Magic: The Gathering's Constant Artificial Rotation | Dies To Removal Episode 38

[@TolarianCommunityCollege]

The Return Of The Revenge Of The Booster Box Game: kzbin.info/www/bejne/q4jMZayPpLWkoaM

[@Ketoinvestor]

Dear Brian and Vince, the eternal format you seek… is it Cube? IDK much about Cube TBH. So maybe I’m wrong but, it seems like a great way to excise the Shareholders’ fiduciary needs from the game 🤷🏾 *xposted in the Main Comments too

[@TheAcidDrip]

Haha at 29:10 I wish I could have seen Vince's face cringe while you tried that tongue twister. Great stuff guys thanks for keeping WotC honest!

[@checkthenutz]

I could rock with Un-Verse

[@fabiohenriquegiusti9900]

Guys guys hear me out, maybe someone already had this idea (actually it has been done before with World championship decks) but why wizards don't print a "proxy horizons"? A reprint only set, with cards from the reserved list, but only valid on FNM and small LGS events with idk a golden border or a grey border. This way people can play with original expensive cards but can't go on GPS etc with them, this would be good for casuals and people invest.

[@balrogdahomie]

9:01 in vid so far; it’s interesting that you say “Un-Sets were meant to be drafted”, when MaRo has gone on record saying that none of the un-sets before unstable were meant to be drafted & that he felt they were bad draft experiences (at least, by themselves; the intent was apparently for them to be used in Chaos Draft with regular sets, or in cubes, but not to be drafted on their own or with each other). He basically said that Unstable was them “giving up”, because everyone was drafting them despite that not being the intended method of play. Not saying you’re wrong; it’s abundantly clear a lot of people preferred to play UnSets divorced from the rest of the game, and authorial intent (designerial intent?) isn’t actually what determines how media “should” be consumed. I just find it interesting how adamant you were on this point.

[@kaszael]

"The flavor of Un-Sanctioned: perfect! No one played with it." I laughed so hard. Then cried while looking at my Un-opened box.

[@Volkbrecht]

Yeah, that was an evil burn... :D

[@Deebofreebo]

Un-opened

[@enricomassignani]

I played with it... once...

[@Jerhevon]

Heh, I think my box store is still selling copies. I haven't had a chance to play mine, but certainly added Fiesty Stegosaurus to my red deck there.

[@jessewieman6955]

Mine is still sealed in a box

[@Romarun]

I am looking forward to Un-affordable a.k.a Double Masters 2

[@nfortin24]

You win today

[@wordsmith451]

These prices are becoming un-tenable.

[@osvaldoramirez805]

So true 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@JStack]

Never seen a comment so funny I cry, and so sad but true I cry.

[@chadbrownlee3677]

(Simpson's voice) HA-HA!

[@zeka2255]

THIS WAS THE BEST INTRO SKIT SO FAR! THE PUNCHLINES FLYING HERE AND THERE WERE SOOOOO GOOD!

[@wordsmith451]

HELLO NICE TO MEET YOU MY CAPS LOCK IS ALSO BROKEN

[@MrMcWrath]

I had to pause after Lil Nas the 10th and look up how to say his name. That's an incredible joke!

[@VillainousVillainessViridi]

It was a very LRR style joke. I could have seen this as a Sketch of theirs.

[@ChuckMordock]

Yes! Please more like this! I was literally laughing out loud when they got to "Uno!"

[@RafaelVolcanes]

Hahaha! Wonderful intro!

[@VanAleph]

Mark Rosewater: "Kitchen table is the most popular way to play Magic" Also Mark Rosewater: "It's a shame you can't use silver bordered cards literally anywhere"

[@styfen]

Magic is going to be better when he retires, though we'll also end up wishing for his return because Inistrad was a success. MaRo has always been a stopped clock.

[@b.c.7741]

@@styfen magic is dead, if Mark isn't here to mess things up, someone else will.

[@VeznansDeadbeatDad]

@@b.c.7741 magic is dead?

[@b.c.7741]

@@VeznansDeadbeatDad the magic I grew up with and have known and loved is. Yours might still be alive tho hopefully.

[@b.c.7741]

@@VeznansDeadbeatDad first fell In love with the game in 1997 with Tempest block. I was 9 years old and obsessed with it for years. Since I would say about 2015 til present this game barely resembles itself anymore. This is all subjective and opinion obviously.

[@athandangerousofalexandria]

As an Eastern Orthodox theologian, the “Ungodly” set made me laugh to the point of tears. I would buy that all up in a heartbeat

[@wordsmith451]

How about ungodly sects? Make orthodox and catholic sets and mash them up as a double feature! And watch as wotc releases a protestant set and infuriates everyone.

[@danielcrosby1254]

Or just have maine caricature from the bible Get ready for my Samson fling deck.

[@jaketorbeck]

As a Catholic theologian, seconded!

[@Dehalove]

I 100% do not believe that

[@JonReid01]

@@wordsmith451 do Mormons get a set?

[@Durgenheim]

When MaRo says that people don't take silver bordered cards seriously, what he really means is that Hasbro is upset that they don't generate as much revenue as black-bordered sets.

