M109R Boss vs Vrod Muscle

[@markurbancowboy]

These are two of the fastest muscle cruisers from the factory! Both bikes put out about the same HP but the M109 puts out more torque. The Vrod will probably pull a bit more because it revs to 9000rpm's whereas the M109R pulls to about 7000rpm's. I've owned a VRod Nightrod Special and have ridden a M109R. I like the low end torque and the high end HP the M109R has. The VRod doesn't have the low end so you gotta keep the revs up. Both bikes were engineered for performance being DOHC, liquid cooled, big bore, short stroke engines to develop horsepower.

[@AFRO_KEEN]

Another way of looking at is that the M109 reaches it full potential at 700 rpm. While the v-rod does not reach full potential until 900 rpm. So which engine given similar horse power works faster,?

[@butteredbiskit3497]

My Audace will spank a vrod! That's with 1380cc's! That m109 is fast.

[@JetCooper3D]

Like to see them up against my Rocket 2020.... it's pretty fast as a muscle cruiser. All three are great bikes.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Congrats on owning a new rocket. Which version did you purchase? How do you like it?

[@JetCooper3D]

@@paulkmaster3231 Hi mate. I bought the Roadster not the GT. Just a personal taste - I find the forward lean more engaging for my riding style. Love the bike, best I have owned. I had the old Rocket and the Gen 2 Vmax. This 2020 Rocket is an easy ride. Even if it's not your taste - def take a test ride for the experience!

[@Johann-4354]

The m109r is well over 700#'s wet, and with a big rider it can deffinitely make a difference in acceleration. That Suzuki is really amazing with it power from a stock machine, even without mods. You have to go to a stage 2, or even 3, to get the same performance out of a Harley, Kawasaki or Yamaha. The big 109r also handles amazingly well in twisties for it's wheelbase and weight. Heck of a bargin muscle bike.

[@myhometechguy]

The M109r has a power advantage but the consensus is the lower weight of the V-Rod gives it the edge. Love both. I have the 109. I can tell you the Turna Dump exhaust on the 109 is ridiculously load. I ran them for a month and switched to the Custom Krome VPR. The Turna's look and sound awesome but are the loudest exhaust Ive ever heard on a bike.

[@jonathanseitz8644]

the Freedom Performance Combat 2-1 Long Exhaust System is the best exhaust for the 109 out there nice deep tone and huge performance gains you go with this exhaust twin spike cold air intakes and the cobra fi2000 fuel management system 35-40 hp gain easy HP for about $1200 bucks lots of fun

[@Hugo-py2ce]

Dude the rider on the m109 weighs like 300lbs cmon!

[@paulkmaster3231]

Compare the original VR1000 Harley racing engine a decade before the so called”Porsche” designed motor was ever designed. They are identical I was blown away when I saw close ups of the original engine. The Harley engine produced 140hp with less than 1000cc’s. Porsche 115hp with a bump of 130cc’s the 1130cc 2002 Vrod engine. Even the later 1250 engine is only 122hp. Remember the original Harley engine was built by the racing team not a full factory effort. I get pissed when people think Harley is too stupid build a fast bike like the Japanese. They don’t because it’s a saturated market with little profit to be made. Does anyone think America can’t make fast cars btw? They can and they do because it’s profitable. American aren’t too stupid to beat anyone at anything.

[@JL-wf2wp]

@@paulkmaster3231 dont get me wrong. The vrod is my favorite and only motorcycle that exists in my head, anything else including other harley models i dont like. And yes of course harley can build a very fast engine, even i could build a very fast one. But there is a very complicated side of building an engine for everyday use and abuse, you should know that about your vrod comparing it to other harleys. This is called reliability and is where all U.S. factories fail compared to german brands. Only because germans have a much higher quality standard that nobody else has

[@paulkmaster3231]

J L yeah I couldn’t agree less with German companies being so much better. I can tell you from an automotive perspective that German cars are much less reliable than Both American and Japanese cars. Ask any experienced car mechanic that works on all makes they will tell you the same. The German companies have done a great job at duping the public but ask people that actually repair them. Another one is Korean cars being compatible to Japanese cars reliability that’s another big lie. I’ve been working on cars for over 40years. I’ve been a ASE ceritified Master tech with an advance computer diagnostics certification as well for over 30 years. I currently work at the largest Transmission shop in South Florida. I’ve repaired just about every vehicle you can imagine from Ferrari’s to Yugos. From Rat Rods to concourse show cars. I have nothing against German vehicles other than they aren’t reliable that’s for sure. If you can name one model of German vehicle that is more reliable than an American Competitor please let me know. American power trains and electronics are far more reliable than Germans. Please ask yourself why you believe that German cars are more reliable where are you getting this information? Sorry I’m ranting but this really bothers me. Just so you know I’m Half Japanese and American from Mostly German ancestry. I was born in Japan and raised in Detroit and got beat up a lot for being Japanese but I’m damn proud to be an American the greatest nation on earth. My job is to find out the truth that’s what I do for a living. Also the other Harley’s are also extremely reliable more so than my Vrod. My Vrod has gone through 3 fuel sending units. One front brake master and a very expensive Abs module also my speedometer lens is cracking! By far the most unreliable bike I’ve ever owned!! I bought it in 2016 with 9000 miles. Btw my 2014 M109r had a stalling issue that was never resolved. Never had any issues with my Streetglide Special it had recalls that I never had any problem with till after they did a poor job at the dealer of bleeding the brake master but that’s not Harley manufactures fault. Bottom line don’t believe everything you hear. Also What better source to on finding out if what car is most reliable than the people that repair them. Don’t take my word for it ask other mechanics. Obviously don’t ask German specialty mechanics they have a bias. Ask mechanics that actually work on a variety of makes which is most reliable

[@JL-wf2wp]

@@paulkmaster3231 you said it yourself, everything on your vrod failed except for the engine 🤷‍♂️ and about the build quality i am telling you from my perspective. As a transporter i move mid to high end vehicles around europe for my clients and i can tell you i one of my clients on the german autobahn blew a brand new trans on a brand new shelby gt500 because they are not built to hold high speeds for a long time like benz or an audis do on an everyday basis. What can i tell you older vehicles tend to fail a lot unless they are given a proper maintenance. Let me know when your vrod engine fails im sure in the meantime many twin cams, m8s and evos will fail even before yours (under the same riding conditions)

[@paulkmaster3231]

J L lol the Tremec T56 is nearly bulletproof if the engine is stock. The only thing that’s causes failure on these transmissions is low fluid or drivers error take your pick. Was this a brand new Gt500 or improperly installed or rebuilt trans? New OE transmissions are extremely expensive for example an original equipment tremec T56 is $8000. An aftermarket T56 or rebuilt is less than half that and this would have nothing to do Ford. A T56 is a difficult and expensive trans to rebuild we give our customers a choice between Original equipment or rebuilt with much less reliability but much cheaper price. Most customers chose the later. It would be most likely be the case in this instance. Also if this particular Gt500 has been tuned for more horsepower than originally design for this transmission this would also decrease reliability. A Gt500 can be tuned for almost 1000hp or more with modifications but not many manual transmissions can handle without careful maintenance and careful shifting. But let’s says this was truly the manufactures fault then you are basing everything you believe about American manufacture because of this one incident. If it’s an automatic than it’s a German designed ZF trans which you are correct they are pieces of shit and break all the time. As far as Harley’s engines go do you think a Vrod engine is going to be more reliable than any of the other evolution or twin cam or M8 engines? Seriously?! These engines last forever and never stop well over 100k since the evolution engine was designed back in the 90’s. We have a joke at our shop “That’s as rare as a German car with a check engine light off”. You might move vehicles place to place but I work on them. Maybe in Europe they are better but here in the states they are junk. Let me give a personal story. I tried to persuade my best friend not to buy anything from Germany especially not used that would be a disaster. He bought a 2012 merc R350 I warned him!!! Within less than a year the transmission engine oil leaks ignition coils and air conditioning systems went out. Over $15000 in repairs. I also showed him he had over 40 malfunction codes still should be addressed he said he is tapped out. So he drives around in a German car with a check engine light on that will most likely will never be attended too. I have a 2005 Pontiac GTO with 145,000 miles no check engine with only a plugs and fluids change and very minor items replaced. Easy to repair and inexpensive parts. It out performs cars from Germany costing 2-3 times more money. Believe me I could tell you countless stories. How I raced and tuned Japanese cars before it ever became popular but after being humiliated by American muscle I switched to the winning side. Dollar for dollar you can’t beat America as far as powerfully fast cars. As far as motorcycle performance go Japan dollar for dollar can’t be beat. As far as best biker experience a Harley pushrod engine in the American biker culture is the only way to go. Nothing feels quite like riding with a group of Harley’s. Btw tremec transmissions are in many German cars that drive on the autobahn with no issues right?!

