely now clustered vultures afew missiles would be fired at them too also punic had mini MACs that would also come into play thus overwelming even the mighty lukrehulk

[@unknownsierra6297]

Note:i love star wars clone era and halo HCW era equally its just theres alot more to the punic that made even CAS classes think carefully about weather to attack.

[@kinkade6710]

1,000 Vulture Droids could unleash a swarm of missiles the Punic would be woefully unable to defend against. In an actual engagement the Frigates and Longswords would be orphans in short order

[@jboydayz]

Well the punic could lunch thousands of missles in response and not to mention it's point defence and mini MACS.

[@Genesongx]

Ray shields cannot block physical weapons, also: "It is theorized that if a ship's armor or shields were to absorb all the kinetic energy of a super MAC round, the release of thermodynamic energy would still vaporize the ship" -Super MAC MkV description Take in count one super mac shot has enough power to go through 2 covenant capital ships will full shields and severely cripple the third one, covenant ships are resiliant asf so who knows. It seems very likely to one shot the lucrehulk yes or yes, with shield or without it

[@amirhaikal6672]

@@kinkade6710 the battle is quite dependent on what the punics were carrying. if the punics were carrying stalwart frigates or gladius corvettes maybe the punics could win

[@jboydayz]

You forgot about the nukes of the punic.

[@scottbaase4042]

The CIS droid fighters don't have shields, and short swords can carry nukes. While nukes cant scratch the paint on the lucrehulk, entire wings of droid fighters can be neutralized by the fighter complement alone. All frigates are also supplied with 3 Shiva nuclear warheads for their missiles. The Punic class probably Carrie's more, for her compliment of long sword fighters. While I appreciate your videos, and to a larger extent your channel, the truth of the matter is that the UNSC has the fighter, range, and numbers advantage. In this scenario, I would much rather want to be the UNSC rather than the CIS. Thank you, keep up the good work.

[@Halogamething]

This seemed bad how did the droid carrier take ALMOST 109 MACS AND SHIELDS NOT GO DONE THIS DONT MAKE SINCE (not 109 macs it was exaggerated but dang)

[@MeddlerPropagandist14]

The lucerhulk would get 3 shotted💀💀

[@eyesofstatic9641]

Those PDCs will shred the vulture droids

[@robertharris6092]

Physical projectiles ignore ray shields in star wars... a single shot from its super mac would literally shoot clean through the lucrehulk and the battle would be over the second the punic fires. Lightsabers also cant block physical projectiles and the projectile is liquified and hits the jedi.

[@spacemichael1177]

Agreed

[@leojosevicaldoo7343]

Well that is if they assume that they are using energy based weapons. But know the UNSC star wars is in for a punch in the balls.

[@robertharris6092]

@@leojosevicaldoo7343 how? Theres nothing they can do to make the shields block a physical projectile.

[@reentrysfs6317]

@@leojosevicaldoo7343 there Are particle shielding but it is made only to withstand small things like asteroids not super macs going at 4% of light speed with 3500 tons of mass

[@joshuamendez9621]

I disagree, a barrage of mac rounds wouldve definetly defeat the lucrehulk's shields.

[@FirstPassOfficial]

They could potentially, but it really depends on the level of power that MAC’s actually punch at. But even so, given a militarized Lucrehulk’s shields could tank entire fleets of Star Destroyers, it just pushed it over the edge for me. It would definitely be a close one though.

[@timmyhoward6638]

@@FirstPassOfficial Hmm, what about nuclear torpedoes? And what if the Punic and it's escorts coordinated fire all at once on a single point on the Lucerehulk's shields and then follow up with a concentrated missile bombardment of the bridge or reactor

[@FirstPassOfficial]

Fair enough, that would be another avenue for victory for the Punic. I’m still thinking the Lucrehulk would win out more often, but I’d lower the odds to 5.5/10 for than my previous 7/10. Its shields are still ridiculously powerful even by Star Wars standards.

[@grandmofftarkin8519]

The Lucrehulks shields are the best 4 a warship under 10 kilometers

[@kinkade6710]

Now you're just cherry picking. The Frigates punch in the low double digit kiloton range and can fire roughly twice a minute. The droid fighters would swarm them before they could fire more than a handful of rounds. The Super MAC on the Punic is the only real threat...and even then the Lucrehulk outguns it considerably.

