Should the MAC Expand?

With the departure of Northern Illinois, the Mid-American Conference feels significantly put off-kilter, which is a bad thing to be in the modern age of college sports. A return of the UMass Minutemen does nothing to potentially quell the fears of the Toledo Rockets, Ohio Bobcats, and Buffalo Bulls, who may choose to jump ship if another conference, such as the Mountain West or American, comes calling.
So the conversation immediately shifts to whether or not the MAC should expand, and if they do, to where and with whom. Top names include Western Kentucky and Middle Tennessee State, who were minutes away from joining the conference in 2021 before the Conference USA stabilized by sucking in a whole bunch of FCS teams, and the two new teams added to the CUSA---Missouri State and Delaware. But more often than not, the conversation shifts to FCS programs, like North Dakota State, South Dakota State, Youngstown State, and Eastern Kentucky.
In this video, I use a controversial formula of my own creation to see if it works at predicting future MAC conference members, and make some surprising and somewhat interesting discoveries.
Chapters:
0:00 Intro
1:51 Schools and Methods
4:15 Too Whack for MAC
5:57 Western Kentucky Hilltoppers
6:26 Middle Tennessee State Blue Raiders
6:53 Missouri State Bears
7:13 Delaware Blue Hens
7:45 Rhode Island Rams
8:15 New Hampshire Wildcats
8:37 Duquesne Dukes
9:00 Dayton Flyers and Youngstown State Penguins
10:00 SUNY Albany Great Danes
10:22 Indiana State Sycamores
10:52 Illinois State Redbirds
11:21 Southern Illinois Salukis
11:43 Eastern Kentucky Colonels
12:03 The Formula
13:07 Results
13:49 Disagreements
14:22 Findings

[@stevenvitte]

I made a video about this a couple weeks ago on my STVCastle channel. (Bobcat Corner 035) It's as good a theory as any to believe that the MAC added UMass back because they're going to further expand in the New England area. I doubt UMass would rejoin the MAC if they knew they'd be the only Northeastern school in the conference for many years. Otherwise, I don't see why UMass was brought back. Also, I think you underestimate the potential of both Albany and Rhode Island. Yes, they have issues but so does pretty much every other school on your list. If you're the MAC, you need to bridge the travel gap to make schools like UMass and Buffalo happy. Albany and Rhode Island have strong enough arguments to at least discuss more.

[@hypnosemblem8829]

Especially if you throw in a team like Maine or even New Hampshire to further solidify it

[@limitlessmdrt]

@ You would need both Maine and New Hampshire because they are attatched at the hip. That rivalry is major up here in all sports.

[@GreenHornet553]

Could the MAC go Northeast and South at the same time? Meaning, could the MAC grab Albany, Rhode Island, Western Kentucky, AND Middle Tennessee?

[@TobiPadwick]

honestly I think they MAC schools should start considering expansion with the idea of a future schism coming that could mitigate costs and allow them to compete. When I look at the MAC, I see a handful of really good schools and a handful of traditional MAC schools who like just hanging around in the FBS ranks. The old rules were something like if you had 6 schools that had played together for 5 years they could form a new conference and get an NCAA tourney auto bid. I think it was the 5-6-7 rule... 7 was they had to pull one more member if I recall. obviously with the PAC situation, rules are a lot more pliable these days, but considering the power 2 don't want more conferences at the FBS level.....hmm. But that rule would have schools in a 12+ team conference considering a MWC stye breakaway.... AND in that instance I would argue it makes sense for ALL the MAC schools. its a weird idea, but swallow a shroom and come with me. NIU left. Toledo is considering it. Ohio seems a step above most MAC schools. Buffalo thought of going but didn't get an offer. UMASS had to bleed out for years to get them to come. MTSU said they would rather stay in a 3 team conference than join the MAC. why? because the bottom tier of the MAC likes the MAC the way it is. Lets think about Delaware jumping to the MAC and NIU NOT bailing. What if Delaware, UMass, Buffalo, Ohio, Toledo, and NIU split off to form a "greater MAC" in a few years? Imagine the two conferences basically beling allied in all the non-revenue sports to minimize costs, but in the two revenue sports being divided between schools chasing the dragon of increasing athletic budgets and schools content to be the traditional doormat FBS entrance level conference in the rustbelt MAC. I could see the greater mac with Delaware, UMass, Buffalo, Ohio, Toledo, and NIU joined by Western Kentucky, Middle Tennessee, Missouri State, Illinois State, Southern Illinois, North Dakota State, South Dakota State, Stony Brook, Dayton, and WIlliam & Mary... I don't know lots of good candidates out east. A west of the great lakes division formed from MVC bones and an Ohio east division with big eastern markets. I could see a conference with some good revenue sports garnering good attention.. I can also see a lesser MAC with Ball State, W. MIchigan, E. Michigan, C. Michigan, Bowling Green, Akron, Kent State, and Miami joined by schools like Indiana State, Youngstown State, Maine, Rhode Island, New hampshire, Albany, Vermont, Wayne State, Richmond, and Grand Valley State. No knock intended to any of these schools. Maybe you could excite the fans by having a delegation and promotion mechanism? fun thought.

[@lutrid]

Youngstown State to the MAC just sounds so right

[@samuelskillern7365]

It kind of fits the "Mid-American" part, too. I still think athletic conferences need to be regional rather than profit-seeking. That seems to be a losing argument, though.