[@chymos6628]

How dare folks not take literal joke cards seriously.

[@JMRyback]

Some friends and I have started dabbling with "Horizonless Modern." Modern rules and ban list, Standard sets still come in, but no direct-to-Modern cards allowed. It's damned fun and something I wish would catch on.

[@meavor]

Isn't that just modern... Before horizon

[@SRaburrido]

@@meavor more like without Horizon. They still put new standard sets.

[@Tacklepig]

@@SRaburrido yeah but... Horizons has been a thing for, what, 2-3 years? This is just what the original concept of modern WAS before WotC fucked with it.

[@UTUB2kholle]

I wish this would pick up. I'd play it. OR we start playing Pioneer and we vow to not allow new-to-pioneer cards ever. In any case we need a community run format since we can't expect to let wotc keep any format untouched longterm. But it's quasi impossible to get such a format going, plus it probably wouldn't be supported on MTGO.

[@goldcreeper7376]

Isn't this basically traditionnal ?

[@ashadeofnight]

The argument against the executive is that they are milking the cash cow too much and its causing some of their more enfranchisemed players to burnout so its record profits now but long term health of the game (and future profits) are in danger

[@kylekafka6636]

@@lunisinko7498 It's still not sustainable. If you want to game to run another 30 years, it's better to have formats where players can more easily dip in and out of the game. Most enfranchised players take breaks from the game regularily, so having an easy re-entry point for them is a good long-term strategy

[@christophcase6394]

I don't know how it's handled within WotC or Hasbro but in most companies incentives for managers are linked to current profits, not long term health of the company (or game). In a few years they will be switching to a different company, so what's it to them?

[@czcbearsrule1]

I have heard this idea of burnout since 2015.... Can people stop using that "long term health" argument without any real data.

[@kylekafka6636]

@@czcbearsrule1 That would be extremely difficult given WotC / Hasbro don't publicly publish their analytics, combined with the fact that tracking the active and lapsed playerbase of a physical card game is even more difficult. Therefore, people use anecdotes and try to look at the general public perception on places like social media and KZbin. People have the general feeling that they're pushing too much product, pushing a lot of high priced products, and that the overall quality is reduced (number of misprints, card quality issues, number of bannings). To add my own anecdote to the pile, I have played Magic on and off since the late 90s. I tried Arena and while the foundations are good, I burnt out within a few months. I haven't gone back, and the new things they're doing in Arena (Alchemy, etc.) haven't encouraged me to change my mind.

[@sawderf741]

Sounds like wizards is taking after konami.

[@Trauma_Llamas]

If I were pitching to a Hasbro executive I would ask them one question. "Are the record profits MTG is generating the result of a growing player base or as a result of earning more revenue per player?" That is a key question they need to be asking. As of right now I think it is both, things like secret lair and the Adventures in the Forgotten Realms set are exposing more people to the game and they have already announced that the price of new sets will be increasing in the near future meaning current players will be spending more by default. The important thing from a business prospective is that growing profits due to a growing playerbase is sustainable and indicative of a good product whereas growing revenue per player is indicative of an invested playerbase but is not always sustainable because not all players can sustain the same level revenue indefinitely. If too many players are pushed too far the game is going to stop growing and eventually even invested players won't be able to keep up. Once that happens, their only option to increase profit is to increase revenue per player which is a strategy with diminishing and eventually negative returns. The problem is that it is really hard to know where that line is until you move past it and once that happens it is nearly impossible to return from.

[@Xoulrath_]

You are not wrong. I've played this game off and on since 1997. I most recently got back in to the game in 2019. And I've just had enough of their price gouging after 2+ years of being back in the game. I'll just put my money towards a new sport bike. It'll ultimately be less expensive and it's a hell of a lot more fun.

[@darth_prentiss]

I’m just so burned out trying to keep up with everything. The phrase “maybe this product isn’t for you” has started to feel more like “maybe this game isn’t for you”. And honestly - I’m not sure it is anymore.

[@spammyv]

Same. Same, honestly.

[@Temperans]

Not just games. That phrase is being used for a lot of things from books to TV

[@ThePestilentDefiler]

Just dont give a shit what comes out. Play as a past time if you need or take a couple years off. Ive taken many breaks since starting. The last 2 years have been the longest ive played consecutively and i may just dip at any time now. Just keep your collection and decks. No point selling unless you NEED to.

[@DrEnginerd1]

I play primarily on arena, and even there the burnout is real. I havent played arena in like a year. At this point ive missed so many sets its hard to get the energy to dive back in and see what ive missed.

[@Sevatar_VIIIth]

Not just MtG, funny thing is I'm here researching and looking into starting MtG for Standard BECAUSE of what Games Workshop has done to Warhammer 40k, BECAUSE of what EA/Activision Blizzard has done to their games I've been playing well over 15 yrs.....it seems WotC is now following down that same road in the early stages of this new "Profit Margins" meet the quota fk the fanbase mentality. It's happening in literally everything now in 2022.

[@Xoulrath_]

I'm actually happier than ever that I've decided to take a prolonged break from the game. All of it has gotten so far pit of control and it's really more about pushing as much product as possible, rather than making the best game possible. At least the Prof and Vince are always entertaining.