[@lonewolf8585]

Most unsc ships engage enemy vessels around 100,000 km

[@bennuredjedi]

This didn't make any sense, a Super Mac could gut Covenant Capital Ships that had better shields than Star Wars shielding so how can a less shielded vesse compared to Covenant standards "tank" Multiple SMAC rounds (twin SMAC) and come out unscathed nah not buying that if anything the Punic would have taken a beating but not a loss unless you saying that Covenant shields are weaker than Star wars and if so you really have to explain that tid bit because Covenant shields although weaker than Forerunner shielding is almost close to it and anyone that know about the Forerunners know that they are essentially God like in terms of technology and the Star Wars universe have no one anywhere near that caliber outside of space magic (the force) lol

[@castlebarron1788]

didnt even count the nuclear ordnance that the punic carries not to mention that of the frigates, last resort move but we have seen high powered explosives are able to not only tear apart star wars shields but severely damage if not destroy the vessel protected by such measures, thus increasing odds in favor of the UNSC as the separatist were not known to use such tactics in regular warfare at least in capital ship engagements.

[@aroventalmav888]

Eh, for one Star Wars has never really quantified it's shield strengths well, and for two there are different kinds of shields. Ray shielding was the most topical in-setting due to most weapons being energy based, and particle shielding. Generally Particle shielding was not a priority beyond being able to tank what they could reasonably expect to run into. I do not think that even a war-time lucrehulk would have the particle shielding to tank more than a salvo or two of SuperMAC fire, much less a coordinated bombardment of the frigates and archer swarms on top of that.

[@gunfumaster1024]

Honestly I think they're fairly evenly matched, maybe to the point where the Punic has a slight edge. The Lucrehulk is SLOW, much slower than a lot of what the UNSC has to offer, and if I were the captain of the Punic knowing my enemy was shielded, I would keep my vessel at range as much as possible since that's where I have the advantage with the super MACs. The Punic has much much better range capability, and although Star Wars turbolasers are ridiculously powerful they also have very short range compared to what Halo has to offer. Also, the Lucrehulk would be unable to evade MAC fire, but to it's credit, it would be able to last quite a while against the UNSC's MAC barrage. I'd say it's 50/50 whether the Lucrehulk would be able to get in effective range of its turbolasers versus a MAC round fucking its shit up. With the Paris-class frigates, each frigate held 40 Archer missile pods, with 30 missiles per pod, so that's 1200 missiles per frigate. These missile pods were originally designed as anti-capital ship weaponry, as they're very smart and will actively avoid enemy point defense systems. However, the UNSC found out it's much better to use these against the tougher shielded Covenant fighters, as the very high yield meant that it had a much greater chance of blowing apart their fighters. Now, when we have 4 heavy frigates, that's 4800 archer missiles just from the frigates alone, and if we include the Punic's Archer complement which is 300 pods, that's 13,800 Archer missiles in total. Reason why I bring this up is because Vulture droids compared to Covenant fighters are outclassed. They're very inexpensive, but they were designed to basically be expendable. They have (comparatively speaking) weak blaster weapons, a small missile complement, and although possessing ungodly agility thanks to being drones, their durability is questionable to say the least. One archer missile would not have a problem potentially destroying multiple Vultures per explosion. If I were an enemy commander, I would not want to send out 1500 Seraphs much less 1500 Vultures against a potential 13,800 Archer missiles. I think the UNSC would have a very easy time wiping out the Vulture droids even without help of a wing of Longsword fighters. Now, if the Lucrehulk were sending, let's say 1500 ARC-170's and/or Y-wings, fighters and bombers that had very strong shielding as well as extremely high-yield weaponry, then I think the UNSC fleet would be absolutely screwed. A big reason the Rebellion was so successful against the Galactic Empire, and you can even relate this to the Galactic Republic fighting the Trade Federation, is that the Galactic Republic and the Rebellion had much better starfighters. The TIE-series were almost all unshielded until the introduction of the First Order, and aside from the expensive Droid Tri-fighter, the CIS were seriously behind when it came to individual starfighters and had to almost entirely rely on their superior numbers and swarm tactics to combat ARC-170's, V-wings, Actis interceptors, etc. I gotta say, I absolutely love the channel and the content. Keep the great work up!