[@mrclean30]

they already have like 7 ohio teams

[@lutrid]

@@samuelskillern7365 indeed it does

[@lutrid]

@@mrclean30 exactly lol

[@samuelskillern7365]

@mrclean30 6, but I get your point; but I just don't see a school in Delaware, Rhode Island, or Massachusetts joining an athletic conference that originally was "Mid-American". I honestly see WKU and MTSU joining. SIU Carbondale and ISU would be neat, but are pipe dreams.

[@tylerclifton4759]

EKU is the right next to a Bucees, I think that’s worth considering

[@M_11_m41n]

Western Kentucky is not going to let them move up.

[@tylerclifton4759]

@ Buc-ee will have some stern words then 😂

[@scmcguire53]

Sadly those copycats at WKU are getting a Buccees of their own nearby.

[@ReinSouls]

@@M_11_m41n Correct. That's why Conference USA passed on them. But the Toppers don't have a say if EKU moves up to the MAC.

[@M_11_m41n]

@@ReinSouls It's not just that they don't want them in the MAC or any conference, but Western Kentucky does not want Eastern Kentucky in the FBS at all. Yeah, certain universities in certain states actually have the power to reject other schools or universities from upgrading themselves, like what Duke and North Carolina is doing to East Carolina.

[@anthonyburnett2196]

Hey I really love your videos; since I've watched them I started doing research on histories of high school leagues in my home state of Massachusetts, and making wiki articles for the ones that don't have them yet. Thanks for the inspiration and the awesome content!

[@Hardle.W]

o7.

[@Ruzzy821]

Idk why I enjoy it it’s nerdy but interesting

[@chasmeinecke4322]

The MAC’s strength has always been they are aware of and have embraced their identity and build around that. They realize their colleges are not gonna attract power conferences because they don’t have national brand appeal but they have loyal regional followers. They attract 2-3 star talent that get to experience college life and enjoy playing in competitive sports while knowing that winning a MAC title is the best they can achieve with an understanding and acceptance of that. MAC schools don’t have a delusion that they have a big enough brand like some of these other schools that are leftovers for struggling power conference that reluctantly accept them, just to stay afloat. They are what they are and it works for them.

[@M_11_m41n]

In this day and age, no conference in the FBS can stay in place anymore with how radioactive it is at this point.

[@royjones3329]

Albany seems like an underrated option being in the SUNY system and close to umass. Would possibly give way to more eastern expansion in the future such as Rhode Island or New Hampshire.

[@Sawyerdoesstuff]

yes this. considering i live near albany, it would be huge if they move to the mac. it would make sense too as maybe a replacement to buffalo if they leave.

[@royjones3329]

@@Sawyerdoesstuffwas thinking this as I live in Albany too could be a factor in Buffalo staying considering the rivalry. I also think stony Brook should’ve been considered as an option for MAC expansion as well

[@peterdenten]

Ok hear me out, WKU is located in Bowling Green Kentucky, when WKU plays BGSU, we call it the battle of the Bowling Greens. Boom half a million in the bank.

[@aarondersnah863]

Not to mention, WKU is the Hilltoppers and Western Michigan used to be the Hilltoppers before switching to Broncos in 1939.

[@jarjr2229]

I think getting ISU would be massive for the MAC. The conference stays in Illinois, ISU has a massive enrollment and alumni base. Distance is the only thing hurting them tbh, but they're not absurdly far away from the likes of WMU, CMU, EMU, Ball State, and the Ohio schools. Not to mention that ISU has that MAC school vibes, big party schools with good vibes.

[@M_11_m41n]

@@jarjr2229 But, Illinois State would rather stay in the Missouri Valley Conference for basketball reasons and they get more money being in that conference and I don't think they would like being separated from their rival in Bradley.

[@jarjr2229]

@ Teams outside their respective conferences can always play against each other in both CFB and CBB. MAC needs to find a way to increase revenue split though

[@jameslavine6798]

ISU is the perfect fit, it's just the matter of having the 5m to make the jump. I always here the MVC basketball argument, but they haven't made a tourney since 98! No reason to stay bc you're a "basketball school" when you SUCK at basketball! Football is king, they need to make the jump before Dakotas head to MW

[@M_11_m41n]

@@jameslavine6798 It's not just basketball, Illinois State is a full member of the Missouri Valley Conference, including the football entity that is separate in a sense. And for some schools, they're better off not moving up. The 4 Dakota schools are not going to move up either because they have a lot of other issues that they have to deal with before they think about moving up to the FBS.

[@uaw602]

Crazy before the video the first school I thought of was ISU. But you're right basketball is kinda a big deal in Bloomington-Normal. Even though they kinda suck.

[@Nohandleentered]

They should make another play for MTSU and WKU. Get schools already in D1 and force CUSA to deal with the headache of moving teams up and fees and such

[@M_11_m41n]

@@Nohandleentered Unfortunately, Conference USA has already signed a Grant Of Rights deal with its members and I think they resigned themselves to be a feeder conference which will be a platform for FCS schools.

[@griffinhays2053]

Dalukes AND Empire on the same day? LFG

[@gocubs1815]

I was a manager for Western Michigan Basketball in the 00's. The Proximity score makes sense. Anyone who says otherwise hasn't ever been on an 8 hr bus ride for a 1 night road trip to Buffalo NY in late January

[@LoganHewell]

Completely different take, IF the SunBelt were to expand again, I’d keep an eye on Ohio. The SunBelt thrives on regional rivalries and pairing them back with Marshall would be interesting seeing they aren’t that far apart if I remember correctly.