[@adolf6066]

Mr Paulk... I have a m109r 2009 I drive this bike for 7 years..brother this bike beast ..POWERFUL engine bro About vrod muscle.. brother I like it so much .. beautiful bike in the same he is a monster ... so these bike is the best ... ... Guys for give about my lounge.. is too bad I I Know for give me guntilman ... ayad my name .. from saudi arabia ... great video brother

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thank you for watching Ayad ! The M109r is a fast comfortable reliable and beautiful bike!

[@godackgudalach1]

"He's a good rider he just can't launch very good" he can't fucking shift either!

[@DankestLankJOJO]

That shifting was disgusting lol

[@MrNismopro]

Bet you he can eat a damn sandwich though!

[@slelliott14]

Was missing it sounded too

[@noneofmybusiness9895]

Fatso has the slowest shifts ever. Look at the time he takes off and back on the accelerator...

[@timothycaldwell3785]

guy on the 109 has NO IDEA what hes doing.

[@kellyd19671]

v rod is a lighter bike, rider was lighter. m109 rider was late on the shifts. these bikes really come down to rider they're both quick bikes

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks very much for watching. I owed a M109R before I bought the Vrod. The M109R feels more powerful because it has a lot more torque. I will try to get it more even by riding the M109R and having someone ride my Vrod that’s the same weight. I’m planing on trying a three way comparison with my friend Nightrod. A Vrod vs Nightrod vs M109R comparison. I’ll give you a link to see the Nightrod briefly we going to compare with kzbin.info/www/bejne/hnqlimaYjrWKqNU

[@kellyd19671]

@@paulkmaster3231 my 109 is modified smokes the tire in 1st gear lifts front wheel when shifting to second. oh i don't use the clutch to shift just blip the throttle and go.

[@paulkmaster3231]

kelly gray very nice👍. M109R is a great bike I think it’s a better bike overall and certainly a better value. I truly think the Nightrod version exists because of the M109R’s impact look at all the styling ques it took. Tandem exhaust on one side. The seat style even the tail light look and see. It’s very different compared to the Vrod Muscle

[@UncleRobsGarage]

My M109 is what most people would consider quite modified but it is only slightly warmed-over it will lift the front wheel probably in 3rd I've done it in 2nd effortlessly using the clutch lever but as the wife tells me being a CDL I need to quit the racing. And also I had a Hayabusa so if I really wanted to race I guess I should have kept that? Plus at my age I need to knock this stuff off.

[@kellyd19671]

@@UncleRobsGarage mine is only slightly modified as well pipes better intake and ecu flash. Its way to much fun

[@combojohn7953]

Both are great bikes but the V-Rod is the real shit for me! So fcking badass!

[@bobbysweeney5377]

Yep

[@LL120]

Well everyone's gonna have their own opinion so here's where I lay mine lol. I own a Busa and plan on keeping it in my collection and adding the M109r into it. I think the M109r looks better than the Vrod and I have a completely different opinion as far as reliability goes on Harleys vs Suzuki but thats just from my 13yrs of bike experiences. Yes Harleys hold their value the best but I don't buy bikes with the intent of reselling them. In the end I love all types of bikes. I guess you can simply say I'm going with the M109r over the Vrod because of my taste in looks and I don't care if its the fastest bike on the road because ill have my Busa at home waiting for me. They're just "cruisers" and not "race bikes" to me. I hope you didn't take this personally buddy. Just my opinion. Great video tho 😎

[@paulkmaster3231]

I love your comment and respect your decision. I agree the M109r looks better and is better overall. I even made a video ranking it #1 out of muscle cruisers. I also think your Busa looks better than my 2020 ZX14r but performance is my number one priority 👍

[@777RocketS]

@LL120 I really respect and appreciate that, it's the same for me but on the opposing side I like the look etc of the Vrod better. I own a 08NRS or as Harley guys call it a DX. One sweet collab between Porsche and HD. And the 1250cc liquid cooled engine isn't avg for a HD. Busas are Rad btw.

[@GeneracionGoshen777]

I love my 2004 vrod ❤️🏍️🔥

[@stevenrichardson5121]

Rider weight and skill would come into play, plus as mentioned has the 109 been tuned properly. Nice vid

[@geoffcarter7512]

the Rod is a performance all rounder cruiser The 9 is a muscle bike that respond well to a hilly road like no other can.

[@sluf1963]

I owned a tuned , 2012 Raider S , and a 2005 V-Rod VRSCSE , they both rode very smooth , both had great qualities , the Raider is more comfortable than the M-109's fat seating , both those bikes are so close in comparison . People don't give H-D , or V-Rod's their open minded perspective , I will say the V-Rod revs to 9,800 r.p.m.'s at red line , and pull all the way thru the curve . I miss my Raider S , but I will be honest , I miss the Screaming Eagle V-Rod more , as it was beautifully made , quality was awesome , my reason for letting it go was lack of H-D's commitment to that model , and future of parts . I love my H-D's , but there is good , and bad in every bike , something to love with them all . Ride safe , and live large .

[@paulkmaster3231]

Great comment and thanks for sharing. I never got the pleasure of riding a raider but always wanted to. It’s a great bike. Any Vrod is also a great bike. It’s fast enough to ride with sportbikes and cruise with your buddy’s touring bikes to biker events. Since my daughter got her motorcycle endorsement she has quickly graduated from her Shadow 750 to my Vrod and rides it everyday. She has taken it over now. Which is on my channel. Check it out if your interested

[@NSTY109]

His weight and learning curve prob made a big difference. He was bouncing off the rev limiter. Also curious if he has a tune or ECU flash. It will definitely run lean if he doesn't

[@RSRS-ws3px]

I know this video is a few months old but I made the mistake of sitting on a M109R a couple days ago when I went to get my RMZ 450 from the shop. Just 3 weeks ago I bought a new, leftover, 2016 GSX-S 1000 for $7k out the door. At almost 50 I can’t ride a full on sport bike anymore so the GSXS is the next best thing. I love it and keep telling myself I am not ready to give in to the cruiser life just yet! But after sitting on the 109, it felt like a perfectly worn in glove! The low center of gravity made it feel lighter than my GSXS! I really hoped I didn’t love it when I sat on it! Now to find a way to make sense out of trading in a 3 week old bike!!

[@paulkmaster3231]

Wow brand new GSX-S 1000 $7k that’s insane!!! Well I’m also in my 50’s and started out on cruisers then started on sport bikes till my last and fastest bike VFR1200f I got rid of because yet another of my friends passed away while riding a sportbike. So I went back to cruisers again but still I miss my VFR really bad. Well let me tell you the the good and the bad about the M109r. The good it’s got incredible off the line performance. It’s seat is great and passenger pillion as well. I loved the cowl for solo riding looks awesome as well. It’s a great looking bike. It’s fairly easy to keep clean better than most cruisers. You will destroy every true Vtwin cruiser on the market except the Vrod. Also it feels more powerful than even the Vrod even though on longer straight aways the Vrod will overtake. The bad: the exhaust note is not very good no matter what exhaust system you chose. I myself thought it’s ok but not as good as a Harley pushrod or even the Vrod exhaust note. It’s heavy!!! 761lbs heavy. The pegs hit very early on this bike. It’s wider than anything I’ve ever ridden even your legs get spread out wide on the foot controls. If you are a Suzuki man than definitely get it. I love the looks of that bike but surprisingly it didn’t get the attention my Vrod Muscle gets. The m109r is a better all around bike but for me the exhaust note and the 2nd fastest performance was the main reasons I traded it in. My buddy owned a Vrod Muscle and it’s no fun getting beat all the time after doing mods like power commander 5 high flow air filters and modifying my exhaust it didn’t make enough of a difference I was still getting beat. I’ve seen Dyno reports of m109r doing 120hp plus. I think the real horsepower is more like 107hp to the wheel. I have many reports of Vrods doing 120hp to the wheel but I think the real hp is more like 110hp. The torque is much more different the torque on M109r is well over a 100lbft. The little Vrod engine only 80lbft. And that is about what you’ll see when these go against each other. The torque of the M109r can keep close off the line maybe even quicker to 60. But then the hp to weight of the Vrod takes over the 100lb less weight of the Vrod makes a significant difference

[@RSRS-ws3px]

Paulk Master thanks for the reply! At 49 and a half I have been rough on my body, 7 surgeries so far between my knees and shoulders. I just can’t stay in the sport bike position these days. I have owned 2 CBR 600’s, 2 GSXR 750’s, and a 2007 Bandit 1250s! I loved the motor of the Bandit but being a short guy on a taller heavy bike got old quickly. I am one of those guys who also loves spending time with his wife and we have found out that the little pillion seat of the GSXS isn’t made for a non petite woman!! And even it is causing my hands to fall asleep in it slightly bent forward position. I don’t know, when the time comes to seriously look into getting a more comfortable bike I will probably look into a few different models before making up my mind.