[@gunfumaster1024]

Also, another thing to note, combining the recoil of the SuperMAC's and reverse thrusters should be about the same acceleration as a Lucrehulk-class battleship. The Lucrehulks apparently were over 10 times slower than most heavy warships in the Star Wars universe.

[@kinkade6710]

There were slower in Atmosphere and marginally slower in STL...but held their own in Hyperspace. Either way, the Punic can't fire enough MAC rounds to snipe the Lucrehulk before it's fighters could gut the ship.

[@gunfumaster1024]

​@@kinkade6710 I mean I already made my point in my original comment, but Vulture droids are swarm fighters, good swarm fighters, but swarm fighters nonetheless. UNSC armor is bullshit thick compared to Star Wars armor because Star Wars had superior shield technology, at the time. There is no way 1500 Vulture droids could make it in time to deliver bombs to the UNSC battle group. 300 fully equipped Longsword fighters wouldn't have a terrible time against vultures, mostly since they were the only non-shielded UNSC fighters that could actually directly combat vastly technologically superior Covenant shielded Seraph fighters, and also the fact that they carry nuclear ordnance on board in the form of either stealth mines or missiles. On top of that, the UNSC would be launching ridiculous amounts of Archer missiles toward the Vultures. Archer missiles were originally smart capital ship killing missiles able to avoid point defense fire, however were quickly rendered obsolete in that role due to Covenant laser beam point defense systems and shielding. They were re-purposed to fend off against shielded Seraph fighters, since they could maneuver very well and had a massive payload capable of blowing right through strike craft shielding. In the absolute worst case scenario, the UNSC have a little more than 9 missiles per vulture droid, but in reality because of the huge payload you'd see single archer missiles destroying multiple vulture droids. Hyperspace doesn't matter in this context, he said we weren't using hyperspace jumps.

[@TheDude50447]

If you run away, shoot, then run away again youll be always facing max shields. The shields will tank and regenerate until the mac gun is out of rounds.

[@gunfumaster1024]

@@TheDude50447 Yes, you're exactly right. But the Punic has a range on a whole other order of magnitude over the Lucrehulk. Heck, even the point defense guns on the Punic have more range than the turbolasers of the Lucrehulk. So the Punic can stay out of range while constantly bombarding the Lucrehulk.

[@angerskarin9222]

I dont think this is right, the punic mac fire a 3000 tons slug at 4% the speed of light, they can go through multiple shielded covenant ships, so there no way that flying donut can tank mac from frigate and the super mac combined, one shot maybe but multiple? no way.

[@FirstPassOfficial]

When the Punic faced enemy capital ships, it could face similar sized or smaller with a decent chance at surviving the engagement, though it was still uphill battle even with the MAC’s. I’ve come to the view that EU Star Wars shielding is as or more powerful than Covenant shielding, so that on top of Lucrehulk’s holding off multiple enemy capital ships since the redesign. Its a close match in my opinion, though the level power scaling in EU pushes it in favor of the Lucrehulk.

[@angerskarin9222]

@@FirstPassOfficial if the shield was as or even a bit more powerfull a full power super mac shot would go through it like butter, and the punic was the only unsc ship who could fight on even ground with the covenant.

[@FirstPassOfficial]

Punic’s were very much one of the only UNSC ship to be able to take on Covenant warships. But even so, an ODP Super-MAC is considerably more powerful and fire far more often than the Punic’s own, primarily due to limitations of mobile vs ground based power generation. So while it could fire very powerful shots that could punch through smaller Covenant vessels, the Punic would still have to avoid engagement with a large capital ship due to the lack of sufficient firepower and only TiA2 armor protecting it. All that being said, power scaling for Halo and Star Wars is quite varied with higher end Halo able to handily win against similar Star Wars vessels. Its all conjecture, to be honest, to which is why I tried to balance the power scaling roughly equally. I probably should’ve guessed there would be a lot of pushback from my conclusion, but then again its perfectly reasonable to say the Punic wins based on one’s head-canon for power scaling should be higher than Star Wars.