[@ChrisBennetts]

You videos are extremely interesting, as is the research necessary to produce them... thank you..

[@kylethomas2993]

I think they should add Illinois State, Western Kentucky and Middle Tennessee

[@maskedpower4736]

You should do these “disaster scenarios” for every conference🔥🔥🔥

[@Mookiethedog21]

Love it!

[@TobiPadwick]

agreed! I don't always agree because sometimes you are saying insane things like leaving Stony Brook off your candidate list, but I do really like your videos. Big fan. More content!!!!!

[@limitlessmdrt]

New Hampshire and Maine are also attatched at the hip, so that is one that would be tricky. But EKU though, man thats a good squad (Im from Maine and a UMaine fan and an EKU Student)

[@M_11_m41n]

@@limitlessmdrt Western Kentucky is not going to let that happen.

[@limitlessmdrt]

@@M_11_m41n If WKU aint moving to the MAC, then EKU can very easily make the move without them blocking. But that rivalry would also be good to bring back as seen with what happened this year off the field and the attention that came from it, so it very well could happen.

[@holsum1holloway482]

Man thank you so much for all the effort you put into these informative videos. I am officially putting you on notification and can’t wait to watch even more content. Us Bison fans and Alum love your channel 🤘🏾

[@TobiPadwick]

another fabulous piece of work although your consistent schilling for albany over stony brook kills me. :) great job, man.

[@tylerwilliams8455]

There’s a few problems with Indiana State that makes them undesirable, but they could be fixed if the university were to go in the right direction in the coming years. A) declining student population = less money overall, but we have a new university president that’s focusing on enrollment efforts rn. B) We are a basketball school, the only way this gets changed is if the football team makes some deep playoff runs, if they increase their recruiting range this could help and having those deeper playoff runs means more money into the athletic program. C) The stadium is awkward but if you’ve been there you’d know that there is clear room for expansion of it, but that will only come with more team success and a larger athletics budget.

[@williamdiehl117]

As an ISU alum, the other major issue is that the stadium is so far from campus. At least when I was a student it was not easy to get out to a game unless you had a car. I agree that the ties to the Valley are strong, but to solve the "Western Expansion" problems the MAC could bring in both ISU's. (Illinois State and Indiana State) you'd get to Valley rivals. Add an Indiana in state built in rivalry between the Cardinals and Sycamores. The Missouri Valley also isn't what it used to be when I was in school when we played Wichita State and Creighton as fellow members. Even UIC who joined after I left has already left for a better league.

[@gocubs1815]

I know this vid focused on football, but I think if you factor in them joining in all sports, it could have a good overall effect on the athletic dept. Plus location wise they work for all the old MAC West schools

[@aarondersnah863]

As a Western Michigan grad living in Georgia, my first choice would be Georgia State (and Georgia Southern if a moving buddy is needed). If those schools consider the MAC a step down, then Kennesaw State (just finished first year in FBS) or Mercer (FCS), even if their stadiums are too small. I promise I would buy tickets whenever WMU came to Atlanta, Kennesaw, or Macon.

[@davedaplumber4507]

UConn as a football only member would add a regional opponent for buffalo and a rival for Umass

[@Bleezeinthetrees]

I would add “CGR” or “Conference Generable Revenue” as a metric to the list. Basically, how much each school brings in for the conference compared to the other members. These days it’s harder to get butts in seats for basically all non power 4.5 conferences so who is watching their schools and will a good season add a bump in attendance or tv ratings. Probably impossible to know, but would be a big factor. Great videos man!

[@jerrellparchman5037]

Wow! Excellent research and production. I did not realize how much WKU, and MTSU are the best of the rest.

[@mdoerty13]

FYI, the CAA is now the Coastal Athletics Conference. It changed its name (but not its acronym or logo) about a year ago.

[@CTback]

That sounds like they're preparing for when the Atlantic Coast Conference goes belly up.

[@dfl6020]

@@CTback wdymm by belly up?

[@JJCG4MES]

Honestly, I would love to see a CUSA/MAC merger as a football only mega league I’d feel it would make sense, as they both would dominate the mid week slots for football And a mega conference like that would have the eyes of everyone, and probably be loved for it’s uniqueness

[@M_11_m41n]

@@JJCG4MES C-USA signed a Grant Of Rights; so, I don't know if they're willing to share.

[@notJCS]

I go to a CUSA school(Go Owls!) n' I was just 'bout to comment this. CUSA n' MAC are very similar conferences in their modern identities, how they're seen by other conferences, focus on rivalries, & even their media deals. However, if ya ask me, I'd wanna see this happen ONLY after both conferences are poached again. In the MAC, Toledo & Buffalo will likely leave at some point, and there's a possibility that the Sun Belt will steal Ohio if they choose to expand again. While CUSA is always on the chopping block(As much as I hate sayin' that). Once that happens, then I fully support it.

[@Animated_Lunch]

Another factor that’s worth considering is all the current schools in the MAC are public institutions. The MAC hasn’t had a full-time private school member since Western Reserve (now Case Western Reserve) left in 1955.