[@paulkmaster3231]

14RS3 14RS3 thanks for reply back. It sounds like you need a more comfortable cruiser. Don’t get a Vrod it’s nowhere as comfy as the M109r. It’s probably your best bet the M109r then.

[@garysmith8455]

Thanks for the video. I would love to run up alongside a 9 or Vrod with my M-90. Lighter, smaller and great power! What do you think? Have you even seen one on the road? I seem to have the only one here in my area of MA.

[@richardwolfe8752]

A little late but I have a 13 M90 in RI/MA line

[@rolandkeith5322]

Great video man As a zx 14r & M109 owner my view is the bikes are very similar and it would come down to the rider and his skill level and weight plays a large roll as well. The M109R can take off very well by just dumping the clutch not sliding it off the line and shift @ just under 7k for the beat pass

[@howardmccauley7878]

Just get yourself a 2nd. generation V Max. Get yourself some of that.. The only bike that can beat a V Max is another one same thing.

[@one4chuckantel]

I concur

[@TheAdx1001]

Saw a zx14 give one a pretty good run. But it still fell SLIGHTLY short. It was crazy close

[@butteredbiskit3497]

What about the Triple?

[@kokobeatz7222]

The frames can’t even handle the torque. Could never trust one after hearing about that. You know their all beat.

[@seanmarchiny]

Dude on the m109r is ALOT heavier than you and do you see the time it takes him to shift? I could say your abc’s in between his shifts, put me on that m109r and I would smoke you lol I think, I am a really good shifter, launcher, and rider

[@paulkmaster3231]

Ok so if I put an equal weight rider with the same skills I have on the M109r then it would be the opposite outcome? Well I tried that when I owned a 2014 M109r vs my buddy’s 2012 Vrod I lost every time it wasn’t even close. So i don’t think you would smoke me. I would go against Ricky Gadsden and he would lose it’s that slow. That’s why I got rid of my M109r I got tired of getting beat up by my buddy. “Can’t beat em join um” Btw the top speed of an M109r is 125mph but the speedo says 140+ so everybody thinks omg....but look I personally think the M109r is better looking more comfortable more reliable and a better overall bike than a Vrod. I even did a video “top 5 muscle bikes no bs” where I ranked the M109r the best muscle cruiser so I’m not biased. I’m just telling the truth

[@allemem1]

V-Rod owner here x's 2 (great bikes) Awesome video! Two popular muscle cruisers going at it. There are so many variables at work here. The M109R is an 1800cc. The V-Rod Muscle is a 1250cc. The 109 has an intake & exhaust and if it's anything like the Muscle, it has to be tuned so it's not running lean. I saw that the Muscle had V & H 2 into 2 exhaust. So, let's assume they're both modded to a Stage 1. The riders are ~50lbs. apart and I heard the 109 smack the rev limiter a few times. I'd say it's pretty even. Both are quick for what they are.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks for watching and commenting. Awesome to hear you are a fellow Vrod owner. Congrats on owning the worlds fastest V twin power cruiser that actually looks like a cruiser. 2nd fastest would be the M109r. I have had the pleasure of owning both. 2014 M109r I bought brand new in response to my buddies 2012 Vrod Muscle. I would always lose against my buddies 2012 Vrod I bought a power commander 5 k+n air filters and debaffled my mufflers because every aftermarket exhaust I researched never showed more the 2hp increase at the time. The exception was revo exhaust but it cost $2000 ouch and no written guarantee of more hp just a “should give 5hp increase” so at that point I decided if I gotta put that kinda money into a gamble like that I might as well just by a Vrod Muscle and be done with it. That was in 2016 I bought my brand new at the time 2016 Vrod Muscle I had Harley install the V+H slip ons bought the screaming eagle tuner and Dyno tuned at Petersen N. Miami Harley. Raced my buddies 2012 Vrod Muscle minus the ABS mine had btw which weighs a couple pound more than his and I weigh more than him as well. I beat him repeatly. Not as bad as I got beat on the M109r but I would creep past him Vrod vs Vrod. So it’s not the rider. Anyways I’m hoping my friend will trade bikes with equal weight riders and try again.

[@allemem1]

@@paulkmaster3231 It's good to hear that you have real world experience. A lot of guys will simply make claims, based on speculation. I came from a CBR600RR and a GSXR750. I wanted to keep the performance aspect, but wanted something with some comfort. The V-rod fit the bill. My '16 Muscle is my second V and I love them. I bought it new, then installed V & H 2 into 2 pipes, K & N filter (topless), removed the screen covers from the front of the bike and added a Dynojet Micro Tuner. She put down 120rwhp. I also lowered the rear by 1" to close the fender gap. There were several factors that led to it, but Harley messed up by discontinuing this bike. ☹

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yeah it was crazy they let it die. 120hp is awesome and the lighter weight than other cruiser truly make it special. Enjoy please comment any time on any of my videos. I could use the support. Thank you

[@zozoa1]

I had a race with a vrod the other day on my m109r and literally left it standing it never got anywhere near me

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks for watching and commenting.

[@markurbancowboy]

If that's the case the Vrod rider didn't know how to ride.

[@Jsims111]

@@markurbancowboy That or he was racing somebody that was't trying to race him.

[@briankrasne3518]

All depends and I'm a more of a Japanese guy when it comes to bikes and that's off the point that there more reliable then American parts and aftermarket mods or more available then American bikes but I think both stock the vrod would walk slowly from the m109r but if you put a little quick shifter modification on that m109r. It would be the other way around but you would need riders within only a 10 pound weight difference tops for it to be a fair race

[@GBMatthew07]

Exactly fat man and couldn't handle his bike.

[@frankquercia3569]

Guys facts are facts ,just Google the quarter mile times and 0to60times ..v rod comes out on top in 6 different sites neither one of these two know how to take off or shift at the right time .v rod does not ring the gears enough ,while the m9 hits the limiter to much. Maybe they should switch bikes .geeez

[@scottdavis2711]

Inexperienced big heavy rider! That 109 r would toast you with the right rider! Nice v rod though.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks for watching and commenting I appreciate it

[@cartertwowheels3358]

Biggest problem the M109R has in any race is it's over geared. If you look at the gear ratios on the Vrod and M109R you'll find its extremely long geared with large gaps between the gears. If you cut 15-20% off the overall gearing it would make a big difference to how fast it could go. Also it would remove the clunky feel people often mention. Bit like changing from first to third to fifth... The motor speed is pulled down by the road speed unless you have very slow gear changes.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yes I agree good point👍

[@DickVanNiggz]

It’s got the torque to manage being geared longer though for sure, compared to the vrod especially, my vrod isn’t partying til 5000 plus rpm lol

[@donaldwayne4219]

Very Good point. Many people comment that they should be a 6 speed but you just learn to live with it, as everything around the transmission is pretty Awesome anyway 😁😁

[@detachedloop1004]

V rod's 0-60 is 3.5 seconds. What are these people talking about leaving it far behind? Yeah it's a m109r but it isn't going against the Fatboy it's a fucking V rod. It weighs a lot less than m109 and yet makes 122hp for the muscle and 125 for the night rod. You don't need to be too smart to guess the outcome.

[@nathanharshbarger9222]

And seemed like was shifting short. Ive went up against all kinds of bikes and haven't lost out the hole with only stage 1 if you know how far to push your bike iyts not likely you will loose out the hole even against rockets

[@picklerickc1375]

Vtx1800c VS VRod VS M109r. Someone needs to do an honest run of the three.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks for watching. It took me 3 years to get someone with an M109R to ride with. I actively seek out any and all power cruisers to ride with and compare. It’s much easier to get streetglide Roadglide Electra glides to ride together with. It’s a mystery to me. Why? But it turns out the M109R guy in video knows a vtx1800 owner we met. Let’s see if he will be interested.

[@picklerickc1375]

@@paulkmaster3231 my father in law is selling me his 1800n in two years for $3500. Can't wait to tune it up a bit and run some quarters with it. I can't really find any quality videos of the vtx's. I think they're an under appreciated bike, for what they are. I'd love to see, real time, how it stacks up with these other muscle bikes today

[@paulkmaster3231]

Nick Ladner I agree with you. The vtx1800 is a very under appreciated bike. It’s a great used bike value. In the $3k range with power and Honda reliability is hard to pass up! Hope you enjoy. God Bless you

[@rscar5]

@@paulkmaster3231 Hi Paul Try to find a c109r another unappreciated bike to go against .

[@alfrede.neuman8611]

As much as I like the VTX 1800 (and am the proud owner of one), it hasn't got a chance against these two bikes. It might be tight for about the first 500ft, because the VTX makes superior torque down low to either of them, but at the top end of the tach, the VTX runs out of steam and the other two keep pulling. Both, honest high-11-second bikes, where the VTX on its best day is a low-12-second bike. That's not to say the VTX is a slug. Its still as fast, or faster than all other competitors. The M109R and VRod are simply just in a league of their own as far as V-Twin Cruisers go.