[@kinkade6710]

Even Covenant Frigates could withstand a single MAC round. The Lucrehulk is a vastly technologically superior ship. The only reason this is a fight at all is because the Punic mounts a high yield long range weapon and Disney Murdered the range of TurboLasers in TLJ. TPM era Turbolasers (or barring that even the Quad Lasers ) can easily engage at 1,000k.The DS1 Fired on Alderan from 75,000k away.

[@yoshikiharo1020]

@@FirstPassOfficial You think Star Wars Spacecraft's Shields are stronger because they are designed to stop common blasters for countless years. Also you forgot to mention the Broadswords.

[@spacemichael1177]

I dont relly argree beacuse of punic's rediculus mac guns they have at The low estimate power of 54 gigatons of tnt [ wach instalation 00 vid for explanation ] but i liked the video

[@gloccry2184]

Name a single CIS defence againts a ship with more nuclear weapons than the active global nuclear stockpile of Earth 2021

[@gloccry2184]

Better yet, a single missile.

[@FirstPassOfficial]

I’ll raise you an asteroid-strike tanking particle shield.

[@owentaylor8700]

Interesting match up!

[@JeanLucCaptain]

The Gundam universe features some interesting and mostly realistic designs that would match well vs Expanse or B5 EA ships. EFSF SCVA-76 Nahel Argama vs the MCRN Donniger!

[@battleship6049]

If the ship doesn't have shielding, it's not going to stand up to a lucrehulk battleship. Specifically the numerous turbolasers will melt through capital grade armor of star wars quality which is already a high level. So the video is pretty accurate to how the fight would go ultimately. To the other commentors. You have to understand Star Wars vs Halo is generally not fair considering the power rating of star wars vessel able to have. A Imperator alone uses more power than a planet in a single hyper space jump. The reactor of the Imperator can be and has been described as a mini star. Imperators as well are capable of great speeds with a acceleration of at least 2300Gs. This number also comes from the mobility needed to move from what we see in the movies such as Endor. A ISD power output is insane at 7.73 x 10^24 Watts as well. Even going off Covenant ships, the common Star Wars capital vessel will be able to take on some of the heaviest ships the Halo verse has to offer. That's disregarding the other feats and technical details that SW has as well. A blaster in star wars, like Han Solo's blaster has the power of a grenade if not more so and is able to blast off walls quite easily. Wookie's bowcaster is more like a 20mm cannon with the force it can hit. Starfighter lasers are in the range of a explosive yield of a ton of TNT if not more. Capital ships have turbolasers which can turn a planet's surface into glass in just a day. The Death Star as well is insane in power output. The station is able to put out more power than the sun will in a million years considering the power of the superlaser and what is needed. Star wars shields as well are nothing to scoff at either. Still being able to stop physical and energy projectiles alike. In the end, you can put halo vs SW but the only chance I see is Forerunners vs SW. Infinity is a big doubt even if fighting something like a Victory II Star Destroyer

[@castlebarron1788]

so i feel your assesment of the scenario would be accurate, up into the point of the lukrehulk closing within 600k kliks, seeing the enemy tank shots but unable to effectively engage even the most junior strategist would know to pull an all aft thrust package thus keeping macs on target and making it far more time consuming and difficult for the lukrehulk to close within range, keep in mind were talking distances measred in hundreds of kilometers the ground the lukrehulk would make during the span of time to stop forward movement and then begin reversing would be almost ineffective to the outcome of the engagement. neither ships are speed demons but lukrehulks are portrayed as especially slow when you compare footage and lore of a star destroyer (IS1 or 2) to a lukrehulk even star destroyers seem to be far more manueva=erable then they actually are. lukrehulks are un weildy ships to pilot while the punics detriment is only its sheer tonnage with no special difficulty ever mentioned to manuever the vessel in lore since it never appears in any iteration on screen. i would call it for the punic 6 out of 10 depending on when the ship begins to reverse (the earlier the better but hubris is a hell of a drug)

[@goldeagle6431]

Great analysis!

[@dianavespid937]

The quality of your video is amazing! You deserve a lot more subs.

[@FirstPassOfficial]

Thank you! That means a lot :)

[@kinkade6710]

This Scenario is ridiculous. You gave the Punic escorts....and then had the Lucrehulk just sit there and tank dozens of MAC hits. The only way this plays out is if the commander is functionally inept. You then had it engage the Escorts with only fighters....and even then only with light blasters, entirely ignoring missiles. The Longswords magically take out 10X their number of fighters and the Punic STILL hasn't taken a single hit. Then, and only then, the Lucrehulk closes to point blank range and guts the Punic with short range weaponry.....instead of acting like the carrier it is...and obliterating it's enemies from afar with it's fighter carried missiles and long range turbo lasers.