[@Eric-IronEagleTravels]

Dude, Notre Dame is right there! JK. Great vid. Solid argument for WKU/MTSU.

[@andrewunderwood8534]

I’d like to see them do a eastward expansion. The Schools I’d like to see that wasn’t mentioned is another SUNY-Stony Brook.

[@VincentStone-w6t]

Man, what a great mention. I would definitely put Stony Brook in. But 🏟️ stadium capacity is too small.

[@Lavery760]

The MAC definitely should expand. I think if they can somehow manage to get the duo of WKU and MTS that would be perfect. Adding another 2 so UMASS isn't so alone would also be cool, but good options for that are really hard to determine.

[@walkingtheline3379]

I really wouldn’t mind making the MAC more eastern

[@lukeontheplains]

I've gotta get you as a guest on my Missouri Valley history

[@walkingtheline3379]

@ don’t tempt me with a good time

[@lukeontheplains]

come through brother

[@stevenblackiston7225]

Just happy SIU got a shoutout in this vid. Go Salukis!

[@AlligatorArms]

Fascinating discussion…Wku and Mtsu would’ve been great adds; solid programs in multiple sports, not too much of a geographical stretch. Kind of feels like that ship has sailed, unfortunately. I’m skeptical about the northeast, just from how barren the region is for prep talent. There are a lot of FCS schools in the northeast but it just seems like none of them really set themselves apart from one another competitively, and none are anywhere near ready to compete at even the MAC’s level right away. I think Northern Iowa deserves to be part of the discussion. They’re out there, but not as far out there as the Dakotas. And not as distant as Umass already is. Football program has fallen on some hard times lately but it seems like not too long ago they were either beating Iowa or Iowa state every season.

[@stanleyroot3097]

I think University of Northern Iowa would be an underdog candidate that was missed in this video

[@VincentStone-w6t]

PLEASE DO NOT LEAVE THE CONF. UNA, NDSU, SDSU & Comp. Play in a WAY better Conf. even though it's D-1AA. Your Comf. makes more 💰. Northern Iowa is NOT missed.

[@jesicahgage3912]

The blue hens are moving to. The fbs level so they could join the mac

[@Thingybopper]

You can use average distance to all other conference schools.

[@UserName-ts3sp]

I was going to say that

[@ThePhl4ever]

Just a small correction, the CAA now stands for the Coastal Athletic Association and not the Colonial Athletic Association. It changed in 2023

[@michaelgraalum381]

NDSU is chomping at the bit to move up and will absolutely join the MAC if thats whats available.

[@murkrow2316]

Holy Cross, Maine, Rhode Island, Western/Eastern Kentucky, Youngstown State

[@M_11_m41n]

Holy Cross is out of the picture because they are a Patriot League school, which is a very limited in scholarships and they're a full member in that conference.

[@scmcguire53]

While a southern move would make sense and a pipe dream of adding Middle Tennessee, WKU, and EKU would benefit everyone, the bad blood between EKU and WKU would ruin things. WKU doesn’t want EKU to return to football glory and has done everything they can to prevent EKU from moving up from the FCS level.

[@jakemcmullen4864]

as a huge sun belt truther, it would be really cool if you made a sun belt expansion video on how they could become one of the premier group of five conferences

[@kyleorndorff1304]

Would really like Delaware joining the MAC over C-USA. My family are all Delaware alums and they hate the idea of Liberty being their conference rival. Playing Akron, EMU, & UMass is better than playing Sam Houston, FIU, & Liberty.

[@TobiPadwick]

I think that is coming. I think Delaware joined CUSA to get to FBS but the MAC has been the goal. The trouble is the MAC is dysfunctional and cheap and would rather have even numbers than add an upgrade in distant delaware. Still, I think their plan is in 5 years they'll be in the mac. Maybe sooner. Now could the MAC totallly screw that up? Yeah.

[@jesskeller2518]

The Media deals suck for the MAC which is the main reason NIU is leaving... Lower TV revenue and games on Tuesdays and Wednesdays (Home games low attendance vs Saturday games which lets Alums go).... Not a good deal for any decent school that wants to join the MAC

[@davidasbury1558]

I can't see MTSU and WKU going to the MAC after they already turned them down last time and CUSA has a Grant of Rights right now. The MAC is not worth buying out of that. I would expect them to get Rhode Island and New Hampshire to get to 14 teams. Then they would have a nice little cluster in the New England area to help with travel costs and rivalries. That's also two flagship schools which make them a little bit more prestigious and better brands to build.

[@M_11_m41n]

You have to remember one thing: The MAC wants all-sports membership and Rhode Island doesn't want to leave the more basketball prestigious Atlantic-10 Conference, which UMass stupidly left.

[@hypnosemblem8829]

Maine is tied to NH so if one moves, so does the other

[@newyorknole2225]

As much as I love mid week MACtion, I would hate it if my team had to do it. NIU is right; midweek games kill attendance.

[@MrLucasD123]

It would be a major win if they could get South Dakota State or North Dakota State regardless of distance. But EKU and Youngstown State make a lot of sense. Also, Indiana State has been good at basketball lately so that could be beneficial for the MAC.