[@BangThatGong]

I sold my collection, kept a few EDH cards and cards of sentimental value and proxied up the rest of the decks. Magic decks are worse than owning a boat. I feel like every time I look around there’s something extra pushed or just better than what I’ve decided to play with and the money required to even keep up with a quarter of products is insane.

[@Xoulrath_]

@GRUMMLER that is the most nonsensical comment that I've ever read here. Wizards of the Coast is absolutely responsible for the direction that the game has gone in. I could spend no money on the game and proxy everything. I could find a store that allows proxies in tournaments. It still doesn't change the fact that WotC, by simply designing chase cards that are pushed or straight up broken, has changed the game. The colors share so much now that it almost doesn't matter what your favorite color is because it can do anything. It's pathetically easy to play 4 and 5 color decks now. There used to be an actual drawback to doing so, but now you're almost punished if you aren't running at least 3 colors. Mono color identity has been destroyed. There are so many more issues that I could talk about, but that would require a novel. The bottom line is WotC could give this game away for free, and it wouldn't change the fact that I feel that they have destroyed the game over the course of the last decade.

[@wilagaton9627]

17:30 This goes against a 'lesson' MaRo did for the Game Design Conference some years ago. One of the lessons in '20 Years 20 Lessons' was that your game should evoke powerful emotion (Lesson 11). If your response to a games is "not terribly so," that's a red flag 😅😅

[@ryandoss6862]

OMG! 🤣😂 Un-remarkable. Just Ikoria without companions. Im dead.

[@hazzardalsohazzard2624]

Did people hate the companions? I only discovered the set a couple of days ago at a chaos Draft.

[@caligo7918]

@@hazzardalsohazzard2624 first, they were multi-format-warping good, then they nerfed them, now they're just a rare gimmik

[@Mmoll1990]

The Professor is right: Pioneer is the last bastion of integrity in an "Eternal" format. Let's make a dead pool on how long until WotC destroys it for profit.

[@Tacklepig]

You don't need that dead pool, Pioneer has never really been alive. I doubt it's taken serious enough as a format yet that WotC will ever want to monetize it - unless tons of players flock over there from a ruined modern or legacy now.

[@Mmoll1990]

@@Tacklepig I'm also fine with it being a gem that flies under the radar. Before the pandemic, local LGS ran Pioneer FMM, and it was pretty good. I hope they will again someday soon.

[@enricomassignani]

@@Mmoll1990 Commander also flew under the radar for some time, and now it's THE cash-cow format.

[@BlueGriffin20]

When you said “don’t you people have money?” I got flashback to the Blizzard’s Diablo mobile game reveal. “Don’t you people have phones?”

[@thetasworld]

Where is a red tshirt guy when you need him though?

[@daftwulli6145]

i am pretty sure this is what he was referring to

[@Dhips.]

thats the joke

[@underscore_5450]

On one hand, I agree with prof on the Un- set stuff. They're taking something unique and just making it into another set. And since all the cards are going to be black border now, I can easily see people getting confused about them. Silver border is very recognizable because it doesn't look like any other magic card. But when the difference between legal and non legal is an oval being turned sideways or upright, I can see that being very confusing. Additionally, by trying to make sure some of the cards can be legal in other formats, they are hindering themselves in some ways. Look at Sawn in Half. If it was any other Un card, it would just split power and toughness in half and use 1/2s. But because it has to be legal for commander, it rounds up. You're losing out on silliness because it has to be legal for other formats. But on the other hand, I also kind of agree with Kenobi. Interest in sets tends to be lower if those cards are only legal for a specific format or draft. I know I'm certainly more interested in Unfinity because of the commander legal cards. It helps give the set more value outside of just a one time silly draft night. Idk, I guess we'll see how things play out.

[@dangerousmatt522]

I agree with the Professor on the unset. The whole point of silver-bordered cards is to push boundaries in fun, crazy, and creative ways. If a card isn’t crazy enough to need a silver border (now acorn 🙄), then it shouldn’t even be in consideration for an unset.

[@jinxed7915]

I disagree. There's enough design space between "normal" Magic cards and silver bordered cards that you can create cards that are wacky or novel enough for a silver bordered set while still being tame *enough* to work fluidly with black bordered magic cards. Hell, Water Gun Balloon Game is an example of this, if you changed it to just give evey other player a token copy of the card and make the card only track its controller casting spells, the only novel thing about it would be that it creates a pink creature token.

[@rockstrongomaxpower]

"400$ of monkey." That's the quote I will use to answer whenever someone asks: What is Modern?

[@vulcanh254]

My answer to that exec: "What do most successful and rich companies have in common? They sacrifice short term profit for long term stability and certainty. Sure, they may operate on a loss for a few years but if charging less money means crushing the competition and attracting more regular and loyal customers it's a huge win. Right now you are not really securing MTG's future like you could and should. You have to think bigger man, think about all the hundreds of millions you'll make because of the satisfied customers that will keep returning! Think big Bill!" Lol I have no idea how to formulate this concept but you should definitely appeal to their greed and convince them that it can mean a lot more money in the long run. Because it's true but the problem is they only see profits, they can't see what they're losing (trust, confidence, stability, returning players, quitting players etc.).