[@FirstPassOfficial]

Punic physically carries in those escorts on its underside, they’re not brought in independently. Both vessels are incredibly slow, so the Lucrehulk has to cross the distance at such speed and tank the rounds. One thing that has to be understood with Star Wars weapons is that they’re almost universally very short ranged, to the point of a few dozen to maybe a hundred kilometers, and yes especially for turbolasers. To that point, it can only bring its full firepower once its within that firing range to get into cqb. Vulture droid fighters engaging the Punic would do little to damage it, but could pose a serious threat to the smaller frigates, thus they’re primaried by them. The Longswords engaging them weren’t doing it alone, they use heavy combat support from the Frigates and Punic’s point defense guns and defensive missile fire. Vultures, en-mass, could moderately threaten a lone Punic, but with its onboard Frigates and Longswords, they’d be stretched thin. Even the heaviest weapons a Vulture carries are a nuisance to 4 km supercarrier. This leaves the comparatively short range Lucrehulk’s turbolasers as the best way to take it out, with the Vultures keeping the Frigates and Longswords busy.

[@Matt-yg8ub]

@@FirstPassOfficial Ignoring the fact that if the vulture droids deployed buzz droid missiles they could literally disassemble the Punic’s weapons turrets and there would be almost nothing they could do to defend against that....The hyperdrive on the Luckrehulk puts it in the unique situation of being able to drop out of hyperspace 6 o’clock high and pound the Punic with a turbo lasers from point blank range while essentially being outside the Punic’s own primary weapons arc. Time and time and time again, seraph class fighters were a threat to UNSC vessels....Here, the scenario simply ignores the CIS fighters as irrelevant by fiat....That is unrealistic at best and dishonest at worst since the luckrehulk is built around its fighter screen. We see in episode one that a Luckrehulk can engage at several hundred miles with its TLs. This scenario is very one-sided Because the Luckrehulk has multiple capitol targets to engage....AND The nature of the Punic. Compared to a SW ship it’s a glass cannon. It has one giant heavy weapon, that if it gets off the first shot will do tremendous damage to the enemy...But it would succumb very quickly to enemy fire.

[@reentrysfs6317]

@@Matt-yg8ub fighters in halo aren’t good Because point defense weaponry nearly neutralizes them The only was to use fighters effectively is to give the fighters nukes to do good damage The other way is to go into point blank range so the point defense is confused and is less effective

[@reentrysfs6317]

@@Matt-yg8ub I mean you could say the same to the lucrehulk in this scenario As particle shielding is meant to stop hundred ton asteroids going at 10.000 kilometers per hour Not several thousand ton projectiles going at 16.200.000 kilometers per hour

[@robertharris6092]

The punic can also turn around and burn hard away from the lucrehulk then rotate back around. Thus going backwards at top zpeed while facing the lucrehulk.

[@sanejingliufan]

Do UNSC Infinity to make this more fair

[@amirhaikal6672]

... no the infinity would win. not just the infinity is bigger it carry 10 strident frigates all of which is shielded against energy based projectiles, the infinity also carry a fuckton of broadsword which is a lot superior to the longswords

[@christophermarshall4080]

UNSC Paris Class vs MCRN Donnager

[@СашаКумылганов]

I disagree completely, SW shields at the time of the end of the clone wars were energy shields, corposcular (against physical objects) were VERY uncommon thus MAC cannon would gut most of Sw ships, while I agree that should the lucrehalk get in to range the outcome would become dicy

[@josesanchezrodriguez1783]

At 3:09 you literally see the Lucrehulk's shields stop proton torpedos which are physical projectiles and stated to be able to go through energy shields

[@josesanchezrodriguez1783]

The Punic could win by employing the classic Marg Sabl maneuver

[@grandmofftarkin8519]

Lucrehulk ez pz especially with 1500 annoying ass vulture droids

[@spacemichael1177]

Not that easy starwars energy shileds don't protect from projectile weapons it depends how you interpret that