[@NeverwascooL]

I think if I was the MAC Commish here, knowing that NIU just left and the chances of Buffalo and Toledo leaving aren't zero; I would cast as wide of a net as possible. Delaware and Missouri State already have FBS homes set up for them and I doubt outside of a power conference extending an offer, they look to leave anytime soon. I'd aim to add at least two schools and ideally four into the conference. EKU, WKU, MTSU and Illinois State [with maybe an extension to Indiana State]

[@M_11_m41n]

@@NeverwascooL If you're going to do something like that, the MAC would have to drop their all-sports membership requirement, which the conference will never let go of.

[@eric6282]

As an NIU fan I'm glad we are leaving. Tired of playing half our conference schedule on weekdays for terrible coverage. ESPN doesn’t even put the games on ABC or ESPN but delegates most of them to ESPNU and CBS Sports Network. Also, the conference keeps expanding far east with its last additions (Buffalo, Temple, and now UMass) further putting NIU on an island by itself. Glad we are moving to a strong conference with better locations (Hawaii, Colorado, California, Nevada, etc) for fans to visit than Muncie, Oxford, Mount Pleasant, etc. The TV coverage and media $$ is far and away better too.

[@ad51603]

As a WKU fan and student, I would prefer if we rejoined the Sun Belt in preparation for a move to the American. I miss the games against UAB, North Texas, and FAU (especially in basketball). I feel like if/when Memphis and Tulane leave for greener pastures (ACC/B12), WKU and MTSU could be decent options to fill the gap left by those two schools if they were to leave for a power conference

[@Thomas6163-wz9fn]

the big problem with Dayton is that they have Big East dreams and want to focus on that

[@Thomas6163-wz9fn]

UNH i think is the best option of the FCS teams: it has the least to lose basketball wise (which the A10 schools all would be very unwilling to do), and has a pre-existing Hockey East rivalry with UMass to be encouraged. the biggest thing in the way may well be that it may want to stick with Maine as its main rival in FCS

[@jacobe5170]

eku mentioned 🔥🔥 would love to see the kerns in the mac

[@gcesports7191]

Dalukes and EMPIRE stay putting out absolute fire content

[@amarimarks3320]

Still not convinced they’re different people lmao

[@lukeontheplains]

can guarantee I can't get my voice to go that low

[@TheChicken_ORW]

For proximity I would have added the range in distance to all schools then divide by the number of schools in the conference you may get a big number buts its most likely miss leading compared to what other schools may score

[@therealnathnath154]

Especially with MACtion taking up a decent chunk (at least 3 of the likely only 5) home games, Duquesne may be able to use Heinz Field pretty conveniently. I think Delaware is an easy one, with those the MAC is at 14 schools and pretty easily split into east/west by splitting Ohio. Best of all, if (when) Toledo and Buffalo leave they still have 12 schools and the same divisional structure. At whatever future date that occurs; look at WKU, MTSU, & IL+MZ States to get up to 16, which will likely have become the standard for FBS. If any school mentioned is not interested, YSU and EKU are great backup options. P.S. I'm not familiar with their athletics budget or facilities, but Miami Ohio is an insanely good school academically. If Toledo and Buffalo do get poached (I'd assume by the American) Miami might also get a look

[@M_11_m41n]

Duquesne is a basketball school and I don't think they want to leave the Atlantic 10.

[@plangineer1375]

Rather than Stadium Capacity, I'd use Average Home Attendance. Why add a 30,000-seat stadium if they only get 6,000 per game?

[@otaviodiniz5934]

New Hampshire and Rhode Island ice aren't the problem of your model. The Curveball is UMass.

[@njbrock22]

i like the idea of it being UNH, Rhode Island and either Delaware or UConn as a way to have a "eastern" branch to kinda give Buffalo and the 2 Cleveland area teams a more defined region of rivalires; Indiana State seems a good idea but i dunno if the budget would allow for them to move up, same with Ill State... Dayton 1 major flaw, from everything i've heard they will NOT give up Non-scholarship Football, it's why they were part of the initial D1-AAA when they wanted to establish that before settling into the Pioneer League due to how that conference's bylaws are; Middle Tenn would probably see it as a Downgrade, same with Western Kentucky, Eastern Kentucky would require them getting their new stadium they've wanted for a long time but well that'll probably not happen for a long time; Youngstown is an almost PERFECT Fit especially with it's proximity to Akron and Kent and would be a nice natural Rivalry throw in Duquesne and you have a very established northeast/eastern Ohio branch of the conference; Albany would be a good intra-state rivalry in the SUNY system for Buffalo and could be good; SIU, i think this would be heavilly reliant on if both of the ISU's make the jump or if they fold into the OVC instead if a lot of movement happens soon; the fun part will be what happens IF this happens(yes a big if) as in what will the MVFC, CAA & NEC do if these teams just up and leave... that's where the Fun REALLY starts... kinda wish we could STOP reallignment though and just go back to what it used to be where it was (mostly) Regional conferences that had some sort of identity... but well you know Money Talks and Sense never does...

[@frmthematrix]

Fuck it bring in wku and mtsu for the rivalry

[@Frank4SouthMiami]

I would add media market. Rutgers and Maryland have never been great football schools, but Rutgers gave the Big Ten greater presence in Philly and NYC while amaryland opened up DC and Baltimore. Miami isn't just living on nostalgia but Miami/FTL is like the 16th largest media and 12th largest Metro in the country.

[@M_11_m41n]

You want Rutgers and Maryland to leave the Big Ten, which they're going to make a lot of money with the new deal and you want the conference to let go of some of the largest media markets in the United States? Hard pass...