[@user-er4nh7pq2d]

M109 would whoop it, get his big ass off it, he can’t even fit his foot under the shifter

[@pooliptico9700]

I own a 2008 stock m109r an they are a bloody fun bike. Love everything about it an is definitely my favourite of all the bikes I have owned. But one day I will have a vrod they are so God damn bloody beautiful. An the sound is amazing in my opinion much better the m109r even though it does still sound nice itself. But even just looking on paper at the specs there is no way I could see the m109r winning. M109r is 128hp (95.5kw), 160nm (118ft-lb) at 347kg (764lbs) wet weight. Vrod is 123hp (90.5kw), 115nm (86ft-lb) at 304kg (670lb) wet weight. That's only 5hp give or take and just over 40kg weight different it makes no sense to think that it would be able to beat a vrod. I mean if you chopped the crap out of the m109r an made it the same weight than In my opinion I reckon it would beat it but that's not possible. But for me in Australia a nice clean stock m109r is about 10k AUD. An a nice clean vrod is at the minimum 25k AUD an thats cheap if you could even find one for that price. So my opinion is that the m109r is way better for your buck atleast in Aus. I mean imagine spending the difference on the engine in the m109r than the vrod would have no chance. But I see no point in doing that as I like the m109r for what it is and for the price it is. But the vrod is one of the best looking bikes I have ever seen in my life an is definitely one of my dream bikes which I will have one day. I love my m109r an I wouldn't trade it for any bike I have had or ridden. Go the Vrod and go the m109r both are bloody beasts anyway.

[@paulkmaster3231]

One of the best comments I’ve had so far..thanks…I think the M109r is a better value and quite simply the better bike overall…back in 2014 I’ve had the 2014 M109r for 2years then traded it for the Vrod Muscle had it for 4 years then in 2020 traded it for the 2020 Vmax….The M109r is hands down the better overall bike out of the three!!! Thanks for watching and commenting from down under..God Bless you😇

[@dominicfarrow4048]

Nah he cant ride that m109r eats vrods

[@Eidrian111]

No it does not.

[@joshhawk392]

Yes it does in every way

[@doylee469]

What are you talking about man? Popular mechanics magazine couldn’t get past the 12 second mark on the quarter mile.. the rod does 11 seconds all day.. put your shit pride to the side for a min and get with the facts bud.. your bike isn’t all that fast, but yes it is a torque monster.

[@bobbysweeney5377]

Vrod absolutely beats the m109r man. I tested them both because they're both my favorites. I've riden multiples of each and ended up getting a vrscse2 because Holy Shhhh! Still, that R is a beautiful bad bike!

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yeah people get mad on both sides of the fence Vrod vs M109r. I owned both bikes for years. I personally believe the M109r is the better bike..cheaper more reliable more comfortable better brakes even without the Abs and even looks better....but when it comes to acceleration handling fuel mileage and sound the Vrod wins on those points

[@adolf6066]

It's a honor join your channels and your video's.... gad bless you brother and blessing your lovely family ..thank u sir

[@jasonvanderheyden3577]

That wasnt even a comparison that guy out weights you by 70lbs and he cant ride whatsoever

[@paulkmaster3231]

I owned both bikes I bought the 2014 M109r because people told me it’s as fast or faster than a Vrod and because it was cheaper. I bought it in response to my best buddy buying a 2012 Vrod Muscle. He smoked me every time we raced…it is so much faster than an M109R. I tried mods to get it closer ..I did exhaust I did intake I did PC5 none of it made it fast enough to change the outcome. People would say well maybe he is a better rider than you..well that’s not true. I got sick of getting smoked so I went and bought an identical denim black Vrod muscle it was a new 2016 at the time. Guess what I never lost a race against his 2012 Vrod Muscle ever again!!! Watch my videos you will see I owned both bikes. Watch my videos and see I now own a 2020 Vmax and a 2020 ZX14r…I’m not lying🙄 I know which is faster and I can tell you. Ricky Gadsden or Chris Moore couldn’t get an M109r to beat me on a Vrod Muscle!!! It’s that much faster. Find me a link where a M109r beats a Vrod I’d love to see it. Anyways thanks for watching and commenting

[@marcosreina1703]

Good video and thank you for your job,I have m109r 2014,but I don’t know to much about it,I appreciate you explaining to me about those bike,please

[@Aaron-ug9jb]

what exactly is this proving? Dude on the M109r is like 300 fuckin pounds, not to mention the bike itself is 780 pounds. Hes also not taking advantage of the M109r's power. this was....💤💤

[@paulkmaster3231]

So if you were on it I would only be like 4 bike lengths ahead instead of 5? Your right that would be less boring😎

[@TheTyrone1981]

Awesome video. I have an 09 muscle and an 05 R1. I haven’t ridden an m109 but sat on a couple and the sheer weight of the bike alone in comparison to the v rod is very noticeable. I’m sure it comes down to rider skill as stock for stock power output is close on both but I personally feel the v rod would be slightly quicker just because it’s quite a bit lighter than the m109. Both are great bikes but I’m sure factoring the added weight of the rider on that 109 didn’t help either. Nothing against him at all. Just simple physics lol. Ride safe!

[@paulkmaster3231]

I traded in my 2014 M109R for that 2016 Vrod Muscle. I bought both brand new. My friend had the 2012 Vrod Muscle me the 2014 M109R and would beat me on top end but I would usually get him to 60mph then he would pass me. I hope to do a 3 way comparison between the Nightrod vs Vrod Muscle vs M109R Boss in the future. Nice combination R1 and Vrod btw. Thanks for watching and commenting.

[@TheTyrone1981]

That’s awesome. I guess the extra few thousand rpms that the v rod engine is capable of spinning makes a big difference in the top end. That would be an awesome comparison. I’ll be staying tuned. Thanks I appreciate it. I get asked all the time which bike I like better. I like them both. Some days I feel to be on the r1 and other days the v rod. I will say if I had to sell one though the r1 would be on the chopping block lol. Still both are awesome bikes and a ton of fun to ride.

[@UncleRobsGarage]

Yeah I figured the V-Rod is at least a hundred and sixty-four pounds lighter than M109R it would be fun to race none the less I figured the V-Rod would be at least five bike lenths ahead by the end of 1/4 Mile.

[@aneebchaudary]

M109R is a BEAST!!!!

[@rscar5]

.HAPPY to see you back doing videos

[@paulkmaster3231]

Well I appreciate your kind words. God Bless you

[@scottfree9994]

Considering the BOSS rider was about 150 lbs over weight has a lot to do with it too.

[@rubbersatin]

Great video! Love to get in there with my 85 V65 Sabre. I think you guys might have some trouble lol

[@paulkmaster3231]

Those are super cool bikes the Sabre V65. Thanks for watching. Please check out some of my other videos

[@rubbersatin]

@@paulkmaster3231 will do!!

[@justinirwin7881]

M109 would smoke that non stock hardley if the rider could stay off limiter and lose 150 lbs

[@oldaxehead655]

The Suzuki is also 90lbs heavier, and with a rider weight as stated at least 50 lbs heavier that's gonna slow you down a bit. Not that this was a real race, I'd still take the M109 for looks and reliaibility.

[@darthzoidberg7850]

With that exhaust and air cleaners and no tune the m109 is almost certainly down on power, when you change the intake and exhaust characteristics you have to get it mapped or you just paid to lose power!

[@IntoTheWildernessBushcraft]

Paul shifts a whole lot quicker makes a huge difference. Awesome video.

[@charlieryan1736]

Congratulations on your new ride 👍🏻 glad I found your channel just subscribed.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thank you for subscribing and watching and commenting 👍👍👍

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thank you for subscribing and watching and commenting 👍👍👍

[@draganm7823]

Glad to see you posting videos again. According to quarter mile times the VRod is faster but not by much so rider skill and weight are definite factors. Ride safe!

[@paulkmaster3231]

Excellent comment. Thanks Dragan M hope everything ok for you too!

[@draganm7823]

Thank you, its still cold here In Winnipeg, Canada but I've had the bike out twice. Ride safe!

[@windycityrider]

That 109 sounds like it still has the rev limiter on it and should be eating that vrod for lunch!

[@rossbrumby1957]

2 power bands? Others call that 1 flat spot which is corrected by a t.r.e. My 07 109r has a t.r.e. and k&n filters and baffle centres removed. No flat spot but at town speeds the throttle is a little twitchy and over responsive over rough patches in the road- every pothole struck gets a blap from the exhaust!