[@Tacklepig]

The big issue being that what you're saying is simply not true. Companies tend to make the biggest money by focusing of short-term profits and simply pulling the rip-cord at the right moment. Sure, you get a more consistent flow of income and a more stable business model by doing what you're proposing, and it's the overall more sensible approach, but at a certain size of company, they don't actively care about being sensible, they just want to see numbers go up. Magic has done exactly what you're saying for more than 20 years, and it worked. The reason they changed is because they wanted short term profits. This was an active decision, not something done out of ignorance.

[@ThisAreOr]

This has to be one of the best episodes ever, you two did such a fantastic job and I really enjoy your dynamic and conflicting outlooks on certain points.

[@ClampEEGEE]

You're missing the pseudo-rotation that bans bring, Oko getting banned was about as meta shaking as some rotations.

[@DavidSJr]

@juter4397 they banned the only 2 blue cards in the format 2 effing weeks before set rotation

[@friendofentropy]

Unsportsmanlike sounds like a silver border Battlebond set

[@alexwright5835]

That intro skit was easily the funniest thing I've ever seen on youtube, yall are killing it with those!

[@CloudCuckooCountry]

It kinda feels like whoever's in charge, whether it's WotC faceless boardroom man or Hasbro faceless boardroom man, the philosophy of the company now is to ignore what the majority of players want because chasing whales who have bad impulse control is thought of as the more profitable strategy. And whether or not it actually is more profitable is kinda beside the question. It's now become industry wisdom and you'll never convince faceless boardroom man that he's wrong as long as he's making money

[@charliemallonee2792]

Eventually the whales will become endangered, and milking them will be illegal. Hopefully. Maybe. Oh please?

[@TheRealWarez]

Well, from his perspective, as long as he's making money *he isn't wrong*...

[@ROMANTIKILLER2]

Are you sure though that it is mostly "whales" t hat WotC is targeting? Collectors are for sure a profitable segment to milk, but if you have a look at the comment sections of most Commander related videos, it would look like the majority of timmies, casual tryharders and players in general keep being hyped at every new release and new must-have staple card that WotC is showing them: even if those are bought as singles on the secondary market, ultimately the cards came from somewhere so it is all revenues for WotC/Hasbro.

[@MetagrossTCG]

The apathy towards MtG really breaks my heart. I’m not a MtG player really, I’m a YGO player. But I gave MtG a shot specifically because of Brian’s passion and enthusiasm for the game. There’s a lot to like about MtG especially limited formats and the variety of formats (both of which are very lacking in YGO). But hearing about how Modern is overwhelmed with an influx of new cards, how Legacy and Commander are suffering from the same. It’s really depressing. YGO is also suffering from overly expensive staples but we also know generally when they will be reprinted each year and in roughly what products. But hearing about the turn and burn phenomenon was particularly frustrating. Getting into a card game should be a joy and hopefully turn into a lifelong passion. It feels like in a lot of recent videos The Professor just isn’t as passionate as he used to be and I understand completely why. I hope you can have fun with Pioneer before the inevitable Horizons set that overwhelms that format too. I hope Commander with friends is fun, and I hope Pauper stays fun too. And if all else fails, I hope you can have fun with Flesh and Blood.

[@raiserofchickens]

After seeing some of the spoiled art and the set abbreviation of UNF, I was really hoping that the new UnSet would be named *Unfair(e)*

[@jeannebouwman1970]

Or Unfun

[@dragonfire14x]

I haven't bought any MTG since July, and I don't plan to. The game has shifted from focusing on providing a good game, to maximizing profits. It's fine for a company to make a profit, but there needs to be a a stopping point and I feel WotC is past that point.

[@ashtongaskill3980]

That was part of what lead me to stop buying when The Walking Dead was announced. Haven't bought any WotC products in 14 months. New Kamigawa looks cool but think I'm good just looking at stuff from afar at this point.

[@xChikyx]

i stopped after the announcement of the walking dead secret lair, and since then I only buy proxys... it has saved me a fortune and I can still play the game

[@dragonfire14x]

@@xChikyx I was thinking of doing the same thing, but I only really play at my LGS and proxies can't be used in events.

[@xChikyx]

@@dragonfire14x no casual? and support the LGS by buying deck boxes, sleeves, and so.,.. that's what i do.... and well i'm starting in flesh and blood too xd

[@dragonfire14x]

@@xChikyx Not usually. They don't like to promote non-event play even before COVID.

[@jamesmarkham7489]

Once sets were described as possibly "not for you" i stopped buying cards. They basically cut off a segment of long time customers.

[@wordsmith451]

Why? I personally love being shoved into a niche and told that eventually I might have the chance to overpay for a limited-time product that has a vague chance of appealing to me.

[@jamesmarkham7489]

@@wordsmith451 well when you put it that way…

[@coreymetzker2521]

Prof saying Uno then Vince suddenly realizing he playing Uno was an acid moment.

[@morganmchenry325]

I almost want to say these last like 3-ish years of WotC has really been a grand experiment on how and what they can do and change, how our market responds, and where they can really push their player base.