[@Frank4SouthMiami]

@@M_11_m41n i never said they would leave, or should on there own accord, just giving him my recommendation when looking at schools to join a conference as to what may be valuable

[@benjaminguzman3428]

Hey, I think you should have simply normalized the score values because it seems like you treat them all the same. I did the math, and the new rankings are: Dayton, WKU, Delaware, MTSU, New Hampshire, Illinois St, Youngstown St, Eastern KY, Duquesne, SUNY, Rhode Island, Missouri St, Indiana St, Southern Illinois.

[@terrencenewman5580]

Another great vid! A few other FCS schools I think are worth considering for the MAC are University of Northern Iowa if you want to expand further west, Richmond could expand the conference into Virginia, and if you're looking for schools in PA I would look at Lehigh and Lafayette instead of Duqaune. Also Holy Cross would make a great travel partner for UMASS and maybe the MAC can get a little press from Holy Cross Alum Bill Simmons on his pod 😂😂😂

[@M_11_m41n]

Lafayette, Lehigh, and Holy Cross are in the Patriot League. The Patriot League is a conference that is very connected to each other and they are very stringent when it comes to scholarships. So, you can count the Patriot league and the Pioneer League out.

[@mrjameshendry]

Western Kentucky belongs in the MAC

[@timothysroot82]

Interesting thought about Missouri State (and Evansville, which doesn't have football), they used to be affiliate members of the conference

[@adammurphy7623]

Why was Maine not considered if we're including URI and UNH for consideration?

[@lukeontheplains]

I forgot is the reason. Whoops! I'll do some math later and add it with some other schools in a pinned comment

[@TobiPadwick]

I know! What's that guy thinking?!?! :)

[@BobKubby22]

I think you got it right. WKU and MTSU make sense along with EKU. Awesome video! Love the formula idea. Takes a lot into consideration!

[@manyoobrown6135]

Would/Could the MAC look at UTChatt, UTMartin, or Austin Peay?

[@esodevulpes6435]

Something worth mentioning when it comes to Delaware in the MAC that any interest the MAC shows in them would probably be mutual. They are regional outliers in an already spread thin conference and would probably ecstatic to leave for something closer. Yes they'd be outliers with UMass too in the MAC but going to the great lakes for conference games is not nearly as bad ass going all the to Florida, Texas, and Arizona. It would also have an unintentional benefit of being a more appropriate level of competition for their others sports. Their baseball and basketball teams are going to beaten up pretty badly in the cusa next year, they just aren't as good as the football program

[@groverdee66]

I’d use average distance to MAC schools instead

[@LRXC1]

I really love your football videos. They're really classy and make me feel proud to be a football fan instead of the very hypermasculine editing and atmosphere some editing has. Keep it up man, you are doing great work! Also Go Huskies!

[@killuhcam27]

i think the MAC should go northeast and target New Hampshire, Albany and Rhode Island, all with stadium upgrades of course. If they can land MTSU and WKU they should definitely do it, but didn't MTSU choose to stay in CUSA when it was only 5 members rather than join the MAC already? I don't really see those two going at this point since the CUSA rebuilt and is doing pretty good right now. I could see EKU actually being fought over by the MAC and CUSA in the near future, I've seen them as a sleeper FBS candidate for the last few years and think they are ready to make the jump.

[@trackguy4038]

How about Towson University? A backyard rival to Delaware

[@Mike_Poppe]

Great video, for future reference it’s pronounced “All-bany”

[@pppaulllllallennnnnnn]

Illinois State makes a lot of sense

[@sawyertuide7636]

If I’m the MAC, I add 2 NE’s schools alongside WKU and MTSU. Those 2 NE schools would accompany UMass and may keep Buffalo around. Those being Rhode Island and Delaware. Good stuff per usual btw Luke

[@erichschaumloffel975]

Hell Umaine would fit as well and maybe see if Nova wants to join for football only

[@M_11_m41n]

​​@@erichschaumloffel975 The MAC wants all-sports membership and Villanova will never leave the Big East.

[@erichschaumloffel975]

@ you are probably right but just a thought

[@danielb.burnham2382]

I wish Rhode Island had a larger stadium or at least a path to easily expanding it. It's impossible to add seats on two sides, as the visitors sideline sits right against the basketball arena, and the north end zone is directly adjacent to the road. The only options are the home sideline, which already has 90% of the seating, and the south end zone.

[@M_11_m41n]

@@danielb.burnham2382 But at the same time, much like a lot of northeastern schools, Rhode Island cares way more about basketball and other northeastern sports way more than they do football.

[@whoovesphd1]

Most important factor you’re leaving out, and probably the most important factor outside of chance to be competitive, is TV market rank. Money talks

[@Ajcruz04]

Your proximity score I think I would’ve just did the distance from the farthest+distance to the closest and then divide that by 2 (or if u wanna get really technical add up all the miles to each school)

[@rangersking6699]

UNH, Albany would be most likely to say yes..there’s no risk in ditching the America East for the mac. Stony brook would be possible but tough. The CAA is a very good basketball league to ditch. I don’t think any MVC schools are attainable unless you add some high quality basketball programs like WKU

[@ColinAerospace]

I am pretty sure akron doesn't have the largest stadium. Central seats 30255 while Western and eastern seat 30200 though eastern has seats that are tarped off

[@toddturcotte4742]

In fact, Waldo Stadium seats 36,361

[@waffleboibailbonds2998]

I think they should expand honestly while they still can. If they can’t land the 100 Miles of Hate, I’d say either get Deleware & New Hampshire or IL State & SIU

[@KanDuex]

Albany and Stony Brook would be nice bridges between UMASS and the rest of the league.