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yes a flat spot that’s right thanks for correcting me! I never tried a tre on that bike it did wonders for my Vfr1200f. Always wondered if my old 2014 M109R with tre and speed govenor removed could beat a Vrod. Never got any real rear wheel Dyno numbers on M109R anywhere. The Vrod has tons of Dyno numbers. I had the one in this video Dyno’ day 111.53hp and 80ft lbs at Petersen Harley @ the North Miami 441 store. The only Dyno numbers I saw was power cruiser showdown which had M109R showing only 90hp and the Night-rod Vrod version @107hp. I thought it was a low number but still it’s lower than Vrod horsepower. Torque is the opposite M109R has tremendous amounts of abundant torque vs Vrod minuscule 80ft lbs. it’s why the M109R feels so much faster Imo. For most people the M109R is a better bike cheaper more comfortable more torque better brakes much better pillion arguably better looking. But all out speed and acceleration 9000 redline and better sounding as well imo is why I now own the Vrod.

[@rossbrumby1957]

Yeah, value is key for me as when the Vrod came out I thought they looked shit hot ( and I never liked harleys so that's saying something!) But would never afford one. The 40,000 km 109 cost me AU$8700 last november ( live in South Australia) compared to the cheapest Vrod here at around $10k for a really sad example. Coincidentally 07 was the first time i laid eyes on a 109 in Harley Heaven in Adelaide! Then new price was AU$ 16990.

[@rossbrumby1957]

My tre has a remotely mounted red led gear indicator. From what I read, my model didn't have it's own.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Ross Brumby yes my 2014 M109R had a factory gear indicator the Vrod doesn’t have a gear indicator. I loved the look of the instruments on the M109R but the Vrod gauges are in a more visible location. The M109R is also more comfortable except it’s girth at the foot controls are very wide. I should really do a detailed comparison between the two bikes. As soon as I can get the keys from my buddy’s M109R I’ll do it PS if I had known at the time I would have made that modification on my M109R with the TRE and gear indicator. It made a big difference on my VFR the front end would come up in 1st gear at 70mph!!! Stock this does not happen. Factory nanny to keep it safer I guess and like you said it’s a little too responsive(M109R)with all 100% of that torque in the lower gears.😁

[@psychospyder2283]

It depends on rider experience and habits. I've smoked several V-rods on a '08 C-90 (1/8 mi drag strip).

[@adbyrd29]

I have had both the m109r and a vrod at the same time and the m109r is more powerful the vrod is smaller and lighter but the m109r is just brute force the m is faster.

[@ejf2461]

VROD does 11.20's stock M109 does 12.40's. You need a couple of subscriptions to Motorcycle Magazines!

[@paulkmaster3231]

The first gen Vrod recorded a 11.20 1/4 mile. Someone posted an 11.6 on “0-60 times” website for the m109r and the Vrod Muscle. I’ve never seen any other place the M109r posted an 11 second run. I’ve seen three places that shows Vrods doing 11 sec runs. When I bought my 2014 M109r new I expected it to be close in acceleration to my friends 2012 Vrod Muscle. Boy was I wrong!!! I was a better rider than him so it would be close up to 60mph but after that he would blow past me. All the BS mods I did exhaust power commander 5 intake didn’t do shit for that bike it kept getting blown away by my buddies Vrod. The only thing all that stuff did was make it louder and ruin my fuel economy. I believed all the garbage the M109r bloggers would say about how they beat Vrods all the time and how much faster it was then the Vrod all bullshit!!! I know now it’s mostly people that hate Harley’s and they start believing and inventing stories and are in echo chambers. I saw a blogger say he owned both bikes the M109r and the Vrod and the Vrod was faster. They talked shit about him and questioned the validity of that claim etc...Now I’m that guy! I didn’t want to believe that guy and now I am that guy! A Vrod will bitch slap an M109r. You won’t find one video on KZbin that proves otherwise. M109r guys can blame all kinds of things the guys weight he can shift he can’t ride etc... I gave him the hit both times and the Vrod would reel him and any M109r every time. I live in south Florida anyone out there with a M109r come over and prove me wrong. I won’t be mean I’ll be nice I won’t disrespect you just come over and see for yourself.

[@ejf2461]

@@paulkmaster3231 M109 is a Good Looking Bike. I'm old school and Cruisers have gotten slower over the last 30 years not faster. All of the so called power cruisers are slow. Vulcan 2000, M109, Mean Streak, Raider, VTX 1800, Rocket 3 and even the Vrod which is faster then all those mentioned and the only one that does Low 11's all of the other are Mid 12's on a good day! In my day a Yamaha Vmax & Kawasaki Eliminator both would break into the 10's stock and that's 1985 and they had carbs!

[@1914Lolo]

M109 tops out about 25mph faster...one is quicker one is faster...

[@kokobeatz7222]

I weigh a buck 30. And I know have the advantage on most bikers. The bikes basically driving itself. And it’s a vtx1800

[@donniem6191]

He’s a really good rider if he only had that bike a week. I’m a big dude and glad your video shows how big he is

[@MrGuitarguyadam]

What ever was your actual outcome on this a year later? Did you get to ride his bike or another newer M109r Boss??

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks for asking. Nothing has happened yet. Hard to get the guy to trade with GoPro on. I’m hoping for a good pilot for my vrod while I’m riding his. In the meanwhile my 19yr old daughter has taken over my Vrod. You can see that on my channel. With so much stuff going on it’s tough to get things resolved

[@ju-r1d3r28]

Cool video.. We're from the same area.. all of us have m109r. We go to cafe 27 a lot too.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Here’s my email [e-mail] 😀👍

[@dwoaks1]

I think it is mainly a skill issue plus the weight difference.

[@kevinfox500]

I think it's all.oc the above, and that it would be interesting to revisit this, after he has a season on that 109. The other question is, beyond.the weight of the rider, what are the power to weight ratios of both bikes? That would also matter, in the end result. Before I wound up with dad's VTX 1800, we lined my 79 XS Eleven against it, for shits and giggles, and found that the X, at 720 dry, and the Eleven, at roughly 550 dry, with both of us around 200 pounds, was actually a pretty close match, as we both had time on the bikes, and a couple decades of riding under our belts, at that point (he's coming up on 50 years.of riding, I'm just shy of 40, having started on dirt, at 5 years old. ) The X makes more power than the Eleven, but pounds per ft lbs, and hp, are almost identical. Great video, and I would love to see a revisit at a later date.

[@IndianChallengerRiders]

Would love to race both of you on my Big Bore + Cam Kit Patrick Racing warrior :D

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks for watching and commenting come on down to Hollywood and join us. Your from Orlando ?

[@IndianChallengerRiders]

@@paulkmaster3231 no brother I am actually in Boynton beach that's where I live. I am currently on the west coast of Florida because I'm going to Leesburg and visiting family over here. So you are down in Hollywood that's cool we should meet up when I'm back and record some VIDS for our channels! I'm a Motovlogger too

[@paulkmaster3231]

Awesome email me when you get a chance [e-mail]

[@paulkmaster3231]

GD Warrior perfect I am always going north my Family live in palm beach off Northlake blvd

[@IndianChallengerRiders]

@@paulkmaster3231 are you on facebook? If yes add me brother facebook.com/GDWARRIOR

[@AFRO_KEEN]

The guy on the M 109 seemed like a new rider.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yeah he is not a new rider. His last bike was a Honda Sabre 1300. Before that I’m not sure. He also has a Kawasaki ZX6r in good condition sitting in his garage.

[@AFRO_KEEN]

@@paulkmaster3231 From the way you handled your bike you look like a rider but from the way he handled the m109 he does not look like a rider. He looked very hesitant to open it up. The way he launched the bike is a disgrace to the M108 community. It's more like cowardlyness in the face of the v-rod enemy.

[@paulkmaster3231]

blackspades0000 I don’t know how to emphasis this more I gave him the hit. I never rolled full throttle till he did!!! I also don’t know how to emphasis this enough I owned a 2014 M109R with mods and would lose against inferior Vrod riders. Proof I beat all other Vrods with my Vrod that used to beat me!!! That’s why I switched. I got to say the only thing a Vrod does better than a M109R is accelerate and sounds better that’s it!!! The M109R is a better bike but just not faster. Thanks for commenting please check out my other videos including me on my old M109R

[@AFRO_KEEN]

@@paulkmaster3231 I see what you are saying. You are saying that from your experience you find the v-rod to be faster. From my research and experience Suzukis are poor when it comes to low end power. If you want to race with a Suzuki you have to know how to manipulate it low and midrange power. If I was into racing on the streets I would pick a Ninja 14R which I started to get before I purchased the M109. I did not buy the 14R because a lot of power and a lot of power and performance at your finger tips leads to temptation. The M108 keeps me grounded and it gives me enough speed for me to get away from cars. Other than the M108 I would choose a Ninja 14R. I owned a tuned down ninja 600 cruiser for 16 years. I find there is no performance and acceleration like what the ninja 600 gives you.