[@Reik483]

I do think that having the black border/acorn thing is going to affect the design in unsets because the designers will always have the thought in there head "if I just remove/tweak this one thing I could make it a real card" and I think they're going to have to have a certain % of real cards from now on.

[@andreaspersson3532]

I stopped playing Arena when Alchemy was released. With the nerfs to Historic my interest died. Play Modern at my FNM, would love to play some of the new mythic bombs. I am 40, have decently paying job and 2 kids. There is no way I can keep up economically with Modern unfortunately. There is no Pioneer locally so not sure if Magic is for me anymore.

[@PartisanGamerDE]

Same here I lost all drive to keep playing. I can't even put my finger on what the exact reason is but I just dont feel like it anymore. Yet another format with yet another set of boosters to aquire. This begins to feel a lot like work.

[@PeteOnTheBeat]

I can relate..they pushed me out of modern since the beggining of MH with all the mistakes they made,but I managed to push through but then MH2 made all my dreams impossible because of the prices. I got into of Modern because I wanted some stability. Then i was getting cozy with Historic,but then that Jump Start with MH2 card hit,and still,i adapted. Now,with Alchemy,even though,as a Phoenix and Grixis/Sultai Control player it benefits me,i don't to play anymore.

[@Xoulrath_]

That's my issue. I'm 44 and I can afford a decent bit, but I can't spend what is needed to currently keep up. And just for the record, I personally love the MH sets and the soft rotation that comes with it, but I'm also a deck builder so that is certainly a personal preference. All that said, the MH sets were great overall, but some of the pushed cards at Mythic rarity being short-printed having the price tags that they do on the secondary market had made the game impossibly hard to keep up with from a competitive standpoint as a normal person. I've personally taken a break from the game for thr last few months, and if things continue down this path, then I won't play again outside of some games with my daughter and her boyfriend. I've already quit Arena and its cash grab permanently.

[@terryschwimmbacher2314]

The weird outcome of all of those issues for me is that it's mostly driven me towards playing vintage on MTGO. Cost-wise it's on par with modern and legacy, and it hasn't been utterly destroyed by crap like Ragavan. I still have to stagger my spending because I have other bills to pay, but at least I know that when I spend even $10 I can get cards I need, unlike on Arena where that same $10 could get me literally nothing of use.

[@hugomaldonado1051]

I know lots of people who stopped playing standard because they didnt want to keep up with rotation. If every format rotates i am sure people will leave the game. (and stop spending money)

[@shypenguin9766]

Never have I ever seen a cardgame having a midlife crisis.

[@Dre2Dee2]

lol. To be fair, most of them die of crib death so I guess it's a novelty?

[@darrenarmitage3460]

Lol. Yeah this one got fat and started eating everything in sight.

[@beecherry3943]

the prof having some FAB boxes on his shelf makes me happy like wow he actually likes a new game I like

[@sirearlgrey2036]

He has made a few videos about FAB. I haven't checked out the game itself, but the videos are worth a watch!

[@jacobriggs4461]

The one thing I LOVE about FAB is that I have yet to lose a game because of RNG with resources (lands). probably every 2-3 games MGTA shufflers bones me either down to an initial 5 card hand or just conceding from bad draws. In FAB you only lose because you're not piloting your deck well enough (usually..)

[@AutumnReel4444]

I got back into Magic in 2019. Seems that this was the worst era of magic to jump into.

[@nothing4mepls973]

If only you knew how bad things really are.

[@thaneofstuff7340]

Yeah. I got in with Eldraine which apparently one of the biggest problem sets as a whole for Magic. Greatly skewed my perception of the game for a few months and within the last year I have found just how bad that was for a lot of things. Just wow.

[@Xoulrath_]

Same. Long story short I got out of the game for the fourth or fifth time in 2009. I sold off a lot of now very expensive cards (dual lands, LED, Yawgmoth's Will, FoW, etc.). I came back five years later in 2014 because my daughter, who I had taught to play years earlier, wanted to play again. So we got back in and I learned about Modern. It immediately became my favorite format, as it essentially replaced my previous favorite format, Extended, and did so in the best way possible. After playing for about a year, my daughter started high school and we stopped playing for pretty much the entire time that she was in school. Then randomly in 2019 she was just like, "Daddy, we should play Magic again." So of course I said yes, we jumped back into the game with WotS and loved it. We loved MH. But every single thing that WotC has done since WotS, and all of the little mistakes that they've made, can no longer be ignored. This game has become nothing but a money sink to stay even remotely competitive at just a local store level. I even tried playing Standard recently with the fresh rotation. I've not been a fan of Standard ever, but a lot of my friends wanted me to play, so I did. Well after about a month of my $50 budget deck getting destroyed by the best decks in the format and their $300+ price tags, I'd had enough. I haven't played since, and at this point I'm not sure that I'll ever bother again.

[@AutumnReel4444]

@@Xoulrath_ At this point I just have a modest pauper cube, a budget battle box I made, and online pennydreadful. Wish ya the best

[@Dani-fo1br]

@@Xoulrath_ Proxies make playing magic fun again.