[@CTback]

Delaware and Missouri State are joining Conference USA in July. Northern Illinois is joining the Mountain West in football, but you didn't say the MAC basically kicked the entire athletic program out when they took that deal. In that case, there are options that don't have them slumming it as an independent. Summit League, Missouri Valley, Ohio Valley, Northeast if they're that desperate to join a conference like Chicago State.

[@frankschaefer8890]

10:03 I am watching this video on the SUNY Albany Campus! Btw its All-ban-ee.

[@Marcooo420]

Surprised UNI didn’t make the list. Football is down right now but has a good history. Basketball is consistently one of the best in the MVC. Would be the only dome stadium in G5. Not sure what their budget looks like but I could see them joining with Illinois State.

[@M_11_m41n]

Northern Iowa would just rather stay in the Missouri Valley Conference.

[@hypnosemblem8829]

Originally thought that Conference USA will be the one to go towards the Northeast expansion wise first.

[@Theperfecthatrick]

4:36 Temple is rumored to join D3.

[@piratesnowman]

I would say Drake but HOWEVER they are in the Pioneer League for football but have also been one of if not the best Pioneer League School and another problem is that they ar in the Missouri Valley for basketball which they have a rivalrie with UNI and that's prob the second biggest in-state rivalry (Unless you count William Penn vs Central U but no one does)

[@primeconor]

I feel like WKU and middle Tennessee will join eventually and Delaware makes more sense in the MAC than C-USA, I also felt like a pitch to UConn as a temporary football only member has a shot to work because of the Umass rivalry and higher payout as well as the burden of scheduling as an independent

[@monexpo86]

Football is killing the mid-majors in other sports

[@M_11_m41n]

Hell, we might see athletic departments cutting out other sports to appease television deals, put more money into more profitable programs, and/or just cut their losses.

[@eric6282]

MAC tried to get MT and WKU when Cusa was on life-support just 3 (?) years ago. If they couldn't get them then it's unlikely they can get them now. Also, the MAC doesn't have much to offer them. MWC is offering NIU far more media money, better bowl games, better chance of CFP, better TV coverage, paying conference exit fees, and a recruitment incentive for joining. MAC can't offer any of that.

[@Gallalad1]

I have a completely out there idea, probably not practical but what about poaching USports schools? Like if you just wanted the cream of the crop with the northeastern push you could poach Laval and Western which are a) in enormous media markets (Greater Montreal and Southern Ontario) and b) would be the only NCAA programs in their respective provinces you'd probably get the entire province in media rights. They're also far and away the best USports Canadian football teams. While there'd be grumbling about moving to four down football the student athletes would be supportive as it makes getting drafted easier. It also isnt that much to go in. If it was successful you could also then poach schools in Toronto or grab UOttawa and Carlton and grab the rowdiest rivalry game in Canada with the Panda Game. Its an unrealistic longshot but definitely one to toy with

[@lukeontheplains]

I thought about putting *Toronto on this list, but I wondered if it would be more difficult to get numbers on athletics department revenue, and if I'd have to translate Canadian marks into American dollars for it. I know Simon Fraser did it, but that was in D2 (keep an eye on my channel for Simon Fraser btw)

[@Gallalad1]

@@lukeontheplains yeah its fair. Canada does athletics differently. Plus the main sport/second sport for all Canadian universities is hockey. Which the MAC doesnt do so it'd be a waste.

[@madbrowniac7871]

@gallalad: Canadian Hockey Schools would have an immediate Rivalry with Bowling Green, Western Michigan, and Miami of Ohio to name at least three.😏🇨🇦🇺🇸🏒🥅👨‍🎓👩‍🎓📚📒🖊B.W.

[@TobiPadwick]

neat idea for a video.

[@Gallalad1]

@ maybe but thanks to certian things that have happened over the weekend any ideas of that are dead on arrival now. I've never seen Canada so angry

[@Vsleezy]

As a Youngstown state fan myself, I would love to see us in the FBS level and in the MAC but I think the CUSA would make a bunch of sense for competitive reasons, and we can build our own brand as the loan Ohio school in that conference rather than thrown right into a box with six other Ohio schools and being known as “another Ohio mac school” my ID situation for us to get to the conference USA would be the standard conference trickling affect college is leaving to jump up for better competition we would start by Texas State leaving the SBC for the Pac12 that put the SBC from 14 teams to 13 and in immediate search for a new member because that conference operates in divisions they ideally would add Liberty to the east side of the SBC and bump GSU over to the west side of the SBC so their conference is solidified then WKU and MTSU leave after Liberty for the MAC after this move that would leave the CUSA with 6 members (could possibly be 5 because I think it is inevitable that NMSU leaves sooner or later to join both of their rivals UNM and UTEP in the MWC) this would leave the CUSA in panic mode yet again to find schools for its conference leaving them no choice but to venture down to FCS I think once we get to this point YSU IMMEDIATELY will be one of the top if not the top target along with EKU to get the conference back to eight teams (or seven depending if NMSU leaves as previously mentioned) the other 3/4 teams added will be Illinois State, SIU, UNI and/or UNH (also worth mentioning YSU has affiliation with both CUSA and MAC for bowling and women’s lacrosse so it’s nice. We already have a slight foot in the door)