[@paulkmaster3231]

blackspades0000 ZX14r is no joke and yes it’s amazing performance can get a person in trouble with the law or in the hospital or morgue quickly. 100% agree performance cruisers are the way to go fast enough to have a blast but tame enough to live a little longer and hold on to your drivers license!

[@max.t.channel]

I've got 109r and feel like going to a gym after watching this vid )

[@paulkmaster3231]

You would probably get better results going to your Harley dealership😁

[@darrellrogers5044]

Who won?

[@motomark9736]

I believe in the 8th mile the vtx will compete with either of these it would depend on who's the best rider I ride a vtx so I'm not just saying this it's from experience I've been beat and I've won a few too

[@kokobeatz7222]

MotoMark I can eat 600s on my vtx. Been riding sport bikes most my life finally switched the the muscle cruiser because cops don’t bug you. Speeding and all. The dudes on 600s are always so surprised. It’s fun. Lol.

[@jeffwolfe3844]

He obviously does not know how to ride that bike. Every V-Rod I came across with my M109R could not keep up with me. I had Cobra pipes, a power commander, and a chip.

[@paulkmaster3231]

I had a 2014 M109r for 2 years K+N filters power commander 5 debaffled exhaust. After being humiliated time after time by my buddies 2012 Vrod Muscle I traded in for this 2016 Vrod Muscle I never lost against any M109r not even close except right off the line because of the M109r’s superior torque. Never lost to my buddies 2012 Vrod Muscle either even though both are identical even the pipes and screaming eagle tuner with Dyno tune are exactly the same. The exception is mine has optional ABS which weighs a couple pound more. I have tried to get the owner of this m109r to trade bikes with me to race. He is not willing as yet. But I will definitely post a new video if anything changes. I’m shocked to hear you are beating Vrod’s left and right. Vrod’s have superior horsepower and much lighter over 100lbs lighter. I wish I could have made my M109r as fast as my current Vrod I would have definitely kept it. M109r is more comfortable stronger brakes looks very slick and a couple thousand dollars cheaper.

[@adbyrd29]

The guy on the m109r doesn't know how to ride I'm heavy too and I was racing a sport bike off the line and he had a hard time keeping up for a while

[@coolkatz9012]

Difference like having a pillion on the back.

[@omgwtflmaololrotfl2368]

Damn they made 60...give them a round of applause

[@JetCooper3D]

Like to see them up against my Rocket 2020.... it's pretty fast as a muscle cruiser. All three are great bikes.

[@robertblair4647]

Pretty even, nice

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks again for watching and commenting on one of my videos and again I appreciate it

[@kkapalle]

Well the Vrod has a Porsche designed engine, Harley never be able to build these kind of balanced engine. only the M109r has more torque

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yeah check out VR1000 engine from Harley way before Porsche was involved. The Porsche engine looks like an exact copycat from Harleys racing engine look it up for yourself and compare. The same exact looking valvetrain head design etc… But let’s forget about that for a second what about the latest Revolution engines variable valve timing etc..in the Pan America the Sportster S and Nightster? They aren’t balanced engines? Hey Klaus the Sportster S is more powerful and lighter and has an extra gear VS the “Porsche” Vrod muscle 5 speed. The M109r is a complete turd compared to either the Sportster S or the Vrods. I know about the M109r I had a 2016 M109r I bought new for two years traded it in for the Vrod Muscle. Sorry for commenting but I get annoyed when people hate on Harley. I love Harleys but I also enjoy my 2020 VMAX And my 2020 ZX14r But nothing compares to the enjoyment I get when I’m riding my Streetglide Special. Must be that unbalanced engine😉

[@robb4964]

It isn't a porsche designed engine. It's based on Harleys VR racing engine.

[@zato6226]

M109R rider rolls on the throttle during take off instead of whacking it open and the he looks like he weighs at least 250lb and you weigh maybe 170?. Put the same weight rider with some take off skill and I think he'll take you. I know cause I have an M109R and I've walked away from VRods.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thank you for watching and commenting. I wished my old 2014 M109r would have walked away from my friends 2012 Vrod Muscle. Never happened though which led to my purchasing this 2016 Vrod Muscle so now I beat his 2012 Vrod Muscle .

[@diningroomfish5470]

M109R all day, i know i would smoke that vrod

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yeah I owned a 2014 M109r for two years. My buddy had a 2012 Vrod muscle. I bought that M109r with the specific purpose in mind to smoke that Vrod! Never happened! Didn’t happen with a PC5 air filters and exhaust mods. I knew I was a better rider as well. If I got the hit on him it would be close to about 60 maybe me ahead by a wheel right at 60mph but then my jaw would just drop after that. The top end power of a Vrod is insane for a cruiser. When after 2years of ownership and no one offering mods other then NOS or turbo that could beat a Vrod I gave in. I traded in the M109r for the Vrod Muscle. First thing I did was tell my buddy I got a surprise for him. I was still in the break in period I didn’t care I just wanted to kick his ass and that’s what I did. Alot of M109r owners comment saying what you say but I know better. Been there done that including talking smack. I live in south Florida I will ride a hundred miles in any direction for any M109r that can beat my Vrod Muscle. I will even post it on KZbin. I have V+H slip ons screaming tuner with high flow filters and a tune from Petersens Harley Miami. That’s an open challenge that no one has taken yet other then this video

[@diningroomfish5470]

@@paulkmaster3231 you are in Florida, I'm in Philadelphia, you're lucky, because you WILL LOSE

[@paulkmaster3231]

John Llewellyn lol sure I would👍Either way thanks for commenting and watching

[@diningroomfish5470]

@@paulkmaster3231 so you really think you will win,tell me

[@supergrendel]

Can't wait to see the new Rocket 3 vs both of these bikes. Come on you have to!

[@paulkmaster3231]

It’s already been done with the old Rocket3 vs Vrod vs Vmax vs Diavel. Diavel and Vmax will smoke a Rocket3 even the newest version.

[@supergrendel]

Paulk Master Oh I’m sure but I’m talking about the new rocket 3 vs the Harley muscle and the m109r.

[@paulkmaster3231]

supergrendel if the old Rocket 3 is faster than the old Vrod...obviously the newer bigger 2.5 liter bike is more powerful than the old 1.25 liter Vrod Muscle. As well as having an extra cylinder and twice the capacity and bigger price tag it better be more powerful right?

[@shadwox9808]

i had a kawasaki nomad 1700 and pick up some green light action from time to time was looking for those 2 bike for my next purchase than ive tried a kawasaki GTR 1400O or the KAWASAKI CONCOURS and ho boy i was sold to the connie from green light to green light its a beast sure its not a cruiser but i found a new way a new style with years on a custom bike it was a big reveal for me. Comfort and power at the same time cant beat it. Ride safe mate ps: i think your friend miss experience on is bike and your know your way on your bike big advantage for you.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yes a “Connie” would smoke a Vrod or a M109R and more comfortable as well. I know all about sport touring it’s great!!! Thanks for watching and commenting!

[@nathanharshbarger9222]

I'm in Williston ND. Love to show what my 03 with 35,000 miles would do against a 109 any takers

[@paulkmaster3231]

Never once had a M109r owner take that challenge online. I even put an open invitation on M109riders.com to anyone in south Florida to come and challenge me. One guy said “oh yeah we are a group of M109r riders that ride regularly go to Cafe 27(a local biker hangout) we will meet with you”. I left them an invitation to let me know when to meet and my email address no response. I owned an M109r a 2014 model for 2yrs which I bought new in response to my friends 2012 Vrod Muscle. M109riders.com regularly blogged that the M109r was just a fast and much less expensive than a Vrod. I thought if the M109r is just as fast as a Vrod then maybe an exhaust and a power commander and other minor mods will do the rest to beat my friends Vrod Muscle. Especially with all that money I saved surely I will beat his Vrod spending that money towards making my M109r faster. Big mistake!!! He smoked my M109r when it was stock he smoked my M109r when I did all those mods these M109r guys keep talking about. I literally could have simply bought Vrod Muscle for all the money needed to beat a Vrod Muscle so I said to myself. If you can’t beat them join them! Needless to say after I traded in my 2014 M109r for a brand new 2016 Vrod Muscle I never again lost to my friends 2012 Vrod Muscle!

[@pacific7775]

Porsche knows how to do fast well

[@gamergilbert6927]

I just like bikes goddamn harley vs suzuki ! Really put me on that 109 I eat that harley for breakfast .hes lagging the clutch and not eating all his rpms before switching gears. But my point being comeback in 30yrs and do ty he same race.see which one is still around .with the same engine ,quote if they continue to treat them like that neither will.........