[@Alessandro-vv2fh]

I've convinced my player group to make Pioneer Brawl decks last year and this was a very good call. The card pool is big enough, most format staples aren't in it, and "artificial rotation" doesn't really occur because commander-warping cards aren't really released often through standard. I'm happy with the result and it really feels like old EDH when people had fewer resources and did brew their own decks to make them work.

[@validtangent]

Some real LRR Friday Nights energy with that intro, love it!

[@johndeuel314]

This was my first episode of the series. I have to say it was well done and a great watch! Will tune in for more. Thanks Professor!

[@zacky7572]

Back when Tempest was the current set, so probably ‘97 or ‘98, my buddy built me my first ever Magic deck and gave it to me. He knew I would like Slivers, so he made a tribal deck that had all the best slivers at the time, including the Sliver Queen. He was right, I fucking loved both the theme and the mechanics. I was in middle school at the time, and my ultra-conservative parents made me give it back because they bought into the Satanic Panic. I’m still mad they did that. But it didn’t stop me from playing the game, and Slivers are still my favorite tribe.

[@ShredAimlessly92]

Actually, a jumpstart set that just printed a bunch of pioneer-legal cards from the start of the pioneer cutoff, all the way up to something like War of the Spark or so, would be pretty cool. Buying singles is great but as someone who hasn’t been playing since the 90’s-00’s, I’d love to get better access to some of these cards so I can dive deeper into the format.

[@dree7211]

"unable.... Where you just can't anymore" Made me tear up, but then the following made me laugh. I love this channel!

[@ScottAtkins49]

favorite podcast! great to see you both back on the horse

[@atlaswar2425]

That looks like a good book you're reading prof I might need one for myself...

[@jongibson4766]

Every time this rotation/pricing argument fires back up, I think about the greatest format ever suggested, and it was right here on this very KZbin channel. You had recommended an EDH-parallel format that maintained the same bans and rules, but the legal card pool was restricted to cards that have gone through standard. I want that format, AND a copy of that format for 60 card 1v1 too.

[@snowsource13]

I feel similarly to your statement around the 10 min mark, Prof. Despite this set supposedly staying the same as previous ones but just with different borders, I can't help but feel like R&D might end up holding back their craziness for the sake of creating commander cards. Not everything has to cater to commander and the un-sets were really great as "throwaway" draft sets with cool basics. It's just another small loss of the magic that makes MtG, well, MtG.

[@clairehaldeman9293]

Im a huge commander player and im totally fine with the amount of cards we were getting like, in 2015-2018, not too little or too much. Now I feel like we're getting swamped with cards and I can't keep up.

[@KeldNeedsCoffee]

I mostly came by to thank you for getting to updating the audio version of the podcast. I'm an old man who still consumes most podcasts while on walks and stuff =D

[@Mmoll1990]

Solution: don't print broken, format-warping cards for corporate greed at the cost of game health.

[@chymos6628]

"Sorry, no can do, must print more money." - Wizards, probably

[@Dubhats]

But monke

[@jordanaraujo2579]

So true

[@jeef16]

@@Dubhats ragavan isn't broken or format warping lol, git gud pls

[@kailin9257]

@@jeef16 Yikes

[@milesherbert9149]

Always enjoy your chats with the young man - highly entertaining! Continue the fantastic work and all the best for the new year!

[@Aellef]

Unexpected sounds like an un set with no spoiler season, no prerelease, and no advertising. One day nothing, next day un drafts at the lgs Honestly, it'd be a nice change of pace from the perpetual hype...

[@poketplayer7197]

Out of all the cold opens this one was my favourite by far. Great Job!

[@canadianhighlanderbremen7717]

Un-believably great intro, as always.

[@froschkenig]

So, once the money-machine grapped on to something things never go back to how it was. That's just the way it is.

[@SaltySparrow]

I am so glad I walked away from historic after all the jumpstart injection. It was very obvious that this was going to be an infinite gyre of rotation.

[@gagevonwyl5133]

All these new episodes are filling a hole in my life I didn't even know was there. Love the podcasts!

[@captainqwark4863]

I've been playing Planechase with my mates for years although a bit different and we love it :D But I really wished that Wizards of the Coast never got bought by Hasbo... Just another greedy company, milking the cash-cow

[@MrHomeduck]

Awesome episode!! Got some genuine laughs out of me. I have definitely shifted over to the apathetic mindset of you, Prof. The difference may be that I made this shift like... at least a few years ago! I think when the FIRE cards started getting released. But the reason was that I decided I didn't want to be one of the mass who yells into the void about how much they hate when this game is going and then turning around and buying a box of the new set. I decided that I was just going to ignore that negative attitude so many people decided to have and just ENJOY THE GAME! At the end of the day, we all enjoy slapping cards onto the table. I encourage people to have this mindset. ❤

[@leilas5419]

another episode so soon?! i feel spoiled 😳 As an aside agree with commander, i stopped paying attention to magic and got a little shock when i came back and my golos deck was suddenly illegal lmao - thankfully people didnt mind me playing it as mine is jank

[@cassandrasibley228]

the rules committee is a joke at this point. they ban cards just because they don't like them or it encourages ways of playing they dont like. im gonna keep playing it with my playgroup too

[@chrismaxwell3001]

I took a longer time to get round to seeing this vid. Manic life! But glad I didnt miss it. I think these vid calls are as good quality as your face to face. Just live seeing you both discuss magic. Best skit too! Keep up the good work. 😊

[@JessieBlackheart]

“A set that takes all the fears that evangelical suburbia had during the satanic panic and confirms them”….So “The Dark” then?