[@notJCS]

If/when Texas State leaves for the Pac, I genuinely think Ohio will be the Sun Belt's main target. SBC is BIG on regional rivalries, n' Ohio has history w/ Marshall. They seem more attractive than Liberty, who just had a kinda down season n' is in a state that already has two Sun Belt members(JMU & ODU). If YSU were to make the jump, I agree that CUSA would be the best landing spot, but I dunno if they'd be interested in that region. Honestly, I see 'em expanding to the Southwest(Likely Tarleton) in order to try n' keep NMSU & SHSU happy.

[@TobiPadwick]

@@notJCS I think CUSA would take Youngstown if they had the $5M check to move up, but yeah Ohio looks like the gem of the MAC ohio schools to me. Are they going to continue to show no real interest in climbing the FBS conference ladder?

[@notJCS]

@TobiPadwick Like I said, I think they'll only switch conferences if the Sun Belt looks to expand, due to their history w/ Marshall n' how similar they are as programs. And if ya ask me, that only happens if/when Texas State leaves n' forces the conference's hand. I think the MAC schools really do value the history they got w/ each other, but the TV deal is gonna drive the higher-end programs away at some point.

[@sirchives4254]

All models are wrong But some are useful

[@coachsimmons]

Tennessee State

[@M_11_m41n]

HBCUs already have a shoestring budget in of themselves and they're pretty fine in the Ohio Valley Conference, which is a better basketball conference.

[@patring303]

This is a long term build and unlikely, buuuuuut University of Charleston (WV)? Doesn’t fit the money and desire role too much (although the money could be found in the capital somewhere) but they do have solid athletics with a rising football team. Plus, while not the best, they wouldn’t be too far from most competition for games. Maybe something to look at for 2030 if Buffalo or Toledo leaves

[@M_11_m41n]

I don't think any Division 2 School wants to move up at this point.

[@denisdooley1540]

I realize it's not a permanent solution because Connecticut won't stay; but, I think offering football only membership to UConn and not kicking Northern Illinois out in others sports makes a lot of sense. It gives you a rivalry game for the time being with UMass and you keep a full conference. I'm not sure if it's a factor, but the MAC and Big East share a similar footprint. I suppose one could use EKU to goad WKU to move without ETSU. But I would definitely love to see WKU. EKU maybe. My cousin's husband in Burlington , KY actually played for them. Illinois State would be a great add geographically and keep the Illinois footprint, but it seems like a big ask for them to move up. I was also surprised that the Larry Bird University Sycamores were so behind. I'll write my alma alma mater and tell them to schedule the Sycamores for a payout game to help them out 😂. Tree vs. tree 🌴 🌲🌴🌲

[@M_11_m41n]

The MAC is all-sports membership requirement only and UConn is all or nothing with their sports.

[@denisdooley1540]

​@@M_11_m41nml I understand these are the respective positions. I'm simply suggesting a no-strings-attached arrangement until UConn wants to go. I think they're relatively content with the non-football Big East until the right offer comes along for all sports. Unless you're Notre Dame, being independent is a pain. Even ND gets half an ACC schedule to make filling their "independent" schedule each year a lot easier.

[@M_11_m41n]

@@denisdooley1540 The reason why is that all of their non-football sports for Notre Dame are in the ACC and used to be in the Big East; until, it fell apart. The only one I know of that Notre Dame is not in the ACC or doesn't have an ACC affiliation is their hockey program in the Big Ten.

[@TobiPadwick]

good idea, imo, but they used that rule to break UMASS, so would they do it? You could add Ill State, and S.ILL and finally "mac-ify" your presence in Illinois, which might end up bringing NIU back. I think bringing in UCONN football would absolutely help UMASS football, but UMASS would hate it conceptually. UConn getting the rug laid out for them while UMASS got a kick in the teeth.

[@denisdooley1540]

​@@M_11_m41nSure, I'm just saying that makes it a lot easier for ND to put a schedule together than UConn.

[@owenstewart7235]

one thing about unh is they would not be willing to join if it meant leaving the hockey east conference. also unh and UMaine would be a package deal

[@Aidan-i9l]

Illinois State would probaly work to they were a top FCS team

[@TheJones3d]

“Dollar dollar bills y’all”😂😂😂

[@TheStupidSeal0]

What about ETSU? It’s a bit of a stretch, but it’s worth a shot. They have a P5 win.

[@terryfox9344]

I think that they should look to add 2 schools. I also think that your conclusion of Western KY, Middle TN, Delaware, New Hampshire, and Eastern KY as targets makes sense. If Duquesne played in a 15 to 20,000 seat stadium, they would make sense because of the Pittsburgh TV market.

[@M_11_m41n]

@@terryfox9344 Western Kentucky, Middle Tennessee, and Delaware already signed a Grant Of Rights with C-USA. Eastern Kentucky has been blocked from even moving up to the FBS by Western Kentucky. If you're bringing New Hampshire, you have to bring their rival Maine. And, Duquesne has a tiny football stadium and with rather stay in the basketball prestigious Atlantic 10.

[@CoolRexxed]

Umass is joining the Mac