[@claytonkokotailo6337]

I hate to say it but the drag pipes on the 9er don't help alot. You lose the bottom end of the bike. I run OE exhaust with scorpion tips only and it is great. Wish we were closer, would love to give her a run. Cheers.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Wish you were closer too. I would be pleasantly surprised if an M109R would walk me. I tried and failed to make my M109R a Vrod beater. The guy from Sweden which also commented said the TRE mod really makes a huge difference. It tricks the computer into thinking it’s in 3rd or 4rth gear. That eliminates the power limiter in 1st and second also speed governor in top gear eliminated. It almost makes me want to try again! BTW those drag pipes don’t sound very good as well as being way to loud. I think a slightly muffled M109R sounds much nicer. Anyways thanks for the great comment

[@claytonkokotailo6337]

@@paulkmaster3231 I done the xtre. I put it in in the morning and took it back out the next morning. I rode the day and was unhappy as it seemed to reduce torque but it did increase top end. It was almost like riding in 4th all day, felt like a loss but some swear by it. If I were to do the next upgrade it would be a PCM reflash.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Clayton Kokotailo wow thanks for the insight on that. I thought maybe it could have been something I should have tried on my 2014 M109R. I had a bazaaz spark retard delete on my VFR1200f always shows 3rd gear in 1st and 2nd. It would pull the front wheel up at 79mph no clutch in first. A stock VFR1200f won’t do that. Back when I owned the M109R I didn’t want to lose my gear indicator by installing the TRE. I was skeptical it would improve performance so I never tried it. I will say that I miss my old M109R it was big comfy and and super torquey. Plus it looks better as well. I gotta start bugging my buddy to trade bikes his M109R for my Vrod for awhile

[@joshhawk392]

Dude cant shift or launch and the weight difference.....m109r is way faster

[@paulkmaster3231]

It wouldn’t make a difference the M109r is not going to win. The reason I own a Vrod Muscle is because I got tired of being humiliated by my friends Vrod Muscle. So i traded in my 2014 M109r and bought the 2016 Vrod Muscle. I live in south Florida if you know anyone with a fast M109r that thinks it’s quicker and faster come on down. I’ve been asking for 4 years now no m109r has won yet not even close. The closest race I’ve seen was me on my M109r and my friends Vrod almost even to 60mph then he just walks away every time. Vrods are very fast top end. If you ever beat one with an M109r trust me he is a shit rider or he wasn’t racing. Please give me any evidence of a M109r beating a Vrod Muscle or a Nightrod Special. I’d love to see it!!!

[@alfrede.neuman8611]

Good runs, but I think you beat the driver on this one. Your buddy on the M109R is either bouncing off the rev limiter, short shifting, or shifting as slow as my grandmother on every run. Anytime I've ever seen these two bikes go, it seems to be a drivers race between them. In this case...that driver, was you. lol

[@JohnDoe-nz6bk]

Both great bikes!

[@danbooher5843]

Nice picture of the sky 😊

[@davidekelman5715]

M109 needs another rider. Both are cool bikes.

[@Jandejongjong]

Why you call it boss?

[@asylumvideos9358]

Just got my muscle out of hd shop with more upgrades..wow is it hard to find honest hard work from hd anymore😥 nice vid btw

[@paulkmaster3231]

yes true that. Its hard to get good honest work anywhere. Thanks for your comment and watching

[@Guzzilunatic]

Unfortunate that they put the aftermarket pipes on the M109. The stock system is better than those drags, by far.

[@jpayton680]

All in good fun but weight and skill does make a difference

[@robertburgher2348]

I'm 5ft 8in and 250lbs,I've been riding big cc size bikes for 31 years now,put me on that bike and I'd leave that vrod behind.he may be a big boy too but I do think its more of new bike to him and need more skill and riding time on it.

[@mitchellwhite1540]

It's that the vrod give u power in each year i have a2009 vrod vrscaw and who ever owned before me took very good care of it .it has a power command and jetpak kit Vance and Hines 2 into 1 exhaust i race i crouch Kawasaki 1400 the wanted to give me $8000 for it i turned him down one of my brother friends he was like damn.that bike is no joke

[@gwilliamwallace]

The M109R with the right rider will smoke the Harley V-Rod every time.

[@paulkmaster3231]

I’ve owned both bikes. I bought the M109r first because so many people said it’s quicker and faster than the Vrod plus it was a couple grand cheaper. Plus my buddy had a 2012 Vrod muscle and wanted to kick that bikes ass. So I bought a brand new at the time 2014 M109r they never let me test ride Btw I had to buy it to test ride it. I already test rode both the Nightrod and The Vrod Muscle. They didn’t feel as powerful to me as the M109r anyways. So i couldn’t wait to wipe that smile of my buddies face by smoking the Vrod Muscle. We lined up I got the hit on him at the light man I was ahead till I hit about 60 and he was overtaking me and that Suzuki just couldn’t get it done. The Vrod will win every time. Like I said the M109r feels faster but runs out of steam the faster the engine revs to its 7800 redline. The Vrod goes to 9000 building all the way to redline. The faster the roll on the worse it gets for the M109r. If you beat any Vrod they either weren’t racing like you thought they were or they are horrible racers. After adding a power commander 5 High flow air cleaners and modded exhaust to the M109r it didn’t make much of a difference against my friends Vrod he beat me just as bad. So people will say I must have sucked at racing then. To which I say when I traded in my M109r to buy my new at the time 2016 Vrod Muscle. I went back to challenge my Vrod buddy. I didn’t even break in my bike because I couldn’t wait. 2016 Vrod Muscle versus 2012 Vrod muscle almost exact copies but mine has ABS adds weight and I’m 20lb heavier as well. I didn’t smoke him but I did beat him every time because I’m a better drag racer than him. George Wallace if you are ever in South Florida bring your M109r and I’ll give you the hit first or if you know of anyone in this area With a M109r I will give the same. I left messages on M109riders.com with zero responses I called a M109r customizations specialist in Miami for a challenge no takers so far. I would love to see one that’s even close in performance and not the three or four bike lengths in the dust. Here’s the biggest giveaway I’ve heard of only 4 people that have ever owned both a Vrod Muscle and a M109r. Starting with a person that posted on M109riders and even I thought he was lying but I think his post was removed because of hate. His experience was exactly like mine the M109r is slower I remembered his statements after I got beat by my buddies Vrod. And three other people all said the same. Not all of them thought the m109r was a bad bike but simply not as fast as the Vrod. If you see a Vrod stop him and make him your friend trade bikes and challenge each other see for yourself. That’s what I did just to get this video

[@gwilliamwallace]

@@paulkmaster3231 I stand corrected thank you. I was out of line and speaking from knowledge gleaned second hand. I'm actually a bigger fan of the V-rod than the M109 to he honest though I own neither of them. Thanks for setting me straight. Now about that drag race. I'll bring my CB1000R and I bet it'll be close. :)

[@paulkmaster3231]

George Wallace you are a scholar and a gentleman sir thank you. And no I don’t think it’ll be close versus your cb1000r super naked I think yours will smoke both these bikes without a sweat. My money would be on your Honda. Btw you don’t know it but there’s a cb1100 behind us and he could keep up no problem and yours is much more powerful than a cb1100 retro bike. Very few people have your good character on KZbin God Bless you

[@gwilliamwallace]

@@paulkmaster3231 Thanks brother. I happen to have a CB1100 too. It's a great bike but you're right it's nowhere near the rocket that CB1000R is. But boy is it ever comfortable as a chill out ride. I put a set of full Arrow race headers on the CB1100 to emulate my 44 year old CB550 with Kerker headers. Those headers allow me to go from stealth mode with the stock canister to wake the neighborhood mode with the Arrow Pro muffler. And just to show what a schizophrenic bike nut I really am I have a 2018 DCT GoldWIng Bagger. I never in a million years said I'd get the DCT but I did and it is just a wicked machine in Sport mode. And a great big pussycat otherwise. Bikes make life worth living.

[@lokeriksson]

Switch bikes and try again, love to look at your videos. The snow its almost gone now here in Sweden, so my Vrod will see the light soon. take care

[@paulkmaster3231]

thanks for watching and commenting all the way from Sweden that is awesome!!!

[@9mmnelson140]

This is what people race when afraid of speed. Why not tractor pull?

[@mrboat580]

The 109 sounded a little roached in the valve train.

[@paulkmaster3231]

It’s a brand new bike with less than 1800 miles at the time of this video. Only the pipe the intake and a PC5 were done on it. Btw as I have said many times I owned a 2014 M109r that I bought new and did exhaust and intake and PC5 as well it didn’t make much of a difference and would get beat by my friends 2012 Vrod Muscle every time. I got tired of losing and traded in my 2014 M109r for a new at the time 2016 Vrod Muscle put V+H pipes and screaming eagle tuner and Dyno tuned by Petersen Harley North Miami so it’s not modified anymore than this M109r.