[@froschkenig]

Collecting the bigger poster of all contraptions together is something I highly enjoyed. Sponsored some Drafts for my friends with the only caveat being me keeping the contractions. Soooo much fun.

[@flicker1395]

We’ve found it. This is the best skit. This one. Right here.

[@abuelovinagres4411]

It's a good one, but none can beat the steamed hams skit. LeL.

[@rfs8194]

You never let the "You have a KZbin channel!" joke die, no matter how old it gets. I respect that!

[@maplz9314]

"it will make them money, why should they care?" Is 100% indicative of a bubble.

[@failfurby]

Your bits are getting better and better!!!

[@TobiasBroad]

It seems to me that the removal of the silver boarders is mostly about making this set marketable to Commander players. This really highlights how silly it is that WOTC doesn’t have “control” of its most popular format. That being said I wouldn’t trust WOTC with control of its most popular format.

[@thatepicwizardguy]

taking the idea of UNsure and making it a mystery reveal game but like with mechanics similar to morph and/or all random roll-for, flip-for, and other chaos effects gone totally wild etc etc would have actually been super cool lol every single card has some kind of hidden, random, or otherwise strange effect that makes the game unpredictable (UNpredictable!) EDIT: also happy to get one of these again so fast, and great intro

[@Timby_]

Losing it this early at Lil Nas the Tenth??? Impossible

[@guyinthecorner0]

I read your comment as it came up in the video, that was too good

[@LordQQQ]

What they should add to Arena is endless daily quests so you could technically keep playing to get gold and buy packs rather than being limited to 3 per day. This severely limits the amount of wildcards you can get for free and also they should make alchemy cards commons and uncommons because there is no draft. Those two changes would make a lot more people less mad.

[@Daybed4448]

There IS a good business reason to maintain a truly non-rotating formating and its what Vince said: game longevity. Magic has lasted more than 25 years and will not last another 25 years with this model. Sure they can make profit right now, but mtg will collapse in on itself when it cannot expand any longer.

[@Imoman3113]

LITERALLY the best MTG skits on KZbin. Love you guys

[@chrishetmanski1709]

I 100% plan to take a silver Sharpie to the borders of my set of Unfinity.

[@MrArchivist1]

Hilarious and spot-on. This is why my playgroup ignores most of the format restrictions and just play whatever cards we enjoy within a strictly casual aesthetic. Otherwise MTG becomes pedantic and irritating almost immediately.

[@Lady_Kitsune09]

It's amazing how many episodes of Dies to Removal can be answered by "play LoR, instead" these days.

[@RadioSilver27]

I'm gonna tell y'all right now. I'm gonna rewatch the intro repeatedly from now on. That was beautiful!

[@PokeStatsStudios]

Introducing the newest un-set from mtg: "Magic: the Gathering: Unfortunately this set isn't for you"

[@SaltyBaconProduction]

'Un'sure sounds like an amazing way to draft a cube with unopened packs of Jumpstart and I am all for it.

[@Lusk1993]

When my now-rotating modern deck costs as much as a Nintendo Switch the choice is pretty easy, give me that Mario.

[@Fausto_4841]

even if i dont have time to listen to the new dies to removal, i always watch the into skit. you guys are tremendous.

[@wordsmith451]

Can't wait for unintentional, unforgivable, unpalatable, uninteresting, unconscionable, and unreasonable. What could be more on-brand for WotC?

[@dankbreh9013]

Un-Wanted

[@txag007]

Almost a full hour of 2 old men yelling out clouds! Another quality episode gentlemen! Please keep up the good work. Can I ask y'all to call out the variation of MID and VOW foil eternal land printing variations between the US and Japan? It's a quality control issue that should be brought up for WotC to hear. Gavin showed us a version of the foil that only showed up in the Japanese packs.

[@chricky]

May i ask, where you got that really cool sign of secret lair x Arcane from? I'd love to get one myself!

[@NicolaiBolas]

The intros never disappoint! "Uno!" with the classic table slam cracked me up!

[@Cpt_Jiggles]

"Even commander has rotation" I'd say this is in part a problem with them printing commander content/support/specific cards. Magic was better with the clear distinction of 'if it was printed within 2 years, its standard legal'. No modern horizons/masters, no commander specific products. Trickle reprints into standard sets, and that'll effect the formats power level appropriately. Not like ikoria and eldrane.

[@erenjager4698]

my solution to this problem is that I'm just a casual player now, who only plays with friends, and rn were designing a cube with a set power level and cards and strategies we like that fit that power level, and we're gonna proxy all the expensive cards and just have fun drafting it, and we don't need to buy expensive new cards or even keep track of what the new sets are. we can just get together, order a pizza, bring out the cube and have fun playing magic. i highly recommend it

[@SleepyTaylor]

The whole "putting staples in only high rarity slots" sounds like they are taking a page from yugiohs book haha. Doesn't surprise me honestly, if a company has been getting away with it for over 15 years, why wouldn't WotC do the same?

[@goncaloferreira6429]

quite a serious question

[@GhostofPhoenix]

They really need to take a good hard look at Yugioh honestly. I remember when Konami banned multiple chase rares on release day. I remember when they basically shut down all organised play overnight, refused to publish decklists etc. Yugioh has never had cash prize - you were lucky if you could win a PS4 and a booster box from a GP esque event. I remember when they decided to errata all the banned old school classics to make them "playable" again. I remember years and years of one-deck formats, unlimited resource combo control play everything from the graveyard forever mirrors, absurd "set up 3+ hard counters on turn 1" decks, "combo loop discard your whole hand turn 1" decks. Not to mention straight up FTKs. Power creep has gone so far trap cards are unplayable because the cost of waiting a turn to activate them is so great. The worst quality bendy foils you have ever seen. Orders of magnitude worse. Nobody in Yugioh has ever complained about foil quality - it's always been trash. So much that WotC is doing now people complain about has happened with Yugioh in the past decade, Magic players have no idea how good they have it

[@lemonflavouredtnt6969]

Another episode so soon! Keep up the great work Prof + Vince

[@meganwalker9148]

LMAO, Ungodly sounds amazing!

[@thesamuraiman]

Planeschase and Archenemy are amazing. And I agree that Planeschase and Archenemy cards having their own sizes to give their own feel is part of what makes it fun

[@thatepicwizardguy]

I left a comment already but I'll say this: their profits and customer loyalty DO have a cap... WotC will eventually reach a point where they push people away and once you break those backs those types of people will likely rarely if not never buy-in again. Spoken by a guy who stopped buying MTG in 2007, only having bought 2 products of the D&D set this year purely because of the specific product and personal collecting value it has to me and I'm now going back to just not supporting WotC for the foreseeable future lol their greed and bullshit was too much YEARS ago and at this point people only have themselves to blame for feeding the greed monsters both at WotC and in the investors market. Honestly we should all stop buying and play player driven formats that prevent new cards from being included.

[@97MasterX]

Watched that intro sequence a few times - really well done!

[@tylerconley7739]

You can avoid all of this by playing player run formats like old school and premodern. Cut wotc out of it and just play fun games. I can't keep up with all of this stuff anymore and maintain my sanity.

[@Izuyoi7215]

Where can I get a premodern deck for under 400? If there is I'd play

[@tylerconley7739]

@@Izuyoi7215 you can build Sligh for less. Oath. Slivers. Elves without cradles. Psychatog. Use gold border cards and you could probably build survival too

[@Supernov4]

@@Izuyoi7215 Literally only a handful decks need the heavy hitters. Majority of the format is cheap, fetchlands being like the top end.

[@RaunienTheFirst]

Why not, instead of changing the system to the acorn-shaped stamp, just have the set be a mix of silver and black border cards? It allows you to print black border cards in an unset but without the additional confusion, and it's *such an obvious solution*!

[@JodouTR]

Many Magic the Gathering players ask: why would I pay real money to crack packs when wild cards are the equivalent of $15? Just kidding, they don't ask that question which is why WotC gets away with what it does. Maybe this is a less a WotC problem and more an irresponsible consumer problem.

[@Xoulrath_]

But it isn't an irresponsible customer problem. There are research articles all over the internet explaining exactly how this is psychological manipulation. This is especially true to people who have lower self-control issues or impulse control issues like people with ADHD or gambling addictions. I'm not saying that the customer doesn't need to be responsible to some degree, but we have to start calling out the predatory practices that all companies use and put an end to them. This is the problem with putting profit over everything else. It becomes a dragon that you're constantly chasing.

[@JodouTR]

@@Xoulrath_ At the end of the day, only one person is responsible for your own actions.

[@jorgemendieta8085]

One of the nice things about previews unsets were the full basic lands, but now they're something that are printed widely in standard. So when everything is special, nothing is.

[@RaunienTheFirst]

What amuses me about Alchemy applying to Historic is that it also applied to Historic Brawl. They buffed Phylath! My Phylath lands deck was already powerful, it didn't need to also have incidental trample on top of that.

[@LithmusEarth]

UNO! - I am in love, with the director of photography here, that camera editing was great at the beginning.

[@kwmpokeproductions8911]

The best argument, financially, for keeping a clean non-rotating format is player base stability. It allows for all the shenanigans they pursue in other formats while providing a safe haven for people who dont have the money nor the time to keep up. And, as more and more people become apathetic to what they are doing and releasing, people will become apathetic to the game and walk away. People leave games not cause theyre angry, but because they dont care, and WotC is pushing more and more players in this direction, while simultaneously turning away new players with high price tags.

[@stropes.]

You mentioned it briefly at the beginning but I'd like a deeper dive sometime into the way that they've put Commander on rotation. The format has become so homogenized since WotC began to 'support' it since support really just meant putting it on rotation with powercreep and redundant effects spread out over multiple cards (a highly upvoted post a few months back on r/EDH actually celebrated this approach and the introduction of powercreep into the format).