[@mrboat580]

@@paulkmaster3231 It was that popping I heard when someone was letting off. Reminded me of the sound of a warped exhaust valve, like one might hear on a well beat motor. Again around the 2:16 mark.

[@paulkmaster3231]

Mr Boat popping on deceleration is usually caused by over rich fuel mixture not a burnt exhaust valve. A warped exhaust valve would get no compression therefore it would just be a dead cylinder not a backfire. Either way it wouldn’t have anything to do with power it’s on deceleration. I’m an ASE certified Master L1 advanced engine performance technician certified for over 30years now. I hear all kinds of off the wall ideas from people that don’t know what they are talking about. I’m sorry if you didn’t like the outcome of this video but as a previous M109r owner and current Vrod owner I know first hand which bike is quicker and faster. I’m amazed how I got “duped” into buying an M109r in the first place. I listened and read too many M109r forums and blogs about how it blows away the Vrod. I thought to myself what’s the worst it could be at least they are very close in comparison and they aren’t. The Vrod blows it away! I purchased my 2014 M109r in response to my buddies 2012 Vrod Muscle I thought I could save thousands of dollars and have a competitive bike vs his. Big mistake I lived with it for 2 years and modifications to get it faster didn’t make much of a difference. I traded it in got this 2016 Vrod Muscle and never got beat again by my buddies 2012 Vrod Muscle. I would trade my Vrod in today for a M109r if there was a way I could make it beat the Vrod without power adders. It’s a better bike in a lot of ways but not in performance or sound.

[@theoriginalmungaman]

The 109 has 1783cc the vrod 1250cc. The 109 has 128hp the vrod 122hp. If the vrod had 1783cc’s it would be in the 150hp range!

[@paulkmaster3231]

I know when I had my m109r 1800cc and got beat by my friends Vrod 1200cc I though omg I’m like a 600cc sportbike more and still got beat!!! Just another reason why I switched to the Vrod. Sorry if I get long winded but I remember back when I was trying to figure out if a M109r could beat my friends Vrod I looked on M109riders.com to get what I thought would be an honest assessment on which one was faster. Everyone of those guys were saying the M109r blows away or plain beats a Vrod. But there was one guy on there that said he had both the M109r and The Vrod he said straight up that Vrod would beat it every time. Everyone hated him and I didn’t chose to believe him either. $12000 mistake plus more money in mods that didn’t do enough to get it to beat my friends Vrod muscle. I liked the Suzuki it was fun and comfy and I still think it looks just as beautiful maybe more than the Vrod. But I got sick of the smack talking and shocked my buddy and bought my Vrod muscle.i never lost against him ever since!!!! Lol People keep saying it depends on the rider trust me you have to be Ricky Gadsden on the M109r and me on the Vrod and I’m pretty damn sure I’m still gonna win but it might be close

[@mikebuckingham5486]

I would think the Vrod would be faster. The guy on the other bike definitely has some weight issues. Also, it didn't help his cause by not trying to tuck in a little more and take away some of the air drag. Great vid bro! Glad you're back. Glad you bought a fast bike! Love those Vrods

[@paulkmaster3231]

Yeah tough to get all the variables equal.Thank you for watching Mike. God bless you. Our family wishes you the very best!!! Always good to hear from you Mike. Hope all is well. Again God Bless you

[@mikebuckingham5486]

Thanks brother! Finally able to start enjoying the FZ-10 again. Haven't been on her in several months. Raced a Ferrari last weekend was doing well over 100mph when my front wheel came off the ground. Was pulling him pretty good but shut it down after that. Definitely got my attention. Lol! God bless you and the Mrs. as well!

[@WilliamJohnson-bc3wd]

Couldn’t launch and hitting rev limiter I have a 07 109r (116hp rear tire)and my mother has 16 vrod muscle and it’s basically who shifts first... Put a driver mod to it and results would be different

[@williambartram2934]

dude on m109 cant ride

[@jefflb1961]

The 109 rider is terrible. The weight definitely impacts the bike, but He couldn’t launch for crap, and slow shifting along with hitting rev limiter. He looks like he’s just started riding. Honestly, he’s horrible at drag racing. You switch bikes and results would be the same if not worse.

[@blainhawkins7648]

That 109 is a beast but it's ugly

[@paulkmaster3231]

I own the Vrod now I still think the m109r looks better but won’t own another one again

[@jp1234554321]

I outweigh my friend by 30lbs. Hes on a 109r me on a v-rod. I pulled him on the highway (5th gear pull) The carnage would have been far worse had we been at a dragstrip.

[@bigdaddypatty2420]

No you didn't lol

[@williamhustonrn6160]

dang man, was worried you got hurt or something... not seen a video from you in a minute

[@paulkmaster3231]

Thanks for caring. I’m ok I got rid of most of my bikes. I still ride everyday rain or shine. I hope you enjoyed the video. Feel free to recommend content I will try to get back to Vlogging more. Appreciate your concern I’m ok I hope you are the same. God bless you

[@jamesanderson562]

He didn't want to push the 109 up high Into the gear 🤣 hes got more and just needs more time on the bike I bounce rev limiter on my intruder 1400

[@glickmpb]

I had a 2013 M109R and now have a 2018 VMax. The VMax will eat both of those bikes without issue.

[@paulkmaster3231]

So what! Both those two bikes look and sound better than a Vmax. Vmax does not look like a cruiser at all. The styling reminds me of an 80’s Japanese “custom”. I ride everyday. I ride in cruiser group rides for years and years and never seen a Vmax ride in a group ever. Always the solo bike rider because they don’t fit in. I also ride sportbikes in groups for years never seen a Vmax. To be honest the 90 mile range and slow top end speeds only 140ish top speed would get blown away by the sportbikes I ride.

[@glickmpb]

@@paulkmaster3231 Sound is completely subjective and I disagree. The VMax doesnt look like a cruiser? Ok.... The blacked out version of the 2018 looks awesome, to me, and thats what sold me on it. Its small for its size but it is most definitely a cruiser. Ill give you the 90 mph range sux, but most knew that when they bought the bike. I didnt buy it for long distance riding. That is exactly what my Goldwing is for. Top end speed is 140ish??? Um, its actually considerably higher than that. Considering the VMax is still one of the fastest, if not THE fastest cruiser after 30 years, its a testament to how awesome the bike truly is. It smokes the M109R in every category too. As for riding in groups... Who cares!? You are trying to discredit the VMax in such childish ways it isnt funny. GIve the bike its due... Everything I said in my original post is totally true and let me add this... The price of the VMax makes it an incredible buy for anyone who is looking for raw power. It blows everything out of the water and nothing come close.

[@paulkmaster3231]

glickmpb I literally talk to and ride with 100 different people of which almost all the cruiser riders would say it doesn’t look like a cruiser. You say it out performs a M109r in every category how about fuel range? How about price? How about no cruiser riders ride with you. I just got done riding with a VTX1800 and a M109r with my streetglide they both commented how awesome to Streetglide sounds. They said its just right! I say that because you know nobody on this planet is going to confuse a V4 exhaust note for a Vtwin. Price $18k is pretty steep I can save $4000 and buy a ZX14r and kick VMAX’s around like they are standing still. This is in my plans btw. If you want ultimate performance don’t waste money on a cruiser by a ZX14r or a literbike super sport. For the same or less money. I’m sorry but I ride a lot with cruisers and I don’t wanna be a third wheeler with the weird bike. If it comes to that I’ll just bring a ZX14r with my alpine starvleather body armored jacket might as well. If you enjoy it that’s awesome I’m happy for you I really am. So don’t get me wrong I’ve fantasized about owning a Vmax 2nd gen as well but then I had some reality checks. Big $$$ plus I’m going solo and might as well get that big ZX14r I keep thinking about.

[@glickmpb]

@@paulkmaster3231 What I find comical is that you think your dick is bigger because you "ride with a lot of other motorcyclists.." Dude, who cares!? I couldnt care less what you or other people think!! I dont buy motorcycles based upon what other people think, nor do I do anything based upon what other people think. As I said, the VMax outperforms a M109 in every category and you asking about fuel mileage is a joke. Personally, I would never own another Harely for reasons that MANY other people share, so Im glad you like how your Streetglide sounds. To me, its nothing more than noise. lol As far as price... I paid $16k for my new VMax and couldn't care less about any other bike YOU would buy to kick its ass. You actually sound like a pretty insecure kid based on your childish comments. I dont buy anything because of what someone else buys nor do I buy anything to "compete" with other people. I buy and do things because I like it - not because I want to fit it in. Thats the Harley mentality that so many people make fun of. Its truly a sign of immaturity, so go have fun with the friends you ride with on your streetglide.

[@boreed5734]

@@glickmpb That bike needs to run with crouch rockets to be fair. It's a V-4 cylinders running up against V-